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14 minutes ago, MyBeautifulScars said:Unfortunately, the website hasn't been updated for a while. They did add a few pics about using the gel on a full thickness wound and how it healed. The healed wound shows hair and hypopigmentation, scarring is present also but that can be hypopigmentation. My feeling is that pre-clinical trials should have ended by now but complications happened along the way.
Where are the new pictures?Sunogel update the formation of their website but they didn't update the content.
15 hours ago, MyBeautifulScars said:Actually, you need to understand how the skin works. It has 3 layers. If the epidermis is injured, there is no scarring. The you have the dermis, most cuts extend to the dermis. And finally, you have the hypodermis or subcutaneous fat layer. You see hair follicles and pores actually lie on the surface of the hypodermis. So, many scars do actually contain hair follicles and pores because the injury didn't go any deeper than the dermis.
Ahh i see , so it depends on the level of skin damage , if it isn't so severe a pore will still be present.
11 hours ago, MyBeautifulScars said:Unfortunately, the website hasn't been updated for a while. They did add a few pics about using the gel on a full thickness wound and how it healed. The healed wound shows hair and hypopigmentation, scarring is present also but that can be hypopigmentation. My feeling is that pre-clinical trials should have ended by now but complications happened along the way.
Healthy human skin contains pores and hair follicles. Any wound above 1.5-2 mm depth leads to scarring, it goes deep well into the dermis and touches the hypodermis. Some people get scars even from just injuring the epidermis. I have a hard time believing that excising 4 mm of scarred skin in depth will not generate another visible trace.
The appearance of human scars depend on genetics. Some people barely have any after hearing while most people get nasty ones. I for once get linear hypertrophic scars that fade over time from red raised bundles of collagen to slightly raised white linear lines or patches.
They have photographic evidence though??? I hear what your saying but i am literally going with the evidence and so far 6% of participants did have some scarring. But not disfiguring scarring etc. So yes that is properly the genetic variable being shown in that 6%. It™s not the depth only, but the diameter of the wound that in more important. For example stick a pin in your full thickness skin. You won™t see a scar unless your prone to keloids etc. But them people are excluded from the trial due to that genetic variable.
ps that is erythema in the pic. So it might not be for you in that case, but for people like me it looks promising.
20 hours ago, nikki_gargin said:They have photographic evidence though??? I hear what your saying but i am literally going with the evidence and so far 6% of participants did have some scarring. But not disfiguring scarring etc. So yes that is properly the genetic variable being shown in that 6%. It™s not the depth only, but the diameter of the wound that in more important. For example stick a pin in your full thickness skin. You won™t see a scar unless your prone to keloids etc. But them people are excluded from the trial due to that genetic variable.
ps that is erythema in the pic. So it might not be for you in that case, but for people like me it looks promising.
Would this work for diabetics ? , because people that might have a genetically predisposed to diabetes are slower at healing from wounds .... regards xx.
On 10/9/2019 at 12:17 AM, nikki_gargin said:Yeh there are restrictions on the trials.Read their patent might say on there specifically
I read it ,but again i don't think it would be an issue , if you have type 2 diabetes it can be controlled ,it's all a question of diet and lifestyle ( anyone can get type 2 ) .... type 1 however is anotherconcern ( genetic , also excessive high glucose to the point of shutting the immune system down and insulin production )
High glucose in your blood can be controlled , i think it wouldrefer to type 1 diabetics ( where the immune system is adversely effected permanently ).
Every Human being can get type 2 diabetes though a terrible diet .... i think type 1is the genetic one.
Is this the case ?.
Also what needs to be considered is age.
Now we need to understand as we get older our ability to heal is compromised , so when scarless healing becomes a reality , would age matter ? , would any condition matter ? ( including type 1 diabetes ) , because after all scarless healing is just that , healing without scar , and most important to all of us on here getting rid of scars .....
18 hours ago, Lip121212 said:Hi everyone, I haven't been on here awhile, but I was wondering if there is any updates with Sunogel or FS2? I emailed Dr. Sun on LinkedIn today to check to see how things are rolling out in preclinicals.
Fantastic , well done .... the sooner the better.
51 minutes ago, AlexZ77 said:There was a study about older people and wound healing and they found out that the older you are the less fibrosis they isin wounds. So i think age doesnt matter, it might work better for older people
Kinda ironic if you think about it , as you get older you heal slower than when you're younger ..... great news for older people ....
As far as microcoring , i think it'd work on someone with diabetes , however with slow healing it would take longer for someone to achieve the desired results ....
I contacted Sunogel regarding if has technology if successful would work on scar and wounds on diabetics, apparently from what i got from his massage it would work on all wounds and scars theoretically ( if his jello works that is , as after all it's still in pre clinical phase ) , so i don't think diabetes would be relevant.
Apologies if i keep going on about diabetes , as people become more susceptible of it as we all get older , and we know it's going to take a couple more years until scarless healing is a reality.
An interesting article , current scar treatments , including what the future holds for regeneration of skin.
On 10/9/2019 at 8:56 AM, Lip121212 said:Hi everyone, I haven't been on here awhile, but I was wondering if there is any updates with Sunogel or FS2? I emailed Dr. Sun on LinkedIn today to check to see how things are rolling out in preclinicals.
Hello, did Dr.Sun reply to you?
On 10/9/2019 at 10:26 PM, AlexZ77 said:There was a study about older people and wound healing and they found out that the older you are the less fibrosis they isin wounds. So i think age doesnt matter, it might work better for older people
Yes also I just thought, devices like recros Medica and cytellis have begun their studies with older participants in which the claim no scarring. (Except 6% of people). But going on from what your saying, I wonder wether the older people get these results because of this fact as well. Really need to see the scar trials to know if its really is for us. I have a deep fibrotic scar so for me I dont see it being a problem if I get a bit of scarring tbh. Those with more subtle scarring might be concerned with replacement scarring.
On 10/11/2019 at 5:17 PM, nikki_gargin said:Yes also I just thought, devices like recros Medica and cytellis have begun their studies with older participants in which the claim no scarring. (Except 6% of people). But going on from what your saying, I wonder wether the older people get these results because of this fact as well. Really need to see the scar trials to know if its really is for us. I have a deep fibrotic scar so for me I dont see it being a problem if I get a bit of scarring tbh. Those with more subtle scarring might be concerned with replacement scarring.
Then this studymakes even more sense, but it bet if it really works it will give us the same scarless results.
No company wound invest heavy money on skin treatment that would work only on very old people
17 hours ago, AlexZ77 said:Then this studymakes even more sense, but it bet if it really works it will give us the same scarless results.
No company wound invest heavy money on skin treatment that would work only on very old people
They have very good investment and one them has a massive German investor. So clearly they expect it to make a good return.
On 10/11/2019 at 11:17 AM, nikki_gargin said:Yes also I just thought, devices like recros Medica and cytellis have begun their studies with older participants in which the claim no scarring. (Except 6% of people). But going on from what your saying, I wonder wether the older people get these results because of this fact as well. Really need to see the scar trials to know if its really is for us. I have a deep fibrotic scar so for me I dont see it being a problem if I get a bit of scarring tbh. Those with more subtle scarring might be concerned with replacement scarring.
Hey Nikki Gargin,
Where did you get the 6% of people info on scarring. Im researching microcoring and wanted to know if that came from a specific source. Is it for Cytrellis or recros medica? Thanks in advance
On 10/7/2019 at 2:53 AM, MyBeautifulScars said:Accutane is dangerous and messes up with the whole way your body functions. Unfortunately, there is no other way to treat cystic acne or its severe forms at this time.Sometimes,these cysts may not be acne.Folliculitis tends to form carbuncles which reach deep into the hypodermis. Wether you decide to goon Accutane or not, extensive damage has alreadyoccured to the skin. How the skin heals and the amount of scarring depends on genetics.
Microcoring is just another gimmick to pray on the vulnerable. It will take many treatments to get that smooth face if ever. If people have the resources, then it is an improvement over laser treatments I believe.
As for fat grafting, this procedure is slowly being phased out. The fat gets absorbed over months by the body because it treats it as something foreign. Skin fillers have been introduced to replace fat grafting. Many dermatologists are also using subcission. Unfortunately with subcission, the scar bonds tend to return over time unless you use a filler.These procedures are dangerous and if not done properly can make everything look worse. Most of these procedures do not work with ice pick scarring which are those tiny puncture holes. Most of us have this form of scarring. The only method that cam get you some improvement is TCA cross or excision. Excision is practiced less and less because a hypertrophic scar tends to form. You exchange the hole for a bigger raised angry looking scar.
Bottom line is that if you have cystic acne, you must accepts thatscarring will follow. Your skin will never be the same again and forever bear the marks of acne on your face.
Current procedures offer little to no improvement for scarring. Some people are quite fortunate enough to get significant improvements.
The medical community has been quite slow in studying the true causes of cystic acne and acne in general. They have many theories and even blame testosterone as the culprit. Yet many adult women seem to suffer more and more.
In my opinion, acne has something to do with food. All these conservation agents seem to make certain bacteria to proliferate.
Scarless healing can only be achieved when they figure out how to regrow severed limbs until then we can stare at our facial pits all day.
I dont understand when you say microcoring is another gimmick but then follow up by saying it will take many treatments to possibly achieve smooth skin? How is it a Gimmick?
If it takes several treatments to eliminate scarring then honestly who gives a shit, I know i wouldn't. Its minimal downtime anyway. Its the most promising treatment on the horizon I believe because the concept is clever yet simple. The big questions are depth of scar for coring to completely remove the unwanted tissue and accuracy. Most acne scars are tethered down by fibrotic tissue creating that soft undulating appearance. The idea behind Microcoringis simple, to excise that scar tissue that causes both the tethered down indentation and the poor texture and allow the healthy skin to close up gradually over treatments.
Most of us have never had such a treatment that will genuinely remove the problem causing the appearance we hate. All treatments Ive had this past decade have been based on disruptive methods to the underlying scar tissue or temporary camouflage methodsand Ibet you are all the same. If it really does excise without scarring (and it has already shown so with laxskin patients who dont have scars anyway) then ill be making an appointment when its available but again there are questions to be answered on scar depth and accuracy.
On 10/12/2019 at 12:17 AM, nikki_gargin said:Yes also I just thought, devices like recros Medica and cytellis have begun their studies with older participants in which the claim no scarring. (Except 6% of people). But going on from what your saying, I wonder wether the older people get these results because of this fact as well. Really need to see the scar trials to know if its really is for us. I have a deep fibrotic scar so for me I dont see it being a problem if I get a bit of scarring tbh. Those with more subtle scarring might be concerned with replacement scarring.
Do you think micro core rings can be used for narrow and deep scars?
On 10/14/2019 at 7:40 PM, hopfullady said:Hey Nikki Gargin,
Where did you get the 6% of people info on scarring. Im researching microcoring and wanted to know if that came from a specific source. Is it for Cytrellis or recros medica? Thanks in advance
Recros medica the 6% And it was in their studies I believe or their presentation.
1 hour ago, DinkumFridge said:Do you think micro core rings can be used for narrow and deep scars?
The needles can go various depths, and narrow is most likely better than wide at least. You would need to see a professional for a real answer though.
On 10/15/2019 at 1:12 PM, Sniffy said:I dont understand when you say microcoring is another gimmick but then follow up by saying it will take many treatments to possibly achieve smooth skin? How is it a Gimmick?
If it takes several treatments to eliminate scarring then honestly who gives a shit, I know i wouldn't. Its minimal downtime anyway. Its the most promising treatment on the horizon I believe because the concept is clever yet simple. The big questions are depth of scar for coring to completely remove the unwanted tissue and accuracy. Most acne scars are tethered down by fibrotic tissue creating that soft undulating appearance. The idea behind Microcoringis simple, to excise that scar tissue that causes both the tethered down indentation and the poor texture and allow the healthy skin to close up gradually over treatments.
Most of us have never had such a treatment that will genuinely remove the problem causing the appearance we hate. All treatments Ive had this past decade have been based on disruptive methods to the underlying scar tissue or temporary camouflage methodsand Ibet you are all the same. If it really does excise without scarring (and it has already shown so with laxskin patients who dont have scars anyway) then ill be making an appointment when its available but again there are questions to be answered on scar depth and accuracy.
If you have the funds and patience to undergo 100x treatments to remove a scar, than by all means go ahead.
3 hours ago, MyBeautifulScars said:If you have the funds and patience to undergo 100x treatments to remove a scar, than by all means go ahead.
Patience? ....ummmm...People have been waiting for what seems like their entire life with no real solution on the table. People lurk on this forum for years waiting for something positive to give them some hope. Are we really getting so picky these days that it needs to be a magic cream that cost $2.99 over the counterthat breaks the dreaded curse. I understand we all have different circumstances be it financially or work/lifestyle balance but for the amount of dedication many of us have poured into this I cant imagine we would continue coming back here praying for something better if we actually have something that works. You could invest your dollars into something that works or wait more years in hope.
I dont know what the cost per treatment may end up being and how many treatments it would take to remove a small scar but they are not going to make it unreasonable or unrealistic for people to get this treatment for scars if it works. Its poor strategy to over price it if it takes 100 sessions as you say which we know is an exaggeration.
If they remove 25% of the scar in one treatment or even 10% then where do you get 100 from? Im doing the math...people gothrough 4-6 treatments with Laser for almost no change,nowthat's a gimmick.
Considering many acne scar sufferers have been through Laser programs and coughed up thousands then they will probably cough up the same amount or even less to actually remove the problem forever if the results we hope for are favorable. If your a long time poster or Lurker here then Patience should not be an issue, we just want something that works.
If it takes 12 months or more of treatments spaced every 8 weeks with minimal downtime to gradually reach your goal then is that really going to deter people. Id think not...
4 hours ago, Sniffy said:Patience? ....ummmm...People have been waiting for what seems like their entire life with no real solution on the table. People lurk on this forum for years waiting for something positive to give them some hope. Are we really getting so picky these days that it needs to be a magic cream that cost $2.99 over the counterthat breaks the dreaded curse. I understand we all have different circumstances be it financially or work/lifestyle balance but for the amount of dedication many of us have poured into this I cant imagine we would continue coming back here praying for something better if we actually have something that works. You could invest your dollars into something that works or wait more years in hope.
I dont know what the cost per treatment may end up being and how many treatments it would take to remove a small scar but they are not going to make it unreasonable or unrealistic for people to get this treatment for scars if it works. Its poor strategy to over price it if it takes 100 sessions as you say which we know is an exaggeration.
If they remove 25% of the scar in one treatment or even 10% then where do you get 100 from? Im doing the math...people gothrough 4-6 treatments with Laser for almost no change,nowthat's a gimmick.
Considering many acne scar sufferers have been through Laser programs and coughed up thousands then they will probably cough up the same amount or even less to actually remove the problem forever if the results we hope for are favorable. If your a long time poster or Lurker here then Patience should not be an issue, we just want something that works.
If it takes 12 months or more of treatments spaced every 8 weeks with minimal downtime to gradually reach your goal then is that really going to deter people. Id think not...
Agreed , and laser actually ruins skin tissue , that's what happened to me , my whole face is bad skin texture and scarring , i would pay hundreds of thousands to have the skin i use to have , no scars , there is hope apart from Micocoring , but if microcoring works to remove scars , then that would make me happy.
On 10/17/2019 at 3:04 PM, Sniffy said:Patience? ....ummmm...People have been waiting for what seems like their entire life with no real solution on the table. People lurk on this forum for years waiting for something positive to give them some hope. Are we really getting so picky these days that it needs to be a magic cream that cost $2.99 over the counterthat breaks the dreaded curse. I understand we all have different circumstances be it financially or work/lifestyle balance but for the amount of dedication many of us have poured into this I cant imagine we would continue coming back here praying for something better if we actually have something that works. You could invest your dollars into something that works or wait more years in hope.
I dont know what the cost per treatment may end up being and how many treatments it would take to remove a small scar but they are not going to make it unreasonable or unrealistic for people to get this treatment for scars if it works. Its poor strategy to over price it if it takes 100 sessions as you say which we know is an exaggeration.
If they remove 25% of the scar in one treatment or even 10% then where do you get 100 from? Im doing the math...people gothrough 4-6 treatments with Laser for almost no change,nowthat's a gimmick.
Considering many acne scar sufferers have been through Laser programs and coughed up thousands then they will probably cough up the same amount or even less to actually remove the problem forever if the results we hope for are favorable. If your a long time poster or Lurker here then Patience should not be an issue, we just want something that works.
If it takes 12 months or more of treatments spaced every 8 weeks with minimal downtime to gradually reach your goal then is that really going to deter people. Id think not...
I had laser in a scar. Swear it made it worse. I just remember this gut feeling my skin didnt like it. Needling however is completely fine. My doctor now doesnt even own a laser, say needling works just as well if not better with none of the same risks.