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2 hours ago, whackutane said:He does make incredibly convincing arguments though, and yes we PAS sufferers are probably at a whole new level with how we have been afflicted, yet we were still quite simply at the mercy of whatclearly was vitamin a toxicity. To dispute that is plain ignorant.
Its a bandwagon Im more than comfortable with jumping on when hearing some posters here have suffered for 20+ years. A 6 month vit a elimination diet should be a walk in the park and a drop in the ocean in regards to that timescale.
Its certainly valid to look into but we really should divide ourselves into 2 groups - those with damage to repair and those who just feel they have toxic levels of Vit A to deal with
At the extreme end Accutane can cause bowel cancer - thats a fact,would any amount of avoiding Vit A counteract this - I dont think so. Thats damage or injury that needs addressing in a specific manner.
As Ive said, I currently have a dysfunctional HPA to deal with - no amount of either consuming Vit A or avoiding it is going to fix this dysfunction.
So youve got to ask yourself what you want out of the anti A diet, it might be perfect if youve just got some toxicity to deal with and no real damage but on the other hand if youve got bigger problems I think you need to address in a smarter way which involves more than just fasting or avoiding A or gluten or sugar etc.
As I said, my situation has finally been diagnosed after years of bullshit frustration working with well intentioned but incapable Medical GPs, theyve offered nothing in the way of repair.
Like mykinesiologist says - by all means go see a GP to put out the house fire but in terms of rebuilding the house they just dont know what to do
See a kinesiologist to rebuild the house - its a slow process but I feel Im on track.
4 hours ago, guitarman01 said:my 500 to 700 iu of vitamin a in my milk and cereal is a drop in the bucket compared to Accutane,
and if its not gone after 20 years already, eliminated this kind of amount probably isn't going to make a lot of difference. your also looking at one of the end products in Accutane right?retinoic acid. it skipped the conversion steps, maybe these conversion steps are normally a safety measure.
I will agree that any excess vitamin a is not the best idea. For some reason we were having a problem with it in the first place,not everyone does to the same extent apparently.
As far as trapped in tissues, wouldn't this be obvious in some murine studies?
They know when women can get pregnant again without risk of birth defects, so how does that work?
This is spot on. It skipped the conversion steps.
Sometimes the body stops doing stuff when it doesn't have to.
Vitamin a does help my digestion, but I am not recommending anyone taking it as we don't really know what's going on in the liver.
Guitarman01 - do you suspect high liver stores or low liver stores of esters?
Lots of different theories out there.
What are peoples thoughts on this link?
5 hours ago, Calcified said:
Lots of different theories out there.
What are peoples thoughts on this link?
It stops the breakdown/depletion of vitaminA
12 hours ago, TrueJustice said:So youve got to ask yourself what you want out of the anti A diet, it might be perfect if youve just got some toxicity to deal with and no real damage but on the other hand if youve got bigger problems I think you need to address in a smarter way which involves more than just fasting or avoiding A or gluten or sugar etc.
Retinoic acid destroys stem cell, by not depleted it from storage, no healing will begin, and proper protein synthesis needed for repair will be impaired. Whether it is impaired in skin(acne), pancreas(diabetes), HPA(CFS), lungs(asthma), bowels(IBS, Chrons), liver, until it is gone, nothing will heal you.
Retinoic acid bypasses all the proper retinol metabolism steps, allows it to sink right into cells and stay there, if you haven't fasted or done long term low vitA it is still in the cell screwing things up.
Like @whackutane said, doing low A is simple and everyone should be trying this. I am seeing the results first hand, and so are the users on Grant's forum.
I will continue to report back, as I progress, I want to see all of us progress!
https://butternutrition.com/vitamin-a-detox-diet/
Thanks under_tow for informacion about low vitamin A diet.
I have to recongnice that last year I was feeling better than now in the free gluten and sugar diet. When I noticed that when I started eating (chucrut) red cabbage... I felt good but.. not as very good as before that. I was not sure why, because I also was going to the dentist and thought it could have been due to antibiotic o so.
But yes, maybe red cabbage is full of vit A because of its colour. Actually I'm also having cod liver oil so... it seems to be the perfect storm. And my eyes hurt a bit so that maybe the reason, overdossage of vitamin A. I feel good because of vit D on cod liver oil but also felt something wrong, the vit A I suppose. Thank again for the information
Health Risks from Excessive Vitamin A
info from theNational Institutes of Health
Because vitamin A is fat soluble, the body stores excess amounts, primarily in the liver, and these levels can accumulate. Although excess preformed vitamin A can have significant toxicity (known as hypervitaminosis A), large amounts of beta-carotene and other provitamin A carotenoids are not associated with major adverse effects. The manifestations of hypervitaminosis A depend on the size and rapidity of the excess intake.
The symptoms of hypervitaminosis A following sudden, massive intakes of vitamin A, as with Arctic explorers who ate polar bear liver, are acute. Chronic intakes of excess vitamin A lead to increased intracranial pressure (pseudotumor cerebri), dizziness, nausea, headaches, skin irritation, pain in joints and bones, coma, and even death.
Although hypervitaminosis A can be due to excessive dietary intakes, the condition is usually a result of consuming too much preformed vitamin A from supplements or therapeutic retinoids. When people consume too much vitamin A, their tissue levels take a long time to fall after they discontinue their intake, and the resulting liver damage is not always reversible.
Hypervitaminosis A
Hypervitaminosis A is having too much vitamin A in the body.
There are two types of vitamin A hypervitaminosis: acute (caused by taking too much vitamin A over a short period of time), and chronic (occurs when too much of the vitamin is present over a longer period).
Complications of vitamin A toxicity include: excessive calcium levels, kidney damage due to high calcium, liver damage. In infants, the children may fail to thrive.
On 2/19/2019 at 10:55 AM, Francisco..Blanquez said:I think our problem is not in the colon (in same particular case maybe too). Fecal replacement is done there, in the colon. Our problem is in the small intestine and stomach.
When you do 16hours fasting you feel good even whenyou have not donne poo...
I think our lining was damaged, the same our libs. Them some good bacteria had not a good place to live and others like fungus or yeast took place. It makes microholes in the intestines hence permeability. The liver is working a lot because of the toxins yeast and fungus produce.
Maybe the lack of energy come from there, a stresed liver, and the lack of some very important vitamins like b12, folic acid, D, and maybe some more since the intestine is damaged and can not absorb them properly.
A theory for the problem digesting fats is that because of the micropores in our intestines... acids can go to our body... so our pH is lower ( I think lower mean more acid and higher more alcaline). So to keep a balanced accidity our liver produce lessaccids...which are needed to digest fats.
On 2/19/2019 at 11:18 AM, Francisco..Blanquez said:Why you feel good when doing fasting? Because the liver is not stresed.
That bad bacteria are not metabolising food and producing toxins which stress the liver. When the liver works well tiroids works better and hormones can be produced .
Moreover, the food metabolised by that fungus and yeast.... are gluten and sugar (included fruit and maybe all kind of sweet thing(not sure because there is a lot of sweeteners)). That is why you feel much better, like cured, when you do a "NO ALMOST" free gluten and sugar diet. Anyway each oneshould investigate for the better food
So.... vitamin A is the missing link, roaccutane is Vitamin A.
We have fatty liver because of the hipervitaminosis so.. it doesnt work properly, dificult to digest gluten and sugar.... hence all our problems.
2 hours ago, Francisco..Blanquez said:
So.... vitamin A is the missing link, roaccutane is Vitamin A.
We have fatty liver because of the hipervitaminosis so.. it doesnt work properly, dificult to digest gluten and sugar.... hence all our problems.
I have read scientists are looking into vitamin A to treat fatty liver.
Also I do note that scientists also suspect retinoic acid/vitamin A prevents obesity.
Yet I also have read studies implying accutane treatment can facilitate metabolic syndrome, I do find it difficult to maintain a healthy weight.
This is more what im looking at right now, a disturbance in commensal bacteriathat never came back, only to be replaced by less desirables that dont serve much benefit.
Our intestinal microbiome influences metabolism -- through the immune system
Study teases out how 'good bacteria' keep us metabolically fit
- June 21, 2018
- The innate immune system, our first line of defense against bacterial infection, has a side job that's equally important: fine-tuning our metabolism.
- https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/06/180621172437.htm
- Watnick and her colleagues knew from their previous research that bacteria living in flies' intestines make a short-chain fatty acid, acetate, that is essential for the flies' own lipid metabolism and insulin signaling.
"When there's a problem processing glucose or lipids, fats get stuck in these droplets in cells that are not designed for fat storage," she says.
The new study again used fruit flies, which are easy to breed and manipulate genetically, and have cell types in their intestines much like humans'. When Watnick and colleagues examined flies with mutations in the IMD innate immune pathway, they again saw fat droplets in their intestines.
Watnick believes these fat droplets, whether caused by loss of intestinal bacteria, loss of tachykinin or loss of the innate immune pathway, are the equivalent of fatty liver. Their accumulation is a sign that the body cannot properly metabolize carbohydrates and fats. In essence, Watnick thinks these flies have metabolic syndrome, commonly associated with obesity and type 1 diabetes.
1 hour ago, Calcified said:Also I do note that scientists also suspect retinoic acid/vitamin A prevents obesity.
Could also be the cause:
3 hours ago, Calcified said:I have read scientists are looking into vitamin A to treat fatty liver.
Also I do note that scientists also suspect retinoic acid/vitamin A prevents obesity.
Yet I also have read studies implying accutane treatment can facilitate metabolic syndrome, I do find it difficult to maintain a healthy weight.
I suppose those scienticics also knows the side efects of vitamin A overdossage and wouldrecongnice ours as some of them. Unless Roche pharmaceutics pay them to say the opossite...
Cant speak for everyone but its super dangerous to fast if you have chronic fatigue- for me that is by way ofHPA dysfunction
Some of us are pretty fucking zapped after 21 years of this onslaught so if youre in the early years itmight be ok but be careful recommending fasting to everyone.
9 hours ago, TrueJustice said:Cant speak for everyone but its super dangerous to fast if you have chronic fatigue- for me that is by way ofHPA dysfunction
Some of us are pretty fucking zapped after 21 years of this onslaught so if youre in the early years itmight be ok but be careful recommending fasting to everyone.
I tried intermittent fasting with low carb in the eating window and it was fine while doing it, but I found myself becoming very intolerant to food. I was taking supplements but still felt it didn't do me any good, like 1 step forward 2 steps back. My vitamin a intake was low, like guitarman01 I have never had a big vitamin a intake.
Hello there,
Meet another accutane sufferer. Got ED after taking only 1 accutane pill. Thats a lot of reading here for me. I've read on propecia forum a coincidental recovery from PrEp medication. But haven't tried myself yet. There arealso some official studies going on regarding both PFS and PAS, since they have same mechanism.but i guess we need to wait.
43 minutes ago, trak said:Hello there,
Meet another accutane sufferer. Got ED after taking only 1 accutane pill. Thats a lot of reading here for me. I've read on propecia forum a coincidental recovery from PrEp medication. But haven't tried myself yet. There arealso some official studies going on regarding both PFS and PAS, since they have same mechanism.but i guess we need to wait.
PAS,PFS,ED, PrEp? Sorry, I dont know that mean
Hello Ladies,
If you are suffering from hormonal acne you must read up on Aldactone. It is usually prescribed in combination with Glycifage for cases of PCOD etc. I have been on this regiment for the last 3 months (Aldactone 50mg, Glycifage 250mg) and it working wonders and giving me my sanity back. Unfortunately, Aldactone is not a treatment for guys as it increases progesterone in the body.
Also, please emphasize a good topical regiment and avoid accutane, antibiotics, birth control pill and B5 vitamin. In my case, I barely had 2 -3 pimples and was prescribed these medicines with out any serious discussion about long term effects, and dependency on them to keep clear skin. They resulted in severely screwing up my gut bacteria. and creating several chronic problems including dermatitis, poor digestion, foggy memory, skin more susceptible to sun damage and freckle/ age spots, severe hair fall, swollen breasts nodules resulting in ultra sound etc.
You could try natural oils use Oil of Oregano and probiotics and look into fixing your diet and exercise. Improving digestion is really really important.
I hope that helps someone out there. I have been struggling for the last decade and I wish I had found Aldactone sooner.
16 hours ago, TrueJustice said:Cant speak for everyone but its super dangerous to fast if you have chronic fatigue- for me that is by way ofHPA dysfunction
Some of us are pretty fucking zapped after 21 years of this onslaught so if youre in the early years itmight be ok but be careful recommending fasting to everyone.
I had chronic fatigue, thyroid, cortisol, blood sugar issues... all the good stuff accutane brings, my first round of accutane was 23 years ago.
Long water fasts help immensely, removes fat where retinoic acid is stored, and depletes vitamin A very quickly.
You will feel way better after some short or long water fasts.
3 hours ago, malika585 said:Hello Ladies,
If you are suffering from hormonal acne you must read up on Aldactone. It is usually prescribed in combination with Glycifage for cases of PCOD etc. I have been on this regiment for the last 3 months (Aldactone 50mg, Glycifage 250mg) and it working wonders and giving me my sanity back. Unfortunately, Aldactone is not a treatment for guys as it increases progesterone in the body.
Also, please emphasize a good topical regiment and avoid accutane, antibiotics, birth control pill and B5 vitamin. In my case, I barely had 2 -3 pimples and was prescribed these medicines with out any serious discussion about long term effects, and dependency on them to keep clear skin. They resulted in severely screwing up my gut bacteria. and creating several chronic problems including dermatitis, poor digestion, foggy memory, skin more susceptible to sun damage and freckle/ age spots, severe hair fall, swollen breasts nodules resulting in ultra sound etc.
You could try natural oils use Oil of Oregano and probiotics and look into fixing your diet and exercise. Improving digestion is really really important.
I hope that helps someone out there. I have been struggling for the last decade and I wish I had found Aldactone sooner.
Spironolactone (Aldactone) is a potassium sparing drug, this actually lowers progesterone so estrogen raises higher, due to being un-opposed by prog.
Higher estrogen means that vitamin A is not being broken down properly, so its like being on accutane and stops acne, this is not a cure and in the long run will harm you.
Depleting vitamin A is the cure.
4 hours ago, trak said:PAS = Post accutane syndrome, PFS = Post finasteride syndrome. Prep = medication to treat/ prevent HIV.
Thanks. Well, I would have been happy if someone had told me 30 years ago that I would feel much better in a free gluten and sugar diet.
In case theyreally care people afected be acutane.... I think they would inform them about a healthy diet mainwhile they investigate to find a cure...
PLEASE READ. Again, the gut is where we can start to solve all of our problems. I went to the hospital multiple times this month due to extreme polyneuropathy throughout the body, spine and brain. Come to find out that it could be caused by kidney damage caused by leaky gut. I dont think this is a vitamin A issue.
Gut-> liver -> kidneys-> nervous system/ brain
Chronic kidney disease (CKD) is a state of accelerated cardiovascular disease, whereby the latter remains the #1 cause of death in this patient population [1]. Non-traditional risk factors contributing to cardiovascular pathology in CKD include chronic inflammation, oxidative stress, protein-energy wasting, disordered mineral metabolism, and deficiency of endogenous calcification inhibitors [24]. With respect to chronic inflammation, a multitude of dialysis and non-dialysis related factors likely play a role including infection, intravenous iron administration, blood-dialyzer interface, and preexisting heart failure [5,6].
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4485546/#idm139812883439488title
Fix gut with low Potassium fibrous complex carbohydrates, pre and probiotics, include foods high in activating NRF2 pathway BROCCOLI SPROUTS.
1 hour ago, StopAccutane said:
PLEASE READ. Again, the gut is where we can start to solve all of our problems. I went to the hospital multiple times this month due to extreme polyneuropathy throughout the body, spine and brain. Come to find out that it could be caused by kidney damage caused by leaky gut. I dont think this is a vitamin A issue.
Gut-> liver -> kidneys-> nervous system/ brain
Chronic kidney disease (CKD) is a state of accelerated cardiovascular disease, whereby the latter remains the #1 cause of death in this patient population [1]. Non-traditional risk factors contributing to cardiovascular pathology in CKD include chronic inflammation, oxidative stress, protein-energy wasting, disordered mineral metabolism, and deficiency of endogenous calcification inhibitors [24]. With respect to chronic inflammation, a multitude of dialysis and non-dialysis related factors likely play a role including infection, intravenous iron administration, blood-dialyzer interface, and preexisting heart failure [5,6].
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4485546/#idm139812883439488title
Fix gut with low Potassium fibrous complex carbohydrates, pre and probiotics, include foods high in activating NRF2 pathway BROCCOLI SPROUTS.
Please read this https://ggenereux.blog/2019/02/05/protein-synthesis-and-setbacks/
Depleting vitamin A will fix your gut. If anti, pre and probiotics were the answer, everyone would already be cured.
3 hours ago, StopAccutane said:
PLEASE READ. Again, the gut is where we can start to solve all of our problems.
Nah.
1 hour ago, under_tow said:Please read this https://ggenereux.blog/2019/02/05/protein-synthesis-and-setbacks/
Depleting vitamin A will fix your gut.
Says that the cells may be permanently damaged. If that's the case, then achieving an ideal ratio may require supplementation rather than depletion. A lot of us have abstained from Vitamin A for many years post Accutane only to see slight symptom improvements in hair loss, dry nose, lips, skin..However lethargy, depression, night blindness, digestion issues remained.
Most alcoholics and smokers can make full recoveries upon cessation of their toxic drug, however this is not apparent when it comes to Accutane. At least not neurologically.
I actually feel quite better when supplementing with beta carotene (along with the rest of my stack). Although, like one European suggested, it may be more beneficial to fix the "fried receptors" consuming natural occurring vitamin A in plants/meat.
8 hours ago, malika585 said:Hello Ladies,
If you are suffering from hormonal acne you must read up on Aldactone.
Create a new thread, you know, one with a specific title and topic.