1 hour ago, shei514 said:Just want to say I think I have seen some good improvement with the quatro for my boxcars. They appear a lot less softer and intense. Maybe punch excision is not needed.
I take it you're seeing Rullan exclusively lately. Did he signal anything else that might work better since subcision and/or cross seems to be diminishing returns?
Did filler not respond at all (ie I remember you indicating Juvederm once I think but forgot did try anything else? Any longer term sculptra/radiesse recommended?), not an option for any of them? The subcision element might indeed just be patient specific based on depth/type or just respond differently. It should work more simply because depth is still present in the pic above, but it's possible the anatomy is just not conducive. What I mean by that is that the healing done already through various procedures (producing scar tissue/healing) might diminish healing or heal less than other with less starting scar tissue perhaps. It's just a guess based on divergences but who knows. I tend to sort of believe that scar tissue trying to heal more scar tissue might be complicating. The best healing might be normal tissue mixed with scar tissue, which might be why dermabrasion heals best for icepicks etc.
Assuming you do excise those areas, they will leave a linear scar and still have a depression. It will still have to be filled to some degree. Does Rullan ever discuss or share views on what an excision/filler situation would look like?
Like getsmart infers though, you typically would excise those two but probably want to excise like 2-3 more in the surrounding area. Even if you do and it looks decent would you fill it or blend it with something? It's just going to leave 4 linear scar marks like I have one on my cheek.
2 hours ago, shei514 said:Just want to say I think I have seen some good improvement with the quatro for my boxcars. They appear a lot less softer and intense. Maybe punch excision is not needed.
Yup like I said excision is not needed for larger scars blending the edges is much more preferred way as you can easily hide the scar.
Just made an account to document my own journey but I remember seeing this thread back in 2019 and it's wild to see that there are still activity happening here. You have come a long way with your treatments, I've looked at your latest pics and was wondering if you've ever done filler? If you have depressions in the skin that won't come up, don't you think it'd be better to fill them up with some filler maybe?
@shei514 how is the improvement going ?
I found this post very very useful. Please keep us posted and keep it active since it gave me confident.
about myself: I am suffering from moderate scarring , mainly rolling and severe atrophic scar which made me disfigured especially in the harsh lights. I cried a lot a lot and made me do not want to hang out with any of my friends. I also afraid of the lightings, it made me want to run away and I only feel safe with certain lighting. I also spent 1k with different doctors claim themselves to be the "top and expert" in scar but I see 0 improvement which made me want to kill myself. Those doctors only charges insane amount of money but not expert at all.
I recently discovered website and post and mede me want to visit Dr rullan but at the same time I am trying to have a baby, so everybody said just wait to visit the dr afterwards. I really wish I could found this website 2 years ago in that way I may be able to save all my money and time to the right doctor. I only wish to go back to 7 years ago when I start to have deep big cystic acne, just go to a derm and control them in time. If I do that I will have a lot less scar.
I hope everyone here is well. I havent done anything to my face in over a year and unfortunately dont have anything in the books. The filler has faded and Im spiralling a lot. I have good results Id say where most people dont notice however up close and when the light hits is where I have an issue and still think more resurfacing is needed. I get uncomfortable in natural sunlight and more natural light settings. I have gone back and forth about permanent filler and maybe a second peel or fully ablative CO2? However fitting this into my life is going to be difficult.
I am currently in the states and going back to NZ soon. I got engaged to my American fiance and will be moving to the states however this wont be happening until late 2024- early 2025 due to backlog at USCIS. I most likely will go back to the states in a year for a visit and maybe will do something then? I have no money to my name and cannot consider doing anything for at least a year or more 🙁 at that point will dr rullan be retired I dont know? So I will wait but when I have money I will be booking several treatments lol. If dr rullan is retired I will consider Dr mark taylor or Dr lim in AU on my way to the USA. Ugh but my fiance is also very against me getting the phenol and acne scar treatments so this isnt easy. But Im getting ahead of myself and do not know who will be available in a years time but I know I want to feel more comfortable in my skin and I think I can get there. So we shall see. My life is a mess and I developed a huge shopping addiction which set me back so much.
im not sure if I should post pics because my phone camera is shit ?
Anyway I digress, I truly hope everyone here is well and loving their best lives. Sometimes I cant aways follow peoples journeys as mine feels like it has staled but I am being negative and need to look forward. So heres to not letting our acne scars dictate our entire fucking lives lol.
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I'm curious as well.
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I tried to find the facebook group he mentioned but nothing showed up.
I'll have a better look tomorrow and see what I can find.
Shie, what are your thoughts on subcision with fat grafting? I have seen some mention it here, have you ever considered it?
I saw someone with great results on reddit - https://www.reddit.com/r/AcneScars/comments/13f6uk3/10_weeks_post_intensive_subcision_fat_grafting/
I believe the results are permanent. I have found very little information out about the procedure however. Would like to know more.
Thanks
@shei514 Hello I sent you a pm. Hope you can respond
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I tried to find the facebook group he mentioned but nothing showed up.
I'll have a better look tomorrow and see what I can find.
Shie, what are your thoughts on subcision with fat grafting? I have seen some mention it here, have you ever considered it?
I saw someone with great results on reddit - https://www.reddit.com/r/AcneScars/comments/13f6uk3/10_weeks_post_intensive_subcision_fat_grafting/
I believe the results are permanent. I have found very little information out about the procedure however. Would like to know more.
Thanks
https://www.reddit.com/r/AcneScars/comments/17dej06/6_month_update_after_co2_subcision_and_co2_laser/
That person updated recently too.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AcneScars/comments/174ejuo/acne_scar_treatment/
This woman appears to have the same surgery done also or at least the same surgeon:
https://www.drphilipyoung.com/procedures/acne-scar/acne-scar-vitalizer-treatment
His website has shady before and after photos with obviously different lighting. However, both of the reddit posts show more legitimate significant improvement from personal sources. This process of using fat stem cells from the abdomen and placing it precisely on facial scars and using a CO laser to level it out is promising. The cost is around 12k to 15k dollars though.
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I was treated using his methods and I can give you my 2 cents, my opinions are rather controversial though but I really think people can benefit from them. (I'm not going to say which doctor/clinic I went to because I don't want this post to come off as an advertisement)
I got TL subcision, multiple excisions (both punch and surgical), fully ablative erbium laser (only on edges of scars), and fractional CO2 on top.
Subcision:
I have researched this topic for a very long time and I believe that Taylor liberator subcision is the ONLY type of subcision that can free up all the scar bands and deliver good results. When I was getting the TL subcision, I was quite shocked by how much force was required to cut the scars even with the razor shape tip of the TL, the doctor had to push extremely hard and pretty much had to put her body into it to cut through the bigger scars. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that doctors claim that they can do the same thing with a blunt canunla or a norkor needle, they are snapping some small scar bands at best, which is why you can get many subcisions and still have tethering. Lastly, we need to keep in mind that most of the subcision results out there are due to SWELLING post OP, so what you are seeing is not the actual result.
Excision:
I got excision for a lot of my boxcar scars and I believe that is what you should do too @shei514. Similar to me, some of your boxcar scars are beyond salvagable with laser to be quite frank. Excision scars look very good nowadays and a linear scar will always look better than a big boxcar scar, especially with over-head lighting. Another reason to get excision is that you have the opportunity to get laser resurfacing while the excision wound is healing, and its common knowledge that a brand new scar will respond way more drastically to treatments (laser and silicone pads) compared to an older one. And lets face it, even without further treatment, most minor mohs/excision scars look better than severe boxcar scars, so there is no reason not to get the big ones cut out. But do keep in mind that bigger scars (>2-3mm) will need surgical excision (shaped like an ellipse) rather than circular punch excision.
Laser (pinpoint):
Regarding the lasers, I think it would be smart to get a pinpoint ablative erbium laser and trace over the boundaries of your scars. This will make the indentation less obvious by not only reducing height of the drop off, but also making it less acute. The latter is extremely important because the reason that boxscar scars look so bad is due to the abrupt angulation between the normal tissue and the scar. In other words, the border of the scar is pretty much perpendicular to the skin surface and creates shadows that make the scar look worse than they really are. Let me give you an analogy, a boxcar scar boundary is like a steep cliff, and if you ablative the edges with a focused laser the cliff can turn into a rounded hill if that makes sense.
@shei514 Your results are incredible, I hope to get results as amazing as you have. I have severe acme scarring and have struggled with my scars mentally for as far back as I can remember, and your outlook and feelings towards your scars are exactly mine toward my own. I just sent Dr. Rullan's office an email, and hope they get back to me soon. I'm aiming to get his 2 day phenol peel/chemabrasion! Given I'm from NJ, I am also thinking doing excision with Dr. Janjua, but have mixed feelings about that at the moment. Anywho, happy new year, and thank you for sharing your journey with us. Your story is inspiring, you have no idea how much I needed to read your thread, so glad I found it, wish you nothing but the best!
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I was treated using his methods and I can give you my 2 cents, my opinions are rather controversial though but I really think people can benefit from them. (I'm not going to say which doctor/clinic I went to because I don't want this post to come off as an advertisement)
I got TL subcision, multiple excisions (both punch and surgical), fully ablative erbium laser (only on edges of scars), and fractional CO2 on top.
Subcision:
I have researched this topic for a very long time and I believe that Taylor liberator subcision is the ONLY type of subcision that can free up all the scar bands and deliver good results. When I was getting the TL subcision, I was quite shocked by how much force was required to cut the scars even with the razor shape tip of the TL, the doctor had to push extremely hard and pretty much had to put her body into it to cut through the bigger scars. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that doctors claim that they can do the same thing with a blunt canunla or a norkor needle, they are snapping some small scar bands at best, which is why you can get many subcisions and still have tethering. Lastly, we need to keep in mind that most of the subcision results out there are due to SWELLING post OP, so what you are seeing is not the actual result.
Excision:
I got excision for a lot of my boxcar scars and I believe that is what you should do too @shei514. Similar to me, some of your boxcar scars are beyond salvagable with laser to be quite frank. Excision scars look very good nowadays and a linear scar will always look better than a big boxcar scar, especially with over-head lighting. Another reason to get excision is that you have the opportunity to get laser resurfacing while the excision wound is healing, and its common knowledge that a brand new scar will respond way more drastically to treatments (laser and silicone pads) compared to an older one. And lets face it, even without further treatment, most minor mohs/excision scars look better than severe boxcar scars, so there is no reason not to get the big ones cut out. But do keep in mind that bigger scars (>2-3mm) will need surgical excision (shaped like an ellipse) rather than circular punch excision.
Laser (pinpoint):
Regarding the lasers, I think it would be smart to get a pinpoint ablative erbium laser and trace over the boundaries of your scars. This will make the indentation less obvious by not only reducing height of the drop off, but also making it less acute. The latter is extremely important because the reason that boxscar scars look so bad is due to the abrupt angulation between the normal tissue and the scar. In other words, the border of the scar is pretty much perpendicular to the skin surface and creates shadows that make the scar look worse than they really are. Let me give you an analogy, a boxcar scar boundary is like a steep cliff, and if you ablative the edges with a focused laser the cliff can turn into a rounded hill if that makes sense.
Hello, thank you for taking the time to write this. However what would you say was the percentage of improvement from all the treatments you listed. I would appreciate any input. I can also share my experiences as well -$24k and 3 years later
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I was treated using his methods and I can give you my 2 cents, my opinions are rather controversial though but I really think people can benefit from them. (I'm not going to say which doctor/clinic I went to because I don't want this post to come off as an advertisement)
I got TL subcision, multiple excisions (both punch and surgical), fully ablative erbium laser (only on edges of scars), and fractional CO2 on top.
Subcision:
I have researched this topic for a very long time and I believe that Taylor liberator subcision is the ONLY type of subcision that can free up all the scar bands and deliver good results. When I was getting the TL subcision, I was quite shocked by how much force was required to cut the scars even with the razor shape tip of the TL, the doctor had to push extremely hard and pretty much had to put her body into it to cut through the bigger scars. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that doctors claim that they can do the same thing with a blunt canunla or a norkor needle, they are snapping some small scar bands at best, which is why you can get many subcisions and still have tethering. Lastly, we need to keep in mind that most of the subcision results out there are due to SWELLING post OP, so what you are seeing is not the actual result.
Excision:
I got excision for a lot of my boxcar scars and I believe that is what you should do too @shei514. Similar to me, some of your boxcar scars are beyond salvagable with laser to be quite frank. Excision scars look very good nowadays and a linear scar will always look better than a big boxcar scar, especially with over-head lighting. Another reason to get excision is that you have the opportunity to get laser resurfacing while the excision wound is healing, and its common knowledge that a brand new scar will respond way more drastically to treatments (laser and silicone pads) compared to an older one. And lets face it, even without further treatment, most minor mohs/excision scars look better than severe boxcar scars, so there is no reason not to get the big ones cut out. But do keep in mind that bigger scars (>2-3mm) will need surgical excision (shaped like an ellipse) rather than circular punch excision.
Laser (pinpoint):
Regarding the lasers, I think it would be smart to get a pinpoint ablative erbium laser and trace over the boundaries of your scars. This will make the indentation less obvious by not only reducing height of the drop off, but also making it less acute. The latter is extremely important because the reason that boxscar scars look so bad is due to the abrupt angulation between the normal tissue and the scar. In other words, the border of the scar is pretty much perpendicular to the skin surface and creates shadows that make the scar look worse than they really are. Let me give you an analogy, a boxcar scar boundary is like a steep cliff, and if you ablative the edges with a focused laser the cliff can turn into a rounded hill if that makes sense.
Hello, thank you for taking the time to write this. However what would you say was the percentage of improvement from all the treatments you listed. I would appreciate any input. I can also share my experiences as well -$24k and 3 years later
I would say my rolling scars are all gone. My boxcar scars are improved by 40-60%. The scars that were excised all improved by 80%, except for one that got infected.
Edit: Right now I'm not going to pursue anymore treatments until more news about verteporfin comes out.
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I was treated using his methods and I can give you my 2 cents, my opinions are rather controversial though but I really think people can benefit from them. (I'm not going to say which doctor/clinic I went to because I don't want this post to come off as an advertisement)
I got TL subcision, multiple excisions (both punch and surgical), fully ablative erbium laser (only on edges of scars), and fractional CO2 on top.
Subcision:
I have researched this topic for a very long time and I believe that Taylor liberator subcision is the ONLY type of subcision that can free up all the scar bands and deliver good results. When I was getting the TL subcision, I was quite shocked by how much force was required to cut the scars even with the razor shape tip of the TL, the doctor had to push extremely hard and pretty much had to put her body into it to cut through the bigger scars. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that doctors claim that they can do the same thing with a blunt canunla or a norkor needle, they are snapping some small scar bands at best, which is why you can get many subcisions and still have tethering. Lastly, we need to keep in mind that most of the subcision results out there are due to SWELLING post OP, so what you are seeing is not the actual result.
Excision:
I got excision for a lot of my boxcar scars and I believe that is what you should do too @shei514. Similar to me, some of your boxcar scars are beyond salvagable with laser to be quite frank. Excision scars look very good nowadays and a linear scar will always look better than a big boxcar scar, especially with over-head lighting. Another reason to get excision is that you have the opportunity to get laser resurfacing while the excision wound is healing, and its common knowledge that a brand new scar will respond way more drastically to treatments (laser and silicone pads) compared to an older one. And lets face it, even without further treatment, most minor mohs/excision scars look better than severe boxcar scars, so there is no reason not to get the big ones cut out. But do keep in mind that bigger scars (>2-3mm) will need surgical excision (shaped like an ellipse) rather than circular punch excision.
Laser (pinpoint):
Regarding the lasers, I think it would be smart to get a pinpoint ablative erbium laser and trace over the boundaries of your scars. This will make the indentation less obvious by not only reducing height of the drop off, but also making it less acute. The latter is extremely important because the reason that boxscar scars look so bad is due to the abrupt angulation between the normal tissue and the scar. In other words, the border of the scar is pretty much perpendicular to the skin surface and creates shadows that make the scar look worse than they really are. Let me give you an analogy, a boxcar scar boundary is like a steep cliff, and if you ablative the edges with a focused laser the cliff can turn into a rounded hill if that makes sense.
Hello, thank you for taking the time to write this. However what would you say was the percentage of improvement from all the treatments you listed. I would appreciate any input. I can also share my experiences as well -$24k and 3 years later
I would say my rolling scars are all gone. My boxcar scars are improved by 40-60%. The scars that were excised all improved by 80%, except for one that got infected.
Edit: Right now I'm not going to pursue anymore treatments until more news about verteporfin comes out.
i'm currently in a research study for verteporfin. i will report back when the surgery is completed. which doctor did you go to get your TL subcision done? also where did you get your excision done. i'm trying to find a competent doctor to do both.
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CUqYaYhlEUv/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Interested in what people think of Dr mark Taylor
I was treated using his methods and I can give you my 2 cents, my opinions are rather controversial though but I really think people can benefit from them. (I'm not going to say which doctor/clinic I went to because I don't want this post to come off as an advertisement)
I got TL subcision, multiple excisions (both punch and surgical), fully ablative erbium laser (only on edges of scars), and fractional CO2 on top.
Subcision:
I have researched this topic for a very long time and I believe that Taylor liberator subcision is the ONLY type of subcision that can free up all the scar bands and deliver good results. When I was getting the TL subcision, I was quite shocked by how much force was required to cut the scars even with the razor shape tip of the TL, the doctor had to push extremely hard and pretty much had to put her body into it to cut through the bigger scars. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that doctors claim that they can do the same thing with a blunt canunla or a norkor needle, they are snapping some small scar bands at best, which is why you can get many subcisions and still have tethering. Lastly, we need to keep in mind that most of the subcision results out there are due to SWELLING post OP, so what you are seeing is not the actual result.
Excision:
I got excision for a lot of my boxcar scars and I believe that is what you should do too @shei514. Similar to me, some of your boxcar scars are beyond salvagable with laser to be quite frank. Excision scars look very good nowadays and a linear scar will always look better than a big boxcar scar, especially with over-head lighting. Another reason to get excision is that you have the opportunity to get laser resurfacing while the excision wound is healing, and its common knowledge that a brand new scar will respond way more drastically to treatments (laser and silicone pads) compared to an older one. And lets face it, even without further treatment, most minor mohs/excision scars look better than severe boxcar scars, so there is no reason not to get the big ones cut out. But do keep in mind that bigger scars (>2-3mm) will need surgical excision (shaped like an ellipse) rather than circular punch excision.
Laser (pinpoint):
Regarding the lasers, I think it would be smart to get a pinpoint ablative erbium laser and trace over the boundaries of your scars. This will make the indentation less obvious by not only reducing height of the drop off, but also making it less acute. The latter is extremely important because the reason that boxscar scars look so bad is due to the abrupt angulation between the normal tissue and the scar. In other words, the border of the scar is pretty much perpendicular to the skin surface and creates shadows that make the scar look worse than they really are. Let me give you an analogy, a boxcar scar boundary is like a steep cliff, and if you ablative the edges with a focused laser the cliff can turn into a rounded hill if that makes sense.
Hi Ascender,
I have a lot of boxcar scars too, and they absolutely did not improve from ablative co2 laser treatments (2 sessions). So I'm seriously considering getting excision done.
But my scars are very close to one another, and I have a lot of them on my cheeks. In this case, would it be best to treat the worst looking ones first, and treat other ones after the ones already treated have been fully healed? I'm thinking it would be a really bad idea to have bunch of them close to one another treated all at once.
TIA.