I've just posted this thread on a different forum, but thought I'd post it up here, as I think potentially it might be quite worthwhile;

I've been reading up a lot on fasting recently, as most 'recoveries' from previous usage of accutane and finasteride seem to involve some sort of fasting, be it a single long-term water fast, multiple water fasts or a juice fast.

Little seems to have been mentioned about short term fasting however, ie 24 or 36 hours. These are obviously a lot easier to do than the longer term sort, and the benefits of these sorts of fasts seem to be quite significant - maybe just as good, or even better than longer fasts.

One thing tane and fin victims seem to have is low/very low growth hormone. I've not had this tested yet myself, but short term fasting has been shown to give significant increase to growth hormone (some studies stating significant increases if you google for it);

Growth Hormone

Aging humans normally experience reductions in growth hormone. While its true that unchecked growth hormone can lead to unwanted cell proliferation (like, ya know, cancer), growth hormone therapy can really help stave off the doldrums of old age. Luckily, short-term fasting induces growth hormone secretion in normal men. Im not for mainlining GH or anything, but Im all for amping up my own production. Furthermore, a recent study found that resistance training actually blunted hunger for an hour. Ive found this to be the case for me. If the body needs food right after a workout, why would hunger be blunted? This is why I tend to hold off on the eating post-workout. Every little bit helps, especially as you age.

The second thing of note is the benefits to brain health, and specifically that short term fasting leads to an increase in 'neuronal plasticity'. A member on another forum who has researched this had found;

"the reason we [tane victims] experience changes in brain chemistry is due to the breakdown of neuronal plasticity in areas of the brain highly sensitive to 5AR"

Again, further benefits of short term fasting;

Neurological Health

Fasting doesnt cause your brain tissue to waste away, contrary to what some people will tell you. Its actually good for brain health. Any dietary restriction tends to increase neuronal plasticity and promote neurogenesis, but it was IF that had the greatest effect (with the fewest downsides). Another study of mice found that meal frequency impacts neuronal health. That is, mice who ate larger meals more infrequently saw greater increases in brain and overall bodily health. Still another study found that IF was beneficial for peripheral nerve function in mice by promoting the maintenance of the neuronal pathways responsible for locomotor performance. Its almost like this stuff just puts your brain in repair, or maintenance mode.

Read more: [Edited link out]

I'm wondering if the fact that recoveries have tended to include fasting is related to the fact that fasting is triggering the body/brain to 'repair itself' with an increase in GH/ increased neuronal plasticity and other things due to the fast being a factor? Some people have tried water fasts for example and not recovered, but if the benefits of intermittent (short term fasting) is as significant, maybe intermittent fasting for a period of time is the way to go?!

Maybe short term fasting could be key to getting a recovery? It's fairly easy to do a day or even 2 a week no matter what your work or schedule. The studies are out there showing the benefits - just google for it.

My plan is currently to build my recovery on a basis of increased health through exercise and better diet, but I will definitely be trying intermittent fasting (maybe a day a week) and hopefully get GH tests done to see how this is making a difference.

Anyone had any experience of short term fasting, or already doing it?!

Thank you Oli Girl. Yes my granddaughter is on a gluten and dairy free diet and has been for some time. Seems like the longer she is on it, the more sensitive she becomes. More and more things seem to upset her system. She is trying to use a base diet of rice and chicken and adding different things to try to identify ones that bother her. Problem is, all that rice has led to even worse constipation and since the repair, she has lost the ability to burp so her body gets really bloated and uncomfortable which exacerbates the problem. She tried a sublingual aid for relieving gas and just the taste of it under her tongue made her extremely nauseous. She can't take pills. Due to the repair, they won't go down. She takes a liquid fish oil for the Omega 3's. My daughter looked up 5-HTP after I found the posting by Chiron and it recommended not taking it if you have IBS so she has been reluctant to try it. One of the reasons I want to talk to Chiron. I am hoping he will respond. Thanks, Barbara

 

I've read on some propecia forums that finasteride (propecia) use can help treat the sexual side effects of accutane. The logic is it temporarily decreases DHT and re-sensitizes your receptors. Any of you have experience with this? Thoughts?

This idea seems to have originated from Kevin Pezzi, who claimed in one of his books that he permanently recovered from sexual sides of Accutane by using finasteride.

I've never heard of any other Accutane sufferer finding relief by this method, although a few finasteride victims said they temporarily recovered from their sexual side effects by going back on finasteride. The only problem was that the recoveries didn't last, and a couple of them ended up with worse-off than they were in the first place.

It's a risky gamble. You might want to carefully investigate the potential sexual side effects of finasteride before making any desperate moves.

I wouldn't recommend propecia I have heard some bad things about that drug , it's a DHT blocker no doubt. I think the last thing an Accutainted victim needs is more drugs. Sexual side effects can often be relieved with something as simple as ..... exercise . There are herbs to try but most are DHT blockers ...Goji berries may be worth a try or tonkat ali these could be helpful herbs , but them main thing as I mentioned would be exercise get the blood flowing throughout the body . There is no question isotretinoin affects circulation in the winter months my fingers go numb easy I'm more susceptible to the cold now.

Well, you have a point there. The last thing we should do is put trust in the drug companies and give them more money...but the short term DHT blocking concept itself is interesting. The scientific literature says that Accutane doesn't reduce, but damages the quality of androgen receptors, so maybe if they are downregulated they can be replaced with newer ones that haven't been accutane exposed...any scientists on here think that makes sense?

Chiron, I am seeking more information about the regimen you have tried to counter the side effects of Accutane. My granddaughter took Accutane for 6 months 2 years ago. Subsequently, and probably unrelated, she had surgery to repair a hernia and the valve from her esophagus to her stomach. She has since developed an alarming number of symptoms which sound like the ones being described by others suffering Accutane side effects. Migraines entered into it but may have been caused by the proton inhibitors prescribed to alleviate stomach problems. She has also been found to be allergic to things she had previously eaten all her life as well as gluten and dairy intolerant. She has so many of the symptoms you and others describe and it seems to be getting worse instead of better. I have been looking for solutions and find very little in the way of how to deal with the problems and live a reasonably normal life so when I read your posts, it seems you have found some solutions and I am so hoping you are willing to share a little more detail with me. My granddaughter is 26, a competitive swimmer (attended college on an athletic scholarship) until now, the pain of working out and swimming is about to stop her swimming altogether. This has turned out to be longer than I intended, I apologize. I am just looking for help as the medical community seems to have nothing to offer except one more expensive test after another with no results. I know you are not a doctor and any information you can give me will be accepted only as information about your solution and not advice that we should do it. Thank you in advance for any aid you can provide. Barbara Gilbert

Hi Barbara, I have been able to function fairly well and live more actively since altering my diet to include eating less sugar, dairy and zero gluten. But actually, it has been a basic regimen of iodine, selenium and occasionally Lithium Orotate that have helped me tremendously with my thyroid issues. I have tried 5-HTP and it helps me to sleep as well as seems to relieve some stomach issues by introducing serotonin into the gut where a huge percentage of the body's supply belongs. I prefer lithium orotate in small doses before bed. But it is difficult to recommend too much manipulation of the thyroid without a better understanding of what these things really do...In addition, good vitamin intake and minerals, amino acids, etc. seem to be the basic building blocks of everything. I am not sure anything needs to be taken all of the time or in large quantities. The leaves of the moringa tree seem to be of great benefit as well, as it includes many of these basic life-sustaining properties in an all-natural form and I feel y energy increase when I eat them. I hope these ideas help some. Chemo-threrapy drugs such as Accutane are destructive, no question. They wind up poisoning all of the cells in the body in their attempt to alter the few. The Gerson Therapy diet is purported to heal most cancers and almost any disease (imbalance) in the body. It consists of juicing and eating cooked vegetables, as well as doing regular coffee enemas over a period of 1 to 2 years. I have not tried it myself yet, but I would bet that it could do wonders for any systemic damage caused by Accutane.

My positive thoughts are with your granddaughter and all of us as we try to better understand and heal. Imortant and helpful for me is also to drinking a fair amount of water particularly upon waking in the morning. This is a critical time to replenish. Perhaps the most important factor in healing is time, and a sustained effort at providing the body with the materials it need and staying away from things it doesn't. Several people have felt that vitamin A is dangerous to our bodies, post-Accutane, but I have seen studies which point to the fact that since it is a synthetic version of retinoic acid, Accutane actually causes vitamin A deficiency rather than overdose, through it's exaustion of the pathways for vitamin A, as well as interfering with other vitamin activity. I hope some of these suggestions help.

On 10/20/2013 at 1:21 PM, oli girl said:

I thought I would just post a random and upbeat post! My daughter who is 16 and a sophomore performed her first lead this weekend and will perform in front of judges next week to qualify for state [Edited image out]

I guess that I just feel grateful even after all the damage and diseases Accutane gave me I am still here to enjoy these small moments.

Hope all is well with everyone....[Edited image out]

Saweet!

Yes it's the strategy, isotherapy to mobilize it, and then expell it with calcium d glucarate, kombucha, artichoke (glucuronic acid), beetroot apple for liver detox nutrients, charcoal psylium bentonite to prevent reabsorption & egyptian liver flush (10-30ml olive oil + lemon juice each morning) after take the charcoal to flush out all toxins. It worked for me.

But doing some "full" liver & kidney flush (moritz/clark) before doing this is important to be in the best conditions.

Maybe its important to have enough true vitamin A while doing this isotherapy, we don't need the body to not flush it out cause he has a deficiency.

You've probably been asked this a lot, but is there a link or a step-by-step guide to this isotherapy? What did you take, when did you take it, for how many days? I'm confused on whether the kombuch/glucarate and charcoal are the isotherapy or just added to it

I see you said on the isotherapy it was " day 1: 30K, day 3: 200K, day 5: XM, day 7: XMK", but I'm not sure what this means...A step-wise approach would be great for anyone else interested in trying this!

I did a web page for this "method" but it won't help more than what i've already said here, and it's french x)

Before the isotherapy i've done everything to put my body in the better state as possible, changing diet (no grains, no dairy, rarely or not at all meat), i've done 10 epsom&olive liver flush and 2 kidney cleanse (clark one).

Isotherapy is homeopathy, but instead we use the exact same substance. There is no active molecule left so it's safe, only the "imprint" of isotretinoin remains.
Kombucha, glucarate & artichoke (+ beetroot&apple) is to help excretion. After the last dose of isotherapy, the "detox" effect remains 6+weeks, even 2 month. The "olive oil thing" is maybe not necessary, but i've done it 1week/2 for 1.5 month so i can't tell if it work without. I took charcoal, psyllium before this "olive oil thing" because i don't want the toxins expelled with the bile to be reabsorbed back.
After this i've done an other isotherapy for two antibiotics i took for 2years before accutane, minocycline & doxycycline.

It has worked for me.

Well, you have a point there. The last thing we should do is put trust in the drug companies and give them more money...but the short term DHT blocking concept itself is interesting. The scientific literature says that Accutane doesn't reduce, but damages the quality of androgen receptors, so maybe if they are downregulated they can be replaced with newer ones that haven't been accutane exposed...any scientists on here think that makes sense?

The study on the effects of Accutane on androgen receptors that everyone cites actually states the drug was found to decrease binding capacity (an indirect measure of the number/concentration of the receptor), but had no effect on biding affinity (a measure of the strength and duration (quality) of the bonding between the receptor and its ligand).

So the drug is not really damaging the receptors, but lowering their level by some means. Some studies show certain substances that reduce DHT reduce androgen receptor levels as well, but others show a drastic increase in receptor levels when a cell is starved of DHT. I think it may depend on cell-type, duration, or intensity of the DHT inhibition. Accutane has also been shown to decrease IGF-1 in several studies, another factor which androgen receptor levels are likely dependent on.

I'm not a scientist, and I can't make complete sense out of most of Accutane's side effects or I wouldn't still be in this mess.

 

Well, you have a point there. The last thing we should do is put trust in the drug companies and give them more money...but the short term DHT blocking concept itself is interesting. The scientific literature says that Accutane doesn't reduce, but damages the quality of androgen receptors, so maybe if they are downregulated they can be replaced with newer ones that haven't been accutane exposed...any scientists on here think that makes sense?

The study on the effects of Accutane on androgen receptors that everyone cites actually states the drug was found to decrease binding capacity (an indirect measure of the number/concentration of the receptor), but had no effect on biding affinity (a measure of the strength and duration (quality) of the bonding between the receptor and its ligand).

So the drug is not really damaging the receptors, but lowering their level by some means. Some studies show certain substances that reduce DHT reduce androgen receptor levels as well, but others show a drastic increase in receptor levels when a cell is starved of DHT. I think it may depend on cell-type, duration, or intensity of the DHT inhibition. Accutane has also been shown to decrease IGF-1 in several studies, another factor which androgen receptor levels are likely dependent on.

I'm not a scientist, and I can't make complete sense out of most of Accutane's side effects or I wouldn't still be in this mess.

please look into low dose naltrexone people. My symptoms are gone. it's only been a month, but i will complete reporting. That joint pain that got worse at first has now completely vanished. I'm not saying it's for everyone, but at least read up on it. If you have undiagnosed autoimmune dysfunction and/or autoimmune disease...it may be your best friend....Again, only been one month...but i have never felt like this before and I have not changed anything in my diet, stress level, etc. just the naltrexone..took my body 2 weeks to adjust to. I'll keep you guys updated. for me, this is the closest thing to a cure all! and yes, it does work to balance hormones.

Heard of naltrexone before, I always wonder in how far you can take it long-term.

I have been taking unflavored fermented CLO by blue ice for about two weeks and my skin has improved significantly, definitely recommend trying it, but this stuff is expensive. I don't take butter oil and don't plan on buying it, never really heard anybody say that butter oil makes a big difference and CLO is already expensive enough. I would assume it is the Vit A in the CLO that does the magic, therefore I am going to try organic cow's liver soon to see if it has a similar effect.

I did a web page for this "method" but it won't help more than what i've already said here, and it's french x)

 

Before the isotherapy i've done everything to put my body in the better state as possible, changing diet (no grains, no dairy, rarely or not at all meat), i've done 10 epsom&olive liver flush and 2 kidney cleanse (clark one).

 

Isotherapy is homeopathy, but instead we use the exact same substance. There is no active molecule left so it's safe, only the "imprint" of isotretinoin remains.

Kombucha, glucarate & artichoke (+ beetroot&apple) is to help excretion. After the last dose of isotherapy, the "detox" effect remains 6+weeks, even 2 month. The "olive oil thing" is maybe not necessary, but i've done it 1week/2 for 1.5 month so i can't tell if it work without. I took charcoal, psyllium before this "olive oil thing" because i don't want the toxins expelled with the bile to be reabsorbed back.

After this i've done an other isotherapy for two antibiotics i took for 2years before accutane, minocycline & doxycycline.

 

It's what worked for me, but there is always a better solution ^^

Do you have a link to the webpage? Would be good to get exposure on here to a potential working therapy

 

 

Well, you have a point there. The last thing we should do is put trust in the drug companies and give them more money...but the short term DHT blocking concept itself is interesting. The scientific literature says that Accutane doesn't reduce, but damages the quality of androgen receptors, so maybe if they are downregulated they can be replaced with newer ones that haven't been accutane exposed...any scientists on here think that makes sense?

The study on the effects of Accutane on androgen receptors that everyone cites actually states the drug was found to decrease binding capacity (an indirect measure of the number/concentration of the receptor), but had no effect on biding affinity (a measure of the strength and duration (quality) of the bonding between the receptor and its ligand).

So the drug is not really damaging the receptors, but lowering their level by some means. Some studies show certain substances that reduce DHT reduce androgen receptor levels as well, but others show a drastic increase in receptor levels when a cell is starved of DHT. I think it may depend on cell-type, duration, or intensity of the DHT inhibition. Accutane has also been shown to decrease IGF-1 in several studies, another factor which androgen receptor levels are likely dependent on.

I'm not a scientist, and I can't make complete sense out of most of Accutane's side effects or I wouldn't still be in this mess.

Apparently, the drug lowers androgen by increasing a protein called FOXO1:

"Isotretinoin treatment may downregulate the transcriptional activity of AR[Androgen Receptor] by increasing the nuclear concentration of the AR cosuppressor FoxO1.

Furthermore, the isotretinoin-induced decrease of IGF-1 serum levels may impair IGF-1/PI3K/Akt-mediated nuclear export of FoxO1. Moreover, IGF-1

is regarded as an androgen-dependent stimulator of 5-reductase activity. In fact, experimental evidence has been provided for decreased androgen 5-reduction in skin and liver of men

with severe acne after oral isotretnoin treatment.The isotretinoin-induced decrease of IGF-1 may reduce the conversion of

less potent testosterone to the more potent dihydrotestosterone (DHT)"

This paper is very advanced, maybe you can make more sense of it than I can: https://www.landesbioscience.com/journals/dermatoendocrinology/MelnikDE3-3.pdf

They go to talk about how accutane causes upregulation of this FOX1 and how that upregulation can cause the specific side effects...but they don't talk about how to help these side effects. They also mention that doing things to downregulate FOX1, like eating foods with a high glycemic index, and eating a lot of dairy cause acne.

By the paper's logic, eating lots of dairy and terrible food should help side effects by decreasing FOX1...however that doesn't seem to be the case and makes side effects worse from what I've heard on here

That's correct. Assuming continually upregulated FOXO1 is still causing our problems after quitting the drug. This is the conundrum we face: We have study after study showing this drug effects various steroids, neurotransmitters, and their respective receptors, causes long-lasting changes in gene expression, decreased neuron growth, decreased bone density, decreased reaction to insulin, and a slew of other potential causes for our different symptoms, but we can't test for 3/4 of the items discussed in the majority of studies. Without those tests, there's not much we can do to prove the drug did in fact cause our conditions or find out exactly what to treat.

The other major roadblock is the fact that the majority of people who used Accutane did not develop life-altering side effects, although they would theoretically have experienced the same biological effects mentioned in the studies. This is thrown in our faces as evidence the drug didn't do us any harm, without a second thought given to the fact that most serious adverse side effects of drugs are rather rare or they wouldn't have made it to market, or that there are blatant indicators in the science behind the drug that point towards the symptoms we are describing. We even have doctors dismissing us as psych cases because they can't wrap their brains around a drug having long-term side effects, while this particular drug is known to have the benefit of long-term remission of acne.

http://www.westonaprice.org/cod-liver-oil/cod-liver-oil-basics

Now you're heard "somebody" say the butter oil is important. Unbelievable...

 

Apparently, the drug lowers androgen by increasing a protein called FOXO1:

"Isotretinoin treatment may downregulate the transcriptional activity of AR[Androgen Receptor] by increasing the nuclear concentration of the AR cosuppressor FoxO1.

Furthermore, the isotretinoin-induced decrease of IGF-1 serum levels may impair IGF-1/PI3K/Akt-mediated nuclear export of FoxO1. Moreover, IGF-1

is regarded as an androgen-dependent stimulator of 5-reductase activity. In fact, experimental evidence has been provided for decreased androgen 5-reduction in skin and liver of men

with severe acne after oral isotretnoin treatment.The isotretinoin-induced decrease of IGF-1 may reduce the conversion of

less potent testosterone to the more potent dihydrotestosterone (DHT)"

This paper is very advanced, maybe you can make more sense of it than I can: https://www.landesbioscience.com/journals/dermatoendocrinology/MelnikDE3-3.pdf

Excellent paper. The author tries to give as much of a scientific explanation of most of Accutane's side effects as is possible right now.

This particular little ditty is priceless:

FoxO-upregulation Explains all Adverse Effects of Isotretinoin Therapy

All patients treated with isotretinoin suffer from multiple side effects. This already shows that isotretinoin affects other organ systems.

The side-effect profiles qualitatively resemble toxic effects of vitamin A or hypervitaminosis A syndrome.

Notice how few people on acne.org say they had absolutely NO side effects.

The part you quoted is from the section that explains how Accutane likely acts as an anti-androgen, among other acne-fighting properties. He is basically saying Accutane stops transport proteins from moving FOXO1 out of a cell's nucleus where it acts to slow or stop androgen receptor protein from being copied from DNA.

He goes on to explain that Accutane's suppression of IGF-1 adds to this effect of keeping FOXO1 in the nucleus, as well as decrease 5-alpha-reductase activity (the conversion of testosterone to DHT).

I want to mention that sex steroids and growth hormones have been linked to telomerase activity, which is another factor that has been implicated as a possible cause of some of our symptoms

This may only be relevant to those of us with sexual side effects, but they are a couple thoughts I had a while back on the ATM forum concerning this paper by Melnick:

There is also evidence that DHT, the AR, and 5ar work together in a feed-forward loop:

http://www.pnas.org/content/88/18/8044.short "Feed-forward control of prostate growth: dihydrotestosterone induces expression of its own biosynthetic enzyme, steroid 5 alpha-reductase" Now, this is just speculation, but I would figure the negative effects of isotretinoin on the androgen receptor itself would put a damper on this feed-forward mechanism, thereby lowering 5ar activity independently of it decreasing IGF-1's positive effect on 5ar.

 

So we get a "double whammy" on 5ar while taking the drug via isotretinoin's negative effects on both IGF-1 and the AR. Guess what else I noticed in that FoxO1 paper,: "Moreover, like an amplification loop, AR receptor signaling increased IGF-1-expression and IGF-1/ IGF-1 receptor (IGF1R)-signaling in the ventral prostate gland. Oral isotretinoin treatment has recently been shown to decrease serum IGF-1 levels, which may decrease AR-mediated gene expression."

Still, there is some reason only an unlucky few get hit by persistent side effects.

Low IGF-1 wasn't a factor for the majority of us on the ATM forum, which would lead one to think continuous up-regulation of FOXO1 isn't happening. By all means it shouldn't be after we quit taking the drug, according to the paper by Melnick. One would think our androgen receptor levels have returned to normal too, but we have no way of knowing.

I personally have decent testosterone levels, ideal IGF-1 levels on several tests, and have normal DHT levels, but have had a urinary steroid test that showed a 5-alpha reductase deficiency and a test that showed low adiol-g (a metabolite of DHT).

There are some of us with very low testosterone, some with very high testosterone, some with very low DHT, and some with very high DHT. Some of us have had gynocomastia and high estrogen levels, while others are right where they should be for a normal young male.

That's the problem with blood tests. They only show circulating levels, and might not indicate a severe deficiency or excess that might only be localized to a specific area, like the CNS for instance. Only biopsies would show what is happening to us at the protein-level, and are usually only available in a research setting with maybe the exception of cancer-detection. Even with clear-cut evidence of health problems, they will be difficult to link to isotretinoin without these types of tests.

So we have a few blood tests come back in the normal range and get booted out of the doctor's office, and have no solid evidence of how and why Accutane screwed us up so badly, but people are killing their doctors, offing themselves, and flying planes into buildings, and it's being blamed directly on side effects of the drug, but no one is listening. That's how it's been going for 3 decades.

The big question is how and why do the side-effects last forever for so many of us. I'm willing to bet no one would be here if it was only temporary. Fooling ourselves into believing it's all psychogenic hasn't helped anyone, and obsessing about something that's seemingly un-fixable hasn't worked in the past either. Anyone have any different ideas how to handle this?

I believe that many of us are struggling from something autoimmune..my new doctor believes this as well, but will obviously only speak to my experience. He fully believes accutane triggered an autoimmune response like sjogrens, hashimoto's, and RA, have ALL the symptoms of each, but neither show up in blood. Since LDN, nonexistent. just have dry skin, but even that has been slightly alleviated. only been one month. don't know long term...side effects appear to be minimal...sleeping like a baby now. deep restorative sleep. I believe much of it has to do with brain malfunction as well. Lack of serotonin and endorphins, any feel good chemical can wreak havoc on any body...i believe accutane devastated my serotonin levels..but no SSRI will fix it...LDN has drastically improved my mood, joint pain, sleep, sex drive, eye moisture, mouth moisture, scalp itching, and nose moisture. I'm not saying it will work forever, but in theory, it should if its helping the autoimmunity i have going on...but im not assuming everyone has something autoimmune either....it can't hurt to research more about it i did. just do a simple google search...go to forums as well for LDN...smart people on there...quite like here

The big question is how and why do the side-effects last forever for so many of us. I'm willing to bet no one would be here if it was only temporary. Fooling ourselves into believing it's all psychogenic hasn't helped anyone, and obsessing about something that's seemingly un-fixable hasn't worked in the past either. Anyone have any different ideas how to handle this?

These are the real questions. I've tried ignoring the side effects, or supposing that they may be psychogenic, especially since my symptoms include depression and anxiety, but that doesnt work for long considering they disrupt my daily life so much. Also, I've obsessed about it, but that only leads me further into worry and depression, as is the case right now. At this point, I'm not really sure what to do about my problems except eat better, exercise, and treat my symptoms as best I can.

I know one thing, I can't afford to have every test and take every supplement, especially since I am not working now. In the past I have tried that, and many thousands of dollars worth of doctors visits and tests got me nowhere.

In any case, my most distressing symptom right now is my depression, and I plan on starting on an SSRI soon, along with a program of exercise, yoga, and meditation, and maybe fasting. If it is true, as Melnick states in his paper, and as reported in other papers which I can provide, that a major cause of depression, anxiety, and psychosis in those treated by Isotretinoin is apoptosis (death) and decrease of neurogenesis in the hippocampus, then maybe an SSRI would reverse this process. Melnick states that in his paper, and when I spoke with him, he suggested that death and slow growth of hippocampal cells could be a lasting legacy of Isotretinoin treatment.

http://www.westonaprice.org/cod-liver-oil/cod-liver-oil-basics

Now you're heard "somebody" say the butter oil is important. Unbelievable...

Well I have heard them time and time again say it is important, but most people I have talked to take the butter oil just because WP says so and say they get the benefits from the FCLO. I eat butter from grass fed cows that is the closest to butter oil I am going to get

 

http://www.westonaprice.org/cod-liver-oil/cod-liver-oil-basics

Now you're heard "somebody" say the butter oil is important. Unbelievable...

Well I have heard them time and time again say it is important, but most people I have talked to take the butter oil just because WP says so and say they get the benefits from the FCLO. I eat butter from grass fed cows that is the closest to butter oil I am going to get

Then you are ahead of the curve, well done.

But still, butter oil != grassfed butter. But you are doing well.

I believe that many of us are struggling from something autoimmune..my new doctor believes this as well, but will obviously only speak to my experience. He fully believes accutane triggered an autoimmune response like sjogrens, hashimoto's, and RA, have ALL the symptoms of each, but neither show up in blood. Since LDN, nonexistent. just have dry skin, but even that has been slightly alleviated. only been one month. don't know long term...side effects appear to be minimal...sleeping like a baby now. deep restorative sleep. I believe much of it has to do with brain malfunction as well. Lack of serotonin and endorphins, any feel good chemical can wreak havoc on any body...i believe accutane devastated my serotonin levels..but no SSRI will fix it...LDN has drastically improved my mood, joint pain, sleep, sex drive, eye moisture, mouth moisture, scalp itching, and nose moisture. I'm not saying it will work forever, but in theory, it should if its helping the autoimmunity i have going on...but im not assuming everyone has something autoimmune either....it can't hurt to research more about it i did. just do a simple google search...go to forums as well for LDN...smart people on there...quite like here

How did you get prescribed this? How long have you been on it for?

I ordered some blue ice / grass fed butter , cinnamon tingle , I will give it a shot and keep the intake at a low level see how my body responds. I have been wanting to try it for a while with winter coming and less sunlight I think the timing is good.

 

http://www.westonaprice.org/cod-liver-oil/cod-liver-oil-basics

Now you're heard "somebody" say the butter oil is important. Unbelievable...

Well I have heard them time and time again say it is important, but most people I have talked to take the butter oil just because WP says so and say they get the benefits from the FCLO. I eat butter from grass fed cows that is the closest to butter oil I am going to get

Then you are ahead of the curve, well done.

But still, butter oil != grassfed butter. But you are doing well.

ChampionBlood,

Excellent Job. Thanks for posting this article. Bumping this article because it is the best article I read on what exactly accutane is doing.

[Edited link out]

It basically says Accutane causes cell aging by interfering with our FoxOs gene

However, here is a published article on how various supplements like Reishi mushroom directly counteracts this aging effect by up-regulating our FoxOs gene.

[Edited link out]

On 11/3/2013 at 7:38 AM, JTM88 said:

ChampionBlood,

Excellent Job. Thanks for posting this article. Bumping this article because it is the best article I read on what exactly accutane is doing.

[Edited link out]

It basically says Accutane causes cell aging by interfering with our FoxOs gene

However, here is a published article on how various supplements like Reishi mushroom directly counteracts this aging effect by up-regulating our FoxOs gene.

[Edited link out]

Yeah I thought the acticle was pretty good, and I felt pretty good about myself for finding the connection, but apparently they have been talking about FOXO1 on another forum ([Edited link out]) for quite a while.

I guess the next question is how do we counteract this aging effect.

It seems like Reishi Mushroom directly up-regulates the FoxO gene resulting in an anti-aging effect.

the article also mentioned how a reduction in calorie intake positively impacts the FoxO gene as well. Maybe this is why when people juice fast, all of their symptoms subside.

On 11/3/2013 at 8:03 AM, ChampionBlood said:

On 11/3/2013 at 7:38 AM, JTM88 said:

ChampionBlood,

Excellent Job. Thanks for posting this article. Bumping this article because it is the best article I read on what exactly accutane is doing.

[Edited link out]

It basically says Accutane causes cell aging by interfering with our FoxOs gene

However, here is a published article on how various supplements like Reishi mushroom directly counteracts this aging effect by up-regulating our FoxOs gene.

[Edited link out]

Yeah I thought the acticle was pretty good, and I felt pretty good about myself for finding the connection, but apparently they have been talking about FOXO1 on another forum ([Edited link out]) for quite a while.