Yeah, I pretty much agree with Spy.

Sometimes I catch myself thinking I can't do something because 'I'm sick' or 'theres something wrong with me' even when I'm feeling pretty decent. It is easy to fall into this state of mind. I also find it easy to think of worst case scenarios such as researching incredibly obscure diseases online or finding out the price of hair-transplants when the inevitable happens and I become completely bald. Of course these can be irrational thoughts so there is definitely a psychological aspect to this.

I generally try to stay positive by thinking in a 'cure' mindset. I love reading earth clinic - it is a very positive place, it seems that very little cant be cured reading reviews there. I also think of the incredible amount of things I haven't even tried yet and the possibilities of these. Healthy eating, exercise, sleep, supplements, can these things cure me? Possibly not. But it feels good to know I'm doing something about it and taking control. If I keep trying different things, the chances are that I will eventually find something that helps.

Every day this thread continues and people continue to share information, try different things, get different tests - every day our chances of complete recovery improve.

I feel particularly crap right now. Woke up with that grey cloud hovering over my head, as usual...

I may get the allergy results later today. It's coming to the point where (God help me) I actually want the results to show that I'm allergic to a lot of the food that I'm eating, just so I can try something different - that's how low Accutane is making me think. Because if not, I feel I've not got many options left. I've literally tried everything. I'm not that convinced that just avoiding allergy foods is going to give me the life changeing results I want anyway. Just want to be freed from this hell Accutane's given me...

Anyway, I'll let you know the results when I get them...

Laters

Hey guys it's me again. I have read all the posts in this thread and would like respond. The general consensus I am getting is that most of you are very educated about healthy food and supplements. This is good as it is a very important part of recovery. Still, it is only a part.

Many of you are frustrated because you are not becoming healthy again at a fast rate or are not seeing much results.

(When I say healthy I mean your body being hot, sweaty, strong, full of energy, no joint pain, no depression, etc.)

The problem I believe is most of you appear to be not exercising correctly and/or intensely enough. It is so important. I made a video a week ago giving some tips on recovery. Please, check it out.

http://www.acne.org/...tane-treatment/

You CAN and SHOULD work out intensely. It will take time though.

3 months ago I couldn't run for more than 50 feet without having to stop and rest. Now I can run 5 miles steadily everyday. And not only that, I can now do it without wearing any shoes! And I keep getting stronger and healthier everyday. You too can reach physical goals that seem impossible, no matter your age or current health.

It only took 3 months of hard work to become much healthier. And admittedly I could have even done it faster had I pushed myself more. So really, it doesn't take much time to completely reverse the condition of your health if you are working hard at it.

I want to make another video, this time showing me actually doing some exercises and tips for people just starting. The video again, will be geared to Accutane specific health problems. I only have a webcam so once I find a video camera I will make it.

Stay motivated everyone! Life is beautiful. You will recover and feel amazing, if you work hard at it.

Have a nice day.

Hi everyone.

Teh Pwn, thanks again. It's good to hear of the possibility to recover via strengthening the body through exercise.

This is definitely something everyone should work towards.

Like, Jmsil, I got my results today.

I've just been reading through and it's clear that the test isn't a load of old balls.

My vitamin deficiencies are non-existent which is a bonus.

I have a mineral deficiency, however, which is Magnesium.

I actually take 630mg daily, though I added this recently. I take this in the form of citrate.

The results state that magnesium can be depleted through stress and gastrointestinal disorders, such as crohns disease can limit it's absorbtion.

While I don't think I have Crohn's, I certainly (as I've mentioned) have something going on with my intestines/colon as my constipation is still around.

The lady, who runs the test, mentioned that Magnesium Chloride can be a better form for absorption.

So, overall, not too bad on that front ...

Hydration is fine apparantly, despite feeling dried up inside. I do drink lots of water, so it's good to know I'm absorbing it.

Next up, I do have some allergies...

These one's are foods I should avoid (for 8-12 weeks, and then try to reintroduce them):

Lactose, Barley, Oats, Rye, Wheat, Gluten, Pea, Green Peppers, Potato, Egg whites/yolk/albumin.

Bit odd, some of these. I love oatmeal in the morning, so I guess that's out of the window.

The lactose and egg add up with what Chico said. Also peppers. Accutane is still in the body it would appear. Why peas? Odd.

These are the foods I should limit:

Banana, Kiwi, Spinach, Brazil Nut, Pineapple, Goat's Milk (which I hate anyway).

There goes the daily banana. Spinach is high in Vitamin A, so I always wondered about that one. Carrots were fine though.

My herbalist did that kinesiology on me for my supplements. One of the ingredients in the super enzymes (by Now) was pineapple, and she narrowed it down to that being something that disturbed my body. I guess it's not a load of crap.

Although, she didn't mention oats or wheat being a problem, when she did a test for them. She also said cows milk wasn't good for me.

The hair analysis lady (Hebe) mentioned allergies can change or develop, so perhaps having oats every day made them an easy target.

I only drink oat/coconut/rice milk anyway though.... Maybe not oat-milk anymore! (For now)

It seems there is a cause for all this. An immune system problem which is causing my body to react badly to certain foods that I eat.

A lot of the one's banned were in my diet/or I had been having in recent months.

[Edited link out]

The test was 47 and I have linked it above. I recommend it.

I won't go into too much detail on the other things, but the test showed my kidneys and liver are not in great shape. My liver is toxic, which I knew anyway. Didn't expect the kidneys to be in bad shape.

My PH balance is slightly acid.

She has recommended some things for me, which I will try.

I'll try cutting out my allergy foods and see what happens.

I expect jmsil will update us on his feedback too.

Teh Pwn, will all due respect, your conclusions about Accutane recovery make very little sense. If you spoke to anyone with a basic training in understanding the human body, and told them to getting your body "hot" and "sweaty" again is any type of cure to these problems, they'd raise their eyebrows and then shake their head.

I know you are looking to help and you know what pain Accutane side effects can cause, even long after stopping, but your evidence is extremely anecdotal. If heavy-duty exercise works for you, then that's great. But that doesn't mean that a) that's what fixed your side effects or b) that everyone else needs to do the exact same things you've done in order to recover and that THEY aren't "exercising correctly".

I'm sorry, I just find your posts and your YouTube video to be really strange because they contain no science or speculation that would make sense to either a medical doctor OR a naturopath.

But yes, at the end of the day, regardless of who someone is or what condition they suffer from, exercise is important. For some people it has to be light, others moderate, but exercise is good. For those who get benefits and are able to, heavy duty exercise can be very satisfying too. But pushing your cardiovascular system and muscles to their limit is not a cure for Accutane problems. It definitely is good to get circulation going, and it's certainly good for your mood, emotions, and mind to exercise. But I just feel you are flogging a dead horse and making some absolutely strange and unfounded claims about how HOW you exercise the right way and that everyone else needs to do the same in order to recover.

Indigo - Sorry for not coming back with this sooner. I've had family round today which has made it hard to get on the computer properly. Sorry also if you've been waiting for a phone call. I'll go into everything important the report detailed so it can be compared to yours and if it's of any interest to anyone else.

Vitamin Deficiencies:

Vitamin B6 (slight deficiency)

Mineral Deficiencies:

Chromium (slight deficiency)

Magnesium (slight defiency)

Essential Fatty Acids:

Slight deficiency.

Food Sensitivites:

Avoid:

Cinnamon

Ginger

Turmeric

Nutmeg

Lettuce

Coriander

Minimise:

Apricot

Banana

Kiwi

Lemon

Orange

Tapioca

Curry Powder

Almond

Pepper (Red)

Brewer's Yeast

Casein

Malt

Energetic Balance of Immune System:

Indicates immune system needs strengthening.

Energetic Balance Of Organs (that require attention):

Liver

Pancreas

Anything else from the report that I have commented on above was normal.

I was reading the Daily Star this morning - did anyone else know that Roche was the maker of Tamiflu? There was a big double page article on pg 4 and 5. It was about how Tamifly has been blamed for the deaths of 13 UK patients, since swine fly in 2009.

"Experts say they have "serious concerns" and promise "big" new research into the drug. DDr Carl Heneghan said "We are in the process of puting toether some big research which will be out in December. Let's put it this way - it will be big". Last night healthcare experts and patients who have taken the drug, including one who was left blind, raised their concerns. Dr Carl Heneghan also said "There are serious concerns - in Japan it has a black box warning for adolescents". Other life threatening side effects include suicidal thoughs (including one attempted suicide), psychotic episodes, convulsions, hallucinations and nightmares."

I know this isn't relevent to Accutane, but I had to mention it after I saw this quote from Roche at the bottom of the article:

Tamiflu maker Roche said: "The well-being of patients and the appropriate and effective use of our medications is an unwavering priority".

Comments like this feel like another stab in the back.

And a link of Roche seemingly washing their hands over any liability of the drug:

http://www.dailystar...-safety-secret/

These are really interesting results, if you wanna compare mine were

avoid

Milk, eggs, Cheese, fish, Chilli, Garlic, Wheat, Gluten

borderline

Carrots, ginger.

The through-line from both of you and myself included is liver weakness. I've just sent off a vitamin D test which i'll await the results of. How many foods were tested on both of your tests?

Indigo- the lactose, eggs, goats milk would make me think fat soluble vitamin A causes problems for you, similar to me. The constipation as well would make me think your problems are liver / gallbladder related.

Jmsil- the immune system is essentially the lymphatic system, if i was you i'd cleanse the lymph with herbs and address the liver / gallbladder issues as well as supplementing with a broad spectrum digestive enzyme for the pancreas, What country do you live in Jmsil?

Jmsil -

It's odd how different our food sensitivities are. It all seems rather random. What worries me is, you can't tell any of these cause a problem when eating them, so if we develop further sensitivities in other foods, how do we know without another test? I'm trying to keep optimistic though. The allergies are there for a reason. I'm still not sure why exactly? Something to do with our immune systems being down maybe. Did Hebe tell you she'd contacted a couple of experts who will give us further advice? And also, did she recommend any supplements for you? I've ordered Colosan for digestive issues. I think it's meant to be like Oxy powder, which I've used before. It does help, but didn't fix the problem. But obviously it's important that you're able to release toxins with ease, regularly. I think we're in the right place though. We're doing the right things. The liver still needs lots of help, but in time I hope it can recover.

She recommended doing a liver/gallbladder flush (as by that Moritz guy) so this may help us, though by what Chico has said it'll be harder to do and we should perhaps use coconut oil instead of olive oil.

My diet looks f*cking dull now though. No oats in the morning. I used to have canned soup for lunch but after checking can see it contains wheat and gluten. Grrrr. Can't have a jacket potato either. I guess it's salad every fookin' meal.

We're both needing to limit bananas and kiwis though. I barely ever had kiwi so it's odd that'd be a sensitivity. You're sensitive to quite a lot of healthy foods, which worries me. We don't need another obstacle to regaining our health, like this, but what can we do eh? It's also weird that I can have red peppers and not green and you're the opposite..

Chico -

http://www.healthsynergy.co.uk/phdi/p1.nsf/supppages/0867?opendocument&part=2

There are the foods it tests for. The majority of things I'd say. I notice that things like Papaya and Watermelon aren't tested.

I wasn't ever aware it was going to tell me the state of my organ health, but it's not mentioned the gall-bladder though I wouldn't count it out of the picture. I guess a liver flush is good for both these organs. While I'm eating healthy like this, it's the perfect time to try some out I suppose.

I wonder what my nutritionist will advise tomorrow. Maybe a diet so I don't get bored to death of cabbage leaves!

Ciao.

There's the answer for why we have allergies. I think it'll mostly be down to our liver.

Oh, and Jmsil, or James, if I may ...

I was indeed aware that Tamiflu was made by Roche. When I found out about all the side effects and then heard it was Roche, I guess I wasn't surprised. Of course, they had to be the ones to do it, while so many people were afraid and suffering. They like big amounts of people to get better, of course. Don't worry. One day, they're going to be answering to lots of people. They've done a fair job of covering it up so far, but they can't keep it up. More and more people take this drug and with the internet and forums like this, people start to collaborate.

Stef

Andrew. I'm quite confused on to why you are replying so aggressively to my post. I was just putting my opinion out there. There have been some posts in this forum topic of people saying the are actually hurting themselves more while exercising. That's why I said they some aren't exercising the correct way and I could make a video to show them how to without hurting their joints more and other tips.

Again, in my opinion, I find it silly that most of this forum is about discussion of complicated chemical methods to fixing the body after Accutane. That sort of information is very questionable as no one knows exactly how Accutane affects the body in a chemical sense. Trying to figure it out seems like a waste of time and energy when there are tried and true methods to get healthy again. This being exercise and strong diet. Without worrying too much about the perfect supplements and foods.

Let me give you an example of the information I am trying to put forth.

"The joint pain can be persistent some days but it comes and goes as well. It can be really intense... sacral pain and knees and ankles, and even the muscles in those areas will feel like they are on fire. It's really painful and it causes me to tense up and not be able to stay still or keep focused on the task at hand. Sigh."

Here is a post by you. The problems you are describing here is from weak/tight muscles and dry joints. I had the same problem. I fixed it by running barefoot and in minimalist shoes with near perfect form. And when I ran I made sure that those areas were getting very hot, sweating, full of blood. This strengthened the muscles, relaxed them, stretched them, helped my joints become hot and lubricated. And I did this consistently. I almost have no pains in that area now.

Take a look at someone like Lance Armstrong, a man who had Cancer. He became very healthy again with consistent intense cardio exercise. He recovered.

I am sorry. I don't want to sound so forceful with the information I am giving. I just get frustrated because I feel like the posters on this thread are wasting time discussing methods that will not get them to get them to their health goals.

Again, everything I post is my opinion so it is absolutely fair for all of you to disagree with me. I just feel like after being on 80mg/day, experiencing all the side effects, and now having recovered, I have the experience.

On a side note, I ran my first 10km race yesterday in Littleton, Colorado. It was extremely fun and one of the best experiences I have had in a while.

Nice one dude.

You both make good points, but there's no need to argue.

You're both right.

Teh Pwn is obviously genuine and is just speaking from experience. If exercise has helped his body, we shouldn't brush this aside. Logically, it makes sense that it'd help. Clearly exercise is a way to enhance the body. Everyone knows how good it is for us. It can certainly make you stronger.

Andrew is sceptical and some people like to see evidence before they can trust things. I've certainly become more focused on science. The lady who did my hair analysis emailed me today. She reminded me of something I read a while back (well, it was an audiobook, which is on my iPod)...

https://www.amazon.com/Healing-Code-Minutes-Success-Relationship/dp/1455502014/

There.

The amount of reviews supporting this technique keep rising.

Sure, it doesn't make sense particularly.

It'd totally different to the paradigm we're used to.

It's centered around energy medicine. Could it work? Maybe it could. I like to think of myself as open-minded, but I gave up on doing the 'exercises' in this book after a couple of weeks thinking 'This couldn't possibly work'.

But, that's how our mind works. We need to now how things work. If our liver is toxic right now, which we believe to be the case (and the test said it), how will doing the healing code or exercise fix it? ...

Perhaps we're getting to focused on science. Maybe, just maybe, if we forget about the figures we'd be better off. Sure, when Teh Pwn was talking about the need to get hot and sweaty, it sounded a bit odd to me. But, we know sweating releases toxins. That's probably all he was saying...

Am I going to stop looking at these forums and give up healing? Of course not.

However, I think what we need to realise is this...

1) We aren't scientists. I think it's great that we are trying to think logically. Chico has obviously done some good research, but if we only focus on the science of it, we block off other options. Like Teh Pwn, I know all about Lance Armstrong's recovery. Sure, cycling/running all day sounds f*cking boring to me, but he seems to have recovered quite well. His book is worth a read.

2) We are doing well on the healthy eating part. I think we should focus on a good diet, and the allergy thing has me in a bit of a muddle now, but we are doing what we're meant to with this. Maybe we need to focus on other things?

3) If you change your perspective, things are different. There are many ways to look at this situation. There are a lot of things coming out about the mind-body connection. The odds are stacked against us, of course. It will be harder to be happy/at peace with all these side effects, but perhaps if we shift our focus and get back into enjoying life our minds will not be in a negative zone and it'll allow our bodies to heal. It could be about changing the way we see things. It depends what meaning you give things. Again, if you're an athiest or someone who brushes things off as 'a load of bull-poo' you will close your mind to alternative options. Mention homeopathy to someone who believe in medicine and you're never going to get through to them, even if homeopathic medicine works.

I don't know if what I said above is a load of old tat, but perhaps new problems, like allergies, are there because we expect them to be and are thinking too much about this thing.

I'm out of things to say.

Chico - I appreciate your specific help. I'll look into products that mey help. I mentioned before I have a rebounder which I don't often use, and know it's good for the lymph, so I may try this more. I'm from the UK.

 

"Food sensitivities can be a result of our modern diet, repeated exposure to toxic foods in the

 

 

form of sugar, caffeine and processed foods, a non-varied diet, together with poorly tolerated

 

 

foods such as wheat and dairy products. Poor digestion, insufficient friendly bacteria, toxins

 

 

and stress also have a marked effect on our systems. Sensitivities can also be due to chronic

 

 

exposure to foods, liver disorders or weakness, repeated trauma or injury to an area exposed

 

 

to chemicals. Common sensitivities relate to adverse responses to foods, food additives and

 

 

exposure to chemicals and may show symptoms such as indigestion, wind, irritable bowel,

 

 

tiredness after consuming particular foods, constipation, diarrhoea, bloating and skin

 

 

conditions (just to name a few). The body may also become overly acidic, which can cause

 

 

further issues."

 

There's the answer for why we have allergies.

 

Or in a nutshell, because Accutane completely screwed our bodies up.

I can't fault the test at all and am glad I have proof on paper about the deficiences my body has. I hope the 2 experts Hebe knows can seriously help. But I can't say at the point in time, I'm any more confident of healing my body from Accutane. The report has came back with deficiences sounding like I may have diabetes in the future, and there's no way I could cope with that ontop of what I already have to put up with. The allergy to lettuce just threw me back. The test confirmed my suspicions about spices, but not about ginger and chillis, which have the same negative effect on me. Also, olives did not come up even though the last time I had olive oil, admittedly a while ago now, I felt bad. In answer to your questions Indigo, regarding supplements, she suggested Chromium, as this was deficient. Other then this, a lot of the advice, such as liver flushes, were the same as you mentioned.

Keep strong man.

Don't think about Diabetes at the moment. If it happens, you'll get through it.

You need to remember how well you're doing.

And I know it feels like you're fighting this alone, but you're not.

Not just us in this forum, I don't mean.

There will be a big outbreak about this drug.

Surely.

And then, maybe someone can put 2 and 2 together and explain what has happened to us, instead of leaving us in the dark and trying to guess.

Yeah, Accutane has created a lot of problems and the allergies are their because of them, but I'm sure we're on track.

Allow yourself to imagine the possibility of coming out of this thing.

Think what you could do.

I know this has gone on for years for many of us, but when (not if) we get out of this mess, we'll get out of it with a lot of knowledge about health. We'll know not to go and take a doctor-prescribed medicine and we can make a difference in the world. Maybe we don't have to wait for the change. Maybe we need to make the change we want to see.

Stay strong brother.

I can't fault the test at all and am glad I have proof on paper about the deficiences my body has. I hope the 2 experts Hebe knows can seriously help. But I can't say at the point in time, I'm any more confident of healing my body from Accutane. The report has came back with deficiences sounding like I may have diabetes in the future, and there's no way I could cope with that ontop of what I already have to put up with. The allergy to lettuce just threw me back. The test confirmed my suspicions about spices, but not about ginger and chillis, which have the same negative effect on me. Also, olives did not come up even though the last time I had olive oil, admittedly a while ago now, I felt bad. In answer to your questions Indigo, regarding supplements, she suggested Chromium, as this was deficient. Other then this, a lot of the advice, such as liver flushes, were the same as you mentioned.

 

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about diabetes. There are a great many things you do to prevent it, low-gi diet, intermittent fasting, exercise. Hell, most of us should be living like we have diabetes anyway.

If your worried about it though, it may be best to take that advice and get a chromium supplement, as it helps with blood sugar control. Too bad your allergic to lettuce though, as romaine lettuce is a good source of it.

P.S - What Indigo said on the previous page was spot on. I think we need to be incredibly open minded about our health. I have no doubt many health problems can be fixed with the mind alone. Western science is great for pinpointing the roles/actions of chemicals, hormones etc but probably not the best at treatment. TCM, Meditation, Accupuncture all have their place. Not being open-minded is probably what got me into this situation, listening to doctors tell me diet has nothing to do with acne. My diet was horrific, I'm shocked at myself for not realising this, now we know better.

Milano, that's what the doctor's told me too. Diet plays no part. Makes me wonder if they believe that or if they say it to get you on drugs. Either way, they should know better.

I may of assumed wrong here in thinking I was being tested for food allergies. When I read through the food section of the report I noticed the word "allergy" wasn't mentioned at all, instead "food sensitivity" was used throughout. I thought maybe "sensitivity" may be testing food intolerance instead, and it seems this is the case. I emailed the Hair Analysis lady, and this was the reply:

"I'm referring to food sensitivities, not allergies (there appears to be little difference between food sensitivity and food intolerance). As I'm sure you're aware, allergies are different to sensitivities and are an immune system reaction with rapid onset. Therefore people are generally aware of their allergies, as due their very nature would have had hospital visits due to these extreme reactions. Sensitivities are more of a digestive issue (although it is thought that the immune system can also be involved), and are a slower process. I therefore see more value in dealing with sensitivities as these are less likely to be identified other than through testing."

I just thought I'd post this incase there is any confusion as to what was tested. This explains why foods which I react bad to didn't appear on the test.

I want to apologize to Teh Pwn... it wasn't fair of me to react to him like I did. I guess I just felt he was being too forceful about doing intense workouts. Of course exercise helps-- just do whatever amount you can. Even regular light exercise is good, and it's sure better than nothing. If you can handle and want to do moderate exercise, that is good too. Heavy-duty exercise is up to the individual, but could also be beneficial as long as it's not too hard on the person.

I guess I also want to point out that I don't think weight-lifting is necessarily a good idea. In fact, if you ask a physiotherapist, they'd rather you do natural movements or smoother movements like running, swimming, many other sports, as opposed to weightlifting which can easily lead to injury and which often involves unnatural movements. It also takes a great knowledge of "form" and technique to lift weights properly.

Anyways, I'm sorry for over-reacting and I wanted to apologize.

[Edited link out]

There's a video I did if anyone fancies watching it. It's only talking about stuff I've mentioned here though really.

Chico, what you've suggested sounds interesting..

I saw my Nutritionist today.

It was my initial consultation.

She said she had some doubts about the hair analysis test me and jmsil had done.

I still think it adds up and sounds legit though.

She hasn't heard of a hair analysis being able to pick up on food sensitivities, but the machine (called a SCIO) is said to detect energy patterns in the hair.

The thing I mention about pineapple is enough for me to believe it works, and the lady (Hebe) is very nice and helpful.

The Nutritionist pointed out she didn't have any qualifications listed in her biography on the page and probably has just worked in Holland and Barrett.

I've certainly learned that you can't trust people (not in a pessimistic way), but I still think the test is genuine.

Since I have chronic consipation though, I am confused the test said my gut flora was in balance.

As for the sensitivities, I'm not really sure what to do.

My diet is pretty healthy anyway, but not being able to have any wheat/gluten really is a bitch.

Walking down the 'free from' isle in Tesco (a supermarket) showed me how much of a rip-off 'free from' foods are.

A small loaf of gluten free bread, for example, is over 2. Normally, a loaf of bread is around 50p.

Crazy money!

But, perhaps for now I'll keep it up. I have some gluten free oats for breakfast (so expensive!!) and picked up some wholegrain rice-cakes for snacks.

I feel a bit confused though. I have been given a lot of different advice and opinions.

Both my herbalist and the nutritionist said, however, I should (or must) get protein with every meal.

This may be something to consider guys...

I know you, Chico, have said nuts aren't great (I forget why), but I can't have fish for breakfast as well as lunch and dinner, and eggs are off limits for now.

In my appointment today, she also stated that I should eat breakfast every day.

I always used to, but sometimes I'm just not hungry in the morning and thought it'd be a good idea to leave the organs to rest and heal.

But it's apparantly very important to eat breakfast due to blood sugar balance.

She said (as I already knew) that it's very important to have a nice big poop at least once a day.

It's not like I'm not trying! I'm not sure what she's suggested will do much, as I already get lots of fibre and water, but she's said to try having more magnesium citrate and 2 tablespoons of flaxseeds (grounded) a day. We'll see what happens. I'll get Colosan (like oxy powder) in the post tomorrow.

The test recommended liver flushes, but the nutritionist says that isn't a good idea at the moment, as my body wouldn't tolerate it well. I don't think she knew much about liver cleansing really.

She also suggested cutting out a couple of the supplements I'm taking, which is annoying as I only just added them in. She said the zinc is too high a dose (50mg) and would possibly over-ride copper, and also that melatonin (which I just fancied trying) would/could mess with my sleep pattern. Kelp is to go. I was taking this for thyroid, in case it'd help. And also chlorella is to be stopped, though I'll use them up as I don't see why they'd be a problem. I already have a huge stash of supplements I'd cut out (from when I saw the herbalist), in my cupboards. I don't want to throw money away. Chlorella was pricey!!

She advised I do an 80/20 rule. 20% of the time, eat what the fuck I fancy.

Maybe I will do that. I want to enjoy food like other people do.

I love healthy food, but I do restrict myself. I deserve a fookin' treat every now and then!

I am now to have lemon and water every morning. We all know what this will be good for.. so I will add this.

I guess she didn't tell me to do much else really. It's not that different to what I'm doing already.

I have arranged to do an adrenal test though, so this'll take place soon and I'll get the results in about a month.

Bye for now.

Hey Indigo,

It sounds like the Nutritionist you saw is quite a 'mainstream' doctor where as the allergy test lady is more alternative. I have to ask, is the nutritionist you see an actual medical doctor? I believe in the UK anyone can call themselves a Nutritionist but you need to be certified to be called a 'Dietician'. If your Nutritionist can order tests like you said however (andrenal/hormonal), that would probably indicate she is an actual doctor.

I guess if she is subscribed to western medicine, then she is likely to dispute a test that measures 'energy' of the hair to determine allergies. I'm not sure what to think of this myself, but like I said, it is best we keep on open mind and go with your intuition.

I myself would love to visit a doctor/nutritionist of some sort, just so they can run some tests. It seems easier in the US to have access to labs that perform these tests, but over here it seems you have to go through a doctor either publicly or privately.

As for her recommendations, they sound reasonable enough. I personally don't eat breakfast. I have found it easier this way as most of us have been brought up thinking that breakfast must consist of cereal/grains/toast/eggs and it feels wrong with anything else. I guess you could have bacon. I also practice intermittent fasting (excellent for blood sugar control by the way and many other things, good reading : link and link), eating at 12 noon or later up until about 8pm.

Chico probably advised against nuts because they are mostly fat and some with Accutane issues find to difficult to absorb. Nuts are generally hard on digestion anyway. Although a good part of my daily calories come from Almonds.

Linked to what I said earlier about her having a 'western medicine; mindset, it is also no surprise that she is wary about supplements. The magnesium citrate will act as a laxative if you take enough.

Interesting about the lemon water, it is good for many of our issues related to digestion. I have tried this myself, half of a lemon squeezed into warm water. The results were interesting, it has a good effect on my seb derm/rosacea in that I am generally paler throughout the day. However, after two weeks I started to develop cystic acne, something I've not had since cutting out milk. This has happened twice now, not a coincidence. It could either be a healing reaction, or an allergy. I'm not sure if I had an allergy it would take two weeks to show itself. Anyway, I stopped drinking it both times as I simply don't think my skin could recover and heal from cystic acne anymore without leaving scars. I am tempted to try it again in the future.

Those are my thoughts anyways.

Dear Indigo Rush, please listen to my situation. I have acne. It can actually get pretty severe. Today, my boss kept making a disgusted face, and asked if I needed to go home. This comment was aimed at a gigantic cyst between my eyebrows. I know what caused the cyst. It's from some cookies and chocolate pudding I ate on the weekends. I've noticed a direct correlation between sugary foods, processed food, alcohol, and acne. I would love to take accutane and stop worrying about this problem, because I'm sick of feeling so insecure and different all the time. I can make my acne a ton better, but I'd have to eat super healthy. But I can't stand having to diet all the time. What should I do? I know kids that take drugs and live off junk food and they seem perfectly healthy, not one zit. I know it sounds shallow, but I would love to be like them and not have to worry about what I eat or how my face looks.

Indigo - Cutting out Zinc is acutally a good thing. She is right about the copper ratio, but are you aware that zinc aids Vit A.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9701158

( Its a older one, but I am sure there's more updated ones)

Hope all is well with everyone!

Taluce- many have taken Accutane with NO sucess to only then go to the holistic fourm and clear up thier acne. Just b/c you take accutane doesn't mean once your course is over that you can continue to eat what you want. I think you already know how many of us feel about Accutane in this thread.

Indigo excess bilirubin in the blood is a major indicator of cholestasis of the liver. Barre in mind whilst liver flushing.... that olive oil / lemon mixture is possibly the worst tasteing thing ever, maybe not quite as bad as pea protein powder which is flat out diabolically inedible.

To taluce dont be a f***** fool and take accutane bro, acne is easy to cure.......start taking responsibility for your health cos the answer is never in a pill. Eat healthy natural foods, exercise and take probiotic rich foods like miso, milk kefir, yoghurt.....and your acne will go away. You'll be so much better off never taking accutane just b-line it and eat more natural foods, maybe do a liver flush and you'll clear that acne right up.

Thanks for the replies guys. I think I believe you guys, but I just always need reconfirmation when I eat crappy and then break out. I guess I better stock up on healthy foods for however long my motivation with this diet lasts.

I think what happens is that I eat healthy and then my acne starts to clear up, so I don't worry about it and start too eat junk food. Then I break out and get angry and depressed start considering medication again. I guess I just have to accept that this condition is for life and always eat healthy.

Oli girl - You want to take zinc. As your study shows, zinc is involved in healthy metabolism of vitamin A and used for many other bodily functions. If you truly believe that accutane is still in your body, then zinc will help get rid of it's toxic forms. I have no doubt that isotretinoin stays in our bodies for a long time because it is a fat soluble molecule, its just basic chemistry. However, I do not believe this to be the main cause for most of our persistent side effects. Isotretinoin switches off certain genes that reduce androgen mediated activity. This increases oxidative stress on our cells, because androgens preserve cell health and longevity.

Indigo - Your nutritionist is correct about zinc and copper, it is good to have them balanced to maximize their effects. Further -- breakfast is important because it greatly reduces stress on your adrenals, this gives your body a better shot at recovering. I would suggest against eating bacon or any kind of beef for breakfast.

This is what I take every morning (After a couple months of practicing this routine I have felt MUCH better) - Hopefully your stomach can handle this:

I mix these ingredients into a blender to make a delicious smoothie:

-4 to 8 ounces 100% coconut milk (Thai Kitchen is best)

-8 to 12 ounces pure fruit juice with pulp (I use 'blue machine' from [Removed] or 'Blueberry B' from Odwalla)

-2 table spoons of chia seeds

-30 grams of 100% natural whey protein

-2 tablespoons of 'Pure Synergy' from the [Removed]

-1 tablespoon xylitol sugar

-2 handfuls of three berry mix: raspberries, marionberries and blueberries

-1 handful of strawberries

I would also recommend taking a balanced multi-mineral such as Mega Multi Mineral from [Removed]. This way you don't have to worry about balancing each of your minerals individually.

The ultimate goal here is reduce oxidative stress on your body as much as you can to help it recover. As a disclaimer, I may have recovered naturally, but most my recovery began after balancing out my nutrition and reducing oxidative stress on my cells.

best regards,

-Welt

Hey..

I think you're right that she was a very science-based physician.

She probably does have a medical background, though I'd need to check.

If anything though, she certainly seemed wary of things outside the norm, i.e. liver flushing and hadn't heard of some of the supplements I was taking (i.e. Liv. 52).

What I've decided though, is just to do what my intuition tells me.

Not really sure what that is yet.

I might just stop trying, apart from carrying on a healthy diet and seeing what happens with my adrenals.

I'm pretty frustrated with getting nowhere with all this.

I still think of Chico as our best hope, but I could be wrong.

What I think is important to remember is, there are (though a very small number) some people who have recovered from this.

At least, I've read of a few.

If you remember, and this would probably of been a couple of pages back, I mentioned a guy called Sergio who contacted me on YouTube.

He said about that girl who had side effects for a couple of years and then recovered.

I was waiting on him to find out how she stopped this turmoil...

Anyway, she didn't appear to do anything in particular.

She said that she started to go out more, to the gym and just hanging out with friends and stuff.

Although this appears unhelpful, if true it could be pointing to the importance of the body-mind connection.

We can do all the correct eating and exercise, but if we're thinking 'Fuck this. I should just die.' etc, etc.. it could stop any healing that should be going on.

I love reading the posts on this forum.

I think you're all great people, and most of the time we're being optimistic about this situation (where we could just see grey).

However, I think this has taken over my life.

It's my main focus.

It's the main part of my day.

My opinion on the things about chemicals being changed in the body and that, i.e causing sexual dysfunction and anxiety and what-not.. is that people are going to be on a wild chase if they try to fix all these things. The wrong questions are being asked. If people think 'Ah, so I have these problems because "A.B.C" is out of whack', I think they're wrong. What we need to realise is the chemistry of our bodies is out of balance because of something. Most likely because there is a problem with our liver/adrenals or whatever else comes into play. They are what needs fixing.

As for the telomere theory, who knows if that's right and we're wasting our time trying, but I believe the body is a machine that can handle anything, and recover from anything. Hell, we took poison, but we're still alive. Because of our bodies. But, why are we not well? Why do we still have these shitty side effects? I think we are correct in thinking Accutane never left our bodies. I think Chico is on to something. Whether I jump straight onto that and join in or what he's trying, I don't know. Maybe I'll see what progress he makes. I have heard of at least two people who recovered after doing liver flushes though. It wasn't a matter of doing a few, but I think it goes to show the liver needs some help, in order to help us by doing what it's meant to.

I refuse to accept this half-life, so of course will never give up.

I'll probably still regularly be talking in this forum, but I think I need to just get on with it, for a while.

Relaxation needs to be a factor for all of us.

Whether than means having a hot bath ("You big old poofter"), listening to hypnosis, or just walking and not worrying about all of this.

Sure, it's hard to not stress. My dog is doing my head in as I type this. Whining in her cage. Man, a puppy is hard work.

But, we need to accept what we can and cannot change, at least in this moment.

I do think we need to do something, because there are some people who took this drug over 20 years ago and now say they look old, and have never been able to live a normal life. It's easy to think 'Shit. No hope left'. But who knows. If those people were stressed all of the time, like a lot of us are, they were probably making themselves worse. Their fault? No, probably not. This is a lot to deal with. But, we need to learn to live again. I'm talking mainly about myself here, but you could fit into the picture. I used to read Harry Potter, James Bond etc. Now I read about the adrenals, the digestive system etc. Do I enjoy the health books? Absolutely. But I'm missing out on other things and putting a hold on my life because of this.

Here's my short plan:

- Exercise daily, in any form. (Most likely a walk or some light weight lifting/sit-ups).

- Eat healthy, but if I really fancy something have it. (80/20 rule).

- Build relaxation into my daily life. I have lots of good Hypnosis CD's.

- Practice The Healing Code again. I need to give this a fair trial. If you're open minded, check out Amazon.com for the reviews. Just because we can't see something doesn't mean it's not there (i.e. Gravity).

- Think about a career. This one is difficult. I haven't had a job for, perhaps 11 weeks now. It probably doesn't do me any good, and all this healthy eating and supplementing doesn't come cheap. Of course, I know I'd love to be a musician as I feel this is what I was born to do. But will I do it at the moment, with all this going on? We'll see.

- Carry on with hobbies. I do drama tuesday evenings. I actually have a performance in a couple of weeks. I enjoy it, despite worrying about my looks and red-eyes, etc. I may start doing something like Badminton with my girlfriend. The gym isn't a place for me.

- Sleep better. I go to bed too late. I need to get to bed around 10-10:30PM. This one is surprisingly hard. It shows the power of habits.

I guess that'll do for now. This will take practice, but I think a change is necessary. It is well known that symptoms can be caused, or worsened by stress. It's not like I've not tried to de-stress before, but I think it's something you have to keep working at.

Hope this is useful for you all,

Indy.

Hey Indigo,

thanks for saying that three times, it really sunk in on the third reading (l'm joking).

It sounds to me like you are in a much more positive mindset now, which is great, perhaps getting these tests/seeing the nutritionist did some good.

Your plan sounds much like mine. I have been a year off Accutane now, and in that year I have built a pretty healthy foundation. I completely turned my diet around, regular exercise, less stress - I still need to work on the sleep thing too. The winter of last year was horrific for me. Daily skin flushing, bad raynauds, body aches, bad IBS. I am better now, it took some drastic changes such as quitting my job. Working in retail is stressful enough, but doing it with about four different skin conditions going on took its toll. The amount of stress it caused on a daily basis was not good for me. I realise that not everyone can do this though and I feel privileged that I have this opportunity.

The majority of my symptoms have improved. My back and hand pains have been greatly diminished, my toilet habits are regular and I no longer flush daily (although my skin is still reddish - hopefully this will improve without the constant flushing). All this from just living healthier. Now I can put some faith in some helpful supplements because I know I am doing things right my end. I am focussing kind of on the hair loss now, only because I see it as kinda of a finite thing. Everyone is pretty much in agreement that its a lot harder to get back than to stop it. Seeing hair in my hands everyday is also stress I could do without.

And yes, surrounding yourself with your health problems all day can never be a good thing. It's good that you will be unwinding. I often think what the hell I used to do in my spare time when I wasn't trying to fathom obscure medical papers or reading ridiculously long forum threads. I always read some fiction at night time (Game of Thrones series - Am-a-zing) and play on my Xbox occassionally (New Call of Duty or Battlefield 3? Hmm choices..). Anything to stop my mind racing, which it tends to do.

Keep the faith.