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@SimpleMutton Will definitely take a look into it when I get the chance. It would be amazing if something like that were available. My scars aren't even that bad and I can't stand them. I can only imagine. The RF microneedling is 3k for like 3 treatments. Expensive but most people are seeing between like 30-50% on average I believe. Still a shitload for minimal results, but it's a start. Will definitely update on here and I appreciate the kind words.
For me RF microneedling would do nothing....I don't even have scars in my face, I have them in my back and it's harder to treat scars in the back since the skin is deeper. I would need something that goes 3,5mm deep reaching subcutaneous fat. Nothing can reach that far without risking a worsening of the existing scarring.
That's why for me only SkinTE can be the solution....excising the skin and regenerate it from scratch
Anyway as far as current treatments go,I do believe the best one right now is subcision+fillers but only on rolling scars and only if you're quoted a decent price considering that you need to go back every 6 months for fillers.
First off, I don't know why anyone replies to @SimpleMutton, it's pretty clear he's here just trying to promote SkinTE. All he negativity he posts clearly shows he has an agenda. Secondly, Dr Lim as hundreds of pictures/videos in the exact same lighting that shows results. He has over 90 reviews on RealSelf and they all are 5 stars. Please stop the negativty
42 minutes ago, SupremeNot said:First off, I don't know why anyone replies to @SimpleMutton, it's pretty clear he's here just trying to promote SkinTE. All he negativity he posts clearly shows he has an agenda. Secondly, Dr Lim as hundreds of pictures/videos in the exact same lighting that shows results. He has over 90 reviews on RealSelf and they all are 5 stars. Please stop the negativty
Pretty funny considering PolarityTE is an American company, it's not even present in Europe, let alone in Italy where I live.
If anything, you're the one that keep posting "results" by doctor Lim on here. And the fact he has 5 star reviews on RealSelf means absolutely nothing, almost all the surgeons that write there has the same rating.
7 hours ago, SupremeNot said:First off, I don't know why anyone replies to @SimpleMutton, it's pretty clear he's here just trying to promote SkinTE. All he negativity he posts clearly shows he has an agenda. Secondly, Dr Lim as hundreds of pictures/videos in the exact same lighting that shows results. He has over 90 reviews on RealSelf and they all are 5 stars. Please stop the negativty
Well, he really sounds cynical but he also speaks the truth. The current treatments are useless.. Sure, you can get pretty good improvement, but you have to spend a lot of money and be pretty lucky. But anyway, no one wants 50% improvement. The scars are still there, they are still visible, you will never be comfortable when none of the scars can be removed completely.. And the prices together with no guarantee.. How the hell is this pricing justified? Lasers seems like pretty simple devices that just generates energy, the procedure is also very short and simple. Not sure why it is so expensive.. It's just the greed and desperation of patients.. Don't even tell me that the doctors had the training and need to be compensated for it. I am confident that many members here know a lot more about scars and their treatment than the actual doctors.. They just have the equipment.
@SimpleMuttonyou don't even have facial scars and you're complaining about faked results when we have another thread by someone with facial scars personally attesting to Lim's expertise? Get the heck outta here
I have severe facial scarring, and I desperatelysearched the internet for solutions. But it is difficult to find any good results. Can you provide a link to the person who got good results with Dr. Lim, with pictures, please?? I want acne scars treatments to be true more than anyone in this forum.
Just go to Dr Lims Realself page, he has plenty of pictures that show results. If all of you guys believe @SimpleMuttonthan why the Hell do we even have this forum? If NO treatment works, than why are we even discussing treatment?
@Scars_Hope Its right on the front page. no pics, but if there was somebody would probably complain about the lighting.
OK, @simplemutton good to have sceptics out there to keep EVERYONE honest. I am no fan of Dr Lim's, I don't think he is THE best, but I know or at least think I know how to assess 3 D vectoring with 3 D vectoring lighting. If one casts the worse possible lighting to highlight scars, the rectifies them, then tries to find the worse possible lighting once contours are corrected and can not, it maybe possible that the pictures are indeed correct. Essentially hard to replicate XYZ spatial orientation of patient with XYZ lighting. Then rectify scars in with the same XYZ axis in both patient positioning and lighting. Only two ways to see if this guy (Lim) is manipulating photos to boost his ego, or if these are indeed real is to get the images as RAW format, then have someone in this forum forensically evaluate them for photoshop or manipulations in lighting or saturations. It's a easy task to do, but it should be done by someone with IT skills. Possibly challenge Lim to provide images in RAW format for forensics and possibly, with his permission contact the patient themselves. Only way to solve the scepticism- I too am intrigued as to how these results are possible. His new Instagram video today shows somewhat usual results, which he attributes to the patients healing, and not his skills. I agree with Realself, it has gone from a community of specialist answering questions about scar revision to a all out commercial crap site when dentists are answering questions on acne scar revision . In the words of Dr Davin Lim ' you would not hear me chime my thoughts on how to perform root canal therapy, so please respect my comments on the limited capabilities of Picosure in the treatment of tethered and anchored scars' - his reply to a dentist who gave his two cents worth on acne scar revision. Post pulled down by real self very quick for 'hostile' retaliation. Total Bull Crap..... I too share your thoughts on RealSelf, however if you read Lim's comments on the 82 odd before and afters, he words the scar revision process not with salesmanship but with education. If an usual even occurs, he highlights its unusual for the patient to heal in an accelerated manner. Not defending the guy, he just tells like like it is. Just email him for all his before and after pics, and get some guru to examine them, or email the patients for their thoughts.
I originally avoided posting in this thread as I was asked not to by the OP indirectly, because he / she felt I was "too negative." Which is farthest from the truth, I feel I offer hope to those who need a solution to get "some" improvement. This really does give hope that pictures by Doctors never can as I have nothing to sell to you, only to help you improve yourself. There are lots of people on this site that have had major improvements and move on. I never promise percentages or over promise. Why because I have been on the side of lies, terrible treatments, bad healing, things getting worse. We are all different with our ability to heal, some of us some things work better for than others. I try to provide a realistic path to scar solutions if you stick with it. I also try to save you some money, ... peels can be done at home and we can avoid the things that simply don't work.
If we are debating different diseases that might be related to acne aka acne conditions that cause scars on the body or other compounded conditions, of course there is no 100% cure for this. IT's a false equivalency to think what mos people are dealing with here which is superficial scars are the same and I do not want to connect the two. I understand the need for hope and for some it's Skin TE (a unproven for "acne" scars) solution for possible regeneration sometime in the future and for others it's what can I do for my skin now so I can move on with things that work. Remember Dr. Lim has said in videos he feels scar regeneration is 10-20 years off and I would consider him obsessed with data and new information on scars. After all they told us 20 years ago they would have a cure for cancer, HIV, fountainof youth, etc... Lots of data, studies, research, patentsand ability to make that happen, but still nada.Not everyone has the same path or the same thing even works for treatment. But to generalize and say all acne scar solutions do not work currently is false.
Let's reframe the mindset of Skin TE, treat now using the proven treatments that actually work andexist that we offer when you have the time and money, and in X number of years you will only get more improvement "possibly" w/ Skin TE if needed right. Treatment does not need to cost a lot if spread out.
Correlation in White paper studies should be considered, not just Drs beauty shots.
Regarding Dr. Lim, I DO think his pictures are accurate. No need to ask for RAW files or patient experiences in my view...
There are so are many other acne scar specialists who can provide the same thing, even Dr Lim mentions this. Dr. Lim is a star in his own right by educating as we try to do here. In fact he often does not take international patients last I read (overbooked with patients) and tells people to save your money and treat locally, there are many good Drs out there, he is just most visually present in today's social media world. My point is these doctors are not idiots. They are not going to post their worst photos or someone who does not heal well. They postthe best case scenarios (seeing thousands of patients monthly, it's easy to get good ones, but this is not you and not individualized for your situation ""realistic expectations""). After all who want's to see poor results, ... you would avoid the Dr right. It's only natural to get a percentage of good and bad. Some things are out of their hands (They are not your bodies ability to heal), some treatments just are not effective for some people. This is why I feel percentages of full scar improvement should not be given. Patients constantly ask for this, but it leads to more heartbreak if things aren't perfect. As a famous Dr said: under promise, and over deliver. Let's not idolize Drs as being some sort of savior. He is educating us, so learn from the education. Pictures to me are very worthless as it's not individualized to your situation or conditions. There are more than several ways to do things and many different paths.
Through a pattern on this site I have seen many with BDD. They want perfect results and who can blame them right, the world is cold and mean. This is why I think therapy should be part of the process, many top Acne Scar specialists require you to see a therapist to be treated. They realize the damage scars do to the psyche and the let down someone can have with unmet expectations. I think it takes the proper mindset to get through acne scars and find treatment. It really can destroy self esteem.
To recap acne scar treatment does not work for all conditions. There is no one Dr that can treat everyone and is the best (post several Drs pictures to discuss instead of just hyper-focusing on one Drs photos, ...care more about the method than the picture. The journey is hard and it can be long up to 3 years of treatments with down time, many give up. People on this site unlike Drs have nothing to gain by telling you the honest truth good and bad of their experience as educational to others, take everything with a grain of salt weather photos, treatment posts, educational materials... You must come to the conclusion of what makes since for YOUR scar treatment journey. What will give you the biggest ROI (Return on Investment).
It is no one's place to discredit for whatever reason the treatment results of those who say they succeeded. What do they have to gain by posting pictures here of their results, they are not Drs. Who cares how they took the picture with their iphone (we have correlation by many the same treatments work). If you still see scars in pics, who cares... They are happy and that's all that matters, we never said you would get perfection.
Note again: peels are cheap and can be done at home, no doctor is wasting your money this way, if they worked for centuries they can work for you (look at Quad's posts this is the only type of treatments he has done). Filler is known to work for various skin conditions and has a huge track record. Scars are not one and done, the take multiple approaches on different X/Y Axis.
If that is not hope don't know what is.
1 hour ago, SupremeNot said:Did any of you guys check out Dr Lims video on instagram directly talking about this forum? What did you guys think of the video?
Link?
My two cents,
I agree doctors use camera tricks to promote their treatments, and users do it to boost their self esteem. But I've said before, pictures are almost always misleading in one way or another, and I prefer video to track my progress. Take a look at the pictures in my topic. I wanted them to be as honest as possible. They don't look like a slam dunk, but I don't think they capture the overall aesthetic improvement, but it's realistically what you can expect from 2 successful subcisions.
Also, sometimes I think we focus on "harsh" lightning too much. While it's important to evaluate your progress in all lighting, so is average lighting. Treatments can make acne scars almost invisible in most lights, and to me that counts.
What treatments have you done and what is the level of severity of your scars? Do you actually have significant scars? As someone who had significant scars, I'll tell you know that dermal fillers were the only thing that worked and were a game changer for me. I don't want to judge your experience, but the moment you mentioned the scarless healing thread, I knew I could not really take your comments as seriously. The people in that thread want a magic eraser that will give them perfect skin. Are you holding out for perfection, or are you genuinely interested in improvement? You basically dismissed all the examples of significant improvement cited above because the results did not meet your threshold for what counts as improvement.
There is no way you can legitimately say that there was NO improvement with Mr. Matt. The improvement is obvious. Unless you've tried all methods and failed, then you can't say that there is nothing that works. Have you tried filler? I believe it is the single most powerful treatment that is AVAILABLE NOW, and not in some distant future. You can literally see the improvement in front of your eyes. If you inject an indentation or lift the face with dermal filler to treat acne scarring related volume loss, you can SEE the effects. Yes you have to maintain them, but there is no way you can argue that it does not work.
I would also look at @QuanHenry. He was as dejected and cynical as you were, but things have turned around for him. Last I heard, he was dating again. Is his skin perfect? No, but it has visibly improved and an objective observer would be able to see it. I'm concerned that people give you examples and you didn't even bother to look past "the first 5 pages" to find their stories. It demonstrates to me that you are interested in honest discussion. Dr Lim is not mentioned here because he's a miracle worker, it's because he has successfully demystified the process of acne scar revision. His b&a's are mostly honest, with some that can be suspect.
I think healthy skepticism is great because there are a lot of shady doctors out to scam people out of their money, but to dismiss everything because it cannot give perfection is not helpful. If the only thing that qualifies as success for you is PERFECT, then well I'm not sure this forum will help you.
Now after I read more of @SimpleMutton's comments....
I just realized now after reading further that @SimpleMuttondoes NOT even have facial scars. I basically wasted my time writing what I wrote above. It's easy for someone to drop into these forums and write drive-by posts dismissing everything because it's not good enough for them. For the people on here with ACTUAL FACIAL scars, improvement can mean getting back to living life again. No, it will not be perfect, but what 99% of people on here want are achievable, realistic results. It is NOT a far flung fantasy, which cannot be said about scarless healing. If you want to hold out hope for a miracle, then fine.
I knew the moment I read the words "Scarless Healing" that I was probably responding to someone who was not interested in serious conversation, just provocation. That thread is filled with literally the same 5 people, who most likely don't even have significant scars, talking back and forth with each other.
You guys should read the name of the forum before replying.
It's acne.org, not facialscars.com.
And this section is called "scar treatments" not "facial scars treatment".
Do you have facial scars? I'm very sorry.... I haven't so all the treatments suggested here don't work for me and for everybody else that don't have scars in the face.
Acne can hit the body (especially back)much worse than the face.
I have scars in my back that are worse than everybody here. If you don't believe in SkinTE but you believe in fillers and lasers then I totally disagree with you.
I stand by what I said about the other guys that have posted pics on here. Their problems is still there and that's why they're looking for new treatments.
You either solve a problem or it's not worth spending money.
@SupremeNot Checked out the vid. Lim definitely gets results. I don't think you will find much better IMO.
Pfff, even with 99.999999999999999999...% improvement, some people will not be satisfied. And why should they? Even the folks with flawless skin are always complaining about their face these days. 
As Jesus once said, some people just don't get it. Merry Christmas, everyone!
Edit: Unfortunately, almost all of the advice given here are more or less the same thing, as if reading from a script. Subcision, Infini, TCA, nada nada.... I don't think doing more of one thing will necessarily make your scars look better. That's why I encourage you to be creative in your approach to scar revision, like utilizing "biohacking"...but I digress.
On 12/22/2017 at 2:35 PM, Sirius Lee said:Pfff, even with 99.999999999999999999...% improvement, some people will not be satisfied. And why should they? Even the folks with flawless skin are always complaining about their face these days.
Edit: Unfortunately, almost all of the advice given here are more or less the same thing, as if reading from a script. Subcision, Infini, TCA, nada nada.... I don't think doing more of one thing will necessarily make your scars look better. That's why I encourage you to be creative in your approach to scar revision, like utilizing "biohacking"...but I digress.
The reason why that advice is given is because those specific treatments are proven to help- as in repeatable, studied in controlled environments, and objectively observed. They DO get great results and that is why people here continue to talk about them.
I was researching your method with DSMO and I found almost NO information on it besides random webpages that support natural remedies and the like. There are peer reviewed papers when it comes to other aspects of dsmo. There is no live human testing of it. (Most similar studies to yours are either done on a rabbit ear for hypertrophic scars and on incubated human tissue, which would negate collateral injury.)
I would strongly urge that you discontinue spouting your nouveau ideas and putting down scientifically proven treatment options. By doing so in these forums and advocating something lacking in research and human testing, you are putting people here at risk.
This thread has got lot of people worried and in dismay so close to the holiday season. There really are options that with repeated use can and will provide near perfection. It is up to us to just keep at it.
Im always stalking this site like, constantly, trying to find a solution, but i almost never comment... this thread hits so close to home though
I have done SO much research on treatments and results, and they just arent very good... I want to say about 85% of the results that look great are staged with good and bad lighting as stated above. I am not saying great results are impossible.. i think thats a little too cynical, however i think its extremely unlikely and very difficult. The results i always see are very minimal.. the scars are still there and completely noticeable. They dont actually look much better and they spent 1000's it is completely depressing and has made me question whether or not treatment is worth it. Should we just accept this is who we are now? Instead of developing all kinds of mental conditions and very unhealthy obsessions.. I am almost getting to a point where i dont wish i didnt have this issue, i just wish i didnt care lol. My life would be just as it was before if i didnt give a shit.. the thing that stands in between the way i was before and how i am now isnt other people, its myself. I literally make myself miserable with this obsession. It just feels as though we are wasting so much energy on something that wont improve much and driving ourselves mad.. Im not against treatment, and im not saying i wont have any myself, but this very discussion is what has held me back.. i know the odds of satisfaction are so against me... do i really want to spend 5000 over time just to feel unsatisfied, not to mention ill probably create some new scars/flaw along the way as i just see that as a common problem with almost any treatment.
Sorry if this message discourages anyone, you do you... im all for anyones need to seek improvement!
2 hours ago, seattlegal90 said:Im always stalking this site like, constantly, trying to find a solution, but i almost never comment... this thread hits so close to home though
I have done SO much research on treatments and results, and they just arent very good... I want to say about 85% of the results that look great are staged with good and bad lighting as stated above. I am not saying great results are impossible.. i think thats a little too cynical, however i think its extremely unlikely and very difficult. The results i always see are very minimal.. the scars are still there and completely noticeable. They dont actually look much better and they spent 1000's it is completely depressing and has made me question whether or not treatment is worth it. Should we just accept this is who we are now? Instead of developing all kinds of mental conditions and very unhealthy obsessions.. I am almost getting to a point where i dont wish i didnt have this issue, i just wish i didnt care lol. My life would be just as it was before if i didnt give a shit.. the thing that stands in between the way i was before and how i am now isnt other people, its myself. I literally make myself miserable with this obsession. It just feels as though we are wasting so much energy on something that wont improve much and driving ourselves mad.. Im not against treatment, and im not saying i wont have any myself, but this very discussion is what has held me back.. i know the odds of satisfaction are so against me... do i really want to spend 5000 over time just to feel unsatisfied, not to mention ill probably create some new scars/flaw along the way as i just see that as a common problem with almost any treatment.
Sorry if this message discourages anyone, you do you... im all for anyones need to seek improvement!
I actually just started a thread discussing whether I should just accept my scars. Remember, scars that you think are unsightly may not be viewed that way by others. And you can always use make up, etc.
5 hours ago, SupremeNot said:Idk why everyone on this forum sounds so negative. there's TONS of examples of people getting 50%+ improvement. A lot of the negativity on here is very unwarranted
I think it has to do with the fact that having scars on the face, while seemingly a physical problem, is truly psychological. Having to look at and examine the scars each morning and night in the mirror is very mentally wearing and that damage compounds every single day.
Many people feel hopeless because they think that no procedure could possibly help their scars. They feel helpless because some can't accept less than perfection. They feel helpless because they were led astray by doctors who promised too much and delivered too little, or who suggested treatments not tailored to that person's own scarring.
It is very easy to get caught in a loop of lacking self-worth and feelings of hopelessness. The only way we can get out of that loop is to keep trudging on- focus on your life, don't say things like, "When my scarring is better I will..." say, "Let's do our best today!" Keep trying your treatments, stay positive and don't give up over a treatment that didn't go as well as planned or seeing pictures online that aren't the best. These things DO improve scarring and will provide a better quality of life. We just need to try.
Happy holidays everyone. Please don't give up before you really started.