Interesting, and inexpensive (my favorite!) - I use AHA morning and night, I have rolling scars which have improved after 4 erbium fractionated treatments (not Fraxel as I was corrected by another user) but they still aren't 100% - I'll add an MSM cream to my routine slowly (I never do anything fast and all over, learned that the hard way).

One question for you, what is the PMD you reference in your last sentence?

Once an indented scar has formed MSM cream or any other cream/lotion cannot fill the indents and cause long-lasting results. MSM cream is just another snake oil. You don't find any before/after pics of atrophic acne scars that have vanished because of the use of that product.

I agree with mikae, creams alone will not help scarring. You need to induce some kind of wound healing response, which is what lazers, dermabrasion, skin needling etc are all designed to do. Creams will only help to improve results after these invasive treatments, using them alone is a waste of time and money.

I agree with mikae, creams alone will not help scarring. You need to induce some kind of wound healing response, which is what lazers, dermabrasion, skin needling etc are all designed to do. Creams will only help to improve results after these invasive treatments, using them alone is a waste of time and money.

''Do not do any additional harm''.

This should have been the law of everyone MD trying to improve skin health .PERIOD.

So MDs should try to feed the skin both from inside and externally. Instead they choose to do further damage that sometimes

has counter productive results.

 

I agree with mikae, creams alone will not help scarring. You need to induce some kind of wound healing response, which is what lazers, dermabrasion, skin needling etc are all designed to do. Creams will only help to improve results after these invasive treatments, using them alone is a waste of time and money.

So MDs should try to feed the skin both from inside and externally. Instead they choose to do further damage that sometimes

has counter productive results.

I show you how much lasers can improve the quality of scarring and you how feeding the skin both from inside and externally helps. Let see which one yields more impressive results! Ok?

Sadly Mikae there are some who would have others believe that snake oils do work. I am not against "alternative" therapies but I am when they are undocumented, not scientifically proven and time consuming. If we simply had to walk outside and absorb the sun while eating good food in order to eradicate our scars (I wish!) then I think it's safe to say that lasers and other skin treatments would not exist. Makes "alternative" medicine moot if you ask me.

Personally, I know for certain that at-home remedies, natural crap (like lemon juice and oils), MSM creams and the like, and not protecting your skin from the sun are completely bogus and will not work. In fact most of these things will only add to your skin concerns, especially not wearing sunscreen and avoiding sunburn!

Scientific research and medical advancements are the answer. Lasers, skin needling, peels etc and the skin care products that augment these treatments are what are and should be mandated. Sure, there are some professionals in the field who are less skilled therefore your chance of negative side-effects is greater with them but that is why we, as consumers, must do our research.

I also know for certain that I am wasting my breath on some, but that's okay. I have seen the proof of scientific/medical devices single-handedly and in countless studies. Can't say the same for our "alternative" medicine loving friends.

People are too brainwashed to not believe in natural methods.

Whatever researchers find,they will also find that Nature has made a better version of it.

Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.Others have side effects cause they are not natural.

People damage their skin with medical methods instead of feeding it with natural.

Quirky fox probably gets sunburn cause she eats too much acidic foods,aka foods of aging.

So sun detoxifies all of her acid and expells it thought her skin.Its her own waste that has made her cell membranes to not be elastic.

Add to this the poisons in her make up and sunscreens(titanium dioxide) and then you see that people are being self poisoned .

But now they know,so they will hopefully change and seek nature to be free from all this medical.

@ quirky .Just do this regimen if you want to stop get scammed.

a)make 1/4 of avocado mixed with 1 teaspon of safflower oil.Leave that mask for 30min to as lon as you like and rinse.

b)rub blackstrap molasses on your scars and also eat 1 teaspoon everyday.

c)take a small flesh of pineapple and rub it to your scrs or whole face.Let it dry and rinse after some time.

d)use cyenne tincture to the scars to improve blood circulation.

e)massage for 15-30 minutes with olive oil ,or jojoba oil or whatever oil you find suitable.

f)rub raw avocado to the scars .its just like butter

g)mix 50/50 jojoba and castor oil apply.Then cover with small cut pieces of plastic wrap(should not contain bisphenol a) and place to cover the whole face

except nostrils and eyes of course.

Stay away from acidic foods,aka foods that make stomach to produce very strong acids and eat mainly fruits.

Report back after some months and you wont blame the Sun .LOL.

I won't be doing any regime that is not scientifically proven or in line with my personal view on things. Also, I do not get sunburned because I wear sunscreen. The last time I was sunburned was over 10 years ago. I am not being scammed so I am not sure where you thought I was. I know what I am doing for my skin.

Whatever researchers find,they will also find that Nature has made a better version of it.

Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.

I'm still waiting that you post evidence that natural methods work better for scarring than lasers?

For others, why there're numerous people trying to vouch natural methods that doesn't work for scars on this site? Of course, some are marketing products or online shops but what about the others? If one would believe the stuff that panos writes it could be harmful and potentially life threatening e.g. "Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.".

 

Whatever researchers find,they will also find that Nature has made a better version of it.

Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.

I'm still waiting that you post evidence that natural methods work better for scarring than lasers?

For others, why there're numerous people trying to vouch natural methods that doesn't work for scars on this site? Of course, some are marketing products or online shops but what about the others? If one would believe the stuff that panos writes it could be harmful and potentially life threatening e.g. "Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.".

Wait bro.With natural methods you can feed your skin every year ,

And every year you can become better.That alone tells everything.

 

Whatever researchers find,they will also find that Nature has made a better version of it.

Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.

I'm still waiting that you post evidence that natural methods work better for scarring than lasers?

For others, why there're numerous people trying to vouch natural methods that doesn't work for scars on this site? Of course, some are marketing products or online shops but what about the others? If one would believe the stuff that panos writes it could be harmful and potentially life threatening e.g. "Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.".

Wait bro.With natural methods you can feed your skin every year ,

And every year you can become better.That alone tells everything.

The fact that you don't post any reliable before/after pics, studies, reviews etc. to support your claims tells everything. The fact that I can do this for lasers etc. tells everything.

You may have hard to believe this but I think overall natural methods are underrated. However, I haven't seen reliable evidence that natural methods would help atrophic scars. Therefore, I have no reason to believe those claims. Peels helps when done properly but that's not exactly what you're vouching for.

People are too brainwashed to not believe in natural methods.

Whatever researchers find,they will also find that Nature has made a better version of it.

Nature wins 100% of all times,so only natural methods work.Others have side effects cause they are not natural.

People damage their skin with medical methods instead of feeding it with natural.

Explain to me who "they" are? Back up your claim that nature wins "100% of all times" with scientific proof. How are people damaging their skin with medical methods? I have seen nothing but improvements.

Quirky fox probably gets sunburn cause she eats too much acidic foods,aka foods of aging.

So sun detoxifies all of her acid and expells it thought her skin.Its her own waste that has made her cell membranes to not be elastic.

Add to this the poisons in her make up and sunscreens(titanium dioxide) and then you see that people are being self poisoned .

But now they know,so they will hopefully change and seek nature to be free from all this medical.

Stay away from acidic foods,aka foods that make stomach to produce very strong acids and eat mainly fruits.

Report back after some months and you wont blame the Sun .LOL.

You don't get it, I do not worry about the sun. The sun is not harming my skin! I wear sun protection, I get enough vitamin D every day, I never get sunburned. You assume I eat acidic foods but you have no way of knowing this, and even if I did it would make no difference because I protect myself from the sun. You claim sunscreen is dangerous. You can claim that, but where's your proof? You do realise that titanium dioxide (which is not found in all sunscreens) is considered to not be a risk? Scientific research has lead to the conclusion that it sits in the stratum corneum... the top most layer of your skin, the dead skin cells. It does not penetrate into the deeper cells therefore it does not cause harm. If someone had any concerns about putting titanium dioxide on their skin then all they would have to do would be to look for a sunscreen that doesn't contain it. Same goes for zinc oxide.

One link to back my claim up (among many links!): http://www.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/currentissue-P10000045

"The Therapeutic Goods Administration actively monitors matters relating to the regulation of nanotechnologies and has found no current evidence to suggest that sunscreen nanoparticles pose greater safety risks than conventional products."

I agree with you, Panos, on one thing only and that is making sure you eat a healthy diet, but this is not even limited to those with scarring, obviously. Everyone should eat a healthy diet. I have never said what I eat or don't eat, so your suggestions about what foods to avoid etc are pointless.

The point that Mikae and I are trying to make is that if you're going to make wild claims about something then you need the irrefutable evidence to back it up. Otherwise, all you're going to be faced with is a barrage of questions and accusations, as you're facing now. These claims that avocado, pineapple and an array of weird oils can somehow magically improve your scarring, in my opinion, is absolute rubbish. If you were to convince me otherwise, you'll need to show me the proof not just empty words. I'm not going to believe you just because you say so and I am not going to waste my money on purchasing products just to try them. That's not how a smart consumer works.

Also, if your claim is that Dermarolling, lasers, chemical peels, dermabrasion etc are scams then explain to me why they work so well for scarring? Have you researched the biology of skin and scarring? I.e. how they form, what they're made of, how they react with different invasive procedures? If you answer yes, then I would like to see some evidence or scientific studies that you have found that proves the effectiveness on atrophic scarring using these "techniques" you claim are so excellent. Because surely, if you know how skin works then you should be able to tell me how these things make a difference. We want to know why they work and we're not interested in what they do to your insides because it is our skin we're working on here.

I have already acknowledged that in rare cases the medical devices that I am defending have caused damage. There are a number of reasons for this including machine break-down, lack of the physician's skill/knowledge, the consumer's choice to accept rip-off treatments or devices and poor self after-care (or consumer lack of knowledge). Blind consumers blame the companies that manufacturer rip-off dermarollers for their skin damage when in fact it is their (the consumer's) fault. In Australia the only "FDA" approved skin needling roller is the original German-made Dermaroller. I found this information out, I made the right choice, my skin is improving. Why others can't too is beyond me. People look for the cheaper, marketed "faster" alternative and this is dangerous. So, my point here is that nothing is ever 100% effective. Anything that claims otherwise is surely a scam.

Furthermore, you need to realise that I know that the Dermaroller works for indented scarring and that the results are permanent and NOT harmful and that the skin care products that I use are improving and strengthening my skin. I know this for a fact because I have seen 80% improvement in my scarring and my skin has never looked better. I encourage you to do the research here, you may be surprised. Dermarolling does not "damage" the skin in the way that you think and the healing process and collagen remodelling is natural. So to that end, there is no scam here. There is however, many incredibly talented scientists, dermatologists, aestheticians, doctors and surgeons out there that have researched, developed and implemented these incredible medical devices and professional skin care products that finally work on our acne scarring and skin issues. I thank them, not avocados.

Dermarolling and peels work but you should do it like once or twice a year and after some period you should go at

totally small mm.

People try to cheat Nature once again .They never seem to learn.

If people would follow a totally healthy diet,(NO MEAT+DAIRY+VEGETABLES WITH BIG FIBERS+JUNK AND PROCESSED STUFF)

would see better results from every other non natural method.

The stuff i purpose WORK because they restore and correct the cells from an electric point of view.But i am sure you wouldnt understand this

even if you are an avid researcher because you have no experience with electricity in the body and subtle energies!

So i advise you to throw the poisons in your trash bin and return to Nature.

Titanium dioxide is a deadly poison,but just like all poisons ,human body adapts to.But it will be STILL A POISON

whatever claims you make and i am not going to DEBATE ON A POISON.

Arsenicum was also used medically some years ago and the body still could adapt !!!!!!!!!!!

The stuff i purpose WORK because they restore and correct the cells from an electric point of view.But i am sure you wouldnt understand this

even if you are an avid researcher because you have no experience with electricity in the body and subtle energies!

As you don't post any evidence I consider you don't find any. Where have you read this stuff btw? It seems like you've googled "natural methods and scars" and combined all the wild claims you have found and consider them as effective. You haven't been able to test them all by yourself. Also, although something might work as a theory it doesn't mean it works in practice.

Panos, I really have nothing more to say to you on this. You have never provided evidence that your methods work. All you do is dodge the hard questions and then go back to raving about your methods. You clearly do not have the answers and I personally think that you are a fanatic; unable to question the effectiveness of your claims.

Good luck in treating your skin. I mean it, you'll need it.

Panos, I really have nothing more to say to you on this. You have never provided evidence that your methods work. All you do is dodge the hard questions and then go back to raving about your methods. You clearly do not have the answers and I personally think that you are a fanatic; unable to question the effectiveness of your claims.

 

Good luck in treating your skin. I mean it, you'll need it.

Its NOT MY METHODS.ITS NATURE METHODS.LIVING IN HARMONY WITH NATURE AND LOVE IS THE CURE FOR ALL DISEASES.

You say you love animals, but you eat them.

You say you love trees, but you chop them down.

You say you love flowers, then you pick them.

And then you say, I love you......

Panos, I really have nothing more to say to you on this. You have never provided evidence that your methods work. All you do is dodge the hard questions and then go back to raving about your methods. You clearly do not have the answers and I personally think that you are a fanatic; unable to question the effectiveness of your claims.

 

Good luck in treating your skin. I mean it, you'll need it.

I couldn't agree with you more on this. I hoped Panos could have been able to defend his claims with solid evidence. He might have come up with information we hadn't thought before. Clearly, that was too much to ask for.

 

Panos, I really have nothing more to say to you on this. You have never provided evidence that your methods work. All you do is dodge the hard questions and then go back to raving about your methods. You clearly do not have the answers and I personally think that you are a fanatic; unable to question the effectiveness of your claims.

 

Good luck in treating your skin. I mean it, you'll need it.

I couldn't agree with you more on this. I hoped Panos could have been able to defend his claims with solid evidence. He might have come up with information we hadn't thought before. Clearly, that was too much to ask for.

Yes, I wish he could back his claims up too. My mind is open to pretty much everything but unlike some I cannot just take the word of someone as being the truth, I need evidence. Panos cannot give me this, therefore I cannot believe what he says is true.

 

Panos, I really have nothing more to say to you on this. You have never provided evidence that your methods work. All you do is dodge the hard questions and then go back to raving about your methods. You clearly do not have the answers and I personally think that you are a fanatic; unable to question the effectiveness of your claims.

 

Good luck in treating your skin. I mean it, you'll need it.

I couldn't agree with you more on this. I hoped Panos could have been able to defend his claims with solid evidence. He might have come up with information we hadn't thought before. Clearly, that was too much to ask for.

Yes, I wish he could back his claims up too. My mind is open to pretty much everything but unlike some I cannot just take the word of someone as being the truth, I need evidence. Panos cannot give me this, therefore I cannot believe what he says is true.

Its so eaSy to prove it for yourself. Take 1/4 avocado and mash it with 1 teaspoon of olive oil(better safflower).

Put the mask everyday on your face for 1 month. And then you can call me a scammer.

ITS SO EASY YET NOBODY DOES IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Its so eaSy to prove it for yourself. Take 1/4 avocado and mash it with 1 teaspoon of olive oil(better safflower).

Put the mask everyday on your face for 1 month. And then you can call me a scammer.

ITS SO EASY YET NOBODY DOES IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Panos,

Please stop with your nonsense. It is insulting to people struggling with real acne scars! No one appreciates a troll.

 

Its so eaSy to prove it for yourself. Take 1/4 avocado and mash it with 1 teaspoon of olive oil(better safflower).

Put the mask everyday on your face for 1 month. And then you can call me a scammer.

ITS SO EASY YET NOBODY DOES IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Panos,

 

Please stop with your nonsense. It is insulting to people struggling with real acne scars! No one appreciates a troll.

Hey man i dont see why i shouldnt mention some natural treatments that works.

Maybe some people are not interested in evaporating their skin with lasers.

Calm down bro.

 

Its so eaSy to prove it for yourself. Take 1/4 avocado and mash it with 1 teaspoon of olive oil(better safflower).

Put the mask everyday on your face for 1 month. And then you can call me a scammer.

ITS SO EASY YET NOBODY DOES IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Panos,

 

Please stop with your nonsense. It is insulting to people struggling with real acne scars! No one appreciates a troll.

Hey man i dont see why i shouldnt mention some natural treatments that works.

Maybe some people are not interested in evaporating their skin with lasers.

Calm down bro.

Because you have been asked repeatedly to provide proof that it works - pictures, real studies, anything would help. But you can't provide any because these "natural" treatments you speak so highly of do absolutely nothing but instill false hope in people.

Guys guys calm down, we are all here to help one another correct?

You don't have to take anyones word for anything - if you want to try it out "these home natural things' then thats fine, if not you don't have to!

I actually break out from using olive oil on my skin, so I can say without doubt that the avocado and olive oil will not work for me.

I wouldn't use lasers either as they seem too risky in my eyes for the light scaring and hyperpigmentation that I personally have.

I am very intrigued with the derma stamp and roller though, has anyone here got any before and after pics with it? or know of any links on this site of people who could?

I am from the UK and so after watching that BBC3 documentary 'dying for clear skin' I am wishing to go and visit the DMK clinic in London and get some professional advice

Hello everybody, I am new to this forum. I have followed the WHOLE thread here. I have decided to try the avocado cream as suggested by Panos who was a fan of natural methods. Unfortunatel, no results. Meanwhile my sister who also has serious scarring issues (perhaps at this point I would like to point out the value of a thread exploring heridatary traits in scarring), has a laser procedure two months ago. She had 90% improvement, basically she is clear of scars...I am going too! I am soryy, but in this case, nature loses, 100%. Thus, I tell you all...the human race is smart...very smart...so move over and let science take over as the saying goes. Thank yo ufor reading my post.