22 minutes ago, can i get a new life please said:Can you take photos with same lightning with old ones?
Phenol peel will remove scars on the right side completely, also who was your dr. Who did the subcision? It looks like he is good with it.
She's in Canada
But if you look for a good doctor for subcision and cross in Europe I recommend Dr Davide Guardoli in Nice. He's a humble guy and doesn't advertise and self promote but he does the job!
41 minutes ago, can i get a new life please said:Can you take photos with same lightning with old ones?
Phenol peel will remove scars on the right side completely, also who was your dr. Who did the subcision? It looks like he is good with it.
I took these today, under overhead lighting. Haha.
I™m seeing my derm on Friday. For TCA Cross, Radiesse and punch excision of anything that can be excised (I doubt much can be excised). No make up. Just tinted sunscreen that was applied about 8 hours ago now haha.
The pink marks are from the excision. My derm in Ontario did my subcision. But I don™t think subcision did a remarkable amount for me because my scars are mostly atrophic. So punch excision was the way to go.
4 minutes ago, Catharsis2018 said:I took these today, under overhead lighting. Haha.
I™m seeing my derm on Friday. For TCA Cross, Radiesse and punch excision of anything that can be excised (I doubt much can be excised). No make up. Just tinted sunscreen that was applied about 8 hours ago now haha.
Did you get the punch excision from Dr Sajic?
1 hour ago, Catharsis2018 said:I took these today, under overhead lighting. Haha.
I™m seeing my derm on Friday. For TCA Cross, Radiesse and punch excision of anything that can be excised (I doubt much can be excised). No make up. Just tinted sunscreen that was applied about 8 hours ago now haha.
The pink marks are from the excision. My derm in Ontario did my subcision. But I don™t think subcision did a remarkable amount for me because my scars are mostly atrophic. So punch excision was the way to go.
After all these treatments subcisions lasers and fillers I don't see a lot of improvement compared to the before pictures but maybe the pictures don't show well.
13 hours ago, getsmart121 said:You seem to be a good candidate for your phenol chemobrasion, if this is not ready then why get a phenol chemobrasion in the first placeif it cant even fix these hard to see scarring. My understanding of scarring if itis hard to see but needs bad lighting to show means you are ready forphenol chemobrasion. Others can correct me on this
@Sirius Lee. Is she ready for phenol chemobrasion?
Why would you go through the ordeal of the deep phenol chemabrasion for scars that is only visible in bad light? Genuinely asking.
1 hour ago, JaysonC said:Why would you go through the ordeal of the deep phenol chemabrasion for scars that is only visible in bad light? Genuinely asking.
Because it™s annoying for me to still be dealing with texture issues. And lol I also used to weigh 100+ lbs heavier. My acne scars don™t fit in with my current identity. So I™ll do what it takes til I™m happy. 
I am quite relentless.
tbh. I think the 3000 I spent on Infini RF was a waste. I think some of my subcisions have been a waste. I think profractional was a waste. Sculptra, with that past derm who I deeply regret going to, I think was a waste.
punch excision was useful. Tca cross was useful. Fully ablative CO2 and Erbium were useful - but only semi. I™m tired of seeing acne scar sufferers get the wrong idea about lasers.
Radiesse was useful. Skinboosters was useful
Mind you, I might not get phenol after the mixed messages I™ve been reading on how effective it is.
but whatever that can improve my scars, I™m probably going to do it.
maybe the road is another fully ablative¦ I™m still debating.
and I may have gotten a bit obsessive about it. I don™t deny that.
I wouldn't do fat transfer if I were you. Not without extensive research at least.
I saw a girl on realself who had similar scars as yours. She did the fat transfer and months to a year later she's complaining that her face is super lumpy now. Her doctor is not responsive.If you must experiment with volume addition, why not opt for a temporary or semi-perm filler? I'd just hate for you to do something permanent to your face and not have any support when things go wrong. I've been there...
I think you could benefit from more subcision. You just need to go to someone with documented results that prove they know what they're doing.
4 hours ago, Catharsis2018 said:Because it™s annoying for me to still be dealing with texture issues. And lol I also used to weigh 100+ lbs heavier. My acne scars don™t fit in with my current identity. So I™ll do what it takes til I™m happy.
I am quite relentless.
tbh. I think the 3000 I spent on Infini RF was a waste. I think some of my subcisions have been a waste. I think profractional was a waste. Sculptra, with that past derm who I deeply regret going to, I think was a waste.
punch excision was useful. Tca cross was useful. Fully ablative CO2 and Erbium were useful - but only semi. I™m tired of seeing acne scar sufferers get the wrong idea about lasers.
Radiesse was useful. Skinboosters was useful
Mind you, I might not get phenol after the mixed messages I™ve been reading on how effective it is.
but whatever that can improve my scars, I™m probably going to do it.
maybe the road is another fully ablative¦ I™m still debating.
and I may have gotten a bit obsessive about it. I don™t deny that.
My point was why getting an expensive invasive treatment like phenol peel for scars seen only at certain lighting. Surely these scars would be very mild and other less aggressive treatments would help.
I can only congratulate you for the perseverance with improving your scars. I'm sure you've seen results. It's just difficult for me to see based on the photos you've shared because on the side photo it seems there's great progess but under the overhead light not so much. Also shiny skin in the afters masks the scars.
Are your scars considered textural now? Is this what the phenol peel is best for? I'm genuinely interested. I'd say your scars would still cast a shadow under angled lighting meaning there's still depth but I might be wrong. Just thinking out loud. I am curious about this because I'm interested in the deep phenol chemabrasion myself and trying to get information and opinions about it.
Is the peel just a substitute for ablative lasers giving you a final polish of textural issues or is it also a legit treatment for deeper scars after every other treatment has failed you and it can improve deeper scars too? That's what I don't understand.
5 hours ago, LivingWithFaith said:I wouldn't do fat transfer if I were you. Not without extensive research at least.
I saw a girl on realself who had similar scars as yours. She did the fat transfer and months to a year later she's complaining that her face is super lumpy now. Her doctor is not responsive.If you must experiment with volume addition, why not opt for a temporary or semi-perm filler? I'd just hate for you to do something permanent to your face and not have any support when things go wrong. I've been there...
I think you could benefit from more subcision. You just need to go to someone with documented results that prove they know what they're doing.
Im going to do Radiesse (semi-permanent filler) on Friday/tomorrow with TCA Cross (#3? #4? I lost count.). Last time I did Radiesse was in December 2020, immediately after CO2 - applied meso style over the face)zAlso going to see if my current derm sees any merit in doing afew more punch excision. Ill ask him about subcision but last time he told me Subcision couldnt do much for me at this point..
@LivingWithFaithAre there any fillers youve seen good results with?
ah. Yeah that sucks to hear about the fat transfer. Lumps is something I can definitely do without.
1 hour ago, JaysonC said:My point was why getting an expensive invasive treatment like phenol peel for scars seen only at certain lighting. Surely these scars would be very mildand other less aggressive treatments would help.
I can only congratulate you for the perseverance with improving your scars. I'm sure you've seen results. It's just difficult for me to see based on the photos you've shared because on the side photo it seems there's great progess but underthe overhead light not so much. Also shiny skin in the afters masks the scars.
Are your scars considered textural now? Is this what the phenol peel is best for? I'm genuinely interested. I'd say your scars would still cast a shadow under angled lighting meaning there's still depth but I might be wrong. Just thinking out loud. I am curious about this because I'm interested in the deep phenol chemabrasion myself and trying to get information and opinions about it.
Is the peel just a substitute for ablative lasers giving you a final polish of textural issuesor is it also a legit treatment for deeper scars after every other treatment has failed you and it can improve deeper scars too?That's what I don't understand.
Yeah I dont know. I think its the overall bad texture of my skin right now that bothers me the most - so the phenol would be that final polish.I cant help but think phenol would help with the texture a lot. But @can i get a new life pleaseis right in that I do have a few more scars that could be levelled up more. Maybe my derm will be open to excising a few more scars tomorrow..
Will update after my treatment tomorrow with my derm.
7 hours ago, can i get a new life please said:Very good, before the phenol peel level up those scars as many as you can. Is excision give you additional scar? How is excision cuts like bumps or p.i.e? Can you see them in real life?
Excisions do leave behind an additional scar. In the pictures, all the pink/red linear spotson my face are from previouspunch excisions
Having never gotten the treatment, I can't really say I know much about Phenol. But from what I've read, it's the strongest acid on the market. It's so strong that it can potentially not only damage your liver but mess up your heart rhythm. Hence, they hook you up to EKG while you're getting the treatment.
That said, unless you've exhausted all your options and are standing at the brink of desperation, I don't think Phenol peel is worth $6000 (or was it higher?). But that's just me.
3 hours ago, Catharsis2018 said:Im going to do Radiesse (semi-permanent filler) on Friday/tomorrow with TCA Cross (#3? #4? I lost count.). Last time I did Radiesse was in December 2020, immediately after CO2 - applied meso style over the face)zAlso going to see if my current derm sees any merit in doing afew more punch excision. Ill ask him about subcision but last time he told me Subcision couldnt do much for me at this point..
@LivingWithFaithAre there any fillers youve seen good results with?
ah. Yeah that sucks to hear about the fat transfer. Lumps is something I can definitely do without.
Yeah I dont know. I think its the overall bad texture of my skin right now that bothers me the most - so the phenol would be that final polish.I cant help but think phenol would help with the texture a lot. But @can i get a new life pleaseis right in that I do have a few more scars that could be levelled up more. Maybe my derm will be open to excising a few more scars tomorrow..
Will update after my treatment tomorrow with my derm.
Excisions do leave behind an additional scar. In the pictures, all the pink/red linear spotson my face are from previouspunch excisions
Not sure why your doctor is doing full ablative, he should do spot ablative around the boxcar edge, this will help to blend the edge into normal skin. When doing fully ablative this will lower the pitted skin as well as the edges. I mean you will see an improvement but not that much in my opinion. And then fillers are a must I think to life the overall area. Have you tried doing subcision and suction.
as per dr Steven weiner, filler after subcision doesnt stop from retethering of scars, he believes the only way to stop rethering is by doing Chinese cupping or repeated subcision. He used ultrasound to prove this.
Hey guys I checked Dr Rullan's webpage and he recommends the 2 days peel together with subcision and cross and Belafill for very severe scars as a first treatment. Has anybody on this forum had this done or are you all at the end of your journey going for the polishing effect of the peel? You know if the peel works for severe scars?
4 hours ago, JaysonC said:Hey guys I checked Dr Rullan's webpage and he recommends the 2 days peel together with subcision and cross and Belafill for very severe scars as a first treatment. Has anybody on this forum had this done or are you all at the end of your journey going for the polishing effect of the peel? You know if the peel works for severe scars?
So update. I am in my derms office. He is going to do two syringes of skinboosters and some TCA Cross.
he said I am a good candidate for phenol and that Im ready for that now because my scars are so shallow. He said he doesnt see anything left to excise and doesnt see how subcision can help at this point.
going to go through with my consult with Dr Rullan in Mid July.
16 hours ago, Catharsis2018 said:So update. I am in my derms office. He is going to do two syringes of skinboosters and some TCA Cross.
he said I am a good candidate for phenol and that Im ready for that now because my scars are so shallow. He said he doesnt see anything left to excise and doesnt see how subcision can help at this point.
going to go through with my consult with Dr Rullan in Mid July.
So this kind of answers my question whether the phenol chemabrasion is suitable for deep scars. Everyone on the forum and doctors as well recommend it for shallow scars. My guess is that Dr Rullan's plan for severe scars involves the peel 'in the end' after getting prior subcision and cross. On the other hand I've also read that someone wanted to get the peel twice, imagine this, as if once is not more than enough for a lifetime lol.
Has Dr Rullan seen you in person, or did you just send photos and he came back with a recommendation?
3 hours ago, JaysonC said:So this kind of answers my question whether the phenol chemabrasion is suitable for deep scars. Everyone on the forum and doctors as well recommend it for shallow scars. My guess is that Dr Rullan's plan for severe scars involves the peel 'in the end' after getting prior subcision and cross. On the other hand I've also read that someone wanted to get the peel twice, imagine this, as if once is not more than enough for a lifetime lol.
Has Dr Rullan seen you in person, or did you just send photos and he came back with a recommendation?
Well no, my derm told me I am a good candidate because my scarring is so shallow now. It was hard for him to treat my scarring yesterday because he had to angle the lighting so many times. He also told me theres not much left I can do that would help except for phenol.. he drew me a drawing to explain lol. That my scars are in the papillary dermis now so they are very shallow and that what can help at this point is phenol or fillers etc
I sent photos but I am being adamant about having some sort of webcam consult before I go through with it, because I live in Canada lol.
15 minutes ago, Catharsis2018 said:Well no, my derm told me I am a good candidate because my scarring is so shallow now. It was hard for him to treat my scarring yesterday because he had to angle the lighting so many times. He also told me theres not much left I can do that would help except for phenol.. he drew me a drawing to explain lol. That my scars are in the papillary dermis now so they are very shallow and that what can help at this point is phenol or fillers etc
I sent photos but I am being adamant about having some sort of webcam consult before I go through with it, because I live in Canada lol.
I am very happy for you. It only motivates me to get my scars as shallow as yours and to get the phenol peel done as well. I wish I lived in North America but I guess I will travel. I will write Rullans office for a recommendation what treatments I should get to get to this stage.I learned that he offers online consultations with photos for free.
15 minutes ago, gynoscar said:Having done phenol peel, I think it will help with your texture. The phenol only reach the upper epidermis as states on rullans research paper.
It helped a lot of my texture but did nothing with my deep scars (seen by angled lighting).
Did Rullan tell you this at the consultation?
Because in his paper it also says that most patients received 70% and more improvement of their scars, some 90%.
1 hour ago, can i get a new life please said:That is absolutely amazing if its true
It would be. But there seems to be a discrepancy between whats in the paper and what mostpeople who havehad the peel say... thats why I am asking.
Also in the paper Rullan says that the acid removes the top layer of the dermis, the papillary layer, and he performs the subsequent abrasion ever deeper...
14 minutes ago, JaysonC said:It would be. But there seems to be a discrepancy between whats in the paper and what most people who have had the peel say... thats why I am asking.
Also in the paper Rullan says that the acid removes the top layer of the dermis, the papillary layer, and be performs the subsequent abrasion ever deeper...
The papillary layer is underneath the epidermis. The procedure only removes the upper epidermis and doesn't reach the dermis layer.
He didnt mention it on my consult, I found out via his paper.
1 hour ago, gynoscar said:The papillary layer is underneath the epidermis. The procedure only removes the upper epidermis and doesn't reach the dermis layer.
He didnt mention it on my consult, I found out via his paper.
I think you might have gotten something wrong. Here a citation from the paper
"The lead author™s 20 years of peeling experience has led him to several observations and theories. Phenol peels can liquefy both the epidermis and upper dermis. This allows a more effective and easy abrasion of the edges and shoulders of deep scars and wrinkles,resulting in new collagen formation in these difficultto-reach area"
I am just curious what the phenol peel can do, thats all. Researching and asking questions.
4 minutes ago, JaysonC said:
I think you might have gotten something wrong. Here a citation from the paper
"The lead authors 20 years of peeling experience has led him to several observations and theories. Phenol peels can liquefy both the epidermis and upper dermis. This allows a more effective and easy abrasion of the edges and shoulders of deep scars and wrinkles,resulting in new collagen formation in these difficultto-reach area"
I am just curious what the phenol peel can do, thats all. Researching and asking questions.
Ah ok. My bad I think I may have forgotten.
15 hours ago, JaysonC said:It would be. But there seems to be a discrepancy between whats in the paper and what mostpeople who havehad the peel say... thats why I am asking.
Also in the paper Rullan says that the acid removes the top layer of the dermis, the papillary layer, and he performs the subsequent abrasion ever deeper...
So its interesting you say this because my derm drew me a drawing and told me after so many treatments, my scars are shallow and arenow in the papillary dermis. He went on to say thatwhat would be best for them now are fillers, phenol and potentially tca cross
I am wondering if @f93d results are still holding up well