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2 hours ago, Kynarr said:Results are in.
Total T: 434 (15nmol/L)
SHBG: 47 nmol/L
Prolactin: 7 ug/L
FSH: 2.4 Ul/L
LH: 1.1 Ul/L
PSA: 0.83 ug/L
Estradiol: Missing from the results.SHBG is down by 3. Total T is down from 505by a lot, considering how hard I've been trying to increase it. PSA is up from 0.65.
So that's the results of 6 months of intensive research and experiments with CdG, Iodine, MK-2866, vit K, magnesium, LongJack, DIM, vit C..
I like your angle on Fox01. I tried researching that angle once, felt stupid, and gave up. It seems it was brought up in the past and nothing came of it anyway. That obviously doesn't mean it's wrong, but it's easy to dismiss one angle in this MESS and move on to another theory. That being said, I may try MK-677 and add another anecdote to the mix, but I'm not interested in supplementing it long-term. I need to research more about what happens when you stop it, above all.
But why are you trying MK-2866 if your goal is to raise testosterone? I have read studies and anecdotes that confirm SARMs obliterate testosterone levels and lower SHBG as well. In fact, some people incur long term problems from them. And like 5-alpha reductase inhibitor withdrawal syndrome, the issue isn't so easy to correct. I'd be very careful with that. (You probably know this already, so I'm curious to know where you're coming from.) When I got off Accutane, my testosterone was at 376. I got it up to 550 by eating red meat and eggs daily. But my cholesterol is clinically undetectable now a days, so I have no idea where to go from here.
Hi Accutane thread,
About time I bit the bullet and posted here, Ive been reading this thread and other forums for years now
A little bit about me:
I took generic Accutane (Amnesteem) in 2005 for 5 months (some 20mg, some 60mg). Had severely chapped lips and a dry face while I was on it, but my cystic acne cleared up.
In the months following coming OFF Accutane is when something strange started happening most notably three things:
-I became severely depressed, like crying everyday for no reason depressed.
-I became incredibly tired all the time, like having to take naps after class to make it through the day.
-Perhaps the most troubling of all, my dick stopped working like Im talking full blown ED out of nowhere. Never had a problem before that. (In fact I can remember specifically not having this problem just earlier that same year).
Now keep in mind, I had no idea this might have been related to the Accutane. I wouldnt make that connection until years later. Might even have been this thread, pretty sure it was actually that IndigoRush guy on Youtube at the very least
I chalked it up to stress/college and continued on with my life the best I could. In 2006, I asked my doctor for Viagra because my dick would not work, at all. I was 21 years old at the time. Long story short fast forward to today, 11 years after I took Accutane
I have tried seemingly everything and attributed this to a bunch of different things over the years (Candida / IBS / Lyme Disease (got bit by a tick in 2008) / Sleep Apnea) but Im reluctantly starting to think that yes, it was in fact the Accutane that set this all in motion.
Here are my current side effects:
-Depressed/numb/dont feel like myself (Put brain fog in this category too.)
-Still tired, up until a couple months ago I was sleeping in my car at lunch and pulling over on the drive home from work because I was too tired to continue driving feeling a little better now (more on that in a minute.)
-I have a white coating on my tongue constantly, comes back after scraping it off (anybody else have this?)
-Severely dry eyes all the time.
-Frequent urination, like embarrassingly frequent (this side is relatively new as of a couple years ago)
-My dick still does not work, and honestly, this is the one Im looking for a solution for out of all of it
What really got me to post is what Ehohel is trying. DHT protagonists / Estradiol inhibitors might be the way forward in this mess honestly not sure, and I know nobody here knows either.
I know Finasteride users have similar issues to Accutane users, but PropeciaHelp isnt much help.
Is there a good forum / discussion board besides this one that I should be aware of? Is anybody trying to organize an actual coherent website for this rather than random forum postings all over the internet?
Anyway, I will share what I believe is working for my tiredness issues if anybody else is having a similar issue:
I am taking Jarrows brand Methyl B-12 5000 mcgs/day, Jarrows D-3 5000 mcgs/day, and Jarrows B-Right (one every other day). No I am not a Jarrows fanboy, just have a lot of experience by now with different supps and these seem to work. I am also on 100MG of Minocycline 2 times a day for the past 3 or so months.
I dont know what is working and what isnt, but I do know I am significantly less tired and blah than I was just a few months ago, and truly believe these meds/supps have made the difference. I hope they can work for somebody else.
Oh and by the way, I still get cystic acne to this day.
4 hours ago, brandon0717 said:Kynarr's post just gave me some insight into why the pilocarpine drops are working for me. The Fox O1 genes, which seem to be upregulated by isotretinoin and it's metabolites, are dystegulated by insulin. The pilocarpine is an M3 Muscarinic acetylcholine agonist and the pancreas has many of these receptors which modulate glucose homeostasis and glucose secretion. It may not be specifically reversing isotretinoin effects, but atleast it may be counter-acting them, and for a significant duration. I just took another dose a few days ago and oddly it seems even more potent. The first time it took several doses over the course of 72 hrs for me to notice the reduction of all my symptoms.
Ok so you get a good response from Pilocarpine, further up the page ehohel mentions the great results from Anastrozole - what are the differences between these drugs???
Anybody?
On 12/21/2016 at 10:44 AM, ACCUiTy_drANE said:I like your angle on Fox01. I tried researching that angle once, felt stupid, and gave up. It seems it was brought up in the past and nothing came of it anyway. That obviously doesn't mean it's wrong, but it's easy to dismiss one angle in this MESS and move on to another theory. That being said, I may try MK-677 and add another anecdote to the mix, but I'm not interested in supplementing it long-term. I need to research more about what happens when you stop it, above all.
But why are you trying MK-2866 if your goal is to raise testosterone? I have read studies and anecdotes that confirm SARMs obliterate testosterone levels and lower SHBG as well. In fact, some people incur long term problems from them. And like 5-alpha reductase inhibitor withdrawal syndrome, the issue isn't so easy to correct. I'd be very careful with that. (You probably know this already, so I'm curious to know where you're coming from.) When I got off Accutane, my testosterone was at 376. I got it up to 550 by eating red meat and eggs daily. But my cholesterol is clinically undetectable now a days, so I have no idea where to go from here.
MK-2866 was an attempt to find something that helps me build muscle without yet dabbing into steroids. As it's very minimally suppressive and I only took it for 4 weeks, I figured why not. If I go on to take Androgel... well, this, without a doubt, will obliterate my natural Testosterone levels. I currently have zero confidence that supplementing Testosterone in this way will fix my issues, rather I'm afraid it will complicate everything. I researched SARMs a lot and MK-2866 is reported to have no sides, unlike older SARMs such as Andarine (S4). MK-677 is another one that appears relatively straightforward in its approach. I'm definitely not worried about trying it, but I'll be looking for an update from Ehohel as I'm burnt out from trying things left and right these past few months.
I've really just split my approach in two. On one side I focus a lot on hormones, and on the other on detoxifying. Maybe my hormone approach will make more sense to you from my thread on the Bulletproof forums, I've received a lot of answers suggesting many different things to try..
[Edited link out]
I too like the FoxO1 angle. The first study I linked is by far the most complete piece of data and evidence we have of the impact of Accutane. The people who published this study know their stuff. This is why, maybe, MK-677 will be my last attempt before giving Androgel a try. In the mean time, well I'm really bummed out about my T being even lower than in June. I've yet to look into it, but I think my LH/FSH signaling is low. I think this would confirm my theory that the pituitary gland doesn't signal properly. I'll keep taking Iodine.
With all these different things that we are all trying but not getting the results we want, we have to start concluding that there is indeed damage we have to deal with in regard to either the glands or our receptors. The average person probably does respond well to all these drugs & supplements but for us tane victims we might be dealing with a damaged Pituitary or hypothalamus or something, until it's fixed we ain't going to get anywhere.
Im not going to use the word "permanent" in all this as the optimistic side of me still believes there's a way out of this mess!
At the moment it feels like we're trying to fix a broken arm by taking a calcium supplement - it just ain't gonna work...
God bless everyone's efforts though!!!
9 hours ago, TrueJustice said:Ok so you get a good response from Pilocarpine, further up the page ehohel mentions the great results from Anastrozole - what are the differences between these drugs???Anybody?
Anastrozole is an aromatase inhibitor. Pilocarpine is an M3 muscarinic acetylcholine agonist. The pilocarpine seems to have many endocrine gland receptors
On 12/19/2016 at 3:28 PM, Kynarr said:@tanedoutI don't sweat and my face skin is very dry. Where does that leave me? Getting DHT tested is not currently an option. I take creatine and lift weights.@JustmomI was dosing 3g CdG per day. I'd recommend 1g three times a day as it clears the system within 5 hours. I felt much, much better on it. Most of my IBS symptoms had gone away. Skin was less dry, and I felt in a better place mentally. I'm not sure if I've kept its benefits now that I'm done with this trial. I haven't taken any for two months. I took a total of 90g. I suggest you look at my post history as I wrote quite a bit on it.
As for glucuronolactone, I haven't played much with it. I'm not even sure if it acts the same, though from what I've read it's safe to take in higher dosages too, especially as it's calcium-free. I will experiment again with these two compounds later down the road, but despite feeling better, I believe these helped convince me that we are not dealing with a vit A toxicity issue. At least not primarily.
I'm totally confused as to why you would say taking calcium d Glucarate and having symptoms improve convinced you that you're not dealing with vitamin A toxicity...that makes no sense to me.
Still seeing great results with sustain alpha - feel i have more energy, libido is at about 90%, and have been having spontaneous erections (in contrast to NOTHING before). Skin is definitely more oily (yet still need humidifiers everywhere), appetite is up, fatigue is down, seems like I don't excessively sweat as much, muscles are harder. Time to fall asleep is definitely much shorter. Feel happier, more confident. Other things I am doing - trying to avoid having more than 5 drinks more than once a week, smoking a lot of cannabis, lifting very heavy weights, and with no aerobic exercise; eating broccoli for DIM, taking zinc, taking align probiotics, and doing no PMO. Not noticing much cognitive improvement, but I have been smoking a ton.
What's interesting is that a lot of stuff that seems to work for both accutane and propecia sufferers (Resveratrol [main ingredient in sustain alpha], zinc, and vitamin e) are some of the strongest downregulators of FOX01. Look at https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/foxo1/#all-ways-to-decrease-gene . So, if you wanna take that angle.. i think we can confirm that that is something some people can work on. I feel I am going to be back to normal within half a year with my current level of sustained progress. Try to avoid reading negative posts.. can't deny that you can psychologically make this condition worse than it is in reality. A healthy lifestyle can fix anything, time and effort is all you need
On 12/21/2016 at 12:26 PM, Kynarr said:MK-2866 was an attempt to find something that helps me build muscle without yet dabbing into steroids. As it's very minimally suppressive and I only took it for 4 weeks, I figured why not. If I go on to take Androgel... well, this, without a doubt, will obliterate my natural Testosterone levels. I currently have zero confidence that supplementing Testosterone in this way will fix my issues, rather I'm afraid it will complicate everything. I researched SARMs a lot and MK-2866 is reported to have no sides, unlike older SARMs such as Andarine (S4). MK-677 is another one that appears relatively straightforward in its approach. I'm definitely not worried about trying it, but I'll be looking for an update from Ehohel as I'm burnt out from trying things left and right these past few months.
I've really just split my approach in two. On one side I focus a lot on hormones, and on the other on detoxifying. Maybe my hormone approach will make more sense to you from my thread on the Bulletproof forums, I've received a lot of answers suggesting many different things to try..
[Edited link out]I too like the FoxO1 angle. The first study I linked is by far the most complete piece of data and evidence we have of the impact of Accutane. The people who published this study know their stuff. This is why, maybe, MK-677 will be my last attempt before giving Androgel a try. In the mean time, well I'm really bummed out about my T being even lower than in June. I've yet to look into it, but I think my LH/FSH signaling is low. I think this would confirm my theory that the pituitary gland doesn't signal properly. I'll keep taking Iodine.
I feel totally fine, even started working out yesterday again yesterday, and catching up with friends, setting up a date soon. Inflammation is gone (but the damage in joints from fucking with them over and over while they wont heal is still there obviously) but I'm combating that with TB-500 + mk-677. Depression is gone, brain fog gone, getting perfect sleep, bloating is 90% gone, no longer pissing outta my ass, having solid shits, feeling pump in my muscles from these last few workouts. Still sorta anxious, but I've always had anxiety, but it's nowhere near the levels it before. Over all I feel great, only thing to hope for is the effects remain long term/forever. Slowly working on piecing my life back together. Not sure how long I'll stay on the anastrozole, but I plan on staying on mk-677 for about a year, just because of the many many benefits with basically no side effects. Also unfortunately I've noticed that I'm starting to get some oil on my nose + forehead. I liked how my face was dry, but not crispy dry, but seems like I'm getting oil again and a few pimples. 
I do plan on doing a cycle of mk-2866 just for the bone/tendon healing properties + helping me bulk up quicker while working out (main reason). And the small possibility of suppression doesn't really bother me since I'm basically already doing PTC (anastrozole)
Do any of you guys have the muscle wasting feeling as well? Sometimes if I go a couple of weeks from physical activity and then one day have a somewhat strenuous day requiring any physical effort next day have muscle soreness as if all of the physical activity I did throughout the year disappeared in weeks. Normal for a 60 year old. but a 28 year old in his "prime"... ridiculous.
Every joint still cracking and popping.
You know what we need to do is get a bunch of Roche scientist to reverse engineer accutane and find a way to put the oil back in us and within our skin. i'd do anythingto have my oily acne and healthy glands working again.
8 hours ago, Weltschmerz47 said:Still seeing great results with sustain alpha - feel i have more energy, libido is at about 90%, and have been having spontaneous erections (in contrast to NOTHING before). Skin is definitely more oily (yet still need humidifiers everywhere), appetite is up, fatigue is down, seems like I don't excessively sweat as much, muscles are harder. Time to fall asleep is definitely much shorter. Feel happier, more confident. Other things I am doing - trying to avoid having more than 5 drinks more than once a week, smoking a lot of cannabis, lifting very heavy weights, and with no aerobic exercise; eating broccoli for DIM, taking zinc, taking align probiotics, and doing no PMO. Not noticing much cognitive improvement, but I have been smoking a ton.
What's interesting is that a lot of stuff that seems to work for both accutane and propecia sufferers (Resveratrol [main ingredient in sustain alpha], zinc, and vitamin e) are some of the strongest downregulators of FOX01. Look at https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/foxo1/#all-ways-to-decrease-gene . So, if you wanna take that angle.. i think we can confirm that that is something some people can work on. I feel I am going to be back to normal within half a year with my current level of sustained progress. Try to avoid reading negative posts.. can't deny that you can psychologically make this condition worse than it is in reality. A healthy lifestyle can fix anything, time and effort is all you need
Interesting, what were your hormone numbers before?
10 hours ago, TrueJustice said:So ehohel - you don't feel the need to take iodine or CBD oil or LDN or Pilocarpine??
By taking anastrozole does this mean no need to take Pilocarpine?
I'm still following iodine protocol until I run out,but haven't noticed it do anything ever. Never taken cbd, will probably take ldn some time later cause I already bought it so might as well see what that's all about.
Anastrozole and pilocarpine have nothing to do with each other.
19 hours ago, Weltschmerz47 said:Still seeing great results with sustain alpha - feel i have more energy, libido is at about 90%, and have been having spontaneous erections (in contrast to NOTHING before). Skin is definitely more oily (yet still need humidifiers everywhere), appetite is up, fatigue is down, seems like I don't excessively sweat as much, muscles are harder. Time to fall asleep is definitely much shorter. Feel happier, more confident. Other things I am doing - trying to avoid having more than 5 drinks more than once a week, smoking a lot of cannabis, lifting very heavy weights, and with no aerobic exercise; eating broccoli for DIM, taking zinc, taking align probiotics, and doing no PMO. Not noticing much cognitive improvement, but I have been smoking a ton.
What's interesting is that a lot of stuff that seems to work for both accutane and propecia sufferers (Resveratrol [main ingredient in sustain alpha], zinc, and vitamin e) are some of the strongest downregulators of FOX01. Look at https://www.selfdecode.com/gene/foxo1/#all-ways-to-decrease-gene . So, if you wanna take that angle.. i think we can confirm that that is something some people can work on. I feel I am going to be back to normal within half a year with my current level of sustained progress. Try to avoid reading negative posts.. can't deny that you can psychologically make this condition worse than it is in reality. A healthy lifestyle can fix anything, time and effort is all you need
Great to hear about the positive results! How many pumps are you using? Do you apply this daily and have you experienced any low-e sides and had to adjust your dosage at all? Any other notable sups you're taking, just the SA and MJ?
12 hours ago, macleod said:Do any of you guys have the muscle wasting feeling as well? Sometimes if I go a couple of weeks from physical activity and then one day have a somewhat strenuous day requiring any physical effort next day have muscle soreness as if all of the physical activity I did throughout the year disappeared in weeks. Normal for a 60 year old. but a 28 year old in his "prime"... ridiculous.
Every joint still cracking and popping.
You know what we need to do is get a bunch of Roche scientist to reverse engineer accutane and find a way to put the oil back in us and within our skin. i'd do anythingto have my oily acne and healthy glands working again.
Yes, right here. Im 6'1, 210 lbs. 60 of those pounds are pure fat that I cant get rid of. I have virtually no muscle maas.despite working out, protein, etc. I wasnt like this before tane. Anyway, anticatabolocs like hica and hmb help.
5 hours ago, ehohel said:I'm still following iodine protocol until I run out,but haven't noticed it do anything ever. Never taken cbd, will probably take ldn some time later cause I already bought it so might as well see what that's all about.Anastrozole and pilocarpine have nothing to do with each other.
Thats my point!!
How are people experiencing earth shattering results from two completely different products???
Energy, less brain fog, better libido - if I'm not mistaken these drugs are working on the same things but why/how?
Just trying to connect the dots that's all, glad you're on the road to recovery!
48 minutes ago, TrueJustice said:Thats my point!!How are people experiencing earth shattering results from two completely different products???
Energy, less brain fog, better libido - if I'm not mistaken these drugs are working on the same things but why/how?
Just trying to connect the dots that's all, glad you're on the road to recovery!
Well he did take hydrocortisone before, I really think that has to do with it the most. Maybe placebo has a role in here too.
14 hours ago, mikez said:Interesting, what were your hormone numbers before?
fortunately, they were pretty revealing. i obviously have far too low DHT and perhaps SHBG and that is my issue. my total test looks ridiculously low for an athletic 20 year old male (it is in the range of 85-100 year olds, in fact), until you look at SHBG and calculate free testosterone in which case it's fine (you can calculate it online.. my albumin = 4.8).. estrogen doesn't look too high, till you look at SHBG and compare it to the test. so i am clearly dealing with perpetually inhibited 5-alpha reductase (type ii i think), an excessively low T:E ratio for any male at any age, and low SHBG. the latter confuses me so im not even addressing it, just the 5ar/dht and t:e ratio for now.
as a side note - LH was 1.1 as a result of accutane before I changed my lifestyle, attitude, etc guys. that is why lifting weights and thinking positive shit helps.
i took 120mg/day for about 5 months 15 mos ago. i also took a course when i was 15. i am 20 yo, 5'9", 165, 15%BF. my acne was mild.
DHT LC/MS/MS - 20 Range: 16-79
DHT, Free - 2.10 Range: 1.00-6.20
FSH - <0.7 Range: 1.6-8.0
LH - 3.0 Range: 1.5-9.3 (This has gone up.. right after accutane it was 1.1)
Progesterone - <0.5 Range: <1.4
Test. Total - 389 Range: 250-827
Estradiol - 25 Range: <39
Sex Hormone Binding Globulin - 13 Range: 10-50
3 hours ago, tanedout said:Great to hear about the positive results! How many pumps are you using? Do you apply this daily and have you experienced any low-e sides and had to adjust your dosage at all? Any other notable sups you're taking, just the SA and MJ?
1 pump, i think im about a week in but id have to check. gonna progress to three pumps and then taper back down. i weigh 165 so 3 is recommended. im not rubbing it on my genitals like it says to, thats just weird and there's no way where its absorbed in the skin is gonna significantly affect much. i am however rubbing it on my chest primarily in case im wrong, as i developed mild gynecomastia immediately after stopping accutane. not very bad, but i had an mri where the docs like yeah thats not muscle, though. haha
not really, i contribute my current wellbeing to primarily SA, cannabis, resistance training and diet, abstinence from binge drinking more than once a week, NoFap, zinc, and align probiotics.. and in that order. im also taking creatine but i dont notice it affecting anything besides my musculature. biotin fixed my hair. the study where it says creatine raises dht is super not very well done.. i dont think creatine effects hormones, besides maybe IGF1. im taking a fw other miscellaneous things that are not relevant
oh and ALSO! that lab was taken just BEFORE starting the SA. dont know what they are rn.
@Weltschmerz47My bloods show low LH and FSH too, which seems to be a common thing, along with low T. SA should increase LH and FSH, so I've got some on order to try. Things that raise T seem to help me, but the issue I alway run into is E becomes too high. I felt fantastic for 4-5 weeks taking 3 heaped teaspoons of pine pollen per day - really confident, rock hard morning glory etc, then started to get high e symptoms like very sensitive nipples, so had to stop. Interesting to see how SA goes as the reservatrol should prevent e spiking (I expect low e sides will be more likely on this stuff)
- FSH = 2.1 iu/L (1.0 - 9.0)
- LH = 2.6 iu/L (1.0 - 9.0)
- Prolactin = 147mu/L ( < 550)
- Testosterone = 13.1 nmol/L (8.0 - 30.0)
- SHBG = 36 nmol/L (13.0 - 71.0)
- Cortisol = 563 nmol/L (150-600)
- DHT = 4.1 nmol/L (0.9 - 2.90)
thats why i think the most important thing for accutane sufferers to do is lose fat and gain muscle. mostly the former. cuz all that fat is what contains aromatase.. which steals all your testosterone and converts it to estrogen. i figure if i maintain this muscle mass and lose a few more percent body fat that is a permanent solution, assuming i maintain that body composition (looks good enough that im motivated to do so).
whats interesting to note is that my older brother also developed accutane after a high dose second course of isotretinoin. played number one singles on a d1 tennis team, one of the best players in the nation.. couple months after stopping, quit tennis, and lost erectile function. viagra stopped working for him and he convinced himself on his volition it arose from accutane. i did not suggest the idea to him. additionally testosterone injections have not worked. guess ill get him a bottle of SA for christmas!
additionally, meniere's disease runs in my family. it has been associated with retinoic acid deficiency, where the body doesnt make enough.
based on the fact that both my brother and i were effected and share genetics, and that latter association, i would say individuals who have some kind of predisposition to an enzyme deficient in synthesizing retinoic acid are those who are susceptible to persistent accutane side effects after cessation.
i think the reason non-gi side effects only affect males and is hormonal is because the testicles have a significant amount of that enzyme.
somebody should try taking a Retinoic Acid Receptor / nuclear receptor antagonist and see what happens..
3 hours ago, Weltschmerz47 said:fortunately, they were pretty revealing. i obviously have far too low DHT and perhaps SHBG and that is my issue. my total test looks ridiculously low for an athletic 20 year old male (it is in the range of 85-100 year olds, in fact), until you look at SHBG and calculate free testosterone in which case it's fine (you can calculate it online.. my albumin = 4.8).. estrogen doesn't look too high, till you look at SHBG and compare it to the test. so i am clearly dealing with perpetually inhibited 5-alpha reductase (type ii i think), an excessively low T:E ratio for any male at any age, and low SHBG. the latter confuses me so im not even addressing it, just the 5ar/dht and t:e ratio for now.as a side note - LH was 1.1 as a result of accutane before I changed my lifestyle, attitude, etc guys. that is why lifting weights and thinking positive shit helps.
i took 120mg/day for about 5 months 15 mos ago. i also took a course when i was 15. i am 20 yo, 5'9", 165, 15%BF. my acne was mild.
DHT LC/MS/MS - 20 Range: 16-79
DHT, Free - 2.10 Range: 1.00-6.20
FSH - <0.7 Range: 1.6-8.0
LH - 3.0 Range: 1.5-9.3 (This has gone up.. right after accutane it was 1.1)
Progesterone - <0.5 Range: <1.4
Test. Total - 389 Range: 250-827
Estradiol - 25 Range: <39
Sex Hormone Binding Globulin - 13 Range: 10-50
My DHT is 2.2 on a 0.7 - 5.1 ref range. I was glad that it wasn't at least obliterated as at one point I thought that might be the main culprit. If only I knew what it was before accutane.
So, the sustain alpha blocks estrogen and contributes to some elevated test by doing that, correct? Which of the supps you are taking is addressing your 5AR inhibition? Just wondering...or does sustain do that also?
14 minutes ago, Mike San said:My DHT is 2.2 on a 0.7 - 5.1 ref range. I was glad that it wasn't at least obliterated as at one point I thought that might be the main culprit. If only I knew what it was before accutane.
So, the sustain alpha blocks estrogen and contributes to some elevated test by doing that, correct? Which of the supps you are taking is addressing your 5AR inhibition? Just wondering...or does sustain do that also?
the sustain alpha does a lot. and also keep in mind im not a sustain alpha fanboy, or even transdermal fanboy. i think you could probably take the same ingredients orally and be fine -- no idea. look up resveratrol and 7,8 benzoflavone. those are the two ingredients.
about 5ar, not doing much man. i figure by increasing testosterone while lowering / modulating estrogen, i will produce more DHT through increased availability of T for conversion and thus increased 5AR action, while not having to worry about high e2 arising from too high testosterone causing an induction of aromatase. the key is to tell aromatase to go away and tell 5ar to come in and start taking a larger proportion of the testosterone in comparison to aromatase using it. thats my angle i suppose
Thank you all for posting your hormone results. I think we can all agree from there that we're dealing with low T and reduced LH/FSH signaling from the pituitary gland. I personally also deal with higher E/SHBG than normal, though I see some of you don't. Let's work on hormone/pituitary/igf-1 ideas and see what gives!
I'm glad we're paying more attention to body composition. It's 4 years of constantly not getting expected results from going to the gym that made me subscribe here. Some dryness here and there I thought was normal-ish, but being completely miserable while most people around me got better results from 1/10th of the work.. that sent a strong signal that something was really, really wrong.
I think I'll refuse to go on Androgel. I'm afraid this would make matters worse and I have zero confidence it would actually help. I'll keep Iodine, order MK-677 sometimes in January, and in the mean time research hormones a bit more to understand what exactly went wrong and how to fix it.
For those looking at SA, I suggest resveratrol in bulk, I just ordered some capsules myself seeing as DIM did nothing for me.
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