I'm from Singapore.

I too would like to get myself tested for these, but the costs of these tests are crazy in Singapore. I am currently looking to sign up for a rather comprehensive hormone screening though.

Some of the items in the package that seems to be of special concern in this community includes includes:

• Full hormone tests inclusive of insulin, cortisol, insulin-like growth factor 1
• Detailed thyroid analysis - TSH, T3 and T4
• Hormonal study (DHEA, LH, FSH)
• Detailed kidney function test
• Detailed liver function test
• Male anti-aging screen - testosterone, free androgen index, sex hormone binding globulin
• Cardiovascular risk - HSCRP
• Inflammatory screen (HBA1C, homocysteine, lipoprotein A)
• Vitamin D level and B12
• Nutritional screen - folate and ferritin

This package is gonna cost me near 600USD. Any advice if this package is comprehensive enough for post-accutane users?

On 14 May 2016 at 0:03 PM, comishcf said:

Hi everyone,

I haven't posted in a really long time but I have tried out some of the things you have been talking about and have had good success with them, namely taurine and a vitamin d3 supplement (which I was originally prescribed by a doctor for mono and have used ever since). I by no means think that what I'm about to talk about is a cure, but I noticed that someone posted about black walnuts a little while back as a means for managing the side effects of whatever we have going on and this is something that has been included in a supplement that I have been taking with good success for the past year.

Initially, I thought that the problems I had been experiencing were due to allergies and inflammation of the gut set on by accutane. To combat this, I started eating a lot of blueberries, blackberries, raspberries, and strawberries (mainly in the form of protein smoothies) and went to a doctor who recommended a supplement called "GI Microb-X" by Designs for Health. I hope this doesn't sound like I'm trying to sell a product because I'm absolutely not. However, this supplement in combination with the berries have actually been great for me for remedying bad side effects (depression, dry skin, basically everything that has been mentioned). The reason why I am bringing this up is because GI Microb-X has 50 mg of black walnuts in it. Here is the full list of ingredients:

200 mg Tribulus Extract
150 mg Magnesium Caprylate
100 mg Berberine sulfate
100 mg Grapefruit extract
50 mg Barberry extract
50 mg Bearberry extract
50 mg Black walnut powder
15 mg artemisinin

I have been following tryingtohelp specifically for a while now, and have to give a specific shout out to you because of how awesome and on top of things you have been. And honestly, the taurine has helped dramatically (taking 2000 mg a day) so thank you for that. I have yet to start with copper because I haven't been tested for it but that looks promising too.

Anyways I hope this bit of info helps. The supplements are quite expensive but I truly believe they have helped mitigate symptoms in combination with the berries, as both of these are proven to attack inflammation. For those of you that are looking for some sort of relief, I believe that these things have done that for me. That being said, its absolutely not the cure just a temporary measure (hopefully).

How did GI Microb- X help with your dryness??

Which part of this formula specifically do you think might of helped?

I can't get any relief with the dryness post accutane with any supplements!

10 hours ago, HealthConscious said:

I'm from Singapore.

I too would like to get myself tested for these, but the costs of these tests are crazy in Singapore. I am currently looking to sign up for a rather comprehensive hormone screening though.

Some of the items in the package that seems to be of special concern in this community includes includes:

• Full hormone tests inclusive of insulin, cortisol, insulin-like growth factor 1
• Detailed thyroid analysis - TSH, T3 and T4
• Hormonal study (DHEA, LH, FSH)
• Detailed kidney function test
• Detailed liver function test
• Male anti-aging screen - testosterone, free androgen index, sex hormone binding globulin
• Cardiovascular risk - HSCRP
• Inflammatory screen (HBA1C, homocysteine, lipoprotein A)
• Vitamin D level and B12
• Nutritional screen - folate and ferritin

This package is gonna cost me near 600USD. Any advice if this package is comprehensive enough for post-accutane users?

I don't know your symptoms but I would recommend testing for autoimmune markers. This has been huge in managing my fatigue/joint pain and diet direction (Autoimmune Paleo). The marker my doctor looks at is called ANA - antinuclear antibodies. We have then looked deeper at thyroid peroxidase and thyroglobulin antibodies (high at times). Also did ENA screen which showed high SSA antibodies. This explains my dry eyes when I am not on my A game. I can lower these autoimmune markers (and joint pain/fatigue) by managing lifestyle (diet, stress, sleep...).

Not an expert but if I had to pick one I think the ANA would show or rule out autoimmune issues which may help direct your recovery.

http://mthfr.net/elevated-homocysteine-level-or-laboratory-error/2012/03/02/

On 5/16/2016 at 7:58 AM, hatetane said:

more glands being damaged - pineal gland, how many others can't recall their dreams?

I cannot recall dreams at all anymore. This is most likely due to infection. The body's interferon system strips trytophan out of the cells to prevent bacteria from converting it to niacin to be metabolized to energy.

Things that help me dream again:
using liposomal melatonin before bed (i use douglas labs brand)
zero lights after 8pm (not even red)
plenty of sunlight during the day (no sunglasses use)
drinking cherry juice before bed (has melatonin)
taking B6 before bed (the pathway:[Edited link out])
take a little niacin before bed (to free up trytophan to produce melatonin instead)
if needing more tryptophan, eat bone broth (the best broths are from pig feet, trust me) & pumpkin seeds

and I've heard great reports from people supplementing with pure sulfur.

@tryingtohelp2014Didn't you mention that supplementing with copper allowed you to experience lucid dreaming for the first time in years? How is your dreaming now? Did your dream recall improve after one dose of copper?
What copper supplement do you recommend?

On 5/16/2016 at 9:27 AM, HealthConscious said:

Have any of you guys tried the atkins diet?

I had also just ordered a bunch of supplements from iherb, after scanning through the information I derived from this thread. I mainly ordered supps that are antagonizing/competitive towards Vit A in the system. (Taurine, VitD +K2, Magnesium, Copper).

Yup, so my strategy is to theoretically decrease my body's storage capacity for Vit A, while reinforcing its ability to get them out of my system.

5

I've not tried that Atkins diet but I have tried a VLC-HF diet with moderate protein (10% protein, 5% carbohydrate, 80-90% lipids).
It makes me feel better energetically but does not heal me. I don't believe it to be a healthy way of eating long-term.
I'd only do it during the Winter from now on to mimic nature. I've now increased my sugar intake to about 20% of total kcals.

Good supplementation strategy. Let us know how it goes. I would personally avoid taking vit D. I wouldn't want soft-tissue calcification. I'd recommend getting out in the sun instead if possible.

On 5/16/2016 at 11:43 AM, HealthConscious said:

I'm from Singapore.
Getting a hormonal test.

This package is gonna cost me near 600USD. Any advice if this package is comprehensive enough for post-accutane users?

Are you sure you want to use $600 on that test? Even if your hormones come back whacky, does it tell you the cause? I'd personally use that money to purchase things that move you towards health.

@hatetaneI've had my homocysteine checked. It was 15.1 umol/L. Ref range is <11.4.
More than likely, my local pathology lab did not perform the necessary requirements to ensure that's not an artifically high test.
I'd assume it is most likely in the normal range in actuality.

On 5/17/2016 at 3:39 AM, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

Good supplementation strategy. Let us know how it goes. I would personally avoid taking vit D. I wouldn't want soft-tissue calcification. I'd recommend getting out in the sun instead if possible.

i disagree. For whatever reason, we cannot assimilate Vitamin D from the sun like we should... be it from the 13-cis retinoic acid transforming into ATRA in the sebocytes, providing less oil for the vitamin D to be produced... to something in the liver stopping it as well. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022202X15409649

so many ways retinoic acid interferes with vitamin D its scary. half of the symptoms on DUULs list are just obvious Vitamin D problems.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/pde.12614/abstract

Candida [Edited link out]
Low back pain/joint pain [Edited link out]
IBS http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/304361.php
Dry eyes http://www.doctorslounge.com/index.php/news/pb/61405

thats why the combination of K2 and Mag should help any out of balance calcium with the D3. the taurine will help it get absorbed. i think this is a big missing piece.

http://www.healthcentral.com/rheumatoid-arthritis/c/798984/116673/ta/
http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2012/11/health-exercise-quickie-vitamin-d.html

Guys, thank you so much for your replies.

I think I may sign up for the hormones test after all. As I mentioned earlier, my dosage of accutane was on the high side at 80mg/day for a whooping 9 months. Yet for now, I can't be sure whether I am actually experiencing it's side effects, so I was hoping that these tests could help me confirm whether I share the same common test anomalies as other fellow post-accutaners.

I eat healthy and, over the years, identified foods that seem to make me sick and have been making the conscious effort to avoid them. Some of them are peanuts and almonds(Legumes?). Chocolates(Lecithin + Diary?) too. Too much of them causes the insides of my mouth and my thyroid to swell, plus horrible canker sores. This actually seems to be some sort of autoimmune issue, drawing reference from @SCOTT242signature.

For now, I seem to have

• High irritability, anxiety, OCD, Misophonia
  • A cortisol level check may shed some light on this for me?
• Decreased genital sensitivity, almost no libido
  • Not really a big issue for me, but I am very concerned about the possible underlying hormonal causes behind this.

Additionally, the hormones test includes Vitamin D and B12. Soft tissue calcification sounds terrible, so it would be a serendipitous bonus from the hormones test package to get my D levels checked to give me a peace of mind before I start supplementation.

I did take a men's multivitamin for about a year, and during that period I felt great and full of energy, foods that usually gave me problems stopped doing so, and I recovered extremely quickly from flu/nose allergies. So it seems like supplementation does help me. Some stuffs included in this multivit are; vitamin D, E, K, folate, B-12, Magnesium(Low) & Copper(Low), Grape seed extract. I stopped because I was concerned about the megadose of come of the vitamins in it.

Also, something interesting to note is that this multivit contains 200% DV Vitamin A in the form beta-carotene and retinyl palmitate, yet I didn't feel any Vit A toxicity effects from it like I did from trying cod liver oil. Weird huh? Maybve the presence of Vit D helped to balance it.

2 hours ago, tryingtohelp2014 said:

i disagree. For whatever reason, we cannot assimilate Vitamin D from the sun like we should... be it from the 13-cis retinoic acid transforming into ATRA in the sebocytes, providing less oil for the vitamin D to be produced... to something in the liver stopping it as well. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022202X15409649

I'm just warning people based off my own experience and knowledge of vit D's mechanisms. I think I severely calcified MANY of my soft tissues leading to chronic pain by taking vit D supplements. I took micellized (highly absorbable) vit D.I brought my Vitamin D 25 HYDROXY (CALCIDIOL) up from 30.4 ng/mL to 85.2 nb /mL in about 4 months and my pain got worse and worse. I regret ever touching the stuff. We probably do have problems with vit D metabolism but that might make the supplementation even worse. It's incredibly unnatural to obtain our major source of vit D from food. If supplementing regardless of my warnings, I recommend NO MORE than 1000IU daily to bring it up 5 ng/ml per month.

I also suggest people learn the mechanisms for how it works.
This video below will explain how K2, D, and A work synergistically.
link

On 5/17/2016 at 5:53 AM, tryingtohelp2014 said:

 

i disagree. For whatever reason, we cannot assimilate Vitamin D from the sun like we should... be it from the 13-cis retinoic acid transforming into ATRA in the sebocytes, providing less oil for the vitamin D to be produced... to something in the liver stopping it as well. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022202X15409649

so many ways retinoic acid interferes with vitamin D its scary. half of the symptoms on DUULs list are just obvious Vitamin D problems.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/pde.12614/abstract

Candida [Edited link out]
Low back pain/joint pain [Edited link out]
IBS http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/304361.php
Dry eyes http://www.doctorslounge.com/index.php/news/pb/61405

thats why the combination of K2 and Mag should help any out of balance calcium with the D3. the taurine will help it get absorbed. i think this is a big missing piece.

http://www.healthcentral.com/rheumatoid-arthritis/c/798984/116673/ta/
http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2012/11/health-exercise-quickie-vitamin-d.html

 

Im still gathering knowledge on Vit D. I was thinking though, why have some doctors put their accutane patients on Vit A when they experience problems during treatment?? ( I haven't heard of any Dr prescribing Vit D!! )

Its kind of like fight fire with fire approach often used in homeopathy!!

We are all looking at different supplements to help overcome our problems but perhaps there is something there in hitting Vit A - perhaps the answer has been staring us in the face all along!?

Please share thoughts on supplementing with Vit A.

1 hour ago, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

 

I'm just warning people based off my own experience and knowledge of vit D's mechanisms. I think I severely calcified MANY of my soft tissues leading to chronic pain by taking vit D supplements. I took micellized (highly absorbable) vit D.I brought my Vitamin D 25 HYDROXY (CALCIDIOL) up from 30.4 ng/mL to 85.2 nb /mL in about 4 months and my pain got worse and worse. I regret ever touching the stuff. We probably do have problems with vit D metabolism but that might make the supplementation even worse. It's incredibly unnatural to obtain our major source of vit D from food. If supplementing regardless of my warnings, I recommend NO MORE than 1000IU daily to bring it up 5 ng/ml per month.

I also suggest people learn the mechanisms for how it works.
This video below will explain how K2, D, and A work synergistically.
link

when you took the D, did you take any magnesium or K2 with it at the time? what were you dosing? in that link, he basically says take K2 to prevent calciification

A 25(OH)D level should also be obtained, as vitamin D deficiency is a common cause of hypercalcemia. Adequate vitamin D replacement will often correct the hypercalcemia; however, vitamin D deficiency may be masking underlying primary hyperparathyroidism.

it wouldnt make sense that 1000iu would do anything good or bad. its just not enough. pregnant women need 6600iu a day just to have any vitamin D for milk its the accutane that causes the high calcium levels in the first place. it causes calcified ligaments . and dont say you can get everything from the sun. my level is 9 and im out in the sun all of the time.

here is a simple theory of why accutane could alter the Vitamin D absorption rates even post-tane.

1. In order for your body to produce Vitamin D from sunlight you need the precursor to be available in the skin to do this. that precursor is7-alpha hydroxylase.

2. accutane disrupts copper ... upregulated ATP7A, super jacked up ceruloplasmin levels, inverse Vit A/copper liver relationship etc etc etc.

3. depleted liver copper levels reduce7-alpha hydroxylase mnra levels 80%

4. low7-alpha hydroxylase levels lead to Vitamin D dysregulation/lower production?

two paragraphs explaining this below:

http://www.intechopen.com/books/lipid-metabolism/the-role-of-copper-as-a-modifier-of-lipid-metabolism
The majority of absorbed dietary copper is initially delivered to the liver. Hepatocytes utilize copper for their metabolic needs (such as respiration and radical defense); they also synthesize and secrete the major copper containing protein in serum, ceruloplasmin, and prevent copper overload in the body by exporting excess copper via the canalicular membrane into the bile (Figure 1). These two important functions of hepatocytes (the production of ceruloplasmin and the removal of excess copper) are performed by another transporter, the copper transporting ATPase ATP7B, which is homologous to ATP7A [6,7]. Inactivation of ATP7B in patients with Wilsons disease and in animal models is associated with marked copper overload in the liver and pathologic changes including marked lipid dysregulation in the liver and the serum (discussed in the later sections).

In copper deficiency, plasma HDL rich in apolipoprotein E (ApoE) accumulates and total ApoE binding to liver plasma membranes increases (also reported as a reduction in ApoE-free HDL binding). Interestingly, the cholesterol levels in the liver decrease with copper deficiency, despite an overall increase in hepatic cholesterol synthesis [41,42]. These changes in synthesis, binding properties, and redistribution of lipoproteins suggest some mechanisms through which copper deficiency affects serum cholesterol levels. Thus far, molecular investigations of copper deficiency have identified increased hepatic expression of SREBP1-responsive fatty-acid synthase, along with the increased nuclear localization of the mature SREBP1 transcriptional activator [24]. Changes in the expression of other genes involved in the fatty acid synthesis have not been explored in any significant detail, although the mRNA levels for cholesterol 7-alpha hydroxylase were found decreased by 80%.

13 hours ago, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

 

I'm just warning people based off my own experience and knowledge of vit D's mechanisms. I think I severely calcified MANY of my soft tissues leading to chronic pain by taking vit D supplements. I took micellized (highly absorbable) vit D.I brought my Vitamin D 25 HYDROXY (CALCIDIOL) up from 30.4 ng/mL to 85.2 nb /mL in about 4 months and my pain got worse and worse. I regret ever touching the stuff. We probably do have problems with vit D metabolism but that might make the supplementation even worse. It's incredibly unnatural to obtain our major source of vit D from food. If supplementing regardless of my warnings, I recommend NO MORE than 1000IU daily to bring it up 5 ng/ml per month.

I also suggest people learn the mechanisms for how it works.
This video below will explain how K2, D, and A work synergistically.
link

I agree. It just doesn't make sense to ingest vit D.

11 hours ago, TrueJustice said:

Im still gathering knowledge on Vit D. I was thinking though, why have some doctors put their accutane patients on Vit A when they experience problems during treatment?? ( I haven't heard of any Dr prescribing Vit D!! )

Its kind of like fight fire with fire approach often used in homeopathy!!

We are all looking at different supplements to help overcome our problems but perhaps there is something there in hitting Vit A - perhaps the answer has been staring us in the face all along!?

Please share thoughts on supplementing with Vit A.

Accutane depletes vitamin A:
link

We're deficient in vit A and toxic in synthetic retinoic acid.

11 hours ago, tryingtohelp2014 said:

when you took the D, did you take any magnesium or K2 with it at the time? what were you dosing? in that link, he basically says take K2 to prevent calciification

A 25(OH)D level should also be obtained, as vitamin D deficiency is a common cause of hypercalcemia. Adequate vitamin D replacement will often correct the hypercalcemia; however, vitamin D deficiency may be masking underlying primary hyperparathyroidism.

it wouldnt make sense that 1000iu would do anything good or bad. its just not enough. pregnant women need 6600iu a day just to have any vitamin D for milk its the accutane that causes the high calcium levels in the first place. it causes calcified ligaments . and dont say you can get everything from the sun. my level is 9 and im out in the sun all of the time.

Yes, I took K2 and LOADS of magnesium while on it as a safety measure. I even was eating homemade sauerkraut made with Kinetic culture (tons of vit K2). It was either the vit D calcifying me or I was building up oxalates in my body by infection or diet. Not entirely sure. For those supplementing vit D, just be smart and monitor your symptomology carefully.

35 minutes ago, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

Accutane depletes vitamin A:
link

We're deficient in vit A and toxic in synthetic retinoic acid.

Yes, I took K2 and LOADS of magnesium while on it as a safety measure. I even was eating homemade sauerkraut made with Kinetic culture (tons of vit K2). It was either the vit D calcifying me or I was building up oxalates in my body by infection or diet. Not entirely sure. For those supplementing vit D, just be smart and monitor your symptomology carefully.

exactly how much Vitamin D and K2 were you taking? did you ever have your calcium levels checked during this time?

On 5/17/2016 at 9:38 PM, tryingtohelp2014 said:

exactly how much Vitamin D and K2 were you taking? did you ever have your calcium levels checked during this time?

This was two years ago. I don't remember exact amounts.

This is the vit D I was using: link
I was taking around 5-10 drops per day.

Not sure how much K2 I was taking. But at that time, I did research and found a good amount to take based off the vit D. I used a mix of MK-7 and MK-4.

I did not have my calcium checked during my heavy dosing period, unfortunately.
My calcium before and after the dosing period hovered between 9.6 - 10.2 mg/dL.

EDIT:
Check out my WBCs from over the past 3 years.
Clearly I have an infection:
[Edited link out]

On 5/17/2016 at 9:53 PM, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

EDIT:
Check out my WBCs from over the past 3 years.
Clearly I have an infection:
[Edited link out]

Interesting your WBC count dropped and reached its lowest level at the end of accutane. exactly what i would expect to see. WBC's go down during a copper deficiency. youre the third guy to report low WBC.. one of them had a confirmed deficiency.

http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/cond/C269841.html

(look under nutrients and testing u should order)

Other Possible Signs of Copper Deficiency
Cells unable to make ATP reduce overall physical energy, creating a sense of fatigue. Hormonal imbalances may result as iron builds up in the endocrine system. This can lead to low body temperature,osteoporosisand bone fractures, an irregular heartbeat, a higher risk of coronary artery disease, low white blood cell counts, and a loss of skin pigmentation. Researchers have also reported copper deficiency causes neural and nervous system dysfunction. Copper-replacement therapy has been found to alleviate these symptoms which appear as a B12 deficiency.^[3]

On 5/17/2016 at 3:39 AM, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:

http://mthfr.net/elevated-homocysteine-level-or-laboratory-error/2012/03/02/

I cannot recall dreams at all anymore. This is most likely due to infection. The body's interferon system strips trytophan out of the cells to prevent bacteria from converting it to niacin to be metabolized to energy.

Things that help me dream again:
using liposomal melatonin before bed (i use douglas labs brand)
zero lights after 8pm (not even red)
plenty of sunlight during the day (no sunglasses use)
drinking cherry juice before bed (has melatonin)
taking B6 before bed (the pathway: [Edited link out])
take a little niacin before bed (to free up trytophan to produce melatonin instead)
if needing more tryptophan, eat bone broth (the best broths are from pig feet, trust me) & pumpkin seeds

and I've heard great reports from people supplementing with pure sulfur.

@tryingtohelp2014Didn't you mention that supplementing with copper allowed you to experience lucid dreaming for the first time in years? How is your dreaming now? Did your dream recall improve after one dose of copper?
What copper supplement do you recommend?

I've not tried that Atkins diet but I have tried a VLC-HF diet with moderate protein (10% protein, 5% carbohydrate, 80-90% lipids).
It makes me feel better energetically but does not heal me. I don't believe it to be a healthy way of eating long-term.
I'd only do it during the Winter from now on to mimic nature. I've now increased my sugar intake to about 20% of total kcals.

Good supplementation strategy. Let us know how it goes. I would personally avoid taking vit D. I wouldn't want soft-tissue calcification. I'd recommend getting out in the sun instead if possible.

Are you sure you want to use $600 on that test? Even if your hormones come back whacky, does it tell you the cause? I'd personally use that money to purchase things that move you towards health.

@hatetaneI've had my homocysteine checked. It was 15.1 umol/L. Ref range is <11.4.
More than likely, my local pathology lab did not perform the necessary requirements to ensure that's not an artifically high test.
I'd assume it is most likely in the normal range in actuality.

Just wondering, no offence but why would you have a test them dismiss it as wrong.
Surly it is worth a re-test.

In to response for Vit D discussion! I have posted this many times before and not in any way disagreeing with other studies posted in relation to Vit D and Vit A.

posted this once before on pg. 2 of this thread...Vit A & Vit D compete against each other, they have a important relationship and there are studies that show Accutane depletes Vit D.

Omega-3 fats and other molecules bind to Vitamin A receptors. Same as Vitamin D is also the most important partnership with Vit A and Omega's.

Retinoid, Vit A, Vit D, Thyroid hormones is in a group called the steroid family. This family is known for developing partnerships w/other hormones (such as growth hormones) They all bind to nuclear receptors, meaning they have access to the nucleus, where they influence gene expression.

When you have either Vit A or Vit D it almost always does so in partnership with Vit A receptor, which binds vitamin A or the omega-3 fatty acid DHA. In the nucleus of the cell, it sits as judge and jury, deciding which genes are turned on and which are turned off. Vit D and its partners Vit A and DHA (omega 3) are conducting the orchestra.

(book written by James E. Dowd, M.D. from MI Arthritis Institute

It is possible to have calcification or other bone issues from Accutane. It is stated in the side effects. I myself and if sooo after all these years I can re post my results while on and after Accutane my calcium levels were high and I was taking No supplements at the time.

As for Copper and Zinc if you test your levels and are low then great to supplementing, however if you have any type of thyroid issue (like myself) please tread careful. I myself am hyperthyroid and zinc is not the best for me and I have to be careful with Copper also. If your Hypothyroid then they are both need at times in average doses.
However, with that said if you have neurological most neurologist check for copper levels as certain disorders and brain issues can be caused by this or lead to low copper levels.

I also suggest those who have not read about epgentic changes due to Accutane and their studies in relation to many issues that most of us suffers have. If you suffer from brain changes James Crandall Ph.D. did a study and has a great explanation on Accutane and the brain. Yes most of know of Douglas Bremner m.d. studies hired by Liam.

One must remember as I have always said, we all have similar or suffer from the same alignments but we are all made up of different DNA and what works for one may not work for another.

If need be I have no problems posting my numerous labs and doctor visits and naturopathic doctor visits from over the last 7-8 yrs!
.
Someone also mentioned hyperbaric oxygen chamber I have had those done in the past they help, but no cure!

Hope you are all doing well,

Jen

Here it is right here. Vitamin A causes DNA damage via copper.

Oxidative DNA Damage by Vitamin A and Its Derivative via Superoxide Generation

http://m.jbc.org/content/275/3/2003.full

Experiments using³²P-labeled isolated DNA demonstrated that retinol and retinal caused Cu(II)-mediated DNA damage

Superoxide is produced as a by-product of oxygen metabolism and, if not regulated, causes many types of cell damage

9 minutes ago, oli girl said:

In to response for Vit D discussion! I have posted this many times before and not in any way disagreeing with other studies posted in relation to Vit D and Vit A.

posted this once before on pg. 2 of this thread...Vit A & Vit D compete against each other, they have a important relationship and there are studies that show Accutane depletes Vit D.

Omega-3 fats and other molecules bind to Vitamin A receptors. Same as Vitamin D is also the most important partnership with Vit A and Omega's.

Retinoid, Vit A, Vit D, Thyroid hormones is in a group called the steroid family. This family is known for developing partnerships w/other hormones (such as growth hormones) They all bind to nuclear receptors, meaning they have access to the nucleus, where they influence gene expression.

 

When you have either Vit A or Vit D it almost always does so in partnership with Vit A receptor, which binds vitamin A or the omega-3 fatty acid DHA. In the nucleus of the cell, it sits as judge and jury, deciding which genes are turned on and which are turned off. Vit D and its partners Vit A and DHA (omega 3) are conducting the orchestra.

(book written by James E. Dowd, M.D. from MI Arthritis Institute

It is possible to have calcification or other bone issues from Accutane. It is stated in the side effects. I myself and if sooo after all these years I can re post my results while on and after Accutane my calcium levels were high and I was taking No supplements at the time.

As for Copper and Zinc if you test your levels and are low then great to supplementing, however if you have any type of thyroid issue (like myself) please tread careful. I myself am hyperthyroid and zinc is not the best for me and I have to be careful with Copper also. If your Hypothyroid then they are both need at times in average doses.
However, with that said if you have neurological most neurologist check for copper levels as certain disorders and brain issues can be caused by this or lead to low copper levels.

I also suggest those who have not read about epgentic changes due to Accutane and their studies in relation to many issues that most of us suffers have. If you suffer from brain changes James Crandall Ph.D. did a study and has a great explanation on Accutane and the brain. Yes most of know of Douglas Bremner m.d. studies hired by Liam.

One must remember as I have always said, we all have similar or suffer from the same alignments but we are all made up of different DNA and what works for one may not work for another.

If need be I have no problems posting my numerous labs and doctor visits and naturopathic doctor visits from over the last 7-8 yrs!
.
Someone also mentioned hyperbaric oxygen chamber I have had those done in the past they help, but no cure!

Hope you are all doing well,

Jen

Excellent post - thank you. But again I ask, why do some doctors put their patients on Vit A during treatment if they experience negative side effects????

I get that accutane is a synthetic version of Vit A, I get that but can someone show me an example of a doctor giving their patients Vit D or even Copper - I'm not seeing any examples of this!!!

Should we investigate taking Vit A again?? I just don't know. Still waiting to see my blood tests on D to see if low before I decide what to try next.

25 minutes ago, TrueJustice said:

Excellent post - thank you. But again I ask, why do some doctors put their patients on Vit A during treatment if they experience negative side effects????

I get that accutane is a synthetic version of Vit A, I get that but can someone show me an example of a doctor giving their patients Vit D or even Copper - I'm not seeing any examples of this!!!

Should we investigate taking Vit A again?? I just don't know. Still waiting to see my blood tests on D to see if low before I decide what to try next.

TrueJustice - I am not sure if your from the U.S., but here the rx form of Vit D is so different from natural or supplement form.

Supplemental vitamin D comes in two forms: ergocalciferol (vitamin D2) and cholecalciferol (vitamin D3).

They have generally been regarded as equivalent and interchangeable, but that notion is based on studies of rickets prevention in infants conducted seven decades ago.

Recent studies have shown that vitamin D3 is a more potent form of vitamin D. Vitamin D2 has a shorter shelf life, and its metabolites bind with protein poorly, making it less effective. One unit of cod liver oil (containing vitamin D3) has been shown to be as effective as four units of Viosterol (a medicinal preparation of vitamin D2).

However, the form of vitamin D used in prescriptions in North America is almost invariably vitamin D2.

I recently began supplementing with Vitamin A (about 32,000 iu/day), and I feel much improved. My skin has noticeably gotten better. It used to be severely dehydrated after accutane, but it's less so now that I have been using Vitamin A.

22 hours ago, hatetane said:

Just wondering, no offence but why would you have a test them dismiss it as wrong.
Surly it is worth a re-test.

This was in regards to homocysteine.
I had the homocysteine test before I knew it had to be done a special way. I don't want to spend the $100+ again. I don't get much out of knowing my homocysteine.

3 hours ago, QuietSoldier said:

I recently began supplementing with Vitamin A (about 32,000 iu/day), and I feel much improved. My skin has noticeably gotten better. It used to be severely dehydrated after accutane, but it's less so now that I have been using Vitamin A.

Taking vitA destroys some people post-accutane. For me, taking vit A helped me (i got it through eating liver).
As I showed in my previous posts, accutane depletes vitamin A.

I speculate that the people who get messed up from eating vit A post-tanereact bc accutane is mobilized when vit A is ingested (out iwth the old, in with the new)

--

Everyone here pleaselook into Field Control Therapy FCT (developed by Dr. Urkovsky). I'm getting this done soon.

I also just began these supplements:

Have also been doing:

This is a long film but worth watching. I think I might have posted before.

Accutane dose cause B12 deficiency, not in everyone of course.

Low B12, raised homocysteineis degenerative which is why it should be taken seriously.
In the film it gives a long list of symptoms - just take a look.

They actually made a film about the nurse Sally Pacholok - catch the trailer on youtube.

I think accutane has made everyone crazy on this forum. You are presented with the side effects before you start the course, obviously your acne affected your life in every single way that is why you all took accutane ! You are going to get side effects. Right now this is the most effective medication for acne. In our life time we probably won't get a 'safer' and effective alternative. Natural remedies/treatments don't work for severe/cystic/persistent acne. Accutane has given me my life back and it has for most people too.

2 hours ago, vanessaxdd said:

I think accutane has made everyone crazy on this forum. You are presented with the side effects before you start the course, obviously your acne affected your life in every single way that is why you all took accutane ! You are going to get side effects. Right now this is the most effective medication for acne. In our life time we probably won't get a 'safer' and effective alternative. Natural remedies/treatments don't work for severe/cystic/persistent acne. Accutane has given me my life back and it has for most people too.

Please this is a thread for suffers. We don't go on your threads and tell you to stop Accutane. So you had severe cystic acne, maybe Accutane was warranted in your situation. With that said for many it is not, you don't know the circumstances regarding a person's situation. Like for instance those who took Accutane before any forms were handed out to be signed, dosage, incompetent doctors etc.
With that said I am going to ask you to please stay out of this thread unless you are suffering and need help or have something to contribute to those who are suffering!