Acne.org Products
Assuming they start human trial at 2016, we could get hydrogel by 2020
It won't be available for treating acne scars. I think it should be approved for such uses.
P.S. I can't understand the papers. I need to merge all information into a simple instruction how to cook and prepare the hydrogel. I'll be glad to get any help, guys. PM me if you want to help.
P.S. I can't understand the papers. I need to merge all information into a simple instruction how to cook and prepare the hydrogel.
First of all, the precise formula for the hydrogel is almost certainly a proprietary blend so you're never going to be able to work out the exact ratio of actives, they're a trade secret and will be patented and licensed to pharma companies.
Second, do you have a degree in biochemistry? If you can't understand the papers then you really shouldn't bother trying to cook up a batch of hydrogel, its not like baking a cake. We're dealing with some complex, finely-tuned chemistry here, it's something an amateur has no business messing with. You'd need some crazy expensive clinical equipment worth tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it properly anyway.
Third, say you somehow manage to get your hands on some hydrogel. Then what? It's never been tested on humans, are you willing to take the very real risk of it failing to work properly and being further disfigured? Again, no ethical plastic surgeon will touch this stuff until they know it reliably works so you'd either have to find a corrupt one willing to butcher you or you'd have to do all the excising yourself, which isn't really an option.
The hydrogel is something that might someday be a simple and effective solution for scarring but that won't happen for several more years at the earliest so until then you'd be wise to not sit around wasting your time waiting and persue other treatments that we know actually work and combine them with a promising healing agent like that egg oil, it wouldn't be an instant fix but odds are that over time you'd be able to greatly reduce your scarring so that by the time the hydrogel is available you'd have very little left to do, which would greatly simplify further treatment, a basic dermabrasion + hydrogel dressing combo would then plausibly suffice.
It's probably something any decent biochem lab could cook up if they had the formula, which clearly isn't going to happen becuase nobody is going to invest millions of dollars in research and development only to give it all away for free. Gemstone Biotherapeutics stands to make an insane amount of money if this hydrogel works out so there's no chance in Hell they'll ever reveal anything close to a workable recipe. The closest we may get is when they file the patent but even then they're sometimes allowed to keep crucial manufacturing details secret, so don't expect the whole formula to become available until the patent expires, which could take decades.
However, one possibility is that Indian pharma might start producing a cheap generic version of the hydrogel under a licensing agreement with Gemstone that allows them to make and sell it inside India, as is commonplace with a whole host of other drugs. As always happens, somebody will unofficially start selling it online and you'll be able to buy some very cheaply, they've been selling cheap generic Indian viagra that way for years.
Problem with that is that it will be illegal for plastic surgeons outside of India to use it on you, so even if you get some it may prove very difficult to actually use it.
Honestly, I'm surprised anybody thought it was remotely possible to make this stuff at home.
Anyway, found another egg oil research paper, this time Chinese:
Pharmacodynamic study on scald wound of egg yolk oil by ethanol extract
Objective: To study the effect of egg yolk oil by ethanol extract on scald wound and its anti-inflammation and its anti-bacteria effect in vitro.
Methods: Healthy Kunming mice of second degree scald were divided into the scalding control group,moisture burn ointment positive control group,dry distilled egg yolk oil treatment group and ethanol extracted egg yolk oil treatment group.The mice model with the grade II burn on the back were established,the healing time,the change of scald surface and the effects were observed.The experiment of inflammation caused by dimethyl-benzene on the ears of mice was carried out to observe the effect on anti-inflammation.The anti-bacteria effect of the sample was studied in vitro.
Results: Compared with that of negative control group,the egg yolk oil by ethanol extract could apparently decreased the wound extravasation and shorten healing time.It had the similar effect with that of dry distilled egg yolk oil,was better than that of moisture burn ointment.Compared with that of the control group,the egg yolk oil by ethanol extract had the significant anti-inflammatory effects(P0.01).It had the similar effect with that of dry distilled egg yolk oil(P0.05),was better than that of moisture burn ointment(P0.05).and inhibitory effect on bacteria was better than that of other groups,especially on Staphylococcus aureus.
Conclusion: Ethanol extract of egg yolk oil has obvious effect on promoting scald wound healing.
http://en.cnki.com.cn/Article_en/CJFDTOTAL-KFYZ201202007.htm
Again and again... When I ask you for help you tell me 1000 things, but nothing about what I'm asking for.
First of all, the precise formula for the hydrogel is almost certainly a proprietary blend so you're never going to be able to work out the exact ratio of actives, they're a trade secret and will be patented and licensed to pharma companies.
I bought a few papers. Imma buy 2 more soon. They described the whole process.
Second, do you have a degree in biochemistry? If you can't understand the papers then you really shouldn't bother trying to cook up a batch of hydrogel, its not like baking a cake. We're dealing with some complex, finely-tuned chemistry here, it's something an amateur has no business messing with. You'd need some crazy expensive clinical equipment worth tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it properly anyway.
First, as I said many times before, I'M NOT GONNA COOK IT MYSELF! Second, as I said before more than first, I'M NOT A NATIVE ENGLISH SPEAKER AND I CAN'T UNDERSTAND SCIENTIFIC PAPERS.
Third, say you somehow manage to get your hands on some hydrogel. Then what? It's never been tested on humans, are you willing to take the very real risk of it failing to work properly and being further disfigured? Again, no ethical plastic surgeon will touch this stuff until they know it reliably works so you'd either have to find a corrupt one willing to butcher you or you'd have to do all the excising yourself, which isn't really an option.
I think you're not so ugly as I am. I'm willing to take any risk. Chances are high anyway. I so tired of waiting.
You guys shouldn't worry about what I'm gonna do and how I'm gonna do it. I know what I'm going to do. Just help me with the goddamn papers. You can imagine that I'm not going to do it.
I bought a few papers. Imma buy 2 more soon. They described the whole process.
The WHOLE, ENTIRE process? Are you sure about that? Do they specify weights, units and ratios? The equipment used? Ingredients, sources? Temperature scales? EVERYTHING? It may seem that way but I highly doubt they'd just give away a workable recipe to their competitors after all those millions of invested dollars.
I think you're just wasting your money if you think you'll be able to scrape a proprietary formula together from a bunch of papers, and even if you somehow did that particular formula would be tailored for porcine skin, not human skin.
First, as I said many times before, I'M NOT GONNA COOK IT MYSELF! Second, as I said before more than first, I'M NOT A NATIVE ENGLISH SPEAKER AND I CAN'T UNDERSTAND SCIENTIFIC PAPERS.
None of us native English speakers can fully comprehend those papers either because none of us are biochemistry majors, that should tell you something.
If the person doing the cooking can't understand either (e.g.if they aren't a legit biochemist) then I really don't know what you think you're going to accomplish with this whole endeavor, they're likely scamming you, promising something they can't deliver.
I'm willing to take any risk. Chances are high anyway. I so tired of waiting.
Look, believe me, I know exactly how you feel, I really do. But you seriously risk making a bad situation even worse, it's almost certain that you won't ever be able to replicate the hydrogel properly, in which case you may end up with something that at best does nothing or at worst ends up scarring you even more. Remember, this is still a highly EXPERIMENTAL technology and we still have no idea if it will even work in humans.
Besides, its not like the situation is hopeless, there are other promising avenues to explore in the meantime, you can keep working on your scars with techniques we know work and experiment with various healing agents and oils, the odds of you dramatically reducing your scarring that way are so, so, so much better.
You guys shouldn't worry about what I'm gonna do and how I'm gonna do it. I know what I'm going to do. Just help me with the goddamn papers. You can imagine that I'm not going to do it.
We can't help you with something we ourselves don't properly understand, we're not biochemists, which is what you need.
The WHOLE, ENTIRE process? Are you sure about that? Do they specify weights, units and ratios? The equipment used? Ingredients, sources? Temperature scales? EVERYTHING?
Yep. But I need to buy more papers.
It may seem that way but I highly doubt they'd just give away a workable recipe to their competitors after all those millions of invested dollars.
It's a patented formula. Competitors can't use it anyway.
I think you're just wasting your money if you think you'll be able to scrape a proprietary formula together from a bunch of papers, and even if you somehow did that particular formula would be tailored for porcine skin, not human skin.
They will do the same thing for humans. They can't change the formulation. Chances are high.
f the person doing the cooking can't understand either (e.g.if they aren't a legit biochemist) then I really don't know what you think you're going to accomplish with this whole endeavor, they're likely scamming you, promising something they can't deliver.
Dude, I'm living in a country when English isn't our native languege. They may be good beochemists, but they don't have to khow English. They won't even read these papers, because they are on English. I just need to cut the required info out and then show them.
Look, believe me, I know exactly how you feel, I really do. But you seriously risk making a bad situation even worse, it's almost certain that you won't ever be able to replicate the hydrogel properly, in which case you may end up with something that at best does nothing or at worst ends up scarring you even more. Remember, this is still a highly EXPERIMENTAL technology and we still have no idea if it will even work in humans.
Besides, its not like the situation is hopeless, there are other promising avenues to explore in the meantime, you can keep working on your scars with techniques we know work and experiment with various healing agents and oils, the odds of you dramatically reducing your scarring that way are so, so, so much better.
There are no solutions that can improve my things. I did many treatments and I got a minimum improvement so far. What should I do? Wait another 5 years and sit on hands? I don't wanna waste my time. Neck or nothing.
If don't want to help me, just forget it. I'll find someone else.
Yep. But I need to buy more papers.
If they're truly revealing EVERYTHING about their formula and manufacturing process as you say then why don't you simply e-mail them and ask them to reply with all the details you need? Quick and cheap.
It's a patented formula. Competitors can't use it anyway.
Yes, its a proprietary formula, which means that they legally can and likely do omit manufacturing specifics such as quantities/proportions/ratios, which you need to know in order to accurately replicate the hydrogel.
And competitors can't legally use it in a marketed product but having access to the formula gives them an opportunity to glean information they can then use in developing their own competing products.
They will do the same thing for humans. They can't change the formulation. Chances are high.
With science there is no room for faith, only experimentation and confirmation. Just because you strongly believe something is going to work doesn't mean it will, the list of experimental drugs that worked great in animals but didn't in humans is VAST, hydrogel may well end up on that list in time.
Dude, I'm living in a country when English isn't our native languege. They may be good beochemists, but they don't have to khow English. They won't even read these papers, because they are on English. I just need to cut the required info out and then show them.
Qualified biochemists typically have a functional grasp of English due to being well-educated and reading from/publishing to peer-review journals, which are overwhelmingly Anglophonic. And even if they didn't, chemical formulas are fundamentally language-agnostic, "H2SO4" is the same in every language.
There are no solutions that can improve my things. I did many treatments and I got a minimum improvement so far. What should I do? Wait another 5 years and sit on hands? I don't wanna waste my time. Neck or nothing.
What treatments did you try? Were you aggressive enough? Did you optimize your healing? Were you eating right? Do you smoke? Do you get enough exercise? There are so many factors at play and that gives you lots of room for improvement, that fact that you got some improvement means that you're heading in the right direction, you just need to fine-tune a few things to get moving faster.
And honestly, sitting and waiting for 5 years is a better option than being butchered, which is what is going to happen if you let some shady hack experiment on you.
If don't want to help me, just forget it. I'll find someone else.
I do want to help you, but I'm not qualified to, none of us are. Just do what I said above, contact Gemstone and tell them about your situation and what you're trying to do, maybe they'll decide to help you out.
They can already do that with lasers by rupturing the pigment at varying wavelengths.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tattoo_removal#Mechanism_of_laser_action
I searched for patents filed through India for the cold process with no sucess. It leaves me uncertain/leary about Vav life's product. The fact that they used the burned infant hand images treated with the cherismon also increases my suspicions.
I want to trust other suppliers, but again not being able to find the Vav patent leaves me suspicious of their claims. The patent should be findable in some for if they applied for one.
First off, did Vav Life ever say their extraction method was patented? I've only ever seen the word "proprietary" used, and that doesn't necessarily mean that a patent has been filed, only that the thing in question is a trade secret and is protected by other legal instruments such as non-compete and non-disclosure contracts. This is actually advantageous because these contracts can be stipulated to last in perpituity, unlike patents which have a fixed expiration date. For example, the Coca Cola formula was never patented, its a proprietary recipe that relies on trade secret legislation to enforce secrecy.
VAV Life Sciences has developed a cold proprietary technology for the extraction of oil from chicken eggs which preserves the therapeutic property of the oil.
Protection of trade secret can, in principle, extend indefinitely and therefore may provide an advantage over patent protection, which lasts only for a specific period of time. Coca-Cola, for example, has no patent for its formula and has been very effective in protecting it for many more years than the twenty years of protection that a patent would have provided. In fact, Coca-Cola refused to reveal its trade secret under at least two judges' orders.[7] The disadvantage is that there is no protection once information protected as trade secret is uncovered by others through reverse engineering, for example, whereas patent has a guaranteed time of protection in exchange for disclosing the information to the public.
So there being no patent filed doesn't necessarily suggest something shady, in fact, it's pretty commonplace.
Regarding the burned infant pics. I noticed that too and it bugged me at first but then I looked more closely at the language used and saw that Vav Life never claimed that it was their egg oil (OLEOVA) that was used, only that an egg oil product had been used.
Which is technically correct. So to their credit they weren't misrepresenting that particular thing. That same article also cites a CHARISMON study, though not by name.
Finally, Vav Life Sciences has been around since 2003 and has developed a pretty good reputation by all accounts, they export most of their wares (90%) to the West and have been consistently growing and expanding since their inception, winning several awards along the way. They're actually a big enough company to warrant a Wikipedia article:
VAV Life Sciences Private Limited is an Indian company producing healthcare ingredients including lecithin and phospholipids, with products serving the food, nutrition, pharmaceuticals, cosmetics and drug delivery markets. In recognition of EYOVA hair Nutrient, it was awarded India's Best SME Innovation Award 2013 by Yes Bank & Business Today (business magazine).[1] The company also features in Dun & Bradstreet's list of leading SMEs of India 2014.[2]
Located with research and manufacturing facilities in Vasai (Thane district) near Mumbai, VAV Life Sciences along with its subsidiary VAV Lipids Private Limited, serves the global market with 90% of its sales outside India. In the pharmaceutical segment, VAV Life Sciences presence straddles four main therapeutic areashepatology, neurology, cardiovascular and oncology. The company is also building a new plant for pharmaceutical grade phospholipids at Ratnagiri, a coastal town of western India.[5]
So we're clearly talking about a respectably-sized and reputable biotech company here, not some fly-by-night scam operation, I really don't see them risking the loss of that hard-gained reputation by producing and promoting a product of questionable quality and efficacy, it would ruin their brand to do so.
Also note that they've recieved an award for their EYOVA product, which is essentially OLEOVA for hair, both are egg yolk oil products.
So, considering all the above I think its safe to assume that OLEOVA is the real deal, and I'm actually going to order a liter once I can scrape the money together and see what miracles it can do.
I have tried making egg oil myself but as you mention its a messy process with a ridiculously low yield, so if somebody else can do it better and more efficiently they can take my money.
OK, more egg oil research, this one from another vintage patent filing:
The inventor of the herein disclosed process for extraction of egg oil has also discovered an extremely valuable use for this natural ingredient of egg yolks in addition to its use in feeds or the like. Egg oil extracted by this process has proven to be of exceptional value as a treatment for external human and/or animal burns. If applied on the area quickly after the burn occurs, and with often-repeated application thereafter (preferably at least three or four times a day) in order to keep the burn area moist with the oil, it not only alleviates the pain but also often prevents a scar.
What follows is a step-by-step guide to producing medical-grade egg yolk oil, which can be safely applied to burns and wounds:
An egg, or quite obviously a number of eggs, are placed in boiling water. After the water has again regained the boiling temperature of 212 F. the eggs are boiled for an optimum time period of about twenty (20) minutes. (note that fifteen (15) minutes might be sufficient and even twenty five (25) or thirty (30) minutes may not be harmful, except for reason of total heat-energy economy and efficiency.)
The very-hard-boiled eggs are then taken out of the water and the shells are broken, removed and discarded.
The yolks are separated from the white albumen portions of the hard-boiled eggs; the yolks being retained and the whites discarded or set aside as a by-product for other uses.
The yolks are then placed in a clean, cool, dry cooking vessel, which preferably has previously been sterilized, and the cooking vessel is placed over heat. In about fifteen (15) minutes--depending on the temperature of the heat source--the heating vessel should reach a temperature of 375 to 400 F. and signs of egg oil will begin to appear. By then any semblance of water will have been evaporated. During this preliminary heating period and thereafter during the entire dry-heat cooking period the previously-hard-boiled egg yolks are constantly being mashed and stirred as with a tined instrument or the like.
After continued heating at this same 375 to 400 F. temperature for some five (5) minutes after the vessel has reached this temperature, or until all dry content of the egg yolks has become charred, all of the oil will have been extracted from the egg yolks.
The charred residue of the yolks is removed and discarded and only the pure egg oil remains in the cooking vessel. This is removed and preserved for its future use. Preferably the oil is drained from the cooking vessel into sterile bottles or other suitable containers.
Approximately one (1) liquid ounce of this medically pure oil is obtained from each sixteen (16) ounces, by weight, of hard-boiled egg yolks.
As is apparent, the egg oil obtained by this process has not been subjected to mixture and/or solution with any other ingredient or additive: It has been heated at 375 to 400 F., which is not detrimental to the oil but is much above the accepted medical sterilization temperature of 212 F.
Therefore, the egg oil so obtained can be considered in all respects to be unadulterated, sterile, and medically pure and if maintained in this same condition it is safe for all purposes and uses where such qualities are required or desired.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4219585.pdf
Another patent filing detailing egg oil's healing properties:
Various portions of the avian egg have found use in pharmaceutical and cosmetic preparations. The albumin, or white, of the egg has been utilized in a pliable bacteriostatic coagulum for the treatment of burns as described in The Lancet, Sept. 18, 1943 issue, at pages 351-353. U.S. Pat Nos. 3,194,732 and 3,196,075 set forth a method of assisting the healing process of abraded, cut or burned human tissue with egg-shell membranes from eggs of domestic fowl.
Burns on the human body may be treated by a variety of methods depending on the extent and severity of the burn. Of concern in the therapy is the reduction of the occurance of scar tissue which may remain long after the healing process is complete. An object of the invention in this regard is a burn preparation which allows rapid healing without the formation of permanent scars at the burn site.
It has been found that an excellent pharmaceutical preparation for topical application to burn areas, including first-, second- and third-degree areas, of burn victim may be obtained by the processing of egg yolk. The ointment is prepared by deriving from the yolk an oil consisting largely of fats with additional amounts of protein, carbohydrates, ash and water. Avian eggs are preferable in view of their low cost and their ready availability, e.g. eggs from chickens, turkeys or other fowl.
It then goes into a more detailed overview of previously cited case studies:
In Case 1, a seven year old male human subject had a third degree burn on his face as the result of a kerosene explosion. Egg oil prepared according to the invention was applied five times per day for six weeks for a total of about three ounces. Thereafter, the skin returned to normal with no trace of permanent scar tissue.
Case 2 involved a ten month old boy who had third degree chest burns from a fire. After treatment of the area of the burn five times a day for four weeks with the egg oil prepared in Example 1 for a total application of about two ounces, the skin returned to normalcy without the development of scar tissue.
Case 3 involved a two year old male with a second degree burn of the shoulder and the side of the face from boiling water. Treatment with the oil prepared in Example 1 was carried out for four weeks with five applications over the burn area per day for a total of two ounces of egg yolk oil. Recovery from the burn was complete without scar formation.
In Case 4, a 28 year old woman sustained a second degree steam burn of the right forearm. After the application of one ounce of the egg yolk oil prepared in Example 1 over two weeks at a rate of four applications per day, the skin returned to normal with no trace of scar tissue.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4219544.pdf
Also found a 2015 study:
Chitosan gel formulations containing egg yolk oil and epidermal growth factor for dermal burn treatment
In the present study chitosan based gel formulations containing Egg Yolk Oil (EYO) and Epidermal Growth Factor (EGF) were formulated successfully aiming at enhanced topical treatment of dermal burns the combination of traditional approaches with modern drug delivery systems.
Physicochemical properties of the formulations were analyzed and efficacy of the formulations prepared were evaluated versus a commercial product; Silverdin (1% silver sulfadiazine) in vivo on Wistar rats. Burns were generated on the back of the rats and at predetermined time intervals tissue samples were collected and evaluated histologically.
The analyses showed that chitosan based gel formulations containing Egg Yolk Oil (E1) and chitosan based gel formulations containing EYO and EGF (M1) formulations seem to be better alternatives for Silverdin with a significant difference (p < 0.05) considering healing ranks of tissue samples.
http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/govi/pharmaz/2015/00000070/00000002/art00001?crawler=true
And here is a 2013 study on egg oil's potent anti-inflammatory properties, which certainly figure heavily in it's extraordinary wound healing ability: http://www.europeanreview.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/472-476.pdf
Yes, several. Read the peer-review literature posted over the past few pages, it definitely does seem to have a remarkable effect on burns and wounds, to the point where some even heal without any noticeable scar-tissue.
And on the anecdotal side of things, egg yolk oil has a consistent track record going back to antiquity, its not some brand new revelation.
BTW, this topic is about Scarless Healing, not specifically hydrogel.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/297906.php
JHU able to regenerate skin from wounding including hair follicles
