For any new guys looking for a bit of inspiration check out Connor McElvain on this forum. You can access him on page 68/69 then start with his earliest post. It looks to me like he started his story then went away and worked on his health and then returned to share his progress.
Unfortunately i couldn't access any of his videos - they maybe on youtube - I will have a look.

Indigo by the way has not fully recovered.
But he has moved on from accutane, has a girlfriend and is an animal rights activist.

Norepinephrine Boosting Foods

The amino acid tyrosineis the basic building block of norepinephrine.

You can eat foods that contain either tyrosine or phenylalanine, another amino acid that converts into tyrosine.

Virtually all animal products are good sources of both tyrosine and phenylalanine.

The foods that increase norepinephrine will be very similar to those that increase dopamine.

You can find a complete list offoods that increase dopaminehere.

Hereare some foods known to specifically increase norepinephrine: (19)

• bananas
• beans and legumes
• chicken
• cheese
• chocolate
• eggs
• fish and seafood
• meat
• oatmeal

13 hours ago, hatetane said:

For any new guys looking for a bit of inspiration check out Connor McElvain on this forum. You can access him on page 68/69 then start with his earliest post. It looks to me like he started his story then went away and worked on his health and then returned to share his progress.
Unfortunately i couldn't access any of his videos - they maybe on youtube - I will have a look.

Indigo by the way has not fully recovered.
But he has moved on from accutane, has a girlfriend and is an animal rights activist.

Indigo should of stuck around, I enjoyed his posts. I think back around the time he left it got heated on the forum and he felt hurt or something - I dunno.

The other guy who knew his stuff was Chico - where's he at these days??

I'm assuming I do all the things these guys do i.e have a career and girlfriend etc but to say he's moved on but still has all the problems associated with tane sounds a bit like denial, each to their own though I guess.

Generally speaking I find people's resolve and tenacity on this forum in searching for answers quite remarkable. I get more out of it than any Dr or specialist I've ever seen, in fact these days I find myself leaving them with more info than they can provide and it all comes from this forum.

21 hours ago, hatetane said:

Norepinephrine Boosting Foods

The amino acid tyrosineis the basic building block of norepinephrine.

You can eat foods that contain either tyrosine or phenylalanine, another amino acid that converts into tyrosine.

Virtually all animal products are good sources of both tyrosine and phenylalanine.

The foods that increase norepinephrine will be very similar to those that increase dopamine.

You can find a complete list offoods that increase dopaminehere.

Hereare some foods known to specifically increase norepinephrine: (19)

• bananas
• beans and legumes
• chicken
• cheese
• chocolate
• eggs
• fish and seafood
• meat
• oatmeal

Symptoms of Low Norepinephrine / Low NorAdrenaline (Signs of Low NorAdrenaline Levels)

https://area1255.blogspot.com/2016/03/symptoms-of-low-norepinephrine-low.html

Norepinephrine Deficiency and Prolonged Stress

In the early stages of prolonged or severe stress, the stress response system is overactive and norepinephrine and other adrenal stress hormone levels are typically elevated. This increases arousal, amplifies the emotional reaction to stress, and can manifest asinsomnia,anxiety,depression, irritability, or emotional instability.

But prolonged stress leads to underactivity of the stress response system, resulting in norepinephrine deficiency, along with cortisol and epinephrine depletion.[1] This lowers arousal and can result inlow energy, daytime fatigue, concentration/focus issues, and general apathy.[1]

Since norepinephrine is made from dopamine (with the help of copper and vitamin C), taking precursors to dopamine, such as the amino acids tyrosine and phenylalanine, may help to boost low norepinephrine levels.

http://universityhealthnews.com/daily/depression/surprising-research-challenges-our-understanding-of-norepinephrine-deficiency/

I've heard several different things. Are we copper deficient or copper toxic?

Are we Th1 or Th2 dominant? I have severe rosacea flushing and severe ocular rosacea, which I believe stems from chronic inflammation and an imbalance resulting in an autoimmune disorder that simulates lupus and thyroid symptoms. Would I need to boost my Th1 or Th2 to deal with this inflammation problem?

I guess what I'm asking is do we (people with lingering side effects from accutane) tend to be Th1 or Th2 dominant? Has that been talked about?

I've done just about everything under the sun for inflammation but nothing has worked and now I'm at a loss.

Will tyrosine supplements help its probably one of the only few things I haven't tried

11 hours ago, brendan452 said:

Will tyrosine supplements help its probably one of the only few things I haven't tried

I am not trying to be rude but I would really like to know what everything includes?
A survey on the propecia forum show that only 75% of PFS get tested!

Have you been extensively tested?
Do you have any irregularities? - studied your own blood test results, not taken doctor's word on it!
If you think or believe you have a hormonal imbalance have you tried fasting, cutting out carbs, any other extreme diet (paleo, juicing),
infrared saunas and carefully thoughtout exercise program. (many say no-fap helps)
It seems that many, I am not suggesting you are one of them, are still looking for the magic bullet that will reverse the damage caused by
prescribed meds. Many are completely lethargic and are not addressing the basics which actually might make a real difference.
Being pro-active is not about going on forums it is about real action.
I am not picking on anyone directly but we all need to be honest with ourselves.

We need a survey and a members story thread.
A recoveries thread. TRT thread etc.

Trying this and that and reporting within days that massive improvements have been made - then reporting crashes and back to square one is just not helpful.

Maybe we also need a long list (tick box) for things tried, found helpful/ not found helpful.
We really have a lot to do guys!

http://aminoacidstudies.org/pine-bark-extract-and-arginine-highly-effective-erectile-dysfunction-treatment/

Just came across this randomly. Thought I'd post it for those of you who still have this problem. I know it's probably not a cure or anything. Just doing what I can. Keep fighting!

https://www.pegym.com/forums/erectile-dysfunction-forum/79944-27-y-o-ed-pe-prostatitis-pelvic-floor-propecia.html

Have a look at what Mr Free T has to say.

https://www.scribd.com/doc/222400050/The-Secret-That-Doubles-Testosterone

I'm all for getting blood tests and accumulating data etc - I've lost count of how much I've done over the years!

I'm also all for having the right amount of testosterone in me each day - totally agree BUT not much good if RECEPTORS are screwed guys!!

Does anyone have any info preferably coming from an Endocrinologist who should know this stuff without us bringing it up. It's one thing to look at panels and say there's nothing wrong but most blood test results will indicate things maybe on the low side but not anything major.
Without receptors working properly though it's all pointless, we'll never be the same!

Some of us are being proactive. I personally have converted to a plant based fruit based diet and exercised for years vigorously with minimal changes in symptoms. And still regardless of poor diet and minimal exercise you will still get clean blood work back, albeit some irregularities in cholesterol when I first did them, and in my case I've seen my TSH (Thyroid stimulating hormone) tank from 2 to about .48 in a period of 2 years. Technically "within range". Even it seems our Vitamin A is in normal range and not in the toxic range, however i'm still exhibiting symptoms of toxicity considering my night blindness.

What seems to have been done has been on a cellular level. Changing our physiology and phenotype through a process of genetic transcription. Big stupid words that I don't like to use more less a doctor hear a patient use.

It is such b.s. to both us the patient and doctors who are on the front line and have to deal with the mess that big pharma causes. And there is so much red tape in between a patient (guinea pig) to even have a conversation with a molecular biologist (most of whom are employed by a pharmaceutical company) who are the only ones capable of solving our issues. We need to get scientists involved somehow.

53 minutes ago, macleod said:

and in my case I've seen my TSH (Thyroid stimulating hormone) tank from 2 to about .48 in a period of 2 years. Technically "within range".

I'm sure the thyroid angle gets brought up, every now and again. It's yet another one of those things we always get back as "low-normal" so we discard it and move on to something else. As I always say, we probably all have something different wrong. But we know Accutane can impact the thyroid. A lot of our symptoms match hypothyroidism pretty well, but a lot of conditions can look like that disease. That, and even if you narrow down your issues to that particular diagnosis, hypothyroidism is difficult to treat in the context of modern medical dogma. T4 treatment is the go-to, but many require more complex interventions to actually feel better. In researching that corner of the internet, it seems many patients banded together in recent years to develop better treatment protocols (addition of T3 or natural desiccated thyroid). This post sums up the complexity of thyroid treatment and why conventional T4 may not be enough, even if T4 is supposed to convert to T3 in the body. I've been knee-deep trying to understand this thyroid mess for a few days now. It's definitely an angle I want to experiment with.

My biggest impediment is getting the blood work done in the first place! Apparently, TSH can be useless for detecting hypothyroidism for some. The test can be fickle as well. Living in New York, I cannot order any blood tests without a doctor's order. I have no idea why such a restriction would possibly exist. All that will do is potentially encourage reckless self-experimentation if doctors don't order the tests patients now know are most useful. Doctors can be stubborn in looking for the same clues for everybody, when the issue may be more layered than we once believed.

Stop the Thyroid Madness sums up patients' grievances with the medical establishment's detection, treatment, and knowledge of hypothyroidism. Again, it's quite a rabbit hole. Just keep this idea in the back of your mind. Perhaps one thyroid test, or a failed response to T4 treatment, isn't enough to discount the possibility of hypothyroidism. That goes for EVERYBODY here. Remember, hypothyroidism is associated with everything to skin dryness, sexual issues, pain, hair loss, cognitive disturbances, psychiatric problems, etc. Never stay married to one theory.

Little update on my 15th day of TRT. I've finally obtained my Dec 2016 E2 result; 146 pmol/L, from 84 in june. Something I did between June and Dec lowered my total T (505 to 434), and almost doubled my E2. Might be some remnants of MK-2866. My next blood test will be mid-march, so we'll get to know how Androgel helps me. I'll be taking 1g of CdG daily this month to maybe help keep my E2 in check, along with usual supplements such as vit C and vit D, but nothing else that would strongly affect my hormones.

I think I'm doing better, but nothing much to write home about. Mentally I feel just fine, and physically not any different than usual. Libido hasn't improved at all, if anything it might be lower. I've gained ~6 pounds over the past two weeks and am effectively up to 152 from ~135 3 months back. Strength has definitely increased and I look in better shape. People started commenting on me looking in shape just one week into TRT. Odd.

I maintain some hope that this is it. I understand it takes a couple weeks to fully take effect so I'll just be patient for now.

I met the andrologist a second time this Monday and she showed me the door after 2 minutes. Did not care to discuss, just wanted to be sure I wasn't dying. I obtained the contact to what appears to be the most knowledgeable Endocrinologist locally. It's private so I'll have to pay, but I'll get in touch with him ASAP.

I've obtained a meeting with a neurologist this Friday. I will request for a CT Scan and verify how my pituitary gland looks.

3 hours ago, Kynarr said:

Little update on my 15th day of TRT. I've finally obtained my Dec 2016 E2 result; 146 pmol/L, from 84 in june. Something I did between June and Dec lowered my total T (505 to 434), and almost doubled my E2. Might be some remnants of MK-2866. My next blood test will be mid-march, so we'll get to know how Androgel helps me. I'll be taking 1g of CdG daily this month to maybe help keep my E2 in check, along with usual supplements such as vit C and vit D, but nothing else that would strongly affect my hormones.

I think I'm doing better, but nothing much to write home about. Mentally I feel just fine, and physically not any different than usual. Libido hasn't improved at all, if anything it might be lower. I've gained ~6 pounds over the past two weeks and am effectively up to 152 from ~135 3 months back. Strength has definitely increased and I look in better shape. People started commenting on me looking in shape just one week into TRT. Odd.

I maintain some hope that this is it. I understand it takes a couple weeks to fully take effect so I'll just be patient for now.

I met the andrologist a second time this Monday and she showed me the door after 2 minutes. Did not care to discuss, just wanted to be sure I wasn't dying. I obtained the contact to what appears to be the most knowledgeable Endocrinologist locally. It's private so I'll have to pay, but I'll get in touch with him ASAP.

I've obtained a meeting with a neurologist this Friday. I will request for a CT Scan and verify how my pituitary gland looks.

Not sure if you suffer from head pressure or not but ask them about the possibility of increased cerebrospinal fluid post tane??

keep us posted on CT Pituitary scan - I'm very curious about what they may discover with us tane victims....good luck.

1 hour ago, TrueJustice said:

Not sure if you suffer from head pressure or not but ask them about the possibility of increased cerebrospinal fluid post tane??

keep us posted on CT Pituitary scan - I'm very curious about what they may discover with us tane victims....good luck.

Will do. I have been having ophthalmic migraines since more or less the time I began Accutane. Not quite sure if it was a month before or after beginning treatment. I'll try to obtain the history to see whether it's correlated or not. I've been having many this year so far, it's becoming difficult to maintain a normal life when I can't see crap half the time and my head just hurts non stop.

Did anybody try/stick with the protocol from the youtube video '8 tips reversing accutane side effects?'

I know quite a few of us were taking calcium d glucarate for a while, some with good results, but curious if anybody tried all the recommendations?

The video mentions pale stools are a sign of cholestasis, which I do have. I think I'm going to give that protocol a try a long with LDN. Will let you all know how I get on.

Those on LDN - what's the best way to obtain it, how did you raise it with Dr?

I mentioned to my GP the other day only briefly as I was there to discuss cholesterol results more than anything but when I mentioned LDN for chronic fatigue she'd never heard of it!!?

Those who are on it, did you just say to your Dr I want to be on it - write me a script??

How many repeats are you on too??

On 2/3/2017 at 5:31 AM, TrueJustice said:

Those on LDN - what's the best way to obtain it, how did you raise it with Dr?

I mentioned to my GP the other day only briefly as I was there to discuss cholesterol results more than anything but when I mentioned LDN for chronic fatigue she'd never heard of it!!?

Those who are on it, did you just say to your Dr I want to be on it - write me a script??

How many repeats are you on too??

I bought mine at [removed] (no script needed)

Also a couple of months back, Joseph Buchignani mentioned an online Dr. that would write scripts for it as well.

On 1/31/2017 at 11:39 PM, tryingtohelp2014 said:

https://www.scribd.com/doc/222400050/The-Secret-That-Doubles-Testosterone

So anyone up for trying this?

I guess everyone has had folate and B12 tested but how many of you have actually had homocystine, Vit A, K2, magnesium, iodine and selenium checked?
Basic Vit and minerals - I am guessing not many.

http://www.foodforthebrain.org/alzheimers-prevention/methylation-and-homocysteine.aspx
All of you must know that accutane causes raised homocysteine - Print of this fact, take it to the doctor and insist on a test.
If you are having cognitive, memory or depression problems this test is a must.

Also there is the very long PFS list as posted previously.
I really doubt that anyone is able to post all the the above test results.

When you go to your doctors you should be asking them to consider you as a PFS sufferer in the absence of anyone who acknowledges accutane damage and to arrange any test that a PFS patient would get.
Even this isn't easy as many doctors don't believe or have knowledge of PFS.

So you see guys - there is still so much more that we could all be doing to get to the bottom of this.

S

21 hours ago, starrfeesh said:

Did anybody try/stick with the protocol from the youtube video '8 tips reversing accutane side effects?'

I know quite a few of us were taking calcium d glucarate for a while, some with good results, but curious if anybody tried all the recommendations?

The video mentions pale stools are a sign of cholestasis, which I do have. I think I'm going to give that protocol a try a long with LDN. Will let you all know how I get on.

You have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Would be interesting to get numbers as to how many tried this protocol.
So good luck and let us know how you get on.
Did you know they have the same guy on youtube but for PFS!

2 hours ago, TrueJustice said:

Those on LDN - what's the best way to obtain it, how did you raise it with Dr?

I don't even bother trying to bring up alternative treatments to conventional doctors. As another alluded to, IRC.BIO is one source. However, they recently got caught selling an impure product on their site (MK-677). Granted, MK-677 is a trickier compound to synthesize than Naltrexone. Another option is to buy from an overseas pharmacy such as Antiaging-Systems. Many CFS sufferers rely on that pharmacy for medications their doctor refuse to prescribe or their insurance won't cover. The same risks of buying supplements/meds online apply to this pharmacy as any other, but they're known for their reliability.

Lastly, I can attest to the legitimacy of LDN Doctor. You will have to pay $210 for the first online visit (in which you will likely acquire a prescription), and then you will have to pay $120 every six months for a renewal of the prescription. The medication itself is $50 for a three month supply of 4.5 mg pills. But you may not need to dose that high, so you won't need to refill as often. If you do require full-dose and use LDN Doctor, your grand total (appointments + medicine) will be $530 for a year supply for the first year and $440 for every subsequent year. If you buy DIRECTLY from an online pharmacy, you will likely spend $45-$50 for a month supply of 4.5 mg pills, so that's approximately $540 per year, plus shipping.

As I may have stated before, I love the concept of online doctors because you know exactly what you're getting into before spending money and time. That being said, does anyone know of reputable online thyroid doctors? Thank you.

2 hours ago, hatetane said:

I guess everyone has had folate and B12 tested but how many of you have actually had homocystine, Vit A, K2, magnesium, iodine and selenium checked?
Basic Vit and minerals - I am guessing not many.

I have had alot of these test.
folate,b12 homocysteine, vit a, magnesium and selenium were all well within range.
have had tsh, free t4 in range
looking at my testosterone granted this was from 2013 but many,many years post accutane it was 738, my free testosterone was 23 out of 30 max
dhea was 5.9
had c reactive protein test
copper test
zinc
vitamin d
vitamin c
cortisol
sjogren's
calcium
vitamin e
iron
immunoglobulins a/e/g/m
a lipid panel
b1
biotinidase.
A couple test if I could just snap my fingers and take to continue to rule things out,
there is no test for vitamin k2 but maybe the closest thing would be a osteocalcin blood test.
also test the active form of vitamin d 1,25
a sibo breath test for methane and hydrogen
a gastrin blood test
a test to measure gastric acid output
pancreatic enzymes blood test
a bone density test.
thats just at the top of my head.

Therapeutic hotline. Does isotretinoin have effect on vitamin D physiology and bone metabolism in acne patients?

1 hour ago, ACCUiTy_drANE said:

I don't even bother trying to bring up alternative treatments to conventional doctors. As another alluded to, IRC.BIO is one source. However, they recently got caught selling an impure product on their site (MK-677). Granted, MK-677 is a trickier compound to synthesize than Naltrexone. Another option is to buy from an overseas pharmacy such as Antiaging-Systems. Many CFS sufferers rely on that pharmacy for medications their doctor refuse to prescribe or their insurance won't cover. The same risks of buying supplements/meds online apply to this pharmacy as any other, but they're known for their reliability.

Lastly, I can attest to the legitimacy of LDN Doctor. You will have to pay $210 for the first online visit (in which you will likely acquire a prescription), and then you will have to pay $120 every six months for a renewal of the prescription. The medication itself is $50 for a three month supply of 4.5 mg pills. But you may not need to dose that high, so you won't need to refill as often. If you do require full-dose and use LDN Doctor, your grand total (appointments + medicine) will be $530 for a year supply for the first year and $440 for every subsequent year. If you buy DIRECTLY from an online pharmacy, you will likely spend $45-$50 for a month supply of 4.5 mg pills, so that's approximately $540 per year, plus shipping.

As I may have stated before, I love the concept of online doctors because you know exactly what you're getting into before spending money and time. That being said, does anyone know of reputable online thyroid doctors? Thank you.

Thank you for info.

let me ask- what do think would come back if you weren't to take LDN??

Do you think less energy, the brainfog might return?

just doing my homework!!

1 hour ago, TrueJustice said:

Thank you for info.
let me ask- what do think would come back if you weren't to take LDN??
Do you think less energy, the brainfog might return?

It helps my IBS symptoms and tolerance for foods. For example, vegetables are much easier on me now. Cognitively, I have noticed my verbal fluency improve a bit. I notice less dissociation symptoms. There's definitely been an improvement in my thinking. Sleep is deeper, appetite is lower (the less I eat, the less my tummy can complain). I still need other supplements to manage my low moods and anhedonia, though. Others say LDN is great for managing depression, so you won't know until you try. My physical energy has always been fine. I can work long days and conclude my day with a hard workout. My biggest issue has always been my MENTAL energy and feeling adequate stimulation from life. In other words, I may be able to go through the motions, but I'll feel like a zombie. Best of luck. Hopefully LDN will allow me to have a mental breakthrough at some point. Again, it's a drug intended to be taken long-term due to its numerous corrective mechanisms. My successes along the way encourage me to keep going with it!

If you took accutane avoid CLA (conjugated linoleic acid) supplements at all cost. I used some a few months ago and feel ill and toxic. I feel like I rebounded. Joints hurts more, libido is dead, depression is back and T levels are 300. It had been "stable" in the 500's for a while. Also, my cholesterol and triglycerides are high. Something they never were before.

This study explains why. CLA makes the liver dump retinols into circulation..

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2759834/

I stopped the CLA a couple months ago but the effect lingers. I've been taking vitamin E and it seems to help a bit. Makes sense now.

Oh, and folic acid seems to be helping in terms of methylation and mood. Folinic and methylfolate make me feel lethargic and depressed.

My body also warmed up with folic acid and my chronic cold hands and feet disappeared! Iodine didnt help much if at all for this problem and I dont have any MTHFR mutations so felt safe to use folic versus the other two kinds.