Acne.org Products
Overall, I definetly look better post fraxel. I don't recall anyone, with possible exception of Cameron, who felt they looked worse after healing has occurred.
It is possilbe that one excision scar looks worse than pre fraxel, but I had an excellent improvement in color, tone and texture. I had a mild, say 15%, improvement in scarring. I had presumed that really small scars would go away period. This did not happen. Basically, my scars filled in a little to amke them slightly smaller and slightly softer. I still notice this subtle process going on, even though my last treamtent was in July. I think I am a slow responder due to my older age.
As to excisons, some have great results, others bad (like me and mz). My theory is that this is primarily surgeon dependent. A great surgeon will know when and when not to excise. And, will not try a procedure he/she does not think will work well. In particular, any excision of a wide scar is bound to fail. Punch elevation or subcison is the preferred method for wider scars, but finding an expert is not easy. Moreover, a P/S is trained in how to hide scars and stitch the underlayer so there is no scar separation, as happened with me using a derm.
Hope this helps
Yeah I totally agree that my derm. messed up on couple of my excisions. Collagen growth is so slow, even for my age. I'm just having tiny bits on scarred areas. Hopefully they will fill in completely. Its been 2 months for me since my 1st treatment. My goal for this week is to bring down the redness.
Billyboy: Yes you've been helpful. It has been ~ 5 months since your last treatment. I think your scars will heal with time or more treatment.
Found a link on alot of excision scars photos. It is treated w/ CO2 instead though. But my scars look simiar to the women that had scars on her chin (depth wise).
Here it is, check it out:
Hi Mz
Thanks for photos and good wishes.
Fraxel is as strong as I will go. Every derm I consulted told me my scars were not deep enough to justify risks of erbium, much less CO2. Plus, I am scared to death of hypo, as I am quite tan.
I don't think fraxel will do much for my excision mistakes, although it may help with melanocyte migration to make scar line have pigment. I am following Troubled's advice and waiting for a semi permanent filler to get FDA approval for filling scars.
PS: While the scars look much better in those photos, I also see many examples of hypo. My scars aren't that bad, and candidly, to some extent I think the scar with a even pigment looks better than a less visible scar with an obvious patch of hypo in those sample photos. Most people will see that you have had "work done" around your scar becasue of hypo patch. I guess this might be ok if you have a white complexion and don't like to sun, but I would probably take the scar over hypo patches.
The results looks amazing expecially the little kid on the photo. I guess CO2 shows better results comparing to Fraxel. I'm not planning on doing CO2 either. At least not now. Its just feels much better to see those photos and realize that there are other options left if Fraxel fails. I honesty don't mind getting that particular scar fix by CO2 (Spot treatment) but I'm hoping that I won't need to. If that scar still present few months after my last treatment (i scheduled for 5total) I might contact the derm. from Kentucky (where Magneticboy went) for spot microdermabrasion. I'm planning things ahead but I really hope I won't need to, really tired of treatments and downtime (the whole acne scar issue).
edited: If I have to rate Fraxel treatment with 10 being the best. Right now, I will give it a 2/10.
edited: Have you guys watched the webinars on Reliant webpage? It says its suppose to be for physicans. I watched a little bit and close it up.
Does a surgical scar/linear scar eventually go away? If so, does anyone know approximately how long? I can say that have excision scars is worse than acne scars. The line is really long and ugly if you have too many of them.
my excision scar from from 3 years ago is still here. it got lighter in color and contracted a little in that time. some hair grew at the edges. i can still see it whenever i look. even the white dots from the stitches are apparent.
it's not that noticeable but i can feel there is no collagen under it. feels like a stretch mark when i run my hand over it. im hoping fraxel might help its color, texture, and build some collagen under it.
i think a key to good excision healing is keeping the wound approximated while it's healing. some docs inject the area with botox to prevent dehissence of the wound.
Troubled and JJ
I looked at the surgical scar on website. I presume left side was treated with Fraxel and right was untreated. The white scar line was more evident on the right side. Candidly, however, unless I am missing something, I am not sure which side looked better, as the left side was red and irritated, even though this hid the white scar line..
I'd be interested in your comments because I may be missing something and I have a surgical line to fix.
Billy, James,
The picture appears to have been taken recently post Fraxel. Probably at the 1 month follow up as the tissue still appears to be angiogenic. (After tissue injury redness usually indicates micro blood vessels are still forming underneath the skin to aid in healing). Not to be confused with hyperpigmentation.
James - Granulation is part of the normal wound healing response and is a marker that reepithelialization is occurring. It is more noticible when a patient is treated with Fraxel at high density because of the extent of cell migration that takes place when MTZ's become more dense. This is especially true with thermal (heat injury) caused by lasers. As far as your body is concerned its healing a burn. These changes are temporary. Hope this helps clarify your questions.
Thanks troubled. I wonder if the skin retains that grainy look though, because with CO2/dermabrasion that is a big problem. Patient's trade deep pock marks for an all over orange-peel texture. I've read that it's permanent with those treatments. I don't see how fraxel would be different.?
James,
I understand your concern. The "orange peel" texture after Co2/dermabrasion has more to do with additional scarring underneath the skin "tiny fissures" that are unveiled after the entire upper layers of skin are removed. This coupled with over active oil glands are what contribute to the dreaded orange peel look. This also explains why Co2 works so nicely with treating wrinkles as a majority of patients without acne scarring heal with much smoother and younger looking skin. (There are still many very good P/S that consider Co2 the gold standard). I tend to agree with you however that with newer technology such as Fraxel and Active FX available the risks with Co2 tend to outweigh the benefits.
One thing I should point out is that Fraxel treated skin heals very differently then other ablative procedures because it initiates cell migration from adjacent healthy tissue as opposed to healing from complete reepithelization as with Co2/dermabrasion. This is why granulation is considered temporary with Fraxel.
I remember reading a post a while back from sossimpole who found an article on the net about this same topic. I was able to find it again and feel that the author did such an accurate job explaining it deserves re-posting:
There is another little-known, but very disturbing risk. Contrary to the
impression given in patient information, it can take many months for the
epidermis to recover following medium-depth resurfacing. In particular, if
you have sebaceous (oily) skin with larger pores, medium-depth resurfacing
can temporarily produce a worse epidermal surface texture, even though there
is no scarring. For many months after the procedure, the pores can appear
larger than before. Tiny, unsightly fissures may be seen around the pores,
producing an "orange peel" texture. The problem is related to how the
pilosebaceous unit (pore and sebaceous gland) influences skin regrowth. It
can take many months for this to resolve and may require long-term use of
tretinoin to again obtain a reasonably smooth skin surface.
I hope this helps put some of your concerns at rest.
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Well i had my first full faced fraxel 3 days ago... My face is still pretty red :redface: and it peeled like crazy..i was surprised that i could just rub off the skin when it was wet while i was washing it.. im not too sure if i was suppose to do that... but i had no dead skin left on my face anymore.. its not swollan today either... I feel it was a HUGE help to my scars and especially my pores.. they are almost all gone... i have one more partial fraxel procedure left and i am sooo pumped to see the results! ALL the pain and the swelling is SO worth it... I wish i knew about this procedure back in my highschool and jr high days...... love it!!
Question..does anyone know of a really good hydrating cream... and where i can purchase it.... 😀
I had my 1st fraxel session 2 weeks ago and I never peeled.
How did you NOT peel.... i peeled the VERY next day after the procedure.. my skin still feels creepy crawly ( itchy) because its sooo dry and my forhead is still peeling a little..and i had it done 5 days ago!
Thanks troubled. I wonder if the skin retains that grainy look though,
I think the grainy texture is only around for a few days as your face is healing/peeling from the laser 'burn'. It's the very top layer of skin flaking off, nothing deep like with a CO2 laser.
Oppps now I see that Troubled has explained it much better then I.
Today is two weeks since 4th treatment (fraxel 2).
Redness is pretty much gone.
I had a minor breakout around my chin 
but that is over now 
.
The improvement to the lines around my eyes is flat out AMAZING.
I'm also pleased with the decrease in depth of the marionette lines. The lines are still present but they are getting more shallow.
Overall, my scars are more shallow/less noticeable. My FAVORITE way to judge the improvement is to view my skin with lighting from behind and at an angle. In that lighting/position, the change is actually quite dramatic. (I took a few pictures this way, so I have a baseilne to use for comparison.)
I have one more treatment to go, it is set for 12/4.
I will reassess in March and I MAY go for a few additional treatments at that time.
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Mz,
I wouldn't give up just yet. As you have probably heard, Fraxel treats aprox. 15-20% of the skin at one time. If you have only had two treatments that would mean only 30-40% coverage. The fact that you have already began to see subtle changes this early would indicate that you will likely get good results. I know it's difficult but please remember patience not desperation will lead you into making good choices and ultimately take you where you want to be. 🙂
On another topic. I wasn't aware of a specialized scar hospital in Shanghai and out of professional interest would like to know what the hospitals name is? Do they have a website?
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Mz,
I wouldn't give up just yet. As you have probably heard, Fraxel treats aprox. 15-20% of the skin at one time. If you have only had two treatments that would mean only 30-40% coverage. The fact that you have already began to see subtle changes this early would indicate that you will likely get good results. I know it's difficult but please remember patience not desperation will lead you into making good choices and ultimately take you where you want to be. 🙂
On another topic. I wasn't aware of a specialized scar hospital in Shanghai and out of professional interest would like to know what the hospitals name is? Do they have a website?
Yeah my mom will ask her friend tonight. Hopefully she could get more info. for me. I did research myself last night and found quite a few of them. I'll try to search again and paste the link on here. I'm not given up on Fraxel yet. I will give it 5 treatments. I feel I have more hope now.
I'm very impatient. If I have a choice I would fly to Shanghai by myself to treat my skin. But that would be my next step if Fraxel didn't work. My mom will probably take this trip w/ me.
Is Coconut juice good for the body? I bought couple but I hope it isn't fattening. I will probably start drinking carrot juice n take Vitamine E.
Day 10 Treatment#2 Fraxel 2
I realized that my surgical scars has shrunk a bit and is less shallow. I'm seeing some improvement. So I might be healing alittle better than Billyboy. I will definately tell my doc. to spot treatment all of my surgical scars on my next appointment (Don't mind if it cost more). I still have red scars with tiny bits growing in them. Does anyone know what those tiny bits are? Will they eventually become new collagen and fill in to flatten the scars? How long does it take for them to fill in?
Here are my apt. dates: Dec. 7th, Jan. 4th, Jan. 26th
Here are the links (in chinese): In case anyone doesn't know how to browse the site. I will posts some of the photos on here.
Some pics. are painful to look at
Edited: Based on the photo of the girl w/ Acne Scars above. Here is a translated of what she had (4 different kinds of treatments):
Commonly used treatment face scar method 1st, the pure excision seam is legitimate Is suitable to the Class Three center small area face scar. After the skin scar excision, with the small needle fine lace careful closed injured area, after the technique only leaves behind a thinner scar . 2nd, the face scar excision adds the skin grafting law A, is suitable for the bigger area scar patient, according to the face natural form district, makes up entire skin in the district place, basis scar excision how many, definitely field planting several parts of skins. B, is suitable the patient which covers entirely the entire face to the face scar, namely time the entire face scar excision, in the transplant whole piece skin, can avoid like this when the district skin grafting the scar formation, after the technique the contour must be better than the district skin grafting, the face color cannot the depth, the cosmetology effect be better. 3rd, uses Pi Banfa to repair the scar Is suitable nearby face some organs the scar repair, like the wing of the nose damage, the eyelid abnormal, the argument is abnormal and so on. After the skin petal transplant the luster comparatively approaches the face skin, but also may carry on the filling repair to a part of faces organization hollow damage. 4th, non- surgery method treatment face scar
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Mz,
I wouldn't give up just yet. As you have probably heard, Fraxel treats aprox. 15-20% of the skin at one time. If you have only had two treatments that would mean only 30-40% coverage. The fact that you have already began to see subtle changes this early would indicate that you will likely get good results. I know it's difficult but please remember patience not desperation will lead you into making good choices and ultimately take you where you want to be. 🙂
On another topic. I wasn't aware of a specialized scar hospital in Shanghai and out of professional interest would like to know what the hospitals name is? Do they have a website?
Yeah my mom will ask her friend tonight. Hopefully she could get more info. for me. I did research myself last night and found quite a few of them. I'll try to search again and paste the link on here. I'm not given up on Fraxel yet. I will give it 5 treatments. I feel I have more hope now.
I'm very impatient. If I have a choice I would fly to Shanghai by myself to treat my skin. But that would be my next step if Fraxel didn't work. My mom will probably take this trip w/ me.
Is Coconut juice good for the body? I bought couple but I hope it isn't fattening. I will probably start drinking carrot juice n take Vitamine E.
Day 10 Treatment#2 Fraxel 2
I realized that my surgical scars has shrunk a bit and is less shallow. I'm seeing some improvement. So I might be healing alittle better than Billyboy. I will definately tell my doc. to spot treatment all of my surgical scars on my next appointment (Don't mind if it cost more). I still have red scars with tiny bits growing in them. Does anyone know what those tiny bits are? Will they eventually become new collagen and fill in to flatten the scars? How long does it take for them to fill in?
Here are my apt. dates: Dec. 7th, Jan. 4th, Jan. 26th
Mmm coconut juice. Delicious. I'm going to assume it is good for you since asian people drink it. Coconut oil is really good for the body, and it has a lot of fat in it, but it's the good kind of fat that peanut butter has in it. Carrot juice is great for you! Lots of vitamin A.
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Mz,
I wouldn't give up just yet. As you have probably heard, Fraxel treats aprox. 15-20% of the skin at one time. If you have only had two treatments that would mean only 30-40% coverage. The fact that you have already began to see subtle changes this early would indicate that you will likely get good results. I know it's difficult but please remember patience not desperation will lead you into making good choices and ultimately take you where you want to be. 🙂
On another topic. I wasn't aware of a specialized scar hospital in Shanghai and out of professional interest would like to know what the hospitals name is? Do they have a website?
I agree wholeheartedly with TroubledSkin. Patience will certainly keep us on the path. The hardest part of all of this, of course is to have patience. I am on treatment #1, 5 days into it. dry skin, still a little swelling, and I know better than to even look in the mirror. I am just going to get my treatments, and then start looking at my face later on. Okay, I do peek now and then, but I'm not going to freak out until 3 months after my last treatment. I still think we could use something that induces permanent swelling... 🙂
Also, I looked at the Shanghai pictures. I am not blown away. In all honesty they are working on some HORRIFIC scars, way beyond what I remember from your pictures. And even still, the results are modest at best, IMHO. Please think carefully before going to Shanghai. I am glad you have decided to stick it out with the Fraxel treatments. I think you will be surprised.
-DreamersRage
Hi All,
For Troubled Skin and anyone else familiar with Minocycline...I started last week on 100mgs 2 times a day, but I think the pills are making me sick so I went down to 1 pill at night before bed. I know this is not ideal because I will not have it in my blood stream at a consistant level. My question is whether the bacteria will actually get stronger or something worse since I am only taking it once a day. Anyone know? Thanks.
Hi All,
For Troubled Skin and anyone else familiar with Minocycline...I started last week on 100mgs 2 times a day, but I think the pills are making me sick so I went down to 1 pill at night before bed. I know this is not ideal because I will not have it in my blood stream at a consistant level. My question is whether the bacteria will actually get stronger or something worse since I am only taking it once a day. Anyone know? Thanks.
Nantynannie,
What are your symptoms? If Minocyline is giving you an upset stomach try this method: Drink 8 ounces of water BEFORE you take the capsule. Then take the capsule with another 8 ounces of water. The medication will digest in the water without irritating your stomach lining. If you are experiencing other symptoms and can only tolerate 100mgs. You may want to consider switching to Doxycycline or possibly taking 50mgs twice daily. Minocycline can work at a single 100mgs dose because of it has a long half life however the tetracycline family of antibiotics are most effective when serum levels are at a constant peak throughout the day. In order for Minocycline to work effectively it takes time and the skin is the last of all your organs to reach theraputic levels. I wouldn't be so much concerned with resistence at 100mgs as I would be another cystic outbreak after your next Fraxel treatment if the medication isn't given enough time to work (as long as 6 weeks to 2 months) sometimes sooner.
Hi All,
For Troubled Skin and anyone else familiar with Minocycline...I started last week on 100mgs 2 times a day, but I think the pills are making me sick so I went down to 1 pill at night before bed. I know this is not ideal because I will not have it in my blood stream at a consistant level. My question is whether the bacteria will actually get stronger or something worse since I am only taking it once a day. Anyone know? Thanks.
I started on 2x 100mg mino 3 weeks ago and was really dizzy 2 days in. I called my derm and she just told me to do 1x a day, so I wouldn't worry about it. There is also a good amount of scientific literature out there that developing mino resistance is highly unlikely. Either way, you should call your derm and ask what you should do.
i got dizzy only a few times on mino. had some hot flashes too. not sure if it was really the mino or just normal. one thing that concerned me is that there is some evidence that mino makes the skin sensitive to light but no one on here has had issues with getting hypopigmented during fraxel/mino combo.
Hi everyone: Tonight my mother went ahead and told a friends of hers my skin condition. I am so embarassed. My mothers friends daughter went through a period of skin problem but she went to Shanghai and fix it. A relative of hers also had a huge scar from cut across her face and she now has flawless skin. Her friend told my mother to take me to Shanghai China for skin treatments. I'm planning on going for 5 treatments of Fraxel. If I do not see any differences I'm going to Shanghai for treatment. They have hospital there specialized in scars.
Mz,
I wouldn't give up just yet. As you have probably heard, Fraxel treats aprox. 15-20% of the skin at one time. If you have only had two treatments that would mean only 30-40% coverage. The fact that you have already began to see subtle changes this early would indicate that you will likely get good results. I know it's difficult but please remember patience not desperation will lead you into making good choices and ultimately take you where you want to be.
On another topic. I wasn't aware of a specialized scar hospital in Shanghai and out of professional interest would like to know what the hospitals name is? Do they have a website?
Hi All,
For Troubled Skin and anyone else familiar with Minocycline...I started last week on 100mgs 2 times a day, but I think the pills are making me sick so I went down to 1 pill at night before bed. I know this is not ideal because I will not have it in my blood stream at a consistant level. My question is whether the bacteria will actually get stronger or something worse since I am only taking it once a day. Anyone know? Thanks.
I was on minocycline for about 8 years. I wasn't able to tolerate 100mg. at one time either(it made me very light headed). I then took 50mg. in the morning, and 50 mg. at night, and had no problem with it. I only needed 100mg. to clear up the acne. You may not need 200mg. Good luck to you.
Make sure you eat enough before taking those pills.
Edited: Is this true?? I heard that we should sleep early and that our body heals and rejunviate from 1am to 4am? I've been staying up these days. I was wondering if it is bad for the healing?
getting enough sleeps is always important for just about anything.. but i dunno some people are more relgious here then others i dont think if you sleep late yours scars are not going to heal. just get enough sleep and drink water.
wow looking at those chinese site's picture makes me further more believe in my views in life that NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE. good luck everyone.
oh yea just a sidenote to considered for those who cared. its been about a little over a month now since my 1st fraxel and i must say my skin does look better then it did before, much better, i am ecstatic and can't wait to see what 3 more treatments at higher density/mjs and more passes will do, and looking at those pictures, if they were from fraxel (can't read chinese) then i must say at this rate, my skin will be smooth out in the near future, by next year i pray. also yes the healing phase does continue after a month post fraxel, i am the proof.
i'm am sorry but some of those pictures are just crazy. honestly, some of those pictures aren't even of the same person; some have even been photoshoped [for example, the first girl on the last link -- see how the skin merges with her lip? yea.. PHOTOSHOPED.] some of those pictures ARE real though but i don't know if the sites are trustworthy i mean if they photoshoped one picture, whats keeping them from doing it to the rest? =/ sorry for being the person that goes "oh shi!! fake" but you guys need to look closely before you head off to shanghai or something.
note: I LOVE link2 though... i like how they displayed all the pictures of the person being treated.. that actually might be true -- i sure hope it is.
Those chinese pics are definitely not fraxel I don't think..
NO, Those photos are not from Fraxel. You can see that most of those people in the photos have far worse scarring than us and they look much better w/ treatments now. It reassures me that incase Fraxel doesn't work for me I always have another alternatives. It just keeps me positive and I wanted to share that w/ everyone.
i'm am sorry but some of those pictures are just crazy. honestly, some of those pictures aren't even of the same person; some have even been photoshoped [for example, the first girl on the last link -- see how the skin merges with her lip? yea.. PHOTOSHOPED.] some of those pictures ARE real though but i don't know if the sites are trustworthy i mean if they photoshoped one picture, whats keeping them from doing it to the rest? =/ sorry for being the person that goes "oh shi!! fake" but you guys need to look closely before you head off to shanghai or something.
note: I LOVE link2 though... i like how they displayed all the pictures of the person being treated.. that actually might be true -- i sure hope it is.
You can believe what you want. But Shanghai does have hospitals specialized in Scar treatment (All different types of scars).
Edited: I will look for more links. Haven't had time to read or translate those links, so not quite sure what type of treatments they had.
I found this one, The patient uses Cool Touch III. You can translate the Chinese writing at here: http://babelfish.altavista.com/
*Fraxel is suppose to be better than CoolTouch. I think going aggressive is the key.