I did as you mentioned i think and began taking 1/8 teaspoon morning and night.

P.S. sorry I think the website is being buggy and won't let me quote so I replied like this.

What dose does the jarrows formula bottle recommend? Maybe it's different/ stronger than the source naturals formula, and you need to start with less. You can try taking it only at night (a few hours after a meal) and see how you feel.

Whenever I took more than I needed I felt a bit bloated and sometimes, if I took it at night, I had trouble getting up in the morning but also some trouble sleeping (could have been stress though). Now I'm just taking a low dose once a day in the morning and it's still working, so more isn't necessarily better in some cases. I had to take it twice initially just to notice a difference, but now I don't feel I need as much because I am also taking DIM.

It says serving size is 1/4 teaspoon, so i've been splitting it into morning and night.

I haven't started taking DIM yet cause I want to see what Inositol can do for now. I'm also starting my 4th month on BC and still breaking out a lot.

You are also on BC? That's probably the issue. It's hard to say if supplements are working when you are on BC.

 

I did as you mentioned i think and began taking 1/8 teaspoon morning and night.

P.S. sorry I think the website is being buggy and won't let me quote so I replied like this.

What dose does the jarrows formula bottle recommend? Maybe it's different/ stronger than the source naturals formula, and you need to start with less. You can try taking it only at night (a few hours after a meal) and see how you feel.

Whenever I took more than I needed I felt a bit bloated and sometimes, if I took it at night, I had trouble getting up in the morning but also some trouble sleeping (could have been stress though). Now I'm just taking a low dose once a day in the morning and it's still working, so more isn't necessarily better in some cases. I had to take it twice initially just to notice a difference, but now I don't feel I need as much because I am also taking DIM.

It says serving size is 1/4 teaspoon, so i've been splitting it into morning and night.

I haven't started taking DIM yet cause I want to see what Inositol can do for now. I'm also starting my 4th month on BC and still breaking out a lot.

You are also on BC? That's probably the issue. It's hard to say if supplements are working when you are on BC.

I'm pretty sure I have to continue taking it though because I've been hopping on/off pill way too much and i have to stick to it this time. things have gotten very slightly better, but at this point i'll take anything, just not things getting worse

In your case, I'm not even sure how you would be able to tell if inositol is working. In all the studies I read, women were only taking inositol and nothing else to see if that worked. Maybe it can work slightly in conjunction with the pill, but if it's the hormones in the pill that are messing you up then inositol is definitely not strong enough to fix that.

@WishClean I've been taking inositol (1095 mg) for 8 weeks now and haven't noticed any improvements with my acne. I have PCOS as well: elevated testosterone and DHEA-S. No insulin resistance, estradiol & progesterone levels are fine. Would you recommend trying another supplement? If so, which one?

In your case, I'm not even sure how you would be able to tell if inositol is working. In all the studies I read, women were only taking inositol and nothing else to see if that worked. Maybe it can work slightly in conjunction with the pill, but if it's the hormones in the pill that are messing you up then inositol is definitely not strong enough to fix that.

Initially what messed me up is going off the pill then restarting mid cycle. since then nothing has worked, and i would get bad acne both on/off the pill. in the past bc is what always cleared me up in no time. now its just a mess and im hoping BC will eventually fix it.

 

In your case, I'm not even sure how you would be able to tell if inositol is working. In all the studies I read, women were only taking inositol and nothing else to see if that worked. Maybe it can work slightly in conjunction with the pill, but if it's the hormones in the pill that are messing you up then inositol is definitely not strong enough to fix that.

Initially what messed me up is going off the pill then restarting mid cycle. since then nothing has worked, and i would get bad acne both on/off the pill. in the past bc is what always cleared me up in no time. now its just a mess and im hoping BC will eventually fix it.

Then maybe you have excess hormones and that's what's messing you up. In that case, inositol won't help, but DIM will with detoxing from excess hormones particularly estrogen. Calcium d-glucarate also works for some people, but sadly it didn't work for me ...but to be honest I didn't stick with it long enough because I switched to DIM.

 

In your case, I'm not even sure how you would be able to tell if inositol is working. In all the studies I read, women were only taking inositol and nothing else to see if that worked. Maybe it can work slightly in conjunction with the pill, but if it's the hormones in the pill that are messing you up then inositol is definitely not strong enough to fix that.

Initially what messed me up is going off the pill then restarting mid cycle. since then nothing has worked, and i would get bad acne both on/off the pill. in the past bc is what always cleared me up in no time. now its just a mess and im hoping BC will eventually fix it.

Then maybe you have excess hormones and that's what's messing you up. In that case, inositol won't help, but DIM will with detoxing from excess hormones particularly estrogen. Calcium d-glucarate also works for some people, but sadly it didn't work for me ...but to be honest I didn't stick with it long enough because I switched to DIM.

The only thing that's stopping me from taking DIM right now is the fear of breaking out more... my face is already covered in marks and tiny scars. But I'm not sure what to do at this point. BTW I noticed that the days I do break out is when I have abnormally high drive. It's to the point that I can very accurately predict my acne just based on my drive. Would that signify high testosterone?

 

@WishClean I've been taking inositol (1095 mg) for 8 weeks now and haven't noticed any improvements with my acne. I have PCOS as well: elevated testosterone and DHEA-S. No insulin resistance, estradiol & progesterone levels are fine. Would you recommend trying another supplement? If so, which one?

I know you've had success with adding DIM but it doesn't seem like I am estrogen dominant (basing this off of blood test results).

As an aside, thank you for posting on this forum regularly and for taking the time to read this. Your posts on this thread and others have been a tremendous help.

Anybody have any suggestions?

The only thing that's stopping me from taking DIM right now is the fear of breaking out more... my face is already covered in marks and tiny scars. But I'm not sure what to do at this point. BTW I noticed that the days I do break out is when I have abnormally high drive. It's to the point that I can very accurately predict my acne just based on my drive. Would that signify high testosterone?

The same thing happens to me...when my drive is high, my skin looks worse. But now it seems like my sex drive has decreased since taking DIM, which is a good thing for me. It only gets high during ovulation and during my period. It's probably due to high testosterone, but it could also be due to low progesterone because if progesterone is low, other hormones are usually unusually high.

DIM is listed as the strongest herbal anti androgen on sites like wikipedia and there are also a few studies on it, like this one:

Plant-derived 3,3-Diindolylmethane DIM) is a strong androgen antagonist in human prostate cancer cells. Journal of Biological Chemistry. 2003 June 6;278(23);21136-45. Le HT, Schaldach CM, Firestone GL, Bjeldanes LF. Department of Nutritional Sciences and Toxicology, University of California, Berkeley, California 94720-3104, USA.

 

@WishClean I've been taking inositol (1095 mg) for 8 weeks now and haven't noticed any improvements with my acne. I have PCOS as well: elevated testosterone and DHEA-S. No insulin resistance, estradiol & progesterone levels are fine. Would you recommend trying another supplement? If so, which one?

I know you've had success with adding DIM but it doesn't seem like I am estrogen dominant (basing this off of blood test results).

As an aside, thank you for posting on this forum regularly and for taking the time to read this. Your posts on this thread and others have been a tremendous help.

Anybody have any suggestions?

Sorry, I missed your earlier post. Inositol can help lower testosterone but it can take up to 3 months to kick in, and 6 months for full effects. For me, it took less than a month to kick in and I wasn't taking as much as you, but for others it takes longer. High DHEA can also cause acne, but I don't know how you would lower it directly. I assume that once you lower excess testosterone, your total androgens would lower as well, but I'm just speculating.

DIM helps lower androgens as well, but it works differently.

No worries. I'll keep at it with the inositol.

Is DIM safe to take if my estrogen & progesterone levels are normal? I can't remember where I read it on this forum but someone said it shouldn't be taken if you don't have issues with estrogen/progesterone.

I'm assuming you're either busy or you only get notified when someone quotes you so I'll post this again:

Is DIM safe to take if my estrogen & progesterone levels are normal? I can't remember where I read it on this forum but someone said it shouldn't be taken if you don't have issues with estrogen/progesterone.

 

I'm assuming you're either busy or you only get notified when someone quotes you so I'll post this again:

Is DIM safe to take if my estrogen & progesterone levels are normal? I can't remember where I read it on this forum but someone said it shouldn't be taken if you don't have issues with estrogen/progesterone.

I'm not sure actually. You should look up "estrogen dominance symptoms" and see if you have most of them. If so, DIM could help. That's how I diagnosed myself because there are no blood tests for estrogen dominance. They would have to thoroughly check E1 and E2 estradiol levels at several points throughout the month, then compare the ratio and fluctuations in order to even come close to an accurate measurement. So basically you have to see for yourself if it's worth the shot. If you take a low dose then it shouldn't mess up with your hormones anyway, but you will still get its antioxidant benefits.

I

Hi Wishclean,

What is the light treatment helping you with? I am planning on getting ultrasonic and galvanic treatments for my face regularly. Do you know if it would help with collagen production(even if it is only to a tiny extent)?

Although I don't breakout as much now, my skin is oily and sensitive to just about anything and everything. I have got hormonal acne under control to a large extent, but I am very sensitive to dust and almost all skin care products(exception being estee Lauder). I was wondering if I should add ultrasonic/galvanic treatments/IR light therapy to my regimen.

I am struggling with the decision, but leaning more towards it since my skin is very crepey.

Also, do you use any particular moisturizer(is your skin oily?)?

 

I

Hi Wishclean,

What is the light treatment helping you with? I am planning on getting ultrasonic and galvanic treatments for my face regularly. Do you know if it would help with collagen production(even if it is only to a tiny extent)?

Although I don't breakout as much now, my skin is oily and sensitive to just about anything and everything. I have got hormonal acne under control to a large extent, but I am very sensitive to dust and almost all skin care products(exception being estee Lauder). I was wondering if I should add ultrasonic/galvanic treatments/IR light therapy to my regimen.

I am struggling with the decision, but leaning more towards it since my skin is very crepey.

Also, do you use any particular moisturizer(is your skin oily?)?

Light treatment helps with hyperpigmentation, inflammation, and collagen production. Galvanic and high frequency are great for acne, I bought a home device that I use, but not as powerful as galvanic facials.

I use image ormedics cleanser and night cream. My skin loves them, they balanced out my ph.

Very interesting information, thank you for sharing!

I was on birth control pills from the age of 20 to 38, went on the patch from 38 to 40, when I got off entirely after my husband had a vasectomy. I had a round of Accutane at age 25, and enjoyed complete acne-free skin until I stopped all birth control. That's when my skin started breaking out again and now, 10 years later, I have the worst skin of my life.

Had my hormones tested two years ago and the doctor saw nothing out of the ordinary. I was deemed pre-menopausal, but that's it. I still have regular periods. I tried Spiro for two months and could not deal with the side effectsand I'm still fighting the after effects of the IB. I'm about to start another round of Accutane, since I had a 15 year remission last go round, and tolerated the drug extremely well.

Only now, reading these forums, I'm wondering how much of that remission had to do with my birth control as well . . . what role my hormones may be playing now, and what, other than Spiro, might be an effective treatment for me. Just the thought, though, of more doctor visits, tests, and research, man I've been doing that for years and I'm TIRED.

If the Accutane doesn't help, I will definitely explore similar routes to yours, get my hormones tested again, and it's good to know there may be an effective alternative to Spiro, which I doubt I'll ever be able to tolerate.

Best of luck to you. Your regimen sounds very promising!

Very interesting information, thank you for sharing!

I was on birth control pills from the age of 20 to 38, went on the patch from 38 to 40, when I got off entirely after my husband had a vasectomy. I had a round of Accutane at age 25, and enjoyed complete acne-free skin until I stopped all birth control. That's when my skin started breaking out again and now, 10 years later, I have the worst skin of my life.

Had my hormones tested two years ago and the doctor saw nothing out of the ordinary. I was deemed pre-menopausal, but that's it. I still have regular periods. I tried Spiro for two months and could not deal with the side effectsand I'm still fighting the after effects of the IB. I'm about to start another round of Accutane, since I had a 15 year remission last go round, and tolerated the drug extremely well.

Only now, reading these forums, I'm wondering how much of that remission had to do with my birth control as well . . . what role my hormones may be playing now, and what, other than Spiro, might be an effective treatment for me. Just the thought, though, of more doctor visits, tests, and research, man I've been doing that for years and I'm TIRED.

If the Accutane doesn't help, I will definitely explore similar routes to yours, get my hormones tested again, and it's good to know there may be an effective alternative to Spiro, which I doubt I'll ever be able to tolerate.

Best of luck to you. Your regimen sounds very promising!

Good luck to you as well. I think accutane should always be a last resort, especially as you get older. Maybe try finding a good doctor/ dermatologist who will accurately diagnose what type of acne you have first of all, then order the right tests. I can't tell you how many useless tests I took over the years. Nobody bothered checking for things like prolactin, cortisol, progesterone, all thyroid panels, the "bad" estrogens, etc...

Hey Wishclean thanks so much for all of your extensive research. I am so frustrated right now because atm I am uninsured and don't really have money to get my hormones tested. At the moment the only symptoms I have coincide with androgen excess aka acne, hirsutism, sweating. But as Ive mentioned in other posts Ive been off bc for 4 mnths now and got a period once. That's I guess normal for me since before bc I had irregular periods. My question is pcos always related to excessive estrogen? Can I have pcos and low estrogen? Its all so confusing. Also Im considering the inositol for the androgen and calming effects. I was diagnosed with borderline pcos a while ago but no insulin resistance. Interesting that you mentioned you didn't have insulin resistance but this helped you too! Im wondering if blood tests didn't pick this up. Anyway thank again!

Hey Wishclean thanks so much for all of your extensive research. I am so frustrated right now because atm I am uninsured and don't really have money to get my hormones tested. At the moment the only symptoms I have coincide with androgen excess aka acne, hirsutism, sweating. But as Ive mentioned in other posts Ive been off bc for 4 mnths now and got a period once. That's I guess normal for me since before bc I had irregular periods. My question is pcos always related to excessive estrogen? Can I have pcos and low estrogen? Its all so confusing. Also Im considering the inositol for the androgen and calming effects. I was diagnosed with borderline pcos a while ago but no insulin resistance. Interesting that you mentioned you didn't have insulin resistance but this helped you too! Im wondering if blood tests didn't pick this up. Anyway thank again!

If you have symptoms like mid-section weight gain, hyperpigmentation, bad PMS, and mood swings then you could have high estrogen. But there are good and bad estrogens (E1 & E2 mainly), so if you have too many bad estrogens, they can convert to more androgens and make your issues worse.

I personally am against women with PCOS using birth control pills because of the added estrogen they are putting to their bodies. Women with PCOS are even more vulnerable to estrogen-related cancers, so they shouldn't be putting synthetic estrogen into their body.

Yes, you can have low estrogen and still have PCOS, but usually women with PCOS have high androgens, high estrogens, and low progesterone. Prolactin is also either too low or too high (can't remember which one now), and cortisol is usually high too. On this forum only the main hormones are discussed, but actually when I was seeing a homeopath, he treated my acne and PCOS by targeting prolactin and reducing stress (= lowering cortisol), and indirectly raising progesterone.

Even though I was never diagnosed with insulin resistance, when I used to eat a lot of processed foods and sugar, my blood sugar used to drop very suddenly and I felt like I was going to pass out. So now I stick to a very simple diet with no refined sugars at all, and I never get dizzy spells anymore.

Thank you so much for your response! Actually before being on birth control I think had some of symptoms of estrogen dominance but no acne. I had (have irregular) heavy painful period and pretty bad pms. To the point that I knew when my period was coming because of the sore breasts, overly emotional (cried every time lol) and I still have cold extremities. Another odd thing is that I would always be sick, had migraines with aura and dizzy spells often. Also I had (have) the classic 3:1 ratio with lh>fsh. Even then I had elevated dhea also. This is all so confusing I am unsure logically I would think if Im not menstruating regularly my estrogen would be high but again I am unsure where my hormones are at now.

The only symptoms I have now are acne, increased hirsutism, increased sweating, crazy emotional and still cold extremities. Also when I did get a period (2.5 mnths after stopping bc) I had my usual symptoms mentioned above. Im strongly considering getting some myo inositol to help regulate period and lower free t. I am assuming if I'm not menstruating regularly I have low progesterone? Ive been looking up symptoms of both low/high estrogen, low/high progesterone and high testosterone. And the only category I am 100% I fall into is the high t. Im so confused. I guess I should just see an naturopath but atm I don't have the means. Thank you for all of your help.

Irregular cycles don't necessarily mean you have high estrogen. You could have very low progesterone, which makes it harder to ovulate... it could be a number of factors. Stress can also have an impact (cortisol especially).

My periods have been very regular since I did my first course of vitex/ agnus castus about 6 years ago. Even when I stopped taking the herb, my periods remained normal. I think it just helped my own hormones function on their own without synthetic birth control.

Inositol can help regulate ovulation, which can then help with regular periods. It helped me have a normal blood flow during my period, but I can't speak for the regular part since my periods were regular before taking it.

DIM has helped me a lot too...I took it because I could no longer take vitex due to stomach problems. But I think you should start with the mildest option, which would be inositol, because you don't want to use anything too strong if you are not sure which hormones are messed up. Also, some vitamins and minerals can help too without messing up your hormones, they can just help your body regulate your hormones naturally.

A good diet also helps, even if you don't have insulin resistance. Everyone with PCOS symptoms should follow a low GI or paleo diet, it's really the best because it doesn't cause hormones to fluctuate too much.

Im thinking that I have low progesterone and high androgens. The reason I say this is because I took Dong quai about a month ago for a week and it induced a period. I just recently started taking it again (about 3 or 4 days ago) and already inducing bleed. Sorry if that's TMI I'm just trying to figure it all out. I researched Dong quai simply for its adaptogenic effects; it'll balance excess/deficiency of estrogen. Apparently it also balances estrogen and progesterone levels from what I have read. I think I read in one of your older posts you said dong quai broke you out? I also started up saw palmetto again to hopefully lower androgenic levels. I know DIM helps metabolize excessive bad estrogens and promote healthy estrogen production but I am a little afraid of trying it out.

I agree though with your hypothesis of all women displaying PCOS symptoms sticking to a low GI diet. My mom never was diagnosed with PCOS but had severe acne and mild hirsutism since a teen. Just almost a year ago she changed her diet and now consumes a low gi diet and rarely breaks out. This is why Im thinking inositol helps even if you aren't diagnosed with ir. Maybe all women with pcos (even thin ones) have some level of insulin resistance. Im going to order some myo inositol and throw this in the mix and she what happens since it doesn't directly alter your hormones. What do you think of all this?

Again I want to thank you so much for all of you research and taking your time out to respond. I really appreciate all of your help!

I never took don quai but my acupuncturist recommended it. I'm a bit wary of Chinese herbs, but it's helped some women with hormonal issues so keep me updated if it works for you.

I was afraid to try DIM too, but based on my experience, noone knows exactly how DIM works and it seems to work differently depending on individual issues, dosage, and brand/ mixture. So I just take pure DIM, not mixed with anything else...I take it separately from inositol just in case they interact, although I don't think they do bc inositol is a b vitamin and shouldn't interact with anything else.

Yes, you can start with a low dose of inositol before meals and see if it helps you. I found it more effective when taken in the morning on an empty stomach, but if it makes you drowsy then take it at night. Drowsiness should only happen, though, if you are taking too much.

Hey WishClean,

It sounds like your skin is doing great and you're being so generous to share your experience with everyone else. From what I've read in this post, DIM and inositol work sort of like metformin and spiro, respectively. The first lowers androgens and the second controls insulin, which reduces inflammation, is that correct? I wonder if one could take DIM and spiro together and then wean off of spiro slowly over time? Did you have an initial breakout on DIM? If not, why are there so many horror stories about people breaking out on DIM, what is the process or interaction at play there?

Thank you!

I would ;ove to know that too! I had the initial breakout on DIM... horrible. Just like back in my pcos time.. I was on birth control pills when I took it. Don't know if that could have had any bad effects

Did you have an initial breakout on DIM? If not, why are there so many horror stories about people breaking out on DIM, what is the process or interaction at play there?

Thank you!

Ok, here's what I think about DIM initial breakouts. There are 2 possible reasons (apart from an allergy to some of the ingredients):

1. Herbs and hormonal drugs do not mix. If you read greengable's post on her DIM breakout a while ago, she was also on spironolactone and broke out from DIM. Herbalists usually say never to mix medication and herbs. Now, if you still want to take your chances, I would say at least take them as far apart as possible. Take one early in the morning and the other at night, that would be your best bet.

2. People who already have liver problems break out from DIM (usually if they rush into the regular dose or higher) because their liver can't handle DIM's detoxing effects. Apparently mine was ok with it, but I started with a very low dose because I was dreading an initial breakout. I never did have one, my skin just kept improving and now I even lowered my inositol and DIM because I don't want to take more than I need, plus they last longer.