You look great, and I still wish I had your abs. LOL Progress will sneak up on you after the initial decline. I didn't initially think I made much progress after my 5th Re:pair after the swelling went down, and then 6 months later I noticed the improvement. This really is a process that it pays to stick with. Too many people get treated at too low a mj and are dissatisfied and quit before they realize the real power of the laser.
I can definitely see why you say Fraxel:Repair is not a one and done treatment. Considering how much I was bleeding, I really did not have much skin ablated off at all to be honest. So most of my scar improvement has to come from collagen production over time as you say. This is a bit mind boggling to me because I thought all fractional CO2 lasers remove quite a bit of skin.
My doctor also mentioned she used a 100% ablated NON-fractional Co2 laser under my eyes called the Ultrapulse, which is one of the only "smooth beam" traditional Co2 lasers still on the market. This would explain why my skin literally fell off in a thick huge chunk after a day or 2. She said she may have to use the Ultrapulse again on my scars to get a better result, as my skin healed from that Fully ablated Co2 rather quickly. I would even argue my skin healed faster under the eyes then where they did the Fraxel:Repair. My skin is very streaky reddish where they did the repair but under the eyes the skin is more pinkish and natural looking where they used the Ultrapulse.
I have been back to work for almost 3 days now and my skin is obviously very red, I may even say it is begininng to hyperpigment on the cheeks as it appears to be slightly more brownish then red, but it is hard to say as my skin is about 10 different colors right now. The funny thing is, NOBODY has commented on my skin at all. I have walked into many home owners houses (as I work in construction, as a on-call repair man) , face red and streaky as can be, not 1 comment. My coworkers ( whom by the way are REAL, total assholes, and would not hesitate to laugh at me if they knew I had a laser treatment) haven't made so much as a peak either. It is a bit mind boggling to me. Not so much as a , " HEY DUDE YOU LOOK LIKE YOU REALLY GOT SUNBURNED unevenly" or anything.
I can definitely see why so many people make complaints about CO2 fractionated lasers for a few reasons. Your skin looks so smooth and scar-free after the laser treatment (due to swelling), that once the swelling goes down, you get this idea in your head that your skin not only did not improve, but got worse. Another would be the how streaky, red, pink, brownish, uneven pigment , discolored your skin looks, it makes your skin look really.... bad. It really makes it appear like you have wrinkles and terrible skin all over your face, but it is just the odd coloring. I also see a slightly noticeable line of decarnation where they used the fully CO2 ablated laser under my eyes. Actually, I can only see one line, under the eye, under perfect light. I would imagine because I don't see it anywhere else it will fade as my skin comes back, but I will definitely ask my doc on the next post-op ( in 3 days).
As much as I would like to comment on the results, I will hold off until my skin color returns to normal and as the collagen -hopefully- gets produced as I continue to "heal". I'll post photos later but I don't see a point now. My red face does not really show up too well on the photos and I don't think there will be any noticeable improvements as of yet.
I have a real hard time believing in "collagen production" over time from lasers in regards to how it will improve scars like mine (shallow boxcar and maybe a few icepick scars) but I will continue being optimistic. I have read several studies from Pubmed.gov that show many people have only "marked" improvement after month 1 but by month 3 they showed "significant" improvement in photos, so who knows.
Dudley what time of scars did you have?
Thank you for the update, collegeboy84. Hopefully your redness and hyperpigmentation will go away soon, and you'll be able to see more improvements from this treatment =)
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
The final results will not be evident until about 6 months. Lasers are a funny thing. First you see great results, then the microswelling goes down and your improvement diminishes and then the collagen formation takes place and you get a rebound improvement. Multiple treatments are almost always indicated for acne scars. I always allow at least 6 months between lasers. It was after the 2nd laser that I saw the greatest improvement. The combination of subcision and laser looks very interesting.
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
Thanks for the update. It's great to hear some much anticipated news. If the pinkish redness bothers you, and you want to see if there has been any textural improvement without being distracted from the uneven colour, you could try dusting on some mineral makeup (I know a bit too much) to even everything out for a better examination. This way you are able to see if your shallow scars have improved even just a bit.
I'm interested about the 'horizontal and vertical red lines' you mention 'where [the lasers] criss-crossed'. Are these line merely apparent because of the red colour (like being red from a sunburn), or are these line textural in nature (i.e. are they lines that are noticeable when light shines on your face and casts shadows from the lines, like valleys/hills - indents, for want of a better word) ?
All in all, have your side effects been limited to merely hyperpigmentation (colour change, which is temporary and easily corrected by Hydroquinone)? Or have you also experienced additional side effects like textural changes?
The following links show some adverse side effects of fractional laser: http://www.realself.com/review/fraxel-laser-horrible
http://www.realself.com/review/new-jersey-fraxel-laser-dont-faxel .
Have you experienced any of the above links?
Also, one last question. Were you prescribed anything to correct the hyperpigmentation? Did they put you on Hydroquinone before and after the procedure?
Thanks again for the update. It's really helpful and also uplifting to know that someone's brave enough to undergo laser treatment. I salute you.
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
Thanks for the update. It's great to hear some much anticipated news. If the pinkish redness bothers you, and you want to see if there has been any textural improvement without being distracted from the uneven colour, you could try dusting on some mineral makeup (I know a bit too much) to even everything out for a better examination. This way you are able to see if your shallow scars have improved even just a bit.
I'm interested about the 'horizontal and vertical red lines' you mention 'where [the lasers] criss-crossed'. Are these line merely apparent because of the red colour (like being red from a sunburn), or are these line textural in nature (i.e. are they lines that are noticeable when light shines on your face and casts shadows from the lines, like valleys/hills - indents, for want of a better word) ?
All in all, have your side effects been limited to merely hyperpigmentation (colour change, which is temporary and easily corrected by Hydroquinone)? Or have you also experienced additional side effects like textural changes?
The following links show some adverse side effects of fractional laser: http://www.realself....-laser-horrible
http://www.realself....aser-dont-faxel .
Have you experienced any of the above links?
Also, one last question. Were you prescribed anything to correct the hyperpigmentation? Did they put you on Hydroquinone before and after the procedure?
Thanks again for the update. It's really helpful and also uplifting to know that someone's brave enough to undergo laser treatment. I salute you.
I am 99% sure the horizontal/vertical lines I see are merely color differences, as the Fraxel:repair does not really remove a layer of skin in the way most people think. However, where they did the fully ablative NON-fractional Co2 (smooth beam) under my eyes, with the Ultrapulse laser... I can see a very very slight line of decarnation where the new skin was peeled down a few layers (my skin peeled off in huge layers under the eyes). My doctor says this line will fade as the new skin "plumps" up and I tend to agree with her for 1 reason. I only see this line under one of my two eyes, and even more so, I only see the line ( under the perfect lighting conditions) on a fraction of where they did the Ultrapulse, towards my ear. The line seemed to have faded in fine where it blends with my cheek and nose area. And honestly? Doesn't really bother me as I can barely notice it.
As for the negative replies on realself, I have just about read them all over the years. And it my opinion? I find it very difficult to take these people seriously. First off, that lady only shows pictures of herself after the laser. I'd like to see her before pictures to prove her scarring was caused by the laser. Most of her complaining is in regards to how painful the laser is, how red her face is, marks caused by the laser, blah blah blah. My response to her is... " No shit lady." Of course the laser hurts, of course your face will be red for weeks if not months. Every doctor warns you of post-laser effects when you go in for the consultation. Hell, you are required to sign paperwork that says you understand and you could possibly have NO improvement.
Actually a lot of these complaints remind me of my own field of work. I often get sent into homes to repair floors,walls, leaks, roofs, painting etc. Before we begin doing ANY work, we often notice a scuff in the homeowners leather sofa, a scratch in the hardwood floor, a stain in the carpet (we are trained to be very observant over the years). And often times when we are all done working on the house, repairing what we were sent to fix, the homeowners will look over our work very carefully before signing the work order. You guys would be so surprised how often they try to blame us for those blemishes, those scratches or anomalies in the area we are working at. Us knowing all along, that those issues were there BEFORE we started, knowing they were not from us. I don't know if these people honestly believe it was us, or if they are just trying to get free carpet/furniture but issues like these happen on a weekly basis. I guess my point is, people don't often see flaws until they take an even closer, harder, second look. Especially when your face is swollen for a week and your scars look like they have vanished, when they come back.... people start thinking it is the cause of the laser.
And yes, 2 weeks before the treatment she put me on Hydroquinone pads with Koljic Acid. Today she gave me another prescription for Hydroquinone but says I do not need. Hydroquinone is not covered by insurance and can be quite pricey. With that being said, I will probably hold off unless my skin starts turning brownish, as for now, it is more red then anything else.
By the way, she treated me at 60 MJ on the scars, 50 MJ on the area she was trying to blend in. I did not even think to ask a what coverage %.
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
mm i had those vertical and cross lines that ended up into serious scars. from my fraxel treatments
i believe it depends on people's skin type and their body's healing mechanism...some ppl benefit from fraxel repair, but some ppl don't...everyone's skin is different...i am sure some skin type can get scars by aggressive treatment like this...sorry to hear you got scars from the fraxel, Syn1122...=(
but i am glad to hear collegeboy84 is doing well =)
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
Thanks for the update. It's great to hear some much anticipated news. If the pinkish redness bothers you, and you want to see if there has been any textural improvement without being distracted from the uneven colour, you could try dusting on some mineral makeup (I know a bit too much) to even everything out for a better examination. This way you are able to see if your shallow scars have improved even just a bit.
I'm interested about the 'horizontal and vertical red lines' you mention 'where [the lasers] criss-crossed'. Are these line merely apparent because of the red colour (like being red from a sunburn), or are these line textural in nature (i.e. are they lines that are noticeable when light shines on your face and casts shadows from the lines, like valleys/hills - indents, for want of a better word) ?
All in all, have your side effects been limited to merely hyperpigmentation (colour change, which is temporary and easily corrected by Hydroquinone)? Or have you also experienced additional side effects like textural changes?
The following links show some adverse side effects of fractional laser: http://www.realself....-laser-horrible
http://www.realself....aser-dont-faxel .
Have you experienced any of the above links?
Also, one last question. Were you prescribed anything to correct the hyperpigmentation? Did they put you on Hydroquinone before and after the procedure?
Thanks again for the update. It's really helpful and also uplifting to know that someone's brave enough to undergo laser treatment. I salute you.
I am 99% sure the horizontal/vertical lines I see are merely color differences, as the Fraxel:repair does not really remove a layer of skin in the way most people think. However, where they did the fully ablative NON-fractional Co2 (smooth beam) under my eyes, with the Ultrapulse laser... I can see a very very slight line of decarnation where the new skin was peeled down a few layers (my skin peeled off in huge layers under the eyes). My doctor says this line will fade as the new skin "plumps" up and I tend to agree with her for 1 reason. I only see this line under one of my two eyes, and even more so, I only see the line ( under the perfect lighting conditions) on a fraction of where they did the Ultrapulse, towards my ear. The line seemed to have faded in fine where it blends with my cheek and nose area. And honestly? Doesn't really bother me as I can barely notice it.
As for the negative replies on realself, I have just about read them all over the years. And it my opinion? I find it very difficult to take these people seriously. First off, that lady only shows pictures of herself after the laser. I'd like to see her before pictures to prove her scarring was caused by the laser. Most of her complaining is in regards to how painful the laser is, how red her face is, marks caused by the laser, blah blah blah. My response to her is... " No shit lady." Of course the laser hurts, of course your face will be red for weeks if not months. Every doctor warns you of post-laser effects when you go in for the consultation. Hell, you are required to sign paperwork that says you understand and you could possibly have NO improvement.
Actually a lot of these complaints remind me of my own field of work. I often get sent into homes to repair floors,walls, leaks, roofs, painting etc. Before we begin doing ANY work, we often notice a scuff in the homeowners leather sofa, a scratch in the hardwood floor, a stain in the carpet (we are trained to be very observant over the years). And often times when we are all done working on the house, repairing what we were sent to fix, the homeowners will look over our work very carefully before signing the work order. You guys would be so surprised how often they try to blame us for those blemishes, those scratches or anomalies in the area we are working at. Us knowing all along, that those issues were there BEFORE we started, knowing they were not from us. I don't know if these people honestly believe it was us, or if they are just trying to get free carpet/furniture but issues like these happen on a weekly basis. I guess my point is, people don't often see flaws until they take an even closer, harder, second look. Especially when your face is swollen for a week and your scars look like they have vanished, when they come back.... people start thinking it is the cause of the laser.
And yes, 2 weeks before the treatment she put me on Hydroquinone pads with Koljic Acid. Today she gave me another prescription for Hydroquinone but says I do not need. Hydroquinone is not covered by insurance and can be quite pricey. With that being said, I will probably hold off unless my skin starts turning brownish, as for now, it is more red then anything else.
By the way, she treated me at 60 MJ on the scars, 50 MJ on the area she was trying to blend in. I did not even think to ask a what coverage %.
Thanks for the really helpful information. My consultation has been booked with Dr. Nicholas Parkhouse at the Cadogan Clinic in Sloane Sqaure, London. Apparently he's a specialist in scar revision. And the BBC news reporter Kate Silverton went to see him for her acne scarring. (You probably won't know either of them as you live in America) But I just hope he would have something to recommend to me or be able to help me.
It's good to have feedback like this, as it makes you aware of the real experience of having a laser treatment, so that you won't be swayed by the cosmetic industry when they nonchalantly disregard anything dangerous about laser treatments, or tell you everything will be 100% perfect.
Looking forward to seeing more picture once the redness has gone. Just a thought, I wonder whether an extra dose of vitamin c supplement would help in your recovery, as vitamin c aids in the formation of collagen production...Just a thought.
how are the result 84? did your scars improve or gone?
Just got back from my 3rd post-op appointment with the doc (day 15 since the procedure). I think there is an improvement, but very subtle so far. It seemed to help a lot with the little wrinkles that I had and my face feels very "tight" if that makes any sense. Honestly, it is very hard to tell as my face is still very uneven pigmented, reddish pink all over. I can see horizontal and vertical red lines where they criss-crossed with the laser which makes it extremely difficult to see if my skin looks any better. As Dudley mentioned and as my doctor reminded me several times, it takes about 6 months to see results as the scars continue to fill in from the collagen. I will say that my scars have not improved as much as I would have expected, but maybe I just misunderstood how the laser works. I would be more surprised if there was NO improvement considering how bloody and swollen my face was after the laser (see photos).
As far as the healing goes, my doctor does not think I will hyperpigment. Which to me is pretty surprising seeing as how I had worked out in the sun for the last 5 days. Yes I have been applying sunblock and wearing a large hat but I still get rays of light hitting the lower portion of my cheek from time to time. I started reapplying Differin which is a different/more subtle form of RetinA to keep my acne in check, but more so to help my skin shed the discoloration. The doctor mentioned that RetinA users usually have the fastest healing time and she sometimes puts her patients on the gel for a few weeks prior to treatment. Fortunately, I have been on Differin for the last year or 2 to prevent any acne breakouts so it really worked well in my case.
Will post photos once the redness dies down.
mm i had those vertical and cross lines that ended up into serious scars. from my fraxel treatments
Hello Syn1122, would you be able to post some pictures of your scars? I'm interested to see the before and after effects of your fraxel treatment. Thanks.
AlexWong, the Christine thread as I call it, is a huge thread, make sure you read all the way through it. http://www.realself.com/review/fraxel-laser-horrible My handle is Dazed on RealSelf. I had my first Re:pair about the same time as when Christine posted that, and it was 2008, not 2009 like it says at the top. At that time there were only 35 Re:pair lasers in the whole country. I don't think anybody has ever figured out what went wrong with her, but personally I think the doctor botched the job. Re:pair is powerful, and few had any real experience with it. I was only my doctors 13th Re:pair at the time. Gosh that doesn't sound very lucky does it? I posted that link on the thread I started back in 2009, which needs to be updated. http://www.acne.org/messageboard/index.php/topic/252527-laser-link-o-rama/
CollegeBoy, I realized about a 30% improvement with my first Re:pair. It was actually 2 non-acne scars that were easy to pinpoint, that turned me into a Re:pair believer. They were so improved that I knew this was working. It was after my 2nd Re:pair that I realized the biggest difference. A lot of people were sold on that "one and done" lie, and that turned them off to lasers. Blame Reliant and Lumenis for that lie. Plus if you are treated at too low a mj level results will come more slowly. Most of my face was done at 70 mj, but around the eyes and on the neck was lower. You will go from elated to deflated and then back up at about 6 months, but it will not reach your initial level of elation. People put out the big money for the first Re:pair and then quit, and most doctors give big discounts for subsequent treatments. Re:pair is a process that must be followed through or people will never see the real benefits. Re:pair has been around long enough that doctors should have a handle on how many treatments they think a person will need. I say Re:pair because it is easier than saying fractionalized ablative CO2. I wish there were more information on the SCAAR FX. They say it can penetrate to 4mm which of course would have to be turned down for the face, but may have good implications for burn scar victims like the Bern Triplets. [Edited link out]
Yes I will post pics soon. Summer school just started and I have been pretty busy with work but I will soon get around to it... even if my skin is still red. I will probably post pictures every month for 6 months as well.
As for the Vitamin C supplements, my doctor recommended 2000 MG per day while healing. Not only was I taking 2000 MG of vitamin C a day, but I was eating a slice of watermelon, a couple crowns of brocolli (sautee'd with garlic), and making my own fruit juices with the blender which consisted of 2 oranges, a bananna, strawberrys, blueberries and a scoop or protein shake powder. I made a list of my diet in one of my previous posts but needless to say, I probably had 6000MG of vitamin C a day if you include the food I digested (which is better then taking supplements). And honestly? I healed very fast. You can see the photos on 3 day ( i think?) my skin came off in huge layers under my eyes where they used Ultrapulse (which is much stronger then the repair laser. By day 5 my new skin completely healed over. As for the red skin, I don't think anything you eat will make much of a difference. Good luck on your consultation!
Hey collegegy I haven't read your whole post but the lines you are probably seeing are where they missed your skin with the laser, basically they didn't do a thorough job of 100% coverage. I had the same with the laser I had.
And I think by your tone your results are starting to fade. It takes a long time to see dramatic improvement......and look at the bright side I'd kill for the very minimal scarring you have. It just looks like very superficial ice pick to me.
Hey collegegy I haven't read your whole post but the lines you are probably seeing are where they missed your skin with the laser, basically they didn't do a thorough job of 100% coverage. I had the same with the laser I had.
And I think by your tone your results are starting to fade. It takes a long time to see dramatic improvement......and look at the bright side I'd kill for the very minimal scarring you have. It just looks like very superficial ice pick to me.
Tenyearswiththis- Thanks I appreciate your input.
Actually I have been looking at my scarring really closely the last few days as I have been working outdoors and can see the beast in its ugliest form. Over the last few days I have noticed a pretty significant "fill in" of 2 of my medium depth boxcar scars that are located on MY-left cheek (the 2 scars closer two my nose). It is weird to see them change so quickly over a few days. I also find it weird because I expected the most improvement directly after the repair, not 16 days later. As for more icepick scarring it is hard for me to notice any improvement in them thus far. I don't know if this is just because they are so deep compared to the boxcar scars, or if the fraxel:repair is just not effective on this type of scarring. Either way I will hold my judgement til a later date.
And I agree with what you say about the lines. I actually got a very good look at my cheeks today in the perfect lighting (during the morning outdoors) and can't see any shadowing or depth differences where the lines are at all. I am 99% sure those lines are just pigmentation differences from where the laser was/wasn't overlapped.
Has anybody had any success with fraxel:repair in regards to ice-pick scarring? I wonder if 60 Joules is deep enough to even penetrate that area. I also get the feeling that my doctor lowered the setting on the Fraxel:repair after she seen how much pain I was in from the Ultrapulse she used under eyes. I don't recall if I mentioned this in a previous post but I was in excruciating pain when they did the Ultrapulse, which is a FULLY ablative (NOT-FRACTIONAL) CO2 laser, because they nurse did not apply the numbing cream OR seran wrap all the way to my eyelashes. I was not numb there AT ALL. It was horrific.
Also the redness is dieing down quite a bit each day. The redness seems to be fading faster as I have been applying Differin every night before bed. For those who don't know, Differin (adapalene) is a 3rd generation retinoid, similar to RetinA that increases cell turnover, thus fading pigmentation faster. I also purchased a 4% Hydroquine (spelling?) from some reputable online store in India so I have been applying that for the last 2 days as well. By the way, Hydroquinine is not covered by insurance here and costs closer to a 100 bucks a tube. From that India store I got 3 tube for about 10 dollars.
Keep you guys updated.
I don't recall if I mentioned this in a previous post but I was in excruciating pain when they did the Ultrapulse, which is a FULLY ablative (NOT-FRACTIONAL) CO2 laser, because they nurse did not apply the numbing cream OR seran wrap all the way to my eyelashes. I was not numb there AT ALL. It was horrific.
...Wow...sounds very scary....!!! I am glad you didn't get any other terrible side effects from that...I'd never get lasers under my eyes...because the skin under eyes are thinner than other area and I feel like laser might make wrinkles...also I've never get any acne or enlarged pore under my eyes yet...but my cheeks...=(
Thanks for the update =)
I don't recall if I mentioned this in a previous post but I was in excruciating pain when they did the Ultrapulse, which is a FULLY ablative (NOT-FRACTIONAL) CO2 laser, because they nurse did not apply the numbing cream OR seran wrap all the way to my eyelashes. I was not numb there AT ALL. It was horrific.
...Wow...sounds very scary....!!! I am glad you didn't get any other terrible side effects from that...I'd never get lasers under my eyes...because the skin under eyes are thinner than other area and I feel like laser might make wrinkles...also I've never get any acne or enlarged pore under my eyes yet...but my cheeks...=(
Thanks for the update =)
It was very scarey hahaha. Especially because thats where they started, on the eyes with the Ultrapulse. I was thinking there is no way I will be able to continue with this through with the repair as well. Actually the laser made any minimal wrinkling under my eyes go away. Really made that area tight.
That's great progress collegeboy84.
But what confuses me is that, judging from your pictures, your ice pick scars hardly look as if they are deep. And if we are to follow the logic of laser depth, which is 1.5 +/-, then why aren't they effective for 'shallow' ice pick scars?
Would someone be able to shed some light on this?
That's great progress collegeboy84.
But what confuses me is that, judging from your pictures, your ice pick scars hardly look as if they are deep. And if we are to follow the logic of laser depth, which is 1.5 +/-, then why aren't they effective for 'shallow' ice pick scars?
Would someone be able to shed some light on this?
I'd like to know myself. My doc looked at my scars very closely and said this was the way to go. This business of theirs is extremely busy. It took almost 40 days to get a consultation so I don't think they are dieing to scam me for my money.
On a side note, my scars vanish when I smile. Which is a bit ironic if you think about it. If I didn't have scars I would smile all the time. But because I do have scars I rarely ever smile thus making my scars visible. My scars also vanish if I stretch the skin a little or even move lips from one side to the other, tightening the cheek skin (without using my hands.) This tells me that if my skin was tighter my scars would be less apparent.Well, Fraxel:Repair is supposed to instantly tighten the skin through dermal heating. In fact, you can watch youtube videos of Repair laser zoomed in 100x and you can literally see the skin shrink (some claim about 13% area shrinkage from 1 treatment.)
Either way I will probably have the fully ablative CO2 Ultrapulse done on my scars as I believe that is more effective then this fractionated approach. That is unless I see significant results in 6 months.
Wow I was under total sedation when they did Regular CO2 on me. I don't know about the effectiveness of any current laser on icepick scars, this is where the new SCAAR FX may come in. I use AllDayChemist, the products are real and the service has been great.
I was just reading up on that SCAAR FX now that you mentioned it. It is part of the Ultrapulse system that they used under my eyes. If my doctor has the Ultrapulse machine, does that mean they have the SCAAR FX attachment? Guess I better ask. Looks like it would be nice for ice-pick scars.
Dudley, what depth for the repair @ 50MJ? 1.3 MM?
While the technology is slightly different, Ultrapulse is fractional Co2:
[Edited link out]
It's probably safer on eyelids than Re:pair. Deep FX or Re:pair is probably deep enough for your scars. Patience is the key here. You need to give collagen time to rebuild from that depth.
On 6/13/2012 at 9:28 AM, TokyoGirl said:While the technology is slightly different, Ultrapulse is fractional Co2:
[Edited link out]
It's probably safer on eyelids than Re:pair. Deep FX or Re:pair is probably deep enough for your scars. Patience is the key here. You need to give collagen time to rebuild from that depth.
I am wondering if there is another hand piece that makes the Ultrapulse Fully Ablative, not fractional. I wonder this for a few reasons. My doctor said the treatment on the eyes with the Ultrapulse is not fractionated and removes 100% of the skin. She also mentioned that this type of laser was used before fraxel was in existence. Which makes sense with how my skin reacted, my skin literally peeled off in huge layers where they did the Ultrapulse. You can actually see in 2 of the photos where my face is red, but under the eyes the skin had peeled off. I don't mean it just flaked, I mean it literally peeled off in layers and you could immediately see the difference as any scars in that depth were completely removed.
Here I read this quote from one of the doctors at realself.com
"Ultrapulse CO2 laser resurfacing is called flat beam resurfacing which means that the entire skin surface is vaporized. Fractional laser resurfacing treats only small areas of the skin leaving some skin intact which allows quicker healing. Fractional CO2 lasers are the ActiveFX, the DeepFX, and the Fraxel Repair. "
Maybe it was Ultrapulsed CO2 not Ultra Pulse. I don't know. This Pubmed article is referring to the Ultrapulsed, published in 1997, long before fractionated technology.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9333279
So in short, I guess I better ask my doctor to clarify. [Edited image out]
Either way I will probably have the fully ablative CO2 Ultrapulse done on my scars as I believe that is more effective then this fractionated approach. That is unless I see significant results in 6 months.
Umm, I think you better think twice about getting fully ablative CO2 ultrapulse. YOU WILL suffer permanent hypopigmentation, this is why fully ablative is no longer used and has been replaced by fractional. Fractional virtually diminished the risk of hypopigmentation.
Maybe you want to walk around with a tan body and pale white Michael Jackson face?
Either way I will probably have the fully ablative CO2 Ultrapulse done on my scars as I believe that is more effective then this fractionated approach. That is unless I see significant results in 6 months.
Umm, I think you better think twice about getting fully ablative CO2 ultrapulse. YOU WILL suffer permanent hypopigmentation, this is why fully ablative is no longer used and has been replaced by fractional. Fractional virtually diminished the risk of hypopigmentation.
Maybe you want to walk around with a tan body and pale white Michael Jackson face?
If you read my posts you would know I have already had the fully ablative CO2 done under the eyes. I have plenty of issues but LIGHTENING of the skin will never be one of them. 
Thanks for your concerns though.
On 6/13/2012 at 11:29 AM, collegeboy84 said:On 6/13/2012 at 11:18 AM, sanjoseskin said:On 6/13/2012 at 8:20 AM, collegeboy84 said:Either way I will probably have the fully ablative CO2 Ultrapulse done on my scars as I believe that is more effective then this fractionated approach. That is unless I see significant results in 6 months.
Umm, I think you better think twice about getting fully ablative CO2 ultrapulse. YOU WILL suffer permanent hypopigmentation, this is why fully ablative is no longer used and has been replaced by fractional. Fractional virtually diminished the risk of hypopigmentation.
Maybe you want to walk around with a tan body and pale white Michael Jackson face?
If you read my posts you would know I have already had the fully ablative CO2 done under the eyes. I have plenty of issues but LIGHTENING of the skin will never be one of them. [Edited image out]Thanks for your concerns though.
It's not just lightening of your skin, it's permanent and complete loss of pigment for life with a clear mark of demarcation between your face and neck.
It's your skin you do what you want. Maybe in 2 yrs we will see you on this forum asking how to regain pigment to your skin.
Out of curiosity, why is someone your age getting fully ablative CO2 done under their eyes? I can see a 60 yr old woman doing that to get rid of wrinkles, but someone who looks like their in their 20s?
For what it's worth, I think you should leave your skin alone, it looks fine.