Acne.org Products
1 hour ago, ACCUiTy_drANE said:Yes, thank you for taking the time to understand my point. I respect your technique and am open to trying it. Can you link me a source that explains how to properly conduct a liver flush? The simpler it is explained, the better. The mental fog is real.
There are many different liver cleanses out there to follow but the one that this forum led me to was "The amazing liver/gallbladder cleanse" by Andreas Moritz.
You might be able to google procedure but I just went and ordered book through local bookstore - even if you didn't touch Accutane I believe you can benefit from following this guys procedure!
Before you even ask - I do the procedure by the book, no shortcuts. What comes out is as accurate as the book indicates!
Soon though I hope nothing comes out, that should indicate a clean liver....
Best of luck
Yes, apoptosis I feel unfortunately. You see, shortly after cessation of accutane, and right around the time when all the side effects started hitting, i noticed my muscles began to atrophy, and developed stretch marks under my thighs, and the biceps, lats, and shoulders began to 'round out' like an adults would (i was only 20), but heres the thing, I wasn't even exercising or working out. i feel as if i was still growing and accutane just sped up the process about 5 years, and here we are, several medical issues.
1 hour ago, macleod said:Yes, apoptosis I feel unfortunately. You see, shortly after cessation of accutane, and right around the time when all the side effects started hitting, i noticed my muscles began to atrophy, and developed stretch marks under my thighs, and the biceps, lats, and shoulders began to 'round out' like an adults would (i was only 20), but heres the thing, I wasn't even exercising or working out. i feel as if i was still growing and accutane just sped up the process about 5 years, and here we are, several medical issues.
After i stopped taking it, I didn't have a bowel movements for like 2 weeks. That's when I knew something was wrong.
22 hours ago, QuietSoldier said:After i stopped taking it, I didn't have a bowel movements for like 2 weeks. That's when I knew something was wrong.
Have you narrowed your digestive problems down to any specific foods? Unfortunately, foods commonly regarded as "triggers" are largely fine on my stomach. These include gluten, high sugar foods, oils, dairy, and general junk food. Whereas, I seem to be sensitive to various whole/"healthy" foods. These include whole potatoes, whole kiwi, concentrated cocoa, whole peanuts (and/or nut butters). How am I supposed to be healthy when my stomach punishes me for it? I tried being vegan for three months and my stomach was REKT. It also did nothing for my brain fog. In any case, I highly recommend looking into making your own probiotic foods. Also, try eating a similar selection of foods for a few months and then eliminate one at time for a period of time to determine what contributes to your problems.
I Believe alot of us have heard and read or taken this supplement, but ive never seen a legit study until this one. Its looks to be about the only one on pubmed. This could be some valuable info though when it comes to gut health.
Gastric reacidification with betaine HCl in healthy volunteers with rabeprazole-induced hypochlorhydria.
Abstract
Previous studies have demonstrated that increased gastric pH from the use of acid-reducing agents, such as proton-pump inhibitors or H2-receptor antagonists, can significantly impact the absorption of weakly basic drugs that exhibit pH-dependent solubility. Clinically practical strategies to mitigate this interaction have not been developed. This pilot study evaluated the extent and time course of gastric reacidification after a solid oral dosage form of anhydrous betaine HCl in healthy volunteers with pharmacologically induced hypochlorhydria. Six healthy volunteers with baseline normochlorhydria (fasting gastric pH < 4) were enrolled in this single period study. Hypochlorhydria was induced via 20 mg oral rabeprazole twice daily for four days. On the fifth day, an additional 20 mg dose of oral rabeprazole was given and gastric pH was monitored continuously using the Heidelberg pH capsule. After gastric pH > 4 was confirmed for 15 min, 1500 mg of betaine HCl was given orally with 90 mL of water and gastric pH was continuously monitored for 2 h. Betaine HCl significantly lowered gastric pH by 4.5 ( 0.5) units from 5.2 ( 0.5) to 0.6 ( 0.2) (P < 0.001) during the 30 min interval after administration. The onset of effect of betaine HCl was rapid, with a mean time to pH < 3 of 6.3 ( 4.3) min. The reacidification period was temporary with a gastric pH < 3 and < 4 lasting 73 ( 33) and 77 ( 30) min, respectively. Betaine HCl was well tolerated by all subjects. In healthy volunteers with pharmacologically induced hypochlorhydria, betaine HCl was effective at temporarily lowering gastric pH. The rapid onset and relatively short duration of gastric pH reduction gives betaine HCl the potential to aid the absorption of orally administered weakly basic drugs that exhibit pH-dependent solubility when administered under hypochlorhydric conditions.
here is a guy from curezone talking about similar problems I know alot of us have that he related to gut health SIBO/Candida.
Friends,
Update on my progress:
10 years of trying to treat Candida (after months of being on Antibiotics) I feel I was going down the wrong path.
I spent over $10K on doctors, tests, supplements, antifungals, acupuncture, etc from NDs all over Canada and US. (All of them presented questionaires etc that I scored high with systemic Candida). So I took their advice.. Supplements, diet, antifungals, probiotics etc... Signing on the dotted line... Another check.. Another let down...
All this with minimal results. Fighting through die off etc etc etc. Constantly trying to kill Candida. I feel now that it was all a waste of time and money.
This is what I feel was my problem now (I say 'feel' as I wont say for sure until at least another few months of feeling this good) Also. I am not saying that this is the root of everyones health issues here. This is me. You can read my history all of my previous posts etc and decide for yourself how similar my story is to yours. (i.e. past meds, symptoms, etc etc) I have on this site for almost 10 years I believe:
I found out that I was not digesting my food properly and the main culprit was low HCL. I have been strictly taking 3x350mg HCL with Pepsin with small meals and 5 x 350mg of HCL with Pepsin with large meals. I have been doing this non stop now for a few weeks. My results are astonishing to me:
- Coated tongue is not gone. Only a slight paste on the back that is slowly receeding
*** Before I would have to brush it daily with Baking soda to clear it and it would return by nightime after a few meals. ALso, my mouth feels more 'clean'. Cant really explain it but it feels like it did prior to taking all of the antibiotics I took years ago.
- Energy has increased tremendously.
- My tinnitus that usually gets horrible during and just after meals or in damp places has almost completely subsided
- My stomach bloating after meals is almost completely gone.
- My eyes are more clear (white). Before I had horrible blood lines and puffyness.
- Eye floaters are hard to find now. I have to really concentrate. Before they were all over.
- My skin is not horribly dry like it was before.
- I dont wake up every 30 minutes like I did prior. I am sleeping much better.
- My mood swings are almost gone. I could feel when they were on. Just after eating anything besides protein. I would get shaky and I would have to take it out on my heavy bag.
- My fecal matter is more solid and I dont see all of the food particals and mucus as I did before. Looking much more similar to what it looked like prior to the antibiotics.
- My ears are not as sensitive to noise.
- My eyes are not as sensitive to light.
** Overall it looks like I have found out what is the core of my problem. I do believe the doctors were correct. I did have an unbalance in my digestive tract (candida vs acidopholus). I tried for years to get the balance back to normal but couldnt do it.
I believe now that it is a viscious cycle. Your stomach doenst digest the food, it empties into your intestines with bacteria, fungi, and food particles. Your intestines then become unbalanced with bacteria and fungus. The food which is still not digested feeds the Candida and other parasites as it passes down into your colon.
WE THEN
Take antifungals, probiotics,colonicsetc. Kill as much as possible but the root of the problem is still there.... The stomach is continuously allowing the food to pass through undigested and the cycle starts again.
** After everything I have tried, my symptoms, history etc I truly believe now that there was some sort of damage to my stomach from the meds I was perscribed. I have read that 'Pareto Cells' can become damaged from certain antibiotics. These cells produce the HCL required for digestion. I am supplementing now but I would like to research if these cells can be repaired.
I have had almost every test imagineable done by both NDs and MDs. Out of all the tests I had done only one test presented a major problem. The 'Heidelburg' test. This test measures the PH of your stomach and mine was dangerously low.(I think he means high)
For this reason I tried HCL supplements initially but only took 1 or 2/meal. I didnt follow the protocol of increas by one tablet until your body tells you to stop (i.e. burning etc). This time I did. I am comfortable at 4 or 5 / large meal.
**** I do however TRULY believe that some of the NDS know that low HCL can cause Candida overgrowth, digestive issues, allergies, etc and prey on people like me to sell them a gamut of antifungals, probiotics, supplements etc only to return in a few months wanting to give me something 'else to try'... This is how they make there living.... Sad... They are not supplemented by the governement in Canada so they have to get money somewhere....... Insurance companies only give me $200/year in ND coverage..
Before you go to another health store or ND and spend your hard earned money please have a 'heidelburg' test done or try the HCL supplement test to determine if your HCL is low.
What I could have bought with $10,000........
More updates to come in the following weeks. I will say a prayer for you all!
Kind regards,
Jake
Early gene changes induced by isotretinoin in the skin provide clues to its mechanism of action
- DOI:
- 10.4161/derm.1.2.8107
Amanda M. Nelsona, Wei Zhaoa, Kathryn L. Gillilanda, Andrea L. Zaengleina, Wenlei Liua & Diane M. Thiboutot*a
pages 100-101
- Published online: 01 Apr 2009
Additional license information
Abstract
Related articles
- Recommend to:
- A friend
Abstract
On 6/16/2016 at 11:39 PM, TrueJustice said:I never said that anyone else mentioned time being no healer - I'm saying that!There are a lot of people who've totally dropped off the radar, I mean the very guy who started this thread 5 years ago, where is he these days? Cured, given up, loving life, who would know?
The only people who don't come back to this thread are the ones who've successfully completed 10 or more liver flushes - perhaps he's part of that group?
Indigo sadly is not cured!
Does anyone know who this was?
this is textbook epigenetic. Recovery on withdrawl. Same thing happens in rat and monkey studies too. Also. Host of PSSD and PFS recovery came from withdrawing a compound that was interacting in the correct layer
"hello guys,
i would like to contact him.
Looks like the user only posted that single item on this thread, and he hasn't been active on the forum for almost 2 years
http://www.acne.org/messageboard/profile/409641-dimmer/?tab=forums_topic_post
Could try and message him I guess, if he gets an email when he receives new messages then he might see it and respond..
I seem to remember there were others who also tried this method though and didn't follow up with a recovery, but I guess people rarely post up exactly how long they followed the protocol, and with what amounts!
being vegan means nothing, you can eat far more trash as vegan than with a "standard" diet. Peanut is the most toxic food ever, worse then gluten for me. soy pretty toxic too. some raw vegs can also be bad when you havedamaged intestines after accutane. also i find little bit of fish far less toxic than legumes which are far too indigestible, everything that is not completely broken down (and so unusable for the body), such as too large/complex gluten moleculesor cooked food who create new byproducts, become toxic(cooked food cause proteins to "merge" with starch and other elements, like glycotoxins, acrylamide, heterocyclic amines,etc.).
everyone has issues with gluten, at different degrees, it's just some don't realize itor never tried to stop it for ~3 month to see the change.
2015 Study: Natural Compounds: Role in Reversal of Epigenetic Changes
http://protein.bio.msu.ru/biokhimiya/contents/v80/full/80081160.html
Interesting study which is focused on an anti-cancer perspective, but seeing as we've almost certainly suffered epigenetic changes, the list half way down of "Natural compounds playing important role in reversal of epigenetic changes" is probably quite relevant! Some of the tables are below:
On 7/6/2016 at 10:35 AM, hatetane said:Email from a prominent PFS doctor:
Youshould have a 24 hour urine hormone profile that looks at all hormonal production over 24 hours, not just cortisol! ifestrogen is way too low itcan affect all the systems in the body. Also needs to have Growth Hormone output checked in urine and by IGF1 levels. All can be done wherever you are or at Rhein Labs in Oregon US. Low estrogen can be replaced if it is not boosted by taking hCG - chorionic gonadotropin at higher levels over 1000 units 3 X weekly, even as high as 2000 units to stimulate the testicles to increase both testosterone and estrogen production. Homeopathic doses of Accutane might reverse the suppression if you can find it. It can be made up in very low micro doses by a homeopathic pharmacy.Any thoughts?
Blackfox01 - this is what is mentioned here! Not sure if anyone would touch accutane or finasteride again!
39 minutes ago, Gladiatoro said:Inigo
How do you know that ? Indigo did however take a large dose of chemo somewhere around 14.000 grams that's a lot of damage.
I don't think the dosage or duration really makes much of a difference to be honest, I think if you're susceptible to the epigenetic changes that the drug induces, then unfortunately you risk getting the sides from a single pill, and some people have. Same with propecia etc. It's like a switch being flicked on.
31 minutes ago, tanedout said:Same with propecia etc. It's like a switch being flicked on.
This is certainly plausible, especially given some of the ways people have recovered. Butthe systems Accutane affect are so vast. It is possible that from one post-Accutane sufferer to the next, the symptoms are coming from different places. Some of may be well-served in examining similarities between Accutane and Propecia, while others of us may be more affected from the "chemo" aspects of Accutane. There are so many ways we could have been hurt.
Gee the poor girl in photo on the 'home page' right now - that's a bad case of acne....
Ok, with the current news on "Epigenetic Changes" - is this related or similar to "Telomere Shortening"??
Also, hate to keep banging-on about liver flushes but if the things listed above happened to us, how on earth would "Liver Flushing" overcome such dramatic cellular changes? I know all our problems are different but did they really get out of this mess just through liver cleansing?
Is anyone else trying them? It's a process - not a quick solution....
5 hours ago, TrueJustice said:Gee the poor girl in photo on the 'home page' right now - that's a bad case of acne....
Ok, with the current news on "Epigenetic Changes" - is this related or similar to "Telomere Shortening"??
Also, hate to keep banging-on about liver flushes but if the things listed above happened to us, how on earth would "Liver Flushing" overcome such dramatic cellular changes? I know all our problems are different but did they really get out of this mess just through liver cleansing?
Is anyone else trying them? It's a process - not a quick solution....
The liver flush idea came about because of the stress accutane puts on the liver in the first place. Choleostatis prevents bile flow and therefore is associated to familiar side effects of accutane. From anecdotal reports, liver flushes may reduce these blockages and increase vile flow. There used to be a video of someone claiming to have cured his accutane side effects by trying around 15 or so I think. Maybe it works for some and maybe it doesn't, but one should Atleast try. They are simple to do and cheap.
Ive done 8 now. Can't say I feel hugely better. But in the last 2 years I have come a long way. They may have cured my existing acne as that stopped around the same time as my 5th or 6th. Either way, no regrets even if I try another 8 more.
15 minutes ago, Iamme. said:The liver flush idea came about because of the stress accutane puts on the liver in the first place. Choleostatis prevents bile flow and therefore is associated to familiar side effects of accutane. From anecdotal reports, liver flushes may reduce these blockages and increase vile flow. There used to be a video of someone claiming to have cured his accutane side effects by trying around 15 or so I think. Maybe it works for some and maybe it doesn't, but one should Atleast try. They are simple to do and cheap.Ive done 8 now. Can't say I feel hugely better. But in the last 2 years I have come a long way. They may have cured my existing acne as that stopped around the same time as my 5th or 6th. Either way, no regrets even if I try another 8 more.
Thx for replying - glad they're working for you!!
I know about the bile flow and decongesting the liver, my point was more about overcoming telomere shortening and/or epigenetic changes. Firstly there's more than 1 person who has claimed a full cure from liver flushing as far as I know and it is possible that they only had a bile flow issue BUT I'm willing to bet they had the same problems as you and I and they are either full of shit in claiming a "full cure" or miraculously they overcame "telomere shortening" and/or "epigenetic changes". I could go on to list other things they must of overcome in the process - Copper overload!!??
Regardless, I'm going to continue doing flushes as I want a clean liver - my recent "fatty liver" diagnosis is enough for me to continue doing them!!!
thx
7 hours ago, QuietSoldier said:I still have some pills left of this poison.... crazy to think taking them could potentially give me some healing
I really wouldn't recommend going there.
This doctor is a andrologist and treats PFS - not that knowledgeable about accutane - accept anecdotal
14 hours ago, Gladiatoro said:Inigo
How do you know that ? Indigo did however take a large dose of chemo somewhere around 14.000 mg that's a lot of damage.
I have contact with Indigo. He's got a great sense of humour but he is still suffering!
The variance in symptoms is expected.
Everyone is different, and an epigenetic change in the androgen receptor for example is going to cause different problems in different people. THe root cause could be the same, but the secondary issues that develop could be different.
Also some people might of been damaged directly by the drugs properties. That seemed to happen with Finasteride people too.
There are just so many subsets in a syndrome which makes it so hard to know WTF is going on.
6 hours ago, hatetane said:I really wouldn't recommend going there.This doctor is a andrologist and treats PFS - not that knowledgeable about accutane - accept anecdotal
Another doctor (Doctor Pezzi) used to fin to cure himself, and this was after he was suffering from Accutane sexual dysfunction. Taking accutane again scares me because of what a megadose of retinoic can do to the body, but I really think this theory of desensitized ARs is the truth.
lm gonna test it out as best I can. Like I said, I still have leftover accutane, but I'd prefer getting my hands on some fin to test this out. I also have saw palmetto, but it's not as potent as a real drug so idk if it'd work as well. What if I took a 5ar inhibitor for like a month, and then after stopping hit my body with some proviron?
On 7/10/2016 at 12:36 AM, QuietSoldier said:Another doctor (Doctor Pezzi) used to fin to cure himself, and this was after he was suffering from Accutane sexual dysfunction. Taking accutane again scares me because of what a megadose of retinoic can do to the body, but I really think this theory of desensitized ARs is the truth.
lm gonna test it out as best I can. Like I said, I still have leftover accutane, but I'd prefer getting my hands on some fin to test this out. I also have saw palmetto, but it's not as potent as a real drug so idk if it'd work as well. What if I took a 5ar inhibitor for like a month, and then after stopping hit my body with some proviron?
Well there's at least 2 people who've recovered following that method, there's some more information on this thread;
[Edited link out]
on Aug 20,2010Goldenwwrote:
This guy might be on to something. i dident post here for a loong time ...
my problem was that i had ed problem caused by roacutane( age 16), and a hairloss problem that started in my early 20. knowing i am in a place with ariguably two of the worst problems a man could have, and no answer to niehter, i decided to give propecia a chance about 5 months ago - which is the main reason i dident post here , feeling bad i am taking this horrible drug but i had to give it a shot on my hair problem, knowing again that i have no sex life at all pretty much.after 3 months with it , i decided i cant give propecia a chance to clear my slight chance of ever recovering from my ed problem i stoped.. i have to say, 4 days after i stoped, i started having my spontanous erections back, morning ererctions also came back to me, wanting sex like every 24 year old should have came back also. i almost feel as normal .. thinking it just might be temporary i dident do much . but hey.. i think i am almost back as any normal guy (allthough i cant really recall how that is after 7 years feelin g nothing and having no idea i have a problem untilll runing in into this forum )
well , right now i figured ill check on into stuff aroun,, and came across this thread.. i thought of posting my last experiince though it might help others, i hope i am good as normal, not sure! if my experince could help cure you guyss, we might be on to something here.. hope again that all of you will cure from your problems.
4 hours ago, QuietSoldier said:Another doctor (Doctor Pezzi) used to fin to cure himself, and this was after he was suffering from Accutane sexual dysfunction. Taking accutane again scares me because of what a megadose of retinoic can do to the body, but I really think this theory of desensitized ARs is the truth.lm gonna test it out as best I can. Like I said, I still have leftover accutane, but I'd prefer getting my hands on some fin to test this out. I also have saw palmetto, but it's not as potent as a real drug so idk if it'd work as well. What if I took a 5ar inhibitor for like a month, and then after stopping hit my body with some proviron?
Just think seriously before you do anything drastic like taking any of those drugs. Discuss it with your loves ones and your doctor if possible.
I bet a lot of the guys here would urge you on just to see if it works but I really would recommend against it.
Try other things first like gut health and plenty of testing. Good diet, exercise and regular supplements. No stress!
Good luck.