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What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
What kind of moron comes on this forum to get advice on what to take when on this poison , you should read the 157 pages of why NOT TO
TAKE accutane.
Gee some peoples kids.
Here are some recent studies that will help temper the UDCA love fest. They also discuss the meekness of past studies.
Both studies are about taking UDCA at a high dose. I have warned about taking UDCA at a high dose before.
High dose of UDCA means 28-30 mg/kg/day as explained in the studies. The standard dose that is used in conventional treatment is around:
14mg/kg/day.+- 1 mg
Taking a high dosage is something medicine is still experimenting with so I stick to what has been proven to be relatively save.
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
>
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
What kind of moron comes on this forum to get advice on what to take when on this poison , you should read the 157 pages of why NOT TO
TAKE accutane.
Gee some peoples kids.
Do you have better alternatives for treatment of acne conglobata??? I have tried vitamins, supplements, paleo diet, differin, epiduo, nizoral and some more and they never worked. I know about the side effects if there weren't any I would have taken Accutane years ago. Being rude isn't necessary gladiatoro.
Here are some recent studies that will help temper the UDCA love fest. They also discuss the meekness of past studies.
Both studies are about taking UDCA at a high dose. I have warned about taking UDCA at a high dose before.
High dose of UDCA means 28-30 mg/kg/day as explained in the studies. The standard dose that is used in conventional treatment is around:
14mg/kg/day.+- 1 mg
Taking a high dosage is something medicine is still experimenting with so I stick to what has been proven to be relatively save.
So, where do you go once the conventional dose fails to exhilarate, and it will? Is there an end in sight with this treatment (rhetorical question)? Dont forget our livers are more than likely compromised, even if the damage is subclinical (not all) at this stage. Also, they are talking about it not working much above placebo levels (at high doses), and even then, in a subset of men whom are heavy.
Hi,
wanted to ask if anyone has maybe some advice for me regarding my hormon values? I just have let checked them because of my all over dryness.
Everything looks normal except these three:
(all of them are too high, especially DHT)
dihyrdotestosterone >2500.0 - (250,00-990,00)
testosterone 8,59 - (1,93-8,36)
shbg 71,70 - (10,00-57,00)
I have an appointment next week to see what the cause of these high values are, thought though I ask you too, because you got probably more knowledge about that then some doctors do?
Thanks a lot in advance!
dihyrdotestosterone >2500.0 - (250,00-990,00)
testosterone 8,59 - (1,93-8,36)
shbg 71,70 - (10,00-57,00)
I have an appointment next week to see what the cause of these high values are, thought though I ask you too, because you got probably more knowledge about that then some doctors do?
Thanks a lot in advance!
Well, you have hit the nail on the head. This is why the most pertinent questions at this stage are: Which country are you in? And whom do you intend on seeing, specifically? It would best to see a doctor that believes isotretinoin is capable of the above.
SHBG is mainly produced by the liver, so that is a start. Raised SHBG is usually increased by high estrogen and thyroxine; you dont seem to have checked for that. When you inhibit DHT (with Accutane or with the herbs trading hands on this thread) testosterone levels increase. Your testosterone levels are on the high end, so perhaps there has been a recent reflux spike as the body attempts to attain some sort of equilibrium by building DHT stores again, now that inhibition should be over.
Here are some recent studies that will help temper the UDCA love fest. They also discuss the meekness of past studies.
Both studies are about taking UDCA at a high dose. I have warned about taking UDCA at a high dose before.
High dose of UDCA means 28-30 mg/kg/day as explained in the studies. The standard dose that is used in conventional treatment is around:
14mg/kg/day.+- 1 mg
Taking a high dosage is something medicine is still experimenting with so I stick to what has been proven to be relatively save.
So, where do you go once the conventional dose fails to exhilarate, and it will? Is there an end in sight with this treatment (rhetorical question)? Dont forget our livers are more than likely compromised, even if the damage is subclinical (not all) at this stage. Also, they are talking about it not working much above placebo levels (at high doses), and even then, in a subset of men whom are heavy.
This treatment is very straightforward. The first 2-3 month you spread the dose over the 24 hours, thereafter you only take one dose of the same amount per day before bed time. The treatment typically lasts 6 to 24 months, thereafter you get off it slowly. It helps your system reach a new euqilibrium assuming your system is not totally mest up and has some power left to heal itself. It is not a drug that fights just the symptom, it provides the body with the resource it lacks and by doing so it will reduce inflammation in the system, make it work more efficiently particularly with respect to the liver, gallbladder and the pancreas.
I take 1250 mg a day. The first time I took 50000 mg in total, then I took a break of several months. The effects I got I think I described on here before. It had a broad range of positive effect for me, for instance, it made me gain a healthy 6 kg and reduced my cravings for food ever since. Now it is much more easy for me to follow a gluten free diet, I am even able to go low carb, without much effort. It is basically like taking insulin, as long as you are on it you are good, but you won't have to increase the dose over time quite the contrary. Plus it has the benefit that it may cure your liver/gallbladder system. Look into it.
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
>
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
What kind of moron comes on this forum to get advice on what to take when on this poison , you should read the 157 pages of why NOT TO
TAKE accutane.
Gee some peoples kids.
Do you have better alternatives for treatment of acne conglobata??? I have tried vitamins, supplements, paleo diet, differin, epiduo, nizoral and some more and they never worked. I know about the side effects if there weren't any I would have taken Accutane years ago. Being rude isn't necessary gladiatoro.
Well take it at your own risk then , but don't say I didn't warn you and don't come crying back here when the side effects kick in ok because a lot
of them are permanent and cannot be reversed.
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
>
What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
What kind of moron comes on this forum to get advice on what to take when on this poison , you should read the 157 pages of why NOT TO
TAKE accutane.
Gee some peoples kids.
Do you have better alternatives for treatment of acne conglobata??? I have tried vitamins, supplements, paleo diet, differin, epiduo, nizoral and some more and they never worked. I know about the side effects if there weren't any I would have taken Accutane years ago. Being rude isn't necessary gladiatoro.
Well take it at your own risk then , but don't say I didn't warn you and don't come crying back here when the side effects kick in ok because a lot
of the are permanent and cannot be reversed.
Gladiatoro - Calm Down! Though I don't promote Accutane, If Mikka indeed as Acne Congblata then that is actually what Accutane should be prescribed for...It is a very painful and rare acne disease. Hope everyone is doing well 
Major breakthrough. Doubled dose of UDCA to something ridiculous like 2g per day. Massive improvement. Definitely had cholestasis. Detox and digestive systems were not working, no matter how perfect the regimine, still life was difficult. Now is easy.
There it is Believe; the caution going out the window for results. I am not having a go at Joseph, but I was there years ago. Sooner rather than later, the labs will reveal all. I couldn't handle liver tonics after 2 years, and I can't see people fairing too well with this stuff, which is harsher. You made your point, and, I have made mine. I have yet to hear of any real cure through this stuff. Peace.
On 6/15/2013 at 10:57 PM, oli girl said:On 6/15/2013 at 10:01 PM, gladiatoro said:On 6/15/2013 at 7:19 PM, mikkia said:On 6/15/2013 at 2:46 PM, gladiatoro said:On 6/15/2013 at 5:04 AM, oli girl said:On 6/14/2013 at 9:24 PM, mikkia said:What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!
On Invalid Date at NaN:NaN PM, oli girl said:>
>
On 6/14/2013 at 9:24 PM, mikkia said:What supplements are beneficial while on Accutane? Currently I'm taking vitamin C, E, D3 and B5, Zinc and omega 3. I thought about quitting vitamin B5 now that i ran out of it though.
I was prescribed Accutane when other medications and treatments failed. Hope you guys can help!
You might want post this question somewhere else as we don't promote accutane in this thread! Accutane is toxic! Sorry!lockquote>
What kind of moron comes on this forum to get advice on what to take when on this poison , you should read the 157 pages of why NOT TO
TAKE accutane.
Gee some peoples kids.
Do you have better alternatives for treatment of acne conglobata??? I have tried vitamins, supplements, paleo diet, differin, epiduo, nizoral and some more and they never worked. I know about the side effects if there weren't any I would have taken Accutane years ago. Being rude isn't necessary gladiatoro.
Well take it at your own risk then , but don't say I didn't warn you and don't come crying back here when the side effects kick in ok because a lot
of the are permanent and cannot be reversed.
Gladiatoro - Calm Down! Though I don't promote Accutane, If Mikka indeed as Acne Congblata then that is actually what Accutane should be prescribed for...It is a very painful and rare acne disease. Hope everyone is doing well [Edited image out]
Oli girl I just warned him that's all if he wants to take the poison by all means I won't stop him it's his body and life , if he really has acne
Congblata I understand he is tempted to take it originally it was approved only for that condition ie severe acne , but he should really weigh all
options and should not make the decision lightly .
Well, you have hit the nail on the head. This is why the most pertinent questions at this stage are: Which country are you in? And whom do you intend on seeing, specifically? It would best to see a doctor that believes isotretinoin is capable of the above.
SHBG is mainly produced by the liver, so that is a start. Raised SHBG is usually increased by high estrogen and thyroxine; you dont seem to have checked for that. When you inhibit DHT (with Accutane or with the herbs trading hands on this thread) testosterone levels increase. Your testosterone levels are on the high end, so perhaps there has been a recent reflux spike as the body attempts to attain some sort of equilibrium by building DHT stores again, now that inhibition should be over.
camaroz,
thanks a lot for your fast reply. really appreciate your help!
i'm in germany. i think it doesn't really matter to which doctor i go, since they have probably all never heard about these side effects, deny them or just don't know at all about this drug. i chose a urologist with a focus on andrology (male hormones) though of course.
i will just try my best to explain the case well, give them the necessary informations, coherences and then see what the next steps could be / they suggest.
i'm also in treatment by a chinese medicine doctor, who saw my values this week already. she will now cooperate with a friend of hers whos a biochemist which shall be very good in her field as she told me. will see what there comes maybe around.
i will also see that i get a test done with oestrogen and thyroxine levels.
i assume that as a good sign with the recent reflux?
so far my liver values were quite high too, but i could luckily manage to get them on a very very good, even quite low level recently through fasting/detox and a special nutrition, maybe this could be the reason for it?
.
i assume that as a good sign with the recent reflux?
so far my liver values were quite high too, but i could luckily manage to get them on a very very good, even quite low level recently through fasting/detox and a special nutrition, maybe this could be the reason for it?
Well, I don't know when you came off, but if it was recently, well then, that is a pretty good sign to have T and DHT up there. Many people are hypogondal for life and need TRT. It is great that you were able to calm your liver down, and hopefully your SHBG levels will follow suit. It sounds like you have some people who want to look out for you. If that doesn't work out you can have a phone consultation with Dr. Crisler in the U.S. It is good to have someone you don't have to fight all the way. All the best and hopefully you are not too bad off.
Joseph, you are right about what you say, UDCA is extremely safe. In fact it only lists very few potential side effects most of which are only to occur in people of old age and with a severly damaged digestive system. However, you can't deny that I have posted links to studies that pointed to the fact that higher doses of UDCA are not the standard protocoll and that there may be potential risks associated with taking UDCA at a higher dose.
I like to play it save, I mean it is working for me. At the same time I would like to point out that detoxing the liver is a slow process that needs time, so why not stick with the standard protocoll? For me it took a little less than 2 weeks to really feel the effects of UDCA, after that you just role with it. I don't see any reason to why to go on a high dosage instead I would recommend trying other ways to support the detox process while taking UDCA to get the most out of it.
Joseph, you are right about what you say, UDCA is extremely safe.
Joseph wants a three-day party, and he definitely does not want to pay the fiddler.
PSC people experience subjective quality of life improvements from UDCA but die faster. Their subjective quality of life improves because UDCA assists liver function and is generally anti-inflammatory. We already know this. So why do they die faster?To understand that, you need a basic understanding of liver function and the nature of PSC. PSC is a blockage of the intra-hepatic bile ducts, NOT a malfunction of the hepatocytes. PSC causes lakes of bile to form in the liver, destroying it. Obviously UDCA flows through the liver and contributes to the size of those lakes, thus accelerating mortality.This is NOT an indictment of UDCA. It is working as intended. The problem is that PSC is a death sentence.The other study just points out that UDCA was no more effective than placebo for people so obese they're suffering liver failure. However they did find benefits on biopsy in younger patients. So the study shows that it is still beneficial. Although the obvious solution for those people would be to lose weight.
You know, I wondered why it took you so long to come to the defence of your beloved UDCA; I'm not going to lie and say: I had no inkling of what you might be up to. More to come on this.
---
Oh, an additional pointer that may be useful:
I don't precisely meter my UDCA dosage. Instead, I always take it with food, so it can fulfill its fat digestive function. This also creates a dilutive buffer to prevent any gastro upset.
My feedback metric is simply stool quality and color. The less I go, the better formed, the darker, the better. I go every few days now, unless I'm pulling an all nighter. Had to do two all nighters this week for work, and I handled it no problem. Gold star for me.
A needless moderation is the hobgoblin of tiny minds. I followed the reasonable moderation practice, and when I finally doubled or tripled my UDCA dosage, I gained a level. The many months I spent at a subtherapeutic dosage were pure loss.When the cost is zero, increase the quantity until the marginal utility is zero.I HAVE seen published studies on very high dosage UDCA. It was still safe, but there was no marginal utility past the 1.5-3g / day range. Therefore 1.5-3g per day is the therapeutic dose and the correct dose, and there is no reason to take any other quantity."However, you can't deny that I have posted links to studies that pointed to the fact that higher doses of UDCA are not the standard protocoll and that there may be potential risks associated with taking UDCA at a higher dose. "I did not see anything about high vs low dose in the links you posted. And I saw only one risk - not a potential risk, an actual risk; not a risk, but a certainty - that UDCA will kill people with PSC faster. This is perfectly logical and expected, since PSC kills by forming lakes of bile in the liver, and therefore increased bile flow will kill them faster."I like to play it save, I mean it is working for me."In other words, you like to leave money/health on the table for purely irrational reasons. I don't."At the same time I would like to point out that detoxing the liver is a slow process that needs time, "Unsupported assertion."so why not stick with the standard protocoll? "1.5-3g / d is the standard protocol.I have an entire drawer full of supplements I haven't tried because I'm too risk averse. The risk/reward profile on high-dose UDCA is ridiculously favorable. I could make a much stronger argument for not supplementing with Vitamin D or practically any of the other supplements or foods recommended here.
So you did not ramp up your intake from the get-go either. However, what you write sounds like you recommend anybody to go all in at a high dose without the supervision of a doctor, which I neither deem necessary for a start and just to test it out at a low dose. But everybody reacts differently so don't be negligent.
Especially if you take UDCA without the supervision from a MD, you should definitely start slow. I don't have any side effects personally, but have come across a few reports from people who did not tolerate UDCA very well at all.
The standard protocoll in Germany is to give patients who are at a normal weight 13-15 mg/kg/day over the course of 6 to 24 months as I have posted before. Depending on your weight you may end up taking 2 g/day.
You are right that cost is a factor. For UDCA produced in Germany you pay about 75 for 50 g.
You know, I wondered why it took you so long to come to the defense of your beloved UDCA; I'm not going to lie and say: I had no inkling of what you might be up to. Alright, to begin with you are accusing the lead doctor running the study of rigorously and premeditatedly expediting his patients death by not following previously established dosing determinations set by the FDA; and, Im not even making mention of the, no doubt, unwilling patients requiring earlier serious intervention, and, or, transplants when donors are generally scarce. If that doesnt constitute negligence, I dont know what does?
You twit, he said they were surprised because the results contravened the results garnered previously. You know what else is a death sentence life is. The disease progresses slowly were the words used. So why act hastily, Dr. Death? The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved a UDCA dose of 13-15 mg/kg/day for patients with primary biliary cirrhosis. I wonder why the FDA set a modest dose. They probably have some sort of petty grievance about NOT WANTING TO KILL PEOPLE with carnivore bile. Obviously, previous recommendations were a farce designed to ratchet-up excitement and $. My favorite part is when they talk about the paradoxical nature of the results. I will tell you what is paradoxical: using really strong bile to clear other bile when evacuation routes are subpar. Also in some cases of medicating they combine concurrent use of cholestyramine and ursodeoxycholic acid to reduce the bioavailability of UDCA. I wonder why (rhetoric)? Binding to albumin is probably why UDCA placental passage does not occur.
Also intrahepatic cholestasis which you lay claim to having (not professionally acknowledged), and you failed to diagnose for years, also includes hepatocyte failure due to cholestasis. The nomenclature can refer to toxic bile acid build-up causing injury to hepatocytes or biliary tree damage, or both at once. Have you had a professional rule out the latter? My point is there really such a difference considering the dangers (rhetoric)?
You presupposed, like you usually do, that the subjects in the second article were so obese; they were suffering liver failure. Pull the other one Joe. The wording used was mildly overweight males. It helped them a little, but was comparable to placebo for the majority. So, not worth the trouble is the take-away point. Please, use this to bring yourself up to speed: Furthermore, some patients with NASH are not obese, do not have diabetes, and have normal blood cholesterol and lipids. NASH can occur without any apparent risk factor and can even occur in children. Thus, NASH is not simply obesity that affects the liver.
You know Joseph, I think I will fold. Send me a box of the good stuff and while you are at it, please include a medium sized carnivore preferably a bear. I want to raise my own UDCA, when my batch runs out. The check is in the mail.
Lol cost is not so much a factor for me but the insurance companies who often times don't want to support taking UDCA long-term.
I take 500mg pills, so just three pills per day.
You know, I wondered why it took you so long to come to the defense of your beloved UDCA; I'm not going to lie and say: I had no inkling of what you might be up to. Alright, to begin with you are accusing the lead doctor running the study of rigorously and premeditatedly expediting his patients death by not following previously established dosing determinations set by the FDA; and, Im not even making mention of the, no doubt, unwilling patients requiring earlier serious intervention, and, or, transplants when donors are generally scarce. If that doesnt constitute negligence, I dont know what does?
You twit, he said they were surprised because the results contravened the results garnered previously. You know what else is a death sentence life is. The disease progresses slowly were the words used. So why act hastily, Dr. Death? The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved a UDCA dose of 13-15 mg/kg/day for patients with primary biliary cirrhosis. I wonder why the FDA set a modest dose. They probably have some sort of petty grievance about NOT WANTING TO KILL PEOPLE with carnivore bile. Obviously, previous recommendations were a farce designed to ratchet-up excitement and $. My favorite part is when they talk about the paradoxical nature of the results. I will tell you what is paradoxical: using really strong bile to clear other bile when evacuation routes are subpar. Also in some cases of medicating they combine concurrent use of cholestyramine and ursodeoxycholic acid to reduce the bioavailability of UDCA. I wonder why (rhetoric)? Binding to albumin is probably why UDCA placental passage does not occur.
Also intrahepatic cholestasis which you lay claim to having (not professionally acknowledged), and you failed to diagnose for years, also includes hepatocyte failure due to cholestasis. The nomenclature can refer to toxic bile acid build-up causing injury to hepatocytes or biliary tree damage, or both at once. Have you had a professional rule out the latter? My point is there really such a difference considering the dangers (rhetoric)?
You presupposed, like you usually do, that the subjects in the second article were so obese; they were suffering liver failure. Pull the other one Joe. The wording used was mildly overweight males. It helped them a little, but was comparable to placebo for the majority. So, not worth the trouble is the take-away point. Please, use this to bring yourself up to speed: Furthermore, some patients with NASH are not obese, do not have diabetes, and have normal blood cholesterol and lipids. NASH can occur without any apparent risk factor and can even occur in children. Thus, NASH is not simply obesity that affects the liver.
You know Joseph, I think I will fold. Send me a box of the good stuff and while you are at it, please include a medium sized carnivore preferably a bear. I want to raise my own UDCA, when my batch runs out. The check is in the mail.
What do you recommend as an alternative to detox the liver? So far I have only gotten similar - sometimes even better - results by doing a combination of liver flushing and colon hydro theraphy.
More importantly, much higher doses have been tested with no bad effects, except for the following case:1. When the intra or extrahepatic bile ducts are blocked: PSC, PBC, biliary atresia, etc.Which is just DUH. If the pipe is blocked, do not flush the toilet. It will overflow and then bad things.
In the case you claim to have (doubt you do; just clutching at straws) you haven't even dropped your little parcel into the toilet yet for you to be concerned about plumbing. That is the point, it hasn't even cleared the cell and you want to throw more in there without knowing the extent of the damage. It sounds about right. Again, it has taken you years to get here?