91baby

Just+had+subcision+-+documenting+w/+photos!

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Hi everyone, I wanted to share my journey with subcision. I will be documenting/posting pictures to give as much detail as possible. I have been inspired by some member's stories so I would like to give back. I've just turned 25yrs old and suffered with acne since I was around 12. The types of scars I have are rolling and (I believe) boxcar. I went to a derm when I was 21 who referred me straight to a clinic for lasers. When I went for my consultation at the laser clinic, I was not listened to, there were no before/after pictures, the Dr was pushy and I just did NOT feel comfortable - the price was going to be upwards of $2000. After that experience I was put off from trying to treat my scarring. It's taken until this year and coming across the subcision threads on this website for me to actually take some action.

My scars have been my focus my whole life. I'm obsessed with mirrors, I wear makeup constantly (and that doesn't help me feel any more confident due to it just sinking into the pits), I stray from any water activities, the beach, camping, staying over at peple's houses etc, I've stayed in an emotionally abusive relationship because my self-worth is barely there.. the list goes on.

Anyway, about a month ago I had a consultation with Dr Catherine Black at Glenelg Day Surgery. She said my scarring was suited to subcision so she booked me in for the 10/11/16 (today) she also recommended it be paired with a dermapen treatment which I refused for now. She said she believes I will receive good improvement but will need multiple treatments, which was expected. 

I was prescribed valium which I took around 9.30am. I arrived at the clinic around 10.30am so they could apply the numbing cream (which, in my opinion, does nothing) then at around 11.30am I was taken into the surgery room and put a hair net on. Dr Black then began by using local anaesthetic on the right side of my face (the needle stings a bit, nothing unbearable), then began the subcision. She inserted the needle horizontally and fanned it back and fourth. Now, this part didn't hurt persay, but it was VERY uncomfortable, I felt like she was almost pulling my skin off my cheek bones (she wasn't, of course!). Then she moved on to my left side. There is about 3 insertion points on each cheek which don't look too bad and Dr Black said they will fade in a couple days time. I was a bit disappointed that I didn't hear the 'popping noise' everyone talks about, but we will see!

My next round of subcision is in 3 weeks time, the 2/12/16. This time I will request she marks the scars before she begins subcision as I believe she may have missed a few, or not been as agressive as I would have liked on some of the ones that bother me the most.

I was a bit swollen at first, but it's been about 6 hours post-procedure and I don't feel swollen at all anymore. I have been icing a bruise on my left cheek bone but that's about the only side effect I've experienced so far. The pictures I'm posting are of my scarring before the procedure and also of my scarring directly after the procedure.

Stay tuned, I will be updating frequently!

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leftsideafter.jpg

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insertionpointsandbepantham.jpg

swellingandbepantham.jpg

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Thank you for documenting! I just wanted to say good luck and also you have very pretty features that your scars don't detract from. Although I understand we are our own worst critics.

Best of luck and looking forward to seeing your improvements.

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I'm new to this so I'm not exactly sure how to respond directly to you UtmostGeese! But thank you all the same, I appreciate that! I spend most of my time in mirrors/my phone camera/reflections of windows/etc so I've had a LOT of time studying my scars (I'd say 10 years worth!) but hearing his like that make all the difference ^_^

I've taken a few more photos this morning, just to show how recovery looks like, it's not actually bad at all - I feel like today I could definitely apply some make up (and sunscreen of course) and go out into the public. That being said, I wont, because I want to relax as much as possible and let my skin/healing do it's thing. I'll just mention also that I am not suctioning/needling/doing anything other than washing my face with water. I iced all yesterday (about 10 minutes every hour) but I've backed off that now, I'll only do it if I feel it's necessary as I want the necessary inflammation. I'm not suctioning because I wanted to first trial how my skin handled the subcision alone. I will decide whether I will be suctioning with the upcoming subcisions in around 2 weeks time.

The only obvious side effects are the insertion points which I'm not concerned about and can easily be covered with makeup - and slight bruising and swelling around the upper cheekbone area, other than that, I'm a tad red and that's about it. If anyone is considering having this treatment done but are scared because of the procedure or downtime, PLEASE DON'T BE! I am the most anxious person I know, I have a low pain threshold and I overthink EVERYTHING - this procedure and the downtime are completely bearable (so far).

I'm not posting these pictures as result pictures (because I see none yet), these are purely to document recovery. I probably wont post pictures for a couple of weeks unless there are any drastic changes (whether good or bad)!

Thanks :smileys_n_people_19:


leftsideday2.jpg


rightsideday1.jpg

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@qerf123 No problems! I certainly will. I wont know true results until I've had multiple subcisions done (I'm wanting between 4-6). I say don't bother waiting for my results, go ahead and do it! I don't believe severe side effects occur with this procedure AT ALL! And for $200 for each sitting, it's definitely manageable.. and worth it for any kind of improvement ^_^ It's 7:49pm now, the first night after the procedure and I'm pretty sure I'll be all good to chuck some makeup on and go out tomorrow with no problems!

@UtmostGeese I figured it out - thanks again!

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Ill be following this thread, good luck.

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“Do not compare yourself to others. If you do so, you are insulting yourself.”


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Thanks guys! there's not much to document at the moment. I feel no swelling anymore, my right cheek bone is slightly bruised still but that's it, absolutely no pain or discomfort. The insertion points are just red dots now and i was wearing makeup and out in public by Saturday (procedure was on the thursday). One thing ive definitely noticed is that makeup has been going on a heck of a lot smoother which is definitely a plus! I will update with pics the day before my next round. Im booked in for friday the 2nd of December and will continue updating with pics after my second round.

So far so good guys, no downside whatsoever! ;D

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Oh my!!! Your absolutley gorgeous hun!! besides that fact I hope that things go well with your procedure in the next comming days:) I hope that your courage grows as things get better. I pray for you, things can be tough , you deserve to be happy. Regarding relationships, you are truly beautiful and no abuse is warranted an such on any persons not matter the state of mind so my only advice is to keeping moving forward!! We all get down sometimes and it is the role of our loved ones to help each other in times of distress if you are not getting that support, Im sure this community will be happy to help!!. Have you thought of fillers after your treatments, I've heard that juvederm volumna is comming in as a popular one!! I can't really differentiate between what type of scarring you have but it seems mostly boxcar/ rolling? Your journey is surely helping others, myself included!! I'm sorry about your strife and what you've gone through, acne scarring is difficult at times to deal with on top of other misfortunes in life! Your treatment has outcomed with good improvement so I think that is something to be proud of in itself!! GoodLUCK!!

{UPDATE}Are you planning on having them every month? I only ask because I've heard mixed reviews between letting the skin heal vs taking advantage of grwoth factors and doing them consequitively .. also if it is not intrusive to ask "were you ever on accutane"?  I just read through your thread after skimming it previously . I would like to try this but not so sure on the sense of waiting a year or 6 months or even two years... I was hoping you could enlighten me if  It's alright. I've read people doing subsicion years after trying lasers and being on accutane 5 + years earlier.... just fyi finshing up accutane in december so I'm vigourously searching for the best treatment  ... would you recomend this 1-2 years post accutane?

Edited by realtalkguRL

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4 hours ago, realtalkguRL said:

Oh my!!! Your absolutley gorgeous hun!! besides that fact I hope that things go well with your procedure in the next comming days:) I hope that your courage grows as things get better. I pray for you, things can be tough , you deserve to be happy. Regarding relationships, you are truly beautiful and no abuse is warranted an such on any persons not matter the state of mind so my only advice is to keeping moving forward!! We all get down sometimes and it is the role of our loved ones to help each other in times of distress if you are not getting that support, Im sure this community will be happy to help!!. Have you thought of fillers after your treatments, I've heard that juvederm volumna is comming in as a popular one!! I can't really differentiate between what type of scarring you have but it seems mostly boxcar/ rolling? Your journey is surely helping others, myself included!! I'm sorry about your strife and what you've gone through, acne scarring is difficult at times to deal with on top of other misfortunes in life! Your treatment has outcomed with good improvement so I think that is something to be proud of in itself!! GoodLUCK!!

{UPDATE}Are you planning on having them every month? I only ask because I've heard mixed reviews between letting the skin heal vs taking advantage of grwoth factors and doing them consequitively .. also if it is not intrusive to ask "were you ever on accutane"?  I just read through your thread after skimming it previously . I would like to try this but not so sure on the sense of waiting a year or 6 months or even two years... I was hoping you could enlighten me if  It's alright. I've read people doing subsicion years after trying lasers and being on accutane 5 + years earlier.... just fyi finshing up accutane in december so I'm vigourously searching for the best treatment  ... would you recomend this 1-2 years post accutane?



Thankyou for the kind words. My scars have held me back basically my whole life.. it's an excruciating thing to go through and i feel for everyone on this site who are battling with them. I have browsed this website since I was around 12 years old (now 25) and it was only the reviews in regards to subcision that pushed me to FINALLY so something! I have definitely thought about fillers, although i'm planning on doing all necessary rounds of subcision first (doc says between 4 and 6).

In regards to doing the rounds monthly, that wasn't my initial plan but Dr Black said no difference comes from doing them closer or further apart. What she pointed out is that it usually takes around 6 weeks to see results/improvement so patients tend to wait so they can gauge how many they may need/if they even need a second one. Myself and my Dr are already confident that I will need multiple sessions so I'm definitely keen to get them all done ASAP rather than waiting the full 6 weeks. 

I've never actually been told what scars I have but I've self-diagnosed with exactly what you said! boxcar and rolling, although it's hard to tell which is which as they tend to kind of blend in with one another (2 scars forming 1 big scar etc.. very frustrating).

I believe there has been slight improvement which im pleased with.. and for $200 AU I couldn't be happier and am definitely looking forward to the upcoming treatments to see how much improvement i can really get.

If i may ask, what kind of scars do you have/what treatments have you recieved/have you had any luck/etc?

In regards to accutane the answer is no. To explain briefly, when i was suffering with cystic acne, my face was never covered in it or anything.. i just always, continuously had 1 or 2 big cysts at one time that wouldn't go away for weeks. Because i am such a self conscious person i could never build the courage to even SPEAK about my acne (or the scarring it was causing) with a doctor or ANYONE for that matter but when i finally did, i was prescribed doxycycline and my acne died down. Now in saying that, when i went in for my initial appointment with Dr Black to recieve treatment for my scarring, i had been (and still am) breaking out due to quitting smoking (if you read up on it, nicotine is actually a hormone suppressant so when you quit, you can flare up for quite a while) so she said that because i still have active acne she wanted to put me on accutane for a year so i could be clear and after the 12 months we could focus on my scar treatments.. I turned that down as I wanted to get onto the scar treatments ASAP! But as far as I remember, Dr Black never said there would be a 'waiting period' needed after accutane but I can definitely ask her when I see her next. I trust her judgement ^_^

Sorry about the novel, i tend to ramble haha, i hope at least some of that is helpful! Thanks for taking the time to show your support xx

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:) No problem!! haha compared to my novel, I think your good. Yeh, I want to get treatment for my acne scars but have gone on accutane 2wice and will be ending this 2nd round in december. It's recommended that I wait 6 months-1year before scar treatment but to be safe I'm thinking 2 years.

lolss my acne was actually medically induced when I was misprescribed the wrong birth control but I was supposed to notice a purge in the begging and I thought it was okay but it ended up not even clearing up and then antibiotics and then birth control again but to say the least I had acne kinda of like yours before I went on anything and then when I developed severe it wasn't really cysts anymore just whiteheads/bacterial infection and it started scarring:((  They were so inflammed and came right after we tryed birth control again and it was to much inflammation for my skin to handle in a period of a year so it happened all at once. It's wierd how things happen, went to doc to treat acne but ended up with more acne and maybe would have even been better off knowing anatomy and learning about the internal cuases!!!! I also suffer from mildly managed pcos which now I've changed my diet to account for and it has helped!!! 


Why I asked about the subsicion  process is becuase I'm going to school in the healthcare field so I've had some background on the details of scaring and it's healing time which basically continues to heal after 2 years. The body is in a constant building and breaking down state as we grow from birth with the stretching of our bones vs when babies learn to walk(cartilage breaking down and turning to bone) vs the elderly when too much breaking down is happening in the body and they get stiff. In this sense there will be repair in your skin as it ages but only if it's extremely well taken care of. Although in  2years skin will not repair itself to normal but  the underlying structures wil have proliferated with new blood vessles to maintain the skin/ bring oxygen and will help further in  healing in future (in my case/hypothesis). Nutrients /blood flow and excerise play a major role in keeping our body functioning while keeping metabolism running and everything. It makes sense that your body reacted that way to nicotine because any imbalance in the body can trigger symptoms like acne as a (purging of excess hormones/or raise in cortisol levels becuase of the sudden change in stopping smoking) Congratulations by the way!!!!. Though it's nothing to fear beacuase diet helps with this!!With  all this is being said I'm no expert though.  The type of scarring I have are rolling and shallow icepick and boxcar. If you go to my profile I have a couple of pics !!!! I have not done any treatments but am thinking to do the same as you and also chemical peels in conjuction.. the dermoneedling I have a feeling is a little excsessive only becuase I learned that after a certain point if there is a lot of pressure or damage done with brute force it will take the same amount to heal it. Again that's from anatomy. Plus you save the fatty tissue underneath which is a (channel if you will) that allows nutrients to cross different layers of the skin providing cushion and support. If this is compromised it could lead to loss of fat or loss of proliferation of collagen/ fibers  in the healing process. It's like taking one for the team /one or the other..but if done by  an experieinced person the method and  amount of damage done can be warranted.  I also only have causion for dermapen because my face already is thin and wel yeah it might be alright for some people but I know MY face and any loss of fat or collagen WILL age me!! It's not something anybody's told me but I see how my relatives age and that is one downer for me. Men I think can get away with this a little bit more because men have the bone structure more held high in asthetics but for women it's  all about the bounce and subtleness...idk if i am making sense..lololosjust my opinion.. I also train a lot to manage my pcos and hormones so it's something I've myself looked heavily into. In your case it might be different though and also the dermapen treatment is something I willl want to try but only  after subsicion and fillers and chemical peels.. I am also looking at microfat injections.. !!!!
   

In regard to consecutive treatment it probably isn't a debilitating  factor to lookout for because logicallly the scaring has not repaired it self substantially enough to warrant not doing anything ( my same boat) and so I believe that your doctor is right in doing treatments in this way.  Yes , :))Please do share the information, that would be great and helpful!! An anatomy class/book would be better to explain the process of scar healing but it is also the diet that helps in the long run so make sure to eat a lot of complete proteins like steel cut oats with fruits and  boiled eggs as these will help you to produce collagen and salads!!  A thing to note is that sugar can lead to inflammation and disrupt hormone balance and healing  so it's a thing to look out for when healing and it also adds to the breakdown of collagen!! Think of  signals in your body responding to stress saying that we need help in this and this and this other area but the main focus for proper healing you want to send is to your face not your gut or your mind when under stress. Hopefully this doesn't bore you and it gives a little bit of help to you!!! But yeh check out my page, also if you'd like to post what procedures you'd think would suit, I'd be most thankfull:))) The price of your treatments and  the timeframe are really wonderful when compared to lasers and the like. I wish you well today and will be following your post!! Edited by realtalkguRL
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@realtalkguRL thanks for all the info! Ill keep it in mind ^_^ 

With this first procedure i haven't really done anything different at all to be honest, no exercise, no amazingly healthy/proper diet, no suctioning etc. i wanted to see what the results (if any) would be like after just 1 round of doing everything normally. Unfortunately i'm on week 2 and i feel as though the improvement is more minimal now. There definitely must have been microswelling going on that allowed makeup to go on smoother - dont get me wrong, it still does, but the 'shadowing' and 'valleys' have come back a little more (although i still feel improvement, even if it is very minimal.. but then again i might just be having high hopes, who knows at this point!)

Im itching to go in for round 2 on the 2nd of december, i might incorporate suctioning this time as ive had no nodules or funny stuff going on under the treated areas - if anyone could suggest where i could (pick up from store preferably) a suitable suctioning device that would be most appreciated! and maybe some guidance as to whether i suction whole areas (multiple scars at once?) or..?? i never really understood the process, my scars are all bunched together and combined so theres definitely no chance of suctioning them singly.

Im really hoping i see some noticeable difference this round - im going to request each scar be marked (she missed some towards my mouth/chin area) and that she be as aggressive as possible (i didnt hear and snapping/popping/crunching last time so this time i wanna hear it!!) 

I will update if any noticeable changes occur before my next treatment but if not I'll take ya'll through my next treatment in the next 2 weeks !! :smileys_n_people_179:
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Hey everyone, i just had my second round of subcision so i thought I'd report back! 

Dr black's first comment was 'yep the contour definitely looks more smooth' but it always does in the morning, my morning skin is very misleading :smileys_n_people_24: my afternoon/night skin is (i feel) my true skin, does anyone else get that??

Anyway! this round was much more intense - dr black definitely inserted the needle in more places and was a little more rough - i didn't mind as i couldnt feel any pain, but it's caused a little more swelling and bruising than last time. i look pretty much the same besides an extra bruise here and there and a bit more 'lumpy' i guess you'd say? the only thing negative about the experience was that i had previously asked her to go lower with the needle this time (towards my mouth/chin) i believe she failed to do this again which sucks because i think that area would have responded really well. The local anesthesic was excruciating this time around but the actual procedure was fine. I was excessively shaky after the procedure (yet again) but the dr says the local anesthetic causes that. The shakes subsided after a few minutes and the nurse got me some biscuits which helped too. here's some pics of me currently - ill keep updating as the days go on ^_^ 

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Edited by 91baby
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33 minutes ago, 91baby said:

Dr black's first comment was 'yep the contour definitely looks more smooth' but it always does in the morning, my morning skin is very misleading :smileys_n_people_24: my afternoon/night skin is (i feel) my true skin, does anyone else get that??


I definitely get that! My scars look rather shallow and mild in the morning, and progressively get worse throughout the course of the day. It's an interesting detail that never gets talked about when people do before/afters. Maybe this should be something mentioned more often?
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16 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

I definitely get that! My scars look rather shallow and mild in the morning, and progressively get worse throughout the course of the day. It's an interesting detail that never gets talked about when people do before/afters. Maybe this should be something mentioned more often?

arghhh yes!! completely agree! when i get up in the morning i almost feel like i could just go straight out into the public.. but i know too well what theyll look like after a couple of hours! The right side of my face looks basically flat and even.. its such a tease. But ive made a point to try my hardest to take pictures at times where i feel my scars look most prominent. I've gone through this thread enough to know to take pictures with the light shining from behind/at different angles/etc. I just hope i get the improvement im looking for so this thread can give people some sort of hope ^_^

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Are you going ahead with suctioning this time? That aspect where the scars seem better in the morning happens to me also!! There has to be a scientific explanation for this phenomenon! Hope You heal well:)))

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14 hours ago, realtalkguRL said:

Are you going ahead with suctioning this time? That aspect where the scars seem better in the morning happens to me also!! There has to be a scientific explanation for this phenomenon! Hope You heal well:)))

 
i really wanted to but i dont know how to get a device/what to use :( i think its too late to bother starting now (5 days post) - but i desperately want to for my third round to hopefully make the 'first week results' more permanent. My dr also really wants me to get dermapen done at the same time as my third round of subcision.. i dont know if its worth it though.. she wont be charging me any extra so i know its not a money-grabbing thing.. any advice ?? x

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That's great!! How do you feel about doing both procedures? It would seem logical for the 3rd one to be more intense and then let the skin heal for a good 6 months- year to let collagen remodel. With the derma pen  it will allow wounding around the site of untethering where the scars are thus promoting new blood vessel capillaries for healing around the section of subsicion;making the area more even,  as the site matures after a certain period of time when the fibroblasts come in and collagen starts to grow!! I don't know if your set on it but it does seem like a good thing to try, that way ..  you can choose to perform the combo either every 6 months( as to not stun your healing if you feel after this round it was intense and think better to have that treatment spaced out over a longer period-2-4months instead of every month) or just as another 3 round sequence. I would go ahead and do it though I'm sure others have better opinions to add!! It would give you a feel of what to expect. This seems like a good chance to try it and see what works because it's one of the more safe procedures then you can work yourself up, i.e.) fillers if needed. Good luck!! In comparison though if you truly want to be careful you could just wait until the effects add up from your last subsicion and wager to do the combo round later. It really does seem that she is there to help you and by that observation because she's giving the added treatment for free, I think you are in good hands!

Edited by realtalkguRL

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If im being completely honest, i feel like it would be hard for me to space out these treatments for more than a month at a time purely because of that kind of 'instant swelling' effect it has.. its truly addictive! when youve suffered as long as i have, any improvement (even for a small amount of time) gives you this kind of high/confidence.. its absolutely crazy.

As far as the dermapen treatment goes, im all for it.. but i have heard it can cause more scarring/is more of a tool for mild resurfacing. I think i might email my doctor and try and discuss it more with her.

The crazy part is is she treats me like i only have mild scarring.. like she talks to me as if its not even that big of a deal.. sometimes it makes me wonder what i look like to other people and if its actually as noticeable as i feel like it is. Like im confident im in the 'severe' category.. therefore i thought she would have suggested fillers combined with subcision rather than dermapen.. i might look into that as well.

does anyone know of any fillers that last more around the year mark rather than the 3-6 month mark?

@realtalkguRL can you suggest any suctioning devices for my next round?

As far as an update, its 5 days post procedure and i have bruising on both cheekbone areas but its completely covered by makeup. That's literally it. Not swollen, no hard lumps etc.

On another note - im in the process of trying to figure out how to use 'facelift tape' in a way where it stretches my skin slightly (for special occasions etc) to make the scarring less prominent when the swelling from this round of subcision goes down. I used this tape/string/device for a couple of months about 2 years ago and it worked great in the morning but come the afternoon, the tape loses its grip a little bit and loosens. If anyone had ever tried this method/heard about it any advice to make it sturdy and stay hidden (so the tape isnt visible on the neck/cheek area) please give me your suggestions!!

Thank you :)

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Oh, Honey, Juvederm Volumna I heard is great, its your best bet for 1-year-18months! https://www.realself.com/review/sumter-sc-voluma-after-laser-treatments check out this these women got a great effect.  https://www.realself.com/review/torquay-uk-acne-scars-treatment-filler-acne-scars

On, the note of suctioning devices , theres this member named robertio on here who has some pretty good experience. I think he said that it was the Chinese suctioning cups for massaging that you can find on amazon that are the ones everyone is talking about! Again, I don't have any experience with the procedure but hope to do it in the future after 1-2 years off accutane! Hope some other members can give you more detail, I'm afraid that's all the versed I am on the subject! Well, with the derma pen if your gut is saying wait maybe that's something to follow.


I heard about this guy and he only had one subsicion so maybe the results that your waiting for will take a little to catch up is all too...haha your addiction is for a good cause:D hope that things are going well today!!! I'm rooting for you!!
 




http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/323341-got-subcision-before-after-pics/

 

Edited by realtalkguRL

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2 hours ago, realtalkguRL said:

Oh, Honey, Juvederm Volumna I heard is great, its your best bet for 1-year-18months! https://www.realself.com/review/sumter-sc-voluma-after-laser-treatments check out this these women got a great effect.  https://www.realself.com/review/torquay-uk-acne-scars-treatment-filler-acne-scars

On, the note of suctioning devices , theres this member named robertio on here who has some pretty good experience. I think he said that it was the Chinese suctioning cups for massaging that you can find on amazon that are the ones everyone is talking about! Again, I don't have any experience with the procedure but hope to do it in the future after 1-2 years off accutane! Hope some other members can give you more detail, I'm afraid that's all the versed I am on the subject! Well, with the derma pen if your gut is saying wait maybe that's something to follow.


I heard about this guy and he only had one subsicion so maybe the results that your waiting for will take a little to catch up is all too...haha your addiction is for a good cause:D hope that things are going well today!!! I'm rooting for you!!
 




http://www.acne.org/messageboard/topic/323341-got-subcision-before-after-pics/

 


oh my, that second link.. wow, what a difference! i dont believe my scars are as deep as hers and I've heard fillers only make a difference for deep scars.. hopefully that isn't true, because those results are remarkable. Ive heard voluma is used for actual facial fat loss more so than for specific scarred areas? i guess theres no harm in enquiring with my doctor.. 

yes i agree, im thinking more intense results/improvement are yet to come. I think i will schedule my third subcision in for around 5 weeks time and hopefully combine with fillers.. although i am worried once i get fillers that i will not be able to have further subcisions.. hmm.. so many questions haha!

i will have to purchase these Chinese cupping things and i will report back if i decide to suction rather than get fillers with my third round of subcision

I cant thank you enough for all your help/support :) xx

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