TCA Cross Mistake (Left Behind Red Marks)

Started by downinthedms downinthedms

27 posts in this topic

Hey guys,

Long story short, I was performing at home TCA Cross on some of my ice picks and small boxcar scars and it was giving me good improvement. 

As I got more and more confident, I decided it was a good idea to do it on some of my bigger rolling scars against all I had read (BIG MISTAKE). Well now after the scabs came off, it left me with big red marks on my face :( . 

The silver lining is that it is easily coverable by concealer. 

Any help is appreciated in what procedures or steps I can take to get rid of the red marks. I thought V Beam might be the best option but I am Fitzpatrick IV skin type so I don't know if I am a suitable candidate for it.

Appreciate the responses! Cheers!

 

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** Always heal for many months (6-12 months) before you try any laser or steroids as they can hinder healing. 

After proper healing time... Picosure or Excel V will work on you. Picosure is for your skin type. Yes this will just take a long time to heal, you have damaged the skin. For some it takes many months, up to a year. 



See the Acid Peel Mega Post linked off the FAQ for more support, ... The last few pages are guys who did similar things to you and healed.

BA

 


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TABLE OF CONTENTS:
1. SUCCESSFUL TREATMENT THREADS                                                                 7. HYPERTROPHIC / KELOID (RAISED SCARS)
2. WHAT IS ACNE & PREVENTING SCARS                                                              8. SUBCISION
3. DIFFERENT TYPES OF SCARRING                                                                      
9. FILLER FOR SCARS
4. TREATING SCARS AT HOME                                                                              10. LASER
5. SKIN: RED (PIE) BROWN (PIH), WHITE MARKS,                                               11. MICRONEEDLING
     TEXTURE, LARGE PORES,  DRYNESS, & COVERING UP SCARS                    12. TCA CROSS FOR ICEPICK SCARS & ACID PEELS                       
6. PUNCH GRAFTING & EXCISION                                                                        13.
LIST OF ACNE SCAR TREATMENT DOCTORS

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2 hours ago, downinthedms said:

Any help is appreciated in what procedures or steps I can take to get rid of the red marks. I thought V Beam might be the best option but I am Fitzpatrick IV skin type so I don't know if I am a suitable candidate for it.


No doubt, Pico or V are probably the best way to go. But if you want to try the home remedy route, I suggest you apply cold mayonnaise. Mayo both reduces inflammation and hydrates the skin at the same time.

There is no life without water. Use it to your advantage.


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@downinthedms How long after the TCA cross session were these photos taken? It will take a LONG time for the redness to fade on its own but it certainly will fade over time.  As @beautifulambition said, you are likely looking at 6-12 months before the redness completely fades and because of where you are on the Fitzpatrick scale, you will probably hyperpigment.  Keep this skin moisturized because due to the inflammation, it's still actively going through the wound healing process, and will continue to remodel for months to come .  My skin went through something similar after a peel, although it wasn't quite as purple looking color-wise, and it took about 3 months for the redness to completely dissipate. It got a little bit better every week.  

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Thanks you for the replies @beautifulambition @Sirius Lee and @UpliftingCat.

@UpliftingCat
The photos were only taken yesterday, around a month after the TCA cross session. You suggested applying mayo, is this still applicable since its already been 1 month?

@beautifulambition
Is there anything I can do to speed up the healing process at home? I get a feeling that its going to be there forever lol. No more saunas and swimming pools for me.

Other than Picosure and Excel V, are there or should there be anything else I should do? Out of Picosure and Excel V, which one is better? Also should I wait for a bit before starting to do lasers or can I go right away?

So many questions....I know. I appreciate the responses.

Cheers!

Edited by downinthedms

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@downinthedms It's in the wound phase, we don't want to do too much or you can irritate / make healing longer (** Always heal for many months (6-12 months) before you try any laser or steroids as they can hinder healing). Aloe Vera is good and manuka honey or triple antibiotic. Consider them small burns, as that is what they are, thus hydrogels and the like made for burns are also options. OF course they must be kept moist and protected from UV, the skin is regenerating. There are various cures in different countries for burns, you just don't want to irritate the face, so no exfoliation or harsh topicals. 

Once we get out of the healing phase 3 weeks I would start with Emu Oil / neem oil, which does help heal.

You can also try 1:1 equal parts moisturizer and hydrocortisone but only after your healed more, it can thin the skin (OTC steroid). Do not do this before 3 months as you can stop the healing. Steroids are not good for healing.

The lasers do make things go quicker but no rush  (think about that 6 months out). 

 

** Please "Like" my response above; Capturedwdn.JPG  As a volunteer encouragement helps! |::wiggle:

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__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 :smileys_n_people_116: CLICKABLE LINK: OFFICIAL ACNE SCAR SOLUTIONS; Q&A / FAQ :smileys_n_people_108:
TABLE OF CONTENTS:
1. SUCCESSFUL TREATMENT THREADS                                                                 7. HYPERTROPHIC / KELOID (RAISED SCARS)
2. WHAT IS ACNE & PREVENTING SCARS                                                              8. SUBCISION
3. DIFFERENT TYPES OF SCARRING                                                                      
9. FILLER FOR SCARS
4. TREATING SCARS AT HOME                                                                              10. LASER
5. SKIN: RED (PIE) BROWN (PIH), WHITE MARKS,                                               11. MICRONEEDLING
     TEXTURE, LARGE PORES,  DRYNESS, & COVERING UP SCARS                    12. TCA CROSS FOR ICEPICK SCARS & ACID PEELS                       
6. PUNCH GRAFTING & EXCISION                                                                        13.
LIST OF ACNE SCAR TREATMENT DOCTORS

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@beautifulambition
Thanks for the reply.

So I guess in that case, I should start with the Emu Oil because its already been 4 weeks since I did the TCA Cross.

As long as the laser won't damage my skin further, I wouldn't mind giving it a shot. Edited by downinthedms

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@downinthedms Doing a vascular laser could actually cause damage. No laser is without risk.  You’re only 4 weeks out from essentially a second degree burn. My doctor won’t even consider a vascular laser until 3 months post. 

In regards to using a hydrocortisone cream, I personally would advise against this so early in the healing process. It impedes wound healing.  I had a peel done 4 weeks ago (so around the same time frame you had yours) and this peel was done so aggressively that it caused me to develop an infection (the deeper the peel the more prone you are to developing an infection). I was worried about the inflammation I had not only from the peel but the infection itself and asked my doctor if he thought I should be prescribed a cortisone cream and he said no and that it would cause irregular healing. Inflammation is a necessary part of wound healing, especially after an aggressive peel. I am incredibly red right now and expect to be red for close to 5 months after this peel.  Patients who get the Baker-Gordon (croton oil/phenol peel) can expect redness for 6-12 months and even as long as 18 months in some cases. 

Has your redness improved at all since this happened? 
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2 hours ago, UpliftingCat said:
@downinthedms Doing a vascular laser could actually cause damage. No laser is without risk.  You’re only 4 weeks out from essentially a second degree burn. My doctor won’t even consider a vascular laser until 3 months post. 

In regards to using a hydrocortisone cream, I personally would advise against this so early in the healing process. It impedes wound healing.  I had a peel done 4 weeks ago (so around the same time frame you had yours) and this peel was done so aggressively that it caused me to develop an infection (the deeper the peel the more prone you are to developing an infection). I was worried about the inflammation I had not only from the peel but the infection itself and asked my doctor if he thought I should be prescribed a cortisone cream and he said no and that it would cause irregular healing. Inflammation is a necessary part of wound healing, especially after an aggressive peel. I am incredibly red right now and expect to be red for close to 5 months after this peel.  Patients who get the Baker-Gordon (croton oil/phenol peel) can expect redness for 6-12 months and even as long as 18 months in some cases. 

Has your redness improved at all since this happened? 
what type of peel did you undergo??

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@UpliftingCat Gave good advice here. 
@Amp2695 Your not waiting the proper time to heal. I know you told me it's been some time but I see from what you put above it's only been 4+ weeks. These things take a long time to heal from. A year or more for many people. As stated you burnt your skin and the body must try to repair it. No good Dr will laser you or use steroid until 3+ months after. Your in the healing phase and we don't want to stop any reconstitution. When I give advice for vascular laser / pico and or dilute steroid it's in the understanding of proper healing time before these are used. You don't pour more acid or energy on a wound before healing can occur.  I don't want you to rush from one problem into another that must be fixed.

Have you considered silicone patches, over the red spots and wear them as much as possible even at night, which will help the upper dermis / epidermis to do some restructuring. Even use some dermablend to cover them during the day. 

Have you seen a board certified aesthetics Dr regarding this issue to consult?

Listen to Uplifting who has treated extensively with peels.

BA

** Please "Like" my response above; Capturedwdn.JPG  As a volunteer encouragement helps! |::wiggle:

I provide - (private) messaging to answer your acne scars. PM me to ask more.

[Thank You For Your Kind Understanding - I reply to individual PM's addressing your concerns as soon as I can, helping many people a day, please be patient.]
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 :smileys_n_people_116: CLICKABLE LINK: OFFICIAL ACNE SCAR SOLUTIONS; Q&A / FAQ :smileys_n_people_108:
TABLE OF CONTENTS:
1. SUCCESSFUL TREATMENT THREADS                                                                 7. HYPERTROPHIC / KELOID (RAISED SCARS)
2. WHAT IS ACNE & PREVENTING SCARS                                                              8. SUBCISION
3. DIFFERENT TYPES OF SCARRING                                                                      
9. FILLER FOR SCARS
4. TREATING SCARS AT HOME                                                                              10. LASER
5. SKIN: RED (PIE) BROWN (PIH), WHITE MARKS,                                               11. MICRONEEDLING
     TEXTURE, LARGE PORES,  DRYNESS, & COVERING UP SCARS                    12. TCA CROSS FOR ICEPICK SCARS & ACID PEELS                       
6. PUNCH GRAFTING & EXCISION                                                                        13.
LIST OF ACNE SCAR TREATMENT DOCTORS

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I agree that will take 6-12 months to heal on it own.

Vbeam would buy you a couple of months. In my opinion, I would wait it out. Vascular laser is expensive and carries risk to treat something that is not permanent, though it does actually work. Up to you.


“Do not compare yourself to others. If you do so, you are insulting yourself.”


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5 hours ago, Amp2695 said:
what type of peel did you undergo??

I had a combination peel which combined dry ice and TCA 35%.  The amount of layers and the aggression that was done with the dry ice was comparative to a Hetter peel (lighter version of the Baker-Gordon peel). My skin swelled up so much my eye was swollen shut and I had a Level 3 frost.  The peel wasn't even applied under my eyes but that's just how extreme the swelling was.  As a matter of fact, the white frost stayed on my skin for 3 days.  It was quite intense! I'd just look for gradual reduction in redness over the coming weeks/months. It will likely go from that purplish red color, to a deep red, to deep pink, and then to a light pink color.  I had that purplish red color too when my skin first peeled but I would say it's now more of a deep pink.   As everyone mentioned, it is imperative that you use sun protection and even wear a hat on a daily basis.  I would also avoid working out or jogging for the time being because increased blood flow can cause broken vessels in the new skin. 
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On 5/15/2018 at 9:42 PM, UpliftingCat said:

I had a combination peel which combined dry ice and TCA 35%.  The amount of layers and the aggression that was done with the dry ice was comparative to a Hetter peel (lighter version of the Baker-Gordon peel). My skin swelled up so much my eye was swollen shut and I had a Level 3 frost.  The peel wasn't even applied under my eyes but that's just how extreme the swelling was.  As a matter of fact, the white frost stayed on my skin for 3 days.  It was quite intense! I'd just look for gradual reduction in redness over the coming weeks/months. It will likely go from that purplish red color, to a deep red, to deep pink, and then to a light pink color.  I had that purplish red color too when my skin first peeled but I would say it's now more of a deep pink.   As everyone mentioned, it is imperative that you use sun protection and even wear a hat on a daily basis.  I would also avoid working out or jogging for the time being because increased blood flow can cause broken vessels in the new skin. 

So are you going to go for any lasers or just going to let it fade on its own?

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2 hours ago, downinthedms said:

So are you going to go for any lasers or just going to let it fade on its own?
I will not be going for any lasers and will just let it fade over time.  I have done quite a few peels before and while the erythema is certainly more intense than prior peels, I expected it to some extent because the depth and the initial inflammatory response I had right after the peel.  Having the infection during the first week of healing likely will prolong the erythema as well beyond what is typical. 

What was the percentage you used for TCA cross? 

In addition, is your skin starting to thicken at all from the cross procedure? If yes, then I certainly think a topical steroid would be an appropriate course of action. If it’s just red though, I’d leave it alone.  Edited by UpliftingCat

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On 5/18/2018 at 2:26 PM, UpliftingCat said:
I will not be going for any lasers and will just let it fade over time.  I have done quite a few peels before and while the erythema is certainly more intense than prior peels, I expected it to some extent because the depth and the initial inflammatory response I had right after the peel.  Having the infection during the first week of healing likely will prolong the erythema as well beyond what is typical. 

What was the percentage you used for TCA cross? 

In addition, is your skin starting to thicken at all from the cross procedure? If yes, then I certainly think a topical steroid would be an appropriate course of action. If it’s just red though, I’d leave it alone. 

I used 50% TCA. Its just red now, I don't think its in the healing phase anymore.

It has basically left behind what seems to be PIE at the places I did it on.

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9 hours ago, downinthedms said:

I used 50% TCA. Its just red now, I don't think its in the healing phase anymore.

It has basically left behind what seems to be PIE at the places I did it on.
It is 100% still in the healing phase!!  The wound healing phase is broken up into several parts: coagulation and inflammation, reepithelization, granulation tissue formation, angiogenesis, and collagen remodeling.  You have already completed the first several stages and have entered into the final two stages of wound healing.  Peeling with 50% TCA is considered a medium-depth peel and the remodeling does not complete until well after 60 days, usually 90 after peeling.  It is not a side-effect to be red after a medium-depth peel, it's expected.  

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On 5/20/2018 at 1:28 PM, UpliftingCat said:
On 5/20/2018 at 3:53 AM, downinthedms said:

I used 50% TCA. Its just red now, I don't think its in the healing phase anymore.

It has basically left behind what seems to be PIE at the places I did it on.
It is 100% still in the healing phase!!  The wound healing phase is broken up into several parts: coagulation and inflammation, reepithelization, granulation tissue formation, angiogenesis, and collagen remodeling.  You have already completed the first several stages and have entered into the final two stages of wound healing.  Peeling with 50% TCA is considered a medium-depth peel and the remodeling does not complete until well after 60 days, usually 90 after peeling.  It is not a side-effect to be red after a medium-depth peel, it's expected.  

Okay you must be right that I am in the final 2 phases of healing but I get a feeling like this redness won't go away by its own for a very long time. It is a side effect to be red but in this case the cross/spot peel was performed incorrectly by me and the redness is much more than it should be AFAIK (I also know this because my previous TCA Crosses didn't result in so much redness).

Since you mentioned its in the last 2 phases of healing still, does this mean I should wait before performing Pico treatments on it or can I go ahead? I found a good Pico clinic near where I live.

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23 hours ago, downinthedms said:

Okay you must be right that I am in the final 2 phases of healing but I get a feeling like this redness won't go away by its own for a very long time. It is a side effect to be red but in this case the cross/spot peel was performed incorrectly by me and the redness is much more than it should be AFAIK (I also know this because my previous TCA Crosses didn't result in so much redness).

Since you mentioned its in the last 2 phases of healing still, does this mean I should wait before performing Pico treatments on it or can I go ahead? I found a good Pico clinic near where I live.
Yes, I advise waiting 3 months and not doing anything while the collagen is still remodeling. Otherwise, you can disrupt or hinder the healing process. 

You certainly may be right that the redness may not be gone by the 3 month mark, but you need to at least give your skin time to completely heal the injury from the chemical peel. 

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On 5/25/2018 at 11:43 AM, downinthedms said:

Makes sense. Thank you @UpliftingCat, you succeeded in uplifting my spirits :D

Well, good ;D.  You will be okay as long as it doesn't feel tender and sore at this point.  I am in the exact same boat as you, my friend.  I have been avoiding a lot of obligations and social activities because I'm so self-conscious about the redness but I know it will improve with time. 

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I tend to concur that I might just try to use concealer or something while it heals/fades. Truth be told it doesn't look that bad. I mean duh it's noticeable but not in a awful way. I truly hate my numerous small icepick/boxcar scars more than anything, but I too deal with them and just try my best overall.

Try to use some things that help healing, be it vitamins or moisturizer or whatever. Eat extremely healthy if you can like fruits/vegetable and healthy proteins to maybe aid regeneration/fading. 

Hopefully it fades well as expected. It should.

Edited by harmlessboy1441

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On 5/26/2018 at 2:50 PM, UpliftingCat said:
Well, good ;D.  You will be okay as long as it doesn't feel tender and sore at this point.  I am in the exact same boat as you, my friend.  I have been avoiding a lot of obligations and social activities because I'm so self-conscious about the redness but I know it will improve with time. 
You can use concealer to hide it, that is what I have been doing. Look absolutely hideous without concealer.

But yeah, I wish I could go to a good dermatologist once and for all and get my scars/pigmentation sorted out once and for all. Would make my life much easier.

Any of you guys plan on doing Pico to remove the redness? 

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On 6/2/2018 at 1:35 AM, downinthedms said:
You can use concealer to hide it, that is what I have been doing. Look absolutely hideous without concealer.

But yeah, I wish I could go to a good dermatologist once and for all and get my scars/pigmentation sorted out once and for all. Would make my life much easier.

Any of you guys plan on doing Pico to remove the redness? 
What concealer are you using? I need to try to put on makeup soon since I have some obligations that I can’t miss. I’m a month and a half post and can’t believe how red I am still. It goes down occasionally throughout the day but seems to get red again in the evening. It’s frustrating because when I feel like I’m making good progress with the redness it comes back the same shade as it was a month ago. Are you making any progress with your redness? 

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i got tea crossed 100% on feb 26. the redness was persistent for a month. but now that it has been about 3 months i would say it has faded about 50-55%.

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On 6/4/2018 at 3:54 AM, UpliftingCat said:
On 6/2/2018 at 2:35 AM, downinthedms said:
You can use concealer to hide it, that is what I have been doing. Look absolutely hideous without concealer.

But yeah, I wish I could go to a good dermatologist once and for all and get my scars/pigmentation sorted out once and for all. Would make my life much easier.

Any of you guys plan on doing Pico to remove the redness? 
What concealer are you using? I need to try to put on makeup soon since I have some obligations that I can’t miss. I’m a month and a half post and can’t believe how red I am still. It goes down occasionally throughout the day but seems to get red again in the evening. It’s frustrating because when I feel like I’m making good progress with the redness it comes back the same shade as it was a month ago. Are you making any progress with your redness? 
Sorry for the late reply, didn't login for a while.

I am making very slow progress as in it is less redder than the beginning but without intervention I don't think it will disappear for years. I am going to try 1 treatment of Pico soon.

I use a Mischa BB cream, but make sure you get your shade right.

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