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Catharsis2018

Do y’all think I’m ready for phenol?

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3 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

How the f did he got so much improvement in 1 session on deep icepick and boxcars from dermabrasion. Sometimes I even question on the tradition scar knowledge I.e raising scars up before doing this deep procedures. But like how. HE didn’t mention the doctor name but I am guessing it is this clinic, In the post he said 2500 and I found the same price in this location.

https://www.realself.com/review/tulsa-dermabrasion-works

https://www.dermatologylaserok.com/scars-dermabrasion.html#accordion

 

If that guy is just pink after one simple week than he must have had a different technique or depth or something than me. I remember I was hoping the pinkness would fade for well over 6 months completely. But yeah, those results are about in sync with my experience. They just nuked the area with a shaver and I woke up like with flat or generally invisible scars.

I'm not sure why most doctors don't do it anymore, and why so many are hesitant on doing it. Maybe it's very hit or miss, no clue. Cost me $2750 (insurance covered due to necessary/I pushed doctor) but I imagine it would cost $4k to $8 now since it was 15+ years ago.

 

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The safer approach still I think is bad scar revision first to raise the scar area and then nuking the area with dermabrasion, that way they don’t have to go deep and potentially avoid side effects where the probability increases as they go deeper. What i know is the deeper you go the risky the side effects.

were your scar exactly as this person deep when you had the dermabrasion.?

3 hours ago, harmlessboy1441 said:

If that guy is just pink after one simple week than he must have had a different technique or depth or something than me. I remember I was hoping the pinkness would fade for well over 6 months completely. But yeah, those results are about in sync with my experience. They just nuked the area with a shaver and I woke up like with flat or generally invisible scars.

I'm not sure why most doctors don't do it anymore, and why so many are hesitant on doing it. Maybe it's very hit or miss, no clue. Cost me $2750 (insurance covered due to necessary/I pushed doctor) but I imagine it would cost $4k to $8 now since it was 15+ years ago.

 

Edited by getsmart121
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42 minutes ago, getsmart121 said:

The safer approach still I think is bad scar revision first to raise the scar area and then nuking the area with dermabrasion, that way they don’t have to go deep and potentially avoid side effects where the probability increases as they go deeper. What i know is the deeper you go the risky the side effects.

were your scar exactly as this person deep when you had the dermabrasion.?

It's hard to remember that long ago but I would say I had more scars in general, I don't think as deep. I remember I had very little boxcars, mostly all icepicks. That's one thing I remember really well. Most of my scars were just icepicks and not as deep. Don't get me wrong they weren't superficial either, just not as deep as this guy or some other people I've seen. Somewhere in the middle. Just lots of icepicks. I definitely agree that if you have deep ones the Dermabrasion simply won't safely get to the bottom of it so something else has to raise them first. Dermabrasion really requires a more level area. 

What I'm unsure about is how dermabrasion trauma would react (if at all) on areas where you already generated significant scar tissue. For the people who do procedures to raise or tweak scars before dermabrasion I don't know if one of the key success reasons was because I had mostly healthy skin around all my scars and just did the dermabrasion which enabled really good healing/blending.

 

Edited by harmlessboy1441
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Well in general if you have raised the area with excision, laser, cross and more closer to health skin and current scars are hovering between shallow to moderate level. Then I guess dermabrasion is safer. Because they wouldnt need to shave down healthy skin to the level of unhealthy skin by that much. Most issues start with going deeper.

Edited by getsmart121
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On 2/26/2022 at 1:17 PM, dirigo39 said:

 

No I didn't see improvement until 3 months after the pixel co2. It actually looked a little worst the first month. 

 

What kind of laser did you use?

Lumenis TotalFX. The redness always makes things look worse and that is one of the downsides of getting laser treatment.

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This may not be helpful, but I've been looking into cheek reconstruction by plastic surgeons. They cut out a portion of the skin/scar and suture it closed. The bottom two photos of yours, I can see a surgeon removing a small portion of skin that may give you a more pleasing result. However, the skill of the doctor, how you heal and location of skin that is being cut out varies in terms of results. I've attached a link I've been looking at. This doctor who runs this website says what types of scar revision is optimal and the suture techniques and provides various cases of cheek reconstruction surgeries, almost like educating future or practicing doctors. This sort of information helps me filter out which doctor is more advanced in techniques and what not... It's almost like a way of vetting for me. Since it is the face and its surgery, I've become hyper-sensitive to the quality and expertise of doctors than ever before. If the doctor is not a plastic surgeon who performs routine scar or reconstruction cases, I won't bother. I guess it's also because I had a somewhat failed punch by a mohs derm and I've now grown a bit wary (although the other excisions performed by mohs derm went very well). I am a perfectionist so any hint of doubt makes me nervous. Anyways. 

I am also slowly researching growth factors and "supercharged" prp (but its still in its early study stages; needs more studies to be more concrete...) which may provide more optimal results after surgical scar is performed. I'll provide links below. Personally, I don't think any more laser or peels would give you any meaningful results but I may be wrong. After all, I'm just seeing photos you provide (vs in person evaluation) and I'm not at all an expert on scar revision. I'm just a guinea pig in a sense. 

You don't need cheek reconstruction by the way, I've just put it out there because I'm researching it. I have scar excision by a scar reconstruction plastic surgeon late in the month for one or two scars so I'd document the process of that soon.

Hope all is well. 

https://scarscenter.com/basal-cell-carcinoma/cheek-reconstruction-2/

Supercharged prp https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8116016/

Growth factors https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK442024/

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8 hours ago, Dontgiveupitsonlyscars said:

This may not be helpful, but I've been looking into cheek reconstruction by plastic surgeons. They cut out a portion of the skin/scar and suture it closed. The bottom two photos of yours, I can see a surgeon removing a small portion of skin that may give you a more pleasing result. However, the skill of the doctor, how you heal and location of skin that is being cut out varies in terms of results. I've attached a link I've been looking at. This doctor who runs this website says what types of scar revision is optimal and the suture techniques and provides various cases of cheek reconstruction surgeries, almost like educating future or practicing doctors. This sort of information helps me filter out which doctor is more advanced in techniques and what not... It's almost like a way of vetting for me. Since it is the face and its surgery, I've become hyper-sensitive to the quality and expertise of doctors than ever before. If the doctor is not a plastic surgeon who performs routine scar or reconstruction cases, I won't bother. I guess it's also because I had a somewhat failed punch by a mohs derm and I've now grown a bit wary (although the other excisions performed by mohs derm went very well). I am a perfectionist so any hint of doubt makes me nervous. Anyways. 

I am also slowly researching growth factors and "supercharged" prp (but its still in its early study stages; needs more studies to be more concrete...) which may provide more optimal results after surgical scar is performed. I'll provide links below. Personally, I don't think any more laser or peels would give you any meaningful results but I may be wrong. After all, I'm just seeing photos you provide (vs in person evaluation) and I'm not at all an expert on scar revision. I'm just a guinea pig in a sense. 

You don't need cheek reconstruction by the way, I've just put it out there because I'm researching it. I have scar excision by a scar reconstruction plastic surgeon late in the month for one or two scars so I'd document the process of that soon.

Hope all is well. 

https://scarscenter.com/basal-cell-carcinoma/cheek-reconstruction-2/

Supercharged prp https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8116016/

Growth factors https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK442024/

Ohh thank you for this. I’ll check out. Just to be clear, the bottom three photos are before I did any acne scar treatments. The top three photos are where I am now. 

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was just browsing and read that you guys are talking about dermabrasion, I did it twice and it is life changing indeed….. I tried a loooooot of acne scar treatments and so far dermabrasion gave me the most perceptible and significant improvement but as I always say it is not for everyone….the recovery was hell and depressing…..not for brown/dark skin individuals, the impatient, or those with suicidal tendencies, recovery would be more difficult for males…..I would do it again but the recovery is sooooo long….you’ll be red and you’ll blush easily for several months to a year and your face will be significantly lighter than your neck for 1 year or more…..can make you prone to hyperpigmentation or melasma…..but it eliminated a lot of my superficial scarring, blended the edges of my deeper scars, made my scars less noticeable and overall skin texture better, got compliments on my skin after dermabrasion from random people……I would say 35-40% improvement each time just my guesstimate…..I was already okay with my skin after dermabrasion but I wanted to try out phenol cross and subcision - currently recovering from it…….

Edited by MissCamay2005
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4 hours ago, MissCamay2005 said:

was just browsing and read that you guys are talking about dermabrasion, I did it twice and it is life changing indeed….. I tried a loooooot of acne scar treatments and so far dermabrasion gave me the most perceptible and significant improvement but as I always say it is not for everyone….the recovery was hell and depressing…..not for brown/dark skin individuals, the impatient, or those with suicidal tendencies, recovery would be more difficult for males…..I would do it again but the recovery is sooooo long….you’ll be red and you’ll blush easily for several months to a year and your face will be significantly lighter than your neck for 1 year or more…..can make you prone to hyperpigmentation or melasma…..but it eliminated a lot of my superficial scarring, blended the edges of my deeper scars, made my scars less noticeable and overall skin texture better, got compliments about my skin after dermabrasion from random people……I would say 35-40% improvement each time just my guesstimate…..I was already okay with my skin after dermabrasion but I wanted to try out phenol cross and subcision - currently recovering from it…….

What is your skin type

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4 hours ago, MissCamay2005 said:

I am a fair and oily skinned Asian gal.

Hmm. I am fitzpatrick 4 what do you think on dark skin?

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13 hours ago, MissCamay2005 said:

was just browsing and read that you guys are talking about dermabrasion, I did it twice and it is life changing indeed….. I tried a loooooot of acne scar treatments and so far dermabrasion gave me the most perceptible and significant improvement but as I always say it is not for everyone….the recovery was hell and depressing…..not for brown/dark skin individuals, the impatient, or those with suicidal tendencies, recovery would be more difficult for males…..I would do it again but the recovery is sooooo long….you’ll be red and you’ll blush easily for several months to a year and your face will be significantly lighter than your neck for 1 year or more…..can make you prone to hyperpigmentation or melasma…..but it eliminated a lot of my superficial scarring, blended the edges of my deeper scars, made my scars less noticeable and overall skin texture better, got compliments on my skin after dermabrasion from random people……I would say 35-40% improvement each time just my guesstimate…..I was already okay with my skin after dermabrasion but I wanted to try out phenol cross and subcision - currently recovering from it…….

This doctor performs chemobrasion technique using sandpaper and tca if anyone is interested. https://www.cosmeticsurgerysb.com/cosmetic-surgery-highlight-chemabrasion-in-santa-barbara/

 

Edited by getsmart121
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2 hours ago, JesusChrist said:

Hmm. I am fitzpatrick 4 what do you think on dark skin?

I would say don’t do it, I think with your skin type the risk will outweigh the benefits and I don’t think any prudent doctor would do dermabrasion on a fitzpatrick 4. I think am fitzpatrick 2 and my face became super “white” and developed melasma on my forehead after and some whitish scars on my cheeks but not very noticeable.

2 hours ago, getsmart121 said:

This doctor performs chemobrasion technique using sandpaper and tca if anyone is interested. https://www.cosmeticsurgerysb.com/cosmetic-surgery-highlight-chemabrasion-in-santa-barbara/

 

That’s kinda like what I did. I don’t believe in the 2 weeks downtime otherwise it’s super superficial with mediocre results. When I did mine I was sedated via IV, mine was combined with TCA too. Dr. Mark Berman in Beverly Hills did my dermabrasion x2.

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On 2/20/2022 at 3:03 PM, Catharsis2018 said:

Honestly man, I’ve done a plethora of treatments since I began my acne scar journey. Kinda makes me sick to think about all of the $$$$$ I’ve spent… 

im talking… 

8-9 blunt cannula subcision sessions (3 with sculptra and 3 with Radiesse)

3 Infini RF sessions

4-5 TCA cross sessions 

1 fractional co2

1 fully ablative Erbium (just for the cheeks)

one visit to Rullan for the trio 

two sculptra 

Punch excision of over 15 scars 

and this is on the top of my head. There’s probably a few I’ve forgotten to mention.

it sucks. Acne scars suck. Not a day goes by where I don’t think how my life would be different if I didn’t have these scars. Mentally I’m ready for phenol. Physically I may not be there yet. But I haven’t even been able to find a doc willing to do subcision for me, the rationale is that my scars are so much to the surface… but maybe it’s time for phenol then? Looking for input, I think. 
photos below were taken 5 mins ago (aka the three photos below are where so am now after all my acne scarring treatments)01CCC0BB-1317-4B69-AF67-5507936B06C7.jpeg.b61c6ff80893faa71707fb598505ec5d.jpegE3809831-66C4-474E-B779-4530AF6A049D.jpeg.5f8f39248c34f9846f1ab831c4d76479.jpegB21D081D-FF4D-4C13-91FC-74501A55CDDF.jpeg.6f644f9cceffefa36a97c3fc8d17b24a.jpeg
 

a comparison to photos of my day zero (the three photos below are before any acne scar treatments)79D81772-4FBC-4886-892B-AE21C755452B.jpeg.87959ccc3bda90d6c7d5196ff2aad4b3.jpegD68A3837-883D-4B33-A0DB-93B21AD8FDEA.jpeg.940095c94540e8de760d5d804b5cfa8c.jpegC711565B-725E-4929-AE06-BC795ACE6DAA.jpeg.6e7109c358af84db6330ce338f4a41a1.jpeg

 

last time I spoke to Rullan he wanted me to do a few more trios. But fuck that. I’m in Canada ffs. And I think phenol is the only thing now that will give me a substantial difference. His office is willing to do another consult with me for the phenol though. So maybe it will go in my favour. 

I kinda have similar scarring when I started my acne scar treatment journey, just my opinion - dermabrasion from a good doctor can make your scars less noticeable….I had 2 dermabrasions it erased a lot of my superficial scarring, boxcar scars, made the edges of scars less noticeable and better skin texture overall but the recovery was hellish……suprisingly after my dermabrasions I started getting comments from random people about how good my skin looks lol but  personally I can still see my scars….currently recovering from subcision ……goodluck!

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3 hours ago, MissCamay2005 said:

I kinda have similar scarring when I started my acne scar treatment journey, just my opinion - dermabrasion from a good doctor can make your scars less noticeable….I had 2 dermabrasions it erased a lot of my superficial scarring, boxcar scars, made the edges of scars less noticeable and better skin texture overall but the recovery was hellish……suprisingly after my dermabrasions I started getting comments from random people about how good my skin looks lol but  personally I can still see my scars….currently recovering from subcision ……goodluck!

Hey thank you for giving your input i appreciate it

I’m thinking dermabrasion is the next step too. However it’s so hard to find a physician that provides dermabrasion. I’m also in Canada, which doesn’t help… 

how far in between were your two dermabrasion treatments? 

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1 hour ago, Catharsis2018 said:

Hey thank you for giving your input i appreciate it

I’m thinking dermabrasion is the next step too. However it’s so hard to find a physician that provides dermabrasion. I’m also in Canada, which doesn’t help… 

how far in between were your two dermabrasion treatments? 

I believe around three years. The recovery was so traumatic I needed to forget about it a little first before I was able to do another one hehehe

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1 hour ago, MissCamay2005 said:

I believe around three years. The recovery was so traumatic I needed to forget about it a little first before I was able to do another one hehehe

Hahaha that sounds fair

what made you opt for a second dermabrasion? How long was your recovery?

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5 hours ago, Catharsis2018 said:

Hahaha that sounds fair

what made you opt for a second dermabrasion? How long was your recovery?

I was impressed by the results but of course scars are scars maybe 35-40% better and better overall skin overall and I started getting compliments on my skin. So I want more improvement so I did a second one, another 35-40% improvement, just my guesstimate. After the 2nd I was okay with my skin, I can live with it….but I still try treatments here and there every now and then but nothing is better than dermabrasion so far. I could have done a 3rd one but I don’t wanna lose another year…

 

recovery meaning looking normal again maybe around 10 months to a year…… the scab will be all gone I believe around  10-14 days but you’ll be red for another 1-2 months then your face will be  “white” that turns tomato red for even the littlest of things like heat, laughing , exertion, and your face will be noticeably lighter than the rest of you, prone to hyperpigmentation  but face will be noticeably smoother …. of course you’ll still have your scar but blended and less noticeable……

Edited by MissCamay2005
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On 3/8/2022 at 2:06 AM, MissCamay2005 said:

was just browsing and read that you guys are talking about dermabrasion, I did it twice and it is life changing indeed….. I tried a loooooot of acne scar treatments and so far dermabrasion gave me the most perceptible and significant improvement but as I always say it is not for everyone….the recovery was hell and depressing…..not for brown/dark skin individuals, the impatient, or those with suicidal tendencies, recovery would be more difficult for males…..I would do it again but the recovery is sooooo long….you’ll be red and you’ll blush easily for several months to a year and your face will be significantly lighter than your neck for 1 year or more…..can make you prone to hyperpigmentation or melasma…..but it eliminated a lot of my superficial scarring, blended the edges of my deeper scars, made my scars less noticeable and overall skin texture better, got compliments on my skin after dermabrasion from random people……I would say 35-40% improvement each time just my guesstimate…..I was already okay with my skin after dermabrasion but I wanted to try out phenol cross and subcision - currently recovering from it…….

are you saying the recovery is harder for males because males generally don't wear makeup?

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5 minutes ago, researchresearch said:

are you saying the recovery is harder for males because males generally don't wear makeup?

partly and females can get away more with “white” face I think… we can also cover with hair a little, people are more accepting of females getting treatments etc. without judgement, it’s more acceptable for female to wear obvious foundation, concealer, Bb/CC cream etc….. but it’s really up to the person I guess, some people don’t care what people think, the stares and the side comments….

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5 minutes ago, MissCamay2005 said:

partly and females can get away more with “white” face I think… we can also cover with hair a little, people are more accepting of females getting treatments etc. without judgement, it’s more acceptable for female to wear obvious foundation, concealer, Bb/CC cream etc….. but it’s really up to the person I guess, some people don’t care what people think, the stares and the side comments….

ok, yeah because I have scars similar to OP. interested in what was discussed with dermabrasion. My scars are pretty much just on my upper cheeks. I have a subcision appointment soon, so figure I'll try that first with suction then move on.

Do you have recommendations on which doctors to trust for dermabrasion? I heard it's risky 

Edited by researchresearch
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On 3/11/2022 at 4:05 PM, researchresearch said:

ok, yeah because I have scars similar to OP. interested in what was discussed with dermabrasion. My scars are pretty much just on my upper cheeks. I have a subcision appointment soon, so figure I'll try that first with suction then move on.

I am currently recovering from subcision… just my opinion based from what I can see at this time so far- 3 weeks post subcision…. I can’t seem to find my rolling/wavy scars anymore not sure if it’s just inflammation but I have yet to see improvement on icepick and boxcar scars ( they are still red and bruised)…. I think for more boxcar scars and blurring edges dermabrasion is better and for more rolling/wavy scars and deep & wide scars subcision is better….goodluck!

ohhhhh you asked for a Doctor recommendation….yearsssss ago I had a hard time finding a doctor who is willing and experienced enough to do dermabrasion…I think it is way harder now because the experienced are way older now or retired and the younger ones who are willing do it it are not experienced/skilled enough….Dermabrasion is not as precise as lasers and is very dependent on the skills of the doctor…..Dr. Mark Berman - Cosmetic Surgeon in Beverly Hills did my 2 dermabrasions. He is still practicing but I’m not sure if he is still doing dermabrasion nowadays…….

Edited by MissCamay2005
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Just wanted to post an update... I paid my down deposit and have officially booked my Phenol Peel for December 2022. I'm elated.. and nervous....but most of all, pretty excited. 

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