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Colonel Angus

Asian Skin Types input please

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For those with light to medium asian skin, what has worked for you and what should be avoided completely. I am asking about stuff that improved your scarring, pores and texture also so even feedback on topical stuff like tazorac, retin-A will help. Even if it irritated in the short term, as long as it helps in the long run.

Thanks,

Colin

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Nothing to avoid yet, although I wouldn't want to recommend full face dermabrasion for asian skin. But treatment like magnetixboy has gone through should be okay. I am currently playing with tca 15 % and jessner.

In the near future I am thinking of a filler for a few big indents and one or two wrinkes because of acne scarring. Beside that I am going to order 100 percent tca to treat my icepicks.

I have a light tan color, but it seems to be this way since my last vacation of 2 months to south asia, my bottoms and upperlegs and chest are a tad whiter than my face / neck and arms. It's almost been a year, will the tan fade or do I need to tan the rest of my body?

I am curious if the tca peel will return the color of my face to the original pretty white color. ( I am Euroasian by the way, mixed)

Anyway I have done 2 layers of tca peel on my forehead, and some individual scars. I hope to see some improvement in the texture on my forehead cuz the texture is awfull. But i got good hopes!

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My brother used Retin-A Micro and still does. He had moderate acne and now he is clear from using it. The only side effects is that his face is a bit pinkish rather then white. I won't suggest that you use BP because neither of us had any results from it. Also, just let me say...if you have light skin, your scars are WAYYYY more visible and looks 10X worse compared to someone with dark skin. So definately figure a way to control your acne...I think people with white skin have it A LOT harder then people with dark skin.

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I've done a full face 25% tca peel this summer and ended up fine. Did CROSS monthly until I stopped 6 months ago and no problems there either. I'm using tazorac at the moment primarily for acne and it doesn't seem to do much for scars. Been waking up with my face red every morning even with moisturizer cause of Taz. I do plan to try medical microdermabrasion if I can manage to find one cheap.

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For those with light to medium asian skin, what has worked for you and what should be avoided completely. I am asking about stuff that improved your scarring, pores and texture also so even feedback on topical stuff like tazorac, retin-A will help. Even if it irritated in the short term, as long as it helps in the long run.

Thanks,

Colin

Honestly, this was a thread I was thinking about starting. About time...thanks Colin.

I have light/medium skin and by that I mean my skin is pale yellow if I don't sun, but I tan very easily. I'm not off-white like some asians can be though. RAM caused me some permanent redmarks, overapplication of bp gave me a red/burn mark ( i emphasize the overapplication here since normal use of it was fine for me), sunscreen/block did nothing to prevent my skin from tanning or burning.

It seems only the simplest most basic regiment works for me: a good diet, rinse face in the morining just with water, and I switch between purpose bar and basis antibacterial bar.

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i did a 12.5% tca on my cheeks and its turning out fine. peeled all week and i had school...talk about embarrasing. anyhoo, no ill effects, looks much better now. gonna do 2-3 layers next week.

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So we can conclude that tca from ?? to 15 % for peel is safe for us asians. But if have to go outside just after the peel and there's sun, use sunblock! We hyperpigment more easily than other races.

We can assume when taking precautions 50 to 100 % is also safe for cross use, CROSS people not peeling.. ( korean studies people!) Anyway I haven't tried it myself but I hear other asian people about having tried the cross and having no problems except sometimes widening of the scar instead of filling her in..

So watch it when u poke with the toothpick, inside the scar not outside.. :lol2:

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Definitely not full face dermabrasion.

I don't know who did your dermabrasion and how bad your scars were/are but with Asian skin the doctor probably should have turned you down.I don't trust most doctors, including or maybe even especially Dr. Y. Like I've stated before he will do about anyone and doesn't seem concerned with risk/reward at all.I've smoothed my scars with repeated peels and CO2 slush treatments , much better than the dermabrasion I had.I had one plastic surgeon tell me(I've seen his work and trusted him) my scars were mild and a dermabrasion AT BEST would only improve already mild scarring.Thats AT BEST and very well could make them look worse along with the other inherit risk of dermabrasion.

I'm not trying to make anyone look bad...I'm stating personal experience with just plain common sense.If i was looking for something to help my scars(I've been there and done that)I would find a dermatotogist that treats acne/acne scars with cryotherapy.I once posted a website that listed dermatologist and what treatments they used.Its been a while back but I'm sure its still here.Co2 slush is a cost efficent way to treat scars after a $100.00-$150.00 investment.One can probably freeze their scars weekly for under $25.00 a year.I would go to a doctor and see how he does it BEFORE you try it.For those that want to try this without learning the technique from a doctor you can easily trade acne scars for frost bitten acne scars with permanent hypopigmentation.I learned it from a doctor than gave me weekly freezes for over a year.

He retired and I started doing it myself.

Jeffh

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It seems to me that when I use bar soap on my face it dries my skin enough to make it shed lightly. Is this bad to do and I wonder if continuous light shedding from soap will improve anything?

DJT, did you stop CROSS because it didn't work or stop because you had success. How long were you hyperpigmented after stopping the CROSS? How long after the 25% peel would you say that your face returned to "normal" and what did it help with?

Aznboi, at any time were you so weird looking that you were unpresentable and did you see any improvements?

Jeff, I wish I knew how to do what you are describing. You wouldn't happen to live in TX would you? I think it might be hard to find a doctor to do this since none of the one's I talked to have mentioned this.

Colin

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It seems to me that when I use bar soap on my face it dries my skin enough to make it shed lightly. Is this bad to do and I wonder if continuous light shedding from soap will improve anything?

DJT, did you stop CROSS because it didn't work or stop because you had success. How long were you hyperpigmented after stopping the CROSS? How long after the 25% peel would you say that your face returned to "normal" and what did it help with?

Aznboi, at any time were you so weird looking that you were unpresentable and did you see any improvements?

Jeff, I wish I knew how to do what you are describing. You wouldn't happen to live in TX would you? I think it might be hard to find a doctor to do this since none of the one's I talked to have mentioned this.

Colin

Hi Colin,

I live in NC.Cryotherapy for scars was in vogue about the time dermabrasion hit its popularity in the 1960's.I read a book about acne/acne scars treatments in the early 1980's and it mentioned freezing.I found only one doctor doing it and that was 20+ years ago.He also did dermabrasions and had performed over 5000.I either wanted him or a plastic surgeon that nicely excised a big raised scar from a motorcyle accident I had that was completely flat.He did a great job and that was in the late 1970's.I mentioned a dermabrasion and he said come back after the acne had cleared up.It cleared up in 1982 after the FDA release of accutane and I returned back to that comestic surgeon.He refused,stating the risk/reward was POOR in my case.In hindsight (which is always 20/20)I have alot of respect for him.I was pissed at the time because I BELIEVED the 50+80% improvement.I thought with mild scars it could have been 100%.It just doesn't work that way.I did find a PS that would do it and was actually preapproved by my insurance.Thats why I didn't use my dermatotogist.I took the cheap way out.My dermatotogist would give me weekly freeze's and wrote my prescriptions for $10.00 per office visit.That was super inexpensive even in 1981.I've pretty much tried everything for acne/acne scars except xrays for acne and fillers for the scars.I will see if I can find that website and post it if I do...Where do you live in Texas?

Jeffh

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Dallas area.

Colin,

here is the website;

http://asds-net.org/find.html

It probably has doctors in TX doing cryotherapy.I would guess it would be with liquid nitrogen over co2.I would prefer co2...It's not as cold and not quite as dangerous.It will level off the high points(over time) but can't pull up the low points.I was never interested in fillers but TCA cross did fill in some minor ice picks.My skin is not perfect but probably as good as it will get.If anyone knows how to make the skin perfect again please show me instead of tell me.I would post some pics but don't have a digital camera.Plus, I have no before pics...The before pics would be from the mid 1980's.

jeffh

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DJT, did you stop CROSS because it didn't work or stop because you had success. How long were you hyperpigmented after stopping the CROSS? How long after the 25% peel would you say that your face returned to "normal" and what did it help with?

Colin

No, I stopped CROSS, because I started Tazaroc. I had good results with it and wanted to continue, but was told that it might not be a good idea since I was on Tazorac. I didn't scab and there were no hyperpigmentation. I've tried 25% and 50% strengths and 50% yields better results, but higher risks if done improperly.

As for the face peel, it took a week for it to fully peel off and I had to miss the first 2 days of class cause of it.

There are only 2 spots that were red, but only after I peeled it by accident myself. Honestly, I couldn't tell what the peel did for me. Maybe it reduced some hyperpigmentation that was left from previous acne and gave me a better skin tone, but I don't think it did much for scars. Low acid TCA peels are known to be ineffective for scars unless you have really shallow scarring and big pores.

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Anyways, fraxel seems to be okay for asian skin. I checked out some singaporean website. here are some pics after fraxel treatments. trouble is I don't live there and i don't seem to find any info in Europe about fraxel..

oww look what i found..

"quote"

Typically patients find they can go back to work soon after treatment or the next day

You may apply make-up or shave soon after treatment.

Clinical studies suggest that 3-5 treatments spaced about 1 month apart produce a gradual remodeling of dermal matrix components, until complete healing occurs and "good" material that contains collagen and elastin replaces old epidermal and dermal tissue. Over a period of 1-3 months, clinical improvement in photo-aged skin correlates with dermal repair and positive skin changes.

""

hm that's not bad, now the money issue to fly back and forth :P

here is the pics of the singaporean website..

http://www.sloaneclinic.com/english/theskin/fra3.jpg

40 to 70 percent improvement so it seems, maybe after a year it's possible to do another course.

Absolutely okay for asians and even darker tones so it seems :)

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Colin,

I hate to break your heart but even for the moderate acne scars, a person may need at least 1-2 dermabrasions, 2-3 CO2 laser or 5-6 erbium YAG treatments in order to see any realistic improvement for shallow rolling or boxcar scars. Of course, the procedures such as punch excision or punch floats are mandatory if some scars are icepick. These are still the standard routine treatments offerred in Far East. Since any loss of pigmentation for Asian skin type will be astoundingly more obvious then Caucasians, special power settings for laser treatments are usually required. Moreover, more intensive/careful post op cares are also needed to minimize any possible complication. IMHO, a very aggressive treatment done by an experienced doctor (in treating Asian skin types) is far safer than a mildly invasive treatment done by someone else. If you can trace back the history on this board, many Asians were treated successfully (to some degree at least) by Dr. Y and move on with their lives. Others may suffer with complications but all of them are still healing.

I personally don't think that having multiple very aggressive microdermabrasions in treating superficial acne scars is a silly idea. As matter of fact, I'm planning to have either a sequence of non-crystal microdermabrasions (using an extra coarse diamond tip) or one superficial dermabrasion (using diamond fraise) to polish out the remaining scars after the redness on my face goes away. I hope that Dr. Y won't retire "early".

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Colin,

I hate to break your heart but even for the moderate acne scars, a person may need at least 1-2 dermabrasions, 2-3 CO2 laser or 5-6 erbium YAG treatments in order to see any realistic improvement for shallow rolling or boxcar scars. Of course, the procedures such as punch excision or punch floats are mandatory if some scars are icepick. These are still the standard routine treatments offerred in Far East. Since any loss of pigmentation for Asian skin type will be astoundingly more obvious then Caucasians, special power settings for laser treatments are usually required. Moreover, more intensive/careful post op cares are also needed to minimize any possible complication. IMHO, a very aggressive treatment done by an experienced doctor (in treating Asian skin types) is far safer than a mildly invasive treatment done by someone else. If you can trace back the history on this board, many Asians were treated successfully (to some degree at least) by Dr. Y and move on with their lives. Others may suffer with complications but all of them are still healing.

I personally don't think that having multiple very aggressive microdermabrasions in treating superficial acne scars is a silly idea. As matter of fact, I'm planning to have either a sequence of non-crystal microdermabrasions (using an extra coarse diamond tip) or one superficial dermabrasion (using diamond fraise) to polish out the remaining scars after the redness on my face goes away. I hope that Dr. Y won't retire "early".

Lunarsurface,

I had an agressive non-crystal form of microdermabrasion using an extra coarse diamond tip as you mentioned called a SilkPeel (I mentioned this in other posts). I don't know if it was the operator but it ended up damaging my skin texture by making it uneven and damaging the pores. I would definitely be careful.

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Colin,

I really won't mind to end up with a rougher (orange peel alike) or overly smoothy (waxy/shining) texture if the scars look less noticeable. It is well known that changing skin texture in an unpredictable way is an inherited risk of having a dermabrasion or an agressive microdermabrasion. For a person with moderate to severe acne scars, I consider this complication just a "small" price to pay. And a rougher skin texture can always be effectively treated with chemical peels but too many peels may result in a waxy texture. A popular way of minimizing this complication is to combine microdermabrasions with chemical peels. (BTW, I think it is unethical to treat a patient NOT by the doctor himself/herself if the treatment carries some risks. This just completely defeats the purpose of seeing that doctor.)

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Colin,

I really won't mind to end up with a rougher (orange peel alike) or overly smoothy (waxy/shining) texture if the scars look less noticeable. It is well known that changing skin texture in an unpredictable way is an inherited risk of having a dermabrasion or an agressive microdermabrasion. For a person with moderate to severe acne scars, I consider this complication just a "small" price to pay. And a rougher skin texture can always be effectively treated with chemical peels but too many peels may result in a waxy texture. A popular way of minimizing this complication is to combine microdermabrasions with chemical peels. (BTW, I think it is unethical to treat a patient NOT by the doctor himself/herself if the treatment carries some risks. This just completely defeats the purpose of seeing that doctor.)

Lunar,

I think the problem I found was that the scarring did not improve and the silkpeel only added more damage and it's not just rough texture, it could be viewed as additional scarring. I think the sandblast method of microderm is much safer than the coarse abrasive head type from what I have seen. Just make sure you do a test area first and let it heal at least a month before you make judgment.

Colin

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Lunar,

I think the problem I found was that the scarring did not improve and the silkpeel only added more damage and it's not just rough texture, it could be viewed as additional scarring. I think the sandblast method of microderm is much safter than the coarse abrasive head type from what I have seen. Just make sure you do a test area first and let it heal at least a month before you make judgment.

Colin

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Jessner is quite week, it peels but its a thin layer. Hard 2 believe you scarred from this week peel.

I am seeing exellent results though with tca/jessner. Me asian too.

How unfortunate that you had negative results..

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Jessner is quite week, it peels but its a thin layer. Hard 2 believe you scarred from this week peel.

I am seeing exellent results though with tca/jessner. Me asian too.

How unfortunate that you had negative results..

Jessner really isn't considered a weak(light) peel but a medium one...the scarring isn't deep but orange peel effect...not pretty...I'm glad you are having good results though :cool:

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