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Has anyone found a way to cure lethargy/chronic fatigue, etc. caused by the drug?
Sorry, I don't know but I just finished a consultation with a specialist who told me that I should not be avoiding vitamin A in food like i've been doing for years. He said that isotretinoin actually makes people deficient in vitamin A. This probably explains why taking vitamin D makes me feel so much worse, specifically creating chronic inflammation. Has anyone here tried taking vitamin A in the form of retinyl palmitate at a dose of 25,000iu per day? This is the dose that he recommended i take. I'm still a little cautious, but i'm willing to give it a try if someone here has taken it before and felt better.
Did he mention how he came to this conclusion? It is my understanding, that some Isotretionoin side effects resemble the side effects of Vitamin A deficiency e.g. night blindness. But that does not necessarily mean, that you are deficient in Vitamin A. In the case of night blindness for example It has been postulated, that isotretinoin likely binds to the same rod photoreceptors as retinol but does not metabolize to physiologically active rhodopsin.
I tried myself to supplement with Vitamin A but I stopped after some days because I felt terrible. I still think, this is an interesting hypothesis and I would like to understand better what your specialist thinks about it. Can you give some more background information about your conversation with the specialist?
The specialist I saw was a Neuro-endocrine Psychiatrist. He is very good and I travelled 15 hours on a plane to see him. He has treated many people who have had long term side effects from accutane. He explained that accutane only works as vitamin A in the skin, but everywhere else, it deprives the body of vitamin A, hence we become deficient in it. In my case, hormone levels, in particular testosterone are low. Vitamin A in adequate levels is very important for us to manufacture testosterone and for thyroid hormone to work properly. I also have a lot of inflammation in my muscles and joints. I thought that taking vitamin D might help this, but it actually made me feel worse. I had so much pain in my body when I took vitamin D. He suggested that it's very important to take vitamin A as well as D. Taking beta carotene is not good enough because it does not convert very well to retinol in those who have taken accutane. He suggested I take 25,000iu of vitamin A in the form of retinol or retinyl palmitate as well as 2000iu - 5000iu of vitamin D3. He also said it was a good idea for me to eat liver and offal on a regular basis and to increase my saturated fat intake from grass fed meats as well as omega 3 and 6 fats. The fats are very important to enable me to produce more hormones.
>I tried vitamin A and it made me feel very sick ... head aches, insomnia worse and mood low. I stopped that and now avoid all vitamin A. I did note however my sex drive came back on it.
What form of vitamin A did you take and what was your dose? How did your muscles and joints feel while you were taking it? It does not surprise me that it increased your sex drive, because vitamin A deficiency which accutane causes, affects libido.
Thanks for posting! I've been telling everyone forever that we are deficient in vit A from the accutane. Refer to chris masterjohn's article on accutane called the pursuit of happiness.
I ate some beef liver and heart several years ago which I am sure was very high in Vitamin A. My sleep disturbances and nightmares returned that very night. So I have been weary of vitamin A in high doses since then. I have been night blind since stopping accutane (8 years). Don't know if that will ever change regardless of Vit A supplementation. Don't think it's a good vitamin for us anymore. At least in higher doses.
I couldn't see in the dark at ALL after accutane. My normal night vision has returned since eating about 1/4 lb liver each week. Hope you can get well as well. Look into cod liver supplementation.
The specialist I saw was a Neuro-endocrine Psychiatrist. He is very good and I travelled 15 hours on a plane to see him. He has treated many people who have had long term side effects from accutane. He explained that accutane only works as vitamin A in the skin, but everywhere else, it deprives the body of vitamin A, hence we become deficient in it. In my case, hormone levels, in particular testosterone are low. Vitamin A in adequate levels is very important for us to manufacture testosterone and for thyroid hormone to work properly. I also have a lot of inflammation in my muscles and joints. I thought that taking vitamin D might help this, but it actually made me feel worse. I had so much pain in my body when I took vitamin D. He suggested that it's very important to take vitamin A as well as D. Taking beta carotene is not good enough because it does not convert very well to retinol in those who have taken accutane. He suggested I take 25,000iu of vitamin A in the form of retinol or retinyl palmitate as well as
>I ate some beef liver and heart several years ago which I am sure was very high in Vitamin A. My sleep disturbances and nightmares returned that very night. So I have been weary of vitamin A in high doses since then. I have been night blind since stopping accutane (8 years). Don't know if that will ever change regardless of Vit A supplementation. Don't think it's a good vitamin for us anymore. At least in higher doses.
I couldn't see in the dark at ALL after accutane. My normal night vision has returned since eating about 1/4 lb liver each week. Hope you can get well as well. Look into cod liver supplementation.
I will give it a try again then. Thank you for your insight.
Yes of course Accutane causes joint problems! Cracking of joints, probably due to depleted hyaluronic acid and pain due to chronic inflammation. I've been off the poison for 19 years and still have a lot of musculoskeletal side effects. I even had to have surgery a couple of times to remove hyperostoses (calcium deposits at attachment of tendons).
Really my main ambition in life was to become a professional athlete and this poison ruined this plan for me!
I couldn't see in the dark at ALL after accutane. My normal night vision has returned since eating about 1/4 lb liver each week. Hope you can get well as well. Look into cod liver supplementation.
How long had you been without night vision for, and how long did you eat 1/4 lb of liver each week for? I'm now 5 years post-tane, but still have zero night vision. Might get back onto the cod liver oil caps if you've actually had success with fixing this!
You should all stop doing these experiments on yourselves.
You can try different supplements and so on...but don't inject hormones and things like that, which suppresses some glands, you wont fix anything with that, and you will damage your bodies even more!
Many, including me, injected hormones. The results, are ALWAYS temporary, for those who took accutane!
You have E.D., you presume you have E.D. 'cause you have low T, you inject testosterone, HCG.
You experience hair loss...you take propecia, minoxidil.
And so on...
But thats not the solution, guys! Testosterone injections will work if you have, let's say, 80 years old, and the cause of your E.D. will be low T. But accutane is the cause of your E.D., not hormones. Accutane is the cause of the hair loss, not M.P.B. .
We are like a machine, where accutane distroyed a piece, which assured a smooth functioning of your bodies. If we fix what accutane damaged in our bodies, only then everything will get back to normal.
That being said, sometimes, when i try new meds, for the first time,,,,like 5htp, propecia, vit.D, etc.... i get overnight recoveries, the brain fog disappears, despression disappears, E.D. gets alot better, hair loss stops, skin gets moist, etc. But the recoveries are only temporary.
We need to find out what accutane did to our body and reverse that somehow. Don't try to fix the E.D. in particular, the hair loss, etc..because it won't work. Try to find out what accutane damaged, reverse that (not sure it's possible), and everything in your body will be fixed, as a result!
I hope now you all understand what i'm saying here.
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And about antibiotics...thought i will lower scalp inflamation with antibiotics. I took today some doxicycline and i had a very bad headache after that, which lasted the whole day. The scalp inflamation got even worse.
I agree with Robert's post above.
I couldn't see in the dark at ALL after accutane. My normal night vision has returned since eating about 1/4 lb liver each week. Hope you can get well as well. Look into cod liver supplementation.
How long had you been without night vision for, and how long did you eat 1/4 lb of liver each week for? I'm now 5 years post-tane, but still have zero night vision. Might get back onto the cod liver oil caps if you've actually had success with fixing this!
Throughout the 5 month course in 2012 I lost my night vision. I couldn't see in the dark for over 2 years. I then changed my diet in Feb 2014 and ate a strictly primal diet. I had a lot of bone broth and organ meats (heart, liver, kidneys, and adrenals - if you could find eyeballs somewhere, that'd be fantastic) for a few months. I'd make a batch of organ meats and bone broth every single week. I don't remember exactly but it was just a few months (perhaps 3-6) of eating this way that resulted in me being able to see in the dark again. I still have loads of eye floaters but they have slightly diminished as well. The night vision is pretty much completely gone. It's a non-issue for me now. I'd say the main thing that helped me vision-wise was eating liver. My night vision was gone before I even started taking cod liver oil (from green pastures). The reason I recommended cod liver oil is it's also got vitamin D which will prevent vit A toxicity. If I could do it over again, I'd have liver AND the cod liver oil. Maybe even throw in a high dose carotenoid supp for extra vitamin A. Also, the animal products I ate all came from local ranchers. They were never fed grain. *Choosing store-bought meats may influence your healing progress.
Be aware, I am not nearly recovered from accutane. I still have DOZENS of health issues. I'm just sharing the fact that my night vision has come back. Again, still have eye floaters and dry eyes.
And I HIGHLY recommend every person here buy a high quality blender. Maybe blendtec or vitamix. I got a vitamix elite blender for around $500 from QVC and it's been the most helpful thing I've done so far! I shove loads of vegetables (low oxalate ones) in it and chug down about a liter of nutritious brown/purple/green liquid each day.
I mainly did it because I couldn't digest vegetables (even when cooked until soft). Not only does the blender turn any vegetable into a liquid, but my body can feel the difference when I go a day without my vegetable juice. Hope this helps
--
Just got a 23andme genetics test. Are there any specific genes I should look at? One major thing I've found is that I'm homozygous for the MTHFR mutation.. Maybe that's why all of those vegetable juices made a noticeable impact on me.
Yes of course Accutane causes joint problems! Cracking of joints, probably due to depleted hyaluronic acid and pain due to chronic inflammation. I've been off the poison for 19 years and still have a lot of musculoskeletal side effects. I even had to have surgery a couple of times to remove hyperostoses (calcium deposits at attachment of tendons).
Really my main ambition in life was to become a professional athlete and this poison ruined this plan for me!
I'm in the same boat joint and tendon wise (especially rotator cuffs at the moment). It is almost systematic how both sides of my joints exhibit injury. Accutane was such a blow to my cellular plasticity. I was never known to be limited by injury in all my years of sports! The worst part throughout all of this is that we all have such similar side effects, and yet the medical industry meets us with blank stares. That is the worst damning and demeaning part throughout all of this experience. An affluent company like Roche to not accept responsibility and support us with investigative research. Maybe find out what traits we all have in common.
But, for Roche to man up and do that would admit guilt and therefore liability. (especially those with the much rarer but serious side effects of depressive episodes)
A true testament to our strength as human beings. Can you imagine to be left injured in a forest and to fend for yourselves. To research every day. To pay out of pocket to repair what once was a healthy life. We are everyday living this reality.
Has anyone found a way to cure lethargy/chronic fatigue, etc. caused by the drug?
Sorry, I don't know but I just finished a consultation with a specialist who told me that I should not be avoiding vitamin A in food like i've been doing for years. He said that isotretinoin actually makes people deficient in vitamin A. This probably explains why taking vitamin D makes me feel so much worse, specifically creating chronic inflammation. Has anyone here tried taking vitamin A in the form of retinyl palmitate at a dose of 25,000iu per day? This is the dose that he recommended i take. I'm still a little cautious, but i'm willing to give it a try if someone here has taken it before and felt better.
I have been taking Vitamin A ( retinyl Palmitate ) 20 000iu per day for two weeks now.
Yes I do feel better. But at this point its purely Mental sides. Less brain fog and I feel connected with my body again. Also speaking is more fluent and more intelligent.
But I think I should take it for 2 months so this way I can exclude the placebo effect.
Also my blood sugar slightly raised when I started taking Vitamin A.
Normally I would hoover around 5.2-5.1 and today I tested it at 5.7.
Maybe thats why I feel better because my brain has more fuel. Lets see.
I just began 20,000iu Retinyl palmitate along with 4000iu Vit D3 per day. The vitamin D, which previously made me feel worse, should not now that I've added the vitamin A. I may even increase the vitamin A dose. I'm going to try this for 6-8 weeks then assess.
My neuro-endocrine specialist also recommended that I have at least 20 oz (over 500g) of liver per week in addition to the vitamin A.
My blood sugar is also 5.1-5.2 which I thought may be too high, but he told me that it should be higher, so don't worry about your blood sugar increasing. That's a good thing.
I agree with the other post about bone broths. I'm going to start on them this week as I've read a lot about their healing power.
I just began 20,000iu Retinyl palmitate along with 4000iu Vit D3 per day. The vitamin D, which previously made me feel worse, should not now that I've added the vitamin A. I may even increase the vitamin A dose. I'm going to try this for 6-8 weeks then assess.
My neuro-endocrine specialist also recommended that I have at least 20 oz (over 500g) of liver per week in addition to the vitamin A.
My blood sugar is also 5.1-5.2 which I thought may be too high, but he told me that it should be higher, so don't worry about your blood sugar increasing. That's a good thing.
I agree with the other post about bone broths. I'm going to start on them this week as I've read a lot about their healing power.
DO NOT TAKE VITAMIN D!
if youre still having symptoms of accutane, your calcium levels are already screwed up... go test for that first. adding vitamin D will just put the calcium right back on your tendons! high synthetic or even regular vitamin A promotes high blood calcium levels. its the reason you have bone spurs and shoulder problems ( i have them as well) ive been off of the drug since 1992! my skin is still bone dry, scars dont heal etc etc. TEWL (sweating thru shirt on a normal workout)
magnesium and vitamin k2 would be a better supplement for the deposits.
also silica (google that for calcified tendons and ligaments DISH)
if youre an athlete ( i was one as well) you have to lose fat....and i mean a lot of it to get at the stored metabolite. you'll see that when youre deprived of vitamin A, that the liver will release whatever is stored.... and the accutane symptoms will be pronounced.
its my hope that i now have the co-factors to deal with this and eliminate it from the body.
thats manganese and choline for the UDP glycotransferes to bind with the metabolite once back in the blood stream.
LIVER DETOX: 6000 mg of TMG daily (interestingly enough another form of choline) to balance the SAM/SAH ratio and to downregulate the GNMT enzyme.
Magnesium and b6 to also help with glutathione.
brazil nuts for Methionine to balance the high amounts of Glycine
500mg DHA to downregulate the FOXO
Thanks very much tryingtohelp2014!
Yes I still have bone spurs appearing. Do I need to have my calcium levels tested?
Should I stop taking Vitamin A? I'm confused now. I avoided vitamin A for more than a decade, but now I've been told to take it and I just started on 20,000 iu. Should I stop that too?
Can I eat liver and bone broth?
I find that my symptoms become worse when I get a lot of sunshine. Is this because of the increase in vitamin D?
Thanks very much tryingtohelp2014!
Yes I still have bone spurs appearing. Do I need to have my calcium levels tested?
Should I stop taking Vitamin A? I'm confused now. I avoided vitamin A for more than a decade, but now I've been told to take it and I just started on 20,000 iu. Should I stop that too?
Can I eat liver and bone broth?
I find that my symptoms become worse when I get a lot of sunshine. Is this because of the increase in vitamin D?
dont take Vitamin A either. If you think natural vitamin A will help, eat some eggs, or grass fed butter... at least with this, you'll be getting a dose of Choline.
Ive avoided anything fortified with vitamin A for 20 years. If it comes from a vegetable etc no worries, i just try to avoid carrots.
My theory is people with a long term problem have a polymorphism... be it a MTHFR problem that causes a methyl group problem, or something like Gilberts disease (which would cause a lot of problems in excreting the accutane metabolite normally) I believe the problem with us is 100% liver related.
Youre never supposed to take Vitamin D without K2 anyway. K2 tells the calcium where to go after the vitamin D helps it get absorbed..but in our case, it should be avoided all together. just get some sun.
get the supplements i mentioned and give it a try for a month. ive just started on the higher dose of TMG, and everything ive read confirms 6000mg is the optimal amount from the studies, to help correct a SAM/SAH imbalance. Also TMG is thought to detoxify the liver over time by helping bile flow. manganese and choline are crucial. in different studies, it showed an increase in the UDP enzyme (the one specifically responsible for conjugating accutane), in a dose dependent matter, while supplementing with manganese.
the catch is this... i think we need to get at the stores that are locked away, but that are still influencing our bodies. this is done by calorie restriction and or heavy exercise. ive done it before, and its not pretty. im currently riding 30 miles a day trying to lose a lot of weight in a short amount of time again.
Thanks very much again, tryingtohelp2014! You seem extremely knowledgeable. Believe it or not, I travelled all the way from Australia to California to consult with a specialist who was not as knowledgeable about Accutane as you seem to be.
Ok so I will now throw away my recently purchased vitamin A and vitamin D capsules.
Since liver is so high in retinol, I guess I should avoid eating that too?
The doctor I saw is a fan of the Weston Price diet and he suggested that the reason my LH and testosterone are low is because I'm deficient in vitamin A. He told me that it was a mistake for me to have avoided vitamin A in foods for more than a decade and was confident that a vitamin A and vitamin D deficiency was the reason why my body is not able to produce enough testosterone. There is information on this topic on the Weston Price website.
I would like to know your opinion on fasting (consuming water only) for several weeks? Do you think this might clean out Accutane residue in the liver?
If so, what should one's diet consist of after the fast? Do you think the Weston Price diet is a good one, or a vegan diet instead? There are arguments for and against, but I think all the carbohydrates that vegans eat may be inflammatory and lacking in key nutrients.
Right now I'm also taking a high potency fish oil liquid, which contains 927mg DHA and 1.9g EPA. Do you think I should keep taking it, or is EPA something that should be avoided? Should I just take DHA?
What type of choline do you suggest? Straight choline, phosphatidylcholine or citicoline?
How about taking choline together with inositol?
What dose of choline, manganese and magnesium do you suggest?
Is it ok to take magnesium glycinate? That's what I'm taking right now.
Sorry for all the questions! You have already been a great help!
Many thanks.
The specialist I saw was a Neuro-endocrine Psychiatrist. He is very good and I travelled 15 hours on a plane to see him. He has treated many people who have had long term side effects from accutane.
Successfully treated? I have to assume he's had at least some success if his reputation is such that you were able to find out about him from the other side of the planet. In which case, why did he tell you to take high doses of Vitamin A if you're not supposed to do this, as tryingtohelp2014 says?
Conflicting information is terribly frustrating 
I didn't go to see him to treat my Accutane side effects. I saw him in the hope that he would tell me why I have such low LH and testosterone levels and how best to treat them. I didn't know before I saw him that Accutane lowered my hormone levels.
It was only when I told him that I had been on Accutane a long time ago that he told me he had seen quite a few patients with long term side effects.
As I mentioned, he believed that my low LH and low testosterone was likely caused by my avoidance of foods high in retinol for more than a decade. He said that this was a wrong move on my part, so advised me to begin eating foods high in retinol and take supplemental vitamin A and vitamin D.
It made sense until I read tryingtohelp2014 posts. Now I feel extremely frustrated and let down. I was hopeful that after seeing this doctor I was now on the right track, but it appears that is not the case at all. So many times I've been inches away from suicide because of the damage this poison has done to my body and the things in life that have passed me by. I'm sure it cost me a career as a professional athlete. I would have much rather died in 1994 and then reincarnated than have had to live the life the poison has forced me to live.
Thanks very much again, tryingtohelp2014! You seem extremely knowledgeable. Believe it or not, I travelled all the way from Australia to California to consult with a specialist who was not as knowledgeable about Accutane as you seem to be.
Ok so I will now throw away my recently purchased vitamin A and vitamin D capsules.
Since liver is so high in retinol, I guess I should avoid eating that too?
The doctor I saw is a fan of the Weston Price diet and he suggested that the reason my LH and testosterone are low is because I'm deficient in vitamin A. He told me that it was a mistake for me to have avoided vitamin A in foods for more than a decade and was confident that a vitamin A and vitamin D deficiency was the reason why my body is not able to produce enough testosterone. There is information on this topic on the Weston Price website.
I would like to know your opinion on fasting (consuming water only) for several weeks? Do you think this might clean out Accutane residue in the liver?
If so, what should one's diet consist of after the fast? Do you think the Weston Price diet is a good one, or a vegan diet instead? There are arguments for and against, but I think all the carbohydrates that vegans eat may be inflammatory and lacking in key nutrients.
Right now I'm also taking a high potency fish oil liquid, which contains 927mg DHA and 1.9g EPA. Do you think I should keep taking it, or is EPA something that should be avoided? Should I just take DHA?
What type of choline do you suggest? Straight choline, phosphatidylcholine or citicoline?
How about taking choline together with inositol?
What dose of choline, manganese and magnesium do you suggest?
Is it ok to take magnesium glycinate? That's what I'm taking right now.
Sorry for all the questions! You have already been a great help!
Many thanks.
yeah magnesium glycinate is fine ... i take a magnesium TRAACs brand.
200-400 mg Mag with P5P (active form of b6)
Sunflower Lecithin (is the phosphatidylcholine i take)
10-20 mg of Manganese (this should help with the tendons as well) do your tendons pop and snap?
TMG 6000mg ( i bought a dry bulk TMG powder of of amazon that i mix in with gaterade when i bike) I know this has been talked about on this thread forever... but i dont think people were taking enough of it. one big horse type pill was only 1000 mg... the powder makes it much easier to take igher amounts.
DHA seems to be more important than EPA for the FOXO downregulation
you can add a bunch of things for support... like b12 and methylfolate to probiotics. but its going to take work. Fasting could jumpstart it... i have no doubt that when you run yourself down, you'll start drawing on reserves from the liver.
Listen i know this is going to sound like bullshit, but i actually did it. i know its anecdotal, but i went from 6'2 225 to 185 one summer in order to get this stuff out of me. and im telling you, towards the end, the side effects (dry lips, the palms of my hands and soles of my feet started to peel, my eyes started to get really dry, massive joint pain) ....but right at the end, for a day or two, my skin got super oily again, just like before the drug! but i stopped.
it can be done.
Thanks very much again, tryingtohelp2014! You seem extremely knowledgeable. Believe it or not, I travelled all the way from Australia to California to consult with a specialist who was not as knowledgeable about Accutane as you seem to be.
Ok so I will now throw away my recently purchased vitamin A and vitamin D capsules.
Since liver is so high in retinol, I guess I should avoid eating that too?
The doctor I saw is a fan of the Weston Price diet and he suggested that the reason my LH and testosterone are low is because I'm deficient in vitamin A. He told me that it was a mistake for me to have avoided vitamin A in foods for more than a decade and was confident that a vitamin A and vitamin D deficiency was the reason why my body is not able to produce enough testosterone. There is information on this topic on the Weston Price website.
I would like to know your opinion on fasting (consuming water only) for several weeks? Do you think this might clean out Accutane residue in the liver?
If so, what should one's diet consist of after the fast? Do you think the Weston Price diet is a good one, or a vegan diet instead? There are arguments for and against, but I think all the carbohydrates that vegans eat may be inflammatory and lacking in key nutrients.
Right now I'm also taking a high potency fish oil liquid, which contains 927mg DHA and 1.9g EPA. Do you think I should keep taking it, or is EPA something that should be avoided? Should I just take DHA?
What type of choline do you suggest? Straight choline, phosphatidylcholine or citicoline?
How about taking choline together with inositol?
What dose of choline, manganese and magnesium do you suggest?
Is it ok to take magnesium glycinate? That's what I'm taking right now.
Sorry for all the questions! You have already been a great help!
Many thanks.
yeah magnesium glycinate is fine ... i take a magnesium TRAACs brand.
200-400 mg Mag with P5P (active form of b6)
Sunflower Lecithin (is the phosphatidylcholine i take)
10-20 mg of Manganese (this should help with the tendons as well) do your tendons pop and snap?
TMG 6000mg ( i bought a dry bulk TMG powder of of amazon that i mix in with gaterade when i bike) I know this has been talked about on this thread forever... but i dont think people were taking enough of it. one big horse type pill was only 1000 mg... the powder makes it much easier to take igher amounts.
DHA seems to be more important than EPA for the FOXO downregulation
you can add a bunch of things for support... like b12 and methylfolate to probiotics. but its going to take work. Fasting could jumpstart it... i have no doubt that when you run yourself down, you'll start drawing on reserves from the liver.
Listen i know this is going to sound like bullshit, but i actually did it. i know its anecdotal, but i went from 6'2 225 to 185 one summer in order to get this stuff out of me. and im telling you, towards the end, the side effects (dry lips, the palms of my hands and soles of my feet started to peel, my eyes started to get really dry, massive joint pain) ....but right at the end, for a day or two, my skin got super oily again, just like before the drug! but i stopped.
it can be done.
It is really encouraging to see, that some people here have not given up and still trying to find a solution. Thanks for the good spirit. You write, that your skin got super oily again at the end of your weight loss. Did your skin stay oily after you gained weight again? Because in theory your body should have taken the reserves from you liver and even after gaining weight again the stuff should have been gone. And your body and skin should have stayed in the good condition, that you reached at the end of your weight loss period.
Thanks very much again, tryingtohelp2014! You seem extremely knowledgeable. Believe it or not, I travelled all the way from Australia to California to consult with a specialist who was not as knowledgeable about Accutane as you seem to be.
Ok so I will now throw away my recently purchased vitamin A and vitamin D capsules.
Since liver is so high in retinol, I guess I should avoid eating that too?
The doctor I saw is a fan of the Weston Price diet and he suggested that the reason my LH and testosterone are low is because I'm deficient in vitamin A. He told me that it was a mistake for me to have avoided vitamin A in foods for more than a decade and was confident that a vitamin A and vitamin D deficiency was the reason why my body is not able to produce enough testosterone. There is information on this topic on the Weston Price website.
I would like to know your opinion on fasting (consuming water only) for several weeks? Do you think this might clean out Accutane residue in the liver?
If so, what should one's diet consist of after the fast? Do you think the Weston Price diet is a good one, or a vegan diet instead? There are arguments for and against, but I think all the carbohydrates that vegans eat may be inflammatory and lacking in key nutrients.
Right now I'm also taking a high potency fish oil liquid, which contains 927mg DHA and 1.9g EPA. Do you think I should keep taking it, or is EPA something that should be avoided? Should I just take DHA?
What type of choline do you suggest? Straight choline, phosphatidylcholine or citicoline?
How about taking choline together with inositol?
What dose of choline, manganese and magnesium do you suggest?
Is it ok to take magnesium glycinate? That's what I'm taking right now.
Sorry for all the questions! You have already been a great help!
Many thanks.
yeah magnesium glycinate is fine ... i take a magnesium TRAACs brand.
200-400 mg Mag with P5P (active form of b6)
Sunflower Lecithin (is the phosphatidylcholine i take)
10-20 mg of Manganese (this should help with the tendons as well) do your tendons pop and snap?
TMG 6000mg ( i bought a dry bulk TMG powder of of amazon that i mix in with gaterade when i bike) I know this has been talked about on this thread forever... but i dont think people were taking enough of it. one big horse type pill was only 1000 mg... the powder makes it much easier to take igher amounts.
DHA seems to be more important than EPA for the FOXO downregulation
you can add a bunch of things for support... like b12 and methylfolate to probiotics. but its going to take work. Fasting could jumpstart it... i have no doubt that when you run yourself down, you'll start drawing on reserves from the liver.
Listen i know this is going to sound like bullshit, but i actually did it. i know its anecdotal, but i went from 6'2 225 to 185 one summer in order to get this stuff out of me. and im telling you, towards the end, the side effects (dry lips, the palms of my hands and soles of my feet started to peel, my eyes started to get really dry, massive joint pain) ....but right at the end, for a day or two, my skin got super oily again, just like before the drug! but i stopped.
it can be done.
It is really encouraging to see, that some people here have not given up and still trying to find a solution. Thanks for the good spirit. You write, that your skin got super oily again at the end of your weight loss. Did your skin stay oily after you gained weight again? Because in theory your body should have taken the reserves from you liver and even after gaining weight again the stuff should have been gone. And your body and skin should have stayed in the good condition, that you reached at the end of your weight loss period.
only for a day or two did the skin stay oily.... it like i was in the middle of an accutane storm.... i had to stop because of the joint pain and sides... i didnt know what was going on. now i do. its like i was dipping below some threshold.
its like i was at the tip of the accutane reserves, and the second i stopped trying to get it out, and started eating fats again, and gaining weight, the side effects diminished, BUT, the skin got dryer again! so its like i was covering up the toxic waste with normal vitamin A, but that was in a sense "topping" me off again, and now its stayed here in some messed up homeostatic state. So the side effects became muted.
Its weird to think back on this now, but thats eactly how it felt like. I think i mobilized the stored metabolite, but my body was so rundown, it just recirculated and couldnt get rid of it.
tryingtohelp2014, thanks once again! (For some reason I can't quote here).
Do you think you will try another round of what you did to get it out of your system again?
I tried a vegetarian diet for 6 months 2 years ago and fasting on water only for 6 days, but I lost so much muscle mass, even though I was resting. My subcutaneous body fat appeared to be about the same at the end of the fast, but my muscles had wasted and I lost so much muscle strength which took me many months to get back. I don't want that to happen again unless that's my only option.
I have the following questions. If you're able to insert your answers below my questions, that would be good.
1) Do you think it would be worthwhile trying a ketogenic diet high in protein and fat and low in carbs to get rid of the stored Accutane?
2) I've been avoiding foods high in retinol for more than 10 years. Should I continue to do this?
3) Should I stop taking fish oil and take straight DHA instead? What dose of DHA?
4) Should I be supplementing with vitamin C? Bioflavonoids?
5) My vitamin D levels on a recent blood test were at bottom of normal range. My doctor suggested that it should be much higher for general good health. Should I still be avoiding vitamin D at any dose and just get it from the sun?
6) Should I supplement vitamin K2, or just get it from foods high in K2?
7) You suggest B12 and P5P, which I'm already taking. How about taking other B vitamins, such as a B complex?
8) Do you find that your symptoms are worse in summer when you are getting more vitamin D?
9) Do you think my low LH and low testosterone levels are caused by Accutane or my avoidance of vitamin A for so long?
10) How do I raise my LH and testosterone naturally? My doctors want me to take testosterone, which I'd rather avoid as it is a life long commitment.
Many thanks.
Accutainted4ever : Hey mate! Do you suffer from hair loss due to accutane?Yes, i agree with tryingtohelp2014, regarding vitamin D and calcium deposits. Stop taking that.
About taking vitamin A, i'm not sure what to say. When you're taking vitamin A, do you feel anything? Some people, after accutane, when they suppliment with vitamin A, even a low dose, they imediately notice skin and scalp inflamation, more hair loss, itchness, etc . Did you nothing anythinng like that after supplimenting with vit. A?
4ever, 20,000 IU sounds ridiculously high. I believe 10,000 IU of supplemented vitamin A daily is considered the threshold of a toxic dose. Either through Accutane or through vitamin A supplementation, much of either substance will be converted to all-trans retinoic acid. You will basically be getting a similar effect as taking Accutane.
FYI: I eat moderate amounts of vit-A rich foods regularly (spinach, eggs, butter, carrots), and it doesn't seem to make a difference, good or bad.
To answeryour question regarding hormones: Yes, I had estradiol tested 3 times. It was toward the low end on two of the tests, and toward the high-end of the range when I was taking clomiphene to increase T to supraphysiological levels.
Dubya, according to the information on the Weston Price Foundation website, toxicity from vitamin A only occurs in doses above 100,000iu.
Regardless, I won't be taking any more vitamin A supplements.
Do you get any bad reaction from eating foods very high in retinol like liver?
How did you respond to Clomiphene citrate? What dose did you take and how much did it increase your T levels? I'm considering taking it before committing to TRT.
There have been some really helpful posts of late by a lot of people who've obviously learn't what to take and what not to take for combating side effects from this fucked up poison. Recently there have been pics sent of people's pantries FULL of supplements......mine is no different. I'm that desperate after 18 years of hell that if someone mentions minor success with something they've tried, I immediately go out and buy it, but I'm not sure this is the best approach??
The reason being, I don't know whether to stop the other five thousand supplements that I draw from each week that actually might be overloading my liver through over consumption. I feel for everyone because it's fucking confusing when one school of thought says to start taking Vitamin A and D again whilst others say to avoid these supplements like the plague.....what do you do??
People are saying to take Manganese and Choline, ok but do I stop taking Taurine,Inositol, Methionine and other supplements that are known to help the liver as well??
For brain fog, do I take TMG and keep taking L-Tyrosine?? and while I'm at it, some of you are suggesting to take DHA..........what is too much here, I'm at a loss. Can someone put a list togther - no need for the science behind it all.......if it works great but do you know what to stop taking along the way??
Common sense tells me that you can be taking too many supplements but beyond that, I don't know what to eliminate?
And after all this, I haven't even mentioned all the stuff at my disposal for helping to stay regular and treat the bowel - most of these supplements have about 10
ingredients anyway in their mix, again this might be too much on top of liver and brain supplements?
I'm pretty confident though that we'll all get a reponse soon from Roche on exactly what to do after taking their poison Roaccutane, I mean it's only been 18 years of HELL for me and even longer for others, I guess you've gotta just remain patient yeah..............these guys have our best interests at heart right??