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so i didnt read the entire thread, i dont have a hair shedding/loss problem, but i dont mega dose, but im trying to understand much of the role of b5 on the body and feel the affect of b5 mega dosing and hair shedding will provide some insight into understanding the effect this vitamin has on the body.
from the few pages i read and bit of research ive done on b5, as it states on wikipedia, CoA biosynthesis requires cysteamine, pantothenate (b5) and adensine triphosphate (atp).
so mega dosing b5 can deplete cysteamine.. so taking l-cysteine or nac (acetylcysteine) assists in coa production, or fat metabolism, which helps the b5 to work as well as doesnt allow cysteamine to deplete ? and this somehow has a relationship with the shedding hair ?
a post i replied to called High Dose B5 And Increased Cortisol someone asked if there was a relationship of adrenal gland size with mega dosing b5.. and perhaps mega dosing b5 could increase cortisol levels to a point which it affects hair loss ? is this what has been discussed here ?
so l-carnitine, l-cysteine and nac all just assist in coenzyme a production, or fat metabolism, and creates an environment where cysteamine does not deplete. that is what is being attempted here in this discussion ?
any cliffs on this thread or feedback on some of the points above would be appreciated and im sure helpful for all.. cheers
On 12/15/2013 at 5:35 PM, itsoveroveriknowiknow said:Fuck!!! Iv lost so much hair now. Looks horrible. Going back on b5 had done some damage. Push it to the limit!? keep eating b5? Is that a good ide? It definitely is!
Not quite sure what you mean here, are you saying taking b5 again has made the hairloss even worse?
On 12/13/2013 at 6:14 AM, krohm said:so i didnt read the entire thread, i dont have a hair shedding/loss problem, but i dont mega dose, but im trying to understand much of the role of b5 on the body and feel the affect of b5 mega dosing and hair shedding will provide some insight into understanding the effect this vitamin has on the body.
from the few pages i read and bit of research ive done on b5, as it states on wikipedia, CoA biosynthesis requires cysteamine, pantothenate (b5) and adensine triphosphate (atp).
so mega dosing b5 can deplete cysteamine.. so taking l-cysteine or nac (acetylcysteine) assists in coa production, or fat metabolism, which helps the b5 to work as well as doesnt allow cysteamine to deplete ? and this somehow has a relationship with the shedding hair ?
a post i replied to called High Dose B5 And Increased Cortisol someone asked if there was a relationship of adrenal gland size with mega dosing b5.. and perhaps mega dosing b5 could increase cortisol levels to a point which it affects hair loss ? is this what has been discussed here ?
so l-carnitine, l-cysteine and nac all just assist in coenzyme a production, or fat metabolism, and creates an environment where cysteamine does not deplete. that is what is being attempted here in this discussion ?
any cliffs on this thread or feedback on some of the points above would be appreciated and im sure helpful for all.. cheers
Really good post mate it sounds like you understand it a lot more than me, I think Itsover and yourself should get talking as I think you two understand the whole thing a lot more than others.
So after all this, would you guys suggest NOT taking b5?
I took it before for 4 months, my hair got dry but no excess shedding was noticed.
My skin didn't completely clear, but that was because I was eating coconut oil and coconut milk every single day the entire time I was taking it, and I know with 100% certainty that coconut oil/fat makes me break out like crazy.
When I took b5 last time, the areas of my back that usually got acne cleared, but my chest and different areas of my back got it instead, I think that was the b5 trying to work and the coconut fat making acne appear elsewhere.
I've just started taking b5 again, as I said it gave me dry hair last time but no shedding, but I don't know if I want to continue if I'll be bald in a few years from it.
Thoughts?
So after all this, would you guys suggest NOT taking b5?
I took it before for 4 months, my hair got dry but no excess shedding was noticed.
My skin didn't completely clear, but that was because I was eating coconut oil and coconut milk every single day the entire time I was taking it, and I know with 100% certainty that coconut oil/fat makes me break out like crazy.
When I took b5 last time, the areas of my back that usually got acne cleared, but my chest and different areas of my back got it instead, I think that was the b5 trying to work and the coconut fat making acne appear elsewhere.
I've just started taking b5 again, as I said it gave me dry hair last time but no shedding, but I don't know if I want to continue if I'll be bald in a few years from it.
Thoughts?
Dude don't even bother taking the stuff it's not worth it man don't make the same mistake I did, im 24 and I have 50% less hair because of it, I'd rather have hair and deal with the acne
so the mega dosing causes the hair loss ?
and the theory behind it is that mega dosing b5 extracts cysteamine which has a role in hair development/loss,..?
can someone advise regarding this, we kind of need to know what is happening, what process is happening for this to happen,..
if it is related to mega dosing only.. or have people noticed this hair loss on 2-3-4g...
Yes to all, we suggest not taking B5 as it has caused hair loss in many of us. I have read a forum where a girl started shedding hair from taking 1 gram of B5 a day (look back in this forum for the link). We are not certain the reason. We have theories.
Better news:
The Clobetasol Propionate (steroid) .05% solution and shampoo have slowed down the shedding. My dermatologist informed me the shedding should slow down if the dandruff/irritation on my scalp was suppressed. Right now I am alternating the steroid shampoo, Ketoconazole 1% and 2% shampoo, and DHS Zinc shampoo. My dermatologist suggested alternating the shampoos would have a greater effect which seems to be working. I am applying the steroid solution every other day.
I am still taking Avodart and applying Rogain 2x per day which has helped me to regrow hair slowly but surely. I also started the stinging nettle root 250mg 2x per day.
1g a day of b5 causes hair loss ? come on this cant be true.. this is mega dosing causing a cortisol issue.. there must be some evidence to show this issue..
itsoveriknowiknow what is the evidence regarding this... anyone else care to comment.. what is the correlation.. is it cortisol ? i have no doubt people experience hair shedding from mega dosing b5,.. too much anectodal evidence to suggest there isnt something to it,.,. but we should find out how/why this is happening.. obviously avoiding high dosing of b5,.. mega dosing is going to be the way to go..
but have people experienced it from 2-3-4 grams ?
The girl who started shedding from 1 gram a day was a post I read.
To be safe, I wouldn't recommend taking anything over half a gram a day.
Could be cortisol that is the cause of shedding. Read through these:
[Edited link out]
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=175738
Low cortisol causes inflammation. Could explain why are scalps are inflamed/irritated and therefore shedding hair. One of the users stated he is now taking B12 shots which some dermatologists give to stop hair shedding, but usually for Telogen Effluvium. I also read a while back that a guy shedding from megadosing on B5 would get monthly steroid injections that helped slow down the shedding. There is also an oral steroid (see below).
Possible treatment?:
http://www.webmd.com/drugs/drug-6730-Cortef+Oral.aspx?drugid=6730&drugname=Cortef+Oral
I recently went to the dermatologist and she said I needed to take biotin, and try rogaine for women. But my question is I heard Biotin can break certain people out, and I went on B5 to help with oily skin and cystic acne. Would it be wise to try out Biotin anyway? She suggested Elon or Nature made Biotin.
Update-
I took RU for 3 months. It completely stopped my shedding/scalp itching and my hair started to grow back. I stopped taking it because I don't want to continue to order chemicals from China, but if interested you may read about it on thebaldtruth. I currently use Ketoconazole 1% (nizoral) which slows down the shedding, but causes no regrowth.
I believe the evidence points towards b5 tiggering male pattern baldness. Those who are having success use products that affects DHT such as AVODART which pjjordan is using. I don't post much because there is no cure if my theory is correct. Don't take b5, hair>acne. Take b5 if you can rock the bald/jacked look or get scalp micro pigmentation.
I am currently taking 3000IU of vitamin D a day for acne with a non dairy diet. I get the occasional pimple, nothing more.
Regarding b5 dosing- B5 turns into testosterone. Men have ~17x more T then girls. Therefore we would expect that B5 would affect girls much more drastically then men due to it being a much bigger percentage change. Here are two cases from acne.org which I posted about earlier.
Two months ago I stopped taking Vitamin B5 due to hair loss. My hair is still falling out in tremendous amounts but I am now starting to notice a bunch of new hairs growing in. I check my scalp regularly & each day I'm noticing more and more new hairs. I'm hoping this is a good thing but the hair falling out has not stopped yet. Anyone suffering from hair loss due to B5 please let me know if this has also happened to you. ~Beautyy
Hi, Just want to give everyone a big warning about this vitamin. I started my 14 year old daughter on pantothenic acid for her skin,. I bought it from Holland and Barratt. A couple of months in she started to shed hair but I thought it was just cyclical. After 5 months and more sheds I took her off it and a fortnight later I could see lots of scalp through her normally thick curly hair. ~Liz Grimshaw
Beautty claimed her hair was growing back, something we would expect since girls don't have MPB. Hope I'm wrong, but take RU if you are desperate.
So I've been re-reading this whole thread from start to finish now, and as it is now it seems pretty hard to get an overview over regimens that have actually been succesful. Itsoveryes seems to have good news with the RU and ketoconazole.
Could anyone else who seem to have found a succesful regimen recap/update, so we have the latest and best info collected.
For me personally nothing has worked so far, I still have diffuse shedding all over the scalp, and all my bloodtests have been within the normal range as I have previously posted.
So I've been re-reading this whole thread from start to finish now, and as it is now it seems pretty hard to get an overview over regimens that have actually been succesful. Itsoveryes seems to have good news with the RU and ketoconazole.
Could anyone else who seem to have found a succesful regimen recap/update, so we have the latest and best info collected.
For me personally nothing has worked so far, I still have diffuse shedding all over the scalp, and all my bloodtests have been within the normal range as I have previously posted.
Since we believe it is MPB you would treat it with what's called the big 3. That is an internal DHT blocker such as fin/avodart (stronger), rogaine, and a shampoo containing keto. RU is an alternative DHT blocker which is supposedly safer due to it blocking DHT only at the scalp, not systemically. Remember there is no cure, all this will slow down the hair loss until hopefully a real cure is developed.
I personally have focused on other areas in my life. Gained ten pounds of muscle, put more stye in my wardrobe, great haircut can make it look like you have zero loss.
Agreed. It clearly started Male Pattern Baldness. It's what every dermatologist labeled my hair loss and I've been to 5 in the past 3 years. In addition, my scalp biopsy came back conclusive MPB.
I am going to try to get RU. Just difficult since you order from China...
http://www.thekaneshop.com/index.php/popular-products/ru58841.html
Order RU there via western union. It's legit, where I got mine.
http://www.mpbtreatments.com/#/shop/4563157000/KB-Solution/1716873
Order KB there, it's the vehicle to deliver the RU into the hair follicle. Never oder pre made it degrades.
Order a small bottle with dropper on amazon to mix the solution. It's very easy.
DON'T go higher than a 4% solution, the KB can only carry that much solution at one time.
http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=12391
Complete RU guide
Hey all. I too megadosed (sorta) on B5 and have now lost about 50% of my hair. I started and stayed on around 2.5 grams daily for around 6 momths. I started to notice minor shedding at around 5 but at 6 it got bad enough to scare me off it. I was taking it with a b-complex as suggested by others and still ended up with the hair loss. I noticed it got really bad after not taking it regularly for about a week coupled with some heavy drinking (holidays). I stopped immediately and am now feeling the full after effects of this god damn devil vitamin.
Reason I'm posting is I'm curious if anyone else is/was experiencing symptoms other than hair loss. Pretty immediately I noticed that my hair was not only falling out but a percentage of individual strands were very wirey or very thin and stick straight up against the grain. In addition, about 30 minutes after showering I would notice pretty substantial flaking and (what I thought) was extreme dryness. My scalp would be irritated for about an hour but by the end of it I would notice my scalp/forehead would be VERY oily. I now have a suspicion that the itchyness and flaking is due to massive amounts of oil coming on but I'm not sure if it's oily b/c its dry or if it's oily b/c I'm off the pills. I did notice flaking/minor scaling in my inner ear which looked like I let glue dry in my ear (not like dry skin) which I think is seborrheic dermatitis or something. It only lasted a few days while I skipped washing my hair b/c so much was falling out.
If that isn't enough, my stool is slightly darker than usual and a different consistency. If I don't wash my hair twice daily I will get a nice sheen on my scalp that smells very much like the inside of a well worn in cap (really sucks).
That's my part of this problem for anyone who's interested. I'm not currently taking any supplements other than protein shakes after I workout. All in all I've only had hair loss for about 2-3 months, with the majority of it in the last 30 days. I know that's nothing compared to some of you other kind folk but I'm sure y'all understand the frustration. I'm hoping that steady working out and positive vibes will help my hair forgive me for what I did to it.
Hey all. I too megadosed (sorta) on B5 and have now lost about 50% of my hair. I started and stayed on around 2.5 grams daily for around 6 momths. I started to notice minor shedding at around 5 but at 6 it got bad enough to scare me off it. I was taking it with a b-complex as suggested by others and still ended up with the hair loss. I noticed it got really bad after not taking it regularly for about a week coupled with some heavy drinking (holidays). I stopped immediately and am now feeling the full after effects of this god damn devil vitamin.
My hair loss also seems to be getting much worse after drinking.
So I've been re-reading this whole thread from start to finish now, and as it is now it seems pretty hard to get an overview over regimens that have actually been succesful. Itsoveryes seems to have good news with the RU and ketoconazole.
Could anyone else who seem to have found a succesful regimen recap/update, so we have the latest and best info collected.
For me personally nothing has worked so far, I still have diffuse shedding all over the scalp, and all my bloodtests have been within the normal range as I have previously posted.
Since we believe it is MPB you would treat it with what's called the big 3. That is an internal DHT blocker such as fin/avodart (stronger), rogaine, and a shampoo containing keto. RU is an alternative DHT blocker which is supposedly safer due to it blocking DHT only at the scalp, not systemically. Remember there is no cure, all this will slow down the hair loss until hopefully a real cure is developed.
I personally have focused on other areas in my life. Gained ten pounds of muscle, put more stye in my wardrobe, great haircut can make it look like you have zero loss.
Agreed. It clearly started Male Pattern Baldness. It's what every dermatologist labeled my hair loss and I've been to 5 in the past 3 years. In addition, my scalp biopsy came back conclusive MPB.
I am going to try to get RU. Just difficult since you order from China...
http://www.thekaneshop.com/index.php/popular-products/ru58841.html
Order RU there via western union. It's legit, where I got mine.
http://www.mpbtreatments.com/#/shop/4563157000/KB-Solution/1716873
Order KB there, it's the vehicle to deliver the RU into the hair follicle. Never oder pre made it degrades.
Order a small bottle with dropper on amazon to mix the solution. It's very easy.
DON'T go higher than a 4% solution, the KB can only carry that much solution at one time.
http://www.baldtruthtalk.com/showthread.php?t=12391
Complete RU guide
Hey dude how's it going? Couple questions for ya while taking the RU did you get and side effects like libido loss or anything? Also completely off topic what supplements did ya use to help gain 10 pounds?
Hello guys. I'm 19 years old. Ive been taking Vitamin B5 10g/day for almost a year, maybe even more. It was from 17-18 years old I think, I cant really remember.
Im pretty sure I had a long break this last summer but this autumn I started to break out again and bought some more vitamin b5, didnt help at all, I think the dose I was taking now was 5G/day, and now ive have not been taking vitamin b5 for atleast 3-4 months.
Well the problem is, I started shedding hair 4 months ago. I think my hairlines have recedeed a little bit, but I lose hair all over my head. I remember when I played football and I grabbed the hair in my neck, 3-5 small hairs could follow.
I also have dandruff, itchy scalp, Ive had it for like 3 months now, it doesnt get better. I always thought I lost hair because of that, but now when I saw this thread yesterday and read all of it, it must be because of the vitamin B5. And I literally cried, yes first time I cried since my grandmother died 5 years ago, I dont know what to do if I'm gonna lose my hair because of this.
I still live with my parents, I havent told them about this. Ive just talked with them about my problems with scalp and ive been to the doctor, they think its seborrhoeic dermatitis.
For the last month, I also experienced strong fatigue and my eyes are tired all the time, its like its hurting my eyes when I look at movies or playing games that requires much focusing.
Ive seen you guys talking about adrenal fatigue, thyroid and mpb. I want you to help me now, I'm gonna talk to my parents about this and I wanna know what test I should get at my doctor, to see if everything is right in my body. So please, name the most important tests about this problem and I will try get them done and share my results with the rest of you!