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42 minutes ago, Jmil3655 said:So what are your thoughts on this? Is it a long term fix over time or will it require constant tanning forever to keep it at bay?
Adequate protein in diet for zinc and retinol binding protein, zero to low vitamin A(~12months), and full body sun exposure whenever you can get it will help(its definitely part of the fix).
1 hour ago, IhateAccutane said:5years passed since my last pill.
I took 40mg/day for two months in 2014 Jan/Feb.
Stopped after I realised that I could not achieve erection.
Other symptoms started after I stopped Accutane.This is the list of my problems ever since:
- ED: Still no connection between penis and brain.
- Shrunken genitals
- No Libido
- Dead flaccid
- No pleasure during ejaculation.
- Tinnitus: still there, biggest concern after ED.
- Vision problems: Floaters are gone by 99%. But I am still night blinded and have some visual snow and double vision.
- Tremors: Gone
- Weak urine: Still there
- Hair condition: I dont have menopause hair anymore.
- Dry eyes, nose, mouth: I never had these.
- Panic attacks, anxiety, suicidal state: Gone
- Energy: Better, just as pre accutane.
- Flexibility: Improved, %80
Have you had your serum retinol tested?
What supps have you tried?
How did you fix flexibility and increase energy?
Under_tow - does anti A fix libido?
12 minutes ago, Calcified said:Under_tow - does anti A fix libido?
Hey @Calcified, that is the hope, and time will tell if we get people reporting their feedback from depleting A.
HyperVitamin A symptom: "edema of the testes followed by atrophy"
PAS and PFS are similar in that they both have reduction in NADPH, one of the foundations of steroid production. Finasteride is a progestin, which blocks breakdown of vitamin A, so there is link there somewhere. Arousal and libido are tied to histamine and estrogen and many other things... I hope that getting A out, will bring back online all those steroids and connections. I lucked out, libido was not completely destroyed, but is back to 100% now, it was my skin that got destroyed.
3 hours ago, under_tow said:Adequate protein in diet for zinc and retinol binding protein, zero to low vitamin A(~12months), and full body sun exposure whenever you can get it will help(its definitely part of the fix).
Any suggestions where to look for information on a low vitamin A diet? Also, is there anything else I can do along with sun exposure to deplete vitamin A quicker?
8 hours ago, under_tow said:Hey @Calcified, that is the hope, and time will tell if we get people reporting their feedback from depleting A.
HyperVitamin A symptom: "edema of the testes followed by atrophy"
PAS and PFS are similar in that they both have reduction in NADPH, one of the foundations of steroid production. Finasteride is a progestin, which blocks breakdown of vitamin A, so there is link there somewhere. Arousal and libido are tied to histamine and estrogen and many other things... I hope that getting A out, will bring back online all those steroids and connections. I lucked out, libido was not completely destroyed, but is back to 100% now, it was my skin that got destroyed.
How does your skin get destroyed? mine too. i keep gettingnew indented scars even from the mildest product i use. its terrifying.
9 hours ago, under_tow said:Hey @Calcified, that is the hope, and time will tell if we get people reporting their feedback from depleting A.
HyperVitamin A symptom: "edema of the testes followed by atrophy"
PAS and PFS are similar in that they both have reduction in NADPH, one of the foundations of steroid production. Finasteride is a progestin, which blocks breakdown of vitamin A, so there is link there somewhere. Arousal and libido are tied to histamine and estrogen and many other things... I hope that getting A out, will bring back online all those steroids and connections. I lucked out, libido was not completely destroyed, but is back to 100% now, it was my skin that got destroyed.
I think A levels are as important as turnover A.
Maybe it's not just reducing A but the increased turnover of A?
Tane could have slowed the process.
Can't help but wonder.
I think the million dollar question is daily requirements for A and zinc after Tane to prevent long-term sides?
11 hours ago, jellyy said:How does your skin get destroyed? mine too. i keep gettingnew indented scars even from the mildest product i use. its terrifying.
Mine was destroyed by extreme sebum production and extreme dry flakiness combined at same time. This is now finally fading away on zero A diet.
4 hours ago, whackutane said:How about cognitive function? Have ou noticed improved memory etc?
Hey @whackutane, so far seeing improved social talking, easier time finding the right words when talking, mood much more positive, sleep has become so much more refreshing, actually feels restorative.
One weird symptom was being clumsy, always dropping things, food, cups, pens, combs, etc, this hasn't cleared yet.
Another thing clearing is the yellowish/orange/brownish hue to skin, especially noticeable around the eyes, upper checkbone, temples. Also hands and feet.
Eyelashes and outer eyebrows starting regrowth and filling back in.
Do anyone know whether ketokenesis decrease the amount of vitamin A in the liver?
I centanlly have experienced ketogenesis avoding gluten and sugar and fruits
My blood test show positive in ketonic bodies.... I have read it is positive when fat from liver is used to produce glucose because of the lack of carbohidrates
So... I dont know whether ketogenesis whould be faster to decrease VA in liver.
12 hours ago, Francisco..Blanquez said:Do anyone know whether ketokenesis decrease the amount of vitamin A in the liver?
I centanlly have experienced ketogenesis avoding gluten and sugar and fruits
My blood test show positive in ketonic bodies.... I have read it is positive when fat from liver is used to produce glucose because of the lack of carbohidrates
So... I dont know whether ketogenesis whould be faster to decrease VA in liver.
I think I read somewhere even though fasting lowers the VA it's not the process, it's the reduced intake, so from that I assumed ketosis does nothing.
The job we have to do is to reduce the size of our liver. It is done by the ketogenesis process and... maybe avoiding VA. I supposethere must be a balance. Avoiding fruit, sugar and any sweet thing must be a must, for sure(It is based on my own experience and that reading about fatty liver yesterday I found someone tellingabout an experiment showing that). Them our source of energy could be rice, potatos, oat, fat... but fat coming from no VA suplemented foods or animals. It is a fight between cravings, and fatty liver and illness.
Aphysiotherapisttold me yesterday that he can know who have a fatty liver just using his hands. It also can be sawusing ultrasounds...echography like in pragned women.
So might be job to do and the way to check the progress
I am just wondering if some one could address somebasic questions on the topic. I have come to realize today just how profound the changes might actually be. Here are some of the things that I at least suspicious of, I am feeling so hopeless right now I really can't put it into words.
Well first off, this is a chemotherapy drug, no body tells us that until it is too late,
Here what I suspect are some of the symptoms, these seem to be changes in my phenotypes,
1. A compromised endocrine system including severe damage to the adrenal glands and reproductive system. This is where the most drastic change has occurred, my stress response does not work the way that it used to. Not to mention I have no libido and shrunken testicles.
2. A damaged digestive system, my metabolism has seemingly slowed down dramatically
3. An inability to socialize like I used to. It almost seems like I have developed antisocial personality disorder. I simply do not feel the same range of emotions that I used to.
4. An inability to think straight or remember things like I used to.
5. A neediness for other people, I used to be so much more independent. I simply do not have the ability to take care of myself in the same ways.
6. A constant acheyness in my joints, My joints seem to be highly susceptibleto feeling pain.
7. A general lack of motivation and what I would call a moderate depression.
I simply do not feel like the same person. Right now I am just trying to manage symptoms but there doesn't seem to be any way to do this because there seems to be no way to reverse the epigenetic changes that have happened. If I was the person that I was before accutane I would be so pissed off butI have lost my ability to even get angry. I don't recognize myself anymore and no one seems to have any idea what I might be going through. I used to be able to run 5 miles at a time, now it is hard to just run a mile. I feel like I used to be a respectable person despite my acne but at this point nobody in my life respects me because of the person that I have become. Everyone says that life is not fair but this seems to be a level of unfairness that I did not think was possible. I used to be capable of creativity but now it is just gone. It seems like the only thing that has not been changed is my genetic code, or wait, it also causes telomere shortening never mind.
Here arethe questions that I have,
1. What do we actually understand about reversing the epigentic changes that have occurred?
2. Has the damage all ready been done on an epigenetic level so it can not be reversed?
1 minute ago, Calcified said:What do you mean by natural vitamin A ?
Well, I have not such an expertise.
But they say that Accutane provides you with a bad version of Vit A. It works more like a steroid which damages your liver in someway giving you symptoms like brain fog, blurred vision, depression, fatigue etc.
This is a link for example:
https://drlwilson.com/ARTICLES/DRUGS-QUITTING.htm
I am just looking for a number of succesful stories...
Currently, I am following the program where we also join a WhatsApp chat with many affected by accutane.
They claim that they have fixed accutane issues.
But please just refer to those practitioners if you are interested.
I am just trying it out.
F
10 minutes ago, Flondon said:Well, I have not such an expertise.
But they say that Accutane provides you with a bad version of Vit A. It works more like a steroid which damages your liver in someway giving you symptoms like brain fog, blurred vision, depression, fatigue etc.
This is a link for example:
https://drlwilson.com/ARTICLES/DRUGS-QUITTING.htm
I am just looking for a number of succesful stories...
Currently, I am following the program where we also join a WhatsApp chat with many affected by accutane.
They claim that they have fixed accutane issues.
But please just refer to those practitioners if you are interested.
I am just trying it out.
F
Sorry, I meant are you taking beta carotene or palmitate or acitate vitamin a supplementation?
1 hour ago, Flondon said:Palmitate.
Do you think it's ok?
Palmitate is synthetic vitamin A, since it has fatty acid tail attached to the retinol it bypasses the body's retinol metabolism pathway, no safety checks. I would never supplement it.
Accutane is just a mirror image of retinoic acid, it is not a steroidal version of vitamin A, the COOH carboxylic acid group on accutane is just flipped over. This one change allowed it to be patented and can be sold for profit as a prescription.
Retinoic acid = C20H28O2 (9-cis-)
Accutane = C20H28O2 (13-cis-)
Getting VA out is being tested now, and is looking like the right solution.
11 minutes ago, Calcified said:If concerned speak to doctor, liver tests etc.
You taking zinc too?
Yes, I do
4 minutes ago, under_tow said:Palmitate is synthetic vitamin A, since it has fatty acid tail attached to the retinol it bypasses the body's retinol metabolism pathway, no safety checks. I would never supplement it.
Accutane is just a mirror image of retinoic acid, it is not a steroidal version of vitamin A, the COOH carboxylic acid group on accutane is just flipped over. This one change allowed it to be patented and can be sold for profit as a prescription.
Retinoic acid = C20H28O2 (9-cis-)
Accutane = C20H28O2 (13-cis-)
Getting VA out is being tested now, and is looking like the right solution.
Thanks for your response.
Any useful link to low vit A diet arguments and successful stories?
1 hour ago, under_tow said:Palmitate is synthetic vitamin A, since it has fatty acid tail attached to the retinol it bypasses the body's retinol metabolism pathway, no safety checks. I would never supplement it.
Accutane is just a mirror image of retinoic acid, it is not a steroidal version of vitamin A, the COOH carboxylic acid group on accutane is just flipped over. This one change allowed it to be patented and can be sold for profit as a prescription.
Retinoic acid = C20H28O2 (9-cis-)
Accutane = C20H28O2 (13-cis-)
Getting VA out is being tested now, and is looking like the right solution.
Palmitate still has to be converted into retinoic acid, converts to Ra forms, not just 13 CIS.
5 minutes ago, Calcified said:Palmitate still has to be converted into retinoic acid, converts to Ra forms, not just 13 CIS.
Palmitate is the preferred method of storage in the body, eating it is not normal, supping with it synthetically you are just increasing your vitamin A load in fat tissues(skin).
"Naturally occurring forms of vitamin A include retinol, retinol esters, retinal and retinoic acid. The alcohol form, retinol, predominates in the circulation but it is too toxic for storage. Instead, the liver stores retinol as retinyl esters - principally palmitate."
"The vitamin-A palmitate added to our staple foods is a manmade molecule. It is manufactured by combining vitamin-A with palmitic acid (a fat). But, vitamin-A palmitate is a dirty, sneaky trick to play on the body. When cells believe that they are taking up a lipid, its really a toxic lipid because it now has the vitamin-A molecule attached to it. For the most part, in the context of all human evolution, this molecule is completely unnatural in the human body. Not only is vitamin-A palmitate added to our foods, but its also added to many cosmetic products, including many sunscreens."
By eating VAP "...it more readily accumulates in tissue than what regular vitamin-A does. They claim that vitamin-A Palmitate is the primary storage form in the skin - yet they skim over the little detail that it is a synthetic molecule, and therefore, it should maybe not be accumulating in the skin at all."