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scarcrash

Regeneration of Human Scar Tissue with Topical Iodine

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Med Hypotheses. 2009 May;72(5):553-61. Epub 2009 Jan 24.

Successful human scar regeneration by topical iodine: a case report: an interim (3.5 year) summary.

Derry DM.

Control of regeneration and wound healing are scientific and clinical objectives. In 1997, topical Lugol's iodine solution applied daily for 3 days to a 50 year old facial scar lead to hyperemic scar tissue. As a working hypothesis, the author proposed topical iodine could initiate, control and complete human scar regeneration. In 2005, after collecting three more surgical scars, topical iodine applications began. Within 3 days all four scars started regenerating. Stopping topical iodine halted the process. Within a week an appropriate adult scar formed. Digital cameras recorded events. Regeneration is complex and slow. Its appearance depends on whether scar is covered with plastic or open. Iodine's chemical properties are discussed along with their reaction with epithelial cells. As there are no visible signs detectable changes from oral iodine on regeneration, details of iodine staining are more thoroughly described. Not all, but most important results are presented. Topical iodine induces hair growth in and around scars. Hair is regeneration's workhorse, moving purposefully in all directions under arrector pili muscle power delivering regenate material accurately to scar tissues and coordinating centers. In addition, hair repeatedly self amputates possibly strengthening regenerating tissues. Two types of regenate material show under plastic wrap: white and globular. The white regenate appears and behaves somewhat like snow, but can be yellow, green or brown depending iodine content. The globular form of regenate material maybe derived from white regenate material with hair's help. Globular regenate material is larger, nondescript, variable in size and color (depends on iodine content) and seemed usually associated with hair. There are two centrally placed coordinating centers 5 mm apart on major scars. Wrist centers have a palpable, but not visible ridge, between them whereas abdominal centers do not. Wrist centers lasted through all regeneration of the wrist scar, whereas abdominal centers were only present for about 18 months before falling off. This paper summarizes and adds to previous preliminary reports. The 50 year old scar regenerated completely 2 years ago. Small experiments on regeneration are possible because it is a slow process and more importantly can be stopped and started at will. These results support the proposed hypothesis topical iodine initiates, controls, and completes human scar regeneration.

PMID: 19168293 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19168293

_______________________________________________________________________________

Abstract: Since Spallanzini first described salamander limb regeneration in 1769, there has been slow progress in understanding this process. Potential treatment benefits from regeneration are worth the effort. A hypothesis that topical iodine would regenerate human scar tissue is tested by applying Lugol’s solution to four scars of various sizes, degree of damage, and location for variable lengths of time. Regeneration starts a few days after applying iodine and stops and forms adult scar if applications are discontinued. One face scar has completely regenerated. The wrist scar’s terminal stages are being studied. The remaining two scars on the abdomen are behaving as if they are one and could take considerably longer to complete. Waiting for completion delays availability of this information for scientists, physicians, and patients. For the past three years, Nikon Cool Pix cameras recorded regeneration changes. Regenate material found under plastic wraps on the scars comes in two forms, snow-like and globular. Their function is unknown. Two black dots both 5 mm apart seen on the wrist and abdominal scar store iodine and appear to coordinate regeneration. Hair is the regeneration workhorse and does an amazing number of things. Amongst the hair activities are free movement to any cell within its range in any direction and self-amputation possibly to strengthen regenerating tissue. Hair delivers regenate material and may be sending cell signals by touch, regenate material, and electrical impulses. The hypothesis that topical iodine in the form of Lugol’s solution regenerates human scar tissue back to normal is supported by these preliminary findings.

http://www.thyroidscience.com/cases/Derry....egen.6.7.08.pdf

Edited by scarcrash

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Haha... if this is true, the thing is, most of us wouldn't be walking around with dark stains on our faces :hand:

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I'm trying this procedure since three weeks. Of course it is not possible to wear the staining iodine (lugols) the whole day on my face, but I do it rigorously every night. Till now I do not see any differences in the apperiance of my scars, but is also to early. The problem is that I do not recognize the mentioned redness of the treated scars. Dr. Dery mentioned that this is part of the modelling process and should appear after four days. Please can anybody tell me if I do anything wrong. I do not use the plastic wrap (it should'nt be very important). Thank you

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You can't just do it every night, it has to be continous, like maybe if you take off the staining for 4-5 hours and come back home and immediately apply it again, the regeneration won't be halted too much, otherwise you are just restarting every day.

And the wrap is not neccesary.

Edited by Scars4Life

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I'm trying this procedure since three weeks. Of course it is not possible to wear the staining iodine (lugols) the whole day on my face, but I do it rigorously every night. Till now I do not see any differences in the apperiance of my scars, but is also to early. The problem is that I do not recognize the mentioned redness of the treated scars. Dr. Dery mentioned that this is part of the modelling process and should appear after four days. Please can anybody tell me if I do anything wrong. I do not use the plastic wrap (it should'nt be very important). Thank you

Are you using oral lugols?

I have noticed that my 5% lugols that is designed for drops in drinking water does not make the tissues as hypermic like my other 5% bottle of lugols. (IMO this suggests people falsely sell lugols saying it is one strength when it is weaker. To the extent I'm considering making my own)

Also, has anyone notice that when you apply the plastic wrap the stain goes quicker, but the tissues tend to get bruised quicker?

And does any reckon when the stain goes with the plastic wrap, should I restain the tissues, or wait until the next day?

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I still think this is only for hypertrophic scars, not atrophic :( Although I am not sure if hair grows in my atrophic regions. If it doesn;t and this forces hair growth through those regions then maybe I am onto something.

Edited by ylem

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Well first off hair never grows on a scar, maybe around it. I know Lugol's is suppose to cause hair to grow around the scar but I'm not so sure whether it actually eventually causes hair to grow in the scar itself, though last I read it seems like it did.

But my concern was that the only scar that he supposely completely regenerated, was a facial scar caused by a mole excision. And says it regenerated in 6 months. Even though he says that every scar he is aware of, should be able to get treated with iodine, I don't really know how it will work for sunken scars, as it not only has to remodel the surface but also somehow restore the lost fat and muscle, which is pretty much the real cause of the sunken scar, back to normal.

I'm hopping someone will explain this to me, crash my hopes/bring my hopes up, its all good, just keep it real with me.

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Well first off hair never grows on a scar, maybe around it. I know Lugol's is suppose to cause hair to grow around the scar but I'm not so sure whether it actually eventually causes hair to grow in the scar itself, though last I read it seems like it did.

But my concern was that the only scar that he supposely completely regenerated, was a facial scar caused by a mole excision. And says it regenerated in 6 months. Even though he says that every scar he is aware of, should be able to get treated with iodine, I don't really know how it will work for sunken scars, as it not only has to remodel the surface but also somehow restore the lost fat and muscle, which is pretty much the real cause of the sunken scar, back to normal.

I'm hopping someone will explain this to me, crash my hopes/bring my hopes up, its all good, just keep it real with me.

Scars4life-Since i've been dermarolling and doing saline injections my scars have been regenerating and i have hair (beard hair) growing from where the scar is/was.I use iodine after a 1.5mm roll and leave it on for 1 hour...but mainly for wound care,never heard of regeneration before,but its interesting.

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Well first off hair never grows on a scar, maybe around it. I know Lugol's is suppose to cause hair to grow around the scar but I'm not so sure whether it actually eventually causes hair to grow in the scar itself, though last I read it seems like it did.

But my concern was that the only scar that he supposely completely regenerated, was a facial scar caused by a mole excision. And says it regenerated in 6 months. Even though he says that every scar he is aware of, should be able to get treated with iodine, I don't really know how it will work for sunken scars, as it not only has to remodel the surface but also somehow restore the lost fat and muscle, which is pretty much the real cause of the sunken scar, back to normal.

I'm hopping someone will explain this to me, crash my hopes/bring my hopes up, its all good, just keep it real with me.

Scars4life-Since i've been dermarolling and doing saline injections my scars have been regenerating and i have hair (beard hair) growing from where the scar is/was.I use iodine after a 1.5mm roll and leave it on for 1 hour...but mainly for wound care,never heard of regeneration before,but its interesting.

Interesting! What kind of iodine do you use after you roll? Where do you buy it at? I'd like to try it as well...

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Interesting "testimonial" I found on the web about the application of iodine to facial scarring:

"15 years ago I was in a terrible auto accident. I was left with a large scar on my face, and have lived with it for a long time. After talking to a friend who is using iodine, I too got some and have been applying it to my scar daily now for 3 weeks. This thing is fading! Just like you said, the Iodine is taking away the old cells and the body is replacing them with new ones and day by day that scar is going away, after 15 years of "miracle creams" and magic potions supposed to remove scars, this simple bottle is really doing it!"

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Now that you mentioned it, I do seem to remember many claims of iodine, though its primary uses were for hypertropic scars.

hope just never seems to rise for the little guys.

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Thanks for the additional info.

I bought some Lugol's solution (5%) from Amazon. I have used it consecutively for about 5 nights now (I apply before I go to bed). It really dries out my skin. I need to wear makeup b/c I have a lot of discoloration (hypopigmentation) and the dryness makes it difficult to apply makeup properly. Kinda like when you are peeling after TCA.

Has anyone else experienced this drying effect from using Lugol's?

Best.

C.

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Can't you just buy iodine tincture at a drug store? Is it the same thing as the Lugol's solution?

I did research this a bit more online and found nothing indicating this helps pitted acne scars. And I would take the doctor's comments with a grain of salt. Take it from me, I have been to many many doctors about acne scars and have been told many lies by MD's, so don't get too excited.

Edited by ylem

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I bought mine online. Is this stuff any good ?

http://www.jcrowsmarketplace.com/1ozlugols...esshipping.aspx

And bought this stuff too.

http://www.jcrowsmarketplace.com/2ozlugols...esshipping.aspx

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000X843V...x_ya_oh_product (iodine pills)

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00076HSV...x_ya_oh_product (DMHO for absorbtion)

Is the doctor from vancouver aware of this thread. Maybe you could mention it to him, hopefully he can post some methods on proper application.

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And you won't find any evidence whatsoever. There are barely a hand full of cases and almost no one knows about this. And usually if something can fix one scar it should fix another. Now all these procedures, fillers, lasers, dermabrasion, they don't fix scars, they just kinda alter everything, make skin tighter, peel away skin, filled it up, and If you're lucky it might work for you. Now if this can actually cause a regeneration, then there is some hope. So yeah try it, you don't have much to lose, everyone is trying lasers with that huge price tag and in many cases makes your skin even worse, this couldn't be any worse.

Edited by Scars4Life

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Hey everyone from the other thread.

I have been applying a fairly strong concentration of Lugol's to a 15yo surface abrasion scar near my elbow for about 5 days now.

It's the kind of scar where you scrape your skin and a large scab appears although the wound was never particuarly deep. Eventually when it heals you end up with an area of permanently smooth and lighter-colored scar tissue in the area that was under the scab.

Anyway, after several days I think I am seeing the beginnings of body hairs growing through the scar tissue. There were not any visible body hairs growing through the scar before I started the Lugols. I believe this is a change that the Lugols is causing.

The scar tissue itself does not appear to be changed in any other visible way. It does not feel like a wound that is healing (no itching/inflammation at the site).

What I am starting to see does appear to match the doc's particular comments about causing hair growth through a scar. Even if the iodine treatment never heals the scarring, then at least it appears this portion of the doc's stories/theories may have merit IMO. The doc's theory about the healing being caused "from the bottom up" would makes sense to explain this. If nothing else I understand how/why he would draw that conclusion.

I will keep you guys posted.

Edited by lac

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guys, is anything supposed to happen when you apply lugols?

ive only applied mine for 3 days but i hear people saying it gives them a stinging sensation or burning sensation for a short while. or that it causes their skin to peel or itch. anything along those lines.

personally it hasnt given me any of these things, so it gives me the impression that im doing something wrong or that my lugols solution isnt strong enough or somethig. i just paint the lugols on with a cotton wool ball and thats it, the staining fades but tends to stick with me all day more or less.

any thoughts/ideas?

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Cartwheeling_Monkey,

I have tired moisturizing. The problem is that after several days of consecutive application, the stained skin becomes leathery just like after a TCA peel and starts peeling. I suppose if I am going to continue to apply Lugol's, I may as well get used to it.

I had severe acne as a teen so I have rolling scars across my forehead and a few on my temples. My cheeks are the problem. The scarring is atypical. After CO2 laser, I ended up with large patches of scarring on both cheeks. It is very uneven but does not look like rolling or pitted scarring. It looks more like burned tissue. It is hypopigmented (pure white, no melanin) so I have to apply makeup to cover it and even then it still looks bad IMO.

I have been dermarolling for about 9 months and have noticed a slight improvement in my skin texture but no change in color. I have not, however, rolled since I started the Lugol's b/c I wanted to see if I could observe the healing/regeneration mechanism discussed in the articles posted here. It's too early to say but I think there may be a slight change in the borders of the hypopigmented areas, as in, I see some redness (which according to the article, is supposed to indicate blood flow). I have not noticed any change in the central areas of the scarring.

I am going to keep going with this self-experimentation for another couple of months because of the slight changes in color I am observing. I'll decide at that point whether I will continue.

I am not sure if BRD has read this thread. It would be interesting to hear his opinion on it.

BRD, are you out there?

Take care all.

C.

Edited by CeciliaR

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guys, is anything supposed to happen when you apply lugols?

ive only applied mine for 3 days but i hear people saying it gives them a stinging sensation or burning sensation for a short while. or that it causes their skin to peel or itch. anything along those lines.

personally it hasnt given me any of these things, so it gives me the impression that im doing something wrong or that my lugols solution isnt strong enough or somethig. i just paint the lugols on with a cotton wool ball and thats it, the staining fades but tends to stick with me all day more or less.

any thoughts/ideas?

With my experience it should sting the non scarred skin near the scar. My diluted oral Lugols did not sting as much as my 5% lugols.

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