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Hey DC girl! Do you know if progesterone OR vitamin E help dissolve scar tissue?!
I really have been trying to find something on Google but I'm not sure... maybe you know something.
I was thinking maybe the progeste helped in that sense... one of those ingredients. Also the massaging when you would put it on since it takes a while to sink in, how long did you massage for?
Hey DC girl! Do you know if progesterone OR vitamin E help dissolve scar tissue?!
I really have been trying to find something on Google but I'm not sure... maybe you know something.
I was thinking maybe the progeste helped in that sense... one of those ingredients. Also the massaging when you would put it on since it takes a while to sink in, how long did you massage for?
Yes, vitamin E actually sheds skin and also softens the scar tissue, so it will remodal and help bloodflow renew the scar in combonation with massage.
You'll want to needle it though too.
What gave you that idea? Scar tissue is made of protein, so only a protease could theoretically dissolve it.
Well, dissolve isn't the right word. You don't want a hole in your face. But vitamin E will indeed help soften and renew the scared skin and accelrate heaing along with needling.
On 8/14/2015 at 11:30 AM, DC-girl said:On 8/13/2015 at 10:09 PM, Meoww said:Hey DC girl! Do you know if progesterone OR vitamin E help dissolve scar tissue?!
I really have been trying to find something on Google but I'm not sure... maybe you know something.
I was thinking maybe the progeste helped in that sense... one of those ingredients. Also the massaging when you would put it on since it takes a while to sink in, how long did you massage for?
Yes, vitamin E actually sheds skin and also softens the scar tissue, so it will remodal and help bloodflow renew the scar in combonation with massage.
You'll want to needle it though too.
On 8/14/2015 at 12:48 AM, Factoid said:>What gave you that idea? Scar tissue is made of protein, so only a protease could theoretically dissolve it.
Well, dissolve isn't the right word. You don't want a hole in your face. But vitamin E will indeed help soften and renew the scared skin and accelrate heaing along with needling.
Thank you for answering DC girl, I will be doing both.
On 8/14/2015 at 12:48 AM, Factoid said:What gave you that idea? Scar tissue is made of protein, so only a protease could theoretically dissolve it.
Yes sorry Factoid, I meant soften not dissolve. Does that mean using ACV & pineapple topically would help with scars? I know both have lots of enzymes maybe applying them topically would help.
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On 8/14/2015 at 11:30 AM, DC-girl said:On 8/14/2015 at 12:48 AM, Factoid said:What gave you that idea? Scar tissue is made of protein, so only a protease could theoretically dissolve it.
Well, dissolve isn't the right word. You don't want a hole in your face. But vitamin E will indeed help soften and renew the scared skin and accelrate heaing along with needling.
Protease doesn't work like an acid, there wouldn't be any holes, the lysed (broken down) scar-tissue proteins would conceivably be replaced with normal, healthy collagen fibers. In theory, at least.
And Vitamin A is a much better topical than Vitamin E for that sort of thing, one of last year's combination therapy studies mentioned how it also helps scarred skin grow back less scarred due to the way it affects collagen weaving.
On 8/14/2015 at 12:13 PM, Meoww said:Yes sorry Factoid, I meant soften not dissolve. Does that mean using ACV & pineapple topically would help with scars? I know both have lots of enzymes maybe applying them topically would help.
[Link removed]
Raised linear scars? Possibly. Atrophic acne scars? Nope, simply "softening" scar-tissue isn't going to fill in an atrophic scar, you need to induce trauma to get that going. TCA does both, it will dissolve scar-tissue AND initiate some serious collagenesis.
On 8/14/2015 at 1:14 PM, Factoid said:On 8/14/2015 at 11:30 AM, DC-girl said:On 8/14/2015 at 12:48 AM, Factoid said:What gave you that idea? Scar tissue is made of protein, so only a protease could theoretically dissolve it.
Well, dissolve isn't the right word. You don't want a hole in your face. But vitamin E will indeed help soften and renew the scared skin and accelrate heaing along with needling.
Protease doesn't work like an acid, there wouldn't be any holes, the lysed (broken down) scar-tissue proteins would conceivably be replaced with normal, healthy collagen fibers. In theory, at least.
And Vitamin A is a much better topical than Vitamin E for that sort of thing, one of last year's combination therapy studies mentioned how it also helps scarred skin grow back less scarred due to the way it affects collagen weaving.
On 8/14/2015 at 12:13 PM, Meoww said:>Yes sorry Factoid, I meant soften not dissolve. Does that mean using ACV & pineapple topically would help with scars? I know both have lots of enzymes maybe applying them topically would help.
[Link removed]
Raised linear scars? Possibly. Atrophic acne scars? Nope, simply "softening" scar-tissue isn't going to fill in an atrophic scar, you need to induce trauma to get that going. TCA does both, it will dissolve scar-tissue AND initiate some serious collagenesis.
Okay that's good to know! thanks!
Hi DC-girl, I remember reading a post where you posted you scheduled a consultation with Dr. Lam in Dallas, TX. Just wondering if got TCA Cross treatment from him or what is your impression of him. I am thinking of going to see him for ice pick and boxcar scars. Thanks.
I have not gotten cross from him but I do like and recommend him.
I just had dermarolling done..
The doc recommended only using Retin-A .4% every other day.
Not sure if I should use it or not.
I always hear about how you should keep the skin moist for wound healing. Not sure if I should be using Vaseline or not or coconut oil or something to keep it moist with.
I'm not into using drugs at all, but I just want good skin.
I have pretty much "virgin" skin if you will. I've never really done anything to it before or used anything topically besides natural things.
I already eat healthy but I plan on eating more variety to get all the minerals and vitamins needed. I intend to juice once a day and continue intermittent fasting along with exercising.
I don't eat any grains or any processed sugars, no dairy except for kefir (anything else makes me break out).
My diet basically consists of meat, veggies, fruit, nuts/seeds.
DC-girl, what do you think about flax oil?
Hi DC-Girl,
First of all, congratulations on your great outcome and thanks for sharing your experience with us.
I can see that you haven't been online for a few months but hopefully you will come along and read this before long...
I would just like to ask, given that it looks like you had some rolling scars, what you attribute your improvement (or should I say, eradication!) of this particular type of scarring to? I'm guessing it's either single needling, dermastamping or a combination of the two.
I have some rolling scars similar to what yours looked like so if I was able to achieve the same results as you I would be thrilled.
Any tips that you or anyone else could give me on single needling would be great because you mention following some instructions on OwnDoc but I can't seem to find them. I think they may have been removed. Anyone know?
Thanks a lot!
Maybe I missed it somewhere in this long thread, but I'm still struggling to understand how do you treat diffused scarring/rolling scars. Meaning scarring that doesn't seem to have a defined point where it is tethered. It is hard to tell, but you seemed to have a few of them on your old picture. While most of mine are boxscars with a few icepick ones, I have numerous rolling scars around my mouth area and I think those bother me the most. I have been needling for a while but inconsistently. I'll admit, I don't keep up with it on a schedule so I won't see the results I want unless I keep it consistent. I did at one point do the single lancet microneedle method and I saw results for a single scar, but in my obsession with getting rid of my rolling scars that I hate the most, I invested in a Derminator Microneedling tool. It has been great. I prick on multiple scars at a time and get an overall benefit for fine lines and wrinkles, but I also know I'm hitting my scarring straight on rather than an angle. The pen may have or may have not helped with my rolling scars, I won't know unless I treat them more consistently. However, I don't know if that IS the proper way of treating rolling scars. I have always been dreadfully afraid of TCA, but as a veteran member since 2005, I have seen the miracle of what it has done to people. My skin is NOT sensitive at all. I have pounded my face with a bunch of irritating chemicals and my scarring seems as stubborn as ever. For this, I feel I have to start at a minimum of 30% TCA. Most scars are 15+ years old and are actually not very deep, somewhat shallow, but they are numerous and stubborn. They get red sometimes making them look terrible in natural/overhead/fluorescent lighting. To the point I'm used to people commenting on them. I'm considering getting back on the scar treatment boat and trying a combination of TCA/needling. I'm just wondering how exactly did you tackle your more diffused scarring or treat uneven textured skin (if any) and was there a method you used to apply the TCA? On what kind of scars?
Thanks and congratulations on your success.
@PetPeeveI feel ya. Both in terms of having rolling scars around the mouth area and being confused about how to tackle rolling scars that don't appear to be tied down.
If you mention that you have rolling scars or someone posts up a picture, the suggested treatment people make is invariably subcision, with the explanation always being that it works by cutting through the fibrous bands that holds it down. However, when a scar doesn't appeared to be tethered - that's where I'm a bit lost.
Untethered rolling scars remain a grey area to me and we would very much appreciate it if anyone could "fill us in" in every sense of the term!
On 4/19/2016 at 6:25 AM, Paul B said:Hi DC-Girl,
First of all, congratulations on your great outcome and thanks for sharing your experience with us.
I can see that you haven't been online for a few months but hopefully you will come along and read this before long...
I would just like to ask, given that it looks like you had some rolling scars, what you attribute your improvement (or should I say, eradication!) of this particular type of scarring to? I'm guessing it's either single lancet microneedling, dermastamping or a combination of the two.
I have some rolling scars similar to what yours looked like so if I was able to achieve the same results as you I would be thrilled.
Any tips that you or anyone else could give me on single lancet microneedling would be great because you mention following some instructions on OwnDoc but I can't seem to find them. I think they may have been removed. Anyone know?
Thanks a lot!
Hey Paul,
You're correct, I did both single needling and dermaneedling. And also tca.
I wouldn't worry too much about how you specifically go about it. The point is you're breaking up scar tissue and bringing blood flow to the scar. Tca and needling both obliterate scar tissue bit by bit. They are just different methods of the same thing. And it takes time and LOTS of repetition, and proper nutrition is essential. Skin cells turn over every 30 days, I believe. So, keep at it!
On 4/20/2016 at 5:10 AM, PetPeeve said:Maybe I missed it somewhere in this long thread, but I'm still struggling to understand how do you treat diffused scarring/rolling scars. Meaning scarring that doesn't seem to have a defined point where it is tethered. It is hard to tell, but you seemed to have a few of them on your old picture. While most of mine are boxscars with a few icepick ones, I have numerous rolling scars around my mouth area and I think those bother me the most. I have been needling for a while but inconsistently. I'll admit, I don't keep up with it on a schedule so I won't see the results I want unless I keep it consistent. I have always been dreadfully afraid of TCA, but as a veteran member since 2005, I have seen the miracle of what it has done to people. My skin is NOT sensitive at all. I have pounded my face with a bunch of irritating chemicals and my scarring seems as stubborn as ever. For this, I feel I have to start at a minimum of 30% TCA. Most scars are 15+ years old and are actually not very deep, somewhat shallow, but they are numerous and stubborn. They get red sometimes making them look terrible in natural/overhead/fluorescent lighting. To the point I'm used to people commenting on them. I'm considering getting back on the scar treatment boat and trying a combination of TCA/needling. I'm just wondering how exactly did you tackle your more diffused scarring or treat uneven textured skin (if any) and was there a method you used to apply the TCA? On what kind of scars?
Thanks and congratulations on your success.
And you DO have to keep up with the microneedling. Set an alarm on your phone and do it every 2 weeks. That way you can't forget.
Also, read Dr. Ray Peat's work and you'll get a better handle on nutrition. That's essential for good healing.
Thanks very much for your reply, DC-Girl.
You mention that getting blood flow is key so presumably some massaging of the skin now and then wouldn't do any harm to increase circulation. Is the 30-minute massage something you stuck to religiously or did you do it to a far lesser extent?
On the subject of blood flow - do you recommend suctioning directly after treating ANY type of scarring just as a means of bringing blood to the area? For example, suctioning is commonly associated following subcision for rolling scars so wondered if you had your rolling scars in mind here or any type of scar. Any tips on how to suction in general would be appreciated as I can see this being something that I'm going to be confused about when it comes to trying it. e.g. which cup size to use in which situation, how many scars to do at the same time and how long to suction for etc.
I am looking to incorporate beef tallow and coconut into my diet if not my skincare regime. Is it right that they are suitable for both purposes? If you could lend any tips how much to use, how frequently or ideas on meals/drinks that I can consume coconut oil with that would be great.
One final thing, were your rolling scars the kind that disappear when stretched or remain visibly indented at all times?
Thanks once again.
Hi DC-Girl,
Thanks for sharing your experience with us.
Do you think your results might be due to a combination of your diet and genetics? My derm has a before and after picture of a person whose scarring was a lot worse than yours, and she has improved basically 100% over 7 months. He only used a microneedling method. He says that results are variable from person to person, and that her results were not to be expected from most people. I want to get results like you, and was wondering if you had any experiences with very quick wound healing in general.
I personally don't heal fast at all. A cat scratched my hand like 5 weeks ago, and the mark is still visible. I found this odd so I did some testing, and it turned out that I had a severe zinc deficiency. So I plan to be taking some zinc supplements and possibly niacinamide to boost healing. I have been eating healthy for the past 3 years, so I should be expecting good results once the deficiency is taken care of.
Would you mind sharing with us the kind of supplements you take, and whether you do cardio or any other kind of aerobic exercises? I would really appreciate that.
On 10/31/2016 at 10:02 PM, deutschegrammophon said:Your results are inspirational, as is your approach. I have a few questions:
1. Did you perform single lancet microneedlingon yourself or did you just needle in and out horizontally? I am unclear what advantage this would have over just needling through the face of the scar if in fact you weren't subcising with a swishing motion.
2. Did you change your diet before needling/TCA, and if so how long after the change did you start treatments?
3. You mention that you went 1cm deep with the needle and found scar tissue. Are you sure this wasn't muscle? How did you avoid vital nerves going so deep?
4. When you needle the scar is the damaged part destroyed by the body and replaced with new healthy tissue or does the body just fill in the gap?
5. What did you do about hypertrophic scars? Would these respond best to TCA?
6. Do you find that there is any cosmetic distinction between areas where a scar used to be and healthy skin?
7. Did you actually have any success breaking up scar tissue manually as in between your fingers?
8. Have you ever caused too much damage for the body to heal without a scar?
You have been very helpful. Sorry if these questions seem to have obvious answers.
She can answer your questions, but ... many of these things are answered in the FAQ below.
I bought TCA 30% but only used it once because people told me it doesn't fix indented scars. I believeDC-girl , but to confirm you did have indented scars, correct? Just asking to be 100% sure, as there seems to be doubt on the thread.
I used the acid and there was a lot of down time. I used it on my temple, but luckily for me, I hide it under my animehair, haha.Also, does TCA have an expirydate? I bought it about one year ago and still got lots of it left.
4 hours ago, Robertitoo said:She had boxcar scars. This wont do anything for rolling scars
Not judging by her before photos. They look like rolling scars to me (wide, undefined edges). She also says on page one that she subscised her scars while single needling so yeah it would help.
Edit: I realise you were talking about TCA
TCA alone does nothing for fat deficiency, tethered, atrophy, regardless of type. Subcision and filler do, more details in the FAQ below under that section. TCA is textural, only the top, scars go deep. Same with laser, it takes off layers on the top, doing very little for the underneath layers.