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I might add that there is a new fraxel laser coming out that is supposed to be painless and not use the blue dye. some had it in baltimore and elsewhere. goblin said it's called the 1440 (probably the wavelength of the laser). but there is no info on it anywhere. there is also a pixel laser that just came out which is a fraxel knock-off.
Hey everyone I have been considering Fraxel for some time now and I was wondering if you think it would help my situation? I have a relatively flat scar (with some ridges, bumps, etc) on my right cheek. It's lighter than the surrounding area as well. I want to blend it into the skin and get the pigment back into it. Will Fraxel accomplish this? Here are some pics.
Hi there, I'm new here. After reading the fraxel thread, I decided to share my own experience with fraxel. I've learned about fraxel after watching the local news featuring fraxel as "the new way of getting rid of acne scars." I researched first before coming to a conclusion that this might work for me. I have tried dermabrassion in the past with not much success. I still have ice pick scars and rolling scars. I went on the fraxel site and they had a list of doctors in my area. I had two consultations by two different doctors. I felt confident with the doctor I choosed. Dr. Fitzpatrick is the guru of all fraxels but you do pay the price for his expertize. For the package of 4 treatments (CHEEKS ONLY) cost me $3800 :shock:By all means, I'm not rich but I am worth it!!!! I am a 38 year old female with type IV skin. With the first fraxel, I saw immediate improvement in the texture of my skin. My face was so smoooth like a baby's buttom. My down time was 5 days. I was in no shape or form to go out in public during these days of feeling like the elephant man. After the redness and swelling subsided I was horrified. My scars looked worse and my pores looked larger. I had hyperpigmentation. My cheeks was so dark that make-up alone could not hide it. My co-workers and clients began to take notice ( I'm a hairstylist, so appearance does matter). All I wanted to do was hide. I began to panic. I called the doctor's office and spoke to the nurse. She said to me to have patience and it is totally normal because the skin needs to heal first. She perscribed me Epiquin (bleaching agent) for the hyperpigmentation. You know what, she was right. My face did get better. However, it was short lived because after the 4 week period elapsed it was time for my second fraxel. Back to square one.
I've been going back and forth on trying out this Fraxel thing...cost is the main reason, although I can set aside some cash if I wanted to..just for three treatments.
Anyway- It seems like with Fraxel, you DO have some downtime...meaning you can't just go have your face Fraxeled on Friday and make your way in to work on Monday without people noticing too much?
I know with smoothbeam you can.
I moved to a new work...been a year, so I don't know the people that well yet..this is different than my old job (I was there for five years) I actually had a few TCA treatments and could care less walking to work with spots all over my face (some did ask, and I just casually said "Oh...acne scar treatments" no biggie).
But this time is different...If I can do the Fraxel on Friday morning (meaning take a day off from work) and go back in Monday with relatively normal skin, I'm ok...if not, I'm not so sure.
billyboy,
Because of my skin color being darker Dr. Fitzpatrick said that it's best to go conservative because it might cause permanent damage to my skin coloring. However, he did say it is still considered agressive treatment. Dr Fitzpatrick has a high reputation and always in demand. So I trust him on how far he can go with the levels. I was curious though, so I asked the nurse the levels. I had my first fraxel at 15 mj's at 125 density, 4 passes total. My second fraxel was just 5 days ago. I asked him to go more agressive this time and he did. He said he will follow my progress with each treatment and proceed accordingly. I just have to remember that he is the doctor and he knows what he is doing. I hope you are healing fine.
I just had my sixth fraxel on Friday. I can honestly say that although the intensity has been increased each treatment, the downtime has gotten better each time as well. Session 1-3 were the worst; I broke out, got weird rashes and was miserable. The last few have been much better with almost no breakouts, just pinkness and flaking. I have one more full face in a few weeks and then will probably have spot treatments done on my cheeks. (as many as they'll do). I guess I'll be the guinea pig to see if more sessions truly is better.
Hi,
What levels were you treated at and what would you say is your current level of improvement?
Blaster
I just had my sixth fraxel on Friday. I can honestly say that although the intensity has been increased each treatment, the downtime has gotten better each time as well. Session 1-3 were the worst; I broke out, got weird rashes and was miserable. The last few have been much better with almost no breakouts, just pinkness and flaking. I have one more full face in a few weeks and then will probably have spot treatments done on my cheeks. (as many as they'll do). I guess I'll be the guinea pig to see if more sessions truly is better.
Hi,
What levels were you treated at and what would you say is your current level of improvement?
Blaster
I'm not sure what the first 3 sessions were at. The 4th was at 15 mj, the 5th was one pass at 15, one pass at 16 and the 6th was at 16. They only do two passes on each part of my face (vertically then horizontally), but overlap quite a bit.....and move the laser fairly slowly. Although I am happy with the clinic I am going to in terms of price and location, it has been frustrating to try and get them to use even higher settings. They will not treat over 20 mj because they say it will cause blistering and the potential for more scarring. But my sensitive skin has done very well, not blistering at all and like I mentioned, reduced down time with every treatment. I have mentioned this forum and the fact that others have been treated at much higher settings but they aren't budging. I might investigate another PS in my area to see what levels she uses for scarring.
That being said, I am pretty happy with the results so far. My first 4 treatments were spaced one week apart. In my opinion, that is not enough time. The last two were spaced two weeks apart and that worked out much better in terms of my skin being healed and ready for another session. (This obviously may not be the case with higher settings than mine).
I would say that some areas of my face definitely show a 40% improvement. Other areas do not. My cheeks seem to have responded the best, along with a few small scars on my forehead. I have two deeper scars that have improved a tiny bit, but not much. However, those didn't bother me as much as the widespread shallow scarring on my cheeks. My skin tone has improved dramatically. I am very pale and ALWAYS had red areas and flaky patches that would get irritated to the point of almost bleeding. Almost all of that is gone now. My skin is much more even in color and feels very soft.
I am very happy I decided to try Fraxel. HOWEVER, every person is different. I want to point out that I am 29, my scars were very new (less than two years old), and I take daily supplements of Borage oil, Primrose oil, MSM, DHEA, Zinc with copper, Vitamin C, B5 powder, and EPA's. I also use Emu oil and copper peptide serums between treatments. I don't know if any of this enhanced my results or not, but thought I should mention it...;)
Oh, I also had a Thermage treatment 2 weeks prior to the Fraxels. Not sure if that helped or not, but for the cost alone, I wouldn't recommend it.
Borage oil, Primrose oil, MSM, DHEA, Zinc with copper, Vitamin C, B5 powder, and EPA's ... are all these supplements helpful in healing and promoting collagen??
also is fraxel good for light skin or dark skin?
They are supposed to help. Here is the link on to the information on these forums:
http://www.acne.org/messageboard/index.php?showtopic=67916
I also read about some of these supplements on the skinbiology.com forums. I want to maximize results any way I can. But who knows what does what at this point? All I can say is that my skin is looking a lot better and I'll keep taking the supplements in case they really are helping.
Fraxel is supposed to be safe for most skin types. However I believe there is a higher risk of hyperpigmentation in darker skin.
Do you honestly need down time after fraxel ?? I asked my doctor and he said you really don't need it. I don't know, just kinda concerned now. I am having my first fraxel this coming Friday and I seriously do not know what to expect.
The "no down time" that doctors and the fraxel/reliant site are advertising is for procedures at "low" energy levels.
A lot of the Fraxel literature and doctor's training is based on wrinkles and sun damage. The energy settings for these are "low" when compared to what is used for moderate to severe acne scarring.
For 10-12 MJ it takes at least a weekend. Anything above 10-12 MJ takes 3 days where you can't leave the house. For 15-20 MJ probably a 1-2 weeks. This WILL vary depending on the density, number of passes, overlapping, skin type, etc.
The idea that you can have fraxel during lunch and go back to work with some make-up on does not apply to us acne scar patients.
I agree with Widgie that the improvement in texture, color and tone has been great, while scar improvement has been modest. She (he?) has had more treatments at lower settings and at shorter intervals.
I believe (but don't know for sure) that male skin should be treated at hgiher mjs because it is thicker, that high settings are needed to correct scarring, that these sessions should be spaced at least 1 month apart, and that many sessions are required.
I will take a pause after # 4 heals to reassess whether I want to go for another package. I observe a nice improvement to very shallow scars, but have been a little disappointed with scarring efficacy otherwise. For example, I have several small, scarred pores, that would probably disappear with a light sanding , if I was willing to risk dermabrasion. While they are a little smaller, I just don't perceive the type of improvement I was expecting (but, I guess I have 1 more treatment and more healing time). I also beleive that if you partially fill a deeper scar, you won't perceive much improvement because from an angle you can still perceive uneveness, even if it is less. So, it is really hard to perceive improvement in deeper scars, absent a major correction.
I don't think the downtime is a bad as JJ implied. My first, at 15mjs, was no problem, as I took 2 daughters to/from volleyball practice that evening (I wore a hat). I was not overly embarrassed to get a massage from my really attractive masseuse 2 days after #2 at 20mjs. While I would not recommend flirting with pretty women at day 2, you can go on with your life. When I went to 25mjs in #3, I looked really really bad for 6 days. At this level, it would be best to take a break from the opposite sex.
hey bill! sorry you're disappointed with the scarring results - just remember that you should continue to see improvement in the coming months. weighing in the other benefits you've gotten in terms of tone, texture, tightening, etc. I would say you got your money's worth - at least it wasn't a total bust & you have quite a bit to show for it!!!
btw, your wife must be VERY secure in your relationship! 
Hey Butterflies- You are right on all counts. I am actually happy with overall results to date for the reasons you mention. If I had it to over again, I would have pushed harder for higher settings in #1. While subjective, I would say there is a 15% to maybe 20% improvement on scars, but all of that resulted from the last 2 treatments.
My wife and I have been together over 30 years and she knows I think women are gorgeous. I can't help it - I was born this way.
Blaster
I look forward to your posts because I think they are valuable. There are a few others like Annie and Coolbreeze (and others who are not top of mind, so please don't be offended) where I feel the same way.
I am 55 and agree that collagen is harder to stimulate as you get older, especially because I have always been a beach guy so I have sun damage. Conversely, I think it is a great way to rejuvenate and tighten skin. My scars started bothering me a few years ago as the the loss of elasticity and collagen made them look worse. So, even if it is harder to stimulate, there is more room for improvement as you age, making Fraxel a good tool for us old guys.
I tend to agree with your comments about settings and assessmnet time frames, but am not 100% sure. Are these comments based on your experience to date, comments form your Docs, or clinical literature? I 've had 3 and see much improvement in texture and some tightening, but only modest improvement in scars, so I am tring to decide whether to go for much higher settings on #4 (my final) and whether to go for more. One idea I have been toying with, if I can get a good package price, is to come in 2 times a year the next couple years and to try needling on my 5 or so deeper scars in between.
Good luck
I have 2 treatments left and am going all out. My Doctor let me know numbing shots were available if I needed them. I think I will do that in exchange for settings over 25... Most of us started off conservatively, as we should, but I think its time to go all out. Well thats what I'm going to do as long as I don't feel anything I don't care. 😀
Question for those that are undergoing fraxel treatments at high settings over 20.
1. Have you experienced bulk heating especially in small areas such as the nose or chin? I suspect this could happen if the surgeon or operator of the laser is not very experienced in other areas of the face or neck or whatever. Can you ask your doctor about this and how they mitigate it? - I guess the use of the small tip would be one but I assume some doctors probably don't have it or have not budgetd for it.
2. This question pertains to hair follicles. Does this laser in any way harm the hair follicles?
Thanks
If by bulk heating you mean "Is your face on fire afterwards?" then for me the answer is YES. Right after we're done, I'm loaded up with ICE COLD COMPRESSES. I know they are COLD only because I'm told they are cold. My face is so HOT, that I can't tell the difference between HOT and COLD. How weird is that? No harm done either.
As for hair follicles, nothing UNFORTUNATELY have happened to mine. There are a few areas I'd like to lose a few hair follicles, I'd save a ton on waxing and depilatoryizining. 😉
Do you honestly need down time after fraxel ?? I asked my doctor and he said you really don't need it. I don't know, just kinda concerned now. I am having my first fraxel this coming Friday and I seriously do not know what to expect.
The "no down time" that doctors and the fraxel/reliant site are advertising is for procedures at "low" energy levels.
A lot of the Fraxel literature and doctor's training is based on wrinkles and sun damage. The energy settings for these are "low" when compared to what is used for moderate to severe acne scarring.
For 10-12 MJ it takes at least a weekend. Anything above 10-12 MJ takes 3 days where you can't leave the house. For 15-20 MJ probably a 1-2 weeks. This WILL vary depending on the density, number of passes, overlapping, skin type, etc.
The idea that you can have fraxel during lunch and go back to work with some make-up on does not apply to us acne scar patients.
Agreed. I'm at 14 - 20 MJ. I'm down for about 5 days but I swell to the extreme and look like an elephant girl. Chances are it might be less than that for others. It all depends on your reactions and the strength. Sort of low levels for the first time are smart. But if you are loloking for acne scar improvement, you need to keep going higher.
Agreed. I'm at 14 - 20 MJ. I'm down for about 5 days but I swell to the extreme and look like an elephant girl. Chances are it might be less than that for others. It all depends on your reactions and the strength. Sort of low levels for the first time are smart. But if you are loloking for acne scar improvement, you need to keep going higher.
I think it's hard to explain the downtime because it seems so different for all of us. I don't swell at all...in fact, I only got really pink in the last few treatments. But I broke out and got skin rashes the first few sessions so I know it was doing something to my skin. But for anyone contemplating getting Fraxel for scarring, you definitely will not look pretty for the first few days afterwards. It doesn't bother me that much because I can wear makeup to cover the worst of it. (Yes, billyboy, I'm female...;))
If anyone is sensitive to going out in public looking a little flaky and red, best to plan at least 2-3 days of hibernation.
I know I have some pictures pre-treatment somewhere on my old computer. If I have time to hook it up, I might try to show before and afters of specific scars to show what I mean by deeper ones that haven't improved and areas where I feel like the texture HAS improved.