She is right about breakouts around the chin area being related to hormones. You say you eat a mostly vegan diet in your signature--is this a high-nutrient diet? Instead of taking Vitamin A capsules, which are dangerous, have you considered beta-carotene rich plant foods like leafy greens? Leafy greens, especially of the cruciferous family, are great at helping to balance hormones and take up excess estrogen (you might also look into DIM). My green smoothie thread (link in my signature) talks more about all of this. Adding blended greens to your diet might do you a world of good, and when you blend them, you get about four times the nutrients, because they cell walls are blended down so thoroughly.

I hope something works out for you. I know it's frustrating to try so many different things, but keep it up--at least you're making great strides towards health!

Yeah, I do eat a lot of leafy greens. I get a local organic box of fruits and veggies delivered once a week, and I juice a lot of them. I stay away from raw cruciferous vegetables because they are bad for the thyroid, which I already have a problem with. I eat pretty healthy, my naturopath is happy where my nurtients and vitamin levels are. But like I said, it's 2 steps forward, one step back with my acne.

I stay away from the vitamin A because of the headaches, but I was closely monitored by my doctor when I was taking those. I might ask her about the anti androgen approach, I don't really understand it even though I've been researching it recently. I doubt my doc will think it's a good idea because we are trying so hard to regulate my hormones. I don't want to throw a monkey wrench into it, but this progesterone is just killing my skin.

About cruciferous vegetables and the thyroid, I found this quote by Dr. Joel Fuhrman, M.D.:

The Thyroid Connection

Isothiocyanates were in the past considered goitergens (anti-nutrients) that inhibit the uptake of iodine by the thyroid gland. However, this no longer thought to be significant in humans. Nutritional excellence Lastly, while everyone eventually jumps on the cruciferous vegetables are good for you bandwagon, lets not forget H = N/C (Health = Nutrient intake divided by Calorie intake). In other words, besides all of their unique features, green cruciferous vegetables still contain more vitamins and minerals per calorie than any other foods.

Source: http://www.diseasepr...rous-power.html

 

 

Where you diagnosed with having low progesterone? High estrogen? Where are you applying the progesterone? I assume it's not synthetic if it's from a naturopath. Are you taking oral contraceptives? Are you taking a thyroid hormone? If so, when did that start and/or has the dosage changed?

And have you tried DIM or broccoli pills which help flush away excess estrogen? What about phytoestrogens which might help by being weaker so they have less of an affect when they bind to receptors? How is your digestion? Did you try taking the zinc with food to prevent the nausea?

And I'm only going on anecdotal evidence gathered from discussions with many people here (and my personal experience) but your breakouts sound like allergic reactions to me. And those do not take 30 days to appear. They often appear within a day or two. I have a suspicion that most if not all cystic acne are inflammatory responses. And breaking out in the same spots over and over as well. I get cysts from most citrus and it appears all along my jawline, neck, temple and hairline. And sometimes on my cheeks. And it seems that different citrus cause breakouts in different places. I've been unwilling to test it on myself, but when I decided to try having a tangerine again after years of avoiding them, cysts appeared at my temples the next day. And for many years, I couldn't have key limes, I would seemingly randomly get cysts on my jawline and neck. Eventually I figured out it was from when I bought key limes to have in water, vs lemons or Persian limes which I don't have a problem with.

I recall others reporting cysts between their eyebrows from members of the Genus Prunus family.

Thanks everyone for your input!

About cruciferous vegetables and the thyroid, I found this quote by Dr. Joel Fuhrman, M.D.:

The Thyroid ConnectionIsothiocyanates were in the past considered goitergens (anti-nutrients) that inhibit the uptake of iodine by the thyroid gland. However, this no longer thought to be significant in humans. Nutritional excellence Lastly, while everyone eventually jumps on the cruciferous vegetables are good for you bandwagon, lets not forget H = N/C (Health = Nutrient intake divided by Calorie intake). In other words, besides all of their unique features, green cruciferous vegetables still contain more vitamins and minerals per calorie than any other foods.Source: http://www.diseasepr...rous-power.html

However, I think eating cooked blended greens is great as well if this is a concern. If you're juicing greens--even better. Are you mostly eating all whole, non-processed foods?

I want to bring up the iodine issue again, because I think it is very, very misunderstood today but highly important. Dr. David Brownstein has done an enormous amount of research about iodine, and he believes nearly all in the U.S. are deficient in it and that it's the cause of many health problems. I know many doctors today dismiss it, and I forget the details why, but I do remember that their dismissal is based off of bad science, tests, etc...something along those lines, but somehow, everyone just went with dismissing it (which of course, helps the pharmaceutical companies). Sorry to not have better facts off hand.

This video:explains a lot more about it -- it's quite fascinating. The first 3:10 minutes are worth watching just for Dr. Brownstein's testimony, as an M.D., for why he no longer fully believes in conventional medicine. Dr. Brownstein also has a book about iodine. There are also many articles about it at www.naturalnews.com.

I'm glad you're on Maca--I have always heard great things about it and was actually looking into it just yesterday. A lot of people have gotten great results with balancing their hormones by taking Maca. Traditional Medicinals has some tea for women that also seems to get great results with balancing hormones.

As for your doctor contradicting what Alternativista has to say, I would definitely seriously consider what Alternativista says and the people here on the message boards--and a lot of her information is based on personal experience from people here on the boards. I put a lot of merit into what works for others. I have found that with any doctor I go to--no matter how well respected they are in the alternative field--I always have to play my own doctor in the end. They always recommend things I disagree with. It's crazy! It doesn't mean they aren't helpful though in helping to figure things out.

I want to applaud you and your husband for all the changes you have made! I know it's not an easy thing to suddenly do cold turkey, but it sounds like you two are really working together as a team to improve both your lives--that's awesome.

I want to bring up the iodine issue again, because I think it is very, very misunderstood today but highly important. Dr. David Brownstein has done an enormous amount of research about iodine, and he believes nearly all in the U.S. are deficient in it and that it's the cause of many health problems. I know many doctors today dismiss it, and I forget the details why, but I do remember that their dismissal is based off of bad science, tests, etc...something along those lines, but somehow, everyone just went with dismissing it (which of course, helps the pharmaceutical companies). Sorry to not have better facts off hand.

This video:explains a lot more about it -- it's quite fascinating. The first 3:10 minutes are worth watching just for Dr. Brownstein's testimony, as an M.D., for why he no longer fully believes in conventional medicine. Dr. Brownstein also has a book about iodine. There are also many articles about it at www.naturalnews.com.

I'm glad you're on Maca--I have always heard great things about it and was actually looking into it just yesterday. A lot of people have gotten great results with balancing their hormones by taking Maca. Traditional Medicinals has some tea for women that also seems to get great results with balancing hormones.

As for your doctor contradicting what Alternativista has to say, I would definitely seriously consider what Alternativista says and the people here on the message boards--and a lot of her information is based on personal experience from people here on the boards. I put a lot of merit into what works for others. I have found that with any doctor I go to--no matter how well respected they are in the alternative field--I always have to play my own doctor in the end. They always recommend things I disagree with. It's crazy! It doesn't mean they aren't helpful though in helping to figure things out.

I want to applaud you and your husband for all the changes you have made! I know it's not an easy thing to suddenly do cold turkey, but it sounds like you two are really working together as a team to improve both your lives--that's awesome.

 

Even in this one thread there is conflicting evidence about iodine, ha ha! I use sea salt (non iodized) and don't eat meat, so I think I probably do need to get my iodine from somewhere. I've been the iodine and iron multi for 2 years¦ so I don't think I am deficient in it, therefore I don't think it's the cause of my issues.

Let me be clear. I am always for a patient being their own advocate. I have two M.D.'s in my family, and am very comfortable disagreeing and debating with doctors. Many times the research I have done for myself has informed my derm and naturopath on which way to go with my care. One of the reasons I am on this site is to research and find what other people find to be true. However, I do trust my doc. She has completely turned around my husband's health, and got me off SSRI's (which I never thought I would be able to do). I don't think people give naturopath's enough credit, even though they are licensed physicians. There are tons of calculations my doctor does with my test results, weighing pros and cons, lots of things lay people didn't go to school for 7+ years to study. This is especially apparent when you consider the philosophy behind naturopathy, treating the body as the interconnected system that it is. Not a la carte "spot treatment". Lots of times I will bring something up to her, and she will take 10 minutes to explain why the thing I spent 3 days researching isn't true in my case. I use her as further education, not as the final word though.

Like I have been saying, the treatment for my depression in a round-about way is causing my acne. I eat well, my digestion is good, I have a low toxic environment, but I am on progesterone. I guess alternativista's research doesn't conflict with what my doctor says, but conflicts with itself (if I am understanding it right):

PMS issues and irregular cycle may be indicators of estrogen dominance. It's about a possible excess of estrogen relative to a possible deficiency of progesterone. And acne and other symptoms occur with the monthly fluctuation of progesterone.

So I have estrogen dominance. Not high estrogen, just not the proper balance of estrogen to progesterone, which can cause acne. But fluctuation of progesterone can also cause acne? So the cure is also the cause!?

Symptom of estrogen dominance: acne.

Side effect of treatment: acne!

It reminds me of a Simpsons quote: "ALCOHOL! The cause of and solution to all of life's problems." Why do I see women on the org that say their acne cleared up by treating estrogen dominance when progesterone causes acne? What am I doing wrong?

In the end, treating my depression is more important than treating my acne. And it has helped me, I just wish there was a way I didn't have to choose. I'm trying to do the right thing and balance my hormones, but instead of it being the magic bullet, it's causing more skin problems. I've been on Maca for about 9 months, I don't think it's done much to balance my hormones. If it did, my doctor could have decreased my progesterone slightly without sending me into a tailspin. Also, theoretically it would have helped my acne if it is hormone related. I can see if my hormones are balanced on Monday when I get my tests back, but the proof is in the pudding. How I feel is the real test.

Thanks for the encouragement about the lifestyle changes. It's been 2 years since we've been on the right track, so I don't think about it too much anymore. All our friends think we are crazy though

Are you taking oral contraceptives? Are you taking a thyroid hormone? If so, when did that start and/or has the dosage changed?

 

So sorry, I missed these questions:

No oral contraceptives, been off of those for about 2.5 years.

Yes, I am on a very low dose of nature-throid at the moment. I was taking 1/2 of a 3/4 grain (which is 28.5 mcg T4, 6.75 mcg T3), but I was getting hyperthyroid symptoms so I have started a 1/4 dose (7.12 mcg T4 and 1.68 mcg T3). My levels are now within the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists levels. (Don't follow Quest's reference ranges, they are outdated and not correct). I will probably ween off soon, or keep on this micro-dose.

I started the thyroid about 18 months ago, first I was on compounded thyroid... which was synthetic but vegan. I was overshooting my levels too much though, so now I am doing the nature-throid which is from pigs (I'm not crazy about that part). I changed over to the nature-throid about 6-8 months ago, no difference in acne that I noticed.

I know there is a link between acne and hypothyroidism. However, getting my thyroid on track has not been the answer for me. Is acne a side effect of thyroid meds? Is this another thing where the symptom is also the side effect? Please, don't let it be so!

Wanted to mention that there are different types of iodine--it's important to take the right kind. Nascent Iodine is a good one, and I believe Lugol's is as well.

What type of maca have you been on? I hear there is the raw maca and then the royal maca, which is slightly cooked I think.

It sounds like you have found a really great naturopath--that's a blessing!

Yes, I am on a very low dose of nature-throid at the moment. I was taking 1/2 of a 3/4 grain (which is 28.5 mcg T4, 6.75 mcg T3), but I was getting hyperthyroid symptoms so I have started a 1/4 dose (7.12 mcg T4 and 1.68 mcg T3). My levels are now within the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists levels. (Don't follow Quest's reference ranges, they are outdated and not correct). I will probably ween off soon, or keep on this micro-dose.

I started the thyroid about 18 months ago, first I was on compounded thyroid... which was synthetic but vegan. I was overshooting my levels too much though, so now I am doing the nature-throid which is from pigs (I'm not crazy about that part). I changed over to the nature-throid about 6-8 months ago, no difference in acne that I noticed.

I know there is a link between acne and hypothyroidism. However, getting my thyroid on track has not been the answer for me. Is acne a side effect of thyroid meds? Is this another thing where the symptom is also the side effect? Please, don't let it be so!

 

I don't know about the meds, but both hypo and hyperthyroid can affect acne. Did any of the med changes coincide with changes to your acne?

And have you considered your adrenal health which affects thyroid function as well as progesterone production?

Good things for thyroid function: http://www.acne.org/...ost__p__2592507 Good things for adrenal health: http://www.acne.org/...ost__p__2579438

 

Where you diagnosed with having low progesterone? High estrogen? Where are you applying the progesterone? And have you tried DIM or broccoli pills which help flush away excess estrogen? What about phytoestrogens which might help by being weaker so they have less of an affect when they bind to receptors? How is your digestion? Did you try taking the zinc with food to prevent the nausea?And I'm only going on anecdotal evidence gathered from discussions with many people here (and my personal experience) but your breakouts sound like allergic reactions to me. And those do not take 30 days to appear. They often appear within a day or two. I have a suspicion that most if not all cystic acne are inflammatory responses. And breaking out in the same spots over and over as well. I get cysts from most citrus and it appears all along my jawline, neck, temple and hairline. And it seems that different citrus cause breakouts in different places. I've been unwilling to test it on myself, but when I decided to try having a tangerine again after years of avoiding them, cysts appeared at my temples the next day. And for many years, I couldn't have key limes, I would seemingly randomly get cysts on my jawline and neck. Eventually I figured out it was from when I bought key limes to have in water, vs lemons or Persian limes which I don't have a problem with.I recall others reporting cysts between their eyebrows from members of the Genus Prunus family.

 

I am going in for the new test results next Monday, but last time I was tested I have low progesterone. My estrogen level was normal. The progesterone is administered in an oral tincture that I take twice a day. I was using bio-identical progesterone cream about a year ago, but it made my acne very bad. I will find out exactly what she is using in the tincture for the progesterone supplementation and ask about the phytoestrogens, but wouldn't that be supplementing estrogen, not progesterone? I know I need the progesterone for my depression because when she tried to lower the dose in December, I became crippled with depression. I haven't tried DIM, I am just learning about anti androgens, but honestly I don't understand how it interplays with estrogen and progesterone. Or is mostly the male hormones that it suppresses? I was low on those too, which can contribute to depression, so that may not be an option for me. I am on a ton of supplements that are listed on the blog in my signature. Maca is one of them, that is supposed to help regulate female hormones.

I really think my acne is hormone related. Since my doc has found this balance with my progesterone for my depression, my acne has gotten worse and I am getting more cysts. I am really just wondering why treatment for estrogen dominance (progesterone) is making my acne worse when some women find that it cures theirs.

 

The DIM/Broccoli and phytoestrogens would primarily help with excess estrogen. And phytoestrogens (which plants are filled with, btw, so you are consuming them) can help or hurt. They usually help if you are low estrogen by adding some estrogen. And if you are high estrogen, they help by being weaker and binding to receptors so that the much stronger human estrogens can't.

Also, hormones don't get absorbed very well via the digestive tract. And some synthetic progestins are notorious for causing acne. you need to find out what you are taking. Progestins also inhibit seratonin production which would affect mood and as melatonin is made from seratonin it would affect your sleep. Melatonin is also a very important antioxidant.

Speaking of which, do you try to keep as natural as possible circadian cycle (exposure to natural light/dark and sleep)? What about stress?

I'm glad you got off synthetic thyroid, because your thyroid can become dependent upon the synthetic stuff, whereas with iodine and the natural thyroid medications, you might eventually be able to repair your thyroid to work on its own.

Alternativista brings up a good point about synthetic vs. natural progesterone. I don't know a whole lot about it, but I know that Emerita is a brand that makes a really good natural progesterone cream (not made from yams...apparently, those don't work so great either). This website has some good information on it: http://www.nutritiongeeks.com/pro-gest-cream-emerita-paraben-free-4/pro-gest-cream-emerita.html

I want to say that I really appreciate you two taking the time to answer my questions and try to help me. I am trying to arm myself with as much knowledge as possible when I go into my next appointment on Monday.

Wanted to mention that there are different types of iodine--it's important to take the right kind. Nascent Iodine is a good one, and I believe Lugol's is as well.

 

What type of maca have you been on? I hear there is the raw maca and then the royal maca, which is slightly cooked I think.

 

It sounds like you have found a really great naturopath--that's a blessing!

 

I'm glad you got off synthetic thyroid, because your thyroid can become dependent upon the synthetic stuff, whereas with iodine and the natural thyroid medications, you might eventually be able to repair your thyroid to work on its own.

Alternativista brings up a good point about synthetic vs. natural progesterone. I don't know a whole lot about it, but I know that Emerita is a brand that makes a really good natural progesterone cream (not made from yams...apparently, those don't work so great either). This website has some good information on it: http://www.nutrition...am-emerita.html

 

Yes, the synthetic thyroid was my idea because I didn't want to be on animal products. Also, since it was compounded it could be specifically tailored to my needs. But it proved to be too strong for me, and the changing doses were becoming cost prohibitive.

That's interesting about the wild yam. I considered myself well researched in this topic. My mother-in-law attended Dr. Janet Lang's lecture about estrogen dominance (I know, my mother-in-law is great. She is a PT and general wellness expert. She's always going to these types of things). She passed along a series of CDs, that talked about thyroid, estrogen dominance, etc. Everything she said applied to me, and was very silmilar to the video of Dr. David Brownstein you linked. At the time, she seemed to think wild yam was the way to go, but did warn against what is known as the "progesterone spill" that happens when progesterone creams builds up in the fat tissue and dumps out all at once. Alternativista touched on it in this thread: http://www.acne.org/...am/page__st__60

I will have to check out her latest podcast ( http://restorativeendocrinology.com/ if anyone is interested), and ask my doc. I don't think that is what I am on now, but thanks for the resource.

____

EDIT: Some additional info about my lifestyle: I don't smoke, rarely drink caffeine (maybe twice a month, unless I get a migraine in which case I take acetaminophen with caffeine), and drink alcohol maybe once a month, if that. I don't use plastics (no water bottles, no plastic leftover storage).

At the time, she seemed to think wild yam was the way to go, but did warn against what is known as the "progesterone spill" that happens when progesterone creams builds up in the fat tissue and dumps out all at once. Alternativista touched on it in this thread: http://www.acne.org/...am/page__st__60

 

So where did you apply it?

I guess alternativista's research doesn't conflict with what my doctor says, but conflicts with itself (if I am understanding it right):

PMS issues and irregular cycle may be indicators of estrogen dominance. It's about a possible excess of estrogen relative to a possible deficiency of progesterone. And acne and other symptoms occur with the monthly fluctuation of progesterone.

So I have estrogen dominance. Not high estrogen, just not the proper balance of estrogen to progesterone, which can cause acne. But fluctuation of progesterone can also cause acne? So the cure is also the cause!?

 

No. That statement isn't saying that progesterone causes acne. Just that it fluctuates on a monthly schedule. And it's just a vague introductory statement that I guess could use some improvement. Some people break out when it's low rather than high. At ovulation rather than menstruation. It can however act like an androgen, especially certain synthetic progestins in many BCPs. Estrogen can also bind to androgen receptors. It really about having the right amount of hormones. Too much of anything causes problems. Just like both too little and too much iodine can cause hypothyroid.

Does your acne come and go with your cycle or is it constant?

At the time, she seemed to think wild yam was the way to go, but did warn against what is known as the "progesterone spill" that happens when progesterone creams builds up in the fat tissue and dumps out all at once. Alternativista touched on it in this thread: http://www.acne.org/...am/page__st__60

 

So where did you apply it?

 

To avoid the progesterone spill, I changed it up. Always applied to thin skinned areas like the inside of my arms, creases of the elbows, sometimes breasts and stomach. But that was over a year ago.

I guess alternativista's research doesn't conflict with what my doctor says, but conflicts with itself (if I am understanding it right):

PMS issues and irregular cycle may be indicators of estrogen dominance. It's about a possible excess of estrogen relative to a possible deficiency of progesterone. And acne and other symptoms occur with the monthly fluctuation of progesterone.

So I have estrogen dominance. Not high estrogen, just not the proper balance of estrogen to progesterone, which can cause acne. But fluctuation of progesterone can also cause acne? So the cure is also the cause!?

 

No. That statement isn't saying that progesterone causes acne. Just that it fluctuates on a monthly schedule. And it's just a vague introductory statement. Some people break out when it's low rather than high. At ovulation rather than menstruation. It can however act like an androgen, especially certain synthetic progestins in many BCPs. It really about having the right amount of hormones. Too much of anything causes problems. Just like both too little and too much iodine can cause hypothyroid.

Does your acne come and go with your cycle or is it constant?

 

Let's assume that I am not on a synthetic progestin (I honestly don't believe my doc would have me on anything synthetic, but like I said I will inquire) and I have been off BCP for 2.5 years. My skin was better when I wasn't on the progesterone supplementation. So I think I am the type of person to break out when progesterone is high, rather than low. I agree about having the right amount of hormones, which is what I am trying to do by taking regular hormone tests. I'm not playing a guessing game like many people on here. But the treatment to get me to the right amount of hormones seems to be making my skin worse. My acne and depression flare up right after ovulation, in the second half of my cycle. By the time my period actually comes around, I am recovering from the cysts and pimples, and rarely get new ones during my period. Sometimes I get pimples before ovulation, usually around my forehead, temples, between the brow and and the apples of my cheeks. The cysts and pimples around my chin and mouth come after ovulation.

Is the general consensus that it must be the type of progesterone that is messing me up? My worry is I am going to go in on Monday, ask what kind of progesterone I am on and get my test results, only to find out that the progesterone is natural, non-synthetic and my hormones are "balanced". Then where do I go?

___

EDIT: What if my progesterone is high when I get my results back? I can't lower it, any attempt made at that in the past has put me into a major depression crash. Then I am really stuck...

Ugh!!! I had just written you a long reply with lots of links and was just about done with it and lost it all!!! Going to see if I can recall what I came up with....

Your multi wouldn't be good for long-term, because it contains isolated Vitamin A, which many studies have shown to be dangerous. Instead, I would take a good trace mineral supplement like Cell Food, a high-quality green powder or food-based multi, a food-based Vitamin C, a food-based B Complex, Vitamin D-3, Magnesium Oil, and a mercury-free Fish Oil, like Carlson's brand.

I would also be sure to address your and your husband's digestive system, which is foundational to good health, with a variety of probiotics from good brands such as PB8, Renew Life, Enzymatic Therapy and Jarrows. Aloe Vera Juice is also very healing to the digestive track and might be a good idea to take. Plant-based enzymes can be helpful as well.

You guys might consider adaptogenic herbs, like Rhodiola Rosea (Eleuthero is one, and you're getting that in your Contegra supplement) , and Corvalen (d-ribose) is a supplement that has greatly helped many with chronic fatigue.

I don't remember exactly why, but the Iodine you're taking isn't the best kind for getting great results. Nascent Iodine is a really good one, and I would think it would be a good idea for your husband to take it as well, as he is most likely also deficient. I have found the best deal on it at Amazon. I'm an Amazon Prime member and save a ton on shipping. Iodine levels can be tested for about $50 from FFP Labs. 877-900-5556 OR 828-694-1144. If you're deficient, you may need about 50 mg a day for 6 months or more. I don't think the test is necessary though - most likely, you need the iodine. I would just look out for symptoms of too much iodine rather than spend money on the test.

The Contegra looks to have good things, but I'd want to choose the things that are in it, such as the Iodine. I don't know what types of B-Vitamins it uses. The Suntheanine it contains is also good.

Oh, and don't forget the Emerita progesterone cream. I'm wondering if the synthetic cream is what started your acne outbreak.

I forget if you said you're getting sunshine? What about doing any breathing exercises? A few minutes or this a day would be good as well as maintaining an attitude of thankfulness for all you have to be thankful for--our attitudes can greatly affect our health.

Do you and your husband get in any exercise? Some easy exercises would be walking, hula-hooping (with a 1.5 lb weighted hula hoop) and just lightly bouncing on a mini-trampoline (great for the lymph system, and in my opinion, the best exercise you can do). If you're going to do more than just bounce, a high-quality trampoline like a Bellicon, Jump-Sport or Cellerciser is recommended so you don't damage your joints.

If you have more funds down the road, you might look into a Chi Machine by Sun Anchon (don't get an imitator). There are tons of people online who swear by using it, and it can help with many different things, and it's like exercising but you don't have to do anything, haha. I think you can pick one up on eBay for about $200-300.

Okay...I think this is everything I had originally come up with. I'm sorry you and your husband are going through this. I know it's hard. It's wonderful that you have a supportive mother-in-law who understands the value of alternative medicine!!

I like zinc picolinate --- doesn't upset my stomach and zinc usually does. I take 50mg. Have you tried calcium citrate with Vit D to help with depression? My doc says Vit D is very important to help with stress and things like mood. Continued resistant acne can definately add to depression. I was taken off all antibiotics and since Oct am following doctor prescribed allergy diet like yours + suppliments and Oracea, Tretinoin Cream and Spiro since last month. Sadly I am flaring up badly despite all this good eating, etc. and it is significantly adding to my feeling of depression!

I hope you feel better soon. I too have wierd reactions to hormones. I can understand the progesteron not working. It may be that your system is especially sensitive to any added hormones or changes in hormones. This is what an endochronologist told me...she said my hormone levels were normal but I appeared to be ultra sensitive. So anything would set it off. In the past Spiro has helped me and my new derm put me back on it. It blocks androgen receptors which helps any other hormones in body to have a chance to balance out...and for the skin to not be overwhelmed by testosterone (androgens). Takes months to happen though.

Unfortunately, I had to reschedule my appt for next Tuesday, so I won't know my test results until then.

Ugh!!! I had just written you a long reply with lots of links and was just about done with it and lost it all!!! Going to see if I can recall what I came up with....

 

Your multi wouldn't be good for long-term, because it contains isolated Vitamin A, which many studies have shown to be dangerous. Instead, I would take a good trace mineral supplement like Cell Food, a high-quality green powder or food-based multi, a food-based Vitamin C, a food-based B Complex, Vitamin D-3, Magnesium Oil, and a mercury-free Fish Oil, like Carlson's brand.

 

I would also be sure to address your and your husband's digestive system, which is foundational to good health, with a variety of probiotics from good brands such as PB8, Renew Life, Enzymatic Therapy and Jarrows. Aloe Vera Juice is also very healing to the digestive track and might be a good idea to take. Plant-based enzymes can be helpful as well.

 

You guys might consider adaptogenic herbs, like Rhodiola Rosea (Eleuthero is one, and you're getting that in your Contegra supplement) , and Corvalen (d-ribose) is a supplement that has greatly helped many with chronic fatigue.

 

I don't remember exactly why, but the Iodine you're taking isn't the best kind for getting great results. Nascent Iodine is a really good one, and I would think it would be a good idea for your husband to take it as well, as he is most likely also deficient. I have found the best deal on it at Amazon. I'm an Amazon Prime member and save a ton on shipping. Iodine levels can be tested for about $50 from FFP Labs. 877-900-5556 OR 828-694-1144. If you're deficient, you may need about 50 mg a day for 6 months or more. I don't think the test is necessary though - most likely, you need the iodine. I would just look out for symptoms of too much iodine rather than spend money on the test.

 

The Contegra looks to have good things, but I'd want to choose the things that are in it, such as the Iodine. I don't know what types of B-Vitamins it uses. The Suntheanine it contains is also good.

 

Oh, and don't forget the Emerita progesterone cream. I'm wondering if the synthetic cream is what started your acne outbreak.

 

I forget if you said you're getting sunshine? What about doing any breathing exercises? A few minutes or this a day would be good as well as maintaining an attitude of thankfulness for all you have to be thankful for--our attitudes can greatly affect our health.

 

Do you and your husband get in any exercise? Some easy exercises would be walking, hula-hooping (with a 1.5 lb weighted hula hoop) and just lightly bouncing on a mini-trampoline (great for the lymph system, and in my opinion, the best exercise you can do). If you're going to do more than just bounce, a high-quality trampoline like a Bellicon, Jump-Sport or Cellerciser is recommended so you don't damage your joints.

 

If you have more funds down the road, you might look into a Chi Machine by Sun Anchon (don't get an imitator). There are tons of people online who swear by using it, and it can help with many different things, and it's like exercising but you don't have to do anything, haha. I think you can pick one up on eBay for about $200-300.

 

Okay...I think this is everything I had originally come up with. I'm sorry you and your husband are going through this. I know it's hard. It's wonderful that you have a supportive mother-in-law who understands the value of alternative medicine!!

 

4Fours,

Sorry for over-stepping earlier, and thank you for the correction about bio-identical hormones--I definitely had that wrong. I am really sorry you're struggling with depression and adding acne on top of that certainly doesn't help. A book comes to mind--I haven't read it, but I have definitely heard good things about it. In case you haven't yet heard of it, and in case it might have new suggestions for you, I thought I'd pass it along: The UltraMind Solution by Mark Hyman. You sound very smart in your approach to this--hoping you find a solution soon.

4Fours,

Sorry for over-stepping earlier, and thank you for the correction about bio-identical hormones--I definitely had that wrong. I am really sorry you're struggling with depression and adding acne on top of that certainly doesn't help. A book comes to mind--I haven't read it, but I have definitely heard good things about it. In case you haven't yet heard of it, and in case it might have new suggestions for you, I thought I'd pass it along: The UltraMind Solution by Mark Hyman. You sound very smart in your approach to this--hoping you find a solution soon.

 

No, not at all! I appreciate your advice, it's just chronic fatigue is a whole can of worms... ha ha! You are right about Corvalen, it is great for CFS sufferers. I wish he had gotten on that stuff earlier, it has helped him a lot.

This books seems really interesting, I'm going to see if they have it available at the library. Even if it doesn't "cure" my depression (or acne for that matter), I figure it couldn't hurt. I definitely could benefit from some self-awareness, mindfulness, meditation. Thanks!

You are very welcome!! CFS is a mystery indeed....very complex! And this reminds me, there's a book called, "Feeling Good," by David Burns. It's the #1 rated book for depression. Hyman's book looks to address supplements/nutrition, whereas this one teaches you how to apply cognitive therapy, in that, your feelings are a reflection of your thoughts (quite fascinating). This book gets better results for most people long-term (and even short-term) than prescription drugs. The intro is pretty amazing in explaining just how effective this book has been for people over the years. Pretty fascinating stuff.

So hope something works for you soon!!

Okay! I finally had a long follow up and got some answers. In her practice, her experience is that many people's acne gets worse when getting treatment for estrogen dominance. We made several changes to my treatment plan, which I've outlined below. But she said that if she were just treating the acne, she might go a slightly different route. The 3 things she said she does for acne is Vitamin A, Zinc and Pan Plex (a digestive enzyme). I can't be on the first 2 in their traditional form, but maybe that can help someone.

Progesterone: My suspicions were confirmed. I am not actually on progesterone, but a compounded herb tincture that supports the body's ability to make progesterone. It's called phytoprogest (ingredients: Dioscorea villosa (wild yam), Vitex agnus-castus (chaste tree berry), Smilax regelii (sarsaparilla), Taraxacum officinale (dandelion), and Trigonella foenum-graecum (fenugreek) in a base of organic alcohol and spring water.) The progesterone cream I was on was indeed wild-yam based.No synthetics!

I now have 2 tinctures I will use. One is an estrogen support for days 1-14 of my cycle. The other is a progesterone support for days 15-28. She also put elements of my Contegra medication (for my depression) into the tincture so I can ween off of those eventually.

Hormone Test Results: The hormone test results show that I am still on the low side for progesterone. My estrogen is at a good place, just the ratio between progesterone and estrogen isn't ideal. However, there have been improvements since the last time I took the hormone test in May.

My androgen levels were on the normal to low side. She did say that cruciferous veggies (specifically a freeze dried broccoli pill that I can buy, still need to get the info) can help keep the androgen's in check, like was mentioned on this thread previously.

Also, my cortisol level is better, which means my body isn't needing to be in the "progesterone steal" cycle as much.

I am going off the Maca and onto "Hormone Balance" by Vital Nutrients.

Iodine: She switched my multi to a detox multi that doesn't have as much iodine. She seems to be of the school of thought that elevated iodine levels can make acne worse. As for the nascent iodine, she doesn't recommend it because you need to be monitored weekly in order to keep the levels in check. It can also increase free radicals.

Omegas: I am on a Omega 3 and 9 only fish oil, which I was concerned about, because of all the "ratio" talk on these boards. However, she said we get enough Omega 6 in our diets, and if anything she would increase my Omega 3 intake.

Digestive Enzymes: She switched me from Similase to Pan Plex, because the Pan Plex has ox bile in it, which helps the body metabolize estrogen faster.

Zinc: They have a new zinc cream that can be applied topically that is used in cases where people are intolerant to taking it orally.

Thyroid: Adjusting my thyroid dose to 1/4 grain a day, 2x a day. This should hopefully help me tolerate the thyroid better without the side effects (brief anxiety attacks I was getting, and shortness of breath). She thinks thyroid is a huge factor in my depression, and my thyroid was slightly enlarged. This means it's having to work harder than it should.

Calcium and Magnesium: This one was my idea. I've read magnesium has helped people with their acne on here, and it's good to take those two coupled together.

All in all, I hope the Pan Plex and zinc cream help with the acne. Right now I am keeping the outbreaks mostly in control with Differin and Aczone. It's completely cleared my forehead, still working on the area between my eyebrows, chin and left cheek. I'll update after a little while about any progress I've made.

Yay!! Sounds like a good plan! You previously said you're not on synthetic thyroid medication, right? I think you said you were taking a non-synthetic. The reason I ask is that some say your thyroid can become dependant on the synthetic thyroid medications but with the natural kind and with iodine, it's possible to wean yourself off of them eventually.

Interesting about the Nascent Iodine causing free radical damage. I think if you're getting too much, your body lets you know. A lady I know had all of her health problems (mostly fatigue) cleared up (after I think 20+ years of trying different therapies) by doing lots of iodine as recommended by Dr. Brownstein, but after a while of doing mega doses, she started getting symptoms of too much iodine, so she just cut back. The book definitely warns of the symptoms of too much iodine.

Got my fingers crossed for you!