Update: So it has been over 4 months since I stopped accutane. Normally I'd start seeing a lot of bumps form after 2-3 months when I stop accutane, but so far everything has been clear (knock on wood).
My routine consists of using Benzoyl Peroxide on my scalp. I then shave my head with a 2 bladed razor using barbosol aloe shaving foam. I then rinse my head with water and then apply isopropyl alcohol on my scalp using cotton balls. It may sting if you have sores, especially if you cut them. I then apply "High Time: Dare to be Bald" scalp lotion with tea tree oil 30 minutes after I shave. I also shave once every other day and only use the same razor for two shaves (when first starting, I'd use a clean one each time until your scalp clears). One other thing I do is eat a raw clove of garlic each day. Not sure if that is helping since I did all of this stuff at once... I also don't drink alcohol anymore and eat slightly less dairy, mostly cutting milk (still eat pizza and the occasional yogurt and doesn't seem to cause anything). I didn't cut sugar or gluten either...
If you can, I'd go on accutane for a bit, then shave your scalp when it clears. I may look weird being bald at 26, but I feel so much better. It can be a pain to shave every other day (I do it at night, since there is more time) but once you get into a routine, it's fine.
Edit: There is still some redness on the back of my neck, but no bumps are forming.
Hi,
do you have any updates? I hope you are doing well!
I have been battling against this condition (my scalp looks very similar than yours) for many years. I have tried everything (yes diet....)and spent a lot of money....it is so stressful and many times I feel so fed up about that!
I have been taking a low dose of accutane, 10 or 20 mg per week, for three years. So far blood tests showed no health problems but it is scary to rely on this terrible drug for the rest of my life. Unfortunately I dont have any other solutions!!!
i am waiting for the science and the pharmaceutical industry....so I have to wait till my death or a miracle for that 0
sorry for my bad English
This condition is most likely caused by a fungus - candida or malasezzia. Try applying clotrimazole antifungal cream. Get back to me if that does not solve the problem, and I can provide more targeted information.
The fungal problem is caused by taking antibiotics and some other meds, and possibly by taking accutane.
This condition is caused by genetic pathology - your skin on scalp produces too much sebum. This is the root of the issue. Fungal, bacterial infections lives andcause inflammation in your scalp only because ofsebum overproduction. For now, the only way to decrease sebum production is to use Roaccutane.I am surprised by the dosage and schemesthat your doctors suggest to you.
MyRoaccutane scheme: 100mg/kg of body weight. My weight is 72kg, so I should get 7200mg. Daily dosage during the first month - 20mg, rest of the period 30mg per day. Course length is 243 days.The purpose of the course- to reduce the activity of the sebaceous glands forever.
Patient and othes
Head "acne" is caused by fungus - either candida (if itchy or painful but no dandruff) or maasezzia (if dandruff). Fungal acne on the head or elsewhere is caused by taking antibiotics and some other meds, possibly including roccutane (it is NOT genetic).
Roccutane can clear malasezzia fungal acne for a while, and then it comes back "with a vengeance". Roccutane makes candida fungal acne worse.
If you have head "acne" use an antidandruff shampoos, avoid sweating, and rub antifungal lotion (clotrimazole or other antifungal lotion) onto your scalp. If you have dandruff, also apply terbenafine antifungal lotion (Lamisil spray or similar) to your scalp.
If these don't work, get back to me and I can provide more targeted information for your condition.
1 hour ago, Aussie Scientist said:Patient and othes
Head "acne" is caused by fungus - either candida (if itchy or painful but no dandruff) or maasezzia (if dandruff). Fungal acne on the head or elsewhere is caused by taking antibiotics and some other meds, possibly including roccutane (it is NOT genetic).
Roccutane can clear malasezzia fungal acne for a while, and then it comes back "with a vengeance". Roccutane makes candida fungal acne worse.
If you have head "acne" use an antidandruff shampoos, avoid sweating, and rub antifungal lotion (clotrimazole or other antifungal lotion) onto your scalp. If you have dandruff, also apply terbenafine antifungal lotion (Lamisil spray or similar) to your scalp.
If these don't work, get back to me and I can provide more targeted information for your condition.
Head acne is caused by a fungus??!! Yes, but not always!Sometimes the cause is bacterial or something else (see many people who clear their skin/scalps with antibiotics...)
you are writing everywhere that everyone has fungal acne...base on what? Online diagnosis?
I didnt take accutane or antibiotics before and yet I have scalp folliculitis. My sister, in a much less degree, has the same problems. We both have very oily skin.
dont get me wrong Aussie scientist I am not angry with you, I only wanted to clarify what I think.
Penthotal
Thanks for your post. It is good to make me think.
I agree that some head acne can be caused by bacteria. I should have said that MOST head acne is caused by fungus.
The reasons that I emphasise fungal skin problems are (i) they are very common (based on extensive reading of the scientific literature and my own observations) and they are almost totally ignored by doctors., and (ii) applying antifungal cream or lotion or antidandruff shampoo is very safe and cheap, and is the best way to determine whether one has fungal skin problems or not.
Fungal skin problems are usually caused by taking antibiotics and some other meds, but they can also be caused by heat and sweat and overuse of moisturisers.
Taking antibiotics and/or accutane (both of which are dangerous) can seem to control some fungal skin problems for a while, and then the fungus "comes back big time".
Applying topical antifungal treatment is cheap and safe. So, if one has on-going skin problems, and unless one has a staph skin infection (which has characteristic features and IS dangerous) or one is an adolescent ,ie, most likely to have ordinary acne) it is best to apply topical antifungal treatments BEFORE trying more dangerous treatments.
Have you tried treating your head "acne" with antifungal lotion/s and antidandruff shampoos ?
Malasezzia fungus (which causes dandruff and fungal acne) feeds on the oils in people's skin.
Aussie Scientist,
I tried an antifungal treatment (including topical and system) and it doesn't help at all. Today is my 19th day on Roaccutane (20mg per day) and my scalp is almost clear, I am extremely satisfied with the results (attached before and today photos).
Aussie Scientist,
Some additional info about my condition:
- I have very oily scalp skin (before Roaccutane, ha-ha)
- I don't have dandruff
-Pus examination (not sure it's the right term) shows that I have Enterobacter Aerogenes bacteria
9 hours ago, Penthotal11111 said:
Head acne is caused by a fungus??!! Yes, but not always!Sometimes the cause is bacterial or something else (see many people who clear their skin/scalps with antibiotics...)
you are writing everywhere that everyone has fungal acne...base on what? Online diagnosis?
I didnt take accutane or antibiotics before and yet I have scalp folliculitis. My sister, in a much less degree, has the same problems. We both have very oily skin.
dont get me wrong Aussie scientist I am not angry with you, I only wanted to clarify what I think.
Your sister has a lower testosterone level (which is OK) that's why she has lower skin issues.
8 hours ago, Aussie Scientist said:and they are almost totally ignored by doctors.,
Because of doctors understood that it's not the root cause of patient's skin issues.
On 1/4/2019 at 12:53 PM, BeyondTheChosen said:
What You all doing is Madness= Doing the same thing again and again expecting different results
The answers we seek are closer then we think. Specifically within post #2 by Laridma
The pattern which emerges from this entire forum is s a repetitive weaving which threads together the error of our methods.
All have tried antibiotics, it helps for it bit, once they stop taking it, the strain of acne comes back with twice the severity and infection. Topical applications, soaps, and all forms of chemically based producsts seem to only work temporarely until the problem builds an immunity to this temporary solution and fights back.
------------------------------------------------------------
The answer is not within what is being applied to the outside of your skin,
Its whats going on inside of your body which is causing a reaction inside the skin to manifest as various kinds of acne in the external surface of the skin.
You are all trying to cure the symptom, but are not getting to the root cause of this reaction happening within. It is true that acne may be various forms of bacteria, fungi, hormonal, allergies, etc.
However head acne is not like any regular acne and it seems to be more of an allergic reaction to something being consumed by the body. Laridma in post #2 of this forum seem to have solve the riddle to this festering type of acne. all of you have failed, but he has succeeded. no blame tho, its always worth exploring every other solution extensively to the point of exaustion. after all, what may not work for you, may work for some one else.
But in this case, it seems like every one else have the head acne resurfacing regardless of antibiotics, creams, cleansers, shampoos, etc. My own research in this subject is as Laridma suggest. Its a dietary issue involving glutin sensitivity which is a form of protein which certain digestive enzymes can not properly decompose in the stomach, so glutin proteins not being able to be broken down causes an allergic reaction in the body of the consumer.
The affects of this allergic reaction to glutin is alarmingly vast, from
adrenal dysfunction, to
vitamin absoprtion abstruction,
depression,
rashes
constempation
joint inflamation
Studies have yet not found direct correlation between folliculities and glutin sensitivity, but all reports from personal experiences seem to suggest a cause and effect relationship between the body being unable to process this certain proteins, then braking out in acne. for what ever reason, some individuals seem to sufffer from keratosis chicken skin while others get severe head acne.
Laridma states, that when ever he eliminates carbs (rice, grains, bread, ryes, etc) it goes away, but when ever he eats carbs, it comes back. the body needs carbs, no doubt.
but you should all eliminate carbs coming from grains, ryes, breads, rice, etc because this is where glutin protein are founed. get carbs from more wholesome sources like sweet potatoes, vegetables, beans, etc.
In short, many of you or all of you may be suffering from celiac disease which is the inability to break down glutin proteins. which now adays is perefectly normal because after decades of processed chemically alterated food, the body is starting to respond back and our immune system is attacking what does not belong there.
A CHANGE OF DIET IS WHAT WILL ASSURE A LONG TERM SOLUTION TO ANYONE SUFFERING FROM SCALP FOLLICULITIS OR EVEN CHICKEN SKIN SYNDROME. ELIMINATE GLUTIN FROM YOUR LIFE, AND THEN APPLY SOME OF THE ABOVE MENTIONED TOPICALLY APPLIED METHODS TO COMPLIMENT A FULL BODIED REMEDY AGAINS YOUR HEAD ACNE. HEAL YOUR BODY FROM THE INSIDE WHILE CURING IT ALSO FROM THE OUTSIDE.
IF YOUR FOLLICULITIS KEEPS COMING BACK, ITS BECAUSE YOUR TREATING THE SYMPTOM, BUT NOT THE ROOT CAUSE OF WHATS CAUSING YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM TO REACT IN SUCH WAY.
I wish the best to everyone for I know this can be a very irritating problem, but if your all willing to put th work in to make some life habit changes, it will pay off beyond gettting rid of your folliculitis. such changes will also benefit the body, mind and individual in many other rewarding and optimistic ways.
So I hear what you are saying but I have been on keto since October 2018 and its july 2019. I got off accutane end of Februaryand started tretinoin on face and head in April to keep myself clear bc Ive been on accutane before and it doesnt completely cure me. Also he had me on clindamycin solution which I was only using as a spot treatment up until June (Ill get back to that).However I never had this until 2016 after a round of accutane for my face. 6 months later my head broke out. Some studies have shown accutane can cause this or make it worse. Iwas completely clear until June when I started using clindamycin twice a day because I got nervous bc I was meeting someone for the very first time from across the United States. Then all hell broke loose literally within 17 days of using clindamycin solution every day. There is no coincidence that clindamycin over use contributed to this as either gram negative bacteria over growth or causing a fungal infection. Or accutane screwed up something again. Probably a combination of both. And my diet is on point with Keto. Ive lost50lbs With diet alone and Ive been doing it since last October.Im on a round of systematic oral fungal medication but its only been 3 days. Some has cleared some worse. The size of some lead me to believe gram negative tho, but they rarely come to a head bc I use tretinoin gel which will inhibit them coming to a head. I found something on reddit about scalp acne 3days agoand I had a bottle of toner that contains Azelaic Acid from exposed skincare. Its not a high percentage that I know of because it doesnt list the % on it. But its helping in only 3 days. May not be a cure but its definitely helping. I ordered the prescription gel 15% online just to try and well see how it goes. I havent got it yet.Here is the reddit post https://www.reddit.com/r/SkincareAddiction/comments/82yadz/beforeafter_azelaic_acid_cleared_up_my_scalp_acne/
Im going back to my dermatologist on Tuesday as he was on vacation this past week when I saw a colleague of his who I absolutely did not like. It actually made me want to switch dermatologists, thats how bad she rubbed me the wrong way. Im at a loss because diet hasnt worked. No gluten or carbs but leafy greens. Everyone has a different situation and if your dermatologist isnt willing to actually test your skin for fungus or bacteria then its time to switch and mine so far has danced around testing so Im about to switch. They all eyeball it and acne looks like acne. Without a test it could take years like mine now has with 2 rounds of accutaneand it still coming back. Google When the Provider is the Patient: My Accutane Story, Part 1, 2, and 3 and youllsee this guys story of folliculitis even tho it was in the beard and he had gram negative folliculitis and eventually got it to go away and he was a PA studying for a dermatologist. But it took testing and several tries.
good luck all
Moody123, please provide details about your Roaccutane course. Dosage, duration and your weight during the course.
By the way I tried Azelaic Acid 20% cream, it doesn't help. I have gram-negative folliculite.
I assume that this guy from Reddit get results only because he take 2 accutane courses and after that applies Azelaic Acid.
Patient
I have lost the "logic flow" on this thread, a bit. But a few things are worth commenting on -
Fungal skin problems are VERY common and they ARE HARDLY EVER DIAGNOSED BY DOCTORS.
I did not understand the point about my (?) sister ???
Gram negative follicultis, ie, gram negative bacterial acne (which is also common and is often not diagnosed by doctors) is CAUSED by taking certain antibiotics - which kill the gram positive bacteria and allow the gram negative bacteria to proliferate.
Gram negative follicutis (= gram negative bacterial acne) can be treated with the correct topical antibiotic for the particular species of gram negative bacteria .
Whatever you do, do NOT take oral fluroquinolone antibiotics (cifloxin etc) for your gram negative folliculitis. Fluoroquinolones are VERY VERY dangerous. They cause irreversible tendon damage, terrible irreversible gut problems, etc etc.
https://www.torhoermanlaw.com/personal_injury_lawsuit/bad_drug_lawsuit/fluoroquinolone-antibiotics/
Topical fluroquinolone antibiotics (Nadifloxin, etc)are not dangerous.
8 hours ago, Patient said:Moody123, please provide details about your Roaccutane course. Dosage, duration and your weight during the course.
By the way I tried Azelaic Acid 20% cream, it doesn't help. I have gram-negative folliculite.
I assume that this guy from Reddit get results only because he take 2 accutane courses and after that applies Azelaic Acid.
Did you read the Reddit post that™s as bad as it was even after accutane and he started Azelaic Acid bc his dr. wanted another round of accutane and he was like no way. Well this the 3rd round of accutane for me. 1 many years ago. 80mgs a day at 225lbs. 5 months kept my face pretty clear a long time. I was probably 27 and I™m 42 now. But my acne got worse again end of 2015 and I did another 5-6 months at 80mg and 120mg at 225lbs. My face was clear and remained relatively clear, but 4-6 months after stopping I developed the acne in the back of my head. Never had it before that round of accutane. Derm put me on topical clindamycin which would work at first then it spread. Leading to another round of accutane 8 months 90mg at 215lbs this time. Ended the very end of February 2019. Derm put me on tretinoin gel and clindamycin topical to keep clear this time and it had bc I was only using clindamycin as a spot treatment when I cut my hair bc I knew the dangers of over use of antibiotics. But as I said I got nervous bc I was meeting someone so I started using it a little more, but when she left on June 11 I was completely clear for the most part but decided to use the clindamycin every day twice a day to absolutely make sure I stayed clear because I was traveling to see her again July into August. That™s when all hell broke loose 17 days later I went from clear to the pics I™ll attach. No doubt over use of antibiotics caused a gram negative or fungal situation plus maybe accutane screwing my candida internally bc literally again 4-6 months after stopping it™s back but my face is clear. And I haven™t used clindamycin on my face at all only the back of my head.
Yea most the over the counter Azelaic Acids are crap. Read the reviews. Then actually read the reviews of the prescription 15% gel. https://www.drugs.com/comments/azelaic-acid-topical/for-acne.html
The toner I™m using is from Exposed skin care. Which if you have mild acne on your face I highly recommend their kit. It™s the best one I™ve ever used and I™ve tried them all. The toner has Azelaic Acid, glycolic acid and 1% salicylic acid and some calming ingredients. It stings a little at first but an hour after putting it on it™s actually more calm then when you got out of the shower. And it™s helped in 3 days. Nothing dramatic but it™s definitely helped. I even went as far as finding the prescription gel online before I get my insurance involved bc it™s expensive like $300 for a 50gram tube which just on your head should last 3 months once a day. So i™d use they in the morning and tretinoin at night. But I got lucky on bay of e and found a tube for $75. With a goodrx coupon you can get it for like $99 which isn™t bad if it™ll last 3 months. It says twice a day but study™s show its just as effective once a day after 3 months.
But a real possible cure lies in PDT therapy with levulan. It™s shown to cure people of folliculitis who have failed to respond to everything else. It™s a kind of invasive procedure requiring about 3-5 treatments. And by invasive I mean you have to be out of COMPLETE sunlight for 48hrs and you™ll have crusting and peeling, but Just google PDT therapy for folliculitis and you™ll see multiple studies. Actual studies not crap. It™s probably the route I™m gonna take. It™ll probably cost me $1000-1500 but I™ve easily spent that on copays and drugs and over the counter shit. So to end this misery I™ll sell my soul lol.
In the pics my head was really itchy before I cut my hair and every time I used the clindamycin it™d itch more and it wasn™t itching before that. And it started to break out a little so I cut it and continued clindamycin until a few days ago bc I realized it was the problem. Before this I had been cutting my hair myself with a guard once a week with no problems at all until I started clindamycin twice a day every day instead of a spot treatment. So from 6/28 to 7/4 it went to hell completely. Worse thing I could have done was to spread bacteria or fungus. It™s gone from good to worse and back. It™s not terrible as before I had larger cysts that crusted yellow ooze 2016-2017, but that™s not far behind bc it™s only been 4 months since accutane at about 6 months it™ll get worse and worse just like last time. Plus I have tretinoin to control the size of them and reduces them before they get big and crusty. And it™s definitely worse than the pictures you can™t really see it well as in a mirror.
2 hours ago, Aussie Scientist said:I did not understand the point about my (?) sister ???
This was aboutPenthotal11111's sister.
2 hours ago, Aussie Scientist said:Gram negative follicutis (= gram negative bacterial acne) can be treated with the correct topical antibiotic for the particular species of gram negative bacteria .
I tried, usedAUGMENTIN (oral for 10 days).3 weeks later the problem returned. After that my doctor suggests Roaccutane.
12 minutes ago, Patient said:This was aboutPenthotal11111's sister.
I tried, usedAUGMENTIN (oral for 10 days).3 weeks later the problem returned. After that my doctor suggests Roaccutane.
Just be careful you dont do antibiotics after accutane. It can cause the gram negative bacteria to reappear. Unless you have a lesions puss tested and you know exactly what gram negative bacteria it is. And take the specific antibiotic for that strain of bacteria at the same time as accutane. Most Drs dont want to test for whatever reason Ive found. If they wont change dermatologists.Check out this guys folliculitis story and he was studying a physicians assistantfor a dermatologist
https://springstderm.com/when-the-provider-is-the-patient-my-accutane-story-part-1/
https://springstderm.com/when-the-provider-is-the-patient-my-accutane-story-part-2/
https://springstderm.com/when-the-provider-is-the-patient-my-accutane-story-part-3/
Good luck on accutane. Is this your first round?
Patient
I agree with Moody. Different gram negative bacteria require different antibiotics. Enterobacteria are NOT controlled by Augmentin, which is amoxillin plus a beta amylase inhibitor (to stop the bacteria breaking down the antibiotic).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12226801
Thanks for the advice re whose sister !!! Very confusing....
Be VERY careful with taking antibiotics. They destroy people's immune systems.
25 minutes ago, Moody123 said:Unless you have a lesions puss tested and you know exactly what gram negative bacteria it is
I know exactly what is my bacteria, it is Enterobacter aerogenes.
26 minutes ago, Moody123 said:Most Drs dont want to test for whatever reason Ive found.
I was lucky with the doctor, we started from theanalysis of pus in the laboratory.
29 minutes ago, Moody123 said:Check out this guys folliculitis story and he was studying a physicians assistantfor a dermatologist
I read this previously, thanks.
29 minutes ago, Moody123 said:Good luck on accutane. Is this your first round?
Yes, and I hope it would be the last.
9 minutes ago, Aussie Scientist said:Enterobacteria are NOT controlled by Augmentin, which is amoxillin plus a beta amylase inhibitor (to stop the bacteria breaking down the antibiotic).
Well, my doctor suggests using Augmentin after laboratory testing of sensitivity of my bacteria to different antibiotics. And I can say thatAugmentin worked, I have absolutely clear scalp for 3 weeks after the end ofAugmentin course.After this, there was a re-infection due to my oily skin on my head.
15 minutes ago, Aussie Scientist said:Be VERY careful with taking antibiotics. They destroy people's immune systems.
I hope I dont need them after the Roaccutanecourse.
I have been using clotrimazol creme more then a month 2 times a day, now with added nystatin powderand taking oral nistatyn suspense. The only sigh of probably Candida wasthe whitishtongue. And scalp acne which are exactly at the same mode since I have started antifungus therapy... after each washing 1 time per 3 days the scalp is more itchy and more acne( I give it a try for another month...
Thinking of roa again..for the 6th time(
Pento
With all due respect, gram negative acne/follicultis CAN be cured with antibiotics that kill the particular gram negative bacteria that are causing the problem, and tretinoin can help also. The condition comes back if one ONLY uses accutane/tretinoin.
One has to kill the bacteria also.
3Advanced issues found
13Advanced issues found
1On 7/8/2019 at 2:45 AM, Aussie Scientist said:Augmentin
Thanks for your careful replies.
The re-infection was not due to your oily scalp. Bacteria do not arise from oil. The re-infection was because the bacteria were not fully controlled by the augmenton.
1. My nickname on this forum is 'Patient', not 'Augmentin'.
2.Re-infection occurred because my head had excellent conditions for the reproduction of bacteria (in other words, precisely because of oily skin).
3.An antibiotic can actually completely kill the bacterium on my head, but it will not give me immunity from this bacterium.
4.Today is my 26 days on Roaccutane (20mg/day) and my scalp is almost clear (just 1 pimple left). Does Roaccutane kill my bacteria? Definitely not. It creates conditions under which the bacterium does not multiply and the problem disappears by itself.
5.I read replies from other guys who say that they had 3-5 courses of Roaccutane previously and it doesn't help. I may assume that they take pills wrong. Roaccutane pills should be always taken with oily food (sour cream, 8% yogurt, eggs, salmon, etc). This maximizes the absorption of Roaccutane.