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Jenny - check out this thread for my experience with bioalcamid removal.
Cheers,
kooky
Hi, kooky,
I revisited that clinic twice for touch-ups to remove those extra filler without much success. Those small to tiny bumps are still visible and I'm so pissed. Besides that, I haven't done anything trying to remove them and I'm wondering if those extra "permanent" filler are still removeable. (Do you have similar problem? Have you successfully removed them by some doctors?)
I'm looking into this Fraxel laser for now and trying to figure out how different it is from the smoothbeam laser I had before.
Have a good day
JennyL
That sucks Ryan, but I would go through with five if I were you. It would make sense for scars to not see much improvement until then because at only 15% of the area being treated it would take that much for a substantial stimulation of collagen.
I'm paying $750 per, which is too much. I think it should be like $300 especially with the popularity of it paying their machines off pretty quick. But it's a big investement for the docs and the tips are expensive too and need to be replaced often. I think both he and Rappaport charge at least $1250 for full face.
Dr. Rohksar has been really informative and said most doctors don't really know how to use it correctly and honestly there's still a lot of experimenting going on because it's so unique.
I did see some pics and saw some definite improvement, some pretty drastic, but others not so much, especially with people who only did 2 or 3.
Dr. Rohksar said there was no limit to how many times it could be done. I didn't ask him about consecutively though. I imagine it would probably be best to do a series of 5 then take several months off and do another series.
He also told me the number of passes really doesn't matter. I think the programming of the computer will only allow the selected density to happen regardless. he said the total energy used is a more important number. Mine was 1.6kj while a whole face is around 6kj.
Jenny - check out this thread for my experience with bioalcamid removal.Cheers,
kooky
Hi, kooky,
AA I revisited that clinic twice for touch-ups to remove those extra filler without much success.AA Those small to tiny bumps are still visible and I'm so pissed.AA Besides that, I haven't done anything trying to remove them and I'm wondering if those extra "permanent" filler are still removeable.AA (Do you have similar problem?AA Have you successfully removed them by some doctors?)
AA I'm looking into this Fraxel laser for now and trying to figure out how different it is from the smoothbeam laser I had before.
AA Have a good day
JennyL
Hey everyone,
This is my first post. Been reading the threads on Fraxel and have already had two treatments so far and get my third tomorrow.
My scars are a bit different and really embarassing but look just like ice-pick and narrow boxcar acne scars. I made a huge mistake when I was only twenty and paniced when I started losing my hair and got talked into a hair transplant by a sleezy doctor. Knew it was a mistake immediately but it was hidden in my natural hair up until now when it became apparent when my hair receded and thinned more.
So I got the transplanted hairs destroyed via laser which was really successful but there were all these scars at my hairline - about 40-50.
My doctor (a derm who was supposed to be one of the best in NYC and was very nice and seemed to actually want to help) did 5 rounds of Erbium which did absolutely nothing except make the scars wider and my skin red. He then did a test spot of CO2 about 1.5 sq inches. It was horrible, has not yet fully healed 3 months later, did nothing for the scars and created hypertrophic scarring. That doctor didn't have a Fraxel and talked it down saying he hadn't been impressed with it. I feel he was not being very honest.
So after reading a bunch about Fraxel I went and got a few consultations. Dr. Rappaport and Dr. Rohksar were really informative and thought Fraxel may help. I ended up choosing Dr. Rohksar b/c he seemed to have the most experience and knowledge of the laser and specifically in treating acne scars. He said his patients on avereage get 50% improvement with 5 treatments, but my scars were much much deeper - 3-4mm even though they are not really that sunken - probably .2 - 1mm. Since they are from grafts they are equivalent to punch grafts for acne scar treatment.
We started right off on the first treatment at the highest setting he will go (20mj at 1250 mtz/cm). Not really at all painful with the zimmer cooling machine. Pretty swollen and pink, but not red like the Erbium. It flakes off and looks great after 5 days with unnoticable swelling but enough to fill the scars in completely which is wonderful but then they show back up in a couple more days which is such a downer.
I've done 2 treatments so far and there is definitely improvement in the overall texture and smoothness of the skin (the erbium left it kinda leathery) but not a whole lot in the scars. Although I really think there is some progress - the scars don't look as deep or as dark and in the mornings I can sometimes barely tell they're there at all. But each evening they roar back.
It's also helping the CO2 area, fading the lines of demarcation and helping the area heal into a more normal texture. The epidermal layer is really thin and the fraxel actually creates some crusting but it heals just as quick as the rest.
I'm going to do at least 5 treatments and maybe 6 if I can scrounge up the credit space (geez). Dr. Rappaport initially only recommended 3 treatments while Rohksar said 5. So after tomorrow being the third one I'm hoping to start to see some real improvement but am bracing myself for none. As Floridaguy said, he didn't really see much until after 4.
I'm doing them at only 10 days apart too so I figure by Thanksgiving I will be able to make a more useful report.
I'm adding this because if it helps me, it should really help you guys with scars that may not extend fully through the dermis, which is probably most of you. I'm also taking photos through the whole thing and will post them at the end.
Thanks for everyone sharing their experience - it's super helpful and if these kind of forums would have existed 12 years ago I would never have been in this mess and just had a sweet buzzed bean.
Hi birch,
That's great to hear...I've heard great things about Dr. Rokshar and he's one of the first doctors to use the Fraxel. He's a bit expensive but I guess office space isn't exactly cheap in Manhattan. My doctor also likes to go at 20/1250 too for acne scarring. Are you waiting a month between treatments?
Did he provide you with any before and after photos of patients with acne scarring and if so, what was your impression of the level of improvement?
Thanks,
kook
Hey kooky,
Yeah it seems the 20/1250 is becoming the standard for acne scars.
Yes Dr. Rohksar was one of the first along with Dr. Fitspatrick in CA and they really targeted it at acne scars doing I think the only clinical study where the average result of 50% improvement for scars came from. He told me he will not go over 20/1250 because you can run into trouble. It still delivers a lot of heat and can blister over that setting which could mean more scarring.
I'm only waiting 10 days between treatments which is the minimum at that setting, but I guess people with just discoloration can do them even quicker.
Thanks lightgirl,
Your posts have been really great. Glad you're seeing improvement.
No I don't think Fraxel can offer any guarantees. Dr. Rohksar expanded on his 50% quote by saying that's how people respond when asked on average. Some do better, some not as well. But it is genuinely hopeful because they predict (like all the other lasers) that there will still be a cumulative improvement over months and maybe even up to a year.
Does your doctor have a zimmer cooling machine? My first treatment he didn't turn it on and the second pass was pretty brutal. But in my second treatment he used it and I almost didn't feel any pain at all even at 20.
Hi birch,
That's great to hear...I've heard great things about Dr. Rokshar and he's one of the first doctors to use the Fraxel. He's a bit expensive but I guess office space isn't exactly cheap in Manhattan. My doctor also likes to go at 20/1250 too for acne scarring. Are you waiting a month between treatments?
Did he provide you with any before and after photos of patients with acne scarring and if so, what was your impression of the level of improvement?
Thanks,
kook
Hey kooky,
Yeah it seems the 20/1250 is becoming the standard for acne scars.
Yes Dr. Rohksar was one of the first along with Dr. Fitspatrick in CA and they really targeted it at acne scars doing I think the only clinical study where the average result of 50% improvement for scars came from. He told me he will not go over 20/1250 because you can run into trouble. It still delivers a lot of heat and can blister over that setting which could mean more scarring.
I'm only waiting 10 days between treatments which is the minimum at that setting, but I guess people with just discoloration can do them even quicker.
Yikes. After my experience today, I think I could not handle level 20 unless I was sedated.
Thanks lightgirl,
Your posts have been really great. Glad you're seeing improvement.
No I don't think Fraxel can offer any guarantees. Dr. Rohksar expanded on his 50% quote by saying that's how people respond when asked on average. Some do better, some not as well. But it is genuinely hopeful because they predict (like all the other lasers) that there will still be a cumulative improvement over months and maybe even up to a year.
Does your doctor have a zimmer cooling machine? My first treatment he didn't turn it on and the second pass was pretty brutal. But in my second treatment he used it and I almost didn't feel any pain at all even at 20.
Hi, everyone,
Just got a price quote from Dr. Fiztpatrick in San Diego: "Ballpark fee for Full Face 6900.00 ( usually 4 treatments about 1-2 weeks apart. Recovery time is mild swelling for 1-3 days you may have spots of blue dye for 24 hours."
Wow, that's $1725 per treatment. Is this a new record?
Still seeking a doc in LA who is experienced treating acne scared patients with Fraxel Laser and charges a lot less.
Kooky,
Thanks for the info. Maybe I should contact Dr. White in NYC? Hate to fly across the continenet just to remove the overly injected filler.
JennyL
hmm only 40% yield of improvement? it does gradually improve overtime right? and for my treatment here, the cost is $2000 for 5 treatments, just on my cheeks though, spaced 2 weeks apart.. and by the way I'm in Thailand..so costs here are much lower..and by the way, do u have before and after shots? how many treatments are u gettin? what's your age too? and where did you find the articles regarding to this? thanks..hollla
hmm only 40% yield of improvement? it does gradually improve overtime right? and for my treatment here, the cost is $2000 for 5 treatments, just on my cheeks though, spaced 2 weeks apart.. and by the way I'm in Thailand..so costs here are much lower..and by the way, do u have before and after shots? what's your age too? and where did you find the articles regarding to this?
I too have had 3 treatments. I must say that my skin is smoother and my shallow scars are better, but I just can't be sure about the deep scars I have on my forehead. After reading some of the things people said about Fraxel, I'm not sure whether I should be an optimist or pecimist. I'm being treated by Dr. Edgar Fincher (an associate of Dr. Ronald Moy, apparently well know in the field of dermatology)at UCLA Medical Center for $900. I wasn't lucky enough to get the $500 deal for being on his website, but oh well. He said I'd need 5-8 treatments to improve my scars by 50-80%. While I hope it'll be 80%, I know that's an unrealistic number for me to expect, and I don't want my parents wasting their money on this. I was wondering if anyone could help steer my decision of whether I should stick with Fraxel or give subcision and augmentation a shot. I just can't decide for myself because all I have in my mind is being back to normal by prom! Any suggestions would help.
i havent' even had one yet lol.. and wow 900 that's a large sum there..but yo post some pics of yourself before and after if you could, it'd really help a lot..thanks.
And lightgirl, thanks for the article.. i hope all goes well for you and that improvements are on the rise.
Just got back from my3rd Fraxel. The doctor went even more aggressive this time. Still at 20/1250 but did more passes (so I guess I was wrong before about the # of passes not really mattering) for a total energy of 2.06kj.
My 1st and 2nd treatments were also at 20/1250 but with 1.06kj and 1.60kj respectively.
No pain at all with the Zimmer machine. Actually felt a little bit of brain freeze like you get eating a snowcone too fast.
Pretty swollen and there was some pinpoint bleeding which he said he expected and is no big deal - just need to use a little aquafor - but he feels it's really necessary to be aggressive for such deep scars.
My 4th treatment will be in 2 weeks and I'm hopeful that if I see any improvement from this one then #'s 4 and 5 will be great.
Just got back from my3rd Fraxel. The doctor went even more aggressive this time. Still at 20/1250 but did more passes (so I guess I was wrong before about the # of passes not really mattering) for a total energy of 2.06kj.
My 1st and 2nd treatments were also at 20/1250 but with 1.06kj and 1.60kj respectively.
No pain at all with the Zimmer machine. Actually felt a little bit of brain freeze like you get eating a snowcone too fast.
Pretty swollen and there was some pinpoint bleeding which he said he expected and is no big deal - just need to use a little aquafor - but he feels it's really necessary to be aggressive for such deep scars.
My 4th treatment will be in 2 weeks and I'm hopeful that if I see any improvement from this one then #'s 4 and 5 will be great.
I had little red dots on two of mine, which were gone in a couple of days with neosporin. I think I have determined that the cold air machine was not as cold as it usually is--it was a new nurse with my doctor. That could have been why I experienced some pain. Looks like we are in the same boat Birch both stuck inside swollen and red for a few days! I am really swollen today!
Lightgirl,
I found the article interesting.. so it sounds like using fraxel at these higher settings does produce much better results. I'm assuming when he says 50% of his patients saw *significant* improvement, that would be 40% or better.. and atleast 80% of them saw moderate improvement, probably 25% to 40%... That would still mean 2 out of 10 saw probably under 25% improvement.
I was also wondering for the swelling and redness... how long on average is it before you look "presentable". If you get fraxel at these settings done say on a friday morning, are you able to return on monday morning with no one noticing?
Sean..
Hi Birch, How r u? I hope your doing ok.. I am going to see Dr Rokhsar for a Consultation next week to see about Fraxel for My scars(mostly on cheeks some deep some shallow) I was just curious if he recommends doing full face or just hitting the noticable scar areas. Also, Does he have different prices for full face and for the cheek only sessions? Thanks..
About me.. I had Laser done w/ the derma K laser( combo of erbium+CO2) 1-1/2 years ago w/ minimal results. Although I healed relatively fast you still have many months of pinkish color in your face and have to be constantly protected from the sun. I am looking into Fraxel or The Medical Roll-CIT.
Hi Birch, How r u? I hope your doing ok.. I am going to see Dr Rokhsar for a Consultation next week to see about Fraxel for My scars(mostly on cheeks some deep some shallow) I was just curious if he recommends doing full face or just hitting the noticable scar areas. Also, Does he have different prices for full face and for the cheek only sessions? Thanks..About me.. I had Laser done w/ the derma K laser( combo of erbium+CO2) 1-1/2 years ago w/ minimal results. Although I healed relatively fast you still have many months of pinkish color in your face and have to be constantly protected from the sun. I am looking into Fraxel or The Medical Roll-CIT.
Lightgirl,
I found the article interesting.. so it sounds like using fraxel at these higher settings does produce much better results. I'm assuming when he says 50% of his patients saw *significant* improvement, that would be 40% or better.. and atleast 80% of them saw moderate improvement, probably 25% to 40%... That would still mean 2 out of 10 saw probably under 25% improvement.
I was also wondering for the swelling and redness... how long on average is it before you look "presentable". If you get fraxel at these settings done say on a friday morning, are you able to return on monday morning with no one noticing?
Sean..