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Update: Laser procedure today. It™s ultrapulse laser, Co2 fractional laser fully ablative, and sculptura filler for collagen stimulation. Here is a few shots right before the procedure with numbing applied.
On 7/10/2021 at 11:46 PM, dirigo39 said:I'm surprised you only had 2 subcisions. My scars are similar to yours and I've had 3. I think I've plateaued what subcisions can do even tho BA and a few others keep saying I need more.
Yes. I™ve thought about another subcision. I™ll ask the doctor now if she thinks I need it and if she is able to do it. Thanks for your comment.
Sorry, I misunderstood the procedure. It™s not picol laser, it™s ultrapulse + Co2 ablative laser + sculptura. Here is the actual form.
And these forms for viewers who want to know more about this procedure.
5 minutes ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:Sorry, I misunderstood the procedure. It™s not picol laser, it™s ultrapulse + Co2 ablative laser + sculptura. Here is the actual form.
And these forms for viewers who want to know more about this procedure.
This place is different from the other one I had with erbium and Infini. They charge me for little things that the other place did not. Just a note. Next procedure, I will negotiate harder because I know the other small things are not added. They also take so much longer. And the staff is less accommodating. Oh well, I guess. It depends how long I will go through this with this place again. Not entirely excited with the experience here. I hope the results make up for it.
Alright guys. We™re done. I took three pain meds in the office and laughing gas. She ended up doing subcision for me at the end of the three lasers. Here is right after the procedure. The red dots are the subcision marks. I don™t know what needle she used for subcision because she did it on the spot. She also inserted sculptra filler.
The first two images are my left side, my worst side. The last two are my right side. Some sort of cream was applied after all of it, but I don™t know what. Sorry, I was dizzy.
Come to think of it, three lasers, subcision and filler for a grand total of $982 doesn™t make me feel so bad. And being under laughing gas is amazing, really takes me somewhere else than focusing on the pain. Pain level was great until the end, the part with the deep Co2, it hurt quite a bit. But it lasted 30 seconds or so on each cheek so it™s not too bad. Well, all in all, it was a B+ experience.
Update: my skins not in pain nor am I even wounded really. I am swollen but that™s about it. I™m starting to get upset because I feel as if this procedure will do nothing for my scars. This might as well be a light peel that they sell at Sephora. How is this ultra pulse and Co2 ablative laser? I don™t know something doesn™t seem right. I feel as if I was ripped off. Can someone tell me if this is right? I feel like I will heal by tomorrow, she said it will take 7 days and be intense. Here is the photos of how it looks right now.
A freaking dermapen does more redness, peeling and bleeding than this. This is really upsetting.
Heck, even infini had more swelling and pinpoint bleeding than this.
Is there a lot of crusting? Are you going to the clinic go get it checked and removed daily in the first days after the laser or how does the after care look like? I'd very much like to get a co2 fractional ablative laser as well at some point. You are very brave for doing this and also have achieved nice improvement so far.
I actually over reacted yesterday. I was not familiar with the recovery process of ultrapulse Co2. The skin seems to break after the actual laser treatment which in my mind is backwards.Im starting to see my skin split, which is nice.Im about to upload todays pictures. Beware, it looks a little raw and peely.
This was Day 1 at 8am. Aquaphor dried out from last night. This is before my wash. I™m going to upload after my wash next.
Text applies to photo below:
This is after the vinegar wash. Then I applied aquaphor and antibiotic ointment prescribed by doctor. I mixed it. My Face is not itchy nor is it irritating in any way. I feel calm. Very unlike the erbium treatment in that sense. I love seeing my skin like this because it makes me feel like new cells and new skin are forming. I™m trying to wash every two hours, especially with how acne prone i can be with the aquaphor. I™m about to wash for the second time today right now. Is it normal for the white vinegar to sting very badly on my face?
10 hours ago, versefifty said:Have a good recovery! Do you know by any chance what settings the doctor used? Co2 ablative is usually very aggressive, it could be that she used mild settings.
Unfortunately no. I could ask her next time I see her, which is next week. Ill try to remember. And thank you
1 hour ago, JaysonC said:Is there a lot of crusting? Are you going to the clinic go get it checked and removed daily in the first days after the laser or how does the after care look like? I'd very much like to get a co2 fractional ablative laser as well at some point. You are very brave for doing this and also have achieved nice improvement so far.
I am not required to go to the clinic. I have an after care sheet provided by the doctors office. I posted the after care sheet above where the forms are. Its white vinegar, water, and a glaze pad socked and applied to face gently. Its supposed to remove the crusting. Then after, aquaphor is applied but before I do that I actually pat some cetaphil cleaners to remove any left over aquaphor from before and then apply the new aquaphor layer. Im trying to avoid breaking out a lot, but I am very sure I will break out either way.
I was right about the break outs. I guess it doesn™t take a rocket scientist to know that. This was a day or two after the photos you saw above. Very red as you can see. I™m not as red or perky anymore. The doctor said 7 days to heal, it took more like 4 days. I told assistant that and she said œoh you™re a fast healer. Could it be that? Or was the procedure mild? I™ll remind you that I™m the type to believe doctors are out to provide mild returns to the patient so that they can gain fatter returns to pay off the shiny Porsche.. so maybe I™m biased. However, I felt erbium was stronger, and much more wounded. It doesn™t help that I paid more for this recent procedure vs. the erbium but anyways let™s move on.
the photos below the red pictures are my left cheek with makeup on. I feel very demoralized today. And yet, I™m swollen. I get a mix of being grateful for what I am able to do and also saddens that I have to see myself in the mirror and feel my heart drop when the reflection isn™t smooth. Yeah, coming from me, someone who doesn™t usually like to sulk, I™m sulking. I have my days, days where I feel like I want to reincarnate to a new person and not deal with scars. Moments like that, where I realize how much of a toll this scar journey takes, makes me even more sad with myself. So yeah, that™s me saying that it™s been a tough day for me emotionally. I keep beating myself up. It™s the time and money and hopes that I can™t get back. My youth that I™m devoting to what feels like a hopeless cause. I literally said today œI hope we keep wearing masks and my sister said œyou just say that because of your scars and I realized she was right. I feel like hiding my own face sometimes. My scars are quite mild since the beginning of the journey but a part of me expects something grand. Maybe it™s my own expectations letting me down, telling myself that I™m just *one* magical treatment away, when I™m not. Or maybe I take the assistants words to me too literally during the negotiation process when I should know they would say almost anything for a sale. Anyways, this isn™t a diary entry so I™ll stop it here, haha. Got a little carried way there! Don™t hold it against me.
Just now, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:I was right about the break outs. I guess it doesn™t take a rocket scientist to know that. This was a day or two after the photos you saw above. Very red as you can see. I™m not as red or perky anymore. The doctor said 7 days to heal, it took more like 4 days. I told assistant that and she said œoh you™re a fast healer. Could it be that? Or was the procedure mild? I™ll remind you that I™m the type to believe doctors are out to provide mild returns to the patient so that they can gain fatter returns to pay off the shiny Porsche.. so maybe I™m biased. However, I felt erbium was stronger, and much more wounded. It doesn™t help that I paid more for this recent procedure vs. the erbium but anyways let™s move on.
the photos below the red pictures are my left cheek with makeup on. I feel very demoralized today. And yet, I™m swollen. I get a mix of being grateful for what I am able to do and also saddens that I have to see myself in the mirror and feel my heart drop when the reflection isn™t smooth. Yeah, coming from me, someone who doesn™t usually like to sulk, I™m sulking. I have my days, days where I feel like I want to reincarnate to a new person and not deal with scars. Moments like that, where I realize how much of a toll this scar journey takes, makes me even more sad with myself. So yeah, that™s me saying that it™s been a tough day for me emotionally. I keep beating myself up. It™s the time and money and hopes that I can™t get back. My youth that I™m devoting to what feels like a hopeless cause. I literally said today œI hope we keep wearing masks and my sister said œyou just say that because of your scars and I realized she was right. I feel like hiding my own face sometimes. My scars are quite mild since the beginning of the journey but a part of me expects something grand. Maybe it™s my own expectations letting me down, telling myself that I™m just *one* magical treatment away, when I™m not. Or maybe I take the assistants words to me too literally during the negotiation process when I should know they would say almost anything for a sale. Anyways, this isn™t a diary entry so I™ll stop it here, haha. Got a little carried way there! Don™t hold it against me.
The last two photos are my left cheek. The first one with fresh makeup (powder) to make the appearance of smooth pores and then the last photo is the makeup throughout the day, which isn™t even the truest form of my Scars because I™m still somewhat swollen and I™m even a little overweight from my normal weight. So yeah, I feel defeated today but it™s okay. My scars are literally 1% of my entire being so why do I focus on it 99% of the time? Nobody else does so why do I? That™s like my own pep talk. Logically, to be this depressed over my scars doesn™t make any sense yet here I am with these emotions of dread. It™s wild.
10 minutes ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:I was right about the break outs. I guess it doesn™t take a rocket scientist to know that. This was a day or two after the photos you saw above. Very red as you can see. I™m not as red or perky anymore. The doctor said 7 days to heal, it took more like 4 days. I told assistant that and she said œoh you™re a fast healer. Could it be that? Or was the procedure mild? I™ll remind you that I™m the type to believe doctors are out to provide mild returns to the patient so that they can gain fatter returns to pay off the shiny Porsche.. so maybe I™m biased. However, I felt erbium was stronger, and much more wounded. It doesn™t help that I paid more for this recent procedure vs. the erbium but anyways let™s move on.
the photos below the red pictures are my left cheek with makeup on. I feel very demoralized today. And yet, I™m swollen. I get a mix of being grateful for what I am able to do and also saddens that I have to see myself in the mirror and feel my heart drop when the reflection isn™t smooth. Yeah, coming from me, someone who doesn™t usually like to sulk, I™m sulking. I have my days, days where I feel like I want to reincarnate to a new person and not deal with scars. Moments like that, where I realize how much of a toll this scar journey takes, makes me even more sad with myself. So yeah, that™s me saying that it™s been a tough day for me emotionally. I keep beating myself up. It™s the time and money and hopes that I can™t get back. My youth that I™m devoting to what feels like a hopeless cause. I literally said today œI hope we keep wearing masks and my sister said œyou just say that because of your scars and I realized she was right. I feel like hiding my own face sometimes. My scars are quite mild since the beginning of the journey but a part of me expects something grand. Maybe it™s my own expectations letting me down, telling myself that I™m just *one* magical treatment away, when I™m not. Or maybe I take the assistants words to me too literally during the negotiation process when I should know they would say almost anything for a sale. Anyways, this isn™t a diary entry so I™ll stop it here, haha. Got a little carried way there! Don™t hold it against me.
The last two photos are my left cheek. The first one with fresh makeup (powder) to make the appearance of smooth pores and then the last photo is the makeup throughout the day, which isn™t even the truest form of my Scars because I™m still somewhat swollen and I™m even a little overweight from my normal weight. So yeah, I feel defeated today but it™s okay. My scars are literally 1% of my entire being so why do I focus on it 99% of the time? Nobody else does so why do I? That™s like my own pep talk. Logically, to be this depressed over my scars doesn™t make any sense yet here I am with these emotions of dread. It™s wild.
Don't be sad, it's still early. Your skin should continue to build collagen months after the procedure. I wouldn't accept these as final results, but it's looking good either way. Huge improvement from your starting point!
10 hours ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:I was right about the break outs. I guess it doesn™t take a rocket scientist to know that. This was a day or two after the photos you saw above. Very red as you can see. I™m not as red or perky anymore. The doctor said 7 days to heal, it took more like 4 days. I told assistant that and she said œoh you™re a fast healer. Could it be that? Or was the procedure mild? I™ll remind you that I™m the type to believe doctors are out to provide mild returns to the patient so that they can gain fatter returns to pay off the shiny Porsche.. so maybe I™m biased. However, I felt erbium was stronger, and much more wounded. It doesn™t help that I paid more for this recent procedure vs. the erbium but anyways let™s move on.
the photos below the red pictures are my left cheek with makeup on. I feel very demoralized today. And yet, I™m swollen. I get a mix of being grateful for what I am able to do and also saddens that I have to see myself in the mirror and feel my heart drop when the reflection isn™t smooth. Yeah, coming from me, someone who doesn™t usually like to sulk, I™m sulking. I have my days, days where I feel like I want to reincarnate to a new person and not deal with scars. Moments like that, where I realize how much of a toll this scar journey takes, makes me even more sad with myself. So yeah, that™s me saying that it™s been a tough day for me emotionally. I keep beating myself up. It™s the time and money and hopes that I can™t get back. My youth that I™m devoting to what feels like a hopeless cause. I literally said today œI hope we keep wearing masks and my sister said œyou just say that because of your scars and I realized she was right. I feel like hiding my own face sometimes. My scars are quite mild since the beginning of the journey but a part of me expects something grand. Maybe it™s my own expectations letting me down, telling myself that I™m just *one* magical treatment away, when I™m not. Or maybe I take the assistants words to me too literally during the negotiation process when I should know they would say almost anything for a sale. Anyways, this isn™t a diary entry so I™ll stop it here, haha. Got a little carried way there! Don™t hold it against me.
The last two photos are my left cheek. The first one with fresh makeup (powder) to make the appearance of smooth pores and then the last photo is the makeup throughout the day, which isn™t even the truest form of my Scars because I™m still somewhat swollen and I™m even a little overweight from my normal weight. So yeah, I feel defeated today but it™s okay. My scars are literally 1% of my entire being so why do I focus on it 99% of the time? Nobody else does so why do I? That™s like my own pep talk. Logically, to be this depressed over my scars doesn™t make any sense yet here I am with these emotions of dread. It™s wild.
There is something with laser, the thing is it actually makes it more uneven in the start texture wise but then it improves. Also two strategies to try could be to do sculptra and one moth later to rf microneedling, or another strategy could be subcision and suction. Have you ever tried subcision and suction. According to one study patient satisfaction rate was around 75 percent. I think this is the important metric when we look at study as the investigator could say that we had more improvement but the important part is do we see the improvement and what percent. Also after you suction the first 2 weeks your results are mostly same at 6 months meaning the results you see from suctioning is the final result you are seeing at the end. There are some side effects I believe but hey what doesn™t. Any invasive procedure has side effects.
21 minutes ago, getsmart121 said:There is something with laser, the thing is it actually makes it more uneven in the start texture wise but then it improves. Also two strategies to try could be to do sculptra and one moth later to rf microneedling, or another strategy could be subcision and suction. Have you ever tried subcision and suction. According to one study patient satisfaction rate was around 75 percent. I think this is the important metric when we look at study as the investigator could say that we had more improvement but the important part is do we see the improvement and what percent. Also after you suction the first 2 weeks you results are mostly same at 6 months meaning here is something about suctioning which is crucial.
I'm not moved by the idea of having filler as a long term solution. Something about filler really turns me off. I have filler now but that was placed at the same time of the laser treatment and subcision to produce collagen from under the scar (It wasn't my idea, it was the doctors and I agreed).I can't mentally break away from the fact that filler is like going to a doctor to help with hair loss and they give you a wig. I mean, sure the wig will look good but it doesn't help the actual hair loss situation, instead it masks it. This is how I view filler. Perhaps I am viewing it in a close minded way and I'm prideful but I want to know what my skin looks like without the temporary solutions. That's also to say that I don't like permanent filler either. I just want actual scar revision.
In terms of RF, I'm not sure. I like laser resurfacing. The problem is that I have ethnic skin and there is potential for hyperpigmentation which luckily hasn'thappened yet but its also because I believe these doctors use a mild setting. RF is a little boring for right now. Boring as in, I am excited by the potentials of laser resurfacing that at the moment RF is not as exciting.
I'm not against subcision and suction. I just don't know what else there is to subcise. My scars look lifted, not tethered. In my opinion, they are floating, they just have dents. Minus my boxcar on my right cheek, that one looks slightly tethered. My goal is to refine the skin so much that the dents flatten. Thats why I researched excision, because at least the scar gets removed and with my continued interest in laser scar revision, my scars could improve in a dramatic direction. The problem with excision is its (1) hard to gather evidence that it works, (2) find a doctor that has great experience in it (3) predicting my outcome is hard because I'm young and dark skinned and (4) the potential of the sutures opening or the sutures not being tied correctly and producing an even worse scar is what is holding me back.
Feel free to disagree with me on any of these topics, I know my view on things is a little black and white.
13 hours ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:My scars are literally 1% of my entire being so why do I focus on it 99% of the time? Nobody else does so why do I? Thats like my own pep talk. Logically, to be this depressed over my scars doesnt make any sense yet here I am with these emotions of dread. Its wild.
Just wanted to say yours scars have improved immensely from when you started. You need to get to a place where you accept what you currently see and not remember what you used to see (before treatments). Your scars are not bad at all and no ones going freak out out over them, go easy on yourself.
3 hours ago, NeedHelpwithscars said:Just wanted to say yours scars have improved immensely from when you started. You need to get to a place where you accept what you currently see and not remember what you used to see (before treatments). Your scars are not bad at all and no ones going freak out out over them, go easy on yourself.
Youre right and deep inside I know this. I still feel self conscious from time to time. Sometimes I feel like I carry a burden to be flawless to project to people that I am competent or able to perform a certain task or worthy ofbasic love and trust. Meaning that I place a lot of pressure on myself to look a certain way and the scars make me feel small, at times. But thats usually very rare for me because I try to be optimistic about the future.Its lately that I have been feeling depressed about it. Which reminds me, I should go to therapy to express myself and find ways to cope with things I cannot control.
On 7/24/2021 at 10:12 AM, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:I'm not moved by the idea of having filler as a long term solution. Something about filler really turns me off. I have filler now but that was placed at the same time of the laser treatment and subcision to produce collagen from under the scar (It wasn't my idea, it was the doctors and I agreed).I can't mentally break away from the fact that filler is like going to a doctor to help with hair loss and they give you a wig. I mean, sure the wig will look good but it doesn't help the actual hair loss situation, instead it masks it. This is how I view filler. Perhaps I am viewing it in a close minded way and I'm prideful but I want to know what my skin looks like without the temporary solutions. That's also to say that I don't like permanent filler either. I just want actual scar revision.
In terms of RF, I'm not sure. I like laser resurfacing. The problem is that I have ethnic skin and there is potential for hyperpigmentation which luckily hasn'thappened yet but its also because I believe these doctors use a mild setting. RF is a little boring for right now. Boring as in, I am excited by the potentials of laser resurfacing that at the moment RF is not as exciting.
I'm not against subcision and suction. I just don't know what else there is to subcise. My scars look lifted, not tethered. In my opinion, they are floating, they just have dents. Minus my boxcar on my right cheek, that one looks slightly tethered. My goal is to refine the skin so much that the dents flatten. Thats why I researched excision, because at least the scar gets removed and with my continued interest in laser scar revision, my scars could improve in a dramatic direction. The problem with excision is its (1) hard to gather evidence that it works, (2) find a doctor that has great experience in it (3) predicting my outcome is hard because I'm young and dark skinned and (4) the potential of the sutures opening or the sutures not being tied correctly and producing an even worse scar is what is holding me back.
Feel free to disagree with me on any of these topics, I know my view on things is a little black and white.
Your scars doesnt look deep enough for excision from the pictures. They are boxcars you should really target the edges of boxcar with laser co2 or erbium fully ablative that would be the best way to blend the surface in. Like you said your scars are lifted just need to ablate theedges.
there is no point in lasering the healthy skin as well.
also if you want to be sure of excision then see if the scar is deep if yes then take a blu marker and mark the scar and see you face in mirror if you feel besides the mark scars the face looks good then most likely you will be happy with excision if it is successful
6 hours ago, getsmart121 said:Your scars doesn™t look deep enough for excision from the pictures. They are boxcars you should really target the edges of boxcar with laser co2 or erbium fully ablative that would be the best way to blend the surface in. Like you said your scars are lifted just need to ablate the edges.
there is no point in lasering the healthy skin as well.
also if you want to be sure of excision then see if the scar is deep if yes then take a blu marker and mark the scar and see you face in mirror if you feel besides the mark scars the face looks good then most likely you will be happy with excision if it is successful
Yes, this box scar in specific is what I am thinking for excision.
It is on my right cheek. It wouldn't be the end of the world if I didn't excise it but it would bother me a bit if I did excise it and it got worse such as a larger depression or even a hypertrophic scar.
I think you are right in that lasering the whole skin would be pointless, just laser off the major scars. I might start microneedling the scars at home with a 15% tca peel on it. Probably in two months. What do you think? I recently started taking vitamins again (Vitamin a, iron, vitamin c with collagen) and I broke out on my jaw line and under my neck pretty badly. I started putting tarozarc on it even though my derm said to wait a month but I can't risk the acne becoming major cysts so I had to put the tarozarc. My skin is easing now, the acne is less on the jaw and neck. I didn't take the vitamins again. I'll probably take them one by one on different days to know which one is breaking me out.
2 hours ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:
Yes, this box scar in specific is what I am thinking for excision.
It is on my right cheek. It wouldn't be the end of the world if I didn't excise it but it would bother me a bit if I did excise it and it got worse such as a larger depression or even a hypertrophic scar.
I think you are right in that lasering the whole skin would be pointless, just laser off the major scars. I might start microneedling the scars at home with a 15% tca peel on it. Probably in two months. What do you think? I recently started taking vitamins again (Vitamin a, iron, vitamin c with collagen) and I broke out on my jaw line and under my neck pretty badly. I started putting tarozarc on it even though my derm said to wait a month but I can't risk the acne becoming major cysts so I had to put the tarozarc. My skin is easing now, the acne is less on the jaw and neck. I didn't take the vitamins again. I'll probably take them one by one on different days to know which one is breaking me out.
Again it™s not deep it™s just noticebele that™s all. Maybe tca and needling will work. A trained laser guy will keep ablating till he sees that the area is flattened. I know dr Taylor uses this technique with erbium laser because you can see the edges flattening.
does anyone know doctors that perform this technique of lasering. I never understood why are you ablating the whole surface equally for instance you don™t do cross on the complete face do you ? Then why should laser be done on the complete face. Unless if your whole face has tiny scars.
On 7/26/2021 at 2:25 PM, getsmart121 said:Again its not deep its just noticebele thats all. Maybe tca and needling will work. A trained laser guy will keep ablatingtillhe sees that the area is flattened. I know dr Taylor uses this technique with erbium laser because you can see the edges flattening.
does anyone know doctors that perform this technique of lasering. I never understood why are you ablating the whole surface equally for instance you dont do cross on the complete face do you ? Then why should laser be done on the complete face. Unless if your whole face has tiny scars.
I didnt see this until now. You have a valid point, doctors usually do treatments by area so I didnt think anything of it. I should do it by scar. I will ask the specialist next time.
On 7/28/2021 at 2:55 AM, downinthedms said:Can you please tell us which doctors you went to for each or majority of the procedures and where?
Hi. There are reasonsI do not say which doctor/specialistand where. I encourage you to look at specialist in your area or a doctor you think will provide you with results. Thats all that I did. The specialist I have gone havebasic knowledge on scarring and I dont really recommend any of them. If you notice, I move from specialist to specialist because whats important to me is price and procedure. I usually walk in with what I have in mind and I let the doctor adjust to what they think would be best for my scarring and I research their suggestions and try to decide if its best for me or not. Thats really all that I do because itusually involves machines such as lasers or RF which I think is not as complex to learn as say for example punch excision or grafting of some sort or even how to apply a chemical peel so anything that is complex I look for well known doctors. This is my outlook and opinion so some may not agree.
TLDR: I advise you to look for your own doctors in your area and do your research. Do not rely on specialists I have seen because I do not recommend any in particular.
Update:
One month approximately after the CO2 ultra pulse laser. I changed the angles to show scarring on how the lighting hits it. This is lighting in a gym restroom, overhead lighting. The first (4) images are my left side, my worst side. The next (4) images are my right side, with the large boxscar. There is probably still some swelling, I™m not sure but true results are three months after procedure, I have two more to go. I am wearing sunscreen and there is some sweat/sebum on my skin.
It™s a journey. These journey™s are long. Patience is needed. I am grateful for all the improvement I am able to receive. I™ll update again next month. Until then, I am continuing my skincare routine such as vitamin c, vitamin e, sunscreen, lactic acid mask once every two weeks, tarzarotene every night and AHA and BHA mask once a month.
