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The seborrheic dermatitis thread

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@Hopedieslast...Yes , stress plays a huge part ,but I also think stress is the cause of all illnesses.

I had an appointment with my dermatologist yesterday and he asked about my stress levels,pfff ...through the roof, always.

I need to start watching more comedies, and don't take things too seriously.

Flekkn...I think you make a lot of sense too , I seem to do well regarding hydrogen or benzoyl peroxide too.

Take care everyone and keep postings your experiences with medications or over the counter.

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Hi guys! I haven't posted in this forum yet, but I'm Lore and I suffer from seb derm on my face :) It was quite severe, but Accutane actually relieved me entirely of the seb derm.

When I came off of the Accutane my skin remained fine seb-derm wise, however as it has gotten colder and moved into the winter seasons, I have noticed patches on the upper section of both sides of my cheek that are extremely red and dry that always flare up in the exact same place. Sometimes they last for a day, sometimes not even, but I have one right now that has lasted for a week and won't seem to go anywhere. It's extremely red and flakey, but moisturizer seemed to make it worse. Cetaphil (which works gloriously on the rest of my face), almost seemed to make it really flare up to the point where it looked swollen. I since have left it to dry out on its own, but it doesn't seem to really be budging. It's a lot less red, but still there.

The weird thing is, looking back at photos, this area didn't use to have seb derm before anyway, so I'm truly wondering if it is or not. But, with it flaring up in the dryer winter and responding bad to moisturizer, I don't seem to think it could be anything else?

Edited by Lore91
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On 10/11/2015, 3:21:44, Lore91 said:

Hi guys! I haven't posted in this forum yet, but I'm Lore and I suffer from seb derm on my face :) It was quite severe, but Accutane actually relieved me entirely of the seb derm.

When I came off of the Accutane my skin remained fine seb-derm wise, however as it has gotten colder and moved into the winter seasons, I have noticed patches on the upper section of both sides of my cheek that are extremely red and dry that always flare up in the exact same place. Sometimes they last for a day, sometimes not even, but I have one right now that has lasted for a week and won't seem to go anywhere. It's extremely red and flakey, but moisturizer seemed to make it worse. Cetaphil (which works gloriously on the rest of my face), almost seemed to make it really flare up to the point where it looked swollen. I since have left it to dry out on its own, but it doesn't seem to really be budging. It's a lot less red, but still there.

The weird thing is, looking back at photos, this area didn't use to have seb derm before anyway, so I'm truly wondering if it is or not. But, with it flaring up in the dryer winter and responding bad to moisturizer, I don't seem to think it could be anything else?


Hello Lore91

i have suggested some things previously that worked for me  you can always check them out. From my experience S.D. sometimes transfers to others areas from where it was previously from time to time . I believe these areas are near the previous ones . 

Although i have mentioned  a cleanser and a moisturizer i have been using when i have a flare up the only thing that really works is ketoconazole 2% which is under different brands in various countries throughout the world. 

Addiotionally what you can try is applying fresh aloe vera from a plant . It didnt work for my at all but for some it did work . Moreover it can be a great moisturizer and has healing properties . All natural.

Take care  Edited by Hopedieslast
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On 11/21/2015 at 4:16 AM, SebdermRelief said:

 

 

On 11/10/2015 at 9:21 PM, Lore91 said:

Hi guys! I haven't posted in this forum yet, but I'm Lore and I suffer from seb derm on my face |::) It was quite severe, but Accutane actually relieved me entirely of the seb derm.

When I came off of the Accutane my skin remained fine seb-derm wise, however as it has gotten colder and moved into the winter seasons, I have noticed patches on the upper section of both sides of my cheek that are extremely red and dry that always flare up in the exact same place. Sometimes they last for a day, sometimes not even, but I have one right now that has lasted for a week and won't seem to go anywhere. It's extremely red and flakey, but moisturizer seemed to make it worse. Cetaphil (which works gloriously on the rest of my face), almost seemed to make it really flare up to the point where it looked swollen. I since have left it to dry out on its own, but it doesn't seem to really be budging. It's a lot less red, but still there.

The weird thing is, looking back at photos, this area didn't use to have seb derm before anyway, so I'm truly wondering if it is or not. But, with it flaring up in the dryer winter and responding bad to moisturizer, I don't seem to think it could be anything else?

 

While you were taking accutane the oil production output from your skin decreased. In the case with seb derm, the Malassezia yeasts feed on oils on your skin. So in theory accutane should help. The most notable side effect with accutane is dry skin. It's also been linked in causing depression and liver damage with long term use.

Seb derm usually becomes worse in the winter months due to the drier air, winds and lack of sunlight. Most people's skin need moisturisers around this time of the year.

For the stubborn patches on your skin try using an alpha hydroxy acid with glycolic acid to lightly exfoliate the affected areas. A raw honey mask a few times a week will help minimize flare ups. I've written an article on tips for [Edited link out]. Washing with epsom or sea salt will calm down the irritation. The minerals in these salts are anti-inflammatory which should help calm redness. 

The only other condition I can think of is maybe eczema. This condition causes one to have patches of rough and inflamed skin.  

 

Edited by Vincci
Edited link out - broken
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"The epiphenomena of Propionibacterium acnes overgrowth, Malassezia furfur multiplication, follicular wall rupture, inflammation both innate and adaptive, folliculopilosebaceous unit disintegration, secondary non-commensal bacterial infection, sinus formation and scarring are all downstream from mTORC1."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3746129/

 

"Acne should be regarded as an mTORC1-driven disease of civilization, like obesity, type 2 diabetes and cancer induced by Western diet."

http://www.medicaljournals.se/acta/content/?doi=10.2340/00015555-1358&html=1

 

 

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Gonna try and bump this thread,

 

After doing alot of research, I think I have figured out what has been giving me so many problems. First, I have had acne since i was a teen. I have been on 2 courses of accutane. Once when I was in high school for facial acne, which completely cleared. The second course was for a strange flare up around age 19 on my lower back and chest, no facial acne. Which leads me to today.

 

I am 28 year old male, and the last year or so Ive started noticing flaky eyebrows, then my mustache would get really red and irritated and start flaking. Now most recently Ive really noticed in the last 6 months or so my skin on my face has become very oily and ive started getting blotchy red spots around my nose and the skin has been very irritated. All this time the inside of my ears have been very flaky and of course my scalp as well. Also, my dad has really bad SD as far back as I can remember, but Ive never seen him with a pimple, so he just lets it run its course and it goes away.

 

All of this hasn't been that bothersome to me, so what I have a flaky beard and itchy scalp, the problem is that I have started breaking out really bad around my nose area where the oiliness has returned. Sometimes just small pimples, sometimes deep cystic acne. The spots are not healing at all as fast as they used to, I used to get a pimple and the red mark would be faded a week or two later. Now it sticks around for a month or 2 before even beginning to fade. This is the only place that I am breaking out. The Derm has given me 2 different antibiotics, but neither helped, and there is no way I can use a retinoid like Retin-a or differin, because it instantly flares up my SB worse than ever.

 

I am seriously considering going on another round of accutane, from what Ive read, this is the only medication that will help both SD and acne, because all of the steroid treatments are good for SD but terrible for acne, and all the acne treatments work well for acne, but flare up the SD. My acne is mild, but it has been there consistently for 5 months now and I want to get a jump on it before it gets out of hand.

 

Just wondering about the long term benefits, when I last took accutane I was clear for 9 years and and it seems my oil production was greatly reduced, or at least I think it was for those 9 years, because I just recently noticed how oily my skin is. If I take a full 6-8 months of accutane, I know the acne and SD will go away during treatment, but its after treatment that I want to know about. Will I be able to use more SD prescriptions without having to worry about breaking out? Will the oil production be less in general and maybe calm down the SD for a long time?? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Doc has already given me the OK for accutane, now I just need to decided what to do.

Edited by Jones4545
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Accutane definately cleared my facial seb derm, but it did stay behind my ears/around nose. Before accutane the only thing that worked was a weekly five minute sunbed (but again... This stopped working in the winter months when my skin broke out horrendously). Its give or take ;(

i've had a bad flare up behind my ears the past couple of weeks which is very annoying... It's permanantly red and ireitated-looking, but has small bumps that look lile acne. Ugh

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quick update 

so i moved to australia , victoria specificaly . My S.D. got worse .It reappeared after 27 days.
I reckon that it has something to do with the humidity here. The humidity is around 50%-85% the whole time .
Also i can't find any alcohol at the drugs store. I usually apply it around my nose to the affected areas and they somehow improve a little. 

anyways what can you do 

EDIT: after shave is a good choice for alcohol  :-)

Edited by Hopedieslast
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My son has suffered with Seborrhoeic dermatitis for approx 5 years. We tried every cream going with no luck. We honestly bought Sebclair as a last resort but I have to say it is a fantastic product and does work. We thought that my son's skin would become used to the cream and would not have the desired effect with regard to the redness and flaky skin but I am pleased to say it does still work and we are so grateful it does
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I found a product called cetaphil which cleared my seb dem, which I suffered from for over 20 yrs.  I found cetaphil from a website called skindrone. One of the products is called facial cleanser and another is called gentle skin cleanser, both seem to work.
I think my problems started back when I was 20 when I used to use moisturiser overnight.  It made my skin far too oily and I get blackheads on my nose also.  So I ended up with a red nose and to the sides to my nose and dry skin in eyebrows and eyelashes.  Most cleansers were far too harsh for my damaged skin.  Presumably cetaphil works for me cos it's so mild or maybe it has some magic ingredient that makes it work?

I think changing my diet to vegetables only also helps my skin, but I lose too much weight  doing that.

Going to check out Dr Cynthia Bailey and her seb dem/ rosacea products.  I like her website and agree with what she says about the problem. Don't know if her stuff works yet though.  Just looking for that last 5% improvement but I'm very happy now with where I am.

 

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Hi guys!

So I have a very thick layer of dead skin buildup on my face. I suspect it’s Seb Derm but I don’t have any of the other symptoms: Redness, oiliness, flakes. My dead skin layer is more of a sticky layer. I have tried the caveman regime and the dead skin was so thick and gross, I eventually gave up and rubbed it off. I can see the dead skin the most when my face is wet or once I get out the shower, it’s a white layer over my face that can be rubbed off with the slightest touch. No matter how many times I exfoliate (manually or chemically), the layer is sure to return.  It’s been two years and this layer is causing my skin to look extremely dull and clogged. I’ve gotten dehydration skin lines due to this because I believe no moisturizer is getting through the layer of dead skin. Could this layer of dead skin be Seborrheic dermatitis even without the redness/flakes/oiliness? 

Edited by ashleymorrow
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I developed seb derm on my scalp due to a contact allergy to Nioxin shampoo/conditionner/spray a little less than a year ago.. I've had eczema when I was younger but my scalp has always been healthy up until that point. Even though my scalp and hair were dry before I started using Nioxin products (few months after accutane) they were clear of any flakes or issues that could be related to seb derm. 1 week after starting Nioxin, I stopped using the leave-in spray because it was practically burning my scalp. For whatever reason I kept using the shampoo and conditionner for a few months (big mistake). I went to see my dermatologist afterwards and he said I had seb derm and prescribed me a tar shampoo and cortisone cream which did absolutely nothing. I stressed and got depressed and was practically sleeping less than 6 hours a day for 4 months straight afterwards and even though my seb derm wasn't getting worse, I was shedding more and more hair than before and couldn't see any regrowth. This hair loss was worse than the one following accutane so I kind of assumed it was telogen effluvium.

It's now about a year later. I buzzed my hair a couple of weeks ago because I couldn't take it anymore. I can clearly see my scalp thru my hair even though I couldn't in the past when I had short hair. My scalp isn't really itchy anymore but it's pink and irritated and I can still see flakes and sebum crust stuck into my scalp. I'm also getting depressed because I read that using a shampoo you're allergic too or taking too long to cure seb derm can permanently damage hair follicles and make hair loss permanent which I'm starting to believe is what is happening to me. I don't really talk about those issues much with my parents anymore because last time I did my mom started getting sad and uncomfortable because she is the one that bought me those Nioxin products.

What helped me the most so far to control the itchiness is using a soft natural shampoo or using dr. bronner castille soap as shampoo and ACV as conditionner. I just wish I could find something to give me back my healthy scalp and hair.

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Hello guys ...long time ,no hear ....
An update ....
It has been really hard to treat hormonal acne due to hypothyroidism ,plus this eczema ,seborrheic dermatitis .
I got fed up with antibiotics.
Ditched everything , ended up using cetaphil antibacterial soap and listerine the blue one cool mint as a toner ,temoved with water, didn't left on skin ,funny , well ...it removed cysts from my face,I didn't know they had a home on it.
My moisturizer ,...oils 
Coconut oil and castor oil ( organic)
Also my Natralia eczema psoriasis cream.
I stopped the listerine since it removed most of my acne and oils.
Right now...
Cleansing day and night
Cetaphil antibacterial soap
Natralia eczema and psoriasis cream, has to be shaken before applying .
To treat my acne or red bumps that want to flare, some drops of oregano oil all over the face, no rubbing , just patting , on top of the eczema cream.
Decided to start oregano oil , 3 drops under tongue as antibiotic , just for awhile.
Hair ,scalp ,Garnier shampo grow strong ,mostly shampoo ,...conditioner sometimes only to the ends of the hair, never the scalp.
Castor oil on scalp.
I did some research on oils and found some good ones on Amazon if you want the names let me know.
This is what I'm doing and this is what it has been working for me, I'm not saying you have to use it.
Regarding the listerine , it's really good for toenail fungus ,soaking the feet diluted with water and a little bit of distilled white vinegar, I know this because my sister used it like this and it worked, it takes time though.
Oregano oil can even be used as a spot treatment on razor bumps .
And listerine too.
I hope you guys are doing well, take care!


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This seborrheic dermatitis,everything fails...
I finally decided to use the xolegel ,ketoconazole 2% gel , hard to apply but I think it's worth it! The gel is expensive, but if you have insurance go to the official website and download a coupon or get one from the doctor, it's about $20.
Wash with cetaphil antibacterial soap and then wait for the skin to dry, then apply the gel, I do it twice a day .
I take oregano oil 3/5 drops under the tongue to bypass the liver(I read about that online)
I also started on blue ice royal blend 
fermented cod liver oil concentrated butter oil ,cinnamon tingle gel from green pasture,it's expensive though. 
I started the cod liver oil, since my mom used to give me that as a child.
I will let you know how it goes.
That's it, keeping it simple!
Best wishes to all!

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Hi, thought I'd just mention that Head & Shoulders Itchy Scalp Formula has helped my seb derm on my scalp. I had been using specific seb derm shampoos but they stopped working after just 2 or 3 weeks. H&S just about keeps it at bay.

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So I return to this thread MANY years later, because I found my CURE!
Nose crease and scalp was prone to SD since birth, and this past year (40+ years later) Im finally free from it.
Also - NO products involved. Only self discipline. And I only do 2 things:

Dry brushing.
Brushing with EV olive oil.


I use a toothbrush for nose wings and cleaning/floor brush for scalp. Dry brush bi-nightly, and with oil 2-4 times pr month. Thanks to this I was even able to grow a beard, which I never could before due to filling up with SD and itching like hell. (Note - I also seem to require 1-2 short tanning bed sessions pr. month during winter to keep it 100% away.)

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 Came across this when researching treatments for seb derm. Thought I would give a heads up on here with info. I am researching this myself for a possible treatment. Locally to me it is offered to reduce pain but might get a Consultant to do procedure for Seb Derm dependent on cost and how many treatments and is willing to do it.

  According to Uchida et al. [2], stellate ganglion block (SGB) is effective in the treatment of skin disorders of the head and neck. According to the authors, this treatment mechanism maintains the homeostasis of hormones by improving the blood flow in the brain. There has been a report of successful treatment of acne vulgaris — which has a similar etiology to seborrheic dermatitis — with SGB [3]. Therefore, we predicted that SGB would also be effective in the treatment of seborrheic dermatitis. Indeed, repeated SGB trials on a patient who had previously undergone unsuccessful dermatologic treatments were effective. This was the first case of seborrheic dermatitis treatment with SGB.A previous study reported that SGBs reduce inflammatory reactions. In the same study, a skin biopsy performed on a seborrheic dermatitis patient's lesion revealed increased counts of inflammatory mediators (interleukin-1, [IL-1], IL-2, IL-4, IL-6, IL-10, IL-12, gamma interferon, TNF-a)[9]. Liu et al. [10] conducted a study on severe trauma patients and reported that the concentrations of IL-b, IL-6, and TNF-a decreased 24 to 72 hours after a SGB. Park et al. [3] successfully treated an acne vulgaris patient with over 50 trials of SGB, and Wajima et al. [11] reported that SGB decreases the levels of serum IgE and eosinophil in atopic dermatitis. These results indicate that SGB is effective in reducing hyper inflammations caused by seborrheic dermatitis, and thus in mitigating the related symptoms. According to a previous study by Wakusugi [12], SGB improves the blood flow in the brain and influences hormone secretions, effectively improving the symptoms of diseases responsive to steroids; hence, SGB can also be applied to seborrheic dermatitis.
In conclusion, seborrheic dermatitis patients are treated with antifungals and steroids. In cases in which the patients are unresponsive to these traditional treatment modalities, SGBs can be useful. SGBs can also be useful in the treatment of other cutaneous disorders with similar mechanisms.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4823414/
Complications are rare as far I can see reading up on it with a image guided injection of anesthetic using a moving xray pictures or ultrasound to guide precise location. But should be taken on board when considering. It's offered at 2 of my local private hospitals as a procedure and looks commonplace as a pain relief treatment but not for seb derm so would have to ask Doctor to consider for seb derm. I am still considering it but it is another option I thought I would share.
Can also be used to lessen hyperhidrosis, craniofacial (excess sweating) in my case which I suffer from and initiated seborrheic dermatitis for me in first place. With having heavy sebum (currently) and cystic acne prone face (face scarred) in past (get some buried cysts a little now and again) and going on antidepressants (up to 20% suffer hyperhidrosis whilst on antidepressants). Antidepressants permanently changed me even after coming off them and gave me night sweats and heavy sweating after slight exertion (e.g 10 mins vacumming) on head. Like contracting athletes foot from sweaty socks with combination of heavy sebum production and excess sweating I had a fungal proliferation resulting in seb derm. If I was told of antidepressant danger or simple things  of not having a heavy duvet on bed just a light sheet to minimise night sweats and wearing shorts all the time in summer heavy sweating might have been avoided  and subsequent seb derm might not have occurred and ruin my life.

Stellate Ganglion Block is used to treat many medical conditions;
Complex regional pain syndrome of the head and upper limbs
Peripheral vascular disease
Upper extremity embolism
Postherpetic neuralgia
Chronic post-surgical pain
Hyperhidrosis
Raynaud disease 
Scleroderma
Orofacial pain
Phantom limb
Atypical chest pain
A cluster or a vascular headache 
Post-traumatic stress disorder
Meniere syndrome
Intractable angina
Refractory cardiac arrhythmias
 
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 I have read on here people using various oils to help with their seborrheic dermatitis but just to give information that they could be fuelling the condition instead of helping.

Malassezia is a lipophilic yeast meaning it eats fats and oils to make itself grow. In a lab environment olive oil is used to enhance the growth of the fungus. (ref.) 

***Therefore many lotions, creams and oils used to hydrate and moisturize the skin will actually make the problem much worse despite offering temporary relief. Using most of them is like adding fuel to a fire!*** 

Most species of Malassezia consume fatty acids with a carbon chain length of 11 through 24. 

Therefore you want to check every single ingredient in a lotion/cream to make sure it is not within that range or else it will feed the Malassezia. For a list of oils (12-24) to avoid;
https://www.scientificpsychic.com/fitness/fattyacids.html
https://www.scientificpsychic.com/fitness/fattyacids1.html
https://www.scientificpsychic.com/fitness/fattyacids2.html

Ointments that appear to be safe are:

Aquaphor is 41% petrolatum, which is composed of very long carbon chains of C25 to C30
Petroleum Jelly has carbon number mainly higher than 25 (ref.)
(Some websites say to avoid petroleum jelly as it is very thick and occlusive and makes seb derm worse)
MCT oil has carbon chain lengths of 8-10

http://www.gestaltreality.com/2014/07/08/healing-skin-by-altering-its-ph-microbial-malassezia-profile/

Here is quotes from another good site about malassezia affecting pityrosporum folliculitis but is applicable to seborrheic dermatitis aswell;
This means that most skincare products available today (I’d say over 95% of them) are problematic because they almost always contain a variation of a fatty acid that will feed malassezia.

Keep in mind that oils also contain fatty acids, usually in the from of triglycerides. Unfortunately, malassezia is quite the practical fella and has enzymes (lipases and phospholipases) that can hydrolyze triglycerides into free fatty acids. (49) In other words, it can break down the fatty acids in oils and use them to grow as well. This has been demonstrated in many studies.

Esters
esters…. I’ve been asked a lot about whether these will feed malassezia. It’s a bit complicated, but the answer is yes. However, it depends on what esters, alcohol moiety, and species of malassezia we’re talking about.

Polysorbates
I’m gonna keep this short and sweet. M. furfur and M. sympodialis were able to utilize tweens as lipid sources. (58, 59, 60)

Your “tweens” are polysorbates. These are esters. Specifically, ethoxylated sorbitan esters. The number you see at the end of them, for example polysorbate 20, corresponds to what fatty acid was used as the base during esterification.

Polysorbate 20 = sorbitan monolaurate (lauric acid, C12)
Polysorbate 40 =sorbitan monopalmitate (palmitic acid, C14)
Polysorbate 60 =sorbitan monostearate (stearic acid, C18)
Polysorbate 80 =sorbitan monooleate (oleic acid, C18:1)
The four polysorbates listed above all fed malassezia in vitro

https://simpleskincarescience.com/pityrosporum-folliculitis-treatment-malassezia-cure/

I wish manufacturers of seborrheic dermatitis products anti fungal creams, shampoos and moisturizers etc would consult these published papers and avoid these products that feed malassezia. Ridiculous that they don't.


You can check products with this great site. Put in ingredients of cream etc and it tells you if any feed malassezia.
https://www.sezia.co
 

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I have persistent redness on my cheeks since years now. I sometimes get breakouts as well so I thought it was acne, now I don’t get as many breakouts but the redness is still there. I went to my GP, thinking it was rosacea. She asked if I get dandruff too, I said yes. She then said it’s seborrhaemic dermatitis then and prescribed me clotrimazole cream to use twice a day. I’ve been using it for a few weeks now but there hasn’t been much improvement in the redness. Any ideas on what else would be helpful?

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Expanding on my post above,
"Dry brushing.
Brushing with EV olive oil."

I have had small very stubborn (years) patches of psoriasis (looks 100% like it at least) on leg and forearm starting some 5 years ago. Google suggests beach bathing and tanning is the ultimate cure. So I dissolved the maximum salt in boiling water and bottled it. Then applied it to the patches as follows:
-Dry-brush it.
-Apply salt water and let dry on skin. Then dry-brush again.
-Brush with olive oil (without removing residue salt). Then just wipe off excess oil (no washing).

Voilà!! 2-3 year old patches disappeared within 14 days of doing this bi-nightly, never to return.

I've since added the salt step for keeping my scalp and nose wings free from seborrhea as well, and it seems to extend its effectiveness to where I can now do it much less often - like once a month or even longer.

Important note - my seborrhea is strongly tied to lack of sun exposure. So I use tanning bed twice a month. Without it, Im unsure how well this would work.

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