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sunday

causes for my acne - masturbation, lack of sleep, dairy

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I'm returning here after a long time... unfortunately with the same problem, under new circumstances. Cystic acne.

I actually spent a couple of years keeping things relatively well under control (uni life meant plenty of sleep, 10 - 11 hours even if I went to bed well past midnight). I ran the regimen for a couple of years at first, and then managed to keep things under control without a heavy need for BP. I have a feeling it stopped working after that unfortunately, perhaps my skin got used to it.

Over the same course of time (2007-2010) I managed to get a good grasp on the things that flared up my acne:

The first one I've seen Dan refute (I scoured ALL the material available back in 07-08), but unfortunately pleasuring myself excessively seems to fire up the cysts. Considering how often your average male does this, it's easy to get an accurate idea of the situation with years of sample data. If I can make myself lay off it for 3 days my face clears up, but that's not easy. So at least for my body, it's a fact.

The second is lack of sleep, which I'm sure plenty will agree on. In my case I found a clear cut difference between <7 hours (more acne, more cysts), 8 hours (acne gets worse or best case doesn't get any better), and 10+ hours (acne gets better, cysts start going down in size).

The third seems to be an excess in dairy. Increases seem to set off the cysts (milkshake phases are bad), and cutting it out completely showed marked improvements in the situation.

Now my problem is, I had these things under control to a reasonable extent, but recently moved out of home, to a new job, in a new country. I can't speak the language, and while I'm settling in okay.... the combo of paying for my own food (= more dairy because it's cheap and easy to keep myself full), long work hours (= 7-8 hours of sleep), and more staying at home alone at night (= excessive self pleasure) has ruined my control over my acne.

I know the obvious answer is to exercise some self control, but it's way easier said than done. I need to draw the line and make some serious changes though, because my once healed face is littered with cysts and in terms of scarring I'd have undone years of good work. I don't even care about that now because active cysts are a much bigger problem.

Appreciate any thoughts, help or advice.

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I think you have it so totally wrong about masturbation. Why would masturbation increase your acne anymore than having sexual intercourse with another person frequently? Sex is sex whether it is a shared experience, a group experience a solitary experience, digital, oral, anal or vaginal. Your logic on this eludes me. Let's suppose you had sexual partner and you had sex with them ten times a day. How is that different from masturbating ten times a day? The physiological impact on your system is exactly the same. In effect you are saying that having sex causes acne. That is so old in thinking.

If you are sleeping 7-8 hours per night, you are probably getting adequate sleep, as that is in the range of most people. Of course some people need nine or ten hours and some people get by on five or six hours.

Dairy, I will not comment about as some people seem to be affected by dairy products.

I think you are coming to some wrong conclusions. Maybe you better go see a dermatologist. Of course based on some of your earlier writings you are convinced that accutane si going to ruin your life. The evidence does not support that conclusion.

Joe Zit

Edited by Joe Zit
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Lack of sleep and adequate rest? absolutely. Excessive dairy intake? possibly if you are allergic. Maturbation? No. What is most likely going on with the very latter is a psychosomatic response or placebo effect to the stress you have over some underlying guilt or obsessive concern that it is exacerbating acne.

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Masturbation=Less stress, happy, refreshed.

Allot of people say something about hormones and testosterone and don't even have evidence. But when confronted all they says is "well everybody is different". Yet they don't explain or show REAL facts with links to sources on how those hormones released or retained cause acne.

Show some before and after pics or documentation of your findings.

If I can make myself lay off it for 3 days my face clears up, but that's not easy. So at least for my body, it's a fact.
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I'm so sick of people saying it's impossible for masturbation to cause acne. in some people it

does. I don't know why, messes up hormones possibly. But it does. I've tested this over the last 4 months, and my acne has gotten 80% worse over the following 3-5 days every single time. It's related in some people, and not in others.

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I'm so sick of people saying it's impossible for masturbation to cause acne. in some people it

does. I don't know why, messes up hormones possibly. But it does. I've tested this over the last 4 months, and my acne has gotten 80% worse over the following 3-5 days every single time. It's related in some people, and not in others.

Okay so you say, but does your acne flare when you have sex with another person? An orgasm is an orgasm and masturbation is just another sexual activity. What you are ultimately saying is that avoid any form of sexual activity, because masturbation is simply one form of it. This absolutely makes no sense.

BTW it is not just some people who say that masturbation NOT causes acne flare-ups, it's the medical community.

Joe Zit

Edited by Joe Zit
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Sleep could be a cause for me. I don't sleep the same time every night

and i don't always sleep for the same amount of time each night.

I don't snap one off that much maybe 2 or 3 times a month

and i've cut out milk products for about a year now.

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Okay so you say, but does your acne flare when you have sex with another person? An orgasm is an orgasm and masturbation is just another sexual activity. What you are ultimately saying is that avoid any form of sexual activity, because masturbation is simply one form of it. This absolutely makes no sense.

Why does this make no sense?

BTW it is not just some people who say that masturbation NOT causes acne flare-ups, it's the medical community.

Seems a good enough reason to question it.

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So if i say the cure for cancer is to stop masturbating and the cancer goes away on some people does that mean it was because of the masturbation? Would you say "everybody is different" and "why trust the medical community"....

Edited by acnegonenow
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So if i say the cure for cancer is to stop masturbating and the cancer goes away on some people does that mean it was because of the masturbation? Oh and my responses would be "everybody is different" and "why trust the medical community"....

Why do you classify masturbation as some kind of distinct activity above and beyond any other sexual act. Sex is sex, so why would masturbation somehow be different from other sexual activity? This makes absolutely no sense, and you have dodged this point previously. The same thing you do with your hand, happens in a mouth, an anus, or a vagina...so why would only masturbation cause acne? (Without trying to sound unkind, perhaps masturbation is your only sexual experience...in which case you need to test your hypothesis by engaging in sex with another person). If you told me that after engaging in sexual intercourse with another person or persons your acne flared, then I might begin to see that your argument has merit, but instead you have focused exclusively on one sexual act. In the end, sex is sex and if you fail to grasp that concept, then there is no point in trying to have a rational dialog.

As for trusting or not trusting the medical community, as imperfect as it is as some times, I will accept the findings of the medical community, which employs the scientific method to reach a conclusion over others whose observations are purely anecdotal and may see a cause and effect where there is in actuality none.

Joe Zit

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So if i say the cure for cancer is to stop masturbating and the cancer goes away on some people does that mean it was because of the masturbation? Oh and my responses would be "everybody is different" and "why trust the medical community"....

Why do you classify masturbation as some kind of distinct activity above and beyond any other sexual act. Sex is sex, so why would masturbation somehow be different from other sexual activity? This makes absolutely no sense, and you have dodged this point previously. The same thing you do with your hand, happens in a mouth, an anus, or a vagina...so why would only masturbation cause acne? (Without trying to sound unkind, perhaps masturbation is your only sexual experience...in which case you need to test your hypothesis by engaging in sex with another person). If you told me that after engaging in sexual intercourse with another person or persons your acne flared, then I might begin to see that your argument has merit, but instead you have focused exclusively on one sexual act. In the end, sex is sex and if you fail to grasp that concept, then there is no point in trying to have a rational dialog.

As for trusting or not trusting the medical community, as imperfect as it is as some times, I will accept the findings of the medical community, which employs the scientific method to reach a conclusion over others whose observations are purely anecdotal and may see a cause and effect where there is in actuality none.

Joe Zit

I said masturbation,sex,orgasm DOES NOT cause acne or at least theres no direct link....In the previous post i made an example of how people pose their arguments and how they can apply to any other medical condition and they respond with "everybody is different" and "why trust the medical community"

Edited by acnegonenow
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Recap:

OP: "For me, masturbation correlates to cystic acne."

Joe Zit: "Your argument has no merit because you have focused exclusively on one sexual act."

Not understanding where you're coming from, Joe.

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I came here for some support and advice, not an argument. I cannot believe some people.

I have been in the acne game for long enough to work out what sets off acne in my body. If you don't agree then that is a product of your own delusion. I am not saying masturbation is bad, and I'm not telling people not to do it - it actually sucks to be me because I get acne as a result of doing something that is natural, normal, and feels great.

Wake up and realise that not everything is certain, not everything you hear is fact; and there are more often than not - exceptions to the rule.

Recap:

OP: "For me, masturbation correlates to cystic acne."

Joe Zit: "Your argument has no merit because you have focused exclusively on one sexual act."

Not understanding where you're coming from, Joe.

Edited by sunday
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I came here for some support and advice, not an argument. I cannot believe some people.

I have been in the acne game for long enough to work out what sets off acne in my body. If you don't agree then that is a product of your own delusion. I am not saying masturbation is bad, and I'm not telling people not to do it - it actually sucks to be me because I get acne as a result of doing something that is natural, normal, and feels great.

Wake up and realise that not everything is certain, not everything you hear is fact; and there are more often than not - exceptions to the rule.

Recap:

OP: "For me, masturbation correlates to cystic acne."

Joe Zit: "Your argument has no merit because you have focused exclusively on one sexual act."

Not understanding where you're coming from, Joe.

Appreciate you reading before posting, apparently some other people haven't been gifted with simple comprehension abilities.

I'm so sick of people saying it's impossible for masturbation to cause acne. in some people it

does. I don't know why, messes up hormones possibly. But it does. I've tested this over the last 4 months, and my acne has gotten 80% worse over the following 3-5 days every single time. It's related in some people, and not in others.

It's good to know I'm not the only one. I presume it is some combination of hormones and stress (or getting worked up, not sure how to explain the joys of self pleasure haha) that sets it off. Personally I find it's not as bad with actual sex because it's over quicker, whereas masturbation tends to happen for longer and more often.

Personally I'd like to know how to reduce my desire for doing it - if I could change from once a day to once every three days, my acne would be under control. It sucks that everyone just assumes there is no correlation, because that also means that there won't be people thinking about solutions to the problem (that does in fact exist).

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Sunday,

Apologies for the empty post above. First, no one is trying to argue with you, but anything you post does require critical analysis. This is not an ad hominem attack on you nor on masturbation. Masturbation is a normal, healthy activity and it is REAL SEX. It has been observed in many other species as well. I am reminded that some people (including a former president of the United States don't regard oral sex as "real sex"...but it is).

It is possible to masturbate for a period of time just as lengthy as other forms of sexual activity. In sexual intercourse between a human male and a female, it is possible for a male to ejaculate in a minute or less. (I am sure that there are many female readers of these posts who have experienced this behavior with their male sexual partners).

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. You say that you are looking for advice, and you have observed a phenomenon within your own physiological make up. Since what you say flies in the face of conventional scientific knowledge, then why not get involved in a serious research project, that can prove your hypothesis?

I have been the the "acne game" probably a lot longer that you have (check my profile) and I think we know how to treat symptoms we know the mechanism of what causes the disease, but the remaining question is we do not know WHY IT HAPPENS? There are theories and indicators that hormones, genetics perhaps food allergies (although this is a bit controversial) all play a part...maybe we are dealing with multiple diseases that manifest the same symptoms and use the same mechanism that cause the disease but different triggers. The issue here, is that no clinical studies have been done that have concluded that masturbation causes acne.

If you believe that there is a cause and effect between your masturbation and acne break outs, then involve yourself in the research community as a test subject, then you will be helping all of us. Otherwise you are merely relating anecdotal information which people are seriously going to question.

Please do not become angry. No one is angry with you. You appear to be an educated person, so why not approach the issue in the context of the scientific method?

There are plenty of undocumented data on the internet, so why not take a more conventional approach and have your experience observed and documented.

If you believe that masturbation inflames your acne, simply do not masturbate and find willing sexual partners who will accommodate your needs, but again I would remind you that sex is sex and if you have sexual experiences with partners with the same frequency as you masturbate and your acne does not become worse, then maybe you are on to something.

I do not think that you are understanding where I am coming from. Science said at one time the earth was the center of the universe and that was disproven, but it was disproven scientifically. It took a long time. Simply relating something on a message board is not doing our community too much good, I am afraid.

Wishing you all the best and with respect,

Joe Zit

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Hi ..

Kind of new to the forum but figured I would add my response.

There is a study on the net for masturbation, sex, dropping a batch ect

and the direct relation it plays on testosterone lvls in males.

Of course I cant find the study when I need it. But will link it when I can find it again.

Basically they took X number of males ( I cant remember the exact number but 100 I think)

and took test lvls daily. With out any physical activity. ( working out ) Just day to day living.

Day 1: would be the day after sex ... of any kind. Test lvls normal

Day 2: No sex, Test lvls increased.

Day 3: No sex, Test lvls increased further.

Day 4: No sex, Test lvls increased further.

Day 5: No sex, Test lvls increased further.

Day 6: No sex, Test lvls increased further.

Day 7: No sex, Test lvls flat line or return to normal. Just as if you had sex or not.

Cycle starts over again

Just like females cycle through once a month and 90% complain that their worst breakouts are

around that time, males cycle through once a week.

As much as we have evolved were still animals and this study wasn't surprising.

Its been happening in the animal kingdom for thousands of years.

When we dont have sex, male body's build test lvls and

starts releasing endorphins to potentially attract there next mate to

spread the genes. Your boys have no idea if your in a long term relationship or not

so having a steady partner will not affect this cycle.

When males have sex of any kind there test lvls increase slightly and for a "very brief" period of

time basically to tell the boys its time to make more solders but the lvl of test increase was not near as notable compared to days 2 to 6 of test increase in the male body from not having sex.

They also found in all male test subjects that when exposed to 10 mins of porn, thinking dirty thoughts or a nice looking gal sitting in front of them in a slinky dress brought an increase in test lvls by %100 on any given day, but returned to near normal after sex.

So basically you don't even have to have sex or masturbate for your testosterone lvls to increase or decrease. Your testosterone lvls are all ways fluctuating day to day. How that plays on your bodys acne breakouts is up to your body.

Conclusion... for males, if your worried about increasing your test lvls through sex of any kind because it affects your acne, your dammed if you do, dammed if you don't. Find a happy medium

Edited by Raden
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Joe Zit -

I appreciate what you're trying to say this time round, but unfortunately I will have to selfishly decline. It's upsetting enough that I'm back here again, and I have no interest in becoming a research subject nor writing a thesis about something that I have a vested interest in purely because it brings me down.

I got the vibe that you thought I was some anti-masturbation freak, and just want to rectify that I am not - I think it is great, and if not for the resultant acne flare ups, I would do it in much of my spare time (as bad as that is for any sort of self development). Like I said, I suspect sex doesn't have quite the same effect on me because (I'm not ashamed to admit) it doesn't last nearly as long. If I had sex as much as I masturbated, I'm confident the results would be the same.

Like I said I am very aware of this being a clear cut cause for acne in MY body and don't really need to research or convince the world that it's true. It might not be the case for 10 billion others. But I am interested in solving my problem, hence this thread. Judging by the responses it might be useful to at least one other person.

Raden -

Interesting stuff, although I suspect it is not testosterone that is the issue. I should elaborate a little and say that if I don't actually ejaculate, the problem doesn't seem to occur (or be nearly as bad). There is something I have wondered that might be relevant - sperm has a high level of zinc, could it be that excessive you-know-what could deplete zinc levels in the body? Or perhaps something else in sperm that is being depleted? I suspected zinc because of the documented connection to skin conditions.

For the record, in my case I'm talking about ejaculation more than once a day, especially more than once in a row. Just so we're clear. :)

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Joe Zit -

I appreciate what you're trying to say this time round, but unfortunately I will have to selfishly decline. It's upsetting enough that I'm back here again, and I have no interest in becoming a research subject nor writing a thesis about something that I have a vested interest in purely because it brings me down.

I got the vibe that you thought I was some anti-masturbation freak, and just want to rectify that I am not - I think it is great, and if not for the resultant acne flare ups, I would do it in much of my spare time (as bad as that is for any sort of self development). Like I said, I suspect sex doesn't have quite the same effect on me because (I'm not ashamed to admit) it doesn't last nearly as long. If I had sex as much as I masturbated, I'm confident the results would be the same.

Like I said I am very aware of this being a clear cut cause for acne in MY body and don't really need to research or convince the world that it's true. It might not be the case for 10 billion others. But I am interested in solving my problem, hence this thread. Judging by the responses it might be useful to at least one other person.

Raden -

Interesting stuff, although I suspect it is not testosterone that is the issue. I should elaborate a little and say that if I don't actually ejaculate, the problem doesn't seem to occur (or be nearly as bad). There is something I have wondered that might be relevant - sperm has a high level of zinc, could it be that excessive you-know-what could deplete zinc levels in the body? Or perhaps something else in sperm that is being depleted? I suspected zinc because of the documented connection to skin conditions.

For the record, in my case I'm talking about ejaculation more than once a day, especially more than once in a row. Just so we're clear. :)

Hey buddy I have some info for you.

"Hormone changes during puberty. During puberty, girls have an increase in male sex hormones called androgens. This increase causes the glands to get larger and make more sebum."

Men expirience a similar increase in these hormones, especially during periods of sexual activity (incl. masturbation). Over production of sebum is the biggest cause of acne. Also a little more about about androgens: they play a major role in sperm production so if you ejaculate and increase the demand on sperm production, you incur a need for more androgens. I hope your following the pattern here.

I hope that answers some of your questions & wish you the best with your skin care :genius:

source:

http://www.womenshealth.gov/faq/acne.cfm

Note: in my personal experience I've noticed a healthy skin glow, and improvement of my acne after sex so I'm not exactly sure where my thoughts lie with all this. As for sleep, less sleep = more stress for me and more stress = more blemishes. Dairy is a natural allergen so it doesn't surprise me that this would cause some people troubles but I have yet to see enough research convincing me of a serious tie between diet and acne.

Edited by hockeymc16
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