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6 hours ago, Rez77 said:This sounds a lot like Recell. But hopefully its something much better and more powerful. I wonder what the costs are right now. Theres a video with the new update on youtube I'm sure you've all seen. But the curious thing about it is that they don't show any before and afters.
It isnothinglike ReCell. Dont you even read what has already been written?
On 10/22/2017 at 5:42 AM, Frasier said:It isnothinglike ReCell. Dont you even read what has already been written?
You don't know that. Recell also required a biopsy which would then be somehow grown and expanded into some kind of salve or emollient and then sprayed onto your burn wound (or a few doctors who used it sprayed onto laser treatments). It only improved the scars maybe 15 percent. The point was the Recell allowed the doctors to go deeper with the laser and scrape down more scars cause the recell helped with healing. I'm just asking, mechanically PolarityTE is proposing the same method. And we're all in agreement you'd need to have your acne scars lasered to deep burn levels for the Polarity TE paste to work, right? This WILL NOT work by just applying the paste to an old facial scar.
31 minutes ago, Rez77 said:You don't know that. Recell also required a biopsy which would then be somehow grown and expanded into some kind of salve or emollient and then sprayed onto your burn wound (or a few doctors who used it sprayed onto laser treatments). It only improved the scars maybe 15 percent. The point was the Recell allowed the doctors to go deeper with the laser and scrape down more scars cause the recell helped with healing. I'm just asking, mechanically PolarityTE is proposing the same method. And we're all in agreement you'd need to have your acne scars lasered to deep burn levels for the Polarity TE paste to work, right? This WILL NOT work by just applying the paste to an old facial scar.
"Expanded into some kind of salve"? It is a completely different approach than Recell. Which have been stated here a hundred times.
Has anyone looked at the PolarityTE investor presentation? Look at the pictures comparing SkinTE against a control wound, and you'll see that SkinTE minimizes scar formation. Not scarless (at least in pigs), but it's a step in the right direction. Smaller wounds could also have proportionately less scar tissue, perhaps none at all. There's also the possibility that SkinTE could be combined with an anti-fibrotic such as hyaluronan or decorin.
Nopoint in arguing over this, just wait untilhuman trial resultsare released.
Probably the first test patients with acne scarring will just involve just small areas of skin to start......burning your skin with a laser to go deeper sounds dangerous.If it doesn't work you end up with severely burned skin. Then even if it does fix scarring....the cost of the procedure will probably be a lot. Talking 20k or more and you know the insurance companies won't pay it because it is cosmedic.
6 hours ago, nikkigirl said:Probably the first test patients with acne scarring will just involve just small areas of skin to start......burning your skin with a laser to go deeper sounds dangerous.If it doesn't work you end up with severely burned skin. Then even if it does fix scarring....the cost of the procedure will probably be a lot. Talking 20k or more and you know the insurance companies won't pay it because it is cosmedic.
Obviously insurance won't pay. And they haven't even figured out if you can do this cosmetically by lasering your sking REAL deep and then applying the PolarityTE salve (which means fucking paste jerkoffs). It's a paste, it's just a paste of stuff that's teh same as recell.
Recell wasn't a complete failure I should say. It was still a step up from what we had before (allografts and xenografts) which is better than nothing basically. Let me explain the differences between Recell and SkinTE:
1.) Recell utilizes a split-thickness autograft where enzymes are applied and then it is sprayed on to the surface of the wound. It actually goes a bit more in detail than that so I will dive a little deeper to hopefully help everyone understand it better.
https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/876290-overview#a2
A split-thickness skin graft is classified as having only a partial part of the Dermis in it. When you obtain the full dermal layer, the correct and appropriate term is: "full-thickness skin graft." Check the above article for reference.
2.) Recell's split-thickness grafts don't even have 1/4th of the Dermal layer. Let's re-wind to something we all should know; Almost all scarring occurs mostly in the dermal layer. Sometimes it can occur within the hypodermis or subcutaneous tissue which is underneath the dermis. So if scars are the result of something that is affected beneath the epidermis which is the outer-most layer, why is only part of the dermal layer addressed? I'm sure they either had complications or did not want to even attempt to go further because of possible worsening conditions that can present themselves.
Look at this Recell training video and I want anyone who cares to open the link I post to fast-forward (feel free to watch the whole thing if you'd rather) to 4:25 in the video. They state the split-thickness graft biopsy must be approximately 0.2-0.3 mm thick. Note those numbers because we're going to do some math; Well, I'm going to do some math for you.
Epidermis and Dermis thickness obviously varies from each skin type. Refer to the links below:
https://training.seer.cancer.gov/melanoma/anatomy/layers.html
In general the epidermis is around .05 mm thick in the thinnest part of the body which is around the eyelids. The dermis can be anywhere from 1.5 mm to 4 mm thick but as stated in the second link, it is on average 2 mm thick. Also stated in the second link the average of the epidermis is 0.1 mm NOT 0.01 mm, but 0.1 mm. Let's go to extremities and assume all skin is thin just like the eyelids (which is obviously not true) and also assume the dermis is as thin as it can be at 1.5 mm which would be unfortunate if all of our skin was in fact like that. I'll use myself as the host/patient in the example below.
Recell takes a biopsy approximately 0.2-0.3 mm thick. My epidermis is 100% obtained because it is only .05 mm thick. Let's do some simple math: Assuming a 0.3 mm biopsy is taken lets simply subtract 0.3 from 0.05 and find that it comes out to 0.25. So the full epidermis is obtained and we can biopsy another 0.25 mm deeper which enters the dermal layer. Now we said that my dermal layer in any area of my skin is 1.5 mm thick so we can simply divide 1.5 by 0.25 to figure out how many times 0.25 can go into 1.5 and find that it comes out to 6 times which is 1/6th of the dermal layer. 1.5 is the entirety of my dermal layer so we can consider 1.5 to be 100% of my dermal layer. All that's left is to divide 100% by 6 to find out what % is each 6th which comes out to 16.666666667 or 16 and 2/3rds percent. So favoring all the best odds on Recell even going to extremities, they still only obtain almost 17% of the dermal layer which is responsible for almost all scarring. I hope everyone understood that I know it can be confusing. Keep in mind that any injuries in the untouched dermal layer will still form a scar because that's what it naturally will do in any scenario where it is left untreated and untouched. That would be the idea right? except all of that math only matters for the biopsy and does not matter for the wound setting itself because Recell utilizes it as a liquid spray. Since it's in the form of a spray, you can't even create a wound setting extending to the entirety of the dermal layer because it will probably not cover the entire area as a liquid substance. Not to mention that they're not obtaining a biopsy of the full dermal layer that has all the essential constructs to function as a normal dermal layer. This is why I believe they can't remove the entirety of the wound/defect.
To try and simplify that: Recell wanted to take a fraction of the UPPER dermis and re-apply it by spraying it onto an injured dermis and expect the damaged part to somehow be replaced even though the biopsy didn't have all of the components from the whole dermis such as sebaceous glands, sweat glands, and even hair follicles which hair follicles are located right below the dermis even. Multiple researchers like Dr. Costarelis claim that the hair follicle is essential in regenerating healthy skin by the way.
Now for SkinTE's construct which would appear to be similar, but in fact, is not.
1.) SkinTE will biopsy a FULL-thickness skin graft that will be expanded using their own technology and then applied to the wound. A dressing will be applied afterwards.
In the picture if you observe the second row you can see that is how a FULL-thickness autograft heals which is not what Recell gets because they utilize a SPLIT-thickness graft. You also see that SkinTE produces an even better result than a FULL-thickness autograft as seen in the third row.
2.) SkinTE perhaps is a paste of your own skin, but it's still different than say, spraying your skin like Recell does. Their skin biopsy was converted into a liquid state with the spray or rather just combining liquid substances with your skin's cells. We all know what drastic changes something as simple as water can undergo when converting between states of matter: Liquid: Water, Solid: Ice, Gas: Steam. A paste would not be a liquid, but more of a solid just like our skin is a solid.
3.) The wound setting needs to be taken into account. Since SkinTE will at least excise 100% of the dermal layer, then any scarring that could've existed or presented itself in the dermal layer is not present anymore. If even the hypodermis is excised, then you can remove any defect and replace it with a potential margin as they like to call it. They can do it too because they're able to cover the entirety of the area with their "paste." Recell doesn't and can't excise the entire dermal layer from the biopsy nor the wound setting (which is responsible for almost all scarring) as was shown above. So any injury in the untouched dermal layer will more than likely result in a scar which is why I would believe Recell only gives slight improvement or even none in thicker skin areas.
Hope this helped everyone to better understand the differences between the two.
I forgot to add that anyone should feel free to correct me or add anything I may have missed.
I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.
I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
Note: Not all questions will be able to be answered and some may be answered, but briefly with not many details because of business related issues.
Note:There's always the chance that he doesn't end up calling me. If so, I'm sorry for the haggle, but we can at least still await their human trial results and go from there.
6 hours ago, Tano1 said:I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.
I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
Note: Not all questions will be able to be answered and some may be answered, but briefly with not many details because of business related issues.
Note:There's always the chance that he doesn't end up calling me. If so, I'm sorry for the haggle, but we can at least still await their human trial results and go from there.
is there any margin after treatment by skinTE?
is there any shape restriction for skinTE treatment?
can acne scars be debrided to get the result?
thx Tano
8 minutes ago, rudy1986 said:is there any margin after treatment by skinTE?
is there any shape restriction for skinTE treatment?
can acne scars be debrided to get the result?
thx Tano
Noted. One of my questions is about the margin so I'll just leave it as is. I'll add the other two and tomorrow afternoon I'll list them from most frequently asked to least relevant and go down the list until we run out of time.
4 hours ago, Tano1 said:I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
1 if there is a margin. it is visible to the naked eye ?
2 in how long, They will launch into the market of the revision scars, if the product skinte works on burns ?
3 we can hope for a scar free for scars less serious than burn Such as a acne scar with skinte ?
Thank you tano !
13 hours ago, Tano1 said:I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.
I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
Note: Not all questions will be able to be answered and some may be answered, but briefly with not many details because of business related issues.
Note:There's always the chance that he doesn't end up calling me. If so, I'm sorry for the haggle, but we can at least still await their human trial results and go from there.
4
Well done Tano! I really hope you'll be able to get some usefulinformation from this conversation.
As for questions, I would personally really like to know the following: are there any current scar treatments that would be possible contraindications for the future use of SkinTE? I was thinking about things like fat-grafting or other permanent fillers. Maybe even excision. It would be such a bummer to do something now for a little bit of improvement only to find out it ruled out your chance of getting a much better improvement later.
Good luck with yourphone call!
14 hours ago, Tano1 said:I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.
I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
Note: Not all questions will be able to be answered and some may be answered, but briefly with not many details because of business related issues.
Note:There's always the chance that he doesn't end up calling me. If so, I'm sorry for the haggle, but we can at least still await their human trial results and go from there.
Thank you Tano for being proactive, I wish you the best of luck. If possible, can you please ask these questions?
1) Ask them about human trials... Do you have to have third degree burns to participate? Can someone have the product tested on them if they wanted to be part of the testing process?
2) Can you cover as large an area of skin as necessary? (For instance, I have sun damage on most of my face, so I would like the top layer of skin removed. That's a large surface area, but not that deep)
3) Is it possible to treat all parts of the body where there's skin- even eyelids?
4) Is this TOTAL scar-free healing? No margin, etc...
18 hours ago, Tano1 said:I was waiting to announce this, but I've received an e-mail at the end of last week from Dr. Swanson COO of PolarityTE and he informed me that he would be happy to chat on the phone regarding some questions I had about SkinTE and the future of cosmetic/scar revision and hair regeneration. I'm still a little shocked that the COO and Vice President of the company would reach out to me after an e-mail I had sent them. I must be of the lucky few that managed to receive some of their time.
I may be posting some information if he does, in fact, call me Thursday or Friday as well as the possible audio of our conversation.
If this works out, I should be able to get possibly 5-7 questions in to him and can maybe reserve some back up questions in case we zoom through them pretty fast or if he has enough time.
If anyone has any questions they'd like to ask him, please reply here to me or pm them to me. I already have 5 questions that were frequently asked, but can replace them or add any that haven't been answered yet by their site, interviews, etc... If there are multiple requests for the same question then I will add it. We only have 1 day or possibly 2 to come up with these questions so please get them in quickly.
Note: Not all questions will be able to be answered and some may be answered, but briefly with not many details because of business related issues.
Note:There's always the chance that he doesn't end up calling me. If so, I'm sorry for the haggle, but we can at least still await their human trial results and go from there.
Will it be possible to have sutures (preferably absorbable) within the area, if the technology were to expand into scar revisions, or will the wound be too small?
Hi, I'm new here. Will you ask him if he thinks that skinte will be able to work for scars on the lips? The lips are considered hard to "dress" and you can't really graft onto them, so I'm curious to see if their paste can work around these normal problems.
I'd really appreciate it!!!