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blairlikescats

Long Distance Consult with Dr. Rullan for Rolling Scars (Phenol Peel vs 30% Salicylic Acid Peel?)

Hi guys!

I'm looking for opinions on phenol peels.

I have rolling scars. I also have one or two small icepick scars and some hyperpigmentation, but my rolling scars are my biggest concern. I live in Austin, TX and I have been getting quotes and consults from various doctors around here. So far, everyone has pushed me to getting laser treatments.

For a Co2 treatment, I've been quoted $1500 and $3000 by two different doctors (full face).

I've also been quoted $5500-$8000 for a single treatment of the Erbium Sciton laser- that was a hard "no."

I had two profractional XC laser treatments done about four years ago, and I can't say that I see a difference; however, I failed to take decent before and after pictures so maybe it did help (I don't know...).

So, I heard about Dr. Rullan on this site (thanks guys!), and I emailed Dr. Rullan's office to get a consult and a quote for rolling scars. I sent a ton of pictures in different lighting and angles so he could accurately assess my skin via email and pictures.

They emailed me back with the following recommendation(s):

"He suggests doing Subcision with CROSS carbolic, Microneedling. Scars should be treated from several different angles. These treatments treat the scars both beneath the surface as well as above the surface and it also helps treat the scars horizontally and vertically to deal with the scar tissue below. I have also attached information on these procedures for your review. It should explain these procedures well, but any additional questions you may have after reviewing we can discuss either by email or phone. You will need at least 1 session of this combination of treatments to prep your skin prior to the phenol peel, however if you are unable to do the phenol peel then we do suggest at least 2-3 if you did this choice alone of these treatments and then eventual filler. The cost is $1750  each time you come in. You will have bruising and swelling for up to one week after.

The phenol peel there is at least 2 weeks down time with this procedure. Attached are some pictures on the phenol peel and one of the Trio procedure to see what you can expect.. Please review all of the attached information and we can go over any questions you may have after that. The cost is $6000. Down time is at least 2 weeks with persistent redness up to 1-3 months after."

So, I'm looking at about $2K for each visit/session when I factor in my traveling costs. Now, It's not a bad price relative to other doctors and whatnot; however, I don't know how I feeling about the phenol peel. $6K is quite a lot and I would need to find ways to save and build this into my finances. I can manage $2K for now, so maybe I should just schedule my first treatment and then figure out the other stuff later?

I've also heard that 30% Salicylic Acid Peel can be very effective for scarring (according to some people on Reddit).

One user cited a study: Study on Salicylic Acid

"The present results suggest that the architecture of the epidermis and the papillary dermis can be regenerated by simply injuring the cornified layer by using topical agents such as salicylic acid that do not cause degeneration or inflammation ... The findings of this study suggest that impairing the cornified layer may have essential effect on the remodeling of the epidermis as well as of the papillary dermis."

Soooooo what are your thoughts? Should I try the cheaper Salicylic Acid at-home treatments first, or do you guys think it won't work on my rolling scars? Are phenol peels worth it? I'm very lost and wish I had enough money to do every treatment haha.

Thanks!

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Thank you for your sharing the details of your experience with physicians. Did you decide against the Sciton erbium because of the price or another reason?   I have been told that the results from this are similar to phenol chemabrasion. 

Edited by Brent21

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Some reddit users think hyperpigmentation = scarring - the 30SA won't be effective on scarring.

$1750 seems steep.. prices must've climbed a lot.

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35 minutes ago, Brent21 said:

Thank you for your sharing the details of your experience with physicians. Did you decide against the Sciton erbium because of the price or another reason?   I have been told that the results from this are similar to phenol chemabrasion. 

I decided against it simply because of the money. I considered it in the first place because Dr. Lim said that it's the better laser for rolling scars (via his YouTube channel). Also, from my understanding, there's no point in laser treatments until you fix what's underneath the skin, generally through subcision for rolling scars. Also, the Erbium Sciton laser was a quote through a plastic surgeon who I don't believe is necessarily an acne scar specialist.

 

21 minutes ago, f93d said:

Some reddit users think hyperpigmentation = scarring - the 30SA won't be effective on scarring.

$1750 seems steep.. prices must've climbed a lot.

Yeah, I kind of scoff when people say they have "scarring" and it's really just hyperpigmentation that can be treated with some chemical peels. I'm sure it's a major concern for those people, but it's kind of trivial compared to the scarring most of us deal with in these forums. I'm also skeptical of just a peel-type of regime since I doubt it would actually fix actual scarring, but I was hopeful of finding something cost-effective since I don't look forward to spending thousands.

Well I think this price was around what I was kind of expecting. I've heard he generally charges around $1500 per session, depending on your treatment plan. This is for "Subcision with CROSS carbolic, Microneedling" within one session, but I'm not too familiar with prices for these kind of treatments. Is this considered expensive?

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Ugh... yeah.  I hate reddit, or really anywhere else for advice about actual scarring.  People there are clueless about pitted scarring.   

 

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Prices have climbed with Dr Rullan. I went in May 2019 and paid 1k for laser, subcision and phenol cross. I was informed via email that the prices would be climbing to 1,500 USD and then eventually 1750 USD. 

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40 minutes ago, shei514 said:

Prices have climbed with Dr Rullan. I went in May 2019 and paid 1k for laser, subcision and phenol cross. I was informed via email that the prices would be climbing to 1,500 USD and then eventually 1750 USD. 

Ah, thank you for this! Man... I wish I went back in May now, haha. I'd stay it's still quite reasonable compared the prices that non-specialist doctors charge.

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10 hours ago, blairlikescats said:

Ah, thank you for this! Man... I wish I went back in May now, haha. I'd stay it's still quite reasonable compared the prices that non-specialist doctors charge.

I wish I booked in again but earlier! It is reasonable and he is a great doctor, knows a lot about acne scarring. I think the deposit is also rising too instead of 250 USD to secure your appointment it’s rising to 500 USD. 

 

Also yes! I’ve been to doctors who have told me they know a lot about acne scarring but I think they meant hyperpigmentation not pitted scarring. There’s a lot of misunderstanding about acne scarring on the internet too. 

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It's $500 just to see him????? Omg that's crazy.  Is it applied to any treatment?   I think I waited too long ugh.

 

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Not everyone has to go to Rullan, he's trained many doctors. I go to doctor who trained under his seminar. I get Subcision for 550, Cross for 600, and do microneedle at home.Note I am a severe case have over 100 scars both big and small cross would normally cost 300. 

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Have you thought about doing subcision/rf microneedling? I’ve only gotten one treatment so far with dr Weiner with that combo so I can’t fully attest  (I also think my scars are much deeper than yours) but even after just one I did see an improvement in overall texture and smoothness. I can see it giving good results since yours are shallower but I’d double check by private messaging “beautifulambition” on here for his opinion, because I’m just speculating. Just figured I’d mention as it’s around the same price as what you were quoted for Rullan.

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7 hours ago, dazzed said:

It's $500 just to see him????? Omg that's crazy.  Is it applied to any treatment?   I think I waited too long ugh.

 

I believe the $500 is a deposit that is applied towards the total cost of the treatment, and the $500 is only required if the cost of the treatment is $1K+ or something.

3 hours ago, joeysk said:

Not everyone has to go to Rullan, he's trained many doctors. I go to doctor who trained under his seminar. I get Subcision for 550, Cross for 600, and do microneedle at home.Note I am a severe case have over 100 scars both big and small cross would normally cost 300. 

Well, we don't have many doctors known for treating acne scars where I live. There's one doctor who does subcision, but the reviews are kind of mixed for him. So, I'd rather pay a little bit more and deal with the traveling than to see a doctor who may or may not be as good.

I mean, there could be a good acne scar doctor here but I haven't heard of one yet.

2 hours ago, hlp334 said:

Have you thought about doing subcision/rf microneedling? I’ve only gotten one treatment so far with dr Weiner with that combo so I can’t fully attest  (I also think my scars are much deeper than yours) but even after just one I did see an improvement in overall texture and smoothness. I can see it giving good results since yours are shallower but I’d double check by private messaging “beautifulambition” on here for his opinion, because I’m just speculating. Just figured I’d mention as it’s around the same price as what you were quoted for Rullan.

Is Dr. Weiner in Austin?

I looked into subcision and rf microneedling. I'm open to other suggestions, but I just figured talking to Dr. Rullan would give me a better idea of what I need to do first. I'm not sure of the best approach, but I'm just tired of doctors telling me to pay for their expensive a** laser.

I believe my scarring is more shallow, relative to other people who have more moderate to severe scarring, but rolling scars are fairly difficult to treat. And, I feel like my scarring looks worse when I wear makeup- which is the first picture I posted.

I'll probably PM beautifulambition, but I know that they will probably say that Dr. Rullan knows what he's talking about, lol.

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23 hours ago, dazzed said:

It's $500 just to see him????? Omg that's crazy.  Is it applied to any treatment?   I think I waited too long ugh.

 

Yeah the 500 dollars is the deposit to secure the appointment not the total cost. Next year to see rullan it will be 1750 USD and a 500 dollar deposit required which will go toward the treatment costs. Right now it’s 1500 usd and a 250 deposit to secure appointment. 

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2 hours ago, shei514 said:

Yeah the 500 dollars is the deposit to secure the appointment not the total cost. Next year to see rullan it will be 1750 USD and a 500 dollar deposit required which will go toward the treatment costs. Right now it’s 1500 usd and a 250 deposit to secure appointment. 

Can confirm. Deposited $500 for my treatment in November. Subcision went from 300 to 750 to 1000 to 1250. Seems like high demand is the cause of this. 

Edited by Wobbywob

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When say $1500, is that all three procedures included?  

He was significantly cheaper just less than a year ago.  So is it safe to assume you won't walk out of there spending less than $1000 a session?  

Edited by dazzed

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47 minutes ago, dazzed said:

When say $1500, is that all three procedures included?  

He was significantly cheaper just less than a year ago.  So is it safe to assume you won't walk out of there spending less than $1000 a session?  

I was quoted 1750 for Erbium, Subcision and Phenol cross as a package discount. Iirc, Amy said $2200~~ total if done separately. Best to email or call Amy and verify. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, dazzed said:

When say $1500, is that all three procedures included?  

He was significantly cheaper just less than a year ago.  So is it safe to assume you won't walk out of there spending less than $1000 a session?  

For the package it’s 1500 I was told by Amy. It will be rising to 1750 for the package which is significantly more expensive than it was earlier in the year at 1000 USD 

And yes that’s all three procedures when I say the package 

4 hours ago, Wobbywob said:

Can confirm. Deposited $500 for my treatment in November. Subcision went from 300 to 750 to 1000 to 1250. Seems like high demand is the cause of this. 

That’s an insane price jump 

I was told the price of goods has changed hence the price increase. 

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There is some serious miss info here. 

Comparing Kansas to LA-NYC-FL for prices and price shopping.  

Rullan has been for the past several years Over 1000 for his package treatment. Can't remember $500 maybe in the early 2000's. For a deposit sure. 

I would not get laser with Rullan so that's cheaper (get laser for someone who specializes in that), ... why is anyone microneedling with a Dr in this day and age. Perhaps his costs went up because he got a new Erbium laser or the PRP kit went up to do with your microneedling.  

Has anyone asked a basic question how much just Phenol Cross and Subcision is? Does that include a filler or not include a filler (Filler is expensive)?

How much is JUST subcision alone?

Can a perspective patient who treats with him ask bluntly why have you gone up in price - it's getting harder for me to pay and I would like to treat with you, and post here the response so there is not speculation. 

Your telling me for laser included it's 1750 right, so minus the laser and the microneedling and tell me the price. He was less for so many years than other Dr's, now he is well known, perhaps he needs to pay more staff to deal with all the patients. Possibly his insurance went up, or his lease on the building. Ask. His passion is peels and we all know this is a very expensive procedure. Facelifts in Hollywood can be upwards of 60K. Context my friends. 

If you want to price shop there is always Korea, Thailand, and the 3rd world.

The price of business is going up in CA, if you want to discuss that, ... business are moving to tax free haven zones. Nothing in life is free.

Lastly if you have other options for providers, you do not need to goto Rullan, I made a whole FAQ full of providers. Consult a few.

With all that said I think Acne scars should be covered under healthcare not not aesthetic procedures. Even places like AUS that they pay Medicare-social services-high taxes for their healthcare still have to pay fees for treatment with the rebates they are discounted. 

This site has launched many Dr's to become famous, and this is what happens. Less experience = cheaper price. But at least he is not Emer charging you $60K for his full production team, Photoshop expert, and glam... but giving Acne Scar treatments with unfavorable results I end up having to fix.  

Take home message. You DO NOT have to goto one Dr for all your treatments, use them as a tool not as a solution to gain success. 

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I think we all understand the rationale of the the price increases.   I was merely astonished at the RATE of how fast the prices are increasing, NOT about the fact that they are increasing.  

Edited by dazzed

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On 9/30/2019 at 10:51 PM, beautifulambition said:

There is some serious miss info here. 

Comparing Kansas to LA-NYC-FL for prices and price shopping.  

Rullan has been for the past several years Over 1000 for his package treatment. Can't remember $500 maybe in the early 2000's. For a deposit sure. 

I would not get laser with Rullan so that's cheaper (get laser for someone who specializes in that), ... why is anyone microneedling with a Dr in this day and age. Perhaps his costs went up because he got a new Erbium laser or the PRP kit went up to do with your microneedling.  

Has anyone asked a basic question how much just Phenol Cross and Subcision is? Does that include a filler or not include a filler (Filler is expensive)?

How much is JUST subcision alone?

Can a perspective patient who treats with him ask bluntly why have you gone up in price - it's getting harder for me to pay and I would like to treat with you, and post here the response so there is not speculation. 

Your telling me for laser included it's 1750 right, so minus the laser and the microneedling and tell me the price. He was less for so many years than other Dr's, now he is well known, perhaps he needs to pay more staff to deal with all the patients. Possibly his insurance went up, or his lease on the building. Ask. His passion is peels and we all know this is a very expensive procedure. Facelifts in Hollywood can be upwards of 60K. Context my friends. 

If you want to price shop there is always Korea, Thailand, and the 3rd world.

The price of business is going up in CA, if you want to discuss that, ... business are moving to tax free haven zones. Nothing in life is free.

Lastly if you have other options for providers, you do not need to goto Rullan, I made a whole FAQ full of providers. Consult a few.

With all that said I think Acne scars should be covered under healthcare not not aesthetic procedures. Even places like AUS that they pay Medicare-social services-high taxes for their healthcare still have to pay fees for treatment with the rebates they are discounted. 

This site has launched many Dr's to become famous, and this is what happens. Less experience = cheaper price. But at least he is not Emer charging you $60K for his full production team, Photoshop expert, and glam... but giving Acne Scar treatments with unfavorable results I end up having to fix.  

Take home message. You DO NOT have to goto one Dr for all your treatments, use them as a tool not as a solution to gain success. 

Actually, Korea isn't a far-fetched idea for me since I'm half Korean and have family in Korea; however, the cost of the plane ticket would cancel out any "savings" from their more affordable sessions/doctors. Hmmmm... My mom did recently offer to buy me a ticket to visit her in Korea, so maybe I should look into this option more.

So, I'm thinking that maybe I should look into subcision with Rullan or another doctor, then maybe just go to a good medspa (there's a great one down the road from me) for microneedling?

And then maybe go to Rullan for a phenoyl peel? There's not too much information on phenoyl peels as far whether the cost is worth it. I can understand if it's the final step to help with texture, but it sounds like it mostly helps with hyper pigmentation and the like. I'm actually kind of indifferent to my hyper pigmentation, haha. I just hate how my rolling scars are 10x worse when I apply makeup.

My main thing is that I haven't found a doctor that seems to be good with subcision- at least none that advertise it. I feel like the Texas market is a little limited/bare on scar experts unless someone here can prove me wrong. I'd love to be wrong, lol.

I'll look at your providers list to see who is closer to me. I didn't see a list before, but I'm still navigating the site.

 

On 10/1/2019 at 12:59 AM, dazzed said:

I think we all understand the rationale of the the price increases.   I was merely astonished at the RATE of how fast the prices are increasing, NOT about the fact that they are increasing.  

Yeah, it makes me a little sad that I didn't look to this website earlier. I would jump on a $1000 session. But, price in my market are also expensive- perhaps more so due to having a smaller dermatology/plastic surgeon market.

 

On 9/30/2019 at 10:10 PM, shei514 said:

For the package it’s 1500 I was told by Amy. It will be rising to 1750 for the package which is significantly more expensive than it was earlier in the year at 1000 USD 

And yes that’s all three procedures when I say the package 

That’s an insane price jump 

I was told the price of goods has changed hence the price increase. 

I think he's just busier nowadays so he increased his prices. I agree, though, it is a quick price jump.

 

On 9/30/2019 at 9:05 PM, Wobbywob said:

I was quoted 1750 for Erbium, Subcision and Phenol cross as a package discount. Iirc, Amy said $2200~~ total if done separately. Best to email or call Amy and verify. 

Hm, my session doesn't even include a laser treatment, which is fine, but it seems like getting a laser thrown in is better value (maybe?).

 

On 9/30/2019 at 5:56 PM, Wobbywob said:

Can confirm. Deposited $500 for my treatment in November. Subcision went from 300 to 750 to 1000 to 1250. Seems like high demand is the cause of this. 

Were these prices just for subcision?

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On 9/29/2019 at 10:57 PM, hlp334 said:

Have you thought about doing subcision/rf microneedling? I’ve only gotten one treatment so far with dr Weiner with that combo so I can’t fully attest  (I also think my scars are much deeper than yours) but even after just one I did see an improvement in overall texture and smoothness. I can see it giving good results since yours are shallower but I’d double check by private messaging “beautifulambition” on here for his opinion, because I’m just speculating. Just figured I’d mention as it’s around the same price as what you were quoted for Rullan.

Her scarring is similar to mine and so far I've responded to rf microneedling. Rf microneedling has overall good reviews, especially for these shallow, textural rolling scars.

Just something to consider. I'd still 100% get a phenol peel by Dr Rullan. 

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22 hours ago, Kay24 said:

Her scarring is similar to mine and so far I've responded to rf microneedling. Rf microneedling has overall good reviews, especially for these shallow, textural rolling scars.

Just something to consider. I'd still 100% get a phenol peel by Dr Rullan. 

Hm yeah. I'm thinking about looking into other stuff first and then MAYBE go to Rullan for the phenol as the final step.

I think that maybe doing subcision first and then doing some microneedling would be the better way to proceed. I'm not sure.

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Noo Weiner is in north Florida (panhandle area/Santa Rosa beach). Also wanted to point out that microneedling and RF microneedling like the Genius are realllly different. I did 4 sessions of regular microneedling before going on this website and it didn’t help the scarring (it did help with fine lines on forehead though) but my scars are deeper. Yeah, subcision is definitely the most important step imo because from what I’ve read on here if the tethers are still attached the other stuff won’t work as well and then fillers/cupping is to prevent the scars from re attaching. 

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19 hours ago, blairlikescats said:

Hm yeah. I'm thinking about looking into other stuff first and then MAYBE go to Rullan for the phenol as the final step.

I think that maybe doing subcision first and then doing some microneedling would be the better way to proceed. I'm not sure.

If you do microneedling go for infini rf. I saw more results from 1 rf than I did with 6 sessions of regular microneedling. My physician used genius rf which is just the latest update to the infini.

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7 hours ago, hlp334 said:

Noo Weiner is in north Florida (panhandle area/Santa Rosa beach). Also wanted to point out that microneedling and RF microneedling like the Genius are realllly different. I did 4 sessions of regular microneedling before going on this website and it didn’t help the scarring (it did help with fine lines on forehead though) but my scars are deeper. Yeah, subcision is definitely the most important step imo because from what I’ve read on here if the tethers are still attached the other stuff won’t work as well and then fillers/cupping is to prevent the scars from re attaching. 

 

3 hours ago, Kay24 said:

If you do microneedling go for infini rf. I saw more results from 1 rf than I did with 6 sessions of regular microneedling. My physician used genius rf which is just the latest update to the infini.

So, subcision first and then rf microneedling. Should I just go to Dr. Rullan for subcision? I guess I should get quotes for subcision where I am; however, I don't think we have great doctors for acne scarring in Austin, TX. From my understanding, subcision involves at lot more skill than laser procedures.

I should also email Rullan's office back and ask how much it is for just the subcision.

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