Acne.org Products
Combination therapy with folic acid and methionine in the prevention of retinoic acid-induced cleft palate in mice.
lol something like this
oysters?
no taurine
i got a couple supplements to try this weekend. cant have anything messing up my friday though. gona do some meth(ionine) and or some of this kilo of glycine I got laying on the table. I m pretty sensitive so il know pretty quick if this shit is good or bad for me.
right now im gona do a beer been looking at this stuff for wayyyy too long
On 1/26/2016 at 2:34 PM, marlin15 said:wow super high testosterone? you're libido is dead? I on the other hand have levels of about 400 and im 21. Doctor doesn't want to do anything about it but i'm miserable. thinking about ordering online.and yes I have tried every single possible way to get it up naturally. And the test was first thing in the am on a fasted state.
No my libido is amazing (but erection quality/blood flow/tissue health etc) are not pre accutane levels. The skin especially looks sorta weird and i have more visible blue veins.
400 should not cause symptoms if SHBG and e2 are normal. If it does then its a lack of DHT. I would try to supplement with DHT (proviron) before going for test (since both are illegal without prescription you might as well go for the non injection kind first)
People here (including me) have used prescription testosterone injections without any good results. I purposefully did a double dose for a while to see if it would be better, it didnt..
On 1/26/2016 at 3:00 PM, tryingtohelp2014 said:did you get a methylmalonic acid test? serum b-12 by itself doesnt confirm anything.
I think and if not ill do it unless its expensive. Ive done nearly all relevant blood tests by now, private or standard medical stuff. I'll look for it (prob has a different name in my language so i might have skipped it)
I agree that people should read it but it fills up so much space pasting studies. It doesnt really help ppl to read it cuz they cant make anything out of it. What helps is the most important sentences and your theories to what to do about it.
On 1/27/2016 at 2:04 AM, guitarman01 said:what about and ige type blood test that would maybe show something related to allergy? someone else here said they tested high.
anyone have this test that came back negative or normal?
The Pfeiffer Treatment Center identifies two different supplement regimes depending on if you are an "over-methylator" or an "under- methylator." These are VERY rough estimations and nothing concrete...they may not be accurate either; further research is needed.
Q: How can you find out if you are over or under?
A: Histamine levels may be a good indicator of whether someone is an over or under-methylator.Low histamine points to over-methylator: If your histamine level is low you are probably an over-methylator (according to Pfeiffer research). This means that many supplements would be detrimental to him (those containing methyl). These would include taurine, GABA [both precursors to methyl activity in the brain], folic acid, B12, B6, DMG, TMG (and SAMe) - to name a few.
Q: What test checks histamine levels?
A: There is a blood test to measure histamine. Your pediatrician can do it.Have we looked at the other end of the spectrum?
Overmethylation (Histapenia): Too much methyl (a carbon group with three hydrogen atoms). It is very active in the brain, and too much leads to œtoo much of a good thing. This causes an overproduction of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine in the brain. In many cases, high serotonin levels can cause psychological problems including reduced motivation, reduced libido, weight gain, and confusion.
This is what I was talking about earlier and maybe why it was the Folate that possibly gave me a limp di*k
Methylation is a bitch to understand based on symptoms, even testing makes it hard. Best indicators are just the SAM/SAH ratio and folate levels. (My doc who is really into methylation says for some reason undermethylators tend to have really high serum folate despite not taking much of it, but reason for that is anyones guess)
One of the biggest labs (private) in my country stopped providing methylation panels because they are nearly useless and cost a bunch. They still provide sam/sah ratio which i have tested. Waiting for results.
Folate causes a bunch of issues for me but not limp dick..
Histamine is also hard to make anything out of, as its such a versatile thing in our body (neurotransmitter for example), my doc has never ever had even the ppl who nearly die from dietary histamine or allergies test positive on a histamine intolerance test. And serum histamine is not a great indicator either 
Rich Van Konyenburg (rip) did write up quite a long text on folate and accutane, indicating we need methylfolate (but probably just normal doses)
All i can say so far is that SAM-e makes me feel great and b12/folate has nothing very noticeable in well being and folate has a bunch of side effects. (Methylfolate)
On 1/27/2016 at 3:22 AM, guitarman01 said:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12221207Hepatic glycine N-methyltransferase is up-regulated by excess dietary methionine in rats.
ok so this. too much methionine is bad?
I should probably stress the fact that we are not rats so it makes it difficult to draw conclusions based on rats who have not taken accutane.
But a lot of methionine is not that great anyhow. But i would assume we need more of it, especially in the form of SAM-e
And on the other hand apparently a lot of glycine is not good.
It is fked up enough to figure the body out in a healthy state, figuring out what to do about the accutane related biological things is even tricker
On 1/27/2016 at 5:25 PM, tryingtohelp2014 said:High folic acid consumption leads to pseudo-MTHFR deficiency, altered lipid metabolism, and liver injury in mice.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25733650
CONCLUSIONS:
We suggest that high folic acid consumption reduces MTHFR protein and activity levels, creating a pseudo-MTHFR deficiency. This deficiency results in hepatocyte degeneration, suggesting a 2-hit mechanism whereby mutant hepatocytes cannot accommodate the lipid disturbances and altered membrane integrity arising from changes in phospholipid/lipid metabolism. These preliminary findings may have clinical implications for individuals consuming high-dose folic acid supplements, particularly those who are MTHFR deficient.
folic acid is not folinic (food form) or methylfolate so that study is rubbish
On 1/28/2016 at 8:02 AM, macleod said:Nice tunes guitarman. I like what you bring to the thread. And for a bit more levity, how about this? 112 wpm. Not bad for a tane brain, eh?
thats impressive, i did 93 on my first try with a mechanical keyboard
20 hours ago, guitarman01 said:Speaking of that. What was one of the first side effects you noticed after accutane. Long time ago I know. But was it facial flushing? I think mine was. Clues... My hair didn't fall out till after this I believe. My eyes didn't become sensitive till much later. I didn't even have to wear sunglasses for a long time
I wish i remembered the time it came in, it was probably something like this: dry everything, joint pain, unconcious mind anxiety (ie avoiding social stuff/school without really knowing why), gynecomastia, libido went away/limp dick, cold body, weight loss, hair loss, suicidal depression, more anxiety/gut problems/other problems, more of those problems and then after a while a complete bedridden fatigue crash.
3 years later a bunch of more symptoms showed up but many of the symptoms are fixed. Depression is very mild, joint pain is gone, hormones are fixed, anxiety is slightly better but not a lot, fatigue is better but still nowhere near normal etc. Some stuff got worse (heart issues) and some got better. (Probably due to time and now living a massively changed lifestyle)
11 hours ago, guitarman01 said:you guys have mentioned histamine type reactions quite a few times I still wonder about vitamin C. i look at my arm hair and its broken and damaged. bent, curled whatever you want to call it. why in the hell does this persist? anyone try vitamin c injections?
go for liposomal vitamin c
Sorry, been pretty busy recently.
As of now I couldnt recommend 1.5m IU over a few days, or the dosages before that as well, with the main symptom against being reduced endurance/ cardiovascular fitness.
I tried that around the 20th December, and still do not feel 100% recovered.
The I believe having so much Vitamin A gave me anaemia, most likely due to the imbalance in all my fat soluble vitamins, in particular vitamin E, but no doubt the others as well. I also am still getting sunburnt relatively easily, and any resulting tan I do get is fading quite quickly.
The symptoms I feel have improved include brain fog, joint pain and libido, and that is why I don't 100% regret the experiment at this point, and I hope in another few months my body will be healthier than ever.
The main reason I regret the experiment is because I am planning to take sport seriously this year, and having pseudo-anaemia contradicts that goal.
I posted recently but got no response so I'll try again just in case someone knows more about this product.
"Alpha Lipoic Acid" - It is known to extend the life of antioxidant nutrients C and E, as well as the enzyme Q10. So in our Vit A ravaged bodies this sounds like a good thing in terms of stabilising correct??
It also targets free radicals both water and fat soluble - I know our issues extend beyond this but again I'm looking at stabilising some of my conditions rather than expecting a flat out instant cure from what I'm taking.
If anyone knows more about ALA please share your thoughts!
1 hour ago, TrueJustice said:I posted recently but got no response so I'll try again just in case someone knows more about this product."Alpha Lipoic Acid" - It is known to extend the life of antioxidant nutrients C and E, as well as the enzyme Q10. So in our Vit A ravaged bodies this sounds like a good thing in terms of stabilising correct??
It also targets free radicals both water and fat soluble - I know our issues extend beyond this but again I'm looking at stabilising some of my conditions rather than expecting a flat out instant cure from what I'm taking.
If anyone knows more about ALA please share your thoughts!
dont know much about it even though I got a bottle sitting in the house.it could be helpful for dryness combined with c,e and q10.those were all actually used in a study to combat accutane side effects while people where on the drug. correction actually i think it was gamma acid or some omega 6. I posted the link not too long ago. also grape seed extract was used
so have we tried a little higher dose methionine? I feel like our side effects are so vague and come and go. good/bad days and maybe have slowly gotten worse it has to be some sort of deficiency we are not aware of.
methionine lowers histamine in the blood.
we get enough to stay borderline healthy. maybe we just need a bit more?
i look at amazon and nobody buys methionine lol
it looks like more cats use it then humans
3 hours ago, guitarman01 said:4 hours ago, TrueJustice said:I posted recently but got no response so I'll try again just in case someone knows more about this product."Alpha Lipoic Acid" - It is known to extend the life of antioxidant nutrients C and E, as well as the enzyme Q10. So in our Vit A ravaged bodies this sounds like a good thing in terms of stabilising correct??
It also targets free radicals both water and fat soluble - I know our issues extend beyond this but again I'm looking at stabilising some of my conditions rather than expecting a flat out instant cure from what I'm taking.
If anyone knows more about ALA please share your thoughts!
dont know much about it even though I got a bottle sitting in the house.it could be helpful for dryness combined with c,e and q10.those were all actually used in a study to combat accutane side effects while people where on the drug. correction actually i think it was gamma acid or some omega 6. I posted the link not too long ago. also grape seed extract was used
Thanks for the feedback. I believe that Gamma lipoic Acid is Evening Primrose Oil, I tried this but didn't have any noticeable results.
I'm assuming that Alpha Lipoic Acid is completely different even though you'd be excused for mistaking these two different supplements.
Thanks for reminding me about Grape Seed Extract - I might look at this next.
2 hours ago, Luke89 said:FYI:
Don't use methionine if you have liver disease.
Is this everyone who's taken Accutane?? I wouldn't have a clue if I have liver disease. I've had a test that indicated high enzyme count - I took Milk Thistle, got another liver function test that came back saying everything was normal after that. Like most of us who've had tests done, everything usually comes back normal. I'd actually welcome a test that pinpointed something wrong, at least than I'd have something to go off for dealing with all these issues!!
Note: After all the science info over the last few pages, what's the verdict on supplementing with Methionone and Taurine. A couple of pages back everyone was advocating Taurine supplements, then one of the reports said that the liver produces heaps of Taurine when on Accutane??
Based on that, I'd have to conclude that Taurine is a no go correct??
1 hour ago, TrueJustice said:Thanks for the feedback. I believe that Gamma lipoic Acid is Evening Primrose Oil, I tried this but didn't have any noticeable results.
I'm assuming that Alpha Lipoic Acid is completely different even though you'd be excused for mistaking these two different supplements.Thanks for reminding me about Grape Seed Extract - I might look at this next.
Is this everyone who's taken Accutane?? I wouldn't have a clue if I have liver disease. I've had a test that indicated high enzyme count - I took Milk Thistle, got another liver function test that came back saying everything was normal after that. Like most of us who've had tests done, everything usually comes back normal. I'd actually welcome a test that pinpointed something wrong, at least than I'd have something to go off for dealing with all these issues!!Note: After all the science info over the last few pages, what's the verdict on supplementing with Methionone and Taurine. A couple of pages back everyone was advocating Taurine supplements, then one of the reports said that the liver produces heaps of Taurine when on Accutane??
Based on that, I'd have to conclude that Taurine is a no go correct??
Taurine levels are depleted by those who take accutane, because it is good at regulating retinoids levels, so your body tries to deal with the streas Accutane puts it using lots of it, and post accutane levels can be quite low
Kinda like when you get an infection it's not the white blood cells that are bad, even if production of those increase due to the infection.
Thats how I see it at least
all we can really do is try different supplements and see how we/you respond taurine is no different some feel pretty good about it, makes sense when fit into the certain scheme of things. For me Ive tried it from time to time and believe it might have gave me some kind of reflux even at moderate doses could be bile reflux. but we are all different in how we respond
Has anyone made any solid progress going down the methylation pathway?
I've just contacted a practitioner who specialises in mineral analysis, have had a test done and it seems I am incredibly high in copper.
He has suggested detoxing this out through zinc and a few other supplements and at the same time working on methlaytion pathways using a supplement called TMG.
My guess is that for each of us who has suffered from accutane we have each had undermethylation as a genetic fault.
This prevented our livers from being able to detox the accutane properly. And previously why we had such bad skin as our livers could not detox anything properly hence the acne.
From there I believe the accutane stored in the liver caused a estrogen dominance which concurrently increased copper.
Copper is known to causes a whole bunch of symptoms, including what I awoke to this morning bleeding gums. This was a result of the antagonistic effect it has on vitamin c, resulting in some form of scurvy in my case. ( my diet as of late has been shocking and I have not had a nutritious meal in quite a few days, at least not what I should be having as I am constantly so depleted. )
- I have multiple symtpoms here that link up to copper toxicity and a general vitamin / mineral deficiency but what ever.
This copper toxicity coupled with a still poor methlaytion cycle is what I beleive is causing all these problems in us.
I havent read this thread in a long time, only the last few pages but who has done what in terms of methylation and perhaps copper/hair mineral analysis?
Here are my results btw
.
methionine is suppose to bind metals. also from wiki There is some evidence that alpha-lipoic acid (ALA) may work as a milder chelator of tissue-bound copper.[22]Alpha lipoic acid is also being researched for chelating other heavy metals, such as mercury.
What kind of test was this? if it was serious I would think there would be serious medical treatment. Could still point to clues though.
5 hours ago, koikoi123 said:Has anyone made any solid progress going down the methylation pathway?
@koikoi123- thanks for posting up your results! I've read about copper toxicity a number of times regarding people suffering from 'tane sides, but also people who have/are prone to acne seem to often have high copper levels, but probably not that high. Looking at the symptoms of excessive copper levels they certainly tie in with many of the issues people are suffering from, specifically those related to 'brain fog' and neurological sides.
Issues with methylation is probably the root cause of our copper toxicity (assuming most/all tane suffers have this). Apparently chapter 2 in this book gives a very good detailed description of methylation (the book is actually on autism, but chapter 2 covers methylation in detail);
[Edited link out]
Great that you got testing done though. I really think people would be better spending their money on testing like this rather than rushing out buying a load of supplements all the time.
So these two studies say, if we have a problem in our livers, we could also have a problem converting the methionine from our diets into the metabolites needed to raise GSH and taurine. The ONLY way around this is with SAM-E. it can be fixed. the two studies show 1.2 grams per day and 2.0 grams per day. Additionally, by administering taurine during the same day, this will allow our bodies to make GSH from the cysteine generated by the SAM-E, instead of everything else. it has a sparing effect.
Mechanisms and consequences of the impaired trans-sulphuration pathway in liver disease: Part II. Clinical consequences and potential for pharmacological intervention in cirrhosis.
The liver is actively involved in the metabolism of the sulphur-containing essential amino acid, methionine. Methionine is transformed into S-adenosyl-L-methionine (SAMe) and then into sulphur-containing metabolites (cysteine, taurine and glutathione) via the trans-sulphuration pathway. Liver disease may affect the trans-sulphuration pathway and decrease the clearance of methionine, which leads to increased fasting methionine concentrations in blood and reduced formation of cysteine and glutathione. There is evidence that this defect, located at the level of SAMe-synthetase, may cause nutritional defects and contribute to negative nitrogen balance whenever non-essential sulphur-containing amino acids are not supplied in adequate amounts. In addition, cirrhotic patients may be at increased risk of hepatotoxicity after treatment with substances which are detoxified via glutathione. The SAMe-synthetase block may be overcome by administration of oral or intravenous SAMe, which improves the fasting amino acid profile and increases the hepatic glutathione concentration. Controlled studies on long term SAMe treatment in patients with cirrhosis are needed to confirm this possible beneficial effect.
S-adenosyl-L-methionine: its role in the treatment of liver disorders.
S-Adenosyl-L-methionine (SAMe) exerts many key functions in the liver, including serving as a precursor for cysteine, 1 of 3 amino acids of glutathione--the major physiologic defense mechanism against oxidative stress. SAMe is particularly important in opposing the toxicity of free oxygen radicals generated by various pathogens, including alcohol, which cause oxidative stress largely by the induction of cytochrome P4502E1 (CYP2E1) and by its metabolite acetaldehyde. SAMe also acts as the main methylating agent in the liver. The precursor of SAMe is methionine, one of the essential amino acids, which is activated by SAMe-synthetase (EC 2.5.1.6). Unfortunately, the activity of this enzyme is significantly decreased as a consequence of liver disease. Because of decreased utilization, methionine accumulates and, simultaneously, there is a decrease in SAMe that acquires the status of an essential nutrient and therefore must be provided exogenously as a supernutrient to compensate for its deficiency. Administration of this innocuous supernutrient results in many beneficial effects in various tissues, mainly in the liver, and especially in the mitochondria. This was shown in alcohol-fed baboons and in other experimental models of liver injury and in clinical trials, some of which are reviewed in other articles in this issue.
[Edited link out]
RTFIT : A SYNERGISTIC COMBINATION -
Both Racemethionine and Taurine are concentrated in liver. When taurine is used up for metabolic reactions, it is biosynthesized from methionine. Thus methionine is used up in this process. Supplementation of taurine reduces the need for conversion of methionine to taurine thus allowing methionine for its other important functions of liver protection.
Remember, accutane is only expelled in one of two ways from our bodies... either in a taurine conjugate or a GAG based glucuronic conjugate.
A Patent mentioning all of these aminos and b vitamins for GAG formation:
Aminosugar, glycosaminoglycan, and S-adenosylmethionine composition for the treatment and repair of connective tissue
http://www.google.com/patents/US6271213
So current best practice now is...
1200mg SAM-E with IP6 (this stabilizes the SAM-E, and enhances hyaluronic acid production)
Taurinetakensublingually significantlyenhances absorption
Supporting:
methylB12
B6 as P5P
TMG
NAG best form of glucosamine... supports all mucous membranes/intestines.
well two take aways then, glad I just took all this methionine and I wish SAM-e was a hella lot cheaper at this high of dosage.
But its one supplement ive never really taken in the past not thinking it was related to accutane. this was before the whole gnmt, methylation theories came out. I actually threw a couple unused boxes away awhile ago. that was probably a lot of money. ah well maybe wallgreens has a 2 for 1 special.
So whats the difference here? I know people have tried sam-e in the past and there were a bunch of people that shot down the whole methylation theory years ago on this forum. So is the main difference just the higher dosage of Sam-e and sticking with it for at least a few months?
and also is straight glycine left out of the equation? wasn't that also related to an overactive GNMT? it being used up
so here is what im doing.. i will try to be as clear as i can
1 hour Before Breakfast:
400mg SAM-E (Natures made brand)
1 dropper full of pure Taurine liquid 50mg sublingual.
1 hour Before lunch:
400mg SAM-E
500mg IP6, Inositol Hexaphosphate
2000mg powdered Taurine dissolved in coffee or water
Right before bed:
400 mg SAM-E
1 dropper 50 mg Liquid Taurine
With any meal 1x a day
1000mg TMG powder dissolved in bottled water
700Mg NAG( N-Acetyl Glucosamine)
5mg Manganese
1000mg sublingual methylB12
25mg P5P
Diet rich in sulfur containing aminos: egg whites,broccoli,cauliflower,onoins. and pumpkin seeds.
btw my liver and blood tests came back. the only thing out of the normal range was bilirubin 1.8 (normal range: .2 -1.2)
Serum B12 400 range (200-1200)
waiting on methylmalonic test results.
48 minutes ago, tryingtohelp2014 said:waiting on methylmalonic test results.
Look into getting plasma methionine checked as well.
I would also supplement phosphatidyl choline.
http://www.allergyresearchgroup.com/lipophos-edta-liposomal-phospholipids-60-ml-2-fl.-oz.
High bilirubin = clogged liver
Oh, and I just got tested again for Lyme. I'm CDC positive.
On 1/31/2016 at 5:16 AM, yetanotheraccutanevictim said:Look into getting plasma methionine checked as well.
I would also supplement phosphatidyl choline.
http://www.allergyresearchgroup.com/lipophos-edta-liposomal-phospholipids-60-ml-2-fl.-oz.High bilirubin = clogged liver
Oh, and I just got tested again for Lyme. I'm CDC positive.
no need,
If im right... the SAM-E and TMG( by sparing effect) should increase thephosphatidyl choline by itself. through PEMT regulation and providing the methyl groups. plus im trying to keep this protocol as simple as possible to figure out which causes which.
from the two above mentioned studies, plasma methionine could be misleading... it could be deficient... or it could be high due to our livers not having the enzyme to break it down to what we need.
http://jn.nutrition.org/content/136/12/3005.full
Phosphatidylcholine is an essential phospholipid that is synthesized by 2 different pathways, the CDP-choline pathway and the methylation of phosphatidylethanolamine by phosphatidylethanolamineN-methyltransferase (PEMT). Recent studies have suggested that PEMT is an important consumer of methyl groups fromS-adenosylmethionine (SAM) and is a major determinant of homocysteine pools. Diabetes and all-trans-retinoic acid (ATRA) have been shown to alter the activities of several enzymes involved in methyl group metabolism.
ive had high bilirubin tests for 20 years btw. i think this is it.
Pharmaceutical-gradeSAMecomes in two forms -tosylate and a newer, more stable form called butanedisulfonate. Only Nature Made and GNC sell the new butanedisulfonate version, but several U.S. retailers import reliable tosylate products.
[Edited link out]
Interesting paper here on how probiotics could act as therapeutics of bile acid dysmetabolism;
- A growing body of evidence indicates that a pathological imbalance in the gut microbial community can result in altered microbial bile acid (BA) metabolism and act as an environmental factor associated with disease
- VSL#3 administration increases fecal BA excretion which was correlated with increased bile salt hydrolase (BSH) transcription and enzymatic activity in feces
- several studies have shown that BSH-active probiotic strains delivered orally to humans [6] and pigs [7] result in a significant increase in the unconjugated BA pool
There have been 2 recent reports of finasteride recoveries with antibiotics to tackle parasites, potentially the result of finasteride destroying specific good bacteria in the gut, and allowing these parasites to flourish. The first person who recovered via this method also used various probiotics, including VSL #3, as referenced int he above studies.
[Edited link out]
13 hours ago, koikoi123 said:Has anyone made any solid progress going down the methylation pathway?
I've just contacted a practitioner who specialises in mineral analysis, have had a test done and it seems I am incredibly high in copper.
He has suggested detoxing this out through zinc and a few other supplements and at the same time working on methlaytion pathways using a supplement called TMG.
My guess is that for each of us who has suffered from accutane we have each had undermethylation as a genetic fault.
This prevented our livers from being able to detox the accutane properly. And previously why we had such bad skin as our livers could not detox anything properly hence the acne.
From there I believe the accutane stored in the liver caused a estrogen dominance which concurrently increased copper.
Copper is known to causes a whole bunch of symptoms, including what I awoke to this morning bleeding gums. This was a result of the antagonistic effect it has on vitamin c, resulting in some form of scurvy in my case. ( my diet as of late has been shocking and I have not had a nutritious meal in quite a few days, at least not what I should be having as I am constantly so depleted. )
- I have multiple symtpoms here that link up to copper toxicity and a general vitamin / mineral deficiency but what ever.This copper toxicity coupled with a still poor methlaytion cycle is what I beleive is causing all these problems in us.
I havent read this thread in a long time, only the last few pages but who has done what in terms of methylation and perhaps copper/hair mineral analysis?
Here are my results btw
.
Yes, it seems a lot of us have too much copper going on post accutane. Apart from what you've listed my doctor said to also take Moly Zinc - it's actually stated on bottle that it's used to rid body of excess copper.
Unfortunately I took all these supplements and didn't notice any difference in how i felt which would suggest that it's not the only problem we have going on in our bodies. At least it's one area you can work on - best of luck!!
On 1/31/2016 at 6:46 AM, tanedout said:Interesting paper here on how probiotics could act as therapeutics of bile acid dysmetabolism;
- A growing body of evidence indicates that a pathological imbalance in the gut microbial community can result in altered microbial bile acid (BA) metabolism and act as an environmental factor associated with disease
- VSL#3 administration increases fecal BA excretion which was correlated with increased bile salt hydrolase (BSH) transcription and enzymatic activity in feces
- several studies have shown that BSH-active probiotic strains delivered orally to humans [6] and pigs [7] result in a significant increase in the unconjugated BA pool
There have been 2 recent reports of finasteride recoveries with antibiotics to tackle parasites, potentially the result of finasteride destroying specific good bacteria in the gut, and allowing these parasites to flourish. The first person who recovered via this method also used various probiotics, including VSL #3, as referenced int he above studies.
http://www.allthingsmale.com/community/threads/2-new-recoveries-w-same-protocol.26219/
i have a round of antibiotics sitting around the house for a 7 day treatment but its not those
I just have no idea why or how this would work or pertain to theirs and ours side effects
not advertising but have you guys looked into this form of hyaluronic acid supplements? they are suppose to be more effective and better absorbed?
http://www.amazon.com/Hyalogic-Chewable-Lozenge-Cartilage-Health/dp/B00B5N51DM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1454195320&sr=8-1&keywords=hyaluronic+acid+lozenges
Superiority of a Lozenge
Topical HA creams and serums can be an ideal choice for hydrating the skin and reducing the signs of aging. But when it comes to oral supplementation, a lozenge form of HA is the best choice because it helps preserve the molecular weight, and thus the activity, of the HA molecule.
When HA of high molecular weight reaches the stomach, it is broken down into smaller, less effective fragments by the acidic environment.28Capsules containing solid HA powder are designed to work in the stomach. However, absorption of high molecular weight HA via the stomach is limited and HA administered via this route would be expected to be less effective.29
The most effective delivery of HA is via the mucous membranes, including the lining of the mouth, tongue and gums. The mucous membranes of the mouth offer high numbers of receptors to attract and bind the HA, as well as the necessary vascularization to receive the HA molecule once it is pulled through the membranes via the receptors. Extending the time that the HA molecule remains in the mouth via formulation into a lozenge extends the time allowed for absorption and increases the effectiveness of the HA.
[Edited link out]
I can provide some insight to a lot of the supplements mentioned above, though of course, results area bit vague.
-Hyaluronic acid 100mg, daily for a year or so. off and on for about 2 - 3 years: Tendons still pop n snap (mainly right rotator cuff with was partially injured in 2012), joints still click from time to time, but hardly any pain, very manageable and I feel I have a good deal of cartilage left. Whether or not this supp has helped...can't confirm or deny.
- Alpha lipoic acid 250mg, on and off for a year or so.
- Cysteine 500mg, on and offfor a year or so.
- Grape seed extract, on and off for a year or so.
^ those four antioxidants have helped a great deal relieve inflammation of my pancreas. very noticeable that I don't have any pancreatitis when I take those. Whether or not they have helped with tane sides, can't confirm nor deny. The cysteine helps with constipation and gets your digestive system running. Also, the hyaluronic acid when you first start it. Expect to go to the bathroom until your body adjusts.
- Tianeptine 10mcg for one month.
When you first start, it's noticeable, a bit of a jolt in brain processing. Body adapts and you hardly notice anything when you take it. Surprisingly, after just that one month treatment, I can say I have very little anxiety, I can converse with strangers, and really not anxious in public anymore. However, daily apathy and slight depression remains.
Taurine - I have been doing 1g of taurine for about 2 months now daily. It also helps with digestion similar to the cysteine.
SO, in conclusion. My intracranial pressure remains (tinnitus, papildema, etc), my night blindness remains, my apathy and slight depression remains, erections still at 85%. Sympathetic nervous system still feels a bit shaky and overproducing.
I think that I still have hyper or hypo vitaminosis A issues. And I don't think these antioxidants will cure that. I would like to begin vitamin A treatment once I get medical insurance again for at the very least cure my night blindness, and who knows, maybe the brain fog and depression resolves.
I will say though, that besides those tane sides, as far as health is concerned, I am running 4-5 miles every other day, and for all intents and purposes, I think if i were tobe blood tested, I would bedeemed heatlhy. It's just the brain fog/depressionthat has me feeling like an indifferent robot and that is by far the worst side that I'd like to rid. And of course the bodies ability to heal, which is stunted, and in my opinion what leaves us vulnerable to so many diseases and health issues.
14 minutes ago, macleod said:I can provide some insight to a lot of the supplements mentioned above, although naturally it is a bit vague.
-Hyaluronic acid 100mg, daily for a year or so. off and on for about 2 - 3 years: Tendons still pop n snap (mainly right rotator cuff with was partially injured in 2012), joints still click from time to time, but hardly any pain, very manageable and I feel I have a good deal of cartilage left. Whether or not this supp has helped...can't confirm or deny.
- Alpha lipoic acid 250mg, off and on for a year or so.
- Cysteine 500mg, off and on for a year or so.
- Grape seed extract, off and on for a year or so.
^ those four antioxidants have helped a great deal relieve inflammation of my pancreas. very noticeable that I don't have any pancreatitis when I take those. Whether or not they have helped with tane sides, can't confirm nor deny. The cysteine helps with constipation and gets your digestive system running. Also, the hyaluronic acid when you first start it. Expect to go to the bathroom until your body adjusts.
- Tianeptine 10mcg for one month.
When you first start, it's noticeable, a bit of a jolt in brain processing. Body adapts and you hardly notice anything when you take it. Surprisingly, after just that one month treatment, I can say I have very little anxiety, I can converse with strangers, and really not anxious in public anymore. However, daily apathy and slight depression remains.
Taurine - I have been doing 1g of taurine for about 2 months now daily. It also helps with digestion similar to the cysteine.
SO, in conclusion. My intracranial pressure remains (tinnitus, papildema, etc), my night blindness remains, my apathy and slight depression remains, erections still at 85%. Sympathetic nervous system still feels a bit shaky and overproducing.
I think that I still have hyper or hypo vitaminosis A issues. And I don't think these antioxidants will cure that. I would like to begin vitamin A treatment once I get medical insurance again for at the very least cure my night blindness, and who knows, maybe the brain fog and depression resolves.
I will say though, that besides those tane sides, as far as health is concerned, I am running 4-5 miles every other day and for all intents and purposes could be blood tested and deemed heatlhy. It's just the brain fog/depressionthat has me feeling like an indifferent robot and that is by far the worst side that I'd like to rid.
Thanks for the info here. Is the Tianeptine something you can take long term? I'm always a bit worried about taking mood enhancement stuff for short periods of time. Also i think it's time I re-investigated taking hyaluronic acid - Baxyl was something I got excited about a few years ago but I didn't get much out of it, might look at some of these other forms/brands.
I'm also currently exercising more which helps greatly with brain fog and overall sluggishness - that indifferent robot feeling I know all about, totally sucks feeling that way especially when you need to perform at work and in social circumstances. Talk about having to be resilient - I need all my willpower sometimes to get over how accutane makes me feel.