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Bulgarian R.

Stem Cells for Acne Scar Repair (SCIENCE FACT, not science fiction!)

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http://www.drcalabriamedia.com/assets/prin...e_March_09_.pdf

As usual, the article is talking about using stem cells for anti-aging. I wish there were more doctors who would focus on acne scar repair. Anyway, the celeution machine, which is what a lot of these doctors are using to extract the stem cells, is still not available in the U.S. I guess he is using it in his office in Italy.

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wasn't some member speaking to a dermatologist in Dubai? any updates on the prodcedure or updates on the results from those who have gone through it?

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unfortunately in Australia where I live there is only one place that does PRP but its the basic version and they do not specialise in Acne scarring so im not confident of going there. Funnily enough, there was an article in the paper over here which commented on Dr Khan and he was saying how the techniques discussed here should be used for the future ill try pull it up.

New procedure offers a long-term alternative to face lifts using patients' own fat and stem cells, says Alice Hart-Davis.

New technology is offering an alternative to invasive facial surgery using patients' own fat and stem cells, says Alice Hart-Davis.

For years, the only way to sort out a sagging wrinkling face was to let it all go south then opt for a facelift. Now, the vogue among practitioners of facial aesthetics is for a series of tweaks and nips, from wrinkle-relaxing treatments such as Botox, to contour-plumping injections.

These are short-term fixes. More long-term is fat grafting (extracting fat from the stomach or thighs, which won't miss it) and injecting it back into the face. It can have great results, but it's a bit hit-and-miss. Up to 50 per cent of the fat cells die off after they have been injected into their new site, so practitioners have to overfill contours, which can lead to a bad case of "pillow face" and leave patients looking overstuffed until it all settles down a few months later.

Hence the excitement in surgical circles about a new, not-quite-surgical procedure that recontours faces using the patient's own fat, mixed with some of their own stem cells. This enables the fat to better "take hold" in its new location, stay alive, and become part of the face. With the new technique, only five to 10 per cent of the grafted fat withers, so the result is potentially more satisfactory, more predictable and longer lasting. Stem cells bring the added bonus of increasing the blood supply to the skin, which has a noticeable benefit to the way it looks.

Stem cells and their applications have been an exciting area of research for the past 10 years. While most of us know that they're found in foetal cells, it's a surprise to learn that master stem cells, the ones with the ability to develop into any kind of tissue or organ, are found in their greatest concentration in the fat around the stomach, thighs and love handles, in concentrations 1000 times greater than in bone marrow. The added advantage of using these cells in fat grafting is that it steers well clear of any ethical minefield that surrounds using foetal stem cells for research.

"This is huge," says Dr Aamer Khan of London's Harley Street Medical Skin Clinic, who is the first practitioner worldwide to offer the treatment in the private sector using FDA-approved stem-cell-harvesting technology.

"It's a very significant move in our field. It will offer people a real alternative to invasive facial surgery, using their own tissues and offering long-lasting results."

The stem cell lift is by no means a lunchtime fix. This is serious stuff, requiring a high degree of skill and is correspondingly expensive. The whole procedure takes four hours and the initial phase takes place in an operating theatre.

First, enough fat - about 250ml - has to be removed by liposuction, which means local anaesthetic and a small incision in the area of the stomach from which the fat is taken. Next, the stem cells are removed from half of this fat, while the other half is purified. The two mixtures are then recombined, and injected into the areas of the face that need boosting and lifting, which usually means the pads of the cheeks, the tear trough beneath and around the eyes, to counteract hollowness, and around the jawline and the temples.

That's easy to write; less easy to go through. By the time the work is finished, the face will look puffy from all the injections and the swelling will take a good week to settle. For the first few days, patients have to sleep propped up and on their backs to minimise swelling. Then there is the bruising, which will take a fortnight to ease, but can be disguised with make-up.

But the results are well worth it, says Linda Shepherd, the first woman in the world on whom the technique has been tried (her case was presented at an international conference of surgeons on September 19).

"I would never have gone under the knife," says Shepherd, 56, who lives in north London. "I wouldn't choose to have surgery and a general anaesthetic unless it was life-threatening, but I had lost the fullness in my face and years of smoking had added years to my appearance. I very much wanted to look more youthful, so this seemed ideal." She had the procedure in July and now, 11 weeks later, is seeing the final, fully settled, results.

"It's nothing less than amazing," she says. "I found it hard to imagine what I might look like, beforehand. I hoped that my face would look fuller and that my lines would be softer, but this is wonderful. I was quite swollen for a week, and the bruising was bad at first, but now it doesn't look as if I have had anything done. There are no scars and I feel it has turned the clock back at least 10 years. I've got cheeks again. It looks natural and it is my own fat that was used."

SAFETY FIRST

Choose your practitioner with care. Ideally, get a personal recommendation, or go via a reputable organisation.

Don't just sign up with the first doctor or surgeon you see. Have a consultation, see what they suggest, and see if you like them. Ask to see before and after pictures of previous clients. Then ask if you can speak to any of these people. Any good practitioner should have a string of fans happy to sing his or her praises. Then visit someone else, for a comparison. It is your money and your face, so take your time.

Don't be surprised if you find it's a nurse who's doing the injecting, rather than the doctor. Nurses often do Botox or fillers all day, and are very good at it.

Don't be pressured into having anything more done than you feel comfortable with.

Do be realistic about what, say, Botox could do for you. You can expect improvements, but not miracles.

The Daily Telegraph, London

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Thanks for posting that, otis20. It was very interesting. Getting the procedure done at Dr. Khan's clinic is pretty expensive but it just might be worth it. Thanks again.

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First, enough fat - about 250ml - has to be removed by liposuction, which means local anaesthetic and a small incision in the area of the stomach from which the fat is taken.

A small incision... That's probably something that will just heal up OK and won't leave a mark then. :think: I've been wondering about that, seeing that somebody described the liposuction part of the procedure earlier in this topic and it seemed pretty rough. :confused:

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Im sure it cant be too bad... So many people went for liposuction to look good. Im sure they wouldnt have done it if it leaves a huge and noticeable scar.

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I Googled liposuction scars today. And there seem to be enough people who have some of them that are very much noticable. But of course this stem cell treatment isn't exactly the same procedure.

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Its good to see more people trying it out. Im hope u see a great improvement wishful thinker. Hopefully it will be my turn in 3 years time lol.

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I think Icaretohelp said he'd not be around so much as he was earlier, if I remember correctly. And as far as BRD... I think he's probably back from that trip to South Korea by now but I guess he's just too busy at the moment. Strange how he took down his avatar, though. :think:

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Well that's what happens to most posts. Overhyped. Though this procedure should have more potential in the future, if all it does is fix megan fox type of scars, then in no way is it worth what Dr. Khan is overcharging. And then there is the ones that got it like heidi, who considers the pics in the first page really bad scars!!! and hers being no where near that. While I am sitting here wishing my skin was half as good as the one in the first pic.

Don't let Doctors sell you that Laser bull of "you need 5 treatments so I can finally buy that car I wanted", I have dark skin and my derm told me to get a fraxel. That's when you know they don't give a damn and just want your money.

As far as the Stem Cell goes theorically it should fix scars 100%, and with that price tag that doc is waiving around as if he was pissing his name on snow, you would think it would come pretty damn close to that. Might as well live off fillers for a few years till real solutions come, but of course if you have heidi scars you would come to 50% with that procedure, otherwise if you have real scars look elsewhere for now, don't let him get his car too.

Living with scars sucks like hell, and if you claim that you didn't think about sucide then you are lying, (unless you have heidi scars, I would go out making public speeches with that skin). But I know how it feels, and just looking at other peoples semi ok skin just kills you a little bit inside. But try to save your money for something better, I know I can't really speak for this because I don't even have that kind of money to pay, so I really don't have an option, maybe if I did I would be more desperate I don't know. (who knew, being poor might have some advantage after all).

But there are things coming and hope.

Sublative Rejuvination- It might be one of those 5 treatments magic trick again Hence: "I want a new car scam", but apperantly it can work on dark skin so a major plus and they have provided with some really good results on acne scars( when I say really good I mean like around 70% all around) something fraxels fails to provide with, as to the only ones I can find is retards trying to get rid of that invisible lines that apperantly bother them to the point where they thousands. (My theory is that we scarred people also lose our sight as we scar so we cant see the invisible lines). Which I guess explains why there are so many before and after pics to which I can't fucking tell which one is the before and which one is the after. But that's ok, once ours scars heal so will our sight. But yeah though I don't really trust too much on what they are saying about Sublative Rejuvination, they are making some noise and big claims with those pics so it's something to look out for.

Acell- another funky procedure that apparently works for likes this. If you cut out your scar and apply the powder your skin will grow back. Now that to me sounds like the biggest bullshit I heard but you know apparently they have science to back it up which from a theoretical level sounds pretty neat, but when it comes to practice I still cant find any pics only claims of what it does, but you never know, watch out for that one as well.

And then there is my fellow Canadian Doctor, who wrote a thesis on scar regeneration through the use Iodine. Apperantly you take Lugol's Solution (contains few forms of iodine put together with some other stuff) and apply it dirrectly to the scar, and through continous use you will eventually see hair growing around the scar and eventually on it and the hair itself plays a role in the regeneration. But anywho, the claim was that he tested this hypothesis on a 50 year old facial scar, and apparently after some time the scar "competely regenerated", whatever that could mean as to I have not seen any pics of it. In my book such a statement can only mean that scar litterally "completely regenerated", we all see those laser derms throwing that word around, so Im not going to go into that. But what I like about this is that he is not really selling anything or trying to make money out of it, as this just purely scientific reaserch and he publish it to get some discussions sparking and hopefully helping people with scars to a simple procedure such as this. But again, I have not seen any authentic "complete regenerations", but then again I have not seen it with any procedure to date.

I am sure more procedures will come out, as they always do, and some will fail to actually fix anything, others will fail before they even try to fix anything *cough* Isolagen *cough*. But better things will come be sure of that. And if fillers can do the trick you should probably stick to them for now, till something good comes out.

If all fails limb regeneration is suppose to come out in around 10-16 years. If you can grow an arm you better believe that you can grow skin too, but we should see earlier versions of that and it will probably start out by growing fingers, but before growing fingers we should see them growing back skin, so it's not really 10-16 years, and that will probably be the only time we will see 100% regeneration.

Keep your chin up.

Bye for now.

Edited by Scars4Life

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icaretohelp

And.. when do you predict this "exciting" thing going to be revealed.

Haha before anyone gets excited, this better be relevant to what we are talking about.

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this discussion seems to be getting hostile, and for what?

1. the efficacy of stem cell treatments for acne scars is simply new and undocumented, not over-hyped. the pictures from the initial post are promising, and if in the near future people post their results, and they are similar, i would consider this to be a successful procedure, or at least the best available.

2. as for the cost, $10,000 USD is a lot of money, but to generalize health care professionals as only in it for the "new car" is simply false, and unproductive. just look at what BRD is doing for this community. also, for some perspective, breast augmentation using this same procedure is priced at $25,000 USD. marinate on that.

3. if this procedure produces results like the pictures from the initial post, and if such results are supported by some before and after pictures from people in this community, i am devoting the next year to financially and psychologically prepare myself to take this procedure on. this would include traveling from the US to the UK. for me, the cost would be worth the payoff.

with that said, i sincerely ask any members of this community who had this procedure done to please post their before and after pictures. just know that it will help a lot of people here tremendously, and if you are concerned about revealing your identity, there are a lot of easy-to-use photo editing softwares out there :)

for me, this is not the miracle i've been waiting for, nor is it a complete disappointment. i'm just trying to do my due diligence and do something about my scars, because i'm tired of wining about it.

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Personally to me I find the cost to be worth it if it can improve the appearance of my scars.

A car - $40000

A plane trip - $2000

Hotel Stay - $3000

Food - $200

Procedure - $20000

Increase my confidence and self esteem - priceless....

Edited by Vanzzzz

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People if there was some procedure that would provide dramatic results I would pay 10,000 just for a consultation. And increasing confidence is priceless, my confidence is pretty bad but oddly my self esteem is pretty high and don't let myself get pushed around. But anyways if a procedure would provide results that I've seen in the first page, paying 10,000 would really not be a problem, heck I'll live in my car for the rest of the year if with those results and brag about it,(if I had a car :cry:). As for BRD I admire his work and dedication to help the helpless find treatment and advancing science forward by informing our ignorant dermatologists.

As for the derms who I was saying don't give a damn about you, they really don't and most really don't give damn about their field, they are just waving their degree around and getting paid really good money(you can't really blame them). But there are others that do, you know, the ones that don't just wait to get a new laser and tell you "Just got my new laser, jump in" derms. But the ones that other than treating people actually contribute to the field and go into the lab do research, find new stuff, publish papers etc. And honestly there are not too many of those, and if you want to try to find one in the US, you are looking in the wrong place. Out of all the derms I went to, half of them said "Bam! laser for you, yes?"(I have dark skin lol), others were just like sorry we don't have lasers yet come back in a month, and some tryed to help but didn't really knew what they were doing. But there was one derm who did not give me bullshit, told me how it is and was willing to try to find places where I could possibly get some help(knew his stuff, was willing to help, and money was not an issue). Rare thing to find nowadays.

Now another thing, one thing that kind of gives me this 'tick' is when I hear all these claims of "OMG I am cured", and I never get to see what that person got "cured" from. No before and afters or anything, and once they open up and start describing what it is that they were treating it seems like it was one of those invisible lines I was reffering to earlier.

Hope someone understands where I am comming from.

Edited by Scars4Life

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I understand fine. I agree the lack of comparison can be frustrating at times. The pics on the first page came from treatments in China apparently. There were people who went there for treatments but they have since stopped posting, not sure whether its because they got the results they want or are too disappointed to post.

People who claimed to have gotten cured are icaretohelp and heidi i think. Heidi didnt even mentioned cured, she just said improvement.

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I understand fine. I agree the lack of comparison can be frustrating at times. The pics on the first page came from treatments in China apparently. There were people who went there for treatments but they have since stopped posting, not sure whether its because they got the results they want or are too disappointed to post.

Just so you know, I was quoted a price by Aolousi (clinic in China) based on photos I submitted. Suffice it to say, it is extremely cost prohibitive and I will not be pursuing it. Not that I ever had any intention to travel to China for treatment, but I was just curious. The poster who was in contact with Aolousi and discussed traveling to China for treatment, also has decided not to go for treatment because of the cost.

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