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oli girl

'Accutane debate placeholder thread'

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I'd really like to see some independent studies on Accutane. As of reading this entire thread, I have not seen a SINGLE credible/unbiased study on the subject. Linking to action groups and class action law suits for this kind of information is worthless and about as biased as you can get.

I agree with duck in that I haven't seen one proper study among all these biased scare sites (most likely funded by those trying to sue Roche). For this same reason, I am wary about putting up a thread of "studies" unless the journals are double checked for validity.

Last year while I was researching vitamin A’s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane’s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

Ever since Accutane was approved by the FDA in 1982, Roche has continued to use the lame excuse in the Physician’s Desk Reference that “the exact mechanism of action is unknown” which is their way of copping out by declaring that they don’t understand how the drug works to reduce acne or how it causes an incredibly long list of side effects. Here’s how Roche thinks. For them it’s like, let’s all just stick our heads in the sand and completely disregard those independent studies showing that Accutane binds to DNA nuclear receptors and alters gene expression and protein transcription, reduces stem cell proliferation all over the body including areas of the brain, damages the body’s ability regenerate the water-holding protein molecule hyaluronic acid in connective tissue (causing chronic cellular dehydration and extreme dryness of the skin, eyes, nasal passage, mucous membranes etc.), or the hidden away chemo studies I discovered which demonstrate that retinoids induce telomere shortening, growth arrest and cell death, we here at Hoffman-La Roche do not know how this drug works down at the cellular level but we do know that it’s certainly effective against pimples

I will link the studies in a bit.

Sorry but I need to correct you again. No such thing as protein transciption, protein translation yes but not transcription. Transcription is for genes only. Gene expression and protein translation are about the same thing.

Hyaluronic acid is not a protein. It is a polysaccharide(long chain of sugar). Function is to lubricate joints and resist compression in joints or tissues, somewhat like a cushion. It does not serve to provide water to the cells thus it cannot cause dehydration. On the contrary, it actually draws water into itself via osmosis. It holds water yeah to serve as a cushion, not to serve as a drink for cells.

Not being sarcastic but just to make sure people know what is correct.

Ok but investigative health journalist Bill Sardi published a compelling and insightful report on Accutane and its long-term side effects titled “Accutane: a modern horror story.” One important topic he covers is how oral hyaluronic acid supplementation may improve the extreme dryness of tissues caused by Accutane. former Accutane users suffering the chronic latent effects of severe systemic dryness of their skin, eyes, lips, mouth, and nasal passage should consider taking oral hyaluronic acid supplements.

I know people who have taken HA and it has helped slightly with the dryness, so explain why?

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Ok but investigative health journalist Bill Sardi published a compelling and insightful report on Accutane and its long-term side effects titled “Accutane: a modern horror story.” One important topic he covers is how oral hyaluronic acid supplementation may improve the extreme dryness of tissues caused by Accutane. former Accutane users suffering the chronic latent effects of severe systemic dryness of their skin, eyes, lips, mouth, and nasal passage should consider taking oral hyaluronic acid supplements.

I know people who have taken HA and it has helped slightly with the dryness, so explain why?

Spot on. I have a copy of that report if anyone would like to read it. It certainly affects the HA compound all over the body in one way or another. There is no disputing that.

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Last year while I was researching vitamin A’s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane’s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

*mod edit*

Accutanes effect is BELIEVED to be that it decreases the size and sebum output of the sebaceous glands. It also stabilizes keratinization, makes the cells that are sloughed off into the sebaceous glands less sticky, and therefore inhibits the formation of comedones. If you have any clue about pharmacology you'd know that many drugs have unknown mechanisms in the human body. There are no Roche secrets, no hidden agenda or government conspiracies. You have yet to post 1 piece on unbiased or relevant information...why? Because you don't have any.

Im here to share my accutane experience, pick up tips for managing side-effects and if possible share some of my knowledge of skincare. You are here to advocate the removal of accutane from the pharmacies which means...YOU ARE IN THE WRONG PLACE!

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*mod edit*

Accutanes effect is BELIEVED to be that it decreases the size and sebum output of the sebaceous glands. It also stabilizes keratinization, makes the cells that are sloughed off into the sebaceous glands less sticky, and therefore inhibits the formation of comedones. If you have any clue about pharmacology you'd know that many drugs have unknown mechanisms in the human body. There are no Roche secrets, no hidden agenda or government conspiracies. You have yet to post 1 piece on unbiased or relevant information...why? Because you don't have any.

Im here to share my accutane experience, pick up tips for managing side-effects and if possible share some of my knowledge of skincare. You are here to advocate the removal of accutane from the pharmacies which means...YOU ARE IN THE WRONG PLACE!

I'll be following your course with GREAT interest.

Someone recently put accutane in perfect perspective here on this board. He/She said "Why is the medication I am taking for my face making my back hurt". They then stopped therapy. The WIDESCALE effects, whether minor or catastrophic, on the human body from this drug are not fully known. Nobody can dispute that when Roche keep updting their prescription protocols and guides.

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hey,

95% of people that reply to these posts are people who are still struggling with acne or the people who have had very unlikely outcomes post-treatment.

For me, and the 10 or so friends that I know have used accutane, the only post side-effect has been clear skin with the odd pimple here and there. Not one negative side effect from any of us.

I would prescribe this medication to absolutely anyone. It is 100% worth it, don't listen to these people, and do yourself the biggest favor of your life, and GO ON ACCUTANE!

You will thank me in the future.

Or resent you and others when more studies become clear about what it can and does do.

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Sheefa, see my signature. That statement about medication effects never being fully known is applicable to ALL medications, not just accutane.

Just about ALL medications effect ALL aspects of a body; everything is interconnected. A medication for discomfort and inflammation may affect coagulation time. A medication for coagulation may interfere with other as of yet unknown pathways. A supplement can interfere with the absorption of other vitamins/minerals. That is just a fact of life with drugs. ALL have side effects. ALL require a choice to take or not take, understanding that there are consequences to those choices.

I think that those of you who do not deal with medications every single day haven't the experience to see that ALL medications WILL cause side effects. The fact that Accutane has side effects (and very severe ones) does not automatically make it evil.

Ever seen Stevens Johnson syndrome from Ibuprofen or a sulfa drug? I have only had a few patients with that reaction and they wanted to die as their skin degloved from the reaction.

Yet they did not agitate to have the sulfa med or ibuprofen removed from the market as both have their uses.

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Last year while I was researching vitamin A™s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane™s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

*mod edit*

Accutanes effect is BELIEVED to be that it decreases the size and sebum output of the sebaceous glands. It also stabilizes keratinization, makes the cells that are sloughed off into the sebaceous glands less sticky, and therefore inhibits the formation of comedones. If you have any clue about pharmacology you'd know that many drugs have unknown mechanisms in the human body. There are no Roche secrets, no hidden agenda or government conspiracies. You have yet to post 1 piece on unbiased or relevant information...why? Because you don't have any.

Im here to share my accutane experience, pick up tips for managing side-effects and if possible share some of my knowledge of skincare. You are here to advocate the removal of accutane from the pharmacies which means...YOU ARE IN THE WRONG PLACE!

I am not the only one who talks about the removal of Accutane, it is a widely discussed subject between health authorities too.

Look at roche's homepage, they claim to be the top researchers in the world, about virology, cancer, etc. so they should clearly know how Accutane works but they don't tell anyone. why?

There ARE Roche secrets, most drugs if not all that have damaged this many people have been removed already, but Accutane remains on the market. why?

All proof can be falisable and Roche will do ANYTHING to manipulate the truth. Like Lammar said earlier, they paid a billion dollar fine for being involved with criminal conspiricies.

There are certain people that use this kind of thinking as a way of making the drug legitimate

Each year, there has been information added onto the accutane label, and this is not good information, as more injured patients continue to report their side effects.

There is money involved with this, please just get it.

You are in denial, just like Roche Pharmaceuticals

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I'd really like to see some independent studies on Accutane. As of reading this entire thread, I have not seen a SINGLE credible/unbiased study on the subject. Linking to action groups and class action law suits for this kind of information is worthless and about as biased as you can get.

I agree with duck in that I haven't seen one proper study among all these biased scare sites (most likely funded by those trying to sue Roche). For this same reason, I am wary about putting up a thread of "studies" unless the journals are double checked for validity.

Last year while I was researching vitamin A’s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane’s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

Ever since Accutane was approved by the FDA in 1982, Roche has continued to use the lame excuse in the Physician’s Desk Reference that “the exact mechanism of action is unknown” which is their way of copping out by declaring that they don’t understand how the drug works to reduce acne or how it causes an incredibly long list of side effects. Here’s how Roche thinks. For them it’s like, let’s all just stick our heads in the sand and completely disregard those independent studies showing that Accutane binds to DNA nuclear receptors and alters gene expression and protein transcription, reduces stem cell proliferation all over the body including areas of the brain, damages the body’s ability regenerate the water-holding protein molecule hyaluronic acid in connective tissue (causing chronic cellular dehydration and extreme dryness of the skin, eyes, nasal passage, mucous membranes etc.), or the hidden away chemo studies I discovered which demonstrate that retinoids induce telomere shortening, growth arrest and cell death, we here at Hoffman-La Roche do not know how this drug works down at the cellular level but we do know that it’s certainly effective against pimples

I will link the studies in a bit.

Sorry but I need to correct you again. No such thing as protein transciption, protein translation yes but not transcription. Transcription is for genes only. Gene expression and protein translation are about the same thing.

Hyaluronic acid is not a protein. It is a polysaccharide(long chain of sugar). Function is to lubricate joints and resist compression in joints or tissues, somewhat like a cushion. It does not serve to provide water to the cells thus it cannot cause dehydration. On the contrary, it actually draws water into itself via osmosis. It holds water yeah to serve as a cushion, not to serve as a drink for cells.

Not being sarcastic but just to make sure people know what is correct.

Ok but investigative health journalist Bill Sardi published a compelling and insightful report on Accutane and its long-term side effects titled “Accutane: a modern horror story.” One important topic he covers is how oral hyaluronic acid supplementation may improve the extreme dryness of tissues caused by Accutane. former Accutane users suffering the chronic latent effects of severe systemic dryness of their skin, eyes, lips, mouth, and nasal passage should consider taking oral hyaluronic acid supplements.

I know people who have taken HA and it has helped slightly with the dryness, so explain why?

It's part of the Extracellular matrix(holds the cell together so they don't float away) between cells. So when you have a lot of it between cells, its like the cells are floating around water but the water does not enter the cells. It serves like a protective film around the cells but when its degraded, the cells around it will start to get dehydrated again so constant use is required. That's why its only helped slightly with dryness. It may help temporary till your body recovers but the main function of hyaluronate is not to serve as a water source and has got nothing to do with cells drying up. The use of words " Cellular dehydration" is wrong because it does not provide the cells with water, on the contrary, it may suck up the water from the cells to serve its purpose but for a normal individual, there is a balance between the matrix and the cells.

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Bill Sardi is a joke. He does rip-off infomercials selling his "super" multivitamins. As a supposed "health guru" in business to help the public he's sure into making money.

Someone recently put accutane in perfect perspective here on this board. He/She said "Why is the medication I am taking for my face making my back hurt". They then stopped therapy. The WIDESCALE effects, whether minor or catastrophic, on the human body from this drug are not fully known. Nobody can dispute that when Roche keep updting their prescription protocols and guides.
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Sheefa, see my signature. That statement about medication effects never being fully known is applicable to ALL medications, not just accutane.

Agree with you Wynne and I know. For me and others suffering though it's the living in fear of what 'might crop up next'.

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If you find the dryness of the skin, chapped lips, lethargy or muscle/joint pains to much to deal with while trying to get rid of the acne, I'd say you are not suffering much from your acne in the first place.

Acne ruined my teenage and early twenties. How dare you accuse me of not having a 'bad' case of acne. I had 1 1/2 good years and then all the accutane side effects creeped in. You don't know me and you're arrogance on this board is something I've not seen from any member before.

Have you ever suffered from SEVERE ARTHRITIS? Thought not, but that's exactly the kind of pain I am going through now and have been the last 20 odd months at the age of 26. You also haven't read my posts about the side effects creeping up AFTER my course. Few bits of advice:

Go away and learn how to conduct yourself in a more appropriate manner in front of others and when sitting at a keyboard.

Read through my previous posts before you even start to judge me, and even then you won't come close to knowing me.

Keep an accutane log because I'm most looking forward to seeing how you get on....albeit in honesty with a sly grin on my face.

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Wynne has some good points, however she does not have full information. Nor does anyone on this board probably, except Dan, he knows what's up, but won't clout, because he needs to protect his rice bowl i think :naughty:

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Are the mods going to have to put in a time out so that tempers can calm down? Enough with the sly little digs at each other. Keep personal attacks, condescending remarks, sly little digs OUT OF THIS TOPIC.

By time out I mean closing this topic for 12-24 hours.

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There ARE Roche secrets, most drugs if not all that have damaged this many people have been removed already, but Accutane remains on the market. why?

Oh really. Explain chemotherapy in the treatment of cancer then. These drugs kill cells, good or bad and are possibly the most dangerous treatments given to patients today. Yet these treatments are still given. Even over the counter medication has side-effects. One of the most common drugs that people overdose on is paracetamol, it'll kill you outright in a few days. Its still being sold. Accutane remains on the market because its still (in lack of others) the best drug for treating stubborn acne.

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Are the mods going to have to put in a time out so that tempers can calm down? Enough with the sly little digs at each other. Keep personal attacks, condescending remarks, sly little digs OUT OF THIS TOPIC.

By time out I mean closing this topic for 12-24 hours.

Let's all be friends! *mod edit*

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No, everyone is. :) Except me of course, I'm almost perfect. :P

PS: That perfect thing is a joke, so no silliness regarding it, m'kay?

It is temporarily closed to I won't have to edit yet another post. It will reopen in a few minutes.

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There ARE Roche secrets, most drugs if not all that have damaged this many people have been removed already, but Accutane remains on the market. why?

Explain chemotherapy in the treatment of cancer then. These drugs kill cells, good or bad and are possibly the most dangerous treatments given to patients today. Yet these treatments are still given.

This is what I've been trying to convey. Cancer KILLS you, which makes treatment with Accutane(chemotherapy) rational, but a patient with acne , i've said it before and i'll say it again is not a patient with a deadly disease, so does treating this patient with chemotherapy, which you said yourself is the most dangerous treatments on the market today, rational in any sense?

Sorry about earlier moderators. I did not get any warnings before though

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If you find the dryness of the skin, chapped lips, lethargy or muscle/joint pains to much to deal with while trying to get rid of the acne, I'd say you are not suffering much from your acne in the first place.

Acne ruined my teenage and early twenties. How dare you accuse me of not having a 'bad' case of acne. I had 1 1/2 good years and then all the accutane side effects creeped in. You don't know me and you're arrogance on this board is something I've not seen from any member before.

Have you ever suffered from SEVERE ARTHRITIS? Thought not, but that's exactly the kind of pain I am going through now and have been the last 20 odd months at the age of 26. You also haven't read my posts about the side effects creeping up AFTER my course. Few bits of advice:

Go away and learn how to conduct yourself in a more appropriate manner in front of others and when sitting at a keyboard.

Read through my previous posts before you even start to judge me, and even then you won't come close to knowing me.

Keep an accutane log because I'm most looking forward to seeing how you get on....albeit in honesty with a sly grin on my face.

Oh wow. You are criticizing me for my behavior and at the same time wishing me the worst of side-effects accutane can cause. Is that your idea of appropriate behaviour?

Wanna compare "suffering"? Fine. I'm 4 years your senior. I've had Severe acne for close to two decades. I don't wanna mention all the treatments i've tried because i don't care to be typing for hours. You are gonna tell me or others in my situation, that our last available option for clear skin shouldn't be available because you had adverse effects?

I've had adverse effects taking simple penicillin, who am i to tell others that they shouldn't take it because i had a bad experience with it?

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If you find the dryness of the skin, chapped lips, lethargy or muscle/joint pains to much to deal with while trying to get rid of the acne, I'd say you are not suffering much from your acne in the first place.

Acne ruined my teenage and early twenties. How dare you accuse me of not having a 'bad' case of acne. I had 1 1/2 good years and then all the accutane side effects creeped in. You don't know me and you're arrogance on this board is something I've not seen from any member before.

Have you ever suffered from SEVERE ARTHRITIS? Thought not, but that's exactly the kind of pain I am going through now and have been the last 20 odd months at the age of 26. You also haven't read my posts about the side effects creeping up AFTER my course. Few bits of advice:

Go away and learn how to conduct yourself in a more appropriate manner in front of others and when sitting at a keyboard.

Read through my previous posts before you even start to judge me, and even then you won't come close to knowing me.

Keep an accutane log because I'm most looking forward to seeing how you get on....albeit in honesty with a sly grin on my face.

Oh wow. You are criticizing me for my behavior and at the same time wishing me the worst of side-effects accutane can cause. Is that your idea of appropriate behaviour?

Wanna compare "suffering"? Fine. I'm 4 years your senior. I've had Severe acne for close to two decades. I don't wanna mention all the treatments i've tried because i don't care to be typing for hours. You are gonna tell me or others in my situation, that our last available option for clear skin shouldn't be available because you had adverse effects?

I've had adverse effects taking simple penicillin, who am i to tell others that they shouldn't take it because i had a bad experience with it?

I agree, Accutane should be available, but only for the most severe forms of acne in low dose. something happened though, and the drug went to other forms of acne, mostly. I also think the people with severe acne should be properly informed, not anything misleading like it is today, which can help them make an informed choice based on full information. I do feel bad for the sufferers of extremely severe painful acne, who would do anything to get rid of the acne they have, unfortunately once accutane's mechanism is proven in a lab, they won't have that option anymore.

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This is what I've been trying to convey. Cancer KILLS you, which makes treatment with Accutane(chemotherapy) rational, but a patient with acne , i've said it before and i'll say it again is not a patient with a deadly disease, so does treating this patient with chemotherapy, which you said yourself is the most dangerous treatments on the market today, rational in any sense?

Sorry about earlier moderators. I did not get any warnings before though

Acne causes a reduction in quality of life. If you are spending your days inside afraid to commit to any social engagements, depressed, lonely and potentially suicidal, how does that not require serious treatment. Your acting like acne is something that anyone can live with, its not.

When all other treatment fails there is only Accutane left. If you got some amazing side-effect free treatment to offer people i'd love to hear about it.

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I do feel bad for the sufferers of extremely severe painful acne, who would do anything to get rid of the acne they have, unfortunately once accutane's mechanism is proven in a lab, they won't have that option anymore.

Actually i don't think you do. You are all so gung-ho about crucifying Roche that you forgot about the people on the other side still suffering from acne.

Hows your acne now, is it still there, and did you ever suffer from severe acne? Did you all forget how it was to feel desperate to get clear skin?

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This is what I've been trying to convey. Cancer KILLS you, which makes treatment with Accutane(chemotherapy) rational, but a patient with acne , i've said it before and i'll say it again is not a patient with a deadly disease, so does treating this patient with chemotherapy, which you said yourself is the most dangerous treatments on the market today, rational in any sense?

Sorry about earlier moderators. I did not get any warnings before though

Acne causes a reduction in quality of life. If you are spending your days inside afraid to commit to any social engagements, depressed, lonely and potentially suicidal, how does that not require serious treatment. Your acting like acne is something that anyone can live with, its not.

When all other treatment fails there is only Accutane left. If you got some amazing side-effect free treatment to offer people i'd love to hear about it.

have you tried led blue light treatments? Many people benefit from this.

Have you changed your diet? Have you cut out all sugar and dairy? Sugar creates insulin = bad for acne. Have you exercised? What about tanning, do you get sun? Did you try incorporating minerals and supplements into your diet? Zinc is good.

Lower fat foods, avoid heavy fats and cholestrol, hormones like testosterone are produced from cholesterl through the cells, ( which is another process accutane permantley alters )

Eat olive oil, and flax seed oil

TRy not to stress to much, add food with trytofan, which creates serotonin in the brain, and makes you feel happier, another thing accutane permantely ceases.

Eat antioxidants, try grape seed extract, or try plenty of fruit

Diet has lots to do with acne.

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oli girl is not a victim (although she tries hard to make it seem like it). oli girl wasn't the "victim" of some freak accident. She wasn't the target of some gross injustice. Oli girl sought out a dermatologist for acne treatment, she was prescribed and purchased the accutane. she was or was not aware of the possible sideeffect (if she wasn't thats just ignorance on her part), and she took the pills hoping that it would cure her acne. When the side-effects hit she decides to blame roche....why?

I am aware that many have side-effects from accutane, still there are only a few that decide to file lawsuits against roche. A few that refuse to take responsibility for their own actions. The side-effects of accutane have been known for decades.

I acknowledge the side-effects of accutane. why is it that oli girl, jmiri and their likes REFUSE to acknowledge ANY of its benefits. With all the positive accutane diaries popping up on youtube, acne.org, reclaimyourskin.co.uk and similar sites, with people telling how accutane made a positive change in their lives, why is it that we should listen to a few bitter individuals who have no intention other then screaming "POISON POISON POISON!"

Exuse me, but no I didn't seek out a dermatologist. I had three cysts the color of my skin, that I had no problems with, Never been to a derm in my life. My internist who owned a skin care clinic reffered to me a derm for accutane, said it was a miracle drug that would take thoose cysts away. Derm said you don't want mess with other meds they don't work... I am not repeating my story that's already posted.

So like I said I never told you not to take accutane...So I don't know why u choose to keep going on......In fact if I was so impartial to pro accutaners, I guess I wouldn't try to give fair advice. I don't scream poison on here....I believe I have said for acne congloblata and severe painful cystic acne it would be justified.

Sheefa-Thank You..........

oh yeah I almost foregot, thoose three cysts still there.....amazing.....

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I keep a 24/7 diet year round, i train 5-7 days a week, i've tried removing every know foodgroup from my diet at some point. Tanning breaks me out like nothing else, i do not tan. Vitamines, minerals, antioxdants and essential oils, they are all in my diet. I don't drink soda or eat candy.

Changes in diet has never affected my skin. It's not something that i'll grow out of, its not something any cream or mumbo-jumbo quack treatment will cure. My problem is out of control sebum-glands, something accutane is known to affect.

Stress is unavoidable in modern life, i shouldn't have to live life as dictated by my skin. i should not have to spend ages getting my face in order before i'm out the door in the morning. accutane is the last resort and thats where its made its name. As a good treatment for those people where nothing else works.

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I do feel bad for the sufferers of extremely severe painful acne, who would do anything to get rid of the acne they have, unfortunately once accutane's mechanism is proven in a lab, they won't have that option anymore.

Actually i don't think you do. You are all so gung-ho about crucifying Roche that you forgot about the people on the other side still suffering from acne.

Hows your acne now, is it still there, and did you ever suffer from severe acne? Did you all forget how it was to feel desperate to get clear skin?

yezzir, I still have acne, it's moderate now, comes and goes. I had some bad teenage acne. I have suffered from both Acne, and of course accutane's side effects.

I remember the moments where i was at my lowest, doing anything to get clear skin, of course i do, and then I came to this website and found out about accutane and how it was some miracle drug.

I don't sit here and inform people for no reason, mostly cause I didn't have full information when I took the drug. I want others to have full information before they take the drug, and now each year that passes more and more information is becoming known about accutane.

I ended up finding out the hard way, it was no miracle, severely more harmful than the profits that are made, I read about it online at some places here and there, its just that these forums acne.org don't reflect the whole picture, you see people with blogs and their clear skin, but it doesn't mean it will be you. it is not the whole picture, it really is not at all,

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