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The seborrheic dermatitis thread

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People with SD have weak immune systems that for some reason just cannot fight off the malassezia furfur on our faces.

People with SD do not have weak immune systems but have a genetical skin problem. Eg. their skin is irritated by oleic acid produced by yeasts. Everyone has malassezia on their skin.

Actually yes they do. Why do you think many of the people infected with HIV suffer from SD?

And we know HIV is an immune disorder. There is a correlation there.

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Yes, I'm aware that immune system plays a role as well but there's no need to go around comparing HIV patients with SD patients. Since SD is essentially dandruff, which a lot of people have I wouldn't say all of those people have weak immune systems as well.

A research has been done that proved how SD starts when there is no malassezia around, just oleic acid. I think it was done by P&G scientists.

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I have mild seborrhoeic dermatitis too. Because of my anxiety disorder I've had difficulty going outside (panic attacks), and after about 2 years, I developed the condition. Since I'm getting little sunlight I'm currently using a Vitamin D supplement (2000 IU daily) to see if that has any effect.

From what I've read, these supplements might help too:

Biotin

Vitamin B Complex

Gamma-Linolenic Acid (GLA)

Pro-biotics/Pre-biotics

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Because of my anxiety disorder I've had difficulty going outside (panic attacks), and after about 2 years, I developed the condition.

It could actually be that your anxiety disorder is fueling SD since SD develops on patients with neurologic diseases.

Since I'm getting little sunlight I'm currently using a Vitamin D supplement (2000 IU daily) to see if that has any effect.

I think small children and babies can become vitamin D deficient (and that occurs only during the winter), adults get plenty of it through diet. I would rather eat vitamin D rich food than take it otherwise.

From what I've read, these supplements might help too:

Biotin

Vitamin B Complex

Gamma-Linolenic Acid (GLA)

Pro-biotics/Pre-biotics

I tried all of the above. The only one that had a positive effect for me was GLA.

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It could actually be that your anxiety disorder is fueling SD since SD develops on patients with neurologic diseases.

Yeah, I've thought about it too. I'm currently trying to get my anxiety disorder under control, and perhaps my condition will then improves in time. Psychological stress can certainly aggravate skin conditions.

I think small children and babies can become vitamin D deficient (and that occurs only during the winter), adults get plenty of it through diet. I would rather eat vitamin D rich food than take it otherwise.

From what I've read, vitamin D deficiency is actually pretty common, especially in people that get little sunlight and people with dark skin. The Linus Pauling Institute recommends that generally healthy adults take 2000 IU of supplemental vitamin D daily, and the Harvard Public School of Health recommends up to 2000 IU of supplemental vitamin D as well. There is even a vitamin D derivative (Calcipotriol) that's prescribed for certain skin conditions like psoriasis. Sure, psoriasis is not completely comparable to seborrheic dermatitis, but the extra vitamin D is worth a try imo.

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I have mild seborrhoeic dermatitis too. Because of my anxiety disorder I've had difficulty going outside (panic attacks), and after about 2 years, I developed the condition. Since I'm getting little sunlight I'm currently using a Vitamin D supplement (2000 IU daily) to see if that has any effect.

From what I've read, these supplements might help too:

Biotin

Vitamin B Complex

Gamma-Linolenic Acid (GLA)

Pro-biotics/Pre-biotics

Hi Jason,

before you developed anxiety disorder, did you used any medicines before? Like anti biotics or a really unhealthy diet... and how is your stool.. sleep and concentration..

best regards

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Hi Jason,

before you developed anxiety disorder, did you used any medicines before? Like anti biotics or a really unhealthy diet... and how is your stool.. sleep and concentration..

best regards

My diet at the time was not very healthy - little fruit/vegetables and I took alcohol - but I've improved that now. And I've used antibiotics before, but only after the development of my anxiety disorder. First Dalacin-T, this is a topical antibiotic to treat acne, and later minocycline. Not sure if you are familiar with the Bristol Stool Scale, but my stool can be described as type 2. And I have very little bowel movements, I have to go to the toilet only every other day. Sleep was at the time very irregular, I was basically up at night and asleep during the day, but that's changed now too. Concentration could be better, I'm easily distracted.

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@ jason

Hi Jason,

thank you.

Did you developed seborrheic dermatitis after the anti biotics if I am right? and if so how much time was there in between?

Did you also had the lack in concentration during the anxiety disorder?

About the stool.... I have a lot of 4,5,67 and also sometimes 2..

,

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Hi Jason,

thank you.

Did you developed seborrheic dermatitis after the anti biotics if I am right? and if so how much time was there in between?

Did you also had the lack in concentration during the anxiety disorder?

About the stool.... I have a lot of 4,5,67 and also sometimes 2..

Yeah, I developed the seborrheic dermatitis after my antibiotics use; at least, I think I did. I think I got it not long after I used the Dalacin-T topical antibiotic. And my concentration has been poor since I've had my anxiety disorder. Basically, it brings a lot of stress and sometimes sleepless nights, and I guess that effects my concentration.

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Normally I have seen that many people develop Sd after oral anti-biotics..

Could it also be after your oral anti biotics?

I am doing a stool test now. but the problem is that there are living 800 spieces of bacterial.. and they only have 20 different kind of probiotics.. and you can't test them all.

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Normally I have seen that many people develop Sd after oral anti-biotics..

Could it also be after your oral anti biotics?

I am doing a stool test now. but the problem is that there are living 800 spieces of bacterial.. and they only have 20 different kind of probiotics.. and you can't test them all.

Yeah, I am absolutely sure that I've used the oral antibiotics after I've got my SD. But I've heard that the human skin contains many strains of bacteria as well, and perhaps the topical antibiotic destroyed the delicate balance of my skin. Bacteria keep each other in check, they are in a constant 'war' with each other. SD is related to a yeast, so maybe the bacteria kept the yeast in check, but since I destroyed the bacteria with antibiotics (but not the yeast), the yeast went out of control? I wish they had some topical pro-biotics, maybe that would help SD sufferers.

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hey jason,

so you used the oral antibiotic minocycline after you developed SD. Can you remember if you had any other medication maybe also a kind of antibiotics.. before the developing SD

I will explain in next mail why.

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hey jason,

so you used the oral antibiotic minocycline after you developed SD. Can you remember if you had any other medication maybe also a kind of antibiotics.. before the developing SD

I will explain in next mail why.

Not any prescription medications, but I did use several over the counter products for acne. Benzoyl peroxide, salicylic acid, etc.

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@ Jason

Hi Jason,

Can you also describe on which place your Seborrheic dermatitis did start and on which places it is now?

I tell you why I wanted to know this.

About the thing with anti biotics... There was one theory for sd suffering people.

If you take anti biotics a REALLY unhealthy diet or fittness shakes with some wrong powders... that they can harm the inestinal track.. so it is proven now that those bacterial metabolism etc have a great influence on the ostrogen level.

than those other things...

SD disapear in woman who are getting pregnant. after child birth is comes again.

Woman who getting in the menopause change their cycle of estrogen sometimes are able in developing SD

woman which suffering SD have in the monthly cirle some more worse periods check these

message of someone I found.

>I am 31 now, and have noted a facial skin rash increasingly getting

>worse since the age of 20. It is not the Metformin that causes this for

>me, as I've been on this for 3 years now. I have heard from a number of

>Doctors a variety of things, "its seb derm." "its rosaeca" etc.. But

>the pattern is that it is worse two weeks before my period starts.

>Mainly, I get redness in the "T" zone, itchy sometimes, oily AND flaking

>dry on the same areas of skin. After my period, it goes away completely

>and I can see my "real" skin.. for about 5 days, then it starts up on

>its way again. This to me, MUST have something to do with hormones or a

>hormone allergy or something. I say this because it goes in cycles

>correlating to my period cycles. I'm going nuts!! I did some research

>on the internet, and came up with some center that treated allergies to

>Progesterone with sub-lingual low doses of Progesterone. Does anyone

>out there have any insight on the possiblity of this being an allergy?

>or has anyone been treated for this? Thanks!

I looked it up what the topically antibiotics can do

"Clindamycin is an antibiotic applied to the skin to treat acne. While only a small percentage of topical clindamycin is absorbed through skin, side effects such as diarrhea, bloody diarrhea, colitis, and pseudomembranous colitis have been reported. Individuals who experience any of these symptoms should contact their healthcare practitioner"

It's hard too believe for me as well.. in other words I can't believe that topical anti biotics destroy

intestinal flora..

too get back on the other theory... intestinal flora > influence hormone > change sebum composition> than M. Globosa and M. restricta Yeast can split sebum and get overactive results in Oleic Acid which penetrates skin and trigger immune reaction with redness and flaking acoording Mr. Dawson Protor & Gamble.

Maybe your diet was bad and you only needed a little of the antibtiocs too destroy the last part..

I don't know..

Maybe you are right about the oral anti biotics on the skin.. but you must know that I talked too so many people who got it from the oral anti biotics or other medication orally.

Even here in Holland. someone succeeded too get rid of SD foregood by eating lots and lots of FRESH oregano with pro-biotics and a anti candida diet. with also plenty garlic.

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Forgot too ask..

How did your SD respond after the oral antibiotic?

Did you already had any dandruff after you took the oral antibiotic..

I looked it up of the oral anti biotic you took.. please see below

http://www.drugs.com/mtm/clindamycin-topical.html

Although this medicine is applied to the skin, your body may absorb enough clindamycin to cause serious side effects. You may not be able to use this medication if you have inflammation of your intestines (also called enteritis), ulcerative colitis, or if you have ever had severe diarrhea caused by antibiotic medicine.

also see

http://www.medicinenet.com/clindamycin-topical/article.htm

Many people using this medication do not have serious side effects. A small amount of this medication may be absorbed into your bloodstream and may rarely cause a severe intestinal condition (pseudomembranous colitis) due to a resistant bacteria.

It looks like that this stuff can enter the intestines.

How is it possible that this via the blood can enter the intestine

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In order for a topical antibiotic to get absorbed into skin in quantities big enough to influence intestinal flora, it has to cover 20% or more of your skin for a longer period.

I had a very severe case of SD until I used topical clindamycin which brought it down to about 5% of its total strength. This just illustrates how much bacteria, such as S. aureus and S. epidermidis, can play a large role in it. I'm not saying everybody's SD has bacteria and yeast infections together, but it is a possibility.

How do intestinal bacteria affect hormone levels?

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Joellie, my SD started around my nose, and later I got it on my forehead too. I have dandruff as well, but I can easily control that with anti-dandruff shampoo. I don't think my SD became worse or better when I used the oral antibiotic for my acne. Didn't change anything for me.

To be honest, I can control my seborrheic dermatitis pretty well with Locobase Repair. My SD is not that bad. It's kinda strange though, Locobase Repair contains a little bit of oleic acid, but it does help me. Locobase Repair is supposed to repair the skin barrier. Perhaps my skin barrier is damaged?

I must say, I haven't tried any pro-biotics, so I'm going to give it a try. Do you guys know if the Solgar Advanced Multi-Billion Dophilus is any good? Four strains of bacteria, 1.25 billion each.

And BTW, I found this page with all kinds of alternative treatments for SD. Not sure if any of those will work, but it might be worth a look.

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Joellie, my SD started around my nose, and later I got it on my forehead too. I have dandruff as well, but I can easily control that with anti-dandruff shampoo. I don't think my SD became worse or better when I used the oral antibiotic for my acne. Didn't change anything for me.

To be honest, I can control my seborrheic dermatitis pretty well with Locobase Repair. My SD is not that bad. It's kinda strange though, Locobase Repair contains a little bit of oleic acid, but it does help me. Locobase Repair is supposed to repair the skin barrier. Perhaps my skin barrier is damaged?

I must say, I haven't tried any pro-biotics, so I'm going to give it a try. Do you guys know if the Solgar Advanced Multi-Billion Dophilus is any good? Four strains of bacteria, 1.25 billion each.

And BTW, I found this page with all kinds of alternative treatments for SD. Not sure if any of those will work, but it might be worth a look.

Thanks.. I used the locobase repair creme a long time ago.. but I was not that much statisfied by that cream. But sure it helps. This oleic acid is different than the one of the secretion of the Yeast M. Globosa see also article http://www.pgbeautyscience.com/index.php?id=599 if you haven't seen it before.

about the pro biotics.. sure they help.. but you can get resistent. I do not know yet which one would be the best.. the person in holland used Lacto Pro brand PURO. I tried them as well and it did help.. but without the 6 months diet and the fresh oregano you are not able too balance your flora on the long run. Only short time possible. But it is for us a guess which bacterial aren't functionating following this theory. So you can give it a try..

I tried many of those remedies of your recommanded page.. but thanks anyway.. a lot of them are helpfull.

Did you had already dandruff before you took the topical antibiotics?

And how long did you used the topical antibiotics in time?

Did you applied it more times a day?

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In order for a topical antibiotic to get absorbed into skin in quantities big enough to influence intestinal flora, it has to cover 20% or more of your skin for a longer period.

I had a very severe case of SD until I used topical clindamycin which brought it down to about 5% of its total strength. This just illustrates how much bacteria, such as S. aureus and S. epidermidis, can play a large role in it. I'm not saying everybody's SD has bacteria and yeast infections together, but it is a possibility.

How do intestinal bacteria affect hormone levels?

Hello Neutron,

It makes it really complex. but it is so important to know all those things. Can you tell us a little bit more about how your possible development of SD? Maybe diet or also medications before?

Do you have sometimes moodswings? How is your stool and concentration...etc.

Very interesting that the topical antibiotic did inhibit your sd.. but that could be... like that the antibiotic attack the yeast on the skin.. which are the final factor of triggering sd and keeps it down, but that the same anti biotic bring the intestinal out of balance.. which is the start of the SD.

maybe crap maybe true..

hormone influence

http://www.scientistsolutions.com/t11439-h...+intestine.html

more info

http://www.danoneinstitute.org/publication...e_intestine.pdf

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I also came on this site

http://74.125.77.132/search?q=cache:rpzfH7...=en&ct=clnk

Certain drugs (e.g., methyldopa, cimetidine [Tagamet®], antiseizure medications) can aggravate seborrheic dermatitis. Looks like it if you google on what they do that they harm the intestinal as well.

about the oral anti biotics jason took, it can be that not all the anti biotics harm that particular bacterial for SD.

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Can you tell us a little bit more about how your possible development of SD? Maybe diet or also medications before?

Do you have sometimes moodswings? How is your stool and concentration...etc.

I developed SD after I carelessly allowed a potent shampoo to sit on my face while showering. After I noticed it sort of irritated my skin, I stopped. But two weeks later SD appeared.

I tried changing diet but didn't notice improvement in SD. I didn't use antibiotics before I got it nor did I have mood swings. Actually, I wasn't sick in a long time. However, as SD worsened over time I had some mood swings and also had to use an antibiotic as I described earlier. My stool is fine and regular, my concentration and memory could have been much better.

Thanks for those links. I'll read them later and maybe post any questions I might have.

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Can you tell us a little bit more about how your possible development of SD? Maybe diet or also medications before?

Do you have sometimes moodswings? How is your stool and concentration...etc.

I developed SD after I carelessly allowed a potent shampoo to sit on my face while showering. After I noticed it sort of irritated my skin, I stopped. But two weeks later SD appeared.

I tried changing diet but didn't notice improvement in SD. I didn't use antibiotics before I got it nor did I have mood swings. Actually, I wasn't sick in a long time. However, as SD worsened over time I had some mood swings and also had to use an antibiotic as I described earlier. My stool is fine and regular, my concentration and memory could have been much better.

Thanks for those links. I'll read them later and maybe post any questions I might have.

Wowww. that is nasty! :(

Did you already had heavy dandruff before your SD came on your face?

On which places did it start?

Did you experience allready before developing SD a lot of oil comming out on your face?

May I ask you the reason for shampooing your face? which shampo was it?

How was your diet before your SD?

I know a little more about the diet in SD

But besides the diet some other factors are really important

like

humidity between 40 and 55 is the best

temperature between 19 and 23 Celcius

and UV light from sun. in those conditions.. otherwise your skin get too much hot and sweaty and will do no good. So if you got a lot of sun in those conditions.. your sd will fully clear and stay good as long you have some sun everyday.

For the diet you must think off what's good

like green lettuce especially the dark green ones.

skip lemon and lime.. those harm so much.. only a few drops is already enough

skip sugars

skip too much olive oil (use a little for cooking..all kinds react differently) and other fatty acids

skip beets

skip 'salmon... instead eat tuna or macreal, or sardines,

skip white beans

skip tofu

skip soy

skip milk,, use yoghurt but use the one which has the most less milk protein like 0,2%

some eggs not all... depends on the ratio of omega 6 and 3

don't use alchohol but you are allowed too drink wodka.. but better not.. but wodka is best choice

don't eat pineapple

skip dark bread... better eat white bread.

skip ketchup and kurries.. but you can have a few tomato

skip tomato soup

skip almond nuts

salt is really worse... a really important one so avoid it completely

skip conconut (milk)

skip black pepper

eat a lot of vegetables and some fruits..

but apple ( eat not a whole one just some pieces)

let me know what you think of it.

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For the diet you must think off what's good

like green lettuce especially the dark green ones.

skip lemon and lime.. those harm so much.. only a few drops is already enough

skip sugars

Hi, I find that eating in general, will worsen the redness when its active. (Fasting is the main part of any detox, no?)

I also find that periods with big meals can cause outbreaks.

(I THINK food takes some water away from the body. Salty food even more so. At the same time it puts a load on the purification system (mainly the liver?). So, in high food periods, there is a mild dehydration combined with buildup of toxins/byproducts. This is probably enough to make the whole system including skin more sensitive.

So when it comes to diet, Im fairly sure a 'detox' style diet is ideal for fighting outbreaks. (Periods of veg-juice and lots of water instead of food. I personally feel that coffee and some teas have a place in this regime, but I know this is debatable. There is some research that coffee greatly aids the liver.. a light roast is most effective.)

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For the diet you must think off what's good

like green lettuce especially the dark green ones.

skip lemon and lime.. those harm so much.. only a few drops is already enough

skip sugars

Hi, I find that eating in general, will worsen the redness when its active. (Fasting is the main part of any detox, no?)

I also find that periods with big meals can cause outbreaks.

(I THINK food takes some water away from the body. Salty food even more so. At the same time it puts a load on the purification system (mainly the liver?). So, in high food periods, there is a mild dehydration combined with buildup of toxins/byproducts. This is probably enough to make the whole system including skin more sensitive.

So when it comes to diet, Im fairly sure a 'detox' style diet is ideal for fighting outbreaks. (Periods of veg-juice and lots of water instead of food. I personally feel that coffee and some teas have a place in this regime, but I know this is debatable. There is some research that coffee greatly aids the liver.. a light roast is most effective.)

Have you tried taking apple cider vinegar internally? Detoxes the body. It helps tremendously with acne and other problems like energy increasing, arthritis pain, etc.

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Hi Cici,

I tried it.. works well. but on the long run it does lose some of it strengthness.

I picked the story below up somewhere on the net.

let me know what you think of it.

Z Hautkr. 1986 Apr 1;61(7):451- 4.Links

[Reflections on seborrheic scalp eczema and psoriasis capillitii

in relation to intestinal mycoses]

Menzel I, Holzmann H.

"Stool samples of patients suffering from seborrheic eczema of the

scalp, psoriasis capitis, or seborrhiasis were investigated. All

patients revealed pathological flora of the bowel to a high degree,

predominantly pathogenic yeasts. Therapy of the intestine seems to be

of good influence to the skin disease as well."

Also in allergic people tested, they almost always find a lack of , or

none whatsoever, of "good" bifidobacterium species in the gut. These

probiotics produce acetic acid byproducts(among others) and as we know

the acetic acid is a killer of some pathogenic yeasts.

So, by taking vinegar(acetic acid) you may restore a good bowel flora

and therefore restore immunity and have a therapeutic effect on SD.

Once you stop it is likely the symptoms will return, unless you

somehow manage to restore the bifidobacterium permanently. In SD

people there is some underlying reason(genetic? ) why these

bifidobacterium cannot seem to take hold and predominate.

__________________

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