Repairing the long-term damage from Accutane

Started by IndigoRush IndigoRush

16,185 posts in this topic

On 10/7/2018 at 6:20 AM, Fchawk said:
My main point is don't avoid it and vitamin A, because Isotretinoin is not vitamin A, and infact can cause vitamin A deficiency. 

Isotretinoin-Induced Night Blindness
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4533586/

Oral isotretinoin, neuropathy and hypovitaminosis A
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1365-2230.2008.03171.x
The second link has case studies which suggests between Vitamin A deficiency pre treatment and suffering depression due to accutane, and by supplementing vitamin A mid treatment helped.

Beta-carotene is safer than straight vitamin A supplementation, so while I used vitamin A myself, BC is probs safer because it is only converted if your body recognises a need for vitamin A (though it is possible isotretinoin reduces conversion because it fucks with the body in mysterious ways, in that case Beta Carotene would just act as an antioxidant) 
Funnily enough - SClippers, who boasted a near full recovery a year or 2 ago, attributed this to starting to eat a high leafy green diet, (obviously getting plenty of beta carotene) after spending years avoiding vitamin A. He felt everything begin to get better and even had oily skin again, instead of the painfully dry skin. 

I've avoided Vitamin A for the most part since accutane (i even supplemented vitamin A for a bit shortly after) and my dry skin has gotten worse and worse over the years. I may start supplementing beta carotene to see how i get on. Most of my symptoms are that of vitamin A deficiency, down to the bumps on the backs of my arms (they appeared whilst on accutane and have been there for nearly a decade since). 

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Yeah I’m reconsidering my options with Vit A too

I have recently pointed out though that when having Kinesiology, Vit A did stress my body out when tested with the vile

Having done some work over last few weeks I am now responding better to it - both A and Beta Carotene aren’t stressing me out - this could only be the result of Tane messing things up!!

I’m now curious on how I’d respond supplementing BC but I’m trying to avoid self diagnosing which up till recently has been out of control for me, definitely something I’m trying to avoid. I’d run it by practitioner and get their thoughts firstly

Currently I’m responding well to both B12 & ALA which I’ll continue.

I’m also curious about this Forskolin product but will see what others have to say before I look into it more. This cAMP is a new area of inquiry that’s for sure!!

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14 hours ago, TrueJustice said:

No worries 

How well are you responding to Forskolin so far?


The same.  Two drops a day and I'm functional.  By next morning I am crashing all over again and two drops later I am back to normal.  There seems to be a process that is "turned off" that forskolin temporarily restores.  Add it doesn't cause tolerance (found a study on this last night but did not save).  

I added ALA and this seems to work well together.  Found more mental clarity after adding ALA.

This is not a cure a far but it's definitely better that injections every 3 days.  I still have to do PCT to wake up the boys but I'm interested to see how Forskolin will affect me after that.

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On 10/13/2018 at 12:00 AM, TrueJustice said:

As always, I appreciate the science but what to do about it....

What are you doing for your gut currently that you can recommend??

Maybe offer us something that even a gastroenterologist couldn’t....

Most gastroenterologists are pretty limited in their duties. they perform colonoscopies and endoscopies all day on mostly new or older patients to check for cancers. 
Speaking of which they found a colon polyp on one of my last visits, which might be pretty rare for my age. (now I get to go again in 5 years)
Ive had multiple local doctors now tell me I need to be at a university or clinic setting like Mayo, because its beyond their scope.

Multiple Associations Between a Broad Spectrum of Autoimmune Diseases, Chronic Inflammatory Diseases and Cancer

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3349285/

  Edited by guitarman01
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I’d agree with you there, like I’ve said many times - if a gastroenterologist doesn’t find anything “sinister” as they put it, they let you go and it’s up to you to work on your gut health in your own time...,

That’s not to dismiss them in any way, they do an awesome job and save many lives but when it comes to discussing what Tane might have done to gut health they don’t know - they kind of treat it as if you’ve smashed your gut health like an antibiotic and leave you to work it out for yourself 

For me they did diagnose my reflux issue which I’m now on top of but if I pressed them that I believe issue stems from Tane they can’t offer me any insight unfortunately 

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22 hours ago, TrueJustice said:

Yeah I’m reconsidering my options with Vit A too

I have recently pointed out though that when having Kinesiology, Vit A did stress my body out when tested with the vile

Having done some work over last few weeks I am now responding better to it - both A and Beta Carotene aren’t stressing me out - this could only be the result of Tane messing things up!!

I’m now curious on how I’d respond supplementing BC but I’m trying to avoid self diagnosing which up till recently has been out of control for me, definitely something I’m trying to avoid. I’d run it by practitioner and get their thoughts firstly

Currently I’m responding well to both B12 & ALA which I’ll continue.

I’m also curious about this Forskolin product but will see what others have to say before I look into it more. This cAMP is a new area of inquiry that’s for sure!!

I'm going to get some BC supplements and try them for a couple of months to see what happens. When I read about Vitamin A deficiency all of my skin symptoms match exactly. 

Slow wound healing, improper keratinisation and skin scaling, bumps on the backs of arms, dry skin (severe). 

I don't have any vision issues and although my vision isn't the best at night, I wouldn't classify it as night blindness, although it has got worse in the past few years. 

I just don't have normal skin anymore, I wouldn't even care about the scarring and redness if it just acted like normal skin and it wasn't wafer thin, painful and dry and affecting every aspect of my day. The only time im comfortable in my skin is at night, lathered in cream, looking like absolute crap when nobody can see me. It wasn't like this on accutane or for years after so i'm inclined to think avoiding vitamin A has just made it worse as the years have rolled on. 

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Yep me too!!

any wound healing is just horrendous 

got a mosquito bite 3 months ago that I scratched a bit.....the red is still there, I get out of the shower and see it each morning - bloody crazy!!

The dryness - that’s a whole other story....

No moisture at all in face or hair

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30 minutes ago, TrueJustice said:

Yep me too!!

any wound healing is just horrendous 

got a mosquito bite 3 months ago that I scratched a bit.....the red is still there, I get out of the shower and see it each morning - bloody crazy!!

The dryness - that’s a whole other story....

No moisture at all in face or hair

Exact same here mate. My whole face is basically like your mosquito bite now though. 80% of it won't heal basically, it's as if the top layer of skin just won't form. 

The more and more i read, the more it does sound like my body isn't getting enough Vitamin A to complete this process and that all these years I shouldn't have avoided it.

For about a year after accutane I was taking a strong multivitamin and whilst my skin was a little dry, I had periods of it being oily and it wasn't like it is now at all, nowhere close, everything seemed to heal quicker back then rather than slower, I think I had a really high skin cell turnover rate. Now it just seems as though it doesn't turnover at all. Every time I get a spot or whitehead now, the red mark doesn't heal over and just stays, so every time I get one it's devastating to me. It shouldn't be like this at all. Hopefully supplementing BC for 2 weeks shows some difference and I can pinpoint that being the issue. I'll keep you posted. 

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An update on the forskolin.  It looks like I'm going to have to stop.  I have a tendency to develop palpitations from stimulants (after I took Tane) which is why I don't drink coffee.  It seems forskolin was not an exception.  I go full on arrhythmia from DHEA, bitter orange, etc.  

Did you work for testosterone?  Yes.  I could definitely feel it in terms of libido, muscle tone and great pumps at the gym.  I got tested today and I'll post results in a couple of days.  Keep in mind I just got off TRT and was in crash mode full on.  This means my levels were rock bottom.  

Stay tuned..

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This is an idea of some of what ive been talking about. I've been looking at yeast colonization which any yeast colonization should be transient, whats not could possibly considered a undiagnosed disease. 
Some of these pathogens might use coagulation factors as a means.

But to switch gears real quick, here's the same principle thought, except with bacteria.
 

Wednesday, October 10, 2018

NIH study finds probiotic Bacillus eliminates Staphylococcus bacteria

Additional studies of common supplement planned.
https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-study-finds-probiotic-bacillus-eliminates-staphylococcus-bacteria

"One strategy to prevent Staph infections is to eliminate S. aureus colonization. However, some decolonization strategies are controversial because they require considerable amounts of topical antibiotics and have limited success, partly because they target only the nose and bacteria quickly recolonized from the gut."

 

by AL Cogen - ‎2008 - ‎Cited by 531 - ‎Related articles
Most scholarly reviews of skin microbiota concentrate on understanding the ..... Staphylococcus aureusalso secretes an arsenal of toxins that damage host cells. .... The cutaneous effects of isotretinoin and other vitamin A derivatives are ...
 

The effects of systemic isotretinoin and antibiotic therapy on the microbial floras in patients with acne vulgaris.

 

Difference in microbial flora throughout the treatment period was detected at least among one of all culture samples of 15 (75%) and 5 (33%) patients in isotretinoin and antibiotic groups. There was statistically significant difference between two groups in means of alteration of the microbial flora (P = 0.013). The difference was definitely observed among nasal cultures (65%) in isotretinoin group and fecal cultures (20%) in the other. Staphylococcus aureus colonization was prominent in the microbial floras of nose and oropharynx

I am more so looking at this possibility with yeast, but being aware of this as well.

 

Edited by guitarman01

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