Hey,
So my doctor said he has seen great imrovement when shallow rolling scars and showed me pics. I also refer patients to him and everyone loves him. I have restalyne cheekbones and cheeks but not around the jawline. My skin texture is better because of retin a and vitamin c serum. My mom will spare no money in the world so if fat injections is what will help i will get, i cannot live like this. I have met people with fat injections in their scars and it made their skin better because of stem cells. Fat has to be processed properly. The lumps from subcision have to be drained. Those lumps can be dissolved but i rather lumps than scars! My doctor is George Yang in NYC he has pics up if u want to check. I asked my friends coworkers dont you notice my acne scars they go noo. I have The laser actually caused me to have some facial fat loss and i hope that doctors croaks somewhere!
Hey Brooklyn - I had a consultation with Dr. Yang actually and really liked him. He was one of the doctors I was considering but I ended up going with someone in NJ mostly because I would have to take the train to Dr. Yang and be all bruised up in public. What do you think went wrong with the laser - what doc was it? If no one notices your scars then you should feel pretty good about that! I'm so glad the restalyne worked out for you. The doc I saw prefers Juvederm for acne scars, I'm not sure why. Why didn't you do Resty along your jawline? Where did you meet people with fat injections? I know of no one who has had any scarring treated in any way.
hi michi31, i had treatments done on my cheek, but not jawline. before i decide to get those treatments, my doctor(previous) mentioned me that sub and fillers usually don't respond well for shallow scars(i went to see a few doctors and all doctors told me the exact same thing..). but he also said that those treatments might work, too... depend on skin types and scar types. so i decided to get them done. but i wasn't really aware of a risk getting lumps. i thought the risk of getting lumps are for much larger scars...but i was wrong... i prefer not to share my previous doctor's name yet, since my treatments didn't go well and i am suffering from the side effects...
i am now seeing a different doctor. I've already booked a few microdermabrasion treatments to improve my texture issue and hyperpigmentation. I really like my new doctor so far! i am planning to share his name once I see improvements on my skin after a few microdermabrasion sessions, he is going to recommend another treatment if necessary.
brooklyn718, I am glad you find a doctor you like hope your treatment will go well. Just watch out for lumps and other side effects. Many doctors say lumps from subcision can be drained. But many patients suffer from lumps developed by both sub and fillers, too. and trust me, they are not easy and not so simple to get rid of. especially if your scars are shallow, most likely lumps will be smaller, and there is no way to drain those small lumps..at least mine. My lumps can not be drained, and nothing i can do but massaging them(both previous and current doctor told me...) in some lighting, these small lumps look very bad...as if i have some allergy reactions or something...and those lump shapes are very weird...! just curious...how much you paid for your filler treatment?
i agree it's very frustrating to have acne scars, it affects your confidence level and social life...and it's very sad and frustrating for me to see my scars got worse from the treatments...when i am trying to get rid of them...but i hope my next treatments will go well for me!
good luck to both of you!
I can find out on how to go about draining them. The restalyne costed me around 500. The subcision im not sure yet because he does it as area not per scar. When i went to go show him my results from restalyne after swelling went down i met a girl there she had subcision and she needed one of her lumps drained and he did it. If you are close to NYC or need an online consult maybe u can contact him. If you want to better ur skin look into the obagi system, the vitamin c serums works great and i love it. I have hyperpigmentation and stuff and its gotten way better with retin a vit c serum.
michi... I do not have any scars on my jawline, chin,forehead, nose, around my mouth mostly upper cheeks by the cheekbones. I didnt have the juvederm done because they didnt have a full syringe and i needed a full one because the laser melted some fat under my eye not anything noticeable but it was very distressing to me. If you are going with subcision I think you should go with Dr.Yang. I feel like if i notice my scars why wouldnt others. I have pics of my scars in my old phone and I will upload them this weekend. My scars are noticeable in certain lights and when i move my bangs out of my face. Im in the medical field in the city for a large urgent care center and I meet all types of people and thats how I met someone with fat injections, they last many many years. I hope soon Dr. Yang will perform this for me. I would post the doctors name who did the laser but im trying to have his license taken away because I met a girl that he did this to as well.
I'm glad that you are taking action against that doc Brooklyn. These docs need to be held accountable. Why do you think Dr. Yang's subcision technique is superior to other docs? It is so hard to choose, and I was choosing between three experienced docs - so it came down to cost/travel.
Ah, George Yang is very well known on MakeMeHeal. http://messageboards.makemeheal.com/ The doctor gives very thorough responses to inquiries. I have had very good results from Fraxel Re:pair so my questions to him have always concerned plastic surgery. I am probably the oldest poster on here so my concerns are a little different than most. Before Re:pair I would say my skin was in worse shape than most of the pictures others have posted. I became the poster boy for my doctor and she now does Re:pair on me for $800 - full face and neck. Read some of Dr. Yang's posts.
http://messageboards.makemeheal.com/george-yang-doctor/
Another website that some, especially the ladies will find interesting. There is a lot about cosmetics, but there is also a lot about treatments.
http://www.essentialdayspa.com/forum/
Hey,
So my doctor said he has seen great imrovement when shallow rolling scars and showed me pics. I also refer patients to him and everyone loves him. I have restalyne cheekbones and cheeks but not around the jawline. My skin texture is better because of retin a and vitamin c serum. My mom will spare no money in the world so if fat injections is what will help i will get, i cannot live like this. I have met people with fat injections in their scars and it made their skin better because of stem cells. Fat has to be processed properly. The lumps from subcision have to be drained. Those lumps can be dissolved but i rather lumps than scars! My doctor is George Yang in NYC he has pics up if u want to check. I asked my friends coworkers dont you notice my acne scars they go noo. I have The laser actually caused me to have some facial fat loss and i hope that doctors croaks somewhere!
Yeah, Obagi are very strict about who can sell their products. I reported one seller one eBay once. Their store magically disappeared after a few weeks (not sure if it was because of my report or something else but clearly they were not allowed to sell the stuff online). Usually only skin care clinics and licensed estheticians can get their hands on it as technically you need to seek advice from a professional before you use it. Same goes for the products I use, Dermaquest. Just be wary of buying it online as yes, it could be fake, but it could also not be right for your skin.
I've tried to read from the start so apologies if i haven't considered anyone's responses ^^
Dermaroller works well for most atrophic-style scarring - however, it does little to improve the visual impact of Grade IV scars and is generally ineffective for ice-pick style as well - that is where all the medical reasearch points to.
Fraxel, other fractional lasers, and IPL for hypertrophic scarring work on a variety of levels - they attempt to coagulate the blood vessels that are feeding the scar, break down the fibrotic scar tissue, and plump out the indented area with more collagen, to reduce the 3-minensional abnormalities of the atrophy.
Radiofrequency is a paired treatment that creates thermal damage in the superficial layers of the skin... similar to but still different from laser. thermal damage by radiofrequency results in a higher proportion of elastin regrowth - the tissue that gives your skin its elasticity. monopolar RF has an infinite penetration depth technically... you don't need that. bipolar RF penetrates to half the depth between the RF poles, normally about 4-5 mm for an 11mm bipolar spacing. More than enough to trigger an appropriate response in scar tissue. Not meaning to plug any specific device but Syneron make ELOS machines which have both RF and laser at the same time.
LED phototherapy... the jury is still out on this one. Sitting under 660-670nm red light does improve collagen regeneration but this effect essentially stop 48 hours after your last treatment, so this is much more effective as a home therapy than anything else. Blue light 435nm is excellent for its bactericidal qualities in acne, but this is a prevention method - it will do nothign for already-formed scars. Green, yellow light... sorry, there is some really weird stuff coming out of the generic factories in CHina and even some local manufacturers and distributors have jumped on the bandwagond for these. No evidence, and i've yet to encounter even plausible anecdotal evidence.
low-level-laser therapy - this one is a bit dodgy, but actually close to my heart becasue it was my firt time to use laser as a professional. Cell histology studies show that using LLLT on repairing skin helps to order your collagen more effectively (scar tissues are one big clumped up mess) to make it more accurately resemble skin. Unfortunately, while the microscopic evidence is compelling, there are no real world results I can speak of. I still do use LLLT in cases of delayed wound healing, where it has strong evidence of benefit.
I think Quirky mentioned that the results fomr laser and dermaroller are permanent... well, that depends. It depends on where the scar 'node' is located. For example, i can use microdermabrasion to slough off the very superficial layers of the stratum corneum, but that would only improve appearance temporarily, because most of the damage is another 2-3 mm into the skin. Similarly, because atrophic scars result from lost volume in the skin, the collagen-boosting effect of fraxel and dermarollers help to mask this volume loss. As your skin continues to age and collagen depletes, these scars may resurface slowly. If you are lucky enough that the scar mass sits at the epidermal-dermal junction, it is theoretically possible that needling under this mass will push the scar tissue up into the stratum corneum, which will subsequently get expunged as your SC renews itself. I say theoretical becasue even though i have done this on myself, i'm not 100% sure if this is the accurate physiological reasoning behind what I see.
subcision is, for want of a better word, the economical gold standard for most ice-pick scars. there is simply no other treatment on the market that can selectively target fibrous scar connections underneath the surface of the skin. To extrapolate what I mean to another area of cosmetics, this is exactly the problem we face with cellulite, which are scar adhesions that anchor your skin to underlying tissue.
subcision followed by dermal filler and supplemented with needling is great if you are confident enough to do it yourself, although probably not cost-effective if you trie d to get professional intervention. Using a dermapen or any of those variants, treatments RRP at 300/session. AN alternative is getting saline injections just un the subcised area - this stimulates the same inflammatory/collagen creating response the plumps your skin. The same technique, practised in other parts of your body for tendon and cartilaginous joint healing , is loosely called prolotherapy.
I sell Dermaquest and while I disapprove of their marketing, there is some solid science backing most of their product lines. Not too sure what they woudl do for scarring specifically but post-laser procedures I use a Dermaquest post laser lotion containing copper, silver and zinc that suppresses bacterial activity and excessive inflammatory responses.
Silicon sheeting and silver/aluminium/copper impregnated dressings help with wound healing in general. Bad scarring results from excess protein production in injured tissue due to excessive stimulation by or an excessive response from inflammatory chemicals in the local area. Suppressing bacteria and suppressing inflammation therefore have flow-on positive effects for wound healing and scar formation. Silicon sheeting is used quite extensively in burns scarring but obviously it is more impractical for facial areas. I have been trying to obtain silicon gel for scarring for almost six months now and cannot find anyone who is able to produce it cost-effectively.
With the exception of LED, i have used all modalities on myself and on clients previously. Ii'm not aware of too much more out there... alot of focus is being given to cellular signalling, which is a form of scar prevention. There could be other treatments out there in the wilderness but I have not found them, or found them unremarkable 
Okay so I apologize as this is going to be long! I'm covering everything I've read on these boards and some new stuff that I have read about science that relates to scar tissue.
Okay, first off I had subcision done back in June, my improvement was not that much, but at the same time I was thinking very negatively about the whole process, so I kind of blame myself if that makes sense?
There is science that backs a lot of this up, it's not necessarily theories either.
Right now, I am looking into having fat injections , fat transfer , blood injections , or dermal grafts. I am wanting people to post their experiences with these, and their percentage of improvement. I want to also mention that I needled one scar on my forehead back in June (only half of it) and it filled it like 100% on that half. It's the weirdest thing, but I am having trouble getting the other side to fill in. It is a linear scar. This website and the internet is packed full of information to get rid of scars, almost to the point where they are not noticeable anymore.
I would reference what I'm about to write, but you will probably have to look it up for yourself, because I know you can't post websites on here.
I have seen numerous posts whether it be on other sites or this one, where fat transfers or fat injections & dermal grafts have significantly improved or gotten rid of scars. There is logic behind this, scientists have recently discovered (in July it was posted) a stem cell in liposuctioned fat that has the ability to adapt to whatever part of the body you inject it in.
"The stem cells discovered in adipose, or fat tissue, are considered "pluripotent," meaning they can be differentiated into essentially any type of body cell, making them potentially useful for a variety of medical uses. Researchers believe that pluripotent stem cells will be used to treat neurological disorders such as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's Diseases.
Until the most recent discovery, made by University of CaliforniaLos Angeles researcher Gregorio Chazenbalk and described in the journal PLOS ONE, the two main types of pluripotent stem cells were embryonic and induced pluripotent cells, which are made by re-engineering skin cells. Several years ago, scientists discovered stem cells in fat tissue that could not be differentiated into other types of cells. According to Chazenbalk, the newly-discovered pluripotent stem cells that exist in fat tissue are known as Muse-AT cells and are particularly stress-resistant, meaning they would be useful for treating traumatic injuries.
This population of cells lies dormant in the fat tissue until it is subjected to very harsh conditions. These cells can survive in conditions in which usually only cancer cells can live," he says. "When you have an injury, it's a harsh environment for cells there is inflammation and apoptosis (mass cellular death). Anything you put there has a low chance of survival. But these cells are already adapted to the stress, and when you put them in damaged tissue, they can survive at high rates.
Unlike embryonic and induced pluripotent stem cells, Muse-AT cells show no evidence of developing teratoma, a cancer-like situation where stem cells rapidly divide until a tumor develops. The development of teratoma has made the clinical application of embryonic stem cell therapies slower than many scientists would like.
"This is a huge advantage because you don't have to re-engineer them to not produce teratomas," he says. "These cells are likely to play a critical role for tissue regeneration in the event of acute injury.""
Okay so this would explain why there is clinical evidence that shows when people get fat injections/or fat transfers the quality of skin texture improves too. There is also another thread I read on here about blood injections & fat transfers. It also relates to why subcision works for some people . Anyway hopefully this gives some people some home. Stem cells really are the future...well NOW. I am looking for people that have had positive experiences with fat transfer, dermal grafts, fat injections etc. Thanks. Please forgive me I'm not an organized person, my mind is a little over active...lol
hey,
I had the restalyne for about three weeks now so far no lumps or anything. I do trust the doctor i go to, he performs subcision but does it differently than other doctors, all you are required is one treatment. I did not know fillers can make ur skin sag! Im just so tired of this. This is nothing we asked for, i feel like i got punished, so many of my relationships got ruined because of my acne scars. Im constantly insecure, im tired of wearing make up and hair in my fac because of this bullshit. Im looking into a fat transfer because I had enough of this embarrassment and feeling ugly and dirty. I feel like if i CANT ACCEPT MYSELF HOW CAN ANOTHER PERSON? This is such an emotional roller coaster. I think i have one boxscar and the rest are rolling they are mainly on my cheekbones. I have been seeing this guy he has seen me without make up, bright florescent light, daytime light and has said nothing about it. My best friend said she never realized I had acne scars until i said something. I have dated a lot and no one had complained about my skin to me yet. Im scared that one day this guy will be like what the eff happened to ur skin. I have no one to talk to about this, because people say its not bad and not noticeable.
I feel the same way! I always think how unfair it is to have scars and as I am still battling acne as well this makes it worse. I have never talked to anyone about it as I am so embarrassed. I also cover up with make up and hide my face, I think I have developed a social phobia as I fear people are staring at my bad skin so I prefer to stay home. I have been with my partner for 3 years and he has never mentioned it. Once a child said my skin was all uneven and not smooth lol, kids tell the truth!!
Would love to see before and after pics, I also have shallow scars and thinking about a filler.
Hi There,
I have rolling acne scars, and have tried many different treatments. I had 2 laser resurfacing treatments which were ok but not a great improvement and left me with pigmentation problems. I have also tried Subscision and needling with the tattoo gun, again not much improvement. I bought a Derma roller and have done around 7 sessions and around 4 sessions with a Derma stamp. This has helped quite a bit and has kept costs down. I really like the Derma stamp, as it's affordable, easy to use and quite effective. I also bought a Baiden mitten which helps exfoliate and help my skin look good. There's lots of good treatments out there it's just trial and error really.
On 8/26/2013 at 12:50 AM, zanyzo said:Hi There,
I have rolling acne scars, and have tried many different treatments. I had 2 laser resurfacing treatments which were ok but not a great improvement and left me with pigmentation problems. I have also tried Subscision and needling with the tattoo gun, again not much improvement. I bought a Derma roller and have done around 7 sessions and around 4 sessions with a Derma stamp. This has helped quite a bit and has kept costs down. I really like the Derma stamp, as it's affordable, easy to use and quite effective. I also bought a Baiden mitten which helps exfoliate and help my skin look good. There's lots of good treatments out there it's just trial and error really.
I completely agree. You're post definitely gives me hope. I am going to purchase a derma roller soon. I am thinking about purchasing the 1.5 mm one. In your opinion how often do you think I should roll? I have see some on here that generally recommend 4-6 weeks in between and then some people roll once a week or every five days. I found some information & please don't think I'm a nut for posting it. I've noticed people using expensive serums and topicals after they dermaroll, and what I have read states that our own saliva has growth factor and repair properties and proteins in it. These are some of the same kind of proteins and stuff these fancy & expensive creams try to mimic. I won't go into too much here, but I just thought I would mention it. I am not recommending it, but yeah I've been doing that myself. lol I don't care how crazy it sounds.
""This study not only answers the biological question of why animals lick their wounds," said Gerald Weissmann, MD, Editor-in-Chief of The FASEB Journal, "it also explains why wounds in the mouth, like those of a tooth extraction, heal much faster than comparable wounds of the skin and bone. It also directs us to begin looking at saliva as a source for new drugs.""
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/07/080723094841.htmz
Check out this website too
[Removed]
Sorry to be random again, but I am also interested in hearing from people that have had successful and permanent fat grafting. I know there are many members on the org that have had it done, but they no longer come on here. I know the method if done correctly most of the fat will live. I understand a few sessions are required in order to ensure satisfaction and permanence. I also know it all depends on how the doctor harvests & injects it. I also read somewhere that a little bit of alcohol consumption is actually good after a fat transfer, because it encourages blood vessels to latch on to the fat & keep it alive. (There's a fancier term for it of course) I'm going to start another thread in hopes of people will send me information, doctors that are skilled in fat grafting for scars & dermal grafts.
Hi There,
I bought the Dr Roller 3 Line, 1.5mm Derma roller and the Titanium Needle Derma stamp 1.5mm from Ebay. I just purchased a new Derma stamp from Ebay * Moderator Edit, No Links Allowed, review the board rules.* I would recommend that you do the treatments every 4-6 weeks as it gives the skin time to heal. My regime is as follows:
- Wash and dry the area to be treated
- Apply numbing cream for around 45 mins and wipe clean after
- Derma Roll/stamp skin, following instructions
- Clean area with Distilled witch hazel
- Use a collagen boosting cream (I use Terproline as suggested by another user from here).
I hope this helps. I totally agree with your comments about saliva, It is a natural healer and worth looking into. I will look at the links you sent, thanks for that. I will try anything that helps, this site is great as we can all help each other. Its good genuine advice, we are all in the same boat and its better to hear from real people that have tried and tested these treatments. But sometimes some people have different success than others, but it's all worth a try. I haven't tried Fat transfer yet but have thought a lot about it and would like to try. I hear Juvederm is good, but think our own fat may react better as it's our own and is less likely to be rejected. Are you in the UK? I am in the UK. I would like to chat with you some more, would be good to discuss our ideas.
Hi There,
I bought the Dr Roller 3 Line, 1.5mm Derma roller and the Titanium Needle Derma stamp 1.5mm from Ebay. I just purchased a new Derma stamp from Ebay * Moderator Edit, No Links Allowed, review the board rules.* I would recommend that you do the treatments every 4-6 weeks as it gives the skin time to heal. My regime is as follows:
- Wash and dry the area to be treated
- Apply numbing cream for around 45 mins and wipe clean after
- Derma Roll/stamp skin, following instructions
- Clean area with Distilled witch hazel
- Use a collagen boosting cream (I use Terproline as suggested by another user from here).
I hope this helps. I totally agree with your comments about saliva, It is a natural healer and worth looking into. I will look at the links you sent, thanks for that. I will try anything that helps, this site is great as we can all help each other. Its good genuine advice, we are all in the same boat and its better to hear from real people that have tried and tested these treatments. But sometimes some people have different success than others, but it's all worth a try. I haven't tried Fat transfer yet but have thought a lot about it and would like to try. I hear Juvederm is good, but think our own fat may react better as it's our own and is less likely to be rejected. Are you in the UK? I am in the UK. I would like to chat with you some more, would be good to discuss our ideas.
I appreciate your response, I'm going to buy a derma roller soon. Can't wait to start rolling, what is your downtime like afterwards? Or was there any?If i used make up would that hide it? I got the idea of saliva, because many people have used it. Also, whenever I cry it starts healing my face, it's so weird actually. But there is so much LOGIC behind it that I could go on all day and explain why. I feel your emotions during healing are more important than anything. it's complicated..and no i don't live in the uk =/ but it's awesome having a friend there (you) you should check out my other thread i have recently started it contains good information and i hope it continues to grow
Hi There,
I bought the Dr Roller 3 Line, 1.5mm Derma roller and the Titanium Needle Derma stamp 1.5mm from Ebay. I just purchased a new Derma stamp from Ebay * Moderator Edit, No Links Allowed, review the board rules.* I would recommend that you do the treatments every 4-6 weeks as it gives the skin time to heal. My regime is as follows:
- Wash and dry the area to be treated
- Apply numbing cream for around 45 mins and wipe clean after
- Derma Roll/stamp skin, following instructions
- Clean area with Distilled witch hazel
- Use a collagen boosting cream (I use Terproline as suggested by another user from here).
I hope this helps. I totally agree with your comments about saliva, It is a natural healer and worth looking into. I will look at the links you sent, thanks for that. I will try anything that helps, this site is great as we can all help each other. Its good genuine advice, we are all in the same boat and its better to hear from real people that have tried and tested these treatments. But sometimes some people have different success than others, but it's all worth a try. I haven't tried Fat transfer yet but have thought a lot about it and would like to try. I hear Juvederm is good, but think our own fat may react better as it's our own and is less likely to be rejected. Are you in the UK? I am in the UK. I would like to chat with you some more, would be good to discuss our ideas.
I appreciate your response, I'm going to buy a derma roller soon. Can't wait to start rolling, what is your downtime like afterwards? Or was there any?If i used make up would that hide it? I got the idea of saliva, because many people have used it. Also, whenever I cry it starts healing my face, it's so weird actually. But there is so much LOGIC behind it that I could go on all day and explain why. I feel your emotions during healing are more important than anything. it's complicated..and no i don't live in the uk =/ but it's awesome having a friend there (you) you should check out my other thread i have recently started it contains good information and i hope it continues to grow
Not much down time really, around a day of redness but it all depends on your skin type. I usually do my treatments on a Friday night so i have the weekend to let my skin heal and breath. We are now Derma rolling friends lol. Are u in the UK? If so we can maybe talk over the phone if you want about this stuff
Okay so I apologize as this is going to be long! I'm covering everything I've read on these boards and some new stuff that I have read about science that relates to scar tissue.
Okay, first off I had subcision done back in June, my improvement was not that much, but at the same time I was thinking very negatively about the whole process, so I kind of blame myself if that makes sense?
There is science that backs a lot of this up, it's not necessarily theories either.
Right now, I am looking into having fat injections , fat transfer , blood injections , or dermal grafts. I am wanting people to post their experiences with these, and their percentage of improvement. I want to also mention that I needled one scar on my forehead back in June (only half of it) and it filled it like 100% on that half. It's the weirdest thing, but I am having trouble getting the other side to fill in. It is a linear scar. This website and the internet is packed full of information to get rid of scars, almost to the point where they are not noticeable anymore.
I would reference what I'm about to write, but you will probably have to look it up for yourself, because I know you can't post websites on here.
I have seen numerous posts whether it be on other sites or this one, where fat transfers or fat injections & dermal grafts have significantly improved or gotten rid of scars. There is logic behind this, scientists have recently discovered (in July it was posted) a stem cell in liposuctioned fat that has the ability to adapt to whatever part of the body you inject it in.
"The stem cells discovered in adipose, or fat tissue, are considered "pluripotent," meaning they can be differentiated into essentially any type of body cell, making them potentially useful for a variety of medical uses. Researchers believe that pluripotent stem cells will be used to treat neurological disorders such as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's Diseases.
Until the most recent discovery, made by University of CaliforniaLos Angeles researcher Gregorio Chazenbalk and described in the journal PLOS ONE, the two main types of pluripotent stem cells were embryonic and induced pluripotent cells, which are made by re-engineering skin cells. Several years ago, scientists discovered stem cells in fat tissue that could not be differentiated into other types of cells. According to Chazenbalk, the newly-discovered pluripotent stem cells that exist in fat tissue are known as Muse-AT cells and are particularly stress-resistant, meaning they would be useful for treating traumatic injuries.
This population of cells lies dormant in the fat tissue until it is subjected to very harsh conditions. These cells can survive in conditions in which usually only cancer cells can live," he says. "When you have an injury, it's a harsh environment for cells there is inflammation and apoptosis (mass cellular death). Anything you put there has a low chance of survival. But these cells are already adapted to the stress, and when you put them in damaged tissue, they can survive at high rates.
Unlike embryonic and induced pluripotent stem cells, Muse-AT cells show no evidence of developing teratoma, a cancer-like situation where stem cells rapidly divide until a tumor develops. The development of teratoma has made the clinical application of embryonic stem cell therapies slower than many scientists would like.
"This is a huge advantage because you don't have to re-engineer them to not produce teratomas," he says. "These cells are likely to play a critical role for tissue regeneration in the event of acute injury.""
Okay so this would explain why there is clinical evidence that shows when people get fat injections/or fat transfers the quality of skin texture improves too. There is also another thread I read on here about blood injections & fat transfers. It also relates to why subcision works for some people . Anyway hopefully this gives some people some home. Stem cells really are the future...well NOW. I am looking for people that have had positive experiences with fat transfer, dermal grafts, fat injections etc. Thanks. Please forgive me I'm not an organized person, my mind is a little over active...lol
I had dermal grafts. It worked well. On some scars it worked better than others. The best areas, probably a 90%+ improvement, on the worst maybe 60%. It's not a miracle treatment though, if you think it will restore your skin back to how it looked before you even had acne, you'll probably be disappointed.
Okay so I apologize as this is going to be long! I'm covering everything I've read on these boards and some new stuff that I have read about science that relates to scar tissue.
Okay, first off I had subcision done back in June, my improvement was not that much, but at the same time I was thinking very negatively about the whole process, so I kind of blame myself if that makes sense?
There is science that backs a lot of this up, it's not necessarily theories either.
Right now, I am looking into having fat injections , fat transfer , blood injections , or dermal grafts. I am wanting people to post their experiences with these, and their percentage of improvement. I want to also mention that I needled one scar on my forehead back in June (only half of it) and it filled it like 100% on that half. It's the weirdest thing, but I am having trouble getting the other side to fill in. It is a linear scar. This website and the internet is packed full of information to get rid of scars, almost to the point where they are not noticeable anymore.
I would reference what I'm about to write, but you will probably have to look it up for yourself, because I know you can't post websites on here.
I have seen numerous posts whether it be on other sites or this one, where fat transfers or fat injections & dermal grafts have significantly improved or gotten rid of scars. There is logic behind this, scientists have recently discovered (in July it was posted) a stem cell in liposuctioned fat that has the ability to adapt to whatever part of the body you inject it in.
"The stem cells discovered in adipose, or fat tissue, are considered "pluripotent," meaning they can be differentiated into essentially any type of body cell, making them potentially useful for a variety of medical uses. Researchers believe that pluripotent stem cells will be used to treat neurological disorders such as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's Diseases.
Until the most recent discovery, made by University of CaliforniaLos Angeles researcher Gregorio Chazenbalk and described in the journal PLOS ONE, the two main types of pluripotent stem cells were embryonic and induced pluripotent cells, which are made by re-engineering skin cells. Several years ago, scientists discovered stem cells in fat tissue that could not be differentiated into other types of cells. According to Chazenbalk, the newly-discovered pluripotent stem cells that exist in fat tissue are known as Muse-AT cells and are particularly stress-resistant, meaning they would be useful for treating traumatic injuries.
This population of cells lies dormant in the fat tissue until it is subjected to very harsh conditions. These cells can survive in conditions in which usually only cancer cells can live," he says. "When you have an injury, it's a harsh environment for cells there is inflammation and apoptosis (mass cellular death). Anything you put there has a low chance of survival. But these cells are already adapted to the stress, and when you put them in damaged tissue, they can survive at high rates.
Unlike embryonic and induced pluripotent stem cells, Muse-AT cells show no evidence of developing teratoma, a cancer-like situation where stem cells rapidly divide until a tumor develops. The development of teratoma has made the clinical application of embryonic stem cell therapies slower than many scientists would like.
"This is a huge advantage because you don't have to re-engineer them to not produce teratomas," he says. "These cells are likely to play a critical role for tissue regeneration in the event of acute injury.""
Okay so this would explain why there is clinical evidence that shows when people get fat injections/or fat transfers the quality of skin texture improves too. There is also another thread I read on here about blood injections & fat transfers. It also relates to why subcision works for some people . Anyway hopefully this gives some people some home. Stem cells really are the future...well NOW. I am looking for people that have had positive experiences with fat transfer, dermal grafts, fat injections etc. Thanks. Please forgive me I'm not an organized person, my mind is a little over active...lol
I had dermal grafts. It worked well. On some scars it worked better than others. The best areas, probably a 90%+ improvement, on the worst maybe 60%. It's not a miracle treatment though, if you think it will restore your skin back to how it looked before you even had acne, you'll probably be disappointed.
Even 60% is very significant though!! I'm just curious, can you tell based on the colour of skin or texture where the grafts are? Or do they blend in?
Okay so I apologize as this is going to be long! I'm covering everything I've read on these boards and some new stuff that I have read about science that relates to scar tissue.
Okay, first off I had subcision done back in June, my improvement was not that much, but at the same time I was thinking very negatively about the whole process, so I kind of blame myself if that makes sense?
There is science that backs a lot of this up, it's not necessarily theories either.
Right now, I am looking into having fat injections , fat transfer , blood injections , or dermal grafts. I am wanting people to post their experiences with these, and their percentage of improvement. I want to also mention that I needled one scar on my forehead back in June (only half of it) and it filled it like 100% on that half. It's the weirdest thing, but I am having trouble getting the other side to fill in. It is a linear scar. This website and the internet is packed full of information to get rid of scars, almost to the point where they are not noticeable anymore.
I would reference what I'm about to write, but you will probably have to look it up for yourself, because I know you can't post websites on here.
I have seen numerous posts whether it be on other sites or this one, where fat transfers or fat injections & dermal grafts have significantly improved or gotten rid of scars. There is logic behind this, scientists have recently discovered (in July it was posted) a stem cell in liposuctioned fat that has the ability to adapt to whatever part of the body you inject it in.
"The stem cells discovered in adipose, or fat tissue, are considered "pluripotent," meaning they can be differentiated into essentially any type of body cell, making them potentially useful for a variety of medical uses. Researchers believe that pluripotent stem cells will be used to treat neurological disorders such as Parkinson's and Alzheimer's Diseases.
Until the most recent discovery, made by University of CaliforniaLos Angeles researcher Gregorio Chazenbalk and described in the journal PLOS ONE, the two main types of pluripotent stem cells were embryonic and induced pluripotent cells, which are made by re-engineering skin cells. Several years ago, scientists discovered stem cells in fat tissue that could not be differentiated into other types of cells. According to Chazenbalk, the newly-discovered pluripotent stem cells that exist in fat tissue are known as Muse-AT cells and are particularly stress-resistant, meaning they would be useful for treating traumatic injuries.
This population of cells lies dormant in the fat tissue until it is subjected to very harsh conditions. These cells can survive in conditions in which usually only cancer cells can live," he says. "When you have an injury, it's a harsh environment for cells there is inflammation and apoptosis (mass cellular death). Anything you put there has a low chance of survival. But these cells are already adapted to the stress, and when you put them in damaged tissue, they can survive at high rates.
Unlike embryonic and induced pluripotent stem cells, Muse-AT cells show no evidence of developing teratoma, a cancer-like situation where stem cells rapidly divide until a tumor develops. The development of teratoma has made the clinical application of embryonic stem cell therapies slower than many scientists would like.
"This is a huge advantage because you don't have to re-engineer them to not produce teratomas," he says. "These cells are likely to play a critical role for tissue regeneration in the event of acute injury.""
Okay so this would explain why there is clinical evidence that shows when people get fat injections/or fat transfers the quality of skin texture improves too. There is also another thread I read on here about blood injections & fat transfers. It also relates to why subcision works for some people . Anyway hopefully this gives some people some home. Stem cells really are the future...well NOW. I am looking for people that have had positive experiences with fat transfer, dermal grafts, fat injections etc. Thanks. Please forgive me I'm not an organized person, my mind is a little over active...lol
I had dermal grafts. It worked well. On some scars it worked better than others. The best areas, probably a 90%+ improvement, on the worst maybe 60%. It's not a miracle treatment though, if you think it will restore your skin back to how it looked before you even had acne, you'll probably be disappointed.
Even 60% is very significant though!! I'm just curious, can you tell based on the colour of skin or texture where the grafts are? Or do they blend in?
They blend in eventually, but it takes some time though.
Here's the thing about 60% or even 90% improvement, though. I was initially very happy with the improvement, because before I had seen no improvement with past treatments. But then, you become used to the way your skin looks and start finding more imperfections and start wanting more. Don't get me wrong. If I look at how my scarring looked before treatments and how it looks now, there is a visible difference, but I think our minds are just trained to see what's wrong. At least that is the way it is for me.
Hi There,
I bought the Dr Roller 3 Line, 1.5mm Derma roller and the Titanium Needle Derma stamp 1.5mm from Ebay. I just purchased a new Derma stamp from Ebay * Moderator Edit, No Links Allowed, review the board rules.* I would recommend that you do the treatments every 4-6 weeks as it gives the skin time to heal. My regime is as follows:
- Wash and dry the area to be treated
- Apply numbing cream for around 45 mins and wipe clean after
- Derma Roll/stamp skin, following instructions
- Clean area with Distilled witch hazel
- Use a collagen boosting cream (I use Terproline as suggested by another user from here).
I hope this helps. I totally agree with your comments about saliva, It is a natural healer and worth looking into. I will look at the links you sent, thanks for that. I will try anything that helps, this site is great as we can all help each other. Its good genuine advice, we are all in the same boat and its better to hear from real people that have tried and tested these treatments. But sometimes some people have different success than others, but it's all worth a try. I haven't tried Fat transfer yet but have thought a lot about it and would like to try. I hear Juvederm is good, but think our own fat may react better as it's our own and is less likely to be rejected. Are you in the UK? I am in the UK. I would like to chat with you some more, would be good to discuss our ideas.
I appreciate your response, I'm going to buy a derma roller soon. Can't wait to start rolling, what is your downtime like afterwards? Or was there any?If i used make up would that hide it? I got the idea of saliva, because many people have used it. Also, whenever I cry it starts healing my face, it's so weird actually. But there is so much LOGIC behind it that I could go on all day and explain why. I feel your emotions during healing are more important than anything. it's complicated..and no i don't live in the uk =/ but it's awesome having a friend there (you) you should check out my other thread i have recently started it contains good information and i hope it continues to grow
Not much down time really, around a day of redness but it all depends on your skin type. I usually do my treatments on a Friday night so i have the weekend to let my skin heal and breath. We are now Derma rolling friends lol. Are u in the UK? If so we can maybe talk over the phone if you want about this stuff
good to know people are from the UK!
So where did you get your derma stamp from? this in conjunction with a baiden mitten seems to be what you advocate? i ACTUALLY have a baiden mitten btw!
I am tempted to use a derma stamp though I have got shallow scaring from squeezing black heads out of my skin situated around my nose and the frontal cheek area (so when you look straight ahead) and unfortunately picking at an outbreak over a year ago that was caused from using emu oil... which ironically i was using to try and heal my skin... great 
anyway the texture, tone and look of my skin is very patchy, red, pitted and it upsets me quite a bit, especially as i am a guy so cant just cover it with make up...
what does distilled witch hazel do? and where would you buy it? have you or anyone reading this used rose water before?
sorry for all the questions, its just you guys seem more knowledgable than me on this stuff and I dont know what route to take, thinking of microdermabrasion?
thanks so much for your time