the asian dude barley has a difference in before and after and when they was using the machine it looks like the needles didnt even penetrate. i cant say for sure but it doenst seem promising .

If you say so.....

http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/329693-fractora-rf-needling-device/

I had the Mixto fractional CO2 laser for acne scaring about 1.5 years ago. My findings are in agreement with the above conclusions on lasers.

My sun damaged facial skin was much improved and some lines much reduced; acne scaring only slight improvement....yes, must do several to obtain the maximum benefit. No thank you!

The laser treatment was done at maximum output and my face was swollen for several days and blister red. Took about two weeks to resolve to normal.

If you got some improvement (I assume somewhere around 15-20%?) and didn't have any side effects, any particular reason you didn't want to do multiple sessions to get decent improvement?

the asian dude barley has a difference in before and after and when they was using the machine it looks like the needles didnt even penetrate. i cant say for sure but it doenst seem promising .

If you say so.....

http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/329693-fractora-rf-needling-device/

>I had the Mixto fractional CO2 laser for acne scaring about 1.5 years ago. My findings are in agreement with the above conclusions on lasers.

My sun damaged facial skin was much improved and some lines much reduced; acne scaring only slight improvement....yes, must do several to obtain the maximum benefit. No thank you!

The laser treatment was done at maximum output and my face was swollen for several days and blister red. Took about two weeks to resolve to normal.

If you got some improvement (I assume somewhere around 15-20%?) and didn't have any side effects, any particular reason you didn't want to do multiple sessions to get decent improvement?

Frankly, at $2700 initial treatment and $1700 per each thereafter, the improvement, if any, was way too little to justify the added expense. The treatment did help my sun damaged facial skin and some lines, but acne scars were minor improvement. No thanks

Lasers burns the whole face and is quite harsh on the skin. You need to be clear for years if you want to embark on laser treatments cos if you breakout again you might end up with additional scarring. Needling has less side effects though it takes lot of time and doesn.t work on all types of scars.

the asian dude barley has a difference in before and after and when they was using the machine it looks like the needles didnt even penetrate. i cant say for sure but it doenst seem promising .

If you say so.....

http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/329693-fractora-rf-needling-device/

>>>>>>>>I had the Mixto fractional CO2 laser for acne scaring about 1.5 years ago. My findings are in agreement with the above conclusions on lasers.

My sun damaged facial skin was much improved and some lines much reduced; acne scaring only slight improvement....yes, must do several to obtain the maximum benefit. No thank you!

The laser treatment was done at maximum output and my face was swollen for several days and blister red. Took about two weeks to resolve to normal.

If you got some improvement (I assume somewhere around 15-20%?) and didn't have any side effects, any particular reason you didn't want to do multiple sessions to get decent improvement?

This scarring would be so EASY to rectify...it would take between 1.5 to 2 years max to achieve smooth skin...

All he would need to do is:

A) Single needle his scars intensively every 4 days for 2 weeks and then stop for two weeks...repeat this every month until clear....he would also need to apply fresh lemon juice for vitamin c straight after the needling to induce collagen production (and possibly every day or every second day too)....he could try the microneedle from owndoc.com (to prick the skin, inducing a few tiny drops of blood)...also, he could use a a thicker pin, like a sewing needle size, not to prick the skin, but to tap it without puncturing the skin to induce the skin's natural injury healing response.... he could do this at least 3 or 4 times per week....

B) Use retin a twice a week...

D) Use beta glucan liquid at least 3 times per week (or daily if the product is pure beta glucan with no additives)

E) Once a week, do 30 minute massages with rosehip oil after a full facial skin rolling session using a shortish 0.25mm roller [see clearskincare.com.au] ...this could be followed with an application of retin a/ fresh lemon juice/ beta glucan liquid...

F) Apply 1 or 2 drops of copper peptides on skin once every week post full skin rolling session

G) Apply a quality dermatological product with B3 niacinamide once or twice a week...

H) Get a professional skin rolling session once a year.

I) Apply a nutrient dense supergreen facial mask 4 times per week for an hour (manuka honey [factor 10 or above] + fresh lemon juice + Synergy Natural's supergreen powder containing chlorella/ spirulina/ wheat grass/ barley grass)

J) Eat/ drink a nutrient dense / super healthy/ organic/ unprocessed/ natural wholefood/ mostly raw vegan diet with lots of supefoods like: berries, kale, quinoa, lentils, chickpeas, peas, beans, sprouted foods like alfalfa/ mung beans etc, using lots of spices and herbs like turmeric/ cayenne pepper/ ginger/ lemon grass/ thyme etc, fresh veg/ fruit juices with supergreen powder (chlorella/ spirulina/ wheat grass/ barley grass), bok choy, spinach salad greens, tomatoes, black olives, brown/ wild rice, beetroot, carrot, vegan flat breads/ wraps, organic non GMO rice, rice crackers, sea vegetables, hummus, fresh lemon juice, garlic, red onions, chia seeds, flaxseed oil, flaxseed mill, LSA, dandelion greens, dandelion tisane, cilantro, basil, mint, broccoli, traditional grains like amaranth/ buckwheat etc, virgin olive oil, gluten free muesli, almond milk, natural dried fruit without sulphites, flat parsley, fresh pineapple, strawberries, passionfruit, kiwifruit, pomegranate, baked potatoes/ pumpkin/ sweet potato, mixed nuts, mandarins, mixed seeds especially pumpkin/ sesame/ sunflower, unhulled tahini, organic virgin cold pressed coconut oil, coconut water, spring water, dark vegan chocolate (85%),avocado, raw cacao, fermented foods like tempeh/ miso/ sauerkraut, cabbage/ red cabbage, apples, banana, watermelon, other melons, shitake mushrooms, oats, other mushrooms etc

K) Exercise daily for 10 -30 minutes ( to induce human growth hormones/ factors)

L) Get daily sunlight for 10 -30 minutes daily for vitamin D

M) Think positive/ say affirmations/ meditate/ do yoga/ practice faith & hope & perseverance....

N) Get out into pristine nature often/ hike/ swim at clean beach etc

O) Surround himself ONLY with encouraging, supportive family & friends

P) Take a quality multivitamin/ mineral daily

Q) Ensure his space is tidy, clean, organized and aesthetically pleasing to his senses...

R) Have a sauna every 2 or 4 weeks (to help detox)

S) Use benoite clay as a mask or internal drink to detox once a month...

T) Take a quality non-dairy probiotic daily....(and possibly a quality fiber supplement)

U) Avoid microwaves, tap water, sodas, coffee, sports drinks, teas, gluten, processed foods, junk foods, dairy, meats, GMO, MSG, aspartame, fast foods, fried foods, additives, fluoride toothpaste & toxic mouthwash etc

W) Avoid big pharma toxic medicine & vaccines!

X) Learn about natural health remedies/ cleaning and using them: i.e. supernaturalsilver.com ; tea tree oil; organic wild oil of oregano, beta glucan, glutathione... etc

Y) Continue researching new, natural health cures & wellness modalities; Create the life he desires & love it!

Z) Not sure, but possibly use LED light therapy....maybe once every two weeks....and use natural non toxic cleansers/ serum/ shampoos/ deodorant/ facial mists etc i.e. see The Body Deli, Jess Organics, Sukin & possibly Bion Research etc

Cheers

PS For extra help for stubborn scars, he could also try vacuum therapy/ suctioning/ cupping at home or by a professional....

Just to be clear the facial photos are NOT of me.

I am 66 years old...have not had any acne fo45 years.

This scarring would be so EASY to rectify...it would take between 1.5 to 2 years max to achieve smooth skin...

Anything with more than 2 steps that takes more than a few months isn't "easy" to me! I guess I'm lazy

AFR = co2, NAFR = erbium"

So ~40% improvement - which in my opinion is reasonable.

There is a problem on how exactly they measure the amount of improvement:

"The only objective tool is the software based on an optical profiling system (Primos Imaging; GFM; Tetlow, Germany), which allows high-resolution topographical imaging of cutaneous scars and calculation of quantitative volumetric and depth changes in atrophic scar volumes before and after treatment. This has been used only in two studies and one of them did not study acne scars All the other studies use either a patient or observer-dependent quartile scoring which is not an accurate indicator of acne scars improvement. The use of photography is also meaningless as it is again assessed by a quartile or self-devised scoring pattern by an investigator wherein the assessment of the depth of the scar is impossible."

This is the study that covered acne scars: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19226575

But I couldn't find the topographical tool mentioned anywhere (it says: "according to study investigator quartile improvement scoring").

Now just before the paragraph i quoted before it is written:

"The third study that subclassified the scar types used a quartile scale and reported patient assessment which is always superior to the physician assessment and thus has less validity."

That third study is the table you posted in your topic: http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/329601-summary-of-laser-study-results/

AFR = co2, NAFR = erbium"

So ~40% improvement - which in my opinion is reasonable.

There is a problem on how exactly they measure the amount of improvement:

"The only objective tool is the software based on an optical profiling system (Primos Imaging; GFM; Tetlow, Germany), which allows high-resolution topographical imaging of cutaneous scars and calculation of quantitative volumetric and depth changes in atrophic scar volumes before and after treatment. This has been used only in two studies and one of them did not study acne scars All the other studies use either a patient or observer-dependent quartile scoring which is not an accurate indicator of acne scars improvement. The use of photography is also meaningless as it is again assessed by a quartile or self-devised scoring pattern by an investigator wherein the assessment of the depth of the scar is impossible."

This is the study that covered acne scars: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19226575

But I couldn't find the topographical tool mentioned anywhere (it says: "according to study investigator quartile improvement scoring").

Now just before the paragraph i quoted before it is written:

"The third study that subclassified the scar types used a quartile scale and reported patient assessment which is always superior to the physician assessment and thus has less validity."

That third study is the table you posted in your topic: http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/329601-summary-of-laser-study-results/

True Miko Yan. But at the same time - would you rather know what % the patient felt they improvement of that a machine said the scar is now 0.2mm instead of 0.1mm? Personally I would rather know what the patients think their improvement is. I wish there was more studies on it - but just have to go with what we can see. I don't think its unreasonable to expect ~40% improvement after a few sessions - but it works different for everyone and does have risks.

I assume if in the article they wrote that the used Primos in that study then it's probably just not listed in the summary.

Compare this to there being only one study done about the dermaroller - and it was a 500 patient study with various # of treatments for various conditions. So we have much more info on lasers than we do dermarolling.

ps. thanks for a real reply though, instead of telling me to go put egg whites on my face and avoid using microwaves.

I have done the single needling from owndoc.com along with the suction device broke on me after a short period of time because it was made so cheaply- don't recommend it. The single needles were so small they didn't do much. I did buy a much bigger needle to do the horizontal needling and that did work better, but it is true when you get to the 18 gauge needles there is more risk of creating a scar with the needle insertion. I didn't screw myself up because I was working on a fleshy part of the cheek that had thicker scar tissue. I wouldn't do closer to the eyes or anywhere where skin is thinner with bigger needles. I say it helped more, but still hasn't cured my problem. I do think TCA peels can help, but you can't go too high a percentage or will make worse. Everyone's scars are different and will respond to different things. It is definitely worth it to try needling and see where it takes you. Lasers, on the other hand, which has been said, has a higher risk to just try. The doctor who advised me against it had a fractional erbium laser.

Yes, I've heard this does happen e.g. Owndoc.com mentioned something about their pump needing regular maintenance as parts become unfixed...however, Tricia, have you considered professional cupping/ vacuum therapy?...a lot of Chinese Medicine/ Holistic practitioners offer this service...it's akin to very deep tissue massage...you could try it with intensive single needle therapy and fresh lemon juice (or potent vitamin c serum)....you could also try 30 min facial massages following a full skin rolling session (this helped my skin - I used a shortish roller 0.25mm)...also have you tried retin a and/ or a B3 niacinamide topical? These help remodel/ resurface your skin...

As for TCA, I found it far too strong (i.e. it made a scar on my skin...but I have since fixed it).....

And yes, I agree with you, everyone's scars are different & need different therapies...but I do sincerely believe that all scars can heal...and it's far easier than most people realize.... it just requires a holistic approach...(it took me a long time to discover this truth!)...

And good to hear your doctor wasn't a charlatan and told you not to get the laser....sounds like an ethical professional....did he suggest something else to you?

Hey aquasea,i want to grasp the chance to post here something from one really nice herbalist

that makes homemade herbs.He is called barefoot herbalist and says that the one that think and persuade themselves that vegetables

are human food they will or have lost the battles with worms/parasites.

I believe you should look into deworming because i see you plan for long term vegeterianism.I am not spreading fear.Just posting this for better understanding,.

Deworming is some bunch of herbs or other natural methods that clean your body from parasites/worms.

I try to be at least 50% fruitarian.

Hi Panos,

I'm not sure what you mean. I am a vegan for ethical reasons. I don't have acne anymore either. My scars are more than 90% healed. And I don't have any symptoms of worms/ parasites.

I think the correlation of eating vegetables and having worms/ parasites is bizarre. Could you please explain your theory?

Cheers

Hi Panos,

I'm not sure what you mean. I am a vegan for ethical reasons. I don't have acne anymore either. My scars are more than 90% healed. And I don't have any symptoms of worms/ parasites.

I think the correlation of eating vegetables and having worms/ parasites is bizarre. Could you please explain your theory?

Cheers

You can ask your question to this guy here.

He will answer you in detail if you ask for it.

http://curezone.com/forums/f.asp?f=626

He is a homemade herbalist and doesnt scam .

The linked page, are you referring to the person who says she has bacon bits in her poop when looking at it through a microscope?...I am hard pressed to find any helpful information in the posts on that link.

The linked page, are you referring to the person who says she has bacon bits in her poop when looking at it through a microscope?...I am hard pressed to find any helpful information in the posts on that link.

No its the forum ''Ask barefoot herbalist''. Everybody ask him stuff about health.

He posts and the name MH. He says according to the great old doctors scarring is simply a result

of bad calcium/lime that forms the scar and the blood is unable to break this hard calcium.

Lol, ok. Thank you for clearing that up for me.

I have been thinking if I am going to try anything else, I may shell out the money for PRP or selphyl. If I knew of a good Chinese practitioner around me that might cup or vacuum my scars maybe I would try it, but I don't really think it will work. I have massaged my scars quite a bit, and continue too every now and then. I do believe massage can help. What is weird about my scarring is there is a circle of raised or thickened scar tissue around my depressions (not really raised off my face, but raised enough to see the scar tissue line) and I'm not sure if it was made worse by the fillers I had, like the little silicone I had, but really I think that is just how my face scars. When I do the TCA peel it burns it off initially and looks better, but then it's like it does have a memory and just grows back. I was hoping through doing some silicone straight to the center of the scars it would create the same thickened tissue and the spot would look an even level, but it didn't work. In the mornings there is more inflammation surrounding my scars from having my head down at night. I wonder sometimes if I should try some product that is really good at reducing inflammation besides hydrocortisone because that thins the skin. I don't know if this all makes sense, but sometimes I just feel my scarring is not normal.

Hi Panos,

Being a vegan has nothing to do with having parasites. I don't eat meat/ eggs/ dairy because I love animals...and I discovered my skin healed as a result of my healthy vegan mostly raw & organic eating habits.... tea tree oil/ sea salt & lavender oil were also key to recovering from acne.

I think the herbalist is a meat eater so he is biased in his views about vegans. Instead I think there are loads of parasites / worms in meat/ dairy/ eggs but not vegetables/ fruits etc....

Cheers

Hi Tricia,

I think injecting your face with silicon is very harmful. Is there any way you can take it out of your body/ scars?

Also, how can your scars heal if there's an artificial substance in them blocking your collagen? And the inflammation is most probably due to the silicon. I think you need to see a specialist which can help take out the silicon. That would be the first thing you need to do IMHO. And as for cortisone, that is sooooo bad for your skin & body long term. You have got to stop using that ASAP. Please see a naturopath or Chinese medicine specialist for more holistic healing advice.

I'm sure your body can heal its scars naturally if you give it good nutrition/ mesotherapy & ensure you have no toxins in your body or on your skin.

Cheers

PS What are PRP or selphy?

PPS If you want fillers, you should only get the ones that use a natural substance that dissipates naturally with time i.e. either your own body fat or hyaluronic acid i.e. restylene etc

PPPS TCA won't rebuild your skin tissue....your body needs to harness its own natural wound healing response to rebuild collagen/ skin tissue naturally. And your skin needs lots of vitamin c to do this...please try applying fresh lemon juice to your skin daily. Preferably after skin needling. You can also add retin a on top every 3 or 4 days to help your skin remodel. Also, supergreen powder (with chlorella/ spirulina/ wheat/ grass) is jammed with minerals/ EFAs/ vitamins your skin needs to heal. Mix it with manuka honey (10 + factor) and fresh lemon juice for a nourishing therapeutic skin mask. Use it 3 or 4 times per week for an hour. It should really help your skin. I use Synergy Natural Supergreen powder but there are other brands too. You could also look into taking beta glucan capsules and applying it to your skin. This is very beneficial to healing & improving your immune system (so too glutathione). B3 niacinamide is also vital for healing damaged skin.

He is not a meat eater Aqua sea. He claims meat CANT be digested by the hyman body.

Too much vegetables will result in parasite build up.

According to him,always, only sweet fruits from the trees are made for human body to digest.

Fruits will clean your blood .For him,a 40 days orange juice fast will give you new skin .A 21 days OJ fast gives new heart.

And a 14 days OJ fast gives 5x red blood cells. Just passing claims.

I agree cortisone is bad and thins skin, so I haven't used it in years. The thing about my scars is they were very inflamed to begin with, even before the microdroplet silicone I had. But since I see no results in the middle of my scars I wonder where the stuff went, and if it perhaps went to the outer edges, where there is too much collagen buildup, thus creating thicker scars. Silicone makes your body build collagen around it, it doesn't inhibit collagen.

Selplyl is where they take your blood and put in into a centrifuge machines, spin it, creating more fibroblasts and inject it into your skin. I have heard it can help, but it doesn't stay like a filler, it spreads out and just is suppose to bring healthier skin.

The fractora machine seems new out, I have read some good reviews through research now, but also it looks a lot like thermage, with the RF heating. Just wondering if I would lose fat. My skin is definitely starting to need tightening though at 38.

Hi Panos,

 

Being a vegan has nothing to do with having parasites. I don't eat meat/ eggs/ dairy because I love animals...and I discovered my skin healed as a result of my healthy vegan mostly raw & organic eating habits.... tea tree oil/ sea salt & lavender oil were also key to recovering from acne.

 

I think the herbalist is a meat eater so he is biased in his views about vegans. Instead I think there are loads of parasites / worms in meat/ dairy/ eggs but not vegetables/ fruits etc....

 

Cheers

 

 

Hi Tricia,

 

I think injecting your face with silicon is very harmful. Is there any way you can take it out of your body/ scars?

 

Also, how can your scars heal if there's an artificial substance in them blocking your collagen? And the inflammation is most probably due to the silicon. I think you need to see a specialist which can help take out the silicon. That would be the first thing you need to do IMHO. And as for cortisone, that is sooooo bad for your skin & body long term. You have got to stop using that ASAP. Please see a naturopath or Chinese medicine specialist for more holistic healing advice.

 

I'm sure your body can heal its scars naturally if you give it good nutrition/ mesotherapy & ensure you have no toxins in your body or on your skin.

 

Cheers

 

PS What are PRP or selphy?

 

PPS If you want fillers, you should only get the ones that use a natural substance that dissipates naturally with time i.e. either your own body fat or hyaluronic acid i.e. restylene etc

 

PPPS TCA won't rebuild your skin tissue....your body needs to harness its own natural wound healing response to rebuild collagen/ skin tissue naturally. And your skin needs lots of vitamin c to do this...please try applying fresh lemon juice to your skin daily. Preferably after skin needling. You can also add retin a on top every 3 or 4 days to help your skin remodel. Also, supergreen powder (with chlorella/ spirulina/ wheat/ grass) is jammed with minerals/ EFAs/ vitamins your skin needs to heal. Mix it with manuka honey (10 + factor) and fresh lemon juice for a nourishing therapeutic skin mask. Use it 3 or 4 times per week for an hour. It should really help your skin. I use Synergy Natural Supergreen powder but there are other brands too. You could also look into taking beta glucan capsules and applying it to your skin. This is very beneficial to healing & improving your immune system (so too glutathione). B3 niacinamide is also vital for healing damaged skin.

 

 

I agree cortisone is bad and thins skin, so I haven't used it in years. The thing about my scars is they were very inflamed to begin with, even before the microdroplet silicone I had. But since I see no results in the middle of my scars I wonder where the stuff went, and if it perhaps went to the outer edges, where there is too much collagen buildup, thus creating thicker scars. Silicone makes your body build collagen around it, it doesn't inhibit collagen.

Selplyl is where they take your blood and put in into a centrifuge machines, spin it, creating more fibroblasts and inject it into your skin. I have heard it can help, but it doesn't stay like a filler, it spreads out and just is suppose to bring healthier skin.

The fractora machine seems new out, I have read some good reviews through research now, but also it looks a lot like thermage, with the RF heating. Just wondering if I would lose fat. My skin is definitely starting to need tightening though at 38.

Hi Panos,

Being a vegan has nothing to do with having parasites. I don't eat meat/ eggs/ dairy because I love animals...and I discovered my skin healed as a result of my healthy vegan mostly raw & organic eating habits.... tea tree oil/ sea salt & lavender oil were also key to recovering from acne.

I think the herbalist is a meat eater so he is biased in his views about vegans. Instead I think there are loads of parasites / worms in meat/ dairy/ eggs but not vegetables/ fruits etc....

Cheers

 

Hi Tricia,

I think injecting your face with silicon is very harmful. Is there any way you can take it out of your body/ scars?

Also, how can your scars heal if there's an artificial substance in them blocking your collagen? And the inflammation is most probably due to the silicon. I think you need to see a specialist which can help take out the silicon. That would be the first thing you need to do IMHO. And as for cortisone, that is sooooo bad for your skin & body long term. You have got to stop using that ASAP. Please see a naturopath or Chinese medicine specialist for more holistic healing advice.

I'm sure your body can heal its scars naturally if you give it good nutrition/ mesotherapy & ensure you have no toxins in your body or on your skin.

Cheers

PS What are PRP or selphy?

PPS If you want fillers, you should only get the ones that use a natural substance that dissipates naturally with time i.e. either your own body fat or hyaluronic acid i.e. restylene etc

PPPS TCA won't rebuild your skin tissue....your body needs to harness its own natural wound healing response to rebuild collagen/ skin tissue naturally. And your skin needs lots of vitamin c to do this...please try applying fresh lemon juice to your skin daily. Preferably after skin needling. You can also add retin a on top every 3 or 4 days to help your skin remodel. Also, supergreen powder (with chlorella/ spirulina/ wheat/ grass) is jammed with minerals/ EFAs/ vitamins your skin needs to heal. Mix it with manuka honey (10 + factor) and fresh lemon juice for a nourishing therapeutic skin mask. Use it 3 or 4 times per week for an hour. It should really help your skin. I use Synergy Natural Supergreen powder but there are other brands too. You could also look into taking beta glucan capsules and applying it to your skin. This is very beneficial to healing & improving your immune system (so too glutathione). B3 niacinamide is also vital for healing damaged skin

im looking in too fractora also. what does thermage and fractora have in common besides the heating?

Well, I see that there are different types of fractora out there and some are actually for getting rid of fat in the chin. I am guessing if they penetrate deeper it will melt fat. Thermage was used on the face and caused a lot of people to lose fat. So, if for some reason the rf heat gets too deep into your face or something goes wrong you could lose fat in your face. I did read one review of a lady who had in on her lids and under eyes and afterwards they were worse with looser skin. Obviously the fat was lost there. I would never let it get near my eyes since skin is thinner. The good thing is the heat misses more of the top part of your skin so there is less downtime. Unfortuntately, I would have to travel 4 hours to get this done, but I will probably be moving with my military husband again at the end of August, so would be closer later.

No_Hope, I confess I have not read through this thread, but responding to your original post I believe your doctor is a negative ninny and full of poop. Fraxel Re:pair done at high mj settings has proven itself. It is the only thing that has ever worked for me. The biggest waste of money would be anybody seeking help that would waste their time and pay his fee. How many people who could have been helped have taken his advice?

P.S. If you don't go strong then just stay home. Minimum mj = minimum results. It is as simple as that.

Well, I see that there are different types of fractora out there and some are actually for getting rid of fat in the chin. I am guessing if they penetrate deeper it will melt fat. Thermage was used on the face and caused a lot of people to lose fat. So, if for some reason the rf heat gets too deep into your face or something goes wrong you could lose fat in your face. I did read one review of a lady who had in on her lids and under eyes and afterwards they were worse with looser skin. Obviously the fat was lost there. I would never let it get near my eyes since skin is thinner. The good thing is the heat misses more of the top part of your skin so there is less downtime. Unfortuntately, I would have to travel 4 hours to get this done, but I will probably be moving with my military husband again at the end of August, so would be closer later.

ya i read on the fat loss . since fractora is adjustable i assume this problem can be avoided. my scarring is on my upper cheeks so i dont think i would be at risk of loosing fat there no? one thing i am really confused about is fractora is almost identical to intracel which is also RF microneedling. unless there the same method just different name i reallly wanna know whats the difference and which one is more effective on deep acne scarring. also i dont think 1mm penetration is deep enough for the deep scars. what do you think?

No_Hope, I confess I have not read through this thread, but responding to your original post I believe your doctor is a negative ninny and full of poop. Fraxel Re:pair done at high mj settings has proven itself. It is the only thing that has ever worked for me. The biggest waste of money would be anybody seeking help that would waste their time and pay his fee. How many people who could have been helped have taken his advice?

P.S. If you don't go strong then just stay home. Minimum mj = minimum results. It is as simple as that.

im glad laser worked for you dudley. you have to remmeber at the end of the day everyone has different skin types. laser is suited more for people with light skin. im hispanic i wouldnt be a candidate for fraxel restore or repair. also with all the side effects and the overpriced cost its just not worth it in the end with some people. the ratio to people having succuess and people not having successs, the non successs is much greater.

no_hope, your point about darker skin types is well taken. I do get a little testy about all the people who say it doesn't work when I know it does. I ignore any comments about results that use the lower settings, and that is where you hear the dissatisfaction. I don't know how many times I have to say the same thing. If you go into Re:pair doing 30-40mj you might as well do nothing. You will not see results! Unless you crank it up to 60-70mj there is no purpose in posting your results. I have also said over and over again that Re:pair is a cumulative process. CollegBoy understands this, I don't know why others can't grasp the concept. YOU WILL NOT GET THE RESULTS YOU WANT AFTER ONE RE:PAIR. There are no "ONE AND DONE TREATMENTS", and people are just silly for thinking there is.

I was trying to remember the name of the other device, you are right it is very similar to intracel. I talked with someone else on here that we getting intracel treatments, and they were happy with repeated treatment. I'm not sure how many side effects will be seen after more people get it done. It is less downtime with very similar results to stronger lasers when a doctor uses strong settings. You can just get the heating without the needling and that will tighten the skin, but the needling will penetrate the heat deeper to where the scars are. I don't know how deep the needles go, but there are various settings. I would just start with a spot treatment if possible. You want to see if it goes well. The cost is definitely more affordable with fractora.

 

Well, I see that there are different types of fractora out there and some are actually for getting rid of fat in the chin. I am guessing if they penetrate deeper it will melt fat. Thermage was used on the face and caused a lot of people to lose fat. So, if for some reason the rf heat gets too deep into your face or something goes wrong you could lose fat in your face. I did read one review of a lady who had in on her lids and under eyes and afterwards they were worse with looser skin. Obviously the fat was lost there. I would never let it get near my eyes since skin is thinner. The good thing is the heat misses more of the top part of your skin so there is less downtime. Unfortuntately, I would have to travel 4 hours to get this done, but I will probably be moving with my military husband again at the end of August, so would be closer later.

ya i read on the fat loss . since fractora is adjustable i assume this problem can be avoided. my scarring is on my upper cheeks so i dont think i would be at risk of loosing fat there no? one thing i am really confused about is fractora is almost identical to intracel which is also RF microneedling. unless there the same method just different name i reallly wanna know whats the difference and which one is more effective on deep acne scarring. also i dont think 1mm penetration is deep enough for the deep scars. what do you think?

>No_Hope, I confess I have not read through this thread, but responding to your original post I believe your doctor is a negative ninny and full of poop. Fraxel Re:pair done at high mj settings has proven itself. It is the only thing that has ever worked for me. The biggest waste of money would be anybody seeking help that would waste their time and pay his fee. How many people who could have been helped have taken his advice?

P.S. If you don't go strong then just stay home. Minimum mj = minimum results. It is as simple as that.