I haven't found anything that has reduced my shedding.
Hi. I™m a female who began taking pantothenic acid in December 2019. I would take 10-15 pills per day (500 mg each). My acne (face and back) was completely gone within 3-4 months. I noticed my ponytail feeling thinner January 2020 but didn™t think too much. Then I noticed my hair way thinner late April 2020. I still kept taking the pills but tapered off of them (probably not as slow as I should have) and took the last pill June 1, 2020. At that point, I was losing handfuls of hair. My hair eventually decreased by at least 50%. Thankfully I had very thick hair to begin with. From June 2020 until January 2021 I tried multiple things to stop the hair loss (inositol powder, biotin, zinc, fish oil, barleans essential vitamins, etc.). February 2021 I began to take Viviscal supplements that I bought at Target. You™re supposed to take one pill two times a day. Sometimes I remember to take two pills a day and other days I just take one (rarely, I forgot to take them at all). Last week I noticed my hair feeling much fuller. My boyfriend and coworkers can see the difference too. I have a lot of short flyaways now. I hope post this helps someone else 
On 4/23/2021 at 10:54 PM, Terrifairy13 said:Hi. I™m a female who began taking pantothenic acid in December 2019. I would take 10-15 pills per day (500 mg each). My acne (face and back) was completely gone within 3-4 months. I noticed my ponytail feeling thinner January 2020 but didn™t think too much. Then I noticed my hair way thinner late April 2020. I still kept taking the pills but tapered off of them (probably not as slow as I should have) and took the last pill June 1, 2020. At that point, I was losing handfuls of hair. My hair eventually decreased by at least 50%. Thankfully I had very thick hair to begin with. From June 2020 until January 2021 I tried multiple things to stop the hair loss (inositol powder, biotin, zinc, fish oil, barleans essential vitamins, etc.). February 2021 I began to take Viviscal supplements that I bought at Target. You™re supposed to take one pill two times a day. Sometimes I remember to take two pills a day and other days I just take one (rarely, I forgot to take them at all). Last week I noticed my hair feeling much fuller. My boyfriend and coworkers can see the difference too. I have a lot of short flyaways now. I hope post this helps someone else
Oh interesting! Glad that had been working out for you. Viviscal has biotin which makes me break out though, argghh.
On 4/28/2021 at 1:29 PM, valorous said:Oh interesting! Glad that had been working out for you. Viviscal has biotin which makes me break out though, argghh.
I just checkedand its only 120 mcg of biotin (40 % of your daily value). I am very acne prone and have not noticed an increase in acne since starting Viviscal a few months ago. I do get about one pimple break out per month but it seems to correlate with my menstrual cycle.
when I stopped b5 I was worried my cystic acne would return but its hasnt yet. I did notice my skin started to get very oily again within weeks of stopping b5 (it was very oily before I started b5). I have consistently been using Panoxyl 10% on my face and body for over a year now and I think thats helped keep my acne from returning. I watch a dermatologist on YouTube named Dr. dray who shares amazing tips.
Alright Im typing on this forum hoping for some advice and experience from others. Im a 19 yr old male who took b5 for about a month and a half, and for a month of taking it I was taking 5 grams a day. I stopped because just like everyone else, my hair became thin pretty fuckin fast. Went from thick curly hair that would take effort to see the scalp to being able to see it easily when my hairs wet or by moving it just a little. Just wanted to know if anyone with similar experience got their hair to grow back, and if they did, the amount of time it took and if they did anything specific to help. Im honestly done with taking any pills though after this shit experience. Fuck acne, fuck b5, fuck hair loss.
Ill also try to come back to this post every few months with updates if my hair hopefully does come back.
I personally do not think that the B5 shed is directly correlated to MPB.
Otherwise, there is no logical explanation as to why women experience B5 shedding - which they clearly do. The mechanism needs to be the same - it's the same vitamin.
Men who alreadysufferfrom MPB often do not realise it until past a certain threshold ashair miniaturisation takes a while (some years) to show.A sudden onset of shedding after starting a vitamindoesn't really seem like logical MPB - even from a hormonal standpoint. That isn't how it usually works.Induced TE can expose and speed up MPB though, especially in men who are currently not on treatment options, so this ismore likely in my opinion.
What most men in this forum are currently seeing is a combination of TE and MPB. The TE, triggered by the B5 eventually stops - but the MPB shed continues, or is now noticed / exposedby the sufferer.
I've been shedding since March 2021. It's also worth noting that I have been using treatment options for MPB prior and throughout my journey with B5. I wasn't shedding for the first 3-4 months on the vitamin.
I'll post an update later, but I did completely cut out the vitamin for a few weeks and noticed a heavy reduction in shedding - even in the shower.
I started taking 500mg once every other day and have noticed the shed start up heavily again. As one can assume, my acne has been getting much worse since stopping. Today was a turning point as I noticed hair on the back of my head fall out heavily, which is not at all a miniaturising region for me. In truth, when TE occurs,hairs fromthe MPB region fall out "easier" - but the fact is, it's because their cyclerate is more common - after all,they are weaker, thinner hairs.
What I will say is that B5 can trigger a complete,heavy shed in all individuals who decide to take it. It works for the skin - so long as you actually continue it. This can be to the heavyexpense of the hair. I have noticed a severe reduction in overall density over the past months. Whilst I've taken B5, I've even noticed increased fallout of eyebrow and eyelash hair, as well as pubic hair.
It's honestly a shame, because the measures I had taken for my hair last year (been taking topical alfatradiol for preservation and DHT protection) have been set back from this.
I now plan to cut B5 completely and take l-cysteine to compensate. I'll hope that my skin will deal with some sort of homeostasis and chill out a bit, but again, that's a gamble I'm gonna have to take for my hair.
//
My skin does look a lot "nicer" when I'm not using B5. I've realised that the oiliness is actually quite a nice look, compared to the drastic, chalky dryness that Vitamin induced. With that said, the oil is clearly what brings about the acne - so that is lame.
i think i just may have an onset of mpb. My family hair genes is utter shit, all my uncles have receding hairlines with bald patches except my dad who has like a bald patch starting to form in his 50s. To further reinforce this notion, my brothers hair started to recede when he was only 17. Welp, im waiting for my dermatologist and ill just bite the bullet and take fin if he concludes that its mpb. Additionally, when i first took the vitamin i was already shedding hair like 2 hours after taking 2 pills of b5. I highly doubt a vitamin can cause this sudden hair loss in just a short span and its not even a day.
On 8/13/2021 at 9:48 PM, christopher140 said:I personally do not think that the B5 shed is directly correlated to MPB.
Otherwise, there is no logical explanation as to why women experience B5 shedding - which they clearly do. The mechanism needs to be the same - it's the same vitamin.
Men who alreadysufferfrom MPB often do not realise it until past a certain threshold ashair miniaturisation takes a while (some years) to show.A sudden onset of shedding after starting a vitamindoesn't really seem like logical MPB - even from a hormonal standpoint. That isn't how it usually works.Induced TE can expose and speed up MPB though, especially in men who are currently not on treatment options, so this ismore likely in my opinion.
What most men in this forum are currently seeing is a combination of TE and MPB. The TE, triggered by the B5 eventually stops - but the MPB shed continues, or is now noticed / exposedby the sufferer.
I've been shedding since March 2021. It's also worth noting that I have been using treatment options for MPB prior and throughout my journey with B5. I wasn't shedding for the first 3-4 months on the vitamin.
I'll post an update later, but I did completely cut out the vitamin for a few weeks and noticed a heavy reduction in shedding - even in the shower.
I started taking 500mg once every other day and have noticed the shed start up heavily again. As one can assume, my acne has been getting much worse since stopping. Today was a turning point as I noticed hair on the back of my head fall out heavily, which is not at all a miniaturising region for me. In truth, when TE occurs,hairs fromthe MPB region fall out "easier" - but the fact is, it's because their cyclerate is more common - after all,they are weaker, thinner hairs.
What I will say is that B5 can trigger a complete,heavy shed in all individuals who decide to take it. It works for the skin - so long as you actually continue it. This can be to the heavyexpense of the hair. I have noticed a severe reduction in overall density over the past months. Whilst I've taken B5, I've even noticed increased fallout of eyebrow and eyelash hair, as well as pubic hair.
It's honestly a shame, because the measures I had taken for my hair last year (been taking topical alfatradiol for preservation and DHT protection) have been set back from this.
I now plan to cut B5 completely and take l-cysteine to compensate. I'll hope that my skin will deal with some sort of homeostasis and chill out a bit, but again, that's a gamble I'm gonna have to take for my hair.
//
My skin does look a lot "nicer" when I'm not using B5. I've realised that the oiliness is actually quite a nice look, compared to the drastic, chalky dryness that Vitamin induced. With that said, the oil is clearly what brings about the acne - so that is lame.
Well if we're talking hormones here,it's well known in the scientific community thatartificiallystarting permanent hair loss is not only possible, but if your hormones are imbalanced enough, probable.
And guess what ? All that information is readily available:
https://www.webmd.com/connect-to-care/hair-loss/symptoms-of-high-dht
QuoteAcne Is a Symptom of High DHT
A Receding Hairline Is a Symptom of High DHT
Sounds familiar doesn't it ? People reporting losing hair permanentlyand also having "oily skin" with acne (if things progress far enough).
QuoteHigh levels of androgens, including DHT, canshrink your hairfollicles as well as shorten this cycle, causing hair to grow out looking thinner and more brittle, as well as fall out faster.
B5 hair loss is not mysterious in the slightest. MPB genes only influence hair follicle susceptibility to DHT in the body and the shape of the hair loss. Elevate your DHT enough and you're going to permanently lose hair regardless of what genes you have or don't have.
Okay now let's piece together the rest of the puzzle. So how do we explainthe people reporting hair loss (that's not permanent) that is happening in their scalp andrandom places around their body (body hair). Ever heard of low testosterone hair loss ?
https://dinerroboticurology.com/blog/low-testosterone/6-signs-of-low-testosterone/
https://www.webmd.com/skin-problems-and-treatments/hair-loss/hair-loss-causes-women
QuoteHair loss in patients with low testosterone isnt limited to the scalp, thinning body hair may also be a signal of a testosterone deficiency.
What if you were to take a certain supplement that taken in large amounts has amechanism of action that can lower said testosterone(and potentiallyelevate DHT in turn).
It's certainly always possible that you could have MPB or telogen effluvium if you have only hair loss and no other symptoms.I've never heard of telogen effluvium being kickstarted from a high supplement dosage and seems like a stretch at best.
QuotePeople reporting losing hair permanentlyand also having "oily skin" with acne (if things progress far enough).
Yeah, this is completely off base. Both are caused by DHT, but exhibited by different expressions of 5-alpha-reductase. Type I, II and III are produced by different strains of 5ar and therefore cannot be said to be directly correlated. Doing so is not only unscientific, but just inaccurate. There are manypeople with acne who never lose a strand of hair and many completely bald individuals with near-perfect skin. Similarly, BPH which is caused by excessive DHT in the kidneys is common in older men, but many have perfect hair. Yes, these things can often interplay, but this is absolutely nota clearcut "this means that" situation.
On 10/11/2021 at 5:05 PM, MrBushido said:Elevate your DHT enough and you're going to permanently lose hair regardless of what genes you have or don't have.
This isn't completely wrong, but it is inaccurate. DHT is generally bad for hair butthese thingsDOdepend on your genes, actually. It depends on follicle sensitivity to DHT and this is in fact related to genetics. Two men with MPB may have the same amount of DHT, but their correlating baldness is in fact due to a genetic predisposition to DHT sensitivity at the hair follicle. Although, the exact genetic expressions for this isstill extremely grey and unverified. You're oversimplifying something you know little about.
On 10/11/2021 at 5:05 PM, MrBushido said:What if you were to take a certain supplement that taken in large amounts has amechanism of action that can lower said testosterone(and potentiallyelevate DHT in turn).
This doesn't make any sense. B5 doesn't lower Testosterone. If anything, taking Pantothenic Acid is desirable for androgenproduction,. It's extremely difficult to lower free-testosterone in males without causing extremely severe and noticeable feminising side-effects and this isn't at all what B5 does. If this WAS what it did, then hair loss would likely be a completenon-issue, as DHT - which is synthesised from freeTestosterone in itself - would be under-produced in correlation to previous levels. If anything, oestrogenwould be in excess and cause completely different issues for the individual. In some cases, this could cause a reversal of hair loss in a dramatic way. This also would not lead to women getting the exact same symptoms as men.B5 works by inhibiting co-enzyme A and this is a different mode of action.
Low-test can and will cause some hair loss at times in certain individuals, but this is usuallyextremely excessive anddoes not all explain theB5 shedding in the slightest, so is very much off-topic.
On 10/11/2021 at 5:05 PM, MrBushido said:I've never heard of telogen effluvium being kickstarted from a high supplement dosage and seems like a stretch at best.
Then you haven't read much at all. T.E is extremely common from a variety of different medications, including SSRIs. Vitamin B5 is not exactly your typical "supplement" like zinc, but even if you were to classify it that way, messing with hormones in general can obviously trigger an induced T.E and this can easily stem from excessive supplementation in one direction. This even happens when starting the hair loss medication "Finasteride."
Your point alsoignores my statementon women which is equally, if not more important. If women shed from B5,which they evidently do, then the mechanism is obviously something separate to a simple "MPB trigger" - with that said, general T.E can and will aggravate already progressingMPB and this should be noted. The two can interplay together. Hormones are more complicated than "this does this and these two things are connected." I think for the sake of everyone here, and those seeking to learn more about shedding, hair loss, acne and more, I think it's best to try and keep things as factual as possible, and if not - then at least acknowledge that knowledge is scarce instead of simplifying these things to a silly degree.
On 1/14/2013 at 7:31 PM, Exister said:So I'm sitting here rubbing my head and watching a dozen or so hairs fall out and realizing, "holy shit, it is true". My L-cysteine should be here this week.
did you hair stop falling?
On 1/5/2013 at 9:41 PM, phillyeagles91 said:Can I get a progress update? Is your hair still not shedding? Any regrowth as of yet?
I took b5 for like a little less than a month at 5-7 grams and experienced crazy shedding to my normally thick hair. Its still continued for 3 months and counting which is pretty depressing, so if this works, GOD BLESS YOU.
hi philly, is your hair still falling out? if not what did you do to help it?
Maybe we should look at the hormones closely again. B5 has a huge effect on the adrenal glands. These produce a lot of hormones that contribute to hair growth and loss. Seems like the body would balance out after a while but the hairloss is hard to stop in many people it seems including myself. Seems like something in the body is still functioning like it has high levels of B5 maybe which can produce more hormones or maybe the adrenals are fatigued and cant produce enough. There are studies showing that removing the adrenal glands from animals such as rats and rabbits boosted their hair growth rapidly and it continued growing thick even in older mice.
The only things that I have found that makes my hair grow back a bit and quit shedding are eating a good diet not consisting of many carbs. Lots of whole food. Keto friendly. Exercise. This also happens to be a diet that is good for the adrenals glands. Maybe there is some correlation here that someone can put together. Processed foods high in carbs make the hairloss speed up for sure. Some people seemed to have success from inositol but there are some scary reviews about that as well as B5. Scared to try it lol. Saw palmetto helped some with hair growth but reduced other hormones.
Sometimes I go for a long hard run. This depletes me of energy and hair grows good for several days. Feels thicker and nice. Maybe decreases stress hormone?? I dont know. Here is a Quote for the article I posted below. This kinda caught my eye. "Subjecting mice to mild stress over many weeks increased corticosterone levels and reduced hair growth. Hair follicles remained in an extended resting phase. Together, these findings supported the role of corticosterone in inhibiting hair regrowth".
Thats All I have for now. Reference below.
https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/how-stress-causes-hair-loss
Maybe we should look at the hormones closely again. B5 has a huge effect on the adrenal glands. These produce a lot of hormones that contribute to hair growth and loss. Seems like the body would balance out after a while but the hairloss is hard to stop in many people it seems including myself. Seems like something in the body is still functioning like it has high levels of B5 maybe which can produce more hormones or maybe the adrenals are fatigued and cant produce enough. There are studies showing that removing the adrenal glands from animals such as rats and rabbits boosted their hair growth rapidly and it continued growing thick even in older mice.
The only things that I have found that makes my hair grow back a bit and quit shedding are eating a good diet not consisting of many carbs. Lots of whole food. Keto friendly. Exercise. This also happens to be a diet that is good for the adrenals glands. Maybe there is some correlation here that someone can put together. Processed foods high in carbs make the hairloss speed up for sure. Some people seemed to have success from inositol but there are some scary reviews about that as well as B5. Scared to try it lol. Saw palmetto helped some with hair growth but reduced other hormones.
Sometimes I go for a long hard run. This depletes me of energy and hair grows good for several days. Feels thicker and nice. Maybe decreases stress hormone?? I dont know. Here is a Quote for the article I posted below. This kinda caught my eye. "Subjecting mice to mild stress over many weeks increased corticosterone levels and reduced hair growth. Hair follicles remained in an extended resting phase. Together, these findings supported the role of corticosterone in inhibiting hair regrowth".
Thats All I have for now. Reference below.
Just thought I'd corroborate your thoughts, I totally agree. I don't think it's as simple as lowering cortisol unfortunately, but more of a balancing act. There was a study I keep referencing on B5: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18520055/ , B5 has been shown to elevate cortisol levels.
There's also this very interesting study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3880087/ , that further confirms that increasing cortisol (i.e. taking B5 in large amounts for example) decreases testosterone.
This is probably common knowledge at this point but testosterone is generally known to perpetuate acne ( https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2923944/ ).
Just suggesting that there is scientific evidence to advocate that B5 could indirectly decrease testosterone (and therefore acne) but I won't speculate further. Maybe someone can poke holes in this argument, but this was the knowledge I operated off of when I was working on resolving my hair loss.
I just want to add some additional supporting articles (which are obviously not studies) to support the above:
https://www.drlamcoaching.com/blog/how-to-control-low-cortisol-acne
In the same vein, when cortisol levels diminish due to adrenal fatigue, the level of testosterone increases.
Testosterone increases the production of sebum, leading to more likelihood of clogged pores. Therefore,low cortisol acneappears.
https://vegamour.com/blogs/blog/cortisol-and-hair-loss
But thatsnot the only waycortisol can cause hair shedding. If elevated cortisol levels impair the production of sex hormones by the adrenal glands, the result can be androgenetic alopecia, added Dr. Ilyas.Androgenetic alopecia is a hormone-driven form of hair loss that is also commonly known as male or female pattern hair loss.
This article was very meaningful for me, as a doctor blanket suggested that elevated cortisol levels can indirectly cause androgenetic alopecia or MPB.
Is this all reductive ? 100%. I'm not blanket suggesting that people on this forum had low cortisol to begin with. I do not believe it's necessarily as trivial as low cortisol = acne, no hair loss and high cortisol = no acne and hair loss but if you're working towards balancing your cortisol (reducing sugar intake, exercising, getting adequate sleep) and using that as a starting point, there's at least 1 person on this forum that thinks you're on the right track.
In regards to inositol, that didn't work for me personally but from my personal experience, recommending supplements is an exercise in futility. People have varying severities of hair loss and the supplements that work seem to often not be transferable. There's a lot of crap out there that addresses the symptoms (sometimes with buzz words like "energy") that may even help short term (i.e. B5) but long or short term either perpetuate the hair loss or screw up your thyroid. I can say from my personal experience that the only supplements that helped me were ones that either supported my adrenal glands (not stimulated) or promoted balance and those were very few and far between.