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rainrunner

Acne Experience/Theories - From Germany

Hello,

I am from Germany, an I am a member of the "aknewelt.de" forum, probably Germany's best Acne-board - it is very similar to this board here, people try to help each other and try to explore known and selfmade acne theories.

Some people of our board do also read your board sometimes, mostly because of interesting acne-theories.

I am sorry - I do not speak english very well, it's only the little english I learned at school, decades of years ago.

I am suffering from Acne for more than 20 years now, I am 35 years old, male, and this means that I do have adult-acne.

I did never take Accutane or similar, didn't want that because of its known side-effects, like shrinking the sebaceous glands... well, I think you know these...

I just wanted to bring in a few experiences I personally made within the last years, concerning acne.

So, here we go:

A few years ago, one moring I discovered that drinking camomile-tea significantly reduced my acne. I kinda had "stomach problems" so I drank one big cup of camomile-tea each morning. I had bread with honey for breakfast every morning, I ate many carbohydrates that time and my acne faded away. Acne disappeard for more than 3 months, and suddenly the camomile-tea lost its force and acne came back.

Camomile tea didn't help me anymore ever since!

I do not know yet what camomile-tea exactly did, but camomile is said to actually have a kind of antibiotic-effect. I wonder if it did reduce any sort of bacteria in the intestine... I think its like that, and I think the bacteria got used to this kind of "antibiotic" after a while.

One girl from Austria, a member of our board went to a chinese-doctor and got a mixture of chinese-herbals, it was also tea, and she had really STRONG acne and after a while her acne was gone, because of this tea. I asked her for the ingredients of this mixture and she wrote it down, but this mixture was quite complex, especially made from her "TCM" doctor for her.

I never tried this mixture, because I didn't find out where to get the ingredients from.

An other experience I made with pills that are called "Enzym Lefax" in Germany. Those are pills containing "pancreatic enzymes", from pigs. I took one pill with every meal, especially when eating carbohydrates, like bread, pasta...

These pills also helped me to reduce acne, maybe because there have not been so much undigested carbohydrates, like soluble suggars, that reached the colon undigested ? I really don't know. Or maybe the pancreas did not have to release so much Insuline while taking these pills? I am sure some of you know about Insuline --> DHT --> Testosterone relation.

I stopped taking these pills, after eating 100 pills or such, because I had some fear, that these enzymes will prevent my pancreas from producing enzymes in the future. I did not want to "gamble". My acne was reduced by the pills, often very significantly!

Then I did an other experiment - I took some pills called "Bicanorm" - these are pills that contain "natriumbicarbonate" or better "Sodiumbicarbonate" packed with an acid-resistant covering, this will prevent the stomach's hydrochloric-acid from destroying the bicarbonate! after passing the stomach they will release the bicarbonate!

I tried these pills, because I sufferded from acid-reflux or do you say "heartburn" ? I think you know what I mean. I thought that this "reflux" could increase my acne.

These pills also helped me a lot - especially when eating carbohydrates.

I don't exactly know how it worked, but I found a lot of stuff in the net, that does have some theory in it.

So it is sayed that these two pancreatic enzymes can only fully do its work if there is no hydrochloric acid within the duodenum! The duadenum must be "neutral" in PH-value, because hydrochloric-acid destroyes pancreas enzymes!

So pancreas normally produces natriumbicarbonate, too! Thats obviously very important. If there is to much gastric-acid in the duodenum, then some carbohydrates/fats may reach the colon and maybe will cause the growth in bacteria in the intestine - maybe causing acne because of creating a kind of "physical" stress within the body, which maybe could release some stress-hormones, that trigger DHT and Testosterone --> acne.

I couldn't fully figure that out. its difficult. it might be theory or not.

I also had some experience with "diarrhea" -

one day I had diarrhea, I already noticed that my skin became worse one day before having diarrhea! I wondered why? My theory: there are some substances within the feces that increase acne! So if I do have diarrhea, the liquid within the colon maybe will wash out these "substances" and they might cause trouble within the body!

That time I had diarrhea for a few days... and after having it for 2 days my acne got better! I think that is, because the body got rid of "feces" twice a day!

Later I did some experiments to "force diarrhea" - I took "lactulose-sirup" which kind of causes diarrhea. I noticed the same thing... a few hours after taking this stuff, my acne tended to get worse... when taking it longer acne got something better... but it never was completely gone with it.

Next I tried Low-Carb diet - kind of Atkinson diet - you know.

That was the best acne-cure I had. After about 3 months acne was completely gone! But I could not resist in eating carbohydrates again. I also had problems when not eating carbohydrates... many problems, with lack of potassium, problems with my eyes... I could not sleep anymore... you know, stuff like that, that was hard... Low Carb was very helpful, but I had too many difficulties with it... so I gave up, but I know that it will help me 100% if I would do it again!

My skin was totally dry, like paper, during Low-Carb - not fatty like it was before - that was my biggest and most important experience!

I am not sure if this works like Insuline --> DHT --> Testosterone

This seems kind of "too simple!" but it might be right... I don't know.

I also experienced that i lost libido during Low-Carb diet - I did'n need/want any sex! That was totally odd! I think Low-Carb totally decreased my Testosterone/DHT or combined hormones! That was the reason.

I had some other experiences - if I eat bananas or orange, or if I drink multi-vitamine drinks, or eat lots of chocolate my acne gets worse, within a few hours. To me vegetables are better than fruits! Maybe because of fructose within fruits... or to much acid in fruits --> PH-value in duodenum... pancreas... see above. I don't know.

Also having much sex affects my acne quite strong! - this is probably because of testosterone - sex increases Testosterone and/or DHT. This is very well known. Testosterone will affect the sebaceous glands.

I also read today, that on animals cold temperature will "erect" their hairs, thus squeezing the sebaceous glands --> fatty/oily skin! Maybe this is a reason why some people do have more acne problems if there is cold temperature. I don't know.

The latest experience, i made was when taking pills to decrease blood-pressure. I have a slightly increased blood-pressure like 140/95 or such, therefor I got some pills from my doctor. A substance called "Metoprolol"

So I took these pills and I noticed that my akne faded away - I wondered why?

So I did a research and found out that "metoprolol" strongly decreases Testosterone (!) This is well known. The problem is, if my blood-pressure is normal, like now, 120/80, I can not take these pills... ;-)

Also I noticed, like with Low-Carb diet, that libido is down when taking these pills... don't need sex... well... loss in Testosterone, I think. ;-)

I also found out that zinc-pills increase my acne - many people get better skin if they use zinc. So i read about zinc and it is said that zinc increases Testosterone - so thats probably the problem in MY case.

I really noticed that ANY increase in Testosterone increases my acne.

I always try to see "the big picture" - and I think acne is caused by hormon-imbalance, which is caused by many different things, but mainly the "food" we eat.

The last days I read something about "Iodine-acne" and "chlorine-acne" -

Especially "chlorine-acne" was of interest to me - it is said that "chlorinated hydrocarbons" do cause very bad acne, if exposed to these chemicals! Many workers in early days did suffer from it, when working with these chemicals. If they suffer, it looks like very bad acne, with big pimples.

I asked myself why? Then I read something, that animals do store "chlorinated hydrocarbones" within their "fatty tissue". As far as I know chlorinated hydrocarbones are also very good "fat solvents"!

So, what I want to say: might there be a small similarity between "chlorine-acne" and "usual acne"? Both make pimples.

We always think that a high testosterone level increases fat/oil production within the skin.

Did anyone notice that sometimes "sebaceous" within the skin is sometimes more fluid and sometimes more "stiff" in consistence? Sometimes it really looks like that, because some days one can easily squeeze out pimples and on other days it is impossible, with "inflammation" deep unter the skin!

I asked myself if there might be a "hardening process" of "sebaceous" within the skin? I mean, not only the hardening due to "oxygene" in the air, causing normal "blackheads"

Does anyone have some studies about how "sebaceous" is exactly produced within the skin? Which substances are involeved in producing sebaceous?

My theory: The body stores fat within fat-tissue, this fat is from "unused" carbohydrates. Saved energy. So what does this fat consist of? I think the body synthesizes "triglycerides" that later form any fats/oil/sebaceous.

The sebaceous might be synthsized from the fat-tissue, or it might be synthsized "on the fly" - i mean, directly, after eating carbohydrates.

Maybe thats the reason why "LowCarb" diet often helps people... when doing a Low-Carb diet, the body does NOT really store/change carbohydrates within tissue. As we know it is very hard to gain weight during Low-Carb.

Might there be an unknown process that adds some molecules to maybe "triglycerides" exactly the time when sebaceous is produced? Molecules that might harden sebaceous? I don't know, its just a theory.

It might be "simple chemistry" - like hardening fats/oils with help of some "substances" - something like that, but much more complex! I don't know.

I think of it as a kind of "isotopic sebaceous" or "isotopc fat/oil" which is harder/stiffer than normal sebaceous and causes problems within the skin!

So, an increase in insuline/DHT/testosterone could still cause acne problems, only the sebaceous is harder! - if the sebaceous is harder/stiffer than normal, then even a lower Testosteron level will have the same effect, concerning pimples... glands will clog even faster!

THIS IS JUST A THEORY !

I don't have any studies how sebaceous production works in detail... to get deeper into it. But maybe people suffering acne do produce different sebaceous/fat/oil within their skin? Some kind of mutated fat/oil... as a result of unknown substances that are produced in our body?

So, that's all for now - quite a long posting already!

Just wanted to share these things. Thanks for reading. :)

greets

rainrunner

Edited by rainrunner

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wow that was very interesting........although i only know carbonhydrates is bad for acne due to the high starch amount where the body had problems digesting it so some of the toxins are released through the skin by the liver causin acne..

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heehee3 -

I think that the carbohydrates do cause a liver problem - no, wait.... bacteria causes this liver problem.

I also did an experiment with "Mariendistel" ... wait... what is it called in english... "ladie's thistle" or "milk thistle"? extract ...the substrance is called "Syllimarin".

I did this test with a girl from your board - she does not really have acne, but she obviously suffers from very oily skin. So we both decided to do a test with this substance, it is known to be a very good liver-supporting substance... so liver should work twice as good as normal or such... :D

Well, "Syllimarin" did not really help any of us.

I really think the problem is caused by undigested carbohydrates that do reach the colon. I think then some sort of bacteria starts digesting those carbohydrates within the colon... maybe they do not only produce "gas" they might produce by-products, like "toxines". Maybe the body absorbs those toxines, because the colon/large intestine does absorb water and maybe these toxines are soluble.

maybe thats the reason why i always notice problems the time i get "diarrhea" - i only nocticed those problems within the first 2 days... those are the days when maybe the fluid washes out some toxines from the feces.

These toxines might reach the liver - or maybe these toxines do cause "physical stress" within the body... which increases "stress hormones" because it might be similar to "intoxication" ...if this happes, then it really seems like the body does release stress hormones... causing "circulation problemes" or something like these.

it is really crazy - because i did not have any problems the time i did LowCarb diet. So either the carbohydrates itself do cause these problems (insuline, hormones) or the bacteria does... or maybe both of them.

I also think that the above mentioned "Bicanorm" and "Enzyme Lefax" experiment is linked to this... because it seems that both experiments did help me to better digest carbohydrates/fats.

In the first experiment there have been more enzymes to digest carbohydrates and in the second one maybe the "bicarbonate" did help to make the pancreatic enzymes more effective, because some of it might have been destroyed by too much gastric acid within the duodenum.

Edited by rainrunner

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one more thought -

in my early "acne days" i got Antibiotics "Doxycycline" from the doctor -

they did help in the beginning, but later they lost its effect. My acne got very bad AFTER antibiotic lost its effect - it was horror!

I think the bacteria within the intestine got resistant to it and also the acne-bacteria within the skin! I think the same happened when drinking camomille-tea! They got resistant to this substance! Different antibiotic substances may have different effects on this bacteria. I think camomilla-tea is a very mild antibiotic... but it helped me even after "doxycycline" lost its effect.

I also think that diffent people do have different bacteria inside the colon, since they do mutate very fast and every day... you know... bacteria is a master in mutation! ;) you can hardly beat em!

After doing the LowCarb diet acne was completely gone - i could even eat lot of carbohydrates for some weeks without any problems!

I think there is a kind of "healing" in the intestine during LowCarb diet !

There might be bacteria which do "eat" undigested carbohydrates - in the colon there is thousands of different bacteria. So if you do a LowCarb diet you take the "food" away from those bacteria, I mean, you take the carbohydrates away and the bacteria kinda dies or something.... or there might be only a few of them!

So if you start eating carbohydrates again, they might begin to grow again... and if they are TOO much, one maybe will get "intoxinated" by their byproducts, causing stresshormones ---> acne.

Edited by rainrunner

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one more thing -

Some people on our german board tried LowCarb diet - many of them do have success, others say they don't ! I think the problem is, it can take quite a long time until bacteria dies !

During Low Carb I tested different things.... acne was almost gone.... and only ONE spoon full of sugar caused pimples in my face, after about 3 days!

When I did Low Carb diet it was VERY hard !

0% sugar! No Potatoes, no rice, no bread, no sweets... i only ate protein from meat, fish, some cheese (be carfull of lactose) and some milk (be carfull of lactose) - I did not eat any fruits because of sugar (fructose) - i only ate vegetables with low carbohydrates <4,5 grams/100 gram.

so it was more like a "no carb" diet --> causing me some problems, with loss in minerals! It was hard, but it helped me 100% !

so the difficult part is, that most people who try LowCarb do always consume a sort of carbohydrates... if they know it or not (hidden carbohydrates) one must always read the label on produced-foods... if there is any suggar in it.... its hard!

so if you reduce bacteria during REAL low carb lets say 50% and if you eat one spoon full of sugar, the remaining 50% in your intestine will probably grow 20% within the next 3 days !

that could be a real problem then! because it could be like 3 steps forward, 4 steps backwards... you know!

AND there MIGHT be even bacteria that do eat rest of proteins or even fat!

well in my case i think there were not any of these, but it might be possible!

in this case Low Carb might not help!

Edited by rainrunner

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heehee3 -

yes, I asked myself this question quite often! ;-)

maybe the key to defeat acne is to give up eating TOO much carbohydrates!

like in "Buddhism".... just living from air *LOL* ;-)))

when i was a teenager I really loved sweets and stuff like that... and pasta... maybe that was the reason for my acne. I think I kind of really "breeded" bacteria within my intestine... :-))

as we all know the surface of the intestine is VERY large... as big as a football-field... this is a good home for all kinds of bacteria. I once read that if you would take all the bacteria within the intestine and would weight it, it would be more than 1 kilogram bacteria in weight! That's almost unbelievable.

I am doing a low-carb diet mixed with mid-carb at the moment and I really do see success also!

so, it is like 2 or 3 days eating almost whithout carbohydrates, like ham&eggs, fish/meat +vegetabels, or even "sausages+sauerkraut"... and maybe on the third day I do eat carbohydrates, like meat+french fries, or gingerbread for breakfast.

it is just to keep those "carbohydrate eating bacteria" at a low level.

to me it works, 3 weeks ago I had some really bad cysts on my cheek, or at the ear... they are completely gone... reduced to very tiny pimples from time to time.

during STRICT low carb (or almost no-carb) i also had quite problems with wound-healing, i noticed that this was quite sub-optimal to get good skin!

but at the moment I really try to reduce carbohydrates whereever I can.

Maybe the best effect would be if someone uses antibiotics for the first time and the same time doing a low-carb diet ! because the antibiotics might reduce the bacteria to almost zero, and this will help to save time ! but the most important thing is to keep carbohydrates even reduced AFTER taking the antibiotics!

I really think that people that do have adult acne will have this bacteria in their intestine FOREVER ! 1 bacteria will survive and reproduce itself... you know... i think one can't kill them all! and thats the problem! one can only reduce them to minimum.

Edited by rainrunner

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I found an interesting "study" today - concerning "bacteria theory" - this also might be connected to acne!

That's kinda what I think is the cause of acne - bacteria in the intestine.

Actually i found an article in german, then I googled for "Samuel Buck Washington" (the one who made a study) and found this article:

http://www.bioedonline.org/news/news.cfm?art=2554

you may find some other articles on that.

in the german text it is also mentioned that maybe the "weight" of a person depends on which bacteria in the intestine you have and how many of them...

it is said that mice having special bacteria inside are more fat than those which do not have this bacteria.

that's quite interesting, since people suffering from acne are mostly very light-weighted people, thin people...

lets imagine one does have the carbo-eating bacteria: if you have them they will produce byproducts, maybe like toxines.... those are maybe "thin people" ...if you don't have them you don't have byproducts... but this might be the fat people.... kinda like that...

Edited by rainrunner

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