I wonder how much money they need. I wonder if researchers and doctors out here in Holland know about this finding and if there are people out here who'd be willing to fund them in the case DoD and NIH won't.

Surely there's a couple rich dudes somewhere with unsightly scars that'd be more than willing to help out... You'd think so anyway.

hey, do not get depressed about things you read. there was one person on this page (Ernesto), he started a treatment with ReCell, combined with laser fraxel repair and subcision http://www.acne.org/...fraxel-re-cell/

He claims that his smalls scar completely disappeared, and the more deep greatly improved. He had really really bad acne scarring.

 

Hey thanks for that link!

I can see that his scars were really terrible and that the overall improvement was significant (he claims that he got 75% improvement) but he had a stem cells treatment and dr Khan promised him that there will be 80% improvement but he claims only 20%improvement , if the stem cells treatment doesn't work that it is a huge disappointment then I guess that recell is the only effective solution for scars today.

And I found this:

http://www.acne.org/...et-skin-clinic/

Are there any good experiences with stem cells treatments anywhere so far?

I wonder how much money they need. I wonder if researchers and doctors out here in Holland know about this finding and if there are people out here who'd be willing to fund them in the case DoD and NIH won't.

 

Well try to contact some venture capital funds, try to convince them in whatever is in your mind learn what is that venture capital fund:

http://en.wikipedia....re_capital_fund

http://nl.wikipedia....ki/Durfkapitaal

Many biotech and IT companies are funded by the venture capital funds (like Renovo, Excaliard, eBay, Google,...), they will invest in start-up companies, in anything that is promising and that could bring them profit in the future.

Here is a 'case study':

Excaliard Pharmaceuticals is funded by three different venture capital firms: 1.RiverVest ($164 million under management) 2.AltaPartners ($2 billion under management) 3.ProQuest Investments ($875 million under management)

http://excaliard.com/investors.html

Board of directors and their representatives:

http://excaliard.com/bod.html

Farah Champsi Managing Director, Alta Partners

Niall O™Donnell, Ph.D. Principal, Rivervest

Alain Schreiber, M.D.Partner, ProQuest Investments

 

I wonder how much money they need. I wonder if researchers and doctors out here in Holland know about this finding and if there are people out here who'd be willing to fund them in the case DoD and NIH won't.

 

 

Well try to contact some venture capital funds, try to convince them in whatever is in your mind learn what is that venture capital fund:

http://en.wikipedia....re_capital_fund

http://nl.wikipedia....ki/Durfkapitaal

Many biotech and IT companies are funded by the venture capital funds (like Renovo, Excaliard, eBay, Google,...), they will invest in start-up companies, in anything that is promising and that could bring them profit in the future.

Here is a 'case study':

Excaliard Pharmaceuticals is funded by three different venture capital firms: 1.RiverVest ($164 million under management) 2.AltaPartners ($2 billion under management) 3.ProQuest Investments ($875 million under management)

http://excaliard.com/investors.html

Board of directors and their representatives:

http://excaliard.com/bod.html

Farah Champsi Managing Director, Alta Partners

Niall O™Donnell, Ph.D. Principal, Rivervest

Alain Schreiber, M.D.Partner, ProQuest Investments

 

I think that is very interesting and I might very well contact Sharon Gerecht myself about that. Thanks.

I'm just kidding, you don't need to contact her about that, she knows all that of course (whoever is she, I don't know) the first thing she has to do is to found her company and then she can expect funding by the venture capital firms if she has something that is promising, VC firms don't do it because of you or me or anybody else, they do it because of money, they want to own a significant stake in that newly founded company, they cannot own the stake in some university, of course Mark Ferguson (founder&CEO of Renovo) couldn't get the VC funding when he worked at University of Manchester before he founded Renovo. If you want to learn something about VC industry here you can find a couple of useful links:

http://www.nfia.com/...s_vc_firms.html

So you can see that there are a lot of specialized VC firms that invest only in biotech companies and nothing else, and Dutch VC industry is quite good, it is on the 17th place in the world measured by World Economic Forum/Global Competitiveness Report ranking.

Lapis lazuli, there is something else that is funded by NSF, NIH and DoD/US Army, scientists from two universities from the US are doing some interesting researches, I'm surprised that no one hasn't mentioned them here yet, I couldn't find a single comment about them by using 'search' on this forum, it won't be available as a treatment in the near future but it is very promising, I will write a lot about it over the next week and I hope you will like it

Seabs135, actually you are pretty right in your guessing, faster re-epithelialization is important but it is not the only thing that should be done if you want to achieve scar-free healing, it is known that fetal rats (that heal scar-free) and adult rats (that form scars) both re-epithelialize in 3 days (72 hours), there are 6 different processes during wound healing (hemostasis, inflammation, ECM production, re-epithelialization, wound contraction, scar formation&remodeling) and if you want to achieve scar-free healing the other things that are necessary, besides much faster re-epithelialization, are:

-reduced hemostatic response after injury

-reduced inflammatory response after injury

-delayed ECM production (along with it's unique structure that can be created by regulation of two important proteins)

Scientists from two universities from the US have identified some of the cellular and molecular mechanisms that regulate these processes, they have identified 27 different genes so far (along with their different levels of expression in time), they have recently published their article in one scientific journal, you will be surprised how far they have gone in their researches and I think that article could be a very good guideline for some future anti-scarring drug development programs, your comments will be welcomed beacuse I think you possess the knowledge and ability for commonsense reasoning, some of your comments sound like you've already read parts of that article, and as I said I'm a business school student and I cannot follow all that medical stuffs so easily.

Greetings!

Lapis lazuli, there is something else that is funded by NSF, NIH and DoD/US Army, scientists from two universities from the US are doing some interesting researches, I'm surprised that no one hasn't mentioned them here yet, I couldn't find a single comment about them by using 'search' on this forum, it won't be available as a treatment in the near future but it is very promising, I will write a lot about it over the next week and I hope you will like it

Seabs135, actually you are pretty right in your guessing, faster re-epithelialization is important but it is not the only thing that should be done if you want to achieve scar-free healing, it is known that fetal rats (that heal scar-free) and adult rats (that form scars) both re-epithelialize in 3 days (72 hours), there are 6 different processes during wound healing (hemostasis, inflammation, ECM production, re-epithelialization, wound contraction, scar formation&remodeling) and if you want to achieve scar-free healing the other things that are necessary, besides much faster re-epithelialization, are:

-reduced hemostatic response after injury

-reduced inflammatory response after injury

-delayed ECM production (along with it's unique structure that can be created by regulation of two important proteins)

Scientists from two universities from the US have identified some of the cellular and molecular mechanisms that regulate these processes, they have identified 27 different genes so far (along with their different levels of expression in time), they have recently published their article in one scientific journal, you will be surprised how far they have gone in their researches and I think that article could be a very good guideline for some future anti-scarring drug development programs, your comments will be welcomed beacuse I think you possess the knowledge and ability for commonsense reasoning, some of your comments sound like you've already read parts of that article, and as I said I'm a business school student and I cannot follow all that medical stuffs so easily.

Greetings!

 

vladislav, if hydrogel can achieve scar free healing, obviously it can achieve all the processes you mentioned, including re-epithelialization,

and.... the "processes" you mentioned actually are phases, i.e. theses phases occur in an order, not simultaneously,

I do not understand your intention with this comment, we are interested in a material that can give us scar free healing, if you want to find out more, you can completely read this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wound_healing

Well the processes (or phases - call it whatever you want) are the same, of course, and of course they occur in an order, not simultaneously everybody knows that... but duration and intensity of some processes are very different between scar-free wound healing and wound healing that results in scar formation, and these processes - their durations and intensities - are controlled by 27 different genes that are identified so far and by the other things like lower number of neutrophils (type of white blood cells), so that is the newest discovery which was published a few months ago by a group of scientists from two universities from the U.S, so they are a few steps closer to a 'magic formula' for truly scar-free healing, and it is not some simplified 'upregulate TGFb3'-like crappy formula for scarless healing, but unfortunately I thing it is far away from commercialization, we won't see any anti-scarring drug based on that discovery very soon, most probably not before 2020, but anyway it is interesting.

Lapis lazuli, there is something else that is funded by NSF, NIH and DoD/US Army, scientists from two universities from the US are doing some interesting researches, I'm surprised that no one hasn't mentioned them here yet, I couldn't find a single comment about them by using 'search' on this forum, it won't be available as a treatment in the near future but it is very promising, I will write a lot about it over the next week and I hope you will like it

Seabs135, actually you are pretty right in your guessing, faster re-epithelialization is important but it is not the only thing that should be done if you want to achieve scar-free healing, it is known that fetal rats (that heal scar-free) and adult rats (that form scars) both re-epithelialize in 3 days (72 hours), there are 6 different processes during wound healing (hemostasis, inflammation, ECM production, re-epithelialization, wound contraction, scar formation&remodeling) and if you want to achieve scar-free healing the other things that are necessary, besides much faster re-epithelialization, are:

-reduced hemostatic response after injury

-reduced inflammatory response after injury

-delayed ECM production (along with it's unique structure that can be created by regulation of two important proteins)

Scientists from two universities from the US have identified some of the cellular and molecular mechanisms that regulate these processes, they have identified 27 different genes so far (along with their different levels of expression in time), they have recently published their article in one scientific journal, you will be surprised how far they have gone in their researches and I think that article could be a very good guideline for some future anti-scarring drug development programs, your comments will be welcomed beacuse I think you possess the knowledge and ability for commonsense reasoning, some of your comments sound like you've already read parts of that article, and as I said I'm a business school student and I cannot follow all that medical stuffs so easily.

Greetings!

 

Again you are wrong. Again before I answer you, this is nothing personal. As when you answer with facts it can sound arrogant. I warn you I'm going to cut you short with facts, therefor it will sound arrogant, but I'm far from arrogant, I'm only interested in removing noise and distractions.

But before I address you, I have been researching scar free healing for years starting with discussing juvista etc.(And yes I know researching something for years does not mean you have or should ever have the gospel etc. But still it gives you an understanding of the types of arguments or discussions people will come up with from time to time, you see a lot of things etc, how they tend to walk away from facts and onto elaborate explainations etc.)

Anyway it is clear to me you are looking at scar free healing under a microscope and you are just confusing yourself or you are deliberately repeating the platitude of the complexity of the microscope (occums razor). And I have seen this before. And it is an absolute error.

Also, "observing something" is more important than "explaining any microprocess", infact even trying to explain the microprocess after something has been observed is fallacious as fuck especially if you are trying to explain something would take years (e.g. if someone seen a vegtable they liked. Why do they not just grow it? or do they have to send it to the lab before they can grow it?) (BTW I will never discuss any microprocesses with you now, now we have observed scar free healing. We don™t need to know why scar free healing happened under a microscope now. Just as we don™t need to know why a flower blooms)

All you do when you try to explain the microprocesses, instead of focusing on what has been observed, is 1 make yourself seem like you have authority and get people to look away from what has been observed IMO. And the question is here why does anyone want this authority?

The fact is, you dont need this authority as we have observed scar free healing.

(Facts: sweat glands and hair tissue do not grow in scar tissue, fact if a wound reepithilizes in under 21days there will be no scar, this reepithilized a 3rd degree wound in 14days. All scaffold degrade in similar speeds in an mammals, e.g. look at the control in the paper. Fact when the scaffold is degraded fast the mammal does all the microprocesses of scar free healing)

Seabs good job, i hope that we found the solution soon.

i hope that we found the solution soon.

 

I hope so too. I mean that would be cool.

I wonder what I'd do if a real scar preventative was available to me though. Would I actually have my scar cut out or would I feel I would be taking too much of a chance? I wonder. I think I'd probably get it done for real though, depending on what the doctors would tell me in terms of the risks of the procedure.

Imagine that period during which you'd be healing. You'd think "Is it really going to work? Is it really going to work?" and then in the case you'd see your new skin after a few weeks you'd just look at yourself in disbelief man. It would be something for sure. No more scars. Awesome.

Check out this site:

http://www.tengion.com/

they're trying to create artificial bladders and other organs, seems to me they're not mentioning skin tissues or scars but anyway it is interesting, it shows

the future of advanced regenerative medicine.

Check out this site:

http://www.tengion.com/

they're trying to create artificial bladders and other organs, seems to me they're not mentioning skin tissues or scars but anyway it is interesting, it shows

 

They are trying to regenerate bladders???? They already have created a bladder. The bladder was first created and transplanted in 1999. This has been reported before in the thread.

BTW there is an inverse relationship between scar and regeneration. Which means if you regenerate something, by default this is scar free healing.

Imagine that period during which you'd be healing. You'd think "Is it really going to work? Is it really going to work?" and then in the case you'd see your new skin after a few weeks you'd just look at yourself in disbelief man. It would be something for sure. No more scars. Awesome.

 

Imagine if you had scarring from 3rd degree burns...

Imagine that period during which you'd be healing. You'd think "Is it really going to work? Is it really going to work?" and then in the case you'd see your new skin after a few weeks you'd just look at yourself in disbelief man. It would be something for sure. No more scars. Awesome.

 

 

Imagine if you had scarring from 3rd degree burns...

 

I can't even begin to imagine that. Let's hope scarfree healing comes to fruition!

any news about hydrogel?

any news about hydrogel?

 

I havent read anything. However I come across this blog were he mentions how he got a medical device approved in 30month.

http://meddevice.blogspot.com/2008/12/510k-approval-timeline.html

 

any news about hydrogel?

 

 

I havent read anything. However I come across this blog were he mentions how he got a medical device approved in 30month.

 

http://meddevice.blo...l-timeline.html

 

Thirty months. That's two and a half years. And Sharon Gerecht said to someone here that testing the hydrogel in humans was still several years away. So that's going to take quite some time. Assuming it will actually come to fruition.

 

Check out this site:

http://www.tengion.com/

they're trying to create artificial bladders and other organs, seems to me they're not mentioning skin tissues or scars but anyway it is interesting, it shows

 

They are trying to regenerate bladders???? They already have created a bladder. The bladder was first created and transplanted in 1999. This has been reported before in the thread.

 

BTW there is an inverse relationship between scar and regeneration. Which means if you regenerate something, by default this is scar free healing.

 

 

Well I have a perfecly heatly bladder so I don't care about artificial bladders (I have no spleen, I've lost in in an accident, but it is not a vital organ - humans can have perfectly healty lives without spleen, and I am protected from blood infections with vaccines)

http://en.wikipedia....urinary_bladder

On January 30, 1999, scientists announced that a lab-grown bladder had been successfully transplanted into dogs. These artificial bladders worked well for almost a year in the dogs. In 2000, a new procedure for creating artificial bladders for humans was developed. This procedure is called an orthotopic neobladder procedure. This procedure involves shaping a part (usually 35 to 40 inches) of a patient's small intestine to form a new bladder, however, as explained above, these bladders made of intestinal tissues produced unpleasant side-effects.

It's not my point to talk about the bladders, my point is to talk about the future of regenerative medicine/tissue engineering, this is interesting:

http://www.telegraph...stem-cells.html

Scientists create human kidneys from stem cells

British scientists have created human kidneys from stem cells in a breakthrough which could result in transplant patients growing their own organs.

 

 

They are currently half a centimetre in length - the same size as kidneys found in an unborn baby.

 

Scientists at Edinburgh University hope they will grow into full-size organs when transplanted into a human.

 

Professor Davies said the technology could be ready for use on humans in around 10 years.

 

 

any news about hydrogel?

 

 

I havent read anything. However I come across this blog were he mentions how he got a medical device approved in 30month.

 

http://meddevice.blo...l-timeline.html

 

 

Thirty months. That's two and a half years. And Sharon Gerecht said to someone here that testing the hydrogel in humans was still several years away. So that's going to take quite some time. Assuming it will actually come to fruition.

 

Lapis, it has been cited they said that this could be approved within 3years.

The several definition means more than 2.

several/sev()rl/

Adjective:

• More than two but not many: "the author of several books"; "Van Gogh was just one of several artists who gathered at Auvers".
• Separate or respective: "their several responsibilities".

Vlad, my point was, you mentioned regeneration, then said it didn't mention scarring. I pointed out to you that regeneration is inversely related scarring and thus if you regenerate anything this means you have scar free healing by default. Therefor when you mention regeneration of a xyz you will alway mention scar free healing by default. And to say something does not mention scarring when it mentions regeneration is illogical.You then mentioned and conveyed that the bladder would soon be available. I pointed out to you that the bladder was regenerated and transplanted in 1999.

Vlad anyway, what you have mentioned has nothing all to do with what has been observed, the facts or the subject matter. It is like discussing a car engine when the fact based subject is how we observed clearly the potato in a garden. Also if you want your spleen regenerated, then there is bound to be some thread on the internet that will be discussing the regeneration of internal organs.

Lapis, it has been cited they said that this could be approved within 3years.

 

The several definition means more than 2.

 

sev·er·al/ˆsev(™)r™l/

 

 

Adjective:

• More than two but not many: "the author of several books"; "Van Gogh was just one of several artists who gathered at Auvers".
• Separate or respective: "their several responsibilities".

 

 

lololololol

Anyway, I guess you're right. I thought the "getting it approved" portion which would take a few years would only start after they've started testing on people which is several years from now. But I may have misunderstood.

I found the patent for hydrogel. It is much richer in detail and information. (VEGF165) VEGF human growth factor was mixed into the dextran hydrogel before it was cured with a uv light. Without the VEGF it will not work. There's so many technical things involved with this hydrogel. It is what it is, It is the end of scars as far as skin goes. John Hopkins Burn Center is behind it. You can bet your ass that it will be on the market one day. The patent describes everything involved- how everything was mixed and where it was purchased from. Unfortunately the equipment needed to make it is very technical and extremely expensive. I hope it gets here fast. When trying to estimate just the cost of hydrogel materials (not the medical equipment used to mix it all up) it was very expensive.

I look forward to the day when this long ass thread is killed. And it will be, very, very soon. 3-5 years is a more honest estimate. This application is a device, not a drug. No 15 years of clinical trials needed

This whole board section (scar treatments) I assume would be closed. As why bother with dermabrasion when you've got scar free healing.

Anyway, do you have a link to the patent? It would be interesting to see.

Here are two more definitions of several. Check it out.

more than a few; an indefinite small number

being more than two but fewer than many in number or kind

So in a small number of years, they'll start testing on people. Should they get the financing. Cool. Or you could say, that it won't take many years before they start testing on people. Which doesn't sound too bad either.

some of the medical devices used to make this gel

a freeze dryer

a 20c medical freezer

nitrogen gas

uv lamp device

macromer

Honestly I would sell everything I own to sort out a way to make it myself. I am tired of waiting and losing time. If I can remove my scars. I will have a much richer life than I do now. Just keep bugging these guys to bring it to the market faster. imagine all the recent burn victims it will save.

This whole board section (scar treatments) I assume would be closed. As why bother with dermabrasion when you've got scar free healing.

 

Anyway, do you have a link to the patent? It would be interesting to see.

 

Here are two more definitions of several. Check it out.

 

more than a few; an indefinite small number

being more than two but fewer than many in number or kind

 

So in a small number of years, they'll start testing on people. Should they get the financing. Cool. Or you could say, that it won't take many years before they start testing on people. Which doesn't sound too bad either.

 

PM me your email Lapis

I'll send you the PDF.