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'Accutane debate placeholder thread'

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Ducks - you're fairly new here, it would be great if you left the forums altogether after your fabulous introduction.

I'm hoping that in 10-15 years time as our bodies begin to age the accutane side effects will become more evident and with a bit of luck many of us will die. At least that's perhaps what is needed to get this damn drug withdrawn from the market.

As for the side effects, how many times has this been said by many. My side effects on the drug were MINIMAL. But as soon as I finished within 4-6 weeks IIRC, my whole body started to go haywire and I've been in chronic joint pain for over 20 months. Now tell me this, have ANY of your dermotologists mentioned to you that accutane can induce latent side effects AFTER stopping treatment???! If they have, count yourselves lucky and buy them a drink. It's then your decision if you take it or not. I for one was NOT warned about this. If I was experiencing severe joint pain amongst other milder side effects whilst ON the treatment do you really think I would of kept taking it?? I may not be a highly educated man but I'm not stupid. I would of ceased therapy right there.

So, for the likes of "Ducks", the new kid on the block who knows all and see's nothing, think about what you are saying before you put that finger to your keyboard. I know of very few drugs (if any off the top of my head), that induce side effects after the course is complete.

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Only a few to decide to file lawsuits against ROche? Why is there a national class action lawsuit with thousands signed up then? If you go around on all those websites, there is also MANY negative experiences, so it goes both ways I guess.

But are the side effects acceptable? Should a drug you take for your skin, be able to damage your brain, or have your colon removed, or make you crippled for life?

Why? because there are many aggressive lawyers out there throwing around promises of money if you join such a class action suit. You claim roche is only in it for the money. You saying the People driving the lawsuit isn't? roche makes billions, ofc they are a target for lawsuits. Even more so in the states where there basically are no limits for the amount of money you can ask for in damages.

Side-effects acceptable?. I can only answer for myself. Yes they are. Unlike you i don't try to answer for everybody else.

The side-effects you mention are 1/1000, yeah it sucks if you are that one guy but its not gonna change the fact that 999 others were on the drug with little more then chapped lips and dry skin, and with acne free faces afterwards.

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*mod edit*

*mod edit*

I'm not going anywhere, you people really have no clue of what unbiased information is about. And unlike you i actually contribute to the rest of this site. And don't just troll around in the Accutane section.

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Only a few to decide to file lawsuits against ROche? Why is there a national class action lawsuit with thousands signed up then? If you go around on all those websites, there is also MANY negative experiences, so it goes both ways I guess.

But are the side effects acceptable? Should a drug you take for your skin, be able to damage your brain, or have your colon removed, or make you crippled for life?

Why? because there are many aggressive lawyers out there throwing around promises of money if you join such a class action suit. You claim roche is only in it for the money. You saying the People driving the lawsuit isn't? roche makes billions, ofc they are a target for lawsuits. Even more so in the states where there basically are no limits for the amount of money you can ask for in damages.

Side-effects acceptable?. I can only answer for myself. Yes they are. Unlike you i don't try to answer for everybody else.

The side-effects you mention are 1/1000, yeah it sucks if you are that one guy but its not gonna change the fact that 999 others were on the drug with little more then chapped lips and dry skin, and with acne free faces afterwards.

1/1000 ??????? Prove it, link me with the info plz.

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No name-calling no matter the provocation. Keep it all polite. This is the ONLY warning. Any more personal attacks will result in official warnings.

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I know of very few drugs (if any off the top of my head), that induce side effects after the course is complete.

Off the top of my head....hmmm, immunosuppresants, several cancer treatments, steroids.

Ie worked as a healthcare professional for almost a decade now. And i did study pharmacology when i was a student. New on the boards...yeah that must mean im 14y.o or something, get a grip man.

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*mod edit*

*mod edit*

I'm not going anywhere, you people really have no clue of what unbiased information is about. And unlike you i actually contribute to the rest of this site. And don't just troll around in the Accutane section.

refer to the brain scan post above that you ignored, as you have clearly chosen to remain blissfully ignorant

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If this thread continues to take too much moderator time to edit out insults on either side, this thread will go the way of others. Keep it civil. No matter how strongly you believe, you can refrain from being insulting or patronizing or provoking.

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Sideeeffects are most commonly divided into common and rare. Common being classified as something 1 in every 100 person experiences. Rare sideeffects are classified as those occuring in every 1 in 1000 persons.

All the sideeffects you mentioned belongs in the rare category.

This is based on the official testing and certification that every drug has to pass before it makes it to the general public. How good is this research? i cant say, im no scientist. I put more trust in that research then the one performed by the people looking to suck money out of big drug companies though.

as for the facts, sure, just go to http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/infopage/accutane/default.htm

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Sideeeffects are most commonly divided into common and rare. Common being classified as something 1 in every 100 person experiences. Rare sideeffects are classified as those occuring in every 1 in 1000 persons.

All the sideeffects you mentioned belongs in the rare category.

This is based on the official testing and certification that every drug has to pass before it makes it to the general public. How good is this research? i cant say, im no scientist. I put more trust in that research then the one performed by the people looking to suck money out of big drug companies though.

as for the facts, sure, just go to http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/infopage/accutane/default.htm

accutane ranks 4th on the fda's database for top adverse reactions, so it can't be 1/1000

the real facts are at http://www.house.gov/stupak/accutane.shtml

accutane was approved in 9 months, when drugs usually take 3-5 years to be approved

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"accutane ranks 4th on the fda's database for top adverse reactions"

Link please. I can't find it on the FDA site.

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Yeah the guy who's son killed himself and the father blaming accutane. Why do you keep posting information that is so clearly biased AGAINST accutane. They are worthless here.

How many posts does it take before you grasp the concept of objective and unbiased information? It's been mentioned over and over and over again.

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"accutane ranks 4th on the fda's database for top adverse reactions"

Link please. I can't find it on the FDA site.

It's because there is no such list where Accutane appears as 4th most dangerous drug. These are more scare-facts from anti-accutane websites.

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"accutane ranks 4th on the fda's database for top adverse reactions"

Link please. I can't find it on the FDA site.

It's because there is no such list where Accutane appears as 4th most dangerous drug. These are more scare-facts from anti-accutane websites.

Have you taken accutane then and had a positive experience? If so, post it in the positive stories section and rant about this brilliant drug there.

I agree in unbiased information, although let's be honest many of the adverse side effects have been studies many a time. I do feel we are victims in most cases here, especially when not fully educated by the risks and Doctors not being open about all the facts.

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I'd really like to see some independent studies on Accutane. As of reading this entire thread, I have not seen a SINGLE credible/unbiased study on the subject. Linking to action groups and class action law suits for this kind of information is worthless and about as biased as you can get.

I agree with duck in that I haven't seen one proper study among all these biased scare sites (most likely funded by those trying to sue Roche). For this same reason, I am wary about putting up a thread of "studies" unless the journals are double checked for validity.

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conf22, that thread is already up and pinned .... feel free to give input on the links posted.

The mods will do their best to check it as well. However, as with every other thread on the board, it is really up to the reader to draw his/her own conclusions.

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I'd really like to see some independent studies on Accutane. As of reading this entire thread, I have not seen a SINGLE credible/unbiased study on the subject. Linking to action groups and class action law suits for this kind of information is worthless and about as biased as you can get.

I agree with duck in that I haven't seen one proper study among all these biased scare sites (most likely funded by those trying to sue Roche). For this same reason, I am wary about putting up a thread of "studies" unless the journals are double checked for validity.

Last year while I was researching vitamin A’s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane’s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

Ever since Accutane was approved by the FDA in 1982, Roche has continued to use the lame excuse in the Physician’s Desk Reference that “the exact mechanism of action is unknown” which is their way of copping out by declaring that they don’t understand how the drug works to reduce acne or how it causes an incredibly long list of side effects. Here’s how Roche thinks. For them it’s like, let’s all just stick our heads in the sand and completely disregard those independent studies showing that Accutane binds to DNA nuclear receptors and alters gene expression and protein transcription, reduces stem cell proliferation all over the body including areas of the brain, damages the body’s ability regenerate the water-holding protein molecule hyaluronic acid in connective tissue (causing chronic cellular dehydration and extreme dryness of the skin, eyes, nasal passage, mucous membranes etc.), or the hidden away chemo studies I discovered which demonstrate that retinoids induce telomere shortening, growth arrest and cell death, we here at Hoffman-La Roche do not know how this drug works down at the cellular level but we do know that it’s certainly effective against pimples

I will link the studies in a bit.

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Exact mechanism of action unknown: that's true for many drugs.

yes, but Roche does know, and if they told anyone, there would be a massive backlash. I am trying to get together the studies now.

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Exact mechanism of action unknown: that's true for many drugs.

yes, but Roche does know, and if they told anyone, there would be a massive backlash. I am trying to get together the studies now.

It's in the PDR. And in my drug book. It's not hidden.

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I'd really like to see some independent studies on Accutane. As of reading this entire thread, I have not seen a SINGLE credible/unbiased study on the subject. Linking to action groups and class action law suits for this kind of information is worthless and about as biased as you can get.

I agree with duck in that I haven't seen one proper study among all these biased scare sites (most likely funded by those trying to sue Roche). For this same reason, I am wary about putting up a thread of "studies" unless the journals are double checked for validity.

Last year while I was researching vitamin A’s role in treating cancer, my curiosity lead me to discover two specific scientific studies buried away in the chemotherapy research archives never to see the light of day, which in my opinion reveal Accutane’s true mechanism of action, and from what I can tell nobody else has made this connection yet.

Ever since Accutane was approved by the FDA in 1982, Roche has continued to use the lame excuse in the Physician’s Desk Reference that “the exact mechanism of action is unknown” which is their way of copping out by declaring that they don’t understand how the drug works to reduce acne or how it causes an incredibly long list of side effects. Here’s how Roche thinks. For them it’s like, let’s all just stick our heads in the sand and completely disregard those independent studies showing that Accutane binds to DNA nuclear receptors and alters gene expression and protein transcription, reduces stem cell proliferation all over the body including areas of the brain, damages the body’s ability regenerate the water-holding protein molecule hyaluronic acid in connective tissue (causing chronic cellular dehydration and extreme dryness of the skin, eyes, nasal passage, mucous membranes etc.), or the hidden away chemo studies I discovered which demonstrate that retinoids induce telomere shortening, growth arrest and cell death, we here at Hoffman-La Roche do not know how this drug works down at the cellular level but we do know that it’s certainly effective against pimples

I will link the studies in a bit.

Sorry but I need to correct you again. No such thing as protein transciption, protein translation yes but not transcription. Transcription is for genes only. Gene expression and protein translation are about the same thing.

Hyaluronic acid is not a protein. It is a polysaccharide(long chain of sugar). Function is to lubricate joints and resist compression in joints or tissues, somewhat like a cushion. It does not serve to provide water to the cells thus it cannot cause dehydration. On the contrary, it actually draws water into itself via osmosis. It holds water yeah to serve as a cushion, not to serve as a drink for cells.

Not being sarcastic but just to make sure people know what is correct.

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This is in regard to the Animal Studies link in the Link to Clinical Studies thread. The line in the study that makes me guffaw states, "In humans, Accutane (13-cis-RA) is used orally between 0.5 and 2.0 mg/kg/day over a 4-month treatment period, predominantly in a teenage population in whom the rate of neurogenesis would be predicted to be relatively high (14). To parallel these conditions, our studies were performed on young adult CD-1 mice, an age and strain with relatively high levels of neurogenesis (14, 23). To avoid the trauma of daily oral gavage, 13-cis-RA was injected i.p. at a daily dose of 1 mg/kg."

1 mg/kg for a mouse is NOT parallel to 1 mg/kg for a human being since the average lab mouse weighs only 20 grams. I'm not a scientist and am not familiar with animal testing, but is it normal to have a high amount of substance/drug based on weight to be tested on an animal and then deem whatever effects happened to that animal (due to pretty much what I think so far is an overdose) would result in a human that weighs a lot more?

ETA: Maybe I'm comprehending the information incorrecty? Maybe the study means 1mg equivalent to the conversion of 0.02kg was given? I hate math. I wish the information wasn't confusing.

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If you had acne for 14 years then get on the accutane. I've had acne for a similar amount of time and i'm starting (ro)accutane next month. I have no doubts about starting with this medication. Read up on the sideeffects and what you can do to make them more bearable. Check out popfry's excellent roaccutane diary (http://www.youtube.com/user/Popfry) and also check out http://reclaimyourskin.co.uk/ for lots of good tips.

I wish you good luck with your treatment :)

Ahhh so you haven't started it yet! Waits in anticipation. :whistle:

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