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'Omega-3 fatty acids can reduce insulin-like growth factor 1 in healthy humans.' from the article in Ndnromeo's signature.
Anyone got any views on:
1. Does exercise really increase GF1?
2. Does reducing GF1, via fish oil, cause you to grow less in height?
3. Does reducing GF1, via fish oil, cause your ability to add muscle, to lower?
I mean are there ANY disadvantages anyone has come up with for taking fish oil?
Also a question concerning the 6:3 ratio.
Is the problem that we have too high amounts of omega 6 and not enough omega 3, or is it merely that the ratio is too far out.
In other words: Does it matter if you remain having the same amount of omega 6 aslong as you take enough omega 3 to achieve a 1:1 ratio? Or is it the actual volume of all that omega 6 that causes the problem?
Hope that is understandable.
Also a question concerning the 6:3 ratio.Is the problem that we have too high amounts of omega 6 and not enough omega 3, or is it merely that the ratio is too far out.
In other words: Does it matter if you remain having the same amount of omega 6 aslong as you take enough omega 3 to achieve a 1:1 ratio? Or is it the actual volume of all that omega 6 that causes the problem?
Hope that is understandable.
I really believe the problem is more of having too much omega 6 than too little omega 3. Although there is no agreed upon quantity, the reality is not much of either is really considered "essential". Supplementing with omega 3 definitely will help even the scale, but the more I read, the more I realize its the excess o6 and even trans fat in the diet that gets replaced in the cells where there should be o3.
Up until the last 100 years or so, oils in the diet weren't that common as there weren't as good of methods to extract oils from seeds, etc. The USDA has recorded we consumed 7g / day of linoleic acid (parent o6) in 1912, up to 25g / day in 1985, and probably a lot more today. Despite the fact that meanwhile our saturated fat intake has decreased somehat, heart disease, etc. has increased. Also, all our livestock grazed much more naturally on grass and greens that contain ALA o3 which will essentially get passed through the food chain. For example, there is one theory that ONE of the reasons for lower heart disease in Mediterranean countries is yeah olive oil is good, but their animals (even their chickens and their eggs had more o3) graze more naturally consuming more grass and even green weeds with higher o3 than the grains the US is feeding most livestock. Also, the consumption of fish is greater. This research was from the 80s though, so I don't know if this is still accurate today.
I just woke up right now and will respond to everyone in full but I finally see the light at the end of the tunnel. Everyone, please read this.
I have a means to measure how deficient I am with omega 3's in my body.
I have another symptom
An astonishing one in three people have a condition called keratosis pilaris, which is rough skin on the back of the arms that feels like goosebumps. It's caused by extra keratin accumulating in the hair follicles. Sometimes it can affect the back and chest and, in less common forms, the face and eyebrows too. In extreme cases it's sore and itchy.# But good news is you can get rid of it through a change in diet. It's a fatty acid deficiency so you need to eat more oily fish.
It's on the back of my arms. It is literally like small acne, it's rough to the touch, but isn't sore like acne is. It's basically where the hair tries to escape but gets stuck because of the extra keratin production (same reason why we tend to have acne (extra keratin and extra sebum)).
This past week or so when I finally increased my dosage to four grams, daily it has been shrinking, there is no NEW keratosis pilarsis marks, and the ones left are going away. And the skin on the back of my arms is getting smoother, and smoother.
The first month that I was only on 1.8 grams, there really was no difference.
After all the research and putting 2 and 2 together this is why I believe so.
It's apparent that we have an omega 3 deficiency over the past XX years of our lives. Any deficiency that great takes months worth of change to get back to where we should be.
When we over compensate in the beginning, we can bring ourselves back to equilibrium within a couple of months rather than 6+ months.
That is why I know now how taking 4 grams is absolutely necessary as to how fast it starts acting.
It's almost a miracle right now, to see the back of my arms have only one, or two bumps left on both arms, and the rest blemishes. The rest are just skin colored bumps that I am sure that are just less severe ones.
But the good news is this is working, please keep at it.
This Keratosis Pilarsis is like my omega 3 meter. I am still in deficit, but not too far away from equilibrium. Once it gets to equilibrium, one more month will bring it to optimal body levels.
The updates should be coming in faster now.
Keep going guys, keep going.
I'll be back after washing/showering.
Hey guys, back again. I continue to somehow experiment with my fish oil bottle as opposed to taking it on a set schedule, as I've sort of been facing some setbacks. In these past couple of days of taking fish oil caplets (usually 4-6 a day) as I've been sitting down in my chair using my PC I've been falling asleep with the quickness, not even 12 hours after waking up and having a decent 7-8 hours a sleep the night before. I don't recall ever having this much trouble staying awake while browsing my PC, but I feel it may have something to do with the fish oil. Is this a sign of lightheadedness??? Today I've also felt slight throbs coming off the side of my head, but they don't really hurt or last more than a few seconds. Is this also a sign of lightheadedeness???Also of note that I've been taking 5000mg aloe vera softgels along with the fish oil capsules to help me digest as of late because I find that I don't visit the toilet as often as I'd like and uh.............don't leave as much of a mess as I feel I should considering the amount of stuff I've been eating as of late. Is this harmful, to take them alongside fish oil??? Only other pills I take alongside fish oil are my leftover B100 caplets.
I would stop the B100 capsules if I were you, and reduce the omega 3. Just wait till you feel okay again, it may be that your BP is getting too low because your body is not accustomed to it. Go to a local pharmacy and use those free machines that check your blood pressure. But don't take the B100 capsules just because, and if you don't need the aloe vera, don't take those, but I am not sure if it does anything against you. Just take a step back to keep checking on what's going on and be cautious. Don't take any more for sure and lessen up for a while till you feel okay.
Let me know how that goes.
'Omega-3 fatty acids can reduce insulin-like growth factor 1 in healthy humans.' from the article in Ndnromeo's signature.Anyone got any views on:
1. Does exercise really increase GF1?
2. Does reducing GF1, via fish oil, cause you to grow less in height?
3. Does reducing GF1, via fish oil, cause your ability to add muscle, to lower?
I mean are there ANY disadvantages anyone has come up with for taking fish oil?
Also a question concerning the 6:3 ratio.
Is the problem that we have too high amounts of omega 6 and not enough omega 3, or is it merely that the ratio is too far out.
In other words: Does it matter if you remain having the same amount of omega 6 aslong as you take enough omega 3 to achieve a 1:1 ratio? Or is it the actual volume of all that omega 6 that causes the problem?
Hope that is understandable.
I really can't answer the question about GF1 levels, but currently that's the least of your worries as once your body gets to a surplus of omega 3, that all won't matter as much. But not too sure.
our problem is that we are not at a 1:1 ratio or anywhere close. And the reason we need to over compensate is so we can get close to 1:1 as fast as possible. Once we are, we can reduce our dosages (theoretically, I will test this out in time but it's starting to look this way).
There are no disadvantages to taking fish oil, except if overdosed, it can lower blood pressure too low and can cause stroke, so as long as your BP is okay, you should be 100% okay. You can tell by the way you feel, if you feel dizzy, weak, etc, it may be too low, but you will know when that happens for sure.
i just wanna know 1 thing do i have to keep taking 4 grams or does it work like b5 where u take alot then slowly lower the dosage ??Thanks
You can eventually lower the dose when you reach your desired benefits.
Again, don't take 4 grams on the first day, and don't reduce it all at once either when you reach your goal.
Also a question concerning the 6:3 ratio.Is the problem that we have too high amounts of omega 6 and not enough omega 3, or is it merely that the ratio is too far out.
In other words: Does it matter if you remain having the same amount of omega 6 aslong as you take enough omega 3 to achieve a 1:1 ratio? Or is it the actual volume of all that omega 6 that causes the problem?
Hope that is understandable.
I really believe the problem is more of having too much omega 6 than too little omega 3. Although there is no agreed upon quantity, the reality is not much of either is really considered "essential". Supplementing with omega 3 definitely will help even the scale, but the more I read, the more I realize its the excess o6 and even trans fat in the diet that gets replaced in the cells where there should be o3.
Up until the last 100 years or so, oils in the diet weren't that common as there weren't as good of methods to extract oils from seeds, etc. The USDA has recorded we consumed 7g / day of linoleic acid (parent o6) in 1912, up to 25g / day in 1985, and probably a lot more today. Despite the fact that meanwhile our saturated fat intake has decreased somehat, heart disease, etc. has increased. Also, all our livestock grazed much more naturally on grass and greens that contain ALA o3 which will essentially get passed through the food chain. For example, there is one theory that ONE of the reasons for lower heart disease in Mediterranean countries is yeah olive oil is good, but their animals (even their chickens and their eggs had more o3) graze more naturally consuming more grass and even green weeds with higher o3 than the grains the US is feeding most livestock. Also, the consumption of fish is greater. This research was from the 80s though, so I don't know if this is still accurate today.
Some good info there BigBeauty.
And thanks Ndnromeo for your informative reply.
I don't have KP but i believe my 'meter' is my milia.
I have been taking .9 grams of omega 3 for the past few months so from today i've upped it to 1.8 grams (3 caps twice a day).
In a weeks time i will up it to 2.7 grams and in another week i will up it to 3.6 (4 caps 3 times a day) and see how that is.
from me going from 6 pills to 8 to 12 I've broken out a lot and I really don't know what has attributed to me having such a big breakout before I had never had such a big break out in god knows how long. But after increasing my dosage of fish oil it seems to have affected my skin ><;; ekkk I look horrible now.
from me going from 6 pills to 8 to 12 I've broken out a lot and I really don't know what has attributed to me having such a big breakout before I had never had such a big break out in god knows how long. But after increasing my dosage of fish oil it seems to have affected my skin ><;; ekkk I look horrible now.
Here's some questions:
What else are you taking? Also, what contributed it to the break out? Do you have lots of dead skin, or lots of oil being produced? Did you slip up on anything else?
Also, are you allergic to fish? Or have any known allergies to any of the ingredients? If so, switch to liquid.
Now, how fast did you increase your dosage? Tell me everything from day 1.
from me going from 6 pills to 8 to 12 I've broken out a lot and I really don't know what has attributed to me having such a big breakout before I had never had such a big break out in god knows how long. But after increasing my dosage of fish oil it seems to have affected my skin ><;; ekkk I look horrible now.
how is your sugar consumption?
are you at about 30 grams or lower a day?
there may be a chance the oils were rancid and oxidized and therefore ineffective.
also check and see that you are at around a 1:1 ratio of o6:o3
Omega 3s are the most unstable, putting them into a pill and having them sit on a shelf is risky business, pay for high quality fish oil its worth every pennie knowing that you are not paying for crap. besides taking it for acne, it may be the best health investment that money can buy, next to taking resveratrol.
if you get fish burps from your pills they are bad, good fish oil doesnt really smell like anything and the bad stuff smells kinda fishy.
Off wiki:
'This necessitates that omega-3 and omega-6 be consumed in a balanced proportion; the ideal ratio of omega-6:omega-3 being from 3:1 to 5:1. Studies suggest that the evolutionary human diet, rich in seafood, nuts and other sources of omega-3, may have provided such a ratio.'
I was under the impression that we were aiming for a 1:1?
Thoughts?
Off wiki:'This necessitates that omega-3 and omega-6 be consumed in a balanced proportion; the ideal ratio of omega-6:omega-3 being from 3:1 to 5:1. Studies suggest that the evolutionary human diet, rich in seafood, nuts and other sources of omega-3, may have provided such a ratio.'
I was under the impression that we were aiming for a 1:1?
Thoughts?
Well, no one knows for sure what the ratio was in the ideal or evolutionary diet and of course it varied depending upon location and the food that was available to various people. Also, these ratios generally refer to the ratio of omega-6:omega-3, not omega-6:fish oil or more specifically omega-6 to EPA+DHA (the type of o3 from fish). The ratio of omega6:(EPA+DHA) would probably end up much higher towards o6 if other meats and green leafy veggies were consumed which both contain mainly ALA.
The whole idea of matching your omega 6 intake to fish oil was pretty much derived here in this thread with no scientific evidence pretty much as a misunderstanding myself included. However, it probably can't hurt to do this at least initially as the main benefits of o3 for acne are probably related to the EPA/DHA and not as much to ALA.
Off wiki:'This necessitates that omega-3 and omega-6 be consumed in a balanced proportion; the ideal ratio of omega-6:omega-3 being from 3:1 to 5:1. Studies suggest that the evolutionary human diet, rich in seafood, nuts and other sources of omega-3, may have provided such a ratio.'
I was under the impression that we were aiming for a 1:1?
Thoughts?
That's just for general health, getting close to 1:1 and not at 1:1. We over compensate in the beginning because we need to make our ratios better faster. It will take 6 months + otherwise if taken at low doses.
http://www.omega3sealoil.com/Chapter3_1.html
Plus, taking it at 4 grams will not only help get to the perfect ratio faster, it will allow for optimal health if taken at that level, even more so than just balancing it, but going over on the omega 3 side, it doesn't allow for any of the omega 6 related defenerative diseases to ever show up:
If you are wondering what they are =)
http://www.omega3sealoil.com/Chapter3_2.html
There's lots of them
Just remember what exactly 4 grams does =) It's optimal yet not excessive.
One of the reason they recommend 1:5 etc is because for most people, it's unlikely they would get at 1:1 because of our diets, and it's not feasible for most people to want to take 4 grams a day. :think:
Also, for particular curative causes, we need a different dosage, as most everything is depending on what you are taking it for =)
I've just read quite a lot of this thread and am really excited to try taking the fish oil & green tea supplements. Does anyone know of a good make of fish oil available in the UK?
Hi,
That's still a topic that will need to be covered by other members. I don't live there so it's hard to say.
Check back through the last 5 or so pages, some members recommended some from there. I think a place called boots. I can't recall, check it out.
If you find some good deals, paste them here so I can put it in the main post for people who are not from the U.S.
I've just read quite a lot of this thread and am really excited to try taking the fish oil & green tea supplements. Does anyone know of a good make of fish oil available in the UK?Hi,
That's still a topic that will need to be covered by other members. I don't live there so it's hard to say.
Check back through the last 5 or so pages, some members recommended some from there. I think a place called boots. I can't recall, check it out.
If you find some good deals, paste them here so I can put it in the main post for people who are not from the U.S.
Yeah Boots will sell them, if someone doesn't go there before i do, i'll let you know whats there cos im planning on picking some up myself.
Off wiki:'This necessitates that omega-3 and omega-6 be consumed in a balanced proportion; the ideal ratio of omega-6:omega-3 being from 3:1 to 5:1. Studies suggest that the evolutionary human diet, rich in seafood, nuts and other sources of omega-3, may have provided such a ratio.'
I was under the impression that we were aiming for a 1:1?
Thoughts?
the ideal ratio is obviously in dispute, but its somewhere in between 4:1 - 1:1 o6-o3
but for therapeutic purposes its a good idea to aim for a 1:1 for like three months then go to a 1:4 for long term or whatever you think is good. its whatever you think will work best for your situation and whats makes sense to you. Nobody here is a doctor but some of us may be more well read then some doctors.ha.
I was taking cod liver oil liquid.. I am going to begin taking it again, and also work my way up to a higher dose after reading this thread.. I currently add Hemp Protein Powder into my Protein shakes which I feel helps my skin very much. To my understanding it has a good balance of Omega 6s to Omega 3s.. Is there a problem with using this in conjuction with the fish oil as far as Omega 6s go?? Please explain..
Thanks alot, great post.
I was taking cod liver oil liquid.. I am going to begin taking it again, and also work my way up to a higher dose after reading this thread.. I currently add Hemp Protein Powder into my Protein shakes which I feel helps my skin very much. To my understanding it has a good balance of Omega 6s to Omega 3s.. Is there a problem with using this in conjuction with the fish oil as far as Omega 6s go?? Please explain..Thanks alot, great post.
We get too many omega 6's in our diet without doing anything so focus on just omega 3's.
If you take cod liver oil, you will be limited since you also need to find out the upper level intake of the vitamins which come in cod liver oil and you shouldn't overdose on those. I believe it's vitamin A or D, hence just taking fish oil is best. Because if you take up to x amount in omega 3's from cod liver oil, chances are you may put yourself at risk of ODing on vitamin A and D which is bad.
If you start out with a balance of omega 3 to 6, it could take up to 6 months or even more to get at a balance, hence over compensating in the beginning is necessary, as it will get to it much quicker (in a couple of months, rather than many months). Plus there is a particular reason for taking 4 grams, rather than just balancing, as balancing omega 3 to 6 is good, but for our cases not best (for a particular cause).
Hope that makes sense.
Hi guys n gals,
Really interesting thread, so interesting that i joined up just to post. I'm ready to add omega 3 to the long list of things i've tried to get my long running war with acne under control! However, I don't really fancy going for such a high dose - as many people have pointed out before, I feel that megadoses of anything isn't that advisable or safely sustainable.
With that in mind I'm wondering if I can take a lower overall dose of Omega 3 and still see good benefits. I'm curious if EPA is more effective than DHA or if it doesn't matter. As a fair amount of research points towards EPA having more benefits (not acne related research) i'm starting with a higher dose of that (6.6:1). I'm going to be trying 2000mg omega 3 (1740mg EPA, 264mg DHA) a day (just 3 capsules).
I just wondered what everyone else thought about this? Most of the capsules i see mentioned here have a 2/1.5:1 ratio, which is good if both are needed in fairly even quantity, but bad if only one is needed (especially if DHA turned out to be more important). Maybe i've missed the whole point in that they are both essential fatty acids?
Sorry if this has been asked/discussed before, but this thread has become extremely long and rambling...still full of useful information and points of view, just a bit hard to digest!
Dave
I thought I'd introduce myself here. I'm currently 35 and have suffered from acne since I was 16. I've been on accutane twice. I was off of accutane in the middle part of 2001.
I've been breaking out a lot more recently, w/ some cystic acne on my neck and near my jaw line. The "stage coach" started turning back into a "pumpkin" so to speak. I do have to wear a shirt and tie to work, so I attribute some of my acne to the irritation I experience wearing a starched shirt and shaving.
I was taking fish oil for the past couple of years to help aid in maintaining my blood pressure. I then switched to flaxseed oil in December of 06 and continued to use it until about a week ago. When I made the switch to Flaxseed I wasn't really breaking out that bad. Just a couple of pimples here and there. During February & March, I noticed that I was breaking out a little bit more and my acne started to become cystic. I never made any correlation that the fish oil might have kept the more severe acne at bay.
This is what intrigued me about this thread. Great information to all of those that contributed and continue to contribute btw. I've been taking fish oil now for a little over a week and have noticed that the amount of my cystic acne subsided. Instead of having several rise up at one time, I've only got one that I'm currently dealing with. I've still got the little "reminders" on my face from a couple of weeks ago, but they're slowly beginning to fade.
Anyway, I'm taking 9 1200mg capsules of fish oil along w/ multivitamins, milk thistle, & garlic pills to maintain my overall health. I saw a thread about the green tea extract capsules and have since ordered a couple of bottles to add to my supplement regimen.
In my opinion, I don't think this will make my skin perfect by any means. But should keep the acne to a tolerable level for me. I'm just hoping for the best like everyone else.
So far it seems to be working. I'll chime in from time to time to let you know how things are going.
-Charles
Hey dave, and charles,
I read your posts, but I will reply by this evening, so check back and bare with me 
Sorry for the delay, I'm in the midst of procrastinating for my accounting exam.
This is a bit strange for me because the last time I had my accounting mid term, I had just started taking fish oil. Now it's been 2 months down the line and I am almost clear.
I'll reply back soon! Thanks for your replies!