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13 hours ago, NagarNikku_ said:So you're talking about surgically removing the entire cheek, the entire area where there's scattered scars?
No, im talking about the fact, that this method cannot help people with wide spread acne scars for example on the cheeks, cause there would be too much tissue removed, it cant be done.
2 hours ago, Iker99 said:No, im talking about the fact, that this method cannot help people with wide spread acne scars for example on the cheeks, cause there would be too much tissue removed, it cant be done.
I think theres a general consensus in the field that if any method claiming to regenerate skin doesnt involve theremoval of the damaged skin, then regeneration will not be achieved. Which also happens to beone of theskepticisms around elastagen.
The only method for scarless healing in this scenario would be for scarred skin to undergo a metamorphosisto normal skin. But nosuch method exists and its probably a harder problem to tackle than scarless healing. (Though there is a paper published that Iodine can regenerate scarsin this fashion back to normal, it wasnt a very rigorous study though)
Now when excising the scar, if closingthe wound is required for verteporfin to work then that would be dumb, we can pretty much do that right now so verteporfin would be kinda useless. From the published paper, the mice grew full set of hair in the excisedarea, vs the mouse that developed a scar instead. The excised area was replaced with normal skin, so its not like the surface area of available skin has decreased.
If you buy that, then you do have anoption ofcontinuous spot treatments. In theory if you got your scar from acne.. then we can assume that each acne event produced an individual scar. For some that could be a lot of events, butyou couldtackle each one in reverse order of occurrencelol. Most of us have very defining scar features, which even morning swelling wont cover, I think getting rid of some of thosespots on the first runwould lift our spiritsquite a bit. Then we can move on to tackling less severe spots.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-021-25410-z
Longaker's Lab published the result of pig studies by FAKI inhibition.
Please know that Verteporfin is used for YAK inhibition, and it's results aren't out yet. However, FAKI inhibition was undertaken by Gurtner, one of the member involved in the previous mice study in April.
I wonder if FAKI inhibition and YAK inhibition will produce different results.
This wasn't a complete regeneration, but still an incredible amount of scarring was prevented. Let me know what you all think
29 minutes ago, Yeeeeaaaaaaahhhhhhhh said:Okay that is actually amazing. Its not reallyscarless but itregrew hairfollicles and sweatglands on a pig. it's basically nothing compared to the scarring on the pigs without it
It isn't a complete regeneration, sure. But yes, there's a massive difference with/without it. It should only get better from here I believe.
12 hours ago, NagarNikku_ said:https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-021-25410-z
Longaker's Lab published the result of pig studies by FAKI inhibition.
Please know that Verteporfin is used for YAK inhibition, and it's results aren't out yet. However, FAKI inhibition was undertaken by Gurtner, one of the member involved in the previous mice study in April.
I wonder if FAKI inhibition and YAK inhibition will produce different results.
This wasn't a complete regeneration, but still an incredible amount of scarring was prevented. Let me know what you all think
here's why I didn't see the word verteporfin.if it's verteporfin
Yeah this is really something - to regenerate sweat glands and hair! In the paper it says something about "nearly the same as uninjured tissue". Sounds like there are at least 2 potential therapeutic avenues(YAP and FAKI inhibitors)that couldsilence mechanical stress and coax the body to regenerate.
Here's the direct quote: "Here, we show that blocking mechanical signaling via FAK inhibition promotes regenerative healing, defined by formation of healed skin with (1) restored biomechanical properties, (2) hair follicle regrowth, and (3) normal collagen fiber architecture. To confirm these findings in humans, we quantify the effects of FAK inhibition on three-dimensional (3D) cultured human fibroblasts at the cellular and transcriptomic levels using single-cell RNA sequencing. We demonstrate that mechanical stress induces profibrotic fibroblast differentiation fates in large organisms, which can effectively be averted by FAK inhibition to instead induce discrete fibroblast clusters that promote wound regeneration."
UnderPorcine and human confirmation of diverging trajectories:
These experiments demon- strated that YAP indeed acts as a master regulator of profibrotic differentiation, and that silencing YAP expression could, like FAK inhibition, promote regenerative EGR1 expression while down- regulating collagen and myofibroblast markers
I believe we should see the results of verteporfin, because i think FAKI just downregulates YAP, but it doesnt block it. What is good is that the researches found the same trajectories in humans as they found in mice so this is promising!
On 9/4/2021 at 4:02 AM, Diamond9199 said:I want to try it on myself, but I'm scared of it
I will honestly pay for the drug and ship it to you if anyone is willing to try it under responsible supervision.
Im talking about verteprofin. Ive had a chemist mix what was in Fs2 a long time ago and used it on a small scar I had. Worked slightly, but not enough.
on the other hand, if I can find a doctor in Los Angeles to try this on me, I would do it too.
3 minutes ago, Scarsbegoneeeeeee said:I will honestly pay for the drug and ship it to you if anyone is willing to try it under responsible supervision.
Im talking about verteprofin. Ive had a chemist mix what was in Fs2 a long time ago and used it on a small scar I had. Worked slightly, but not enough.
on the other hand, if I can find a doctor in Los Angeles to try this on me, I would do it too.
What is FS2? and you tried verteporfin before you mean?
FS2 was a drug that was supposed to stop fibrosis years back. It sort of worked, but not really.
I have not used verteporfin on myself, but what I am saying is id pay for the drug for someone to try on themselves. I do know where to get it, but hesitant on injuring and injecting myself. BUT if someone else wants to try it, Id pay for their drug and have it shipped to them no joke.
otherwise If anyone knows of any forward thinking dermatologists who would be willing to try verteprofin off label, Id volunteer to do it.
10 minutes ago, Scarsbegoneeeeeee said:FS2 was a drug that was supposed to stop fibrosis years back. It sort of worked, but not really.
I have not used verteporfin on myself, but what I am saying is id pay for the drug for someone to try on themselves. I do know where to get it, but hesitant on injuring and injecting myself. BUT if someone else wants to try it, Id pay for their drug and have it shipped to them no joke.
otherwise If anyone knows of any forward thinking dermatologists who would be willing to try verteprofin off label, Id volunteer to do it.
Honestly I'd be willing to try verteporfin but there's still some details that are not out, if it's better to use it as a gel or inject.
21 minutes ago, Scarsbegoneeeeeee said:From my understanding, they mixed it with a saline type gel. If you can get your hands on the original paper and read it, that should tell you the answer.
I would honestly be happy to pay for the injection. Its definitely spendy. You would be supervised though, correct?
Yep, just waiting for the pig research paper to be published with verteporfin.
28 minutes ago, NagarNikku_ said:Yep, just waiting for the pig research paper to be published with verteporfin.
Did he say when results were going to be published? I emailed him today asking whether or not the results they had thus far were truly scarless or just improved healing.
51 minutes ago, Scarsbegoneeeeeee said:Did he say when results were going to be published? I emailed him today asking whether or not the results they had thus far were truly scarless or just improved healing.
I'm assuming that the research paper would be out by October or November.
If you see above some hairloss group actually had an update from Longaker himself, and he says they're just finishing up with the studies. Hoping for the best!
We 're almost there everyone .... i have dermatitis of eyelids , facial scarring etc ... if this works on humans things will only get better .... everyone scarfree healing will happen sooner rather than later ....
When it comes to removing old scars, is it guaranteed that the skin acts the same as unwonded skin? Like are there still scar producing cellsaround the scar that will produce another scar anyways, even though some ENFs might not differentiate to EPSs.
It did say in the NYT article however,that there was no reason to think you could not remove an old scar,so I guess we should trust/hopethat. I was just wondering if theres anyissues related to removing an old scar and the skin around it?
9 minutes ago, giddy said:When it comes to removing old scars, is it guaranteed that the skin acts the same as unwonded skin? Like are there still scar producing cellsaround the scar that will produce another scar anyways, even though some ENFs might not differentiate to EPSs.
It did say in the NYT article however,that there was no reason to think you could not remove an old scar,so I guess we should trust/hopethat. I was just wondering if theres anyissues related to removing an old scar and the skin around it?
Since the damaged tissue is going to be removed, it would make new wounds anyway so I think it shouldn't make a difference.
It shouldn't matter if the skin removed was damaged or perfectly normal before, since the healing process will begin from square one.
On 9/9/2021 at 2:04 AM, NagarNikku_ said:Since the damaged tissue is going to be removed, it would make new wounds anyway so I think it shouldn't make a difference.
It shouldn't matter if the skin removed was damaged or perfectly normal before, since the healing process will begin from square one.
But lets say that around the damaged skin, the ENFs have all been converted to EPFs. You need the ENFs to get regenerative healing. The question then is, how far from the scar do you find the ENFs. Like what is the range of ENF-EPF convertion during scarring? It probably wont be a problem since you can remove alot of skin, but it would be usefull knowledge if you would have to cut away some more skin in addition to the scar in order to remove the EPFs and get to the ENFs that have not been converted.
I do not have the knowledge. Like it is possible that ENFs are simply still close,around the scar. That some ENFsdo not convert.But It doesnt say anywhere whether that is true or not, so that led to my curiosity
1 minute ago, Ivvan said:Verteporfin should work on wrinkles too, they could remove wrinkled skin andregenerateit asa new wrinklefree skin.
It would be great to remove both wrinkles/fine lines and scars.
I think the main concern here is getting rid of scars.
8 minutes ago, Shelly399 said:I think the main concern here is getting rid of scars.
The main concern is both because we got old from waiting so long for scarless healing.
20 minutes ago, Ivvan said:Verteporfin should work on wrinkles too, they could remove wrinkled skin andregenerateit asa new wrinklefree skin.
It would be great to remove both wrinkles/fine lines and scars.
I don't think so. Wrinkles are mostly caused by fat loss in the deep hypodermis layer of the skin, the fat bags basically shrink once we age.
What scarless regeneration would mean is regeneration of dermis, since epidermis regenerates itself. (It might regenerate hypodermis in causes of severe burns as well). But I'm not so sure about the fat pads regenerating under hypodermis.
P.S - I could be very well wrong though, since I'm not in the medical field and all my knowledge of this scarless healing is obtained by internet.