14 hours ago, laserorange said:

Do you know any doctor who does anterior chemabrasion?

I did inquire about it. Dr rullan used to do with sandpaper but stopped doing it saying that it produced inconsistent scarring. Anterior chemobrasion is nothing but acid like tcaplus abrasion using sandpaper. Not sure if dr rullan used phenol or tca for acid base combined with sandpaper. Maybe if you assume the risk dr rullan can do it.

16 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

I did inquire about it. Dr rullan used to do with sandpaper but stopped doing it saying that it produced inconsistent scarring. Anterior chemobrasion is nothing but acid like tcaplus abrasion using sandpaper. Not sure if dr rullan used phenol or tca for acid base combined with sandpaper. Maybe if you assume the risk dr rullan can do it.

I just called for a follow-up appointment and the receptionist literally said she doesn't know anything about anterior chemabrasion so I'm guess it's not on the menu of treatments. Looks like I'll have to go to Europe to go and have a stab at it?

6 hours ago, wombatstaywoke said:

I just called for a follow-up appointment and the receptionist literally said she doesn't know anything about anterior chemabrasion so I'm guess it's not on the menu of treatments. Looks like I'll have to go to Europe to go and have a stab at it?

The receptionist is new. I did talked with dr rullan directly . Even in the paper where he mentioned phenolchemobrasion you can see he mentioned sandpaper as well

9 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

The receptionist is new. I did talked with dr rullan directly . Even in the paper where he mentioned phenolchemobrasion you can see he mentioned sandpaper as well

The "chemabrasion" part of the phenol chemabrasion procedureis abraded or scraped with a tongue depressor and not sandpaper. Confirmed this with him first day ofpost-op.

On 3/26/2022 at 9:21 AM, wombatstaywoke said:

The "chemabrasion" part of the phenol chemabrasion procedureis abraded or scraped with a tongue depressor and not sandpaper. Confirmed this with him first day ofpost-op.

Yes i never said he is using that technique now. I said he mentioned about it in the paper. See page 5 below the picture

https://www.drrullan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/3431158a99250d951e124f497a9197c2.pdf

6 minutes ago, getsmart121 said:

Yes i never said he is using that technique now. I said he mentioned about it in the paper. See page 5 below the picture

https://www.drrullan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/3431158a99250d951e124f497a9197c2.pdf

Ah, my mistake. In a way I wish he used it cause it could be more efficacious to the scarring and texture.

8 minutes ago, wombatstaywoke said:

Ah, my mistake. In a way I wish he used it cause it could be more efficacious to the scarring and texture.

The thing with scraping is that the epidermis is coming off and nothing else. When you use dermabrasion or sandpaper you are actually shaving the healthy tissue to a degree making it come closer to unhealthy skin and hoping it heals uniformly but that is where risk comes in so the trick is to not to shave the healthy skin that deep. Because most people can regenerate collagen so scar revision comes first. So you dont have to go that deep and avoid unnecessary complications

March 2022 : ~90 Day Phenol Peel Update:

*I'll be sure to edit and post this on my original post so people don't have to go to other pages to see/read updates collectively. 

** I just woke up the day I took the photos of me wearing a black shirt. Excuse the messy hair!

Scar wise, so far so good. Complexion/hyperpigmentation wise, so far so good (I think).

I've noticed that during my mornings and afternoons when my skin isn't super oily from a stressful day, my scars look rather faint and the texture is still rather very smooth. It should be no surprise that the scars are still there but I'd say they've improved a fairly good amount in terms of collagen production, texture, and appearance at least in my opinion. For reference, places that I frequent often like my bathroom mirror (lol fml), the gym mirrors (bathroom and weight room), and outdoor shops, I barely take notice or at least as much notice to my scars. There's a scar spot in particular on my left cheek that's rather devoid of collagen. I'm sure you'll see it below. But that area won't be plump until I get some filler.

My skin is a little dry and patchy at times but I'm applying a HA moisturizer three times daily. It's crazy to think that the signs of phenol peel would last this long after three months! I'm hopeful that I'll continue to see improvement in particular my skin tone being more uniform with my untanned skin. You'll notice that there has been some PIH left behind around the eyes. Yes, I have been told by people if I'm trying to stay up for an entire week or if I got initiated by the raccoon tribe outside my backyard. It looks bad at times but I always say I'm just tired )-_-(*. 

I'll post another update in late April to mid-May on this when I'll be at around the 4 month mark. Again, I'm not skin type I-III so I have a lot more healing to do. The results of doing this on a person with a little more (a lot more) melanin can cause some issues and I think healing from it properly with the right amount of time and care are needed. Scar wise, I think after 5 to 6 months I'll revisit and see if I want to do anything else. Maybe another at home microneedling session for filling in and then filler. Complexion wise, I'll have to wait and see what over the counter skin lightening methods i.e. kojic acid, vitamin c, arbutin, and lord forbid hydroquinone, can do to help even out the complexion. I'm hoping Father Time is kind to me and heals quick cause I'd really like some self-confidence back. I know f93d  said it took around 7 months for the demarcation lines alone to disappear so I'm hoping any hyper/hypopigmentation left evens out by then.

I think my skin has come a long way from my first treatment from 2014 and now this treatment in 2021/2022. It still bothers me but it doesn't bother me as much. I don't bat an eye! Except of course I look at my temples... sigh. Dr. Emer for Belafill, anyone? Nah, better find someone better, more economically priced, and doesn't come off as money hungry on social media.Do I think it's worth what I paid? I think it could've been a little more cheaper but this is an intense procedure that requires more than one medically trained person in the room so there's that. 

On 4/1/2022 at 11:48 AM, wombatstaywoke said:

March 2022 : ~90 Day Phenol Peel Update:

*I'll be sure to edit and post this on my original post so people don't have to go to other pages to see/read updates collectively. 

** I just woke up the day I took the photos of me wearing a black shirt. Excuse the messy hair!

Scar wise, so far so good. Complexion/hyperpigmentation wise, so far so good (I think).

I've noticed that during my mornings and afternoons when my skin isn't super oily from a stressful day, my scars look rather faint and the texture is still rather very smooth. It should be no surprise that the scars are still there but I'd say they've improved a fairly good amount in terms of collagen production, texture, and appearance at least in my opinion. For reference, places that I frequent often like my bathroom mirror (lol fml), the gym mirrors (bathroom and weight room), and outdoor shops, I barely take notice or at least as much notice to my scars. There's a scar spot in particular on my left cheek that's rather devoid of collagen. I'm sure you'll see it below. But that area won't be plump until I get some filler.

 

My skin is a little dry and patchy at times but I'm applying a HA moisturizer three times daily. It's crazy to think that the signs of phenol peel would last this long after three months! I'm hopeful that I'll continue to see improvement in particular my skin tone being more uniform with my untanned skin. You'll notice that there has been some PIH left behind around the eyes. Yes, I have been told by people if I'm trying to stay up for an entire week or if I got initiated by the raccoon tribe outside my backyard. It looks bad at times but I always say I'm just tired )-_-(*. 

 

I'll post another update in late April to mid-May on this when I'll be at around the 4 month mark. Again, I'm not skin type I-III so I have a lot more healing to do. The results of doing this on a person with a little more (a lot more) melanin can cause some issues and I think healing from it properly with the right amount of time and care are needed. Scar wise, I think after 5 to 6 months I'll revisit and see if I want to do anything else. Maybe another at home microneedling session for filling in and then filler. Complexion wise, I'll have to wait and see what over the counter skin lightening methods i.e. kojic acid, vitamin c, arbutin, and lord forbid hydroquinone, can do to help even out the complexion. I'm hoping Father Time is kind to me and heals quick cause I'd really like some self-confidence back. I know f93d  said it took around 7 months for the demarcation lines alone to disappear so I'm hoping any hyper/hypopigmentation left evens out by then.

 

I think my skin has come a long way from my first treatment from 2014 and now this treatment in 2021/2022. It still bothers me but it doesn't bother me as much. I don't bat an eye! Except of course I look at my temples... sigh. Dr. Emer for Belafill, anyone? Nah, better find someone better, more economically priced, and doesn't come off as money hungry on social media.Do I think it's worth what I paid? I think it could've been a little more cheaper but this is an intense procedure that requires more than one medically trained person in the room so there's that. 

The improvement (below the temples) is insane in my opinion. Day and night!! I™m so happy for you. Your texture is significantly improved. Is there anything else you™re doing to make sure your skin is as hydrated as possible?  Are you taking any actives (vitamin C, retinol) right now? 

yeah I™m sure some filler in the temples will do the trick 

by the way how did you convince Rullan to do the phenol on your skin type? I™m skin type 4 but lighter than you but he has been hesitant to do the phenol on me 

PS thank you for all the updates. Your thread has been enormously helpful for me And I™m sure for countless others 

2 hours ago, Catharsis2018 said:

The improvement (below the temples) is insane in my opinion. Day and night!! Im so happy for you. Your texture is significantly improved. Is there anything else youre doing to make sure your skin is as hydratedas possible? Are you taking any actives (vitamin C, retinol)right now?

yeah Im sure some filler in the temples will do the trick

 

by the way how did you convince Rullan to do the phenol on your skin type? Im skin type 4 but lighter than you but he has been hesitant to do the phenol on me

 

PS thank you for all the updates. Your thread has been enormously helpful for me And Im sure for countless others

Howdy! Every part of my skin has improved but like all acne scar sufferers we want perfect improvement, which I know we can't truly have.

As for my routine, I'm using a kojic acid soap twice a week at night for hyperpigmentation + anHA moisturizer (Hada Lobo; just pick anyone. They're all good in my opinion). During the day I'm using a gentle, pH-neutral face wash, the same HA above, and some sunscreen that's SPF 50 PA+++. I've never used retinol/retinoids but may have to down the line. I want to start using vitamin c again but probably after month 4. If my skin can handle kojic acid, I'm sure it can handle vitamin c, but I'd like to tread with caution at this point so I'm not rushing it.

I "convinced" Rullan to do phenol on me when I showed him photos of my acne scar journey since 2014. He was impressed that the PIH from high levels of Infini RF had subsided within weeks and that my skin did not react as adversely as other patients with 100% TCA-CROSS. I think he's done every patient except skin type VI (African/Melanesian) so a little surprised as to why he denied you. I'm Type V on the face but IV everywhere else which is why I wanted it so badly! I really do hope complexionimproves.

Are you planning to get the procedure anytime soon?

Youre looking great. You must be nearly 3-4 months post-op? Its an intense procedure for sure, sounds like youre healing well.Im currently about 9 months post-op and have no redness to speak of and havent for some time.

Looks a lot better (obviously), colors fading/blending nicely. Just superficial texture left really and it might just mostly be the difference in pigmentation basically. Do you feel you have hyperpigmentation still like subcutaneous the scars? I can't really tell from the pics. Any tips for how your attempting to fade/blend it better?

I would try to quit thinking aboutskin if I were you. Your cheeks are perfect. There are not a single sane person on this planet who would say something bad about your cheeks.Isee one scar on your temple I would get subcison on. And that's it.

14 hours ago, shei514 said:

Youre looking great. You must be nearly 3-4 months post-op? Its an intense procedure for sure, sounds like youre healing well.Im currently about 9 months post-op and have no redness to speak of and havent for some time.

Yeah! If I'm measure from the day I got the bismuth mask removed it would be 92 days I believe exactly. Rullan even suggested to wait longer to heal since I have ethnic skin, to which I was surprised to hear. I've noticed that when I work out, go for runs, or just get stressed, my skin has a reddish, like angry reddish tint to it, that eventually fades after like a minute. Did you have that around this time frame? Hope you're well! Your thread as kept me informed before getting phenol!

13 hours ago, harmlessboy1441 said:

Looks a lot better (obviously), colors fading/blending nicely. Just superficial texture left really and it might just mostly be the difference in pigmentation basically. Do you feel you have hyperpigmentation still like subcutaneous the scars? I can't really tell from the pics. Any tips for how your attempting to fade/blend it better?

Hyperpigmentation is there in different parts cause 1) my skin had a shitty complexion to begin with and 2) because I'm skin type IV I have more melanin and will most likely react adversely to chemical procedures that are melanotoxic. I think for now, time and proper skin care are my best bets before I spend anymore money on procedures to further improve my skin, scars or hyperpigmentation wise. As of now, I'm using kojic acid soap twice a week since it's an active and using a arbutin/vitamin c HA moisturizer from Hada Lobo. I'll most likely use HQ or azealaic acid sometime on month 5 or 6.

9 hours ago, Candy Says said:

I would try to quit thinking aboutskin if I were you. Your cheeks are perfect. There are not a single sane person on this planet who would say something bad about your cheeks.Isee one scar on your temple I would get subcison on. And that's it.

Ehh, we're our own worst critic! I have to see my face everyday so there's that. My cheeks have improved a lot to the point they won't make me cry like they did back in high school or even in college T_T. I want to get one or two most procedures to untether the scars and then think about getting fillers on the depressed areas. I know I have three areas specifically - one mid left cheek, both temples, and one sliver depression below my mouth right-side. I can live with them for now but would like to see them improved. Were you able to find TCA 100% to do at home? Hope your skin journey is going well as well!

1 hour ago, wombatstaywoke said:

Ehh, we're our own worst critic! I have to see my face everyday so there's that.

Not to mention our society is so perception based, so superficial, so discriminatory in many aspects, that it's practically impossible to separate the two. Even if someone says this or that, we have to compare ourselves to 80-90% in our society/towns, that's just how it is. We live in a competitive superficial society. Whether I like that or not, it's reality. I think that's another reason we are so hard on ourselves.

1 hour ago, harmlessboy1441 said:

Not to mention our society is so perception based, so superficial, so discriminatory in many aspects, that it's practically impossible to separate the two. Even if someone says this or that, we have to compare ourselves to 80-90% in our society/towns, that's just how it is. We live in a competitive superficial society. Whether I like that or not, it's reality. I think that's another reason we are so hard on ourselves.

As much as I hate to agree with you, it is what it is. I've dealt with bullying about my skin since childhood and it's followed me into adulthood to the point where I get bullied and ridiculed at work, within social groups, and even randomly by strangers. I just can't pull a Will Smith on everyone, though!It hurts - it really does. But instead of seeing it as an insult, I do my best to frame it as constructive criticism haha. I just need to improve my skin to the best of my ability and that my body will allow while remaining financially sound and mentally sane.

And, yes. Appearance can beeverything, sadly. We judge people's value by how well they look on the outside, which carries some merit to itI believe, but shouldn't be the only one. Even as someone who's been labeled "ugly" a little too often,I too am guilty of judging someone's value by how good or bad they look face and body wise.

4 hours ago, wombatstaywoke said:

As much as I hate to agree with you, it is what it is. I've dealt with bullying about my skin since childhood and it's followed me into adulthood to the point where I get bullied and ridiculed at work, within social groups, and even randomly by strangers. I just can't pull a Will Smith on everyone, though!It hurts - it really does. But instead of seeing it as an insult, I do my best to frame it as constructive criticism haha. I just need to improve my skin to the best of my ability and that my body will allow while remaining financially sound and mentally sane.

And, yes. Appearance can beeverything, sadly. We judge people's value by how well they look on the outside, which carries some merit to itI believe, but shouldn't be the only one. Even as someone who's been labeled "ugly" a little too often,I too am guilty of judging someone's value by how good or bad they look face and body wise.

Exactly and join the club. In fact the sad thing is more adults are harsher than kids when I was growing up and even now. I wouldn't care so much about what others think growing but at the same time you need society to survive and even prosper, so it's life on hard mode. Sometimes it's utterly impossible. I'm lucky I got significant results after Dermabrasion, like 80% just with one procedures so I'm really grateful but the pore scars left look so bad in certain lights and Dermabrasion does NOT cure fat loss or even out subcutaneous,so basically any shift in my skin even sweating or even moving face to eat,will expose creases and scars at times (hard to explain) so that adds to extreme anxiety never knowing what I'll look like at any given time.

But anyway you got some really good results and I commend your priorities, especially financial priorities.

On 4/4/2022 at 3:01 AM, wombatstaywoke said:

Yeah! If I'm measure from the day I got the bismuth mask removed it would be 92 days I believe exactly. Rullan even suggested to wait longer to heal since I have ethnic skin, to which I was surprised to hear. I've noticed that when I work out, go for runs, or just get stressed, my skin has a reddish, like angry reddish tint to it, that eventually fades after like a minute. Did you have that around this time frame? Hope you're well! Your thread as kept me informed before getting phenol!

Wow time does sure fly. I lowkey want to do it all again but it is just so expensive so I probably won™t for a while. Yeah you™ll take longer to heal for sure, but you™re looking really good you must be pleased. I know I would be! I notice the same as well, there is more redness and you get redder than you would have usually. But I am so pale lol I can™t tell if it™s the peel or just me getting red like normal  

do you think you™ll get anything else done? 

2 hours ago, shei514 said:

Wow time does sure fly. I lowkey want to do it all again but it is just so expensive so I probably won™t for a while. Yeah you™ll take longer to heal for sure, but you™re looking really good you must be pleased. I know I would be! I notice the same as well, there is more redness and you get redder than you would have usually. But I am so pale lol I can™t tell if it™s the peel or just me getting red like normal  

 

do you think you™ll get anything else done? 

It is not expensive if you repeat the phenol peel again he will probably do a regional peel just covering the cheeks. It™s more like 20 percent cost of the original peel.

4 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

It is not expensive if you repeat the phenol peel again he will probably do a regional peeljust covering the cheeks. Its more like 20 percent cost of the original peel.

Interesting. This makes me wanna do it right now lol. But I will hold off as down time is kinda a concern for me atm. I will stick with the fillers. But thats good to know. The cheeks could use a touch up.

13 hours ago, shei514 said:

Wow time does sure fly. I lowkey want to do it all again but it is just so expensive so I probably won™t for a while. Yeah you™ll take longer to heal for sure, but you™re looking really good you must be pleased. I know I would be! I notice the same as well, there is more redness and you get redder than you would have usually. But I am so pale lol I can™t tell if it™s the peel or just me getting red like normal  

 

do you think you™ll get anything else done? 

I too would like to do it again but I think I'll have to wait for a good minute. I came in financially prepared to the point I didn't even realize how much I spent on just one procedure. I really would like to fix my texturing left by rolling scars so I may travel to Europe to find a practicioner in anterior chemabrasion (the one with sandpaper). 

I'll assess it at the 6 month mark but I'm looking to get a pico laser for my hyperpigmented areas. I know this is a scar thread but for me my scars are just as concerned as those long standing dark spots. I think aside from that, I'm looking to get filler as well (Belafill or Restalyne) for depressed areas on my temples and like two spots on my cheeks. 

How many times have you gotten filler? Was it worth the price for how long it lasted? I got filler on my tear troughs three years ago and it faded in like 3 months. It's because I'm a very active person so the metabolism plus constant moving brought the volume down fast  

11 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

It is not expensive if you repeat the phenol peel again he will probably do a regional peel just covering the cheeks. It™s more like 20 percent cost of the original peel.

Yes, this is the contract I believe @shei514. If I had to choose an area, it'd probably be my eyes since some of the lines are still there (but of course not as bad). Still gonna wait a solid 6-7 months before I reassess it. Will you be getting the peel soon @getsmart121? Hope you're well!  

18 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

It is not expensive if you repeat the phenol peel again he will probably do a regional peeljust covering the cheeks. Its more like 20 percent cost of the original peel.

I don't think this is true. I remember signing a form that says if you don't see 60-90% improvement, you can request for a touchup after 6 months for half the price.

I do remember rullan saying he doesn't usually do regionals as well since the tone of your cheeks may differ from your chin/nose/temple.

10 hours ago, gynoscar said:

I don't think this is true. I remember signing a form that says if you don't see 60-90% improvement, you can request for a touchup after 6 months for half the price.

I do remember rullan saying he doesn't usually do regionals as well since the tone of your cheeks may differ from your chin/nose/temple.

On 4/2/2022 at 4:31 PM, wombatstaywoke said:

Howdy! Every part of my skin has improved but like all acne scar sufferers we want perfect improvement, which I know we can't truly have.

As for my routine, I'm using a kojic acid soap twice a week at night for hyperpigmentation + anHA moisturizer (Hada Lobo; just pick anyone. They're all good in my opinion). During the day I'm using a gentle, pH-neutral face wash, the same HA above, and some sunscreen that's SPF 50 PA+++. I've never used retinol/retinoids but may have to down the line. I want to start using vitamin c again but probably after month 4. If my skin can handle kojic acid, I'm sure it can handle vitamin c, but I'd like to tread with caution at this point so I'm not rushing it.

I "convinced" Rullan to do phenol on me when I showed him photos of my acne scar journey since 2014. He was impressed that the PIH from high levels of Infini RF had subsided within weeks and that my skin did not react as adversely as other patients with 100% TCA-CROSS. I think he's done every patient except skin type VI (African/Melanesian) so a little surprised as to why he denied you. I'm Type V on the face but IV everywhere else which is why I wanted it so badly! I really do hope complexionimproves.

Are you planning to get the procedure anytime soon?

I really want to get the procedure done soon. I have the money saved up, plus some. But its up to Rullan to give me the okay. Did you show him photos in person or virtually? How many times did you meet him before the phenol?

when you mean every part of your skin has improved what do you mean by that?

like PIH, fine lines faded, small scars very faint, better texture or something else?

9 minutes ago, Catharsis2018 said:

I really want to get the procedure done soon. I have the money saved up, plus some. But its up to Rullan to give me the okay. Did you show him photos in person or virtually? How many times did you meet him before the phenol?

when you mean every part of your skin has improved what do you mean by that?

like PIH, fine lines faded, small scars very faint, better texture or something else?

I went to him in person for one consult on phenol and nothing more. I provided high quality photos of my acne scar/skin journey to him via his patient care coordinator and he approved for it.

When I state "every part of [my] skin" I mean to say every "bad part" has looked better except for hyperpigmentation which is probably PIH at this point. Scarring, texture, and fine lines have improved at least 40% I'd say.

What was the exact reason he denied you? The sooner the better. Not sure how lock semi-lockdown will last. I'm also assuming you have a remote job as well so take advantage of it!