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11 hours ago, TrueJustice said:Not sure how you would go about reversing brain damage? I mean it's one thing to detox the body, clean up liver etc as it has the capacity to repair itself, as for the brain - can't do much about that as far as I know.
Right, and that is what has always bothered me in looking at research regarding Accutane's effects on the brain. There are lots of angles to look at, so there's no way to know brain damage is necessarily the cause for any one person. But one paper I linked here demonstrated how alcoholics with brain damage eventually showed improvement after 10-15 years. (We are talking about similar brain regions for Accutane-induced brain damage and alcohol-induced brain damage.) Time is the number 1 remedy for such an issue, but limiting inflammation in the brain would be important too, assuming that is relevant.
On 6/7/2016 at 7:16 PM, ACCUiTy_drANE said:That is my problem as well. I have some mutations in my CBS genes that supposedly mean I should avoid sulfur products, yet so many sulfur supplements are regarded as useful. I also have a gene that implies I should be taking the bio-available form of folate. So I've been doing the methyl-folate and methyl-b12 protocol for two months now. I have been been having more good days (cognitively and mood wise) lately, but I have no idea what to attribute it to. Interestingly, I also have the Apoe-e4 gene, which is associated with an increased Alzheimer's risk. To me, this is significant because studies show that those people who go through chemotherapy and possess the Alzheimer's gene (Apoe-e4) are MORE likely to show cognitive decline and memory issues post-chemotherapy than those who do not have the gene. It's just yet another angle to look into, as many of us feel like we have chemo-brain. Ah! As if we don't have enough to look into already!
Yes, although Accutane is confirmed to cause apoptosis, the question remains, is it the source of our problems? What about everyone's theories that Accutane affects DHT just as Propecia does, and that it acts as a 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor? I only recently started looking at this angle and it's ridiculous how much many of us have in common with those who took Propecia. I don't know where to go from here, but I try to throw out ideas where I can.I will have to look into the enzymes. So far, home-made Kefir has been an absolute game-changer in dealing with my IBS symptoms. All thanks to a random recommendation I read 100 pages back!
With all due respect, I am done replying to you due to your continued misrepresentation of my viewpoints. I know it is garnering likes, but it is imperative that we accurately portray other peoples' ideas.Epitalon does not affect an isolated aspect of the body. It affects multiple TYPES of cells and multiple systems in the body. Also, I never claimed it was the end-all cure. I believe supplements are an aid, just like you do (but our methods obviously differ). Certainly other aspects of health should be considered. (What good are healthy cells with lengthy telomeres if your diet is off? Of course I acknowledge the big picture matters.
)
As a follow up to the Epitalon theory, has anyone actually gotten their Telomere length tested? I'd be curious to try Epitalon, but if our Telomere length is okay, it would likely be a waste. Test seems to be 150$ online from what I've seen. I'm not yet willing to pay this much for a test that may not mean much, though as a 24yo I'd be curious to see how old my telomere length makes me.
44 minutes ago, ACCUiTy_drANE said:Right, and that is what has always bothered me in looking at research regarding Accutane's effects on the brain. There are lots of angles to look at, so there's no way to know brain damage is necessarily the cause for any one person. But one paper I linked here demonstrated how alcoholics with brain damage eventually showed improvement after 10-15 years. (We are talking about similar brain regions for Accutane-induced brain damage and alcohol-induced brain damage.) Time is the number 1 remedy for such an issue, but limiting inflammation in the brain would be important too, assuming that is relevant.
What are the best supplements again for reducing inflammation? I still feel like my brain is swollen every other day and just have no idea what to take, it's different to a headache more a pressure in the head ( cranial pressure ) but for all I know it could just be prolonged inflammation. Not just the brain but other parts of body too.
Im currently on a holiday, saw an Ayurvedic Dr today as part of a free consultation and he said my partner and I could benefit from taking:
"Neem" capsules
"Triphala" capsules
look them up, they seem to have multiple benefits, everything from blood purifier,eye protection and anti inflammation ( to what degree I'm not entirely sure ) I didn't get to discuss Accutane with him, he just said based it on body type that these would be good for me ( pitta/Vata type )
Im liking some of the Ayurvedic medicine that's out there, it ties in nicely with some of the Yoga stuff I've studied over the years. Hard to refute and used by millions over many years around the world so I'm happy to start exploring what is out there
32 minutes ago, TrueJustice said:What are the best supplements again for reducing inflammation? I still feel like my brain is swollen every other day and just have no idea what to take, it's different to a headache more a pressure in the head ( cranial pressure ) but for all I know it could just be prolonged inflammation. Not just the brain but other parts of body too.Im currently on a holiday, saw an Ayurvedic Dr today as part of a free consultation and he said my partner and I could benefit from taking:
"Neem" capsules
"Triphala" capsuleslook them up, they seem to have multiple benefits, everything from blood purifier,eye protection and anti inflammation ( to what degree I'm not entirely sure ) I didn't get to discuss Accutane with him, he just said based it on body type that these would be good for me ( pitta/Vata type )
Im liking some of the Ayurvedic medicine that's out there, it ties in nicely with some of the Yoga stuff I've studied over the years. Hard to refute and used by millions over many years around the world so I'm happy to start exploring what is out there
I will have to look into the Ayurvedic medicine. I hope it works out for you.
In terms of reducing inflammation, there a few options. For one, blueberries. They can be frozen or fresh and seem to give the same benefits. Examine compiles a whole bunch of research done on blueberries, including a subheading about neuroinflammation. If you wish to take a blueberry extract supplement, be sure it includes anthocyanins. Curcumin Longvida is another great option, as it passes the blood-brain barrier. Different forms of Curcumin help with different sources of inflammation as well. Lastly, cannabidiol is an "anti-inflammatory, anticonvulsant, anti-oxidant, anti-emetic, anxiolytic and antipsychotic" (its anti-inflammatory properties extend to neuroinflammation).
2 hours ago, TrueJustice said:What are the best supplements again for reducing inflammation? I still feel like my brain is swollen every other day and just have no idea what to take, it's different to a headache more a pressure in the head ( cranial pressure ) but for all I know it could just be prolonged inflammation. Not just the brain but other parts of body too.Im currently on a holiday, saw an Ayurvedic Dr today as part of a free consultation and he said my partner and I could benefit from taking:
"Neem" capsules
"Triphala" capsuleslook them up, they seem to have multiple benefits, everything from blood purifier,eye protection and anti inflammation ( to what degree I'm not entirely sure ) I didn't get to discuss Accutane with him, he just said based it on body type that these would be good for me ( pitta/Vata type )
Im liking some of the Ayurvedic medicine that's out there, it ties in nicely with some of the Yoga stuff I've studied over the years. Hard to refute and used by millions over many years around the world so I'm happy to start exploring what is out there
Neem oil is good stuff controls my mild chest acne , in India it is considered the village pharmacy having said that I have never tried neem capsules.
On 7/31/2016 at 1:23 PM, tanedout said:I'm aware he's not a doctor as he often points that out in his posts, but regardless he's clearly spent a vast amount of time studying CFS related issues, and no doubt has an excellent understanding of the biochemical processes behind this, and tane and PFS issues are clearly closely related, to CFS issues. Look at how many people have benefited from his methylation restart protocol for example, this guy is worth listening to.If he says he believes tane sides could potentially be mitigated with a high dose of methylfolate then it's probably our best shot at a 'cure'. You can see his thinking regarding this, how this would in theory lower GNMT activity and break the vicious cycle we appear to be stuck in.
How much methylfolate were you taking, and for how long, was it an active form (i.e. listing L-methylfolate on the ingredients)? I'm guessing you hadn't worked up to say 30mg/day for a month or anything?
Has anyone tested low in any folate test? real question. There is no way I could have worked up to 30mg a day I was maybe on 5mg if I recall. It was the active folate the exact one he recommended. It gave me a side ache, dry skin and low libido. I didnt feel like these were effects I was supposed to "push through" to get better, so I stopped. I would give you all my bottles of folate if I could thats how unconvinced I am.
I feel like more then anything atm, (for me anyways) Im dealing with some low grade type of infection that just wont go away. The ear fullness,facial flushing, hair loss, stomach problems, Brain fog. Something is constantly attacking my body leaving it in a state of stress.
Its f'd up to say but its like its high grade enough to cause serious chronic problems, but low grade enough not to kill me. Yet anyways. Fuck. There are senior citizens that dont have the problems some of us do. Something is not right.
I got some more blood test coming, Full liver panel. Copper and zinc.
1 hour ago, Amar21 said:None of you are medical professionals and have no right to your accusations. I took accutane at 18, I am the same person I was before the treatment and so are all of you, end of story
You do realize your entire post is a contradiction. You basically said all of our "accusations" are anecdotal and you followed up with your anecdotal experience. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having read that. I award you no points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
4 hours ago, Amar21 said:None of you are medical professionals and have no right to your accusations. I took accutane at 18, I am the same person I was before the treatment and so are all of you, end of story
Go back to pub med.com were you belong the rest of us are reading natural news.com.
If you ask any honest derm he will tell you isotretinoin IS a controlled POISONING, end of story.
Why do you think 1/3 of derms around the world won't even use it in there practice ? One derm said and I quote " we don't know the long term outcome of these patients ". It is the worlds most dangerous DRUG. FACT , simply because of its long term side effects.
Antibiotics-- Long-termantibioticuse may lowerbiotinlevels by destroying the bacteria in the gut that producesbiotin.
This could go for vitamin k as well(produced by bacteria) . I know some people have a problem with calcium. There is such a thing as free calcium. Vitamin k/k2 binds free calcium in the blood and puts it in the bones where it should be. Excess free calcium could also contribute to depression and muscle spasms, tics and twitching
55 minutes ago, guitarman01 said:Antibiotics-- Long-termantibioticuse may lowerbiotinlevels by destroying the bacteria in the gut that producesbiotin.This could go for vitamin k as well(produced by bacteria) . I know some people have a problem with calcium. There is such a thing as free calcium. Vitamin k/k2 binds free calcium in the blood and puts it in the bones where it should be. Excess free calcium could also contribute to depression and muscle spasms, tics and twitching
I always said the ones that are worst off are the multiple antibiotic users throw in accutane to finish them off.
1 hour ago, Gladiatoro said:2 hours ago, guitarman01 said:Antibiotics-- Long-termantibioticuse may lowerbiotinlevels by destroying the bacteria in the gut that producesbiotin.This could go for vitamin k as well(produced by bacteria) . I know some people have a problem with calcium. There is such a thing as free calcium. Vitamin k/k2 binds free calcium in the blood and puts it in the bones where it should be. Excess free calcium could also contribute to depression and muscle spasms, tics and twitching
I always said the ones that are worst off are the multiple antibiotic users throw in accutane to finish them off.
Exactly, I was a multiple antibiotic user and sometimes I am thankfully that last antibiotics did harm to me that I saw. Because otherwise next step was accutane. Antibiotics was doing damage anyway but I was lucky that the last cycle of antibiotics did VISIBLE FOR ME damage. Otherwise if I took them for maybe one or two weeks less damage wouldn't be visible and I would took Accutane... Well I don't even want to know how messed up I would be then
BTW Two weeks ago I was diagnosed with SIBO. All those years I was trying to reuild my flora with probiotics, suplements etc but nothing was working. Now I know that problem was elsewhere. Long time I thought I had candida overgrowth but now i see that's unlikely(no sugar craving, no joint or muscle pains, no headaches, only symptoms are digestive problems and fatigue but man those symptoms can mean milion of different things)
Right now I am in middle of dealing with SIBO. I already feel better. I urge everyone who took antibiotics before to test SIBO, test is safe and inexpensive so why not? I had before two gastroscopies and those were extremely painful for me.
And don't lost hope. Read maybe mind over medicine by Lissa Rankin. Many doctors don't want to acknowledge that but
state of mind is HUGE helper or destroyer of our health. Sometimes I'm asking my mom "why those derms destroyed
my health?" and she always answered "well, they were destroing you health then, and now you are destroying
yourself". And it's true. Even if we took antibiotics, and accutane hope is still there. Even if it's small, then
our state of mind and emotions can make that hope even smaller or at least a little bit bigger
8 hours ago, guitarman01 said:Antibiotics -- Long-term antibiotic use may lower biotin levels by destroying the bacteria in the gut that produces biotin.This could go for vitamin k as well(produced by bacteria) . I know some people have a problem with calcium. There is such a thing as free calcium. Vitamin k/k2 binds free calcium in the blood and puts it in the bones where it should be. Excess free calcium could also contribute to depression and muscle spasms, tics and twitching
I believe you're correct but then why don't we respond to biotin supplements??
I mean it would be too much to ask just take probiotics to get our gut health back, for some reason it's incredibly difficult even though experts say it's not that hard?
Anyone done the "Gut thrive in five" program where you end up buying 500 different supplements to work on gut health??
Anyone done a fecal matter gut transplant? Apparently that's the big thing in restoring gut health these days. I'm going to ask Gastro Dr when I go for another appointment in Sept. If it works fucking bring it on I say
On 8/1/2016 at 0:44 PM, Kynarr said:As a follow up to the Epitalon theory, has anyone actually gotten their Telomere length tested? I'd be curious to try Epitalon, but if our Telomere length is okay, it would likely be a waste. Test seems to be 150$ online from what I've seen. I'm not yet willing to pay this much for a test that may not mean much, though as a 24yo I'd be curious to see how old my telomere length makes me.
Here is the deal. One telomere test by itself is probably useless, unless it shows a LARGE discrepancy between your age and telomere length. For example, a telomere test may tell someone he/she five years older than he/she actually is. But the test cannot possibly account for the fact that a given 30 year old is going to have a different "average" or "healthy" telomere length based on his/her sex or race. These telomere tests are most useful if you use one test as a reference point, make a modification (for better or worse), and get tested again. Using this method, you can test the efficacy of your diet/supplement regimen.
Look at this anecdote. An otherwise healthy 49-year-old man got a telomere test and it came back that he had the telomere length of a 55-year-old. In reality, he may have been perfectly average for his profile. He then injected 500 mg of highly bioavailable forms of Epitalon and got another telomere test. He then showed as having the telomeres of a 10-year-old. He posted his results online:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Nootropics/comments/4vk596/my_experience_with_epitalon/
1 hour ago, ACCUiTy_drANE said:Here is the deal. One telomere test by itself is probably useless, unless it shows a LARGE discrepancy between your age and telomere length. For example, a telomere test may tell someone he/she five years older than he/she actually is. But the test cannot possibly account for the fact that a given 30 year old is going to have a different "average" or "healthy" telomere length based on his/her sex or race. These telomere tests are most useful if you use one test as a reference point, make a modification (for better or worse), and get tested again. Using this method, you can test the efficacy of your diet/supplement regimen.Look at this anecdote. An otherwise 49-year-old man got a telomere test and it came back that he had the telomere length of a 55-year-old. In reality, he may have been perfectly average for his profile. He then injected 500 mg of highly bioavailable forms of Epitalon and got another telomere test. He then showed as having the telomeres of a 10-year-old. He posted his results online:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Nootropics/comments/4vk596/my_experience_with_epitalon/
Funny, that's exactly the post that prompted me to inquire if someone had done the test. I found going from a 55yo telomere length to a 10yo one very interesting. What I'm curious to know, is how badly the length of our telomeres would have been affected by Accutane, if at all. My DNA results are normal-ish. My blood tests are all amazing. It's like Accutane is an invisible murderer of sorts.
I might do the test sometimes soon just to see what my age is according to this, but if someone that's gone through Accutane has done it already, it could be a good reference as to what to expect.
Someone years ago on one of the old Accutane forums said they saw a Dr who thought that our problem was we have a virus of some sort post treatment brought on by destroying our gut health, I mean when you get all these blood tests coming back fairly normal yet you have fatigue and creaking bones and sore eyes etc, kinda makes you think Accutane just smashed our gut health in such a dramatic way that it compromised our immune system and gave us all these issues!?
When I got my recent gut health results I really was wanting them to find something, I didn't care if it was sinister, I just wanted them to identify something for once but as usual nothing was found - so the search goes on.
I still don't know for sure though that I don't have "leaky gut" or "SIBO", this is what I want to ask the Dr - where do I go next with improving gut health??? Just because they didn't find anything sinister doesn't mean I don't have bad gut health.
Im on track though to starting my real life at 50 - looking forward to the huge payout coming our way from Roche and also looking forward to the apology letter we will all receive
I wish it was something as simple as a virus or something treatable. But, if you think about it, it just doesn't really add up. Clearly something is at play on the genetic transcription level. That's not to say we haven't developed chronic illnesses or diseases as a result. But treating them isn't going to reverse the underlying mechanisms at play. I'm sorry, but I'm on board with the 5ar reductase theory and nathan's telomere theory. I don't see any other logical explanation at the moment.
On 8/2/2016 at 8:41 AM, macleod said:You do realize your entire post is a contradiction. You basically said all of our "accusations" are anecdotal and you followed up with your anecdotal experience. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having read that. I award you no points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
wow someone needs to stfu. If you had a good experience with accutane, grey. Now leave us alone, were here because we didn't.
On 8/3/2016 at 1:23 AM, cnb30 said:I just had one of those moments when I realize just how much my mind has been damaged. I honestly don't think I can go on like this much longer.
I still think you can get better but it may take a while. I think the right med would work wonders for you. Or something like st johns wort. If ypu are mistrustful of doctors maybe see a naturopath.
BTW I just wanna add, I really like everyone's sardonic usernames on here. You guys are a twisted bunch. I like that.
On 7/30/2016 at 5:14 AM, Dubya_B said:Hate to play the devil's advocate, but isotretinoin/13-cis-retinoic acid does occur naturally in very small concentrations. (around 1.5ng/dL)
[Edited link out]
It is produced as a by-product of retinoid metabolism.
On a side-note, I tried leaving a comment refuting some of the one-sided misinformation about the safety profile of Accutane on that dermatologist's blog:
[Edited link out]
and it was blocked.
im pretty sure you're correct. Thats like saying, hey static electricity is the same as the atom bomb.
Was reading bifido bacteria are more susceptible to destruction from antibiotics then lactobacillus bacteria. The small intestine is much more clean, meaning only millions of bacteria mostly lactobacillus/some bifido. compared to the large intestine or colon that harbors billions of bacteria mainly bifido based. What I was reading said antibiotics more so effect the small intestine when it comes to destruction of beneficial gut flora. It's more rare or harder for the effect of antibiotics to travel the distance and reach the large intestine or colon. Unless the course of antibiotics was prolonged. If accutane was able to disrupt the gut flora in the large intestine, you would probably need a certain type of probiotic that itself was proven to survive the journey all the way to the large intestine.
6 hours ago, snarkygirl said:I still think you can get better but it may take a while. I think the right med would work wonders for you. Or something like st johns wort. If ypu are mistrustful of doctors maybe see a naturopath.
9 hours ago, cnb30 said:I just had one of those moments when I realize just how much my mind has been damaged. I honestly don't think I can go on like this much longer.
I definitely agree that it is worth trying a few supplements and/or medications out before throwing in the towel. My "don't blow your brains out" stack is perhaps overkill, but I have been noticing more good days than bad as of late. This is how I manage my depression (brain fog/anhedonia):
1. 25 - 30 mg Tianeptine Sulfate - I am sure this medication has been mentioned before. It is one of the fastest acting antidepressants available. It is not prescribed in the U.S. because its patent has expired, therefore it is not profitable. Although I understand why someone may want to stick to herbs, I think it is worth looking into older drugs that are not pushed by the U.S. healthcare system. Sometimes those are the most effective, but don't make anybody rich.
2. 0.75 pounds of blueberries per day - The word "superfood" gets tossed around a lot, but even the most stingy scientific folks agree that blueberries are a superfood. It increases BDNF, helps memory, controls neuroinflammation, ect. You will feel the difference.
3. 20 mg of cannabidiol - I've beat this one to death.
4. 150 mg of Ashwagandha - It has anti-inflammatory effects and works as an anti-anxiety without the tolerance.
5. Intense cardio 5 days per week.
6. Intermittent caffeine use - Caffeine actually has a ton of health benefits, but if used regularly, it can inhibit neurogenesis in the hippocampus (bad). If used sporadically, I find it to be a great way to increase my motivation for an important task. It can also increase my sociability, which has positive implications beyond any one day or moment!
7. Kefir - I have no idea if it is doing anything for my moods, but it definitely helps my digestion. If it is re-balancing my gut flora, surely that has an effect on depression/cognitive issues.
8. Wait for a rebound - Every two weeks, I have a 2 day span where I feel almost normal. Lately it's been more often, or perhaps I'll feel well for MOST of a day. We'll see.
Disclaimer: Although all of these treatments are legal, seek advice from the appropriate authorities before obtaining.
6 hours ago, snarkygirl said:BTW I just wanna add, I really like everyone's sardonic usernames on here. You guys are a twisted bunch. I like that.
My favorites are "Accutainted" and "TanedOut." They were inspirational to mine. I almost went with AccuDrained, but felt like that would have been too imitative of me.
I tried tianeptine for months. It helped with anxiety, and physical exercises. Definitely puts a "pep in your step", you'll also notice vivid dreaming, however downsides are a bit of racing thoughts, if you take too much, and it also spikes your insulin* levels, as in, if you are susceptible to high sugar levels, for example diabetics, not necessarily good for you. i think it lowers it in the end, but there is a definitely a temporary spike. here's the data.
Someone was asking about estadiol recently. Surly everyone of you have had this checked as a basic!!
We all know that PFS sufferers have trouble with estradiol.
Can as many people as possible post their test results. Include any related sex hormones results as well: testosterone, SHGB, DHT etc
Aricle:
High and Low Estradiol Symptoms
Low Estradiol: fatigue along the lines of sleepiness; hypersomnia (sleeping too much and too often); strong erections but limited sensitivity; loss of erections; osteoporosis and osteopenia; joint pain, clicking or popping joints; eye fatigue (eyes seem more tired despite adequate sleep, dark circles); loss of libido (interest in sex); difficulty retaining water (constant urination); anxiety, depression, irritability. Exclusive to low estradiol (usually): sleepiness fatigue; hypersomnia; limited penile sensitivity; osteoporosis/osteopenia, joint clicking/popping, pain; difficulty retaining water (urination); anxiety/depression.
High Estradiol: soft erections, inability to maintain an erection; water retention (less frequent urination), leading to excessive sweating, including more than 2-3 pounds of weight loss after an intense cardio workout; blood pressure spikes or high blood pressure (from the water retention); insomnia; hot flushing (flushing around the ears or on the face); night sweats (from estradiol lowering, causing loss of water retention); bloating; brain fog (like your head is in a bubble); testicles seem smaller than usual (not accounted for by testicular atrophy via TRT). Exclusive to high estradiol (usually): soft erections, inability to maintain; water retention; excessive sweating; blood pressure spikes or high blood pressure; brain fog; night sweats; bloating.